Many people have been sending me this story about Texas considering accrediting the Institute of Creation Research for training teachers, and I’ve just been reluctant to mention it because poor Texas has been getting walloped over creationism lately, and I was feeling a terrible sympathy for the place. It’s as if the whole state has fallen into a pit of suck.
The ICR wants to offer Masters degrees in science education, of all things; they claim they’d be offering instruction in evolution alongside their science curriculum, but we know that is a lie, since the people at ICR aren’t competent to offer kindergarten level courses in pretty, pretty baby animals, let alone real biology. A state advisory board, in a fit of ignorance and insanity, has approved this plan, but it next has to go before the Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board for final approval.
I hope Texas scientists can slap that Board into wakeful reality before that meeting, because if this goes through, the trust I can give Texas-trained teachers is getting flushed right down the sewer. And if Texans can’t fix this, the rest of the country has to step up and deny certification to anyone trained in Texas — their diplomas and degrees will be worth about as much as Monopoly money.
Sorry, Texas. It’s just getting to be a bit much.
Why do fundies hate America?
Why do fundies wonder why Americans can’t compete on a global level.
Fear of anyone different, dumbing down of Americans in general and educators and students in particular.
America USED to lead the way in the sciences, but those days seem long gone and, if these idiots get their way, gone for good. It really is a shame, so many good minds are being tortured and wasted by these people and their wretched methods of controlling the government from local to national levels
Let me reiterate my usual defense. It’s easy to blame this on Texans en masse, but don’t forget that i) Texan schoolchildren are entirely blameless and deserve as good an education as anyone else and ii) Texans have been hoodwinked by politicians, grimy media, business and religion.
I don’t hold all Americans responsible for voting in Bush, and by the same token I expect others not to hold all Texans responsible for the stupidity of a few crooks who seem to run this state.
As for not trusting teachers trained in Texas, remember to ask where they went to school. While these hucksters get headlines, UT Austin has more than doubled its output of math and science teachers through the now ten-year old UTeach program ( http://www.uteach.utexas.edu/ ) (disclosure: I’m a graduate of the program)
Not only have they increased quantity, they’ve increased quality. We’re trained to teach our students science by having them DO science (as opposed to the seemingly ubiqitous “let’s read from the textbook and then do a cookbook lab” And sure, the concepts our students discover have been known by humanity for hundreds of years, but it’s the process and habit of skeptical thought that matters). With 12 other universities now creating copies of the program, maybe our stealthy “train people who know how to do science to teach science” approach has scared another batch of wackos into taking more extreme measures to spread ignorance and lies…
Naw, they’re just wackos.
So incredibly sad to see this. I was born and raised in Texas, and went through 12 years of public schools there. It was an incredibly mixed bag of an educational experience. I played in an 80-piece high school orchestra that played serious classical repertory (Beethoven’s Eroica Symphony, The Nutcracker–not the Suite, the whole damn ballet for a staged production–Franck D minor symphony, the Barber Adagio for Strings; one of the other high school orchestras in town actually played the Penderecki Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima, etc. etc.), had a bona fide genius for a drama teacher and acted in both traditional and very avant-garde productions, read Chaucer, Bocaccio, Melville, Wharton, Marquand, Merimee, Homer, Fitzgerald, Sophocles, Shakespeare and Milton, took American history from a teacher not afraid to expose the darker side of things, but also had to deal with illegal school prayers more than a decade past the relevant Supreme Court decisions, jingoistic know-nothing government and economics teachers, and a culture that valued sports over practically everything else. My math and science courses were pretty good, but I didn’t take biology because I was squeamish about dissecting, so I can’t directly address the evolution issue. Still, there was much good in the people and the schools there, so it’s hard for me to take this in. It almost literally makes me weep. I can’t imagine what it’s like to be a serious, honest, dedicated science teacher there these days.
Greg Laden says
I don’t think it was ignorance or insanity. I think somebody is paying off somebody else. The panel that did the initial review for the state consisted mainly of people from religious institutions, and no biologists. Their conclusion; “This place is like any biology masters program … the only difference is the name” .. or words to that effect.
I actually think there is less harm in this than may appear to be the case at first. What I’ve been asking is this: If this ICR program is accredited by the state, would this not mean that the names of graduates is public information? I am not sure about this but it would be intersting to find out.
This way, it would just be a matter of creationist lining up to pay good money to put their names on a “do not hire” list
Sorry, Texas. It’s just getting to be a bit much.
Now don’t be saying nothing bad about Texas!
Ha! I was just thinking about this today. Years ago ICR had a big fight with the California state Department of Education over accreditation, which then-Superintendent of Public Instruction Bill Honig wanted to deny. ICR managed to survive Honig’s disdain, but Texas should be a much better fit for it.
Why was I thinking about it? Because today’s mail brought the latest issue of Acts & Facts, the ICR newsletter, complete with a full-page house ad touting their grad school. Here are some tidbits from the ICR grad school ad:
Challenge Your Mind.
Impact Your World.
Earn the M.S. degree in Science Education with one of 4 new minors in ICR’s online Distance Education program.
Founded by Dr. Henry Morris, ICR Graduate School has offered quality graduate education for over 25 years, establishing itself as the premiere graduate institution in the disciplines of creation science.
Explore the sciences through the framework of biblical authority, guided by leading faculty who combine their extensive experience in graduate education and field research to offer a comprehensive program in creation science.
Both an education and research institution, ICRGS conducts ongoing scientific investigations in creation science:
* Radioisotopes and the Age of the Earth (RATE)
* Genomic Evaluation — New Evidence (GENE)
* Flood Activated Sedimentation and Tectonics (FAST)
If these guys were as good at scientific research as they are at cobbling up goofy acronyms, the journals would bristle with their articles. But no.
I’ll be writing a post eventually about the hilarious new article on ICR’s RATE program (acceleration of radioactive decay must have occurred so that the earth is only a few thousand years old!), but right now I have a calculus final to write. So later.
Impact your world, indeed.
As a writer, though, Texas’ shifting in this direction will be convenient for a future novel series I have planned.
If it proves difficult to prevent the State of Texas from allowing the ICR to grant graduate degrees in science education, we can hope that some rationality gets applied when it comes to the employment of these poor suckers.
I agree with the conclusion of this article, that
Texas has low QOL scores. The poverty and child poverty levels are much higher than the national average. The teen pregnancy rate is also much higher. This is despite being awash in oil money due to $92/barrel oil.
So what do they do? Attack science, their own school system, and their own children. This is supposed to be a Xian thing to do.
I’m sure that if one looks at that state advisory board, it is packed full of creo fundamentalists. Most likely why the LOL Institute for
braindeadLying Creation Research relocated their. A stacked deck and done deal.
The governor is a theocrat, the state legislature is full of wingnuts, and The Theocratic Peoples Dictatorship of Texas is born. As we have already seen, these people are quite prepared to purge anyone who gets in their way, rule of law be dammed.
Theocracies earned a bad name centuries ago. Seems once one is established, truth, morality, common sense, and honesty just disappear. On the road to the new Dark Ages, Texas is just getting started. Wait till there are wholesale purges and refugees streaming into the USA and Mexico in search of a better life.
For the reality based community in Texas, stockpile popcorn and wine. After one has finished trying to prevent civilization’s fall, nothing left to do but kick back and watch.
Just be careful not to make Texas look too much like Mordor. I know it fits well and all, but, from what I gather, Mordor didn’t have a beach or any pro sports teams.
So…does that mean we can start holding accredited bible school classes, where we teach the controversy (on the one hand, this is the true and perfect word of god; on the other hand, what a load of old bollocks. Discuss).
I’m sure there would be pitchforks at sundown over that plan. I’m in. Anyone else?
If Texas actually does show signs of watering down their evolution requirements, the University of Texas might try a tactic that the U. Of Kansas considered in 2005. UK required at least one high-school science course to get in. The science class that everyone takes is biology, because …. (well, my physics background may be biasing me). So UK threatened to not accept biology courses from Kansas high schools to fulfill their entrance requirement. That created quite a stir at the time.
I attend a Texas college. *sob* DAM U TEXAS!!!
I say if we Texans cannot fix this sticky conundrum, rather than play politics, we simply move a sizeable chunk of godless liberals into the state. Now, I’m not proposing moving people out of their homes or anything. Nor am I proposing to rip people from their safe and secure lives. Nay. Instead, we clone ten thousand and train them in truth. Meanwhile, while Texas is being run by a facist regime, we sneak our clone army into the country and demand they be sanctioned. The clones may be florescent mutants, and they may garner much bigotry, but in the same fashion that illegal immigrants have gained a voice, so will they. Victory will be ours!
Bert Chadick says
As a product of the Texas K-12 school system and four years at a State University during the 50’s and early 60’s I had my fill of segregation, forced prayer, slavery apologist history and loyalty oaths. It doesn’t look like things have changed much. Well the schools are crappier, but that is a funding decision more than anything else.
Things might have changed since I considered teaching in Texas, but a Master degree in any subject doesn’t give you the right to teach. You still need to be certified. Likewise, a degree in something has no relevance in what you teach or how. My supervising teacher when I student taught Physics was a recycled Biology teacher. The exams really were that easy. I didn’t study for mine, and still easily passed. For the professional development test, I picked whatever answer would best benefit the students, even for the questions that didn’t directly address student needs. In any case, someone could have a degree from UT, TAMU, or wherever, and still be just as loony as someone who holds a “degree” from ICR, and they could still teach. To me the first sign of how bad the Bush Presidency was going to be was when he started calling himself the Education president.
I would hope that ICR won’t gets its cert just because it seems to be a diploma mill for the religious right, and I’d hope that’s how future employers would see it, but maybe that is too optimistic.
I would hope that ICR won’t gets its cert just because it seems to be a diploma mill for the religious right, and I’d hope that’s how future employers would see it, but maybe that is too optimistic.
The only reason it’s being considered for accreditation is because it’s a diploma mill for the RR.
This is fuckin’ Texas we are talking about here. Of course you are being too optimistic, otherwise things never would have gotten this far.
Texas loves to act like it is all big and bad, as in, “Don’t Mess with Texas”…
But what is the reality? How many times did Texas get its ass handed to it? How come the only battles they won were when Easterners showed-up to fight for them? And seriously, they act like the English and French as all wimps, but how many wars has France and England won? Now how many has Texas? Who are the real wimps?
Yes, I see the plan now. Texas will become the home of on line internet fundie diploma mills. All acredited by the Texas State Ministry for Education and the Advancement of the One True Faith.
The next step will be the granting of Ph.D.s, MDs, and JDs from the newly accredited graduate schools, medical schools, and law schools. All “distance learning” of course, get your graduate or professional
diplomasdegrees in your bathrobe before work.
If Texas is going to hand out degrees like paper towels, might as well go all the way. A lot of states have laws about diploma mills and diploma mill degrees. After Texas gets done, many more will.
Looks like they are well on the way to third world banana republic status. That is one of the peculiarities of fundies. Rather than elevate themselves, they want to drag everyone down to their level.
That’s why I hope the Chinese manage to do something spectacular, or at least successful with their manned space program. I am NOT a fan of NASA’s manned exploration program. I’d rather see the money go elsewhere into robotic research. But it is politically/socially useful when another country gets ahead.
I grew up a child of the 50’s, with the U.S. totally spooked by the Soviet Sputnik satellite. My generation grew up having science crammed down our throats as young children so we could “compete” with the Russkies. My toys as a kid were things like chemistry sets (that you can’t buy today), Tasco telescopes, and model rockets… all strongly supported by my parents because that was the national Zeitgeist back then. We had to beat the Russians, and that meant a focus on Capital “S” Science down to the elementary school level. All of that drifted away over the years after we reached the moon, the Berlin Wall fell, and we got complacent about our superiority as a nation.
I think that’s what we need here in the U.S. now: a hard shot of competitive reality, by some other nation that isn’t locked into this religious insanity. Doesn’t even have to be a space program, although that seems to grab attention easily. It could be some biotech breakthrough. Maybe China, or South Korea, or some other country will save us indirectly by waking up what we used to be as a country.
ICR EDUCATIONAL PHILOSOPHY
The study and understanding of the created world involves original research to discover the truth about the world as it really is. Such findings can then be applied for the benefit of mankind and glory of God.
Here are a few sentences they forgot to include:
P.S. ICR students who discover in the course of their research that God doesn’t exist are no longer considered to be doing original research and will be expelled.
P.P.S. We have a shredder for student papers we disapprove of. We will use it.
P.P.P.S Any student who quotes fewer than fifty bible verses in an original research paper will be penalized one whole grade.
Didn’t the Edwards decision essentially declare that teaching YEC in public schools is unconstitutional? In other words, even if people get degrees from the “Institute of Creation Research”, what good will those degrees be? Won’t these folks be much more likely to be watched and the target of lawsuits at the first sign of creationism in the classroom?
If anything, this seems like a great occurrence for our side, as it helps to identify who the likely troublemakers will be. If I were a clever and devious creationist, the last thing I would do is train teachers at a school with “Creation” in its name.
Seeing as I know that someone is going to be bringing up the return Texas to Mexico statement, I’d like to make on request. Please hold off for the next year and a half until I go to college somewhere far away from Texas.
I’ve actually been lucky in regards to my science education in Texas. This might have something to do with my mother volunteering her time to singlehandedly establish the science program at my elementary school because she didn’t like what they had, and once I got hooked there, I was able to choose to go to a science magnet highschool. Thankfully for me, most of the science teachers either had been teaching at colleges, or had industry experiance, and actually knew science.
However, I doubt mny people are as lucky as I have been with my oppurtunities. Hopefully this idea gets shot down, but I fear that Texas will become a fundie diploma mill. Yet one more reason why I want to go somewhere far away for college.
I understand the reluctance to stigmatize the Texas population (as opposed to those in positions of power) over this stuff, but, as one who lives in the state, I can tell you that a massive number of Texans are as gob-smackingly, aggressively anti-evolution as you can possibly imagine and well deserve any contempt the sane world directs their way.
Dan B says
I presume you’ve seen this, PZ, but nonetheless
Another interesting (if terribly faulty and well… dumb) commentary on how atheism is a “stealth religion.”
I live in Texas, and I can say that this is a state full of fundie wackos. The typical street intersection in Texas has three gas stations and a Baptist church.
This is where Bubba rules, and ignorance is a high virtue.
To be sure, there are some spectacular exceptions, such as the Houston Medical Center, the M. D. Anderson Hospital and Tumor Institute, NASA, a world class symphony orchestra in Houston,etc., but by and large this is a dismal, brain-dead society.
We need a lot of pressure from the real world to let the education clowns here know that if they turn the education system into a bowl of creationist pabulum, there will be real costs.
I realize why you’re incensed at the state right now, but crackpot opinions about history based on opinion and emotion instead of facts are just as wrong-headed as similarly motivated scientific ones.
I hadn’t heard about this stuff yet so thanks for posting the story; it’s absolutely ludicrous. As to the issue of Texas schools in general, the reason for the low test scores are fairly standard.
1) High rates of poverty resulting from a) The vastness of the state, b) the lateness of development. Unlike the eastern states, which have ~300 years of development under their belt, besides the major cities, Texas had pretty much zero industrialization or public investment until the New Deal and Rural Electrification. That means that, for the most part, that infrastructure investment in this state didn’t start until the 1940’s, and c) the basically rural character of it’s communities that results.
2) A lack of educational funding. In Texas, schools are supposed to be paid for by oil money and property taxes. Obviously, this isn’t a very steady source of revenue. Areas with low property values get shafted, and when oil is cheap school funding plummets. You would think that the flip-side of this would be that schools would be well funded when oil is high, but what really ends up happening is that the legislature appropriates revenue during oil gluts to pay off the state debts they run up in times of dearth or as an excuse for tax cuts, which means less money for schools twice over. More than funding problems, it creates pressure in Texas municipalities against opening new schools to deal with an increasing population, which leads to classroom overcrowding. This is why we as a state adopted Robin Hood school funding laws, taking from rich districts to fund poor districts in the hopes of stabilizing performance, which worked fine for the 90’s, but they were declared unconstitutional by the State Supreme Court in 2004, I think. Of course, all this means teacher salaries aren’t terribly high in much of the state, and all of this stacks on the politicization of the language issue to insure that the majority of South Texas districts will continue to return poor results year after year, pushing down the state averages.
3) TAAS/TAKS. You would know this as the No Child Left Behind standardized tests. We’ve had them in Texas since I was in the 3rd grade, and I’m a post grad so that should tell you something about the condition of Texas schools. A school with low test performance has its funding cut. All the arguments against NCLB being trotted out these days have been part of Texas politics for years. Really, I can’t understand why the rest of the country, when looking at how TAAS has played out in Texas, ever allowed their legislators to support that idiotic bill. The whole point of it is to defund and discredit public schools so that conservs can push their charter schools where its perfectly acceptable to teach creationism and revisionist U.S. history. That’s how they’ve used it in Texas, and that’s what they planned on doing with it at the national level. Same thing with Bush’s environmental policies btw; during Ann Richards governorship, Houston was the cleanest metropolitan area in the Union; by the end of Bush’s it was so dirty the EPA put a lien on any new construction within it’s limits.
There are other reasons too I’d imagine; Macmillian wanting to make money by printing substandard textbooks and using the typical shenanigans to get them adopted in the state, the shoddy enforcement of educational standards and uniformity throughout the state, the segregation/discrimination issue brought up by a previous poster, ect. ect. Most of these are the same sort of difficulties most states faced over the course of this century though, and to varying degrees they have fairly simple remedies. It’s those big three though, I think, that cause the problem. And none of those are related to this creationism bs going on right now.
The current crop of creationist nonsense has not been a part of Texas educational politics or discourse (that I’ve noticed) until recently. They are definitely motivated by politics, they are most certainty the result of ID institute prodding, and looking at it as a concerted campaign to try and gain legitimacy and a foothold in what they see as a friendly state, at a time when there’s what they see as a friendly Supreme Court, is absolutely positively accurate. My point is that this isn’t a natural outgrowth of how the state or its people look at these issues. To give an example, Texas A&M is a college that, just 3 years ago, had a scandal involving a school newspaper running a black-face cartoon. Right now, they’re in a huff over the first woman being appointed president to the university(or it might be to the board of regents, I’m kinda fuzzy on that atm). They fight the state and municipalities (Bryan and College Station) ever year for the right to allow drunken college students to build a multi-story structure out of shaved logs and burn it, even though only ~5 years ago numerous such students were crushed by such a structure and, even before that, a handful of casualties resulted from it ever year. My point is, Texas A&M is not the most enlightened and forward thinking institution out there. Yet their biology, veterinary, and agronomics departments (national leaders in the subjects from what I understand) didn’t lose a second in signing that letter of protest this week, and you can bet you kidney the heads of those departments will be at whatever hearings regarding these issues get held. You see what I’m saying? They aren’t nice people by any means, but they’re no more anti-science than any of us here.
For what it’s worth I just sent the following email to the Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board. I urge anyone else living in Texas to go to http://www.thecb.state.tx.us/Comments/ and let them know how you feel.
“I just read, with considerable alarm, about the request by the Institute for Creation Research in Dallas to teach a masters level degree in science education. I have visited their web site and it is evident they have no intent of teaching real science, specifically evolution, in the classroom. Despite the protests of the intelligent design/creationist supporters, they do not apply scientific principles to reach conclusions based on verifiable evidence.
Now this group seeks approval so that graduates of this institution could become public school teachers within Texas. As the father of two high school students I am very concerned that if this oranization is approved that my kids could end up with a teacher who masquerades religious belief as science in the classroom.
Creationists say they only wish to “teach both sides.” This is a false dichotomy; their only desire is to take pot-shots at evolution which is strongly supported by solid scientific evidence while simultaneously claiming unsubstantiated creationism as the only other alternative. I hope the board can truly see that approval of The Creationist Worldview certification program opens the door of science education in Texas to any and all beliefs being taught as science.
I strongly urge the board not to approve the Institute for Creation Research in Dallas for any recognition that would permit graduates of their course to teach creationism in our school’s science classrooms.
Thank you for your time.”
Experienced students may wish to move on to our advanced creation science topics:
* Geology According to Genesis: a Modern Evaluation (GAGME)
* Worldwide Inundation Theories: Hermeneutial Approaches (WITHA)
* Faith Overrides Rational Knowledge (FORK)
BTW: A Happy Beethoven’s Birthday to all. I know I’ll be celebrating.
I’ll be nice and tell you up front-this comment starts way off topic, but explains my attitude towards Texas bullshit.
Ah , Texas. I try not to be prejudiced, I really do. Both sides of my family have some roots in Texas. Bill Hicks, ZZ Top and Butthole Surfers are from Texas, right?
I try to be nice, but I pretty much blew my top a few years back when Christian Republican Texas businessmen and Christian Republican Texas politicians conspired to fake a few energy crises and not only rob my beautiful home state of California of tens of billions of dollars, but then turn around and use those extra funds to help recall a semi-decent governor whose biggest fault was trusting Christian Republican Texans. His second biggest fault was being too much like a Republican himself, but that’s beside the point.
The point is that the voters of Texas have backed people who are willing to break laws and lie to steal money from more legitimately successful states and use those some of those funds to interfere in OUR fucking politics. We Californians elect shitty enough governors on our own, thank you very much! Due to high rates of voter sanity, none of them so far have been downright lunatics but with Texas’ help, I’m sure we’ll get there soon.
And now this. I would ignore it as an internal matter and laugh it off but because of the market size and textbook issues, I can’t. I don’t want the festering Texas Christian Republican Retard plague to infect this state as well. All I can legally do is be more vigilant for my own state and be more vocal about the issues.
Sane Texans reading this: Get off your asses and fight! The battle is here and now, right where it’s always been. I apologize for ranting on old issues, I apologize for broad and hasty generalizations, but Damn! I live in a state full of non-english speaking immigrants, single parents, potheads, hard core druggies, gangs, actors, porn stars, rock stars, the looniest of the left and a whole lot of christian republican rednecks who are actually(slowly) trying to improve themselves. And as unharmonious a lot as we are, even the D students know that Jesus Christ and Louis Pasteur don’t belong in the same fucking class.
I am a product on Texas schools in their reality based heyday of the 70s and 80s. We had quite good comprehensive sex education, thorough teaching of geology and biology (notice I didn’t “evolution”, evolution was not presented as a special topic, but rather as part of the glue that held biology together) and no-nonsense drug education. History class taught both that free trade is generally good and that the kind of life we live today is largely due to the successes of the labor movement. Sure, the biology textbooks had that “theory rather than fact” disclaimer stamped in them (which showed an ignorance of the accurate meaning of these terms), but for the most part, everything was as it should have been.
Where did it all go wrong? Back in the 80s Texas was the urban, progressive powerhouse, diversifying its economy to cope with the oil slump and the savings and loan crisis. I blame W. How did he beat Richards? I think that election was rigged.
But really, things aren’t so bad here. We have a Pacifica station, and the Houston Progressive Forum sells out the halls every month. We just have to get the limo-liberals of Houston (as featured in the film _Rushmore_) to realize their very way of life is under threat. Money talks and they’ve got lots of it.
I realize why you’re incensed at the state right now, but crackpot opinions about history based on opinion and emotion instead of facts are just as wrong-headed as similarly motivated scientific ones.”””
Where am I wrong?
Jonathan Vos Post says
Based on their own publications, ICR Graduate School has offered graduate education for over 25 years, establishing itself as the WORST graduate institution in the disciplines of creation science.
If they disagree, let them identify a worse one among their competitors.
Even if, that is, one considers these “disciplines” rather than dogma-factories, and incorrectly believed that “creation science” was science.
Steve LaBonne says
I’m dreaming of a big lawsuit
Just like the Dover one we know
Where the lawyers glisten
And judges listen
To learn what our kids should know
I’m dreaming of a big lawsuit
That will make Texas see the light
May your days be merry and bright
And may Texas someday get it right.
Steve Sutton says
Texas: It’s like a whole other third-world country. At least, it will be, if this keeps up.
It is part of a wish to return to the days of slavery, where if nothing else, you were the superior of any black.
KEEP THOSE FLAMERS HOT!
The game will be played here in Austin. Use the CRI to bash the Texas Education Agency. Make the point that Theocracy & Piety aren’t good business.
The smalltowners call us “The Peoples Republic of Austin.”
Tom DeLay told an audience, in Pearland, don’t send your children to UT. A&M or Baylor “…because they teach evolution”. The active support of ignorance is usually done out of sight by pols seeking to milk pious votes.
Maybe a little rivalry would wake them up: Seed magazine: Arab world builds its own science infrastructure.
(Much of it from the U.S.)
Ed Darrell says
Greg Laden said:
Good heavens! That’s brilliant!
Buy space in the “legal notices” section of the newspaper and publish the names. See if you could put the ad next to the city’s listing of johns arrested for soliciting sex for hire. Start a website to list the names and aliases of the graduates; call it a “registry,” and put a notice in that while law currently prevents cities from telling schools not to hire these people, or from telling them they could not live within 1,000 feet of a school or church, the public has a right to know . . .
Can we start with a list of past graduates? Some of us here in Texas fear that the State Board of Education and the staff at the Texas Education Agency are loaded with parolees from the ICR. It would be interesting to see.
David Marjanović, OM says
Link doesn’t work.
David Marjanović, OM says
Link doesn’t work.
PZ Myers says
Legal notices in a newspaper is too evanescent. It’s got to go on the web, so that googling a job candidate’s name turns up his or her ICR affiliations.
I am being trained in Texas at UTA. I can understand where you are coming from in this, but I don’t think that my degree, which will end up putting me 50-60k in debt to get, should be made worthless because of a few fucktards in Austin.
Scott Hatfield, OM says
At the risk of being persnickety, ICR is already accredited through TRACS, which in turn is already recognized by the U.S. Department of Education. TRACS was placed on probation in the mid-1990’s due to irregularities in accreditation, but its recognition by USDE was effectively renewed in 2004.
So what is at issue is not whether or not ICR is accredited, but whether the sovereign state of Texas will recognize said accreditation for the purpose of future compensation of Texas school teachers.
Gee, that was silly. Why spend 60K $ for a degree from UTA when you can get a degree from ICR for a few hundred bucks on line in a few weeks?
Of course, the ICR degree would only allow you to lie a lot and warp young minds in Texas but it will probably pay pretty well.
I’m starting to see that those ads for schools on matchbook covers and in the backs of comic books were real after all.
Hitler invoked god and Jesus often. It is all through Mein Kampf. He also thought the neopagan stuff was dumb and said so as well.
Xians have been lying about this ever since. They do it every time Hitler and the Nazis come up. A lie repeated a million times is still a lie. FWIW, they also forged documents after the war to try to cover up Hitlers reliance on Xians and Xianity to massacre millions of people. That didn’t work either.
Mark, we’ve heard your standard homeschool, brainwashed, moron, lies millions of times over the last 62 years. It was bullcrap in 1945 and it is bullcrap in 2007.
Try to do something honest for the first and last time in your life. Copy Martin Luther’s plan to eliminate the Jews, 7 points and it is on Wikipedia. At Nurenberg, some of the Nazis said they were just carrying out Luther’s plan. It was true but they hung them anyway.
OOPPPPSSSSSSSS!!!! Post above was for another thread. Where some creo homeschooler Godwined the board. These fundies haven’t had an original thought in centuries. This clown is repeating the old Hitler was an atheist crap.
raven: $60k to not be a raving retarded lunatic seems like a good deal to me:-p