Creepy Uncle Jordy has some advice about rape

He has sympathy for the idea that rape is not a property crime, but a crime against a person, BUT

Sure, you can say that untrammeled sexual access to a woman is a crime, but it needs to be criminalized in such a way that men still flock to her defense. It’s not sufficient to have a society where a woman can say “no”, you also have to arrange it so that she will have enraged masculine protectors surrounding her.

Continuing this reasoning based entirely on the idea that women are helpless, I don’t think it’s sufficient that it’s against the law to beat up weak old men and steal their money, we have to rally beefcake to defend them when they step out on the street. Likewise, it’s terrible that birds are preyed upon by cats…we need to put an army of strong young men who are angry on patrol in our parks.

This is the logic of a bully who thinks the solution to everything has to be force, preferably force delivered by some brutish male. Reduce everything to a question of whether a gang of men will support it — that’s the way the Proud Boys think.

Quickly, before they usual mob starts screaming about “CONTEXT!” — that short clip comes from a nauseatingly long (one hour and 45 minutes!) interview by Louise Perry, a conservative “feminist”. This clip comes from around 1h 30m in the whole thing, and precedes a bit where he explains that “unsophisticated women” don’t say “no” soon enough or strongly enough, but hey, he’s not blaming the victim, he says. If we could fix this, we wouldn’t have this huge debate about consent on college campuses, he claims.

What debate? I think it’s settled. Non-consensual sexual assault is bad. No debate necessary.

I didn’t listen to the whole thing. Five minutes of pompous babbling with weird hand gestures is about all I can take.


  1. says

    In the code of Hammurabi, rape is indeed a property crime against the father, husband, or slave owner depending. If you rape a virgin, you have to pay her father and marry her. If you rape a slave, you owe a fine to the owner.

  2. F.O. says

    I stopped calling out the utter logical inconsistency of… pretty much all of modern right-wing rhetoric?

    They don’t care.
    If they cared, they would be able to find the flaw themselves, it’s not difficult.

    And if you point the flawed logic at them, all they do is “LOL I triggered you!”

    Because all they care about is “My team strong! Others inferior!”

  3. raven says

    Jordan who?
    His 15 minutes of fame is long over with.

    He is now just repeating right wingnut talking points for money.
    This is the strategy of a parasite, a parasite of right wingnuts.

    We all need money but most of us try to find something worthwhile and useful to earn it.

  4. raven says

    Peterson is a very vocal miosogynist. He truly hates women, especially autonomous women sometimes called feminists.

    There was that enforced Monogamy plan.
    Sure it is disgusting and cuckoo.
    It’s also just one of many Peterson’s misogynistic comments.

    Jordan Peterson is a sick puppy!!! No matter how horrible a human being you think he is, the reality if far worse.

    Here is a repost with some of Peterson’s greatest hits. There are pages and pages of sick trash like this.
    My replies are in bold.

    ..women have a subconscious wish for brutal male domination
    This is bullcrap. He doesn’t know this.
    ..that it’s unfortunate that men can’t control women who say crazy things because they aren’t allowed to hit them
    How about crazy men like Peterson. We aren’t allowed to hit them either.
    Peterson admires violence and is frustrated that he can’t be violent towards women.
    Guy is a sick puppy.

    ..young women are outraged because they don’t have a baby to suckle
    Gibberish. He doesn’t know this. It’s just a misogynistic insult.

    ..if a woman doesn’t want to have kids, there’s something wrong with her
    Gibberish. It’s an opinion or an assertion without proof. It’s also wrong.
    It’s a sick puppy thing again.

    ..and says “The idea that women were oppressed throughout history is an appalling theory.” – despite women lacking basic human rights and legally being owned by men throughout history
    The oppresion was/is blatantly true and obvious.
    ..says stuff like “Men cannot oppose pathological women because chivalry demands they keep their most potent weapons sheathed” on twitter
    That violence thing again. I would be very surprised if Peterson doesn’t have a history of violence against women, children, and pets. Anything smaller and weaker than himself.
    There is lots more. Pages and pages of sick garbage like this.
    No matter how ugly and vicious Peterson seems, the reality is going to be far worse.
    More from a respected blogger, wonkette.

    SO MANY. Starting with “the idea that women were oppressed throughout history is an appalling theory,” and moving on to calling women who wear makeup and heels at work and don’t want to be sexually harassed “hypocrites.”

  5. raven says

    Peterson has been a lifelong conperson.

    It worked until it didn’t. Everywhere he has been, he has alienated everyone sooner or later, and they’ve eventually seen through him.
    Even his academic specialty, Jungian psychology is rather dubious as to whether there is anything there besides old pseudoscience.

    College of Psychologists of Ontario to Jordan Peterson › news › college-psychologists-…

    Jan 11, 2023 — The College of Psychologists of Ontario is threatening to revoke Peterson’s psychology license if he refuses to undergo reeducation,

    Peterson has been reprimanded by his professional organization in Ontario and is about to lose his license to practice clinical psychology.
    Peterson is far less qualified than my cat to practice anything involving interacting with humans.
    This is the guy the term, “toxic personaltiy” was invented for.

    He has also been kicked out by the University of Toronto, despite tenure.
    And long after they should have done so.

  6. cheerfulcharlie says

    Not only women get raped. Men are sometimes raped by other men. Maybe Jordan Peterson can tell us his thoughts on his own self being raped by another male, or gang of violent male rapists and why that would or would not be wrong. And then may rethink his stupid ideas about women and rape.

  7. says

    Everywhere he has been, he has alienated everyone sooner or later, and they’ve eventually seen through him.

    That could be why he no longer has fanboys patrolling the ‘tubes and reliably coming to his defense wherever he’s criticized. Perhaps even that lot have at realized they can’t credibly defend him anymore.

    And how have his personal healthcare choices been of late?

  8. says

    Even his academic specialty, Jungian psychology is rather dubious as to whether there is anything there besides old pseudoscience.

    It’s perfect for someone like Peterson, because it allows him to tell other people about themselves, using old stories, fairytales, fantasies and “archetypes,” instead of having to sit and listen to a bunch of people they don’t like telling them anything.

  9. woozy says

    I am not sure he knows what the hell is he talking about.

    Well, to be fair, I don’t know what the hell he’s talking about either.

  10. ANB says



    PZ, I’m surprised you could listen to 5 minutes of this guy.

  11. Dunc says

    Even his academic specialty, Jungian psychology is rather dubious as to whether there is anything there besides old pseudoscience.

    We could argue about whether psychology as a whole is a pseudoscience, but even so, most psychologists have regarded Jungian psychology as pseudoscience for about 50 years.

  12. chrislawson says

    Contra Peterson’s pathetic insistence, any interpretation suggesting that delaying a “no” is part of the causal chain that leads to rape is definitely victim-blaming.

    Any suggestion that we need to educate people to say “no” earlier is just outright rape apologetics.

    How about educating people about consent instead of inventing arbitrary cutoff points?

  13. whywhywhy says

    #16 But consent requires listening to other people and respecting their views as being valid. These are not Peterson’s strengths. Especially, if the other person is female. I can see why he is looking for ways to make rape OK rather than treating women as equals.

  14. cheerfulcharlie says

    Everybody understands “no”. The problem is those who do not care about “no”. And ignore “no”.

  15. lanir says

    Wow, that’s impressive. I don’t think I’ve ever heard someone back their way into a defense of witch hunts, actual literal witch hunts, so quickly or effectively.

    It doesn’t take much to get there. He’s already tossed aside a woman’s consent as largely irrelevant. All the negative consequences such as loss of bodily autonomy with no justification, risk of disease, and risk of pregnancy with a partner not of their choosing are just not as important as what the men in their life feel about it. Which means it’s a popularity contest. Because if they don’t have men in their life, then what? It’s not a crime, he says? So how is that different from a witch hunt that targets unpopular women and kills them?

  16. cheerfulcharlie says

    Baliff, whack his pee pee!
    – Chech and Chong

    For some, “no mens no” will only count if the penalties are raised.

  17. unclefrogy says

    I have a problem just reading what this “guy” says I can not listen to him at all without getting angry and disgusted that such an asshole like him can make me angry .
    the only thing good about him and what he says is the focus on his attitude places and the question, do I harbor elements of them without thinking?