You know, MRAs and their fans think (or pretend to think) feminists hate men and say outrageous things about men, but take a look at “Ask Men,” which bills itself an advice site for men. Just the front page is insulting – it’s insulting the way things aimed at women are insulting to me. Sports grunt grunt. Cars grunt grunt. And then there’s “how to get a woman to put out” sorry I mean “top ten ways to flirt with a woman sexually.”
1 Find the double meanings
The English language is literally packed with words you can twist around to create sexual meanings. Wet, juicy, hard, fast, hot — the possibilities are endless. For example, if she says her drink is big, you can reply with something like: “Big can be a good thing, don’t you think?” You’ll be surprised how easy it is to add a bit of sexuality to everyday conversations once you start looking for opportunities.
Oh jeezis – this must be where Colin McGinn gets his ideas. “Hey baby – wanna pretend we’re glass-blowers so we can talk about hand jobs and blow jobs? wink wink nudge nudge know what I mean?”
2 Want to know a secret about female sexuality that 99% of men don’t know? Here it is: Many women feel compelled to vacuum their house when they’re ovulating. Some experts believe it has something to do with wanting to “clean the nest” before laying her “egg.” So, when a woman tells you she is vacuuming, say: “Vacuuming? Are you ovulating or something?” She’ll be stunned that you know this and wonder what else you know about female sexuality. Of course, if she doesn’t know what you mean, fill her in. Women love it when you teach them something new — especially about themselves.
That has got to be parody, right? But, no, it’s not. Which is worse – the ludicrous idea that it’s clever to say “Vacuuming? Are you ovulating or something?” or the even more ludicrous claim that women love it when Mr Horndog passes on some bullshit claim about women.
The advice is insulting to men (as well as women), and it’s also just bad advice. Maybe if they added a warning label saying this is advice strictly for avowedly pickup-oriented social occasions and no others, it would be ok, but it appears to be just general advice for talking to women to get them to fuck you. You know why that’s bad advice? Because what they’re advising is sexual harassment. It’s not like sexual harassment, it is sexual harassment. Note that “You’ll be surprised how easy it is to add a bit of sexuality to everyday conversations once you start looking for opportunities.” That is sexual harassment you’re talking about there!
It’s as if the advice had been written by the Two Wild and Crazy Guys, now that their English has improved.
The first one sounds like a young-ish teenager trying to seem older by turning absolutely everything everyone says into sexual innuendo because they think grown ups talk about sex all the time.
The second one is frankly baffling.
This is treated as serious advice for human interaction ?!? Honestly, it looks more like a scam/prank along the lines of Monty Python’s “Hungarian Phrasebook” sketch. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6D1YI-41ao
“I wish to plead incompetence” indeed!
So, Michael Scott’s writing for Ask Men, now?
Nothing more sexy and manly than a “That’s what she said!” joke.
There’s a reason his office had a full time HR rep. It’s not even okay in a fictional workplace.
That’s a fascinating bit of insight about the vacuuming. And here I was thinking that we vacuum a couple of times a week because, you know, cats.
Please tell me this is an Onion type site, please?!
What does this have to do with MRAs? You do realize that Cosmopolitan and other trashy women’s magazines have the same kind of idiotic advice, only in reverse. Google “how to get a man to give you a ring” and see what you come up with. Does this mean feminists hate men? I am having trouble following your logic here.
And then I’m guessing these same dingdongs wonder why they aren’t wild hits with gorgeous women. Right?
As they say elsewhere on the intertoobz: Teh Stupid. It Burns.
Sean – that’s what I said. Second sentence in the post; you can’t miss it. “Just the front page is insulting – it’s insulting the way things aimed at women are insulting to me.”
Michael Scott is indeed the right comparison. I almost got there – I was thinking of The 40-year-old Virgin, specifically the advice given by the Seth Rogen character and his pals. David Brent even better.
I must be the one in my household who ovulates because I do all of the vacuuming. That’ll come as a surprise to the wife.
Sean, are you labouring under the assumption that these “how to please a man so he will marry you”-shitbits are in any way feminist? If so, you may need some “Feminism 101” education.
I’m pretty sure that’s not Ophelia’s fault.
@Sean Hint: Cosmo is not written by feminists.
I thought I ran the vacuum so often because there are so many people and critters tracking dirt in the house. But thanks to this genius, I now know that I just ovulate daily.
Sean, Cosmo isn’t a feminist magazine. Feminists are not concerned with getting trinkets from men. I’m not sure why you think that mentality s remotely related to feminism.
How often, exactly, do they think women talk about vacuuming? It really doesn’t strike me as the sort of conversation I’d have, well, ever, but especially not in a situation where chatting-up would be likely.
So is the fact that I’m a slob who rarely vacuums somehow linked to the fact that I asked my doc to put me on the pill to stop me from having periods?
Oh but these rules aren’t just for situations where chatting-up is likely! They’re for ALL situations. Or if they’re not, the geniuses in charge forgot to stipulate that.
Top Ten Ways to Get a Woman to Stare at You Before Finally Saying, “Are You Fourteen?”
“You do realize that Cosmopolitan and other trashy women’s magazines have the same kind of idiotic advice, only in reverse.”
Oh, no. Not at all Sean. My sister recently bought a copy and I flipped through it, about 4 different articles with variations on How To Please Your Man (I’m not kidding). It’s definitely not feminist. The advice isn’t in reverse, it’s sexist towards women. There aren’t articles on how to chip away at your boyfriends confidence so he won’t leave you, or how to beat your husband and get away with it, like I’ve seen in mainstream men’s magazines.
I vacuum every Saturday. And I expect I will continue to vacuum after menopause. Anyone who thinks there is a correlation between my vacuuming and ovulation is not someone who knows enough about my anatomy to touch my body.
I is laughing hard.
… See also, as per OB’s observation: ‘The sexual harassment fake book.’
Alternate alternate title: ‘No, honest, the world really does need more inane, predictable double entendres with skeevy, suggestive overtones, we swear’.
(/Alternate alternate alternate title: ‘The horrible sitcom writer’s sourcebook’.)
Won’t the house have got dirty again after nine months? These ovulating women just don’t think it through. Probably because they’re hormonal.
I wished I could use this vacuum-info to adequately time my contraception. Apprently we only need to use any when we get back from the holidays and the caravan needs cleaning because I fucking never use the vacuum.
Oh, today I stumbled about an online guide for sex and breasts. 9 out of 10 points were about how I can use my breasts to please him and exactly one was about how my breasts could play a role in my enjoyment….
@Kevin Anthoney points out a flaw in the method. A correction is needed. Clearly one should say “Vacuuming? Are you ovulating or pregnant?
”
I don’t often whip out the word “ludicrous”, but it seems apropos for this odd advice.
Unfortunately, I specifically bought a house with no carpet at all (small children + multitudes of critters). Fortunately, my ovulation is fairly easy to spot. It’s when I jump my husband whenever we get a moment alone. All hail the vasectomy.
Please note that the advice is for betas. It says so right in the name of the website, at the top of the page.
While reading those click-baited pages, it occurred to me that if I were conspiracy-minded I would see this as kind of sinister — not against women but against the men who take this ridiculous advice seriously. You see, any man who tries to follow this advice will be turned down or turned in. He will then blame women for his rejection (never blaming the bro’s who want to sabotage their competitors), and this will feed into the cycle of loathing that keeps the MRA scene going.
But actually, the simpler explanation is that is an attempt to get webhits from people who can only read one paragraph per page.
Oh, dear. I’ve gone over to read the original, and I’m still having a difficult time believing it’s not a parody.
If you start at the beginning (the intro comes before the 10th-most effective tip, and from there it’s a countdown), it says that the article is going to show you how to talk to women like this with being “creepy” or “clueless”.
So…really, this *is* a joke, right? Because it’s ALL creepy and clueless. REALLY REALLY creepy and ASTOUNDINGLY clueless. I mean…use innuendo to tell her she’s a stud, so if she says, about something else, like you making her a drink, “gee, you’re good at that”, tell her “I’m good at LOTS of things”, and she’ll get the hint that you’re a real stud.
Oh. My. Freakin. Lord. This IS a joke. Honestly. It just *has* to be a joke.
Okay, that was supposed to be “tell her you’re a stud”
@26-I think you may be on to something.
@28-If a guy has to tell someone he’s a stud that’s a pretty clear sign that he isn’t.
If some guy asked me, “you know what else is big”, I would have to say your stupidity? But that is only if I were clever enough. I would probably would just stare at him as if he were stupid
I never said Cosmopolitan was a feminist magazine. That it isn’t is precisely the point I am making. I don’t see the connection between Ask Men and MRAs anymore than I see the connection between Cosmo and feminism.
If you have a link to an article in one of those lad mags on how to beat your wife and get away with it I’d appreciate if you could share it. I find the idea of that far more repulsive than this article, and am curious just how low some of these publications will sink.
um, people, sean didn’t say that cosmo was written by feminists.
sean seems to be saying that it is not clear what the association is between “ask men” and mras.
just like there being no association between “cosmo” and feminists.
the problem with what sean said is that mras were not claimed to be responsible here. sean needs to re-read the first sentence in the OP again. that first sentence only says that men apparently say some stuff that is also insulting to men.
Jeezis. Sean: It’s in the first paragraph of the post.
I’ll break it down into smaller pieces.
MRAs say feminists hate men and say things that are insulting to men.
Ask Men says things that are far more insulting to men than anything feminists say.
Ask Men is not feminist.
It’s interesting that Ask Men is more misandrist than feminism is.
How about this, Sean.
Category: Insulting to women; Says hateful or outrageous things about men / Not Feminist
*MRAs
*Ask Men website
*Cosmo
Category: Feminist
*none of the above
Clear?
If a guy has to tell someone he’s a stud
Then screw him into your tyre; they are great for winter traction.
No ovaries. Must explain why I hate vacuuming.
Argh. The killer is that it is a good thing to know about women’s biology, and it will probably make a woman happier if you have that knowledge. Just don’t use it as a damn pickup line, especially if it’s….you know…really stupid-sounding, and probably not actually true.
I can’t speak to the usefulness of any of the advice in that Ask Men article — most of it seems a little silly. But we’re not pretending that people don’t pick-up people are we? We’re not going to pretend that people don’t make sexual comments to each other and that sometimes it works?
Politeness or etiquette notwithstanding, we don’t live in a world where people walk around acting like androgynous robots with no sex drive. Yes, if a person is at their job, they should refrain from conversations that are inappropriate. The HR Dept. will have a guide. But men and women do it because it works. It might not work with Person A, B or C, but Person D will respond positively. That’s why it’s done.
I surfed that site and I found what Ophelia’s post has embedded above: links to David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating. So the article is essentially an infomercial, which makes me wonder who’s behind AskMen in general.
Brighter side: This thread is a good excuse for a link to Danice Macleod’s Crevice Tool (circa 1987).
@Sean
It’s actually “How To Beat Your Wife Without Leaving Marks,” my apologies. (But googling how to beat your wife and get away with it gets you a ton of hits from various sites, it’s pretty gross.)
It was in Playboy:
http://www.eurowrc.org/00.news/10.news.htm
The other article on chipping away at your girlfriend’s self esteem (one of the bits of advice was to go to strip clubs regularly and let her know you do, so that she knows there are always women with better bodies out there to keep her insecure). I can’t remember the name of the magazine, but my male roommate left it behind when he moved out and it was sickening. It wasn’t a porn mag, it was a pretty mainstream one from what I can remember.
The advice has that familiar not-so-subtle contempt toward women that mras are known for. But I think that’s a pretty mainstream attitude, mras just take it to new levels of nasty.
Here is the actual article:
Playboy. Romania, April 2000, Anul 2, No. 4
>
>How to beat your wife… without leaving prints.
>
>1. Here is one of the modern man’s problems! Most men have felt the natural
impulse to pommel his wife’s face, but even more men wonder what they will
do if she goes to the Medico-Legal Institute. Certificate, trial, divorce,
what else? Nasty! So, upon the request of an increasing number of readers,
we asked for the advice of a specialist in the field: N.C.O. Gabor.
>
>2. As a surgeon, you have to weigh each move. You have to be confident and
determined. You have decided to beat her up, then do it. Why? She knows why.
Firstly, you stare at one piece of wife. It’s best to get to her hair. Then
you stick your hands in her hair. Necessary tools: a policeman’s beating
stick. If you do not have one, improvise. Suggestions: a pot stick, a
washing-machine driving belt etc.
>
>3. If you hold her well by her hair, the job is almost done; as she cannot
escape. Still, the operation is not over. You take a (kitchen) chopper that
will be applied slowly to the wife’s livers. Once the chopper is fixed
there, you only have to hit her with the stick. Hard and with a proletarian
hatred; and most important: without fear! If you are afraid, you’d better
quit. Take up knitting!
>
>4. Hit hard and steady, since you do not know when you have a second
chance. Even if she acts as if she screamed in pain, do not be afraid! It is
just a fake! The important thing is the way you hold the victim. At the
beginning, given that you do not have experience, the girl will escape from
your “claws”. In such circumstances, give her a little extra at the end. So
that she is accustomed to it.
>
>5. After the beating, you only have to watch. She will swear like hell and
will threaten you with divorce, court, alimony and all kind of non-sense.
But when she looks around at the deed’s place, in search for prints and
bruises that will be good for a trial, surprise!!! Not even a print. The
beating must not last more than 10-15 minutes.
>
>Here is the end. Confronted with such a work of art, the wife will
certainly be impressed. Only experts can beat so awfully nice. On the other
hand, you will notice that the wife sometimes wants to be beaten up again.
As one says in an academic language: “Boy, she is really looking for a
beating, mother fucker!” Good luck and have a harmonious marriage!
I haven’t vacuumed in about 30 years. I have a very nice Italian lady who does it. Nevertheless I must have ovulated at some point, because I have two now-grown children. Did I miss something?
I still can’t wrap my head around a situation in which a guy would be chatting up a woman he doesn’t know well… while she is vacuuming something. ?
Oh, but theoreticalgrrrl, that article is just a joke, can’t you tell? They don’t really mean for you to beat your wife! They just think that it’s hilariously funny to talk about wife beating, that’s all. No problems there at all. *eyeroll*
Carlie, it IS a joke and meant to be a parody of macho attitudes as a gotcha for Playboy readers, I think, but it is pretty weak, I agree.
Splicer, if you can’t speak to the “usefulness” of the advice in that article, stop pretending like you know the first thing about seduction or hook-ups. No, lines like that don”t “work” on any woman who wasn’t desperate enough to get laid that she was willing to endure ignorant, insulting, sexist and even dull conversation to achieve her goal. in the first place. Yes, people “hook up”. No, women do not need to be tricked into sex. A man trying this ham handed attempt to pretend to know anything about a given woman and her interests might indeed get the attention he desires, but it will not be because of this horrible advice. It will be because he happened to encounter a woman who wanted him despite the fact that he has no real interest in women outside of what they can do for him sexually. I don’t know why you would pretend to think that talking to a woman about housework and ovulation is so hot that she’ll simply have to have you tonight! Surely, you know better. Meanwhile, please do not lecture us on how sexytimes work. We aren’t children. We have written nothing that implies prudishness or denial of human sexual appetite. So, let me put your troubled mind at ease: We’re aware that people have sex. That is not what is being criticized here.
@Minnow
“According to local experts, Romania leads Balkan statistics for domestic
violence against women, who have little legal protection in the ex-communist
country.”
I disagree that it is a parody, plenty of men have the exact same attitude toward women that the article conveys. You don’t do a parody of macho attitudes in a magazine for macho males, in a country that has high statistics for domestic violence against women. They won’t get it at all, they’ll just see it as more social proof that there is nothing wrong with what they do. If it is a ‘joke’, the wives are the butt of the joke.