Curtis Knapp, pastor of New Hope Baptist Church in Seneca, Kansas, says the government should kill homosexuals. (Whatever happened to small government? What about governs best that governs least? Inquiring minds want to know.) He said it in a sermon.
In the sermon, Knapp cites Scripture to back up his point and said among other things: “They should be put to death. That’s what happened in Israel. That’s why homosexuality wouldn’t have grown in Israel. It tends to limit conversations. It tends to limit people coming out of the closet.
“So, you’re saying we should go out and start killing them? No. I’m saying the government should. They won’t, but they should.”
And why? Oh you know – because Jesus. Or Leviticus, or Timothy, or one of those guys. Does it matter? The point is – we hates’em, precious.
Didn’t the Bible also say that thinking about killing someone, or even hurting them, was as bad as murder? Man, this guy is a mass-murderer by his own sick standards.
Whatever happened to “be shrewd as snakes and gentle as doves*”? This guy is just ham-fistedly violence-mongering. How disgusting.
*Though I’ve heard doves aren’t actually gentle or peaceful, making this yet another stupid Biblical teaching
The Seneca County administrator appears to have taken messaging lessons from DJ:
No thanks Ms. Haverkamp. I don’t feel safe in your county. No one thinks your governmental body advocates violence. That’s not the point. For me to feel safe, you would have had to have said,
“We are shocked and appalled and I want to make it perfectly clear that we not only don’t condone violence but we will defend the safety of any LGBT person in our jurisdiction. We will not tolerate even hints of violence.”
Oops. I’m sorry. I meant “messaging” lessons.
Puke.
With or without quotation marks?
And yes, excellent point.
Um, what about quotation marks (iz feeling stoopid)?
On “messaging”! I’ll take that as a no. :- )
I mean a without.
Or a “without.”
Goddammit O, you’re harshin’ me snark! 🙂
Oh, Ophelia, oh! I didn’t mean to indicate that I wanted you to change my post. Duh. Told you I was dumb tonight. Whatever. Doesn’t matter either way–I got my digs in, and we all know that’s what counts.
Reading about this highlights some reflection I’ve been doing recently about my past. I remember some sentiments of basic hope for the future as a younger person (for various values of younger) here in the U.S. Not hope in the “it’s all gonna be so great in 50 years when everyone has rocket boots!” sense, though I have had periods, even unto this day, of continued longing for rocket boots. Which is probably stupid, because I’d probably end up flying into a turbine or something in a horrific accident. So often what we imagine is cool about a technology ends up not at all how the technology (or the people who have it) behaves.
Anyway, I often felt a sense of hope more along the lines of, “Things seem to be better in many ways than previous years and generations have seen.”
That may have been accurate about some things like polio, which was gone in the U.S. by the time I was born.
One of the things that I thought, though, was that the U.S. (at the time, for whatever value of time at which I thought such) is really . . . advanced, for lack of a better word. I thought it was technologically advanced, and in many ways it is.
But I think I assumed that certain things like technologically advanced (or advanced in areas like polio eradication) also automatically meant socio-cultural advancement. After all, the U.S. of the past 40 years isn’t at all like Europe in 1190 C.E.!
It’s a reflection of my privilege in so many ways. Wow, the U.S.! Look how advanced we are!
And then a story like this comes up, another in a long line of U.S. stories, everything from rampant and systemic misogyny to rampant and systemic racism to disenfranchisement and disposal of people who are ill or poor, and on and on.
But the U.S.! Advanced!
Yet there are still far too many places in the U.S. where the socio-cultural mindset is Europe, 11-fucking-90 C.E. And anyway, any shaking of my head is just me stunned while once again trying to check my privilege. I have more work to do.
Will Knapp ever realize he’s not at all further along than 1190 C.E.? Will he care?
Maybe, increasingly, Knapp’s howl isn’t the call to crusade, but rather the dirge of his socio-cultural and political relevance lurching hatefully toward its appointed place in the dustbin of history.
I am heartened by you and your blog, Ophelia. I am heartened by the overturn of DOMA as your next post mentions. It is not on anyone else but me to make it for myself: I want that heartening to be the hope of getting better, not the hope of rocket boots.
Still learning,
Robert
Thankfully (and hopefully), Robert, I think that’s it. It’s disturbing to watch the cockroaches crawl out into the light in all their disgusting glory, but this happens every time a dying generation realizes it’s doomed. I really do think this is the last gasp of a generation of vileness that will be looked at with shock and spitting scorn in the history books.
What are the chances that Curtis Knapp has already killed a homeless or sex working gay man or trans woman? Pretty high, I’d say. The police should investigate this scary homocidal creep fully and watch him like a hawk from now on if they don’t find anything right away. That sermon was a window into his psyche.
Spelling error: I meant homicidal. And I see Urban Dictionary has already ruined what could have been a good word for people expressing a desire to slaughter gay people.
I love/HATE the second part of his quote: “I’m not saying WE should kill teh gayz, I’m saying duh gubmint should kill teh gayz. It’s not the same thing if duh gubmint does it, and they’re not actually going to do it anyway, so it’s okay to ponder it longingly!”
SM F-ing H
Well, I suppose you could say that this is marginally better than the pastor who wants to round up gay people and put them into concentration camps where they will all die out because “they can’t reproduce.” At least Knapp seems to understand that you can’t eliminate homosexuality through violence and oppression — you can only shut it up and drive it underground. Which is apparently an acceptable substitute, in God’s eyes. He’ll forgive the nations which do that, and not punish the whole room for the misdeeds of a few.
The more they want to drive us all into a closet, the more I want to remove the hinges from the closet door.
And yes, I love this example of “smaller government.”
Oh, so he only wants them dead if they’re obviously gay, but hiding it is ok.
Sounds like someone who’s already in the closet, but wants company!
Josh:
Oh, OUCH.
Desert Son:
I grew up in the 1970s and early ’80s. I had a similar feeling, except that it wasn’t based on technology but on the rapid degree of social change in those years. I was unaware then that progress can be reversed.
Mortally wounded animals remain vicious and dangerous.
Aratina:
{{shudder}}
But I have little to no hope that, even if there were a smoking gun, justice would be done. A white straight cis fundie preacher, versus a sex worker who doesn’t conform to patriarchal gender roles, in Kansas.
I think so too. And oh, do I hope so.
So is this pastor also going to call for intervention on wearing mixed fabrics and eating shellfish? How about killing children who change their religion? Why is it just the gay bits of Leviticus that are trotted out? Isn’t it ALL god’s word? I guess they really, really just want to kill gay people (but still enjoy Red Lobster).
Of course, modern Israel has more-progressive laws with regard to homosexuality than the US.
Israel has allowed gays to openly serve in the military since — well, for a lot longer than the US.
Civil unions are available, and marriages from other countries are recognized.
In fact, homosexuality is not illegal and private behavior (a boy kissing a BOY!) is not regulated.
So, Israel appears to have little problem at all with gays.
He must be thinking of Iran. I know, both “I” words.
No, Kevin. He’s thinking about Bronze Age Israel. Because the Bronze Age was the Golden Age, after all.