More from the bully boyz


And then we drop in on the Ahmadiyya Muslim Youth Association UK – which is actually not a “youth association” at all because it addresses members as “Brothers,” so clearly it’s only for male youth. Anyway we drop in on it and find its views on how to get more deference and obedience from people who don’t share its religious commitments.

You should all now be aware that we have been running a campaign over the past week in response to the decision take by Atheist Society of UCL to post a cartoon depicting the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw) and the Holy Prophet Jesus (as) having a beer (God forbid) at a pub frequented by some of the UCL students.

To defend the honour of our beloved Prophets, a press release was issued along with a number of articles. Our message to the UCL Atheist Society was simply that they should use their right to ”freedom of speech” in a responsible way which demonstrates both tolerance and respect.

The voice of the goombah bully boy again. The voice of the thug smacking a club against the palm of his hand in a threatening manner. “Hey you: use your ‘freedom of speech’ [pause to spit on the ground] in a responsible way or you might be getting a visit from us. Demonstrate tolerance and respect or we’ll make things hot for you. When we say ‘respect’ we mean do whatever we say as soon as we say it; that’s respect. We hope we don’t have to remind you of this again.”

All this for the sake of “defending the honour” of a couple of guys who have been dead for many centuries.

Comments

  1. Brownian says

    Wait, a religious “youth association”? Does Stedman know about this? What an opportunity for them to all agree on how much they agree!

  2. Andrew B. says

    “…they should use their right to ”freedom of speech” in a responsible way which demonstrates both tolerance and respect.”

    “Freedom of speech” covers ALL speech, not just “respectful speech.” What kind of dipshit would think otherwise? What is irresponsible is to demand that only nice sentiments may be uttered, never unkind or critical ones. It is not for believers to decided what is responsible speech for atheists.

    I’m starting to think all of this Ahmadiyya “Love for All, Hatred for None” is just a bunch of bullshit. It’s not very loving to try to bully, intimidate or strong-arm others into honouring your unjustified demands. It’s actually rather bossy.

  3. Irene Delse says

    How nice of the Amhadiyya to lay it out for all to see: “yep, this is our strategy, using the words ‘tolerance and respect’ to silence critics”. Makes me think of the way Creationnists claim “academic freedom” to get their doctrine into science classrooms. Doublethinkers, all of them.

    Shall we start calling that “lying for Allah”, on a par with the “lying for Jesus” on the Fundies side?

  4. says

    I’ve never heard “goombah” used for anything other than an Italian guy.

    ***

    I was going to comment on the previous post, then just decided to turn it into a post of my own.

    ***

    and the Holy Prophet Jesus

    I imagine some Christians would find this offensive.

    ***

    their right to ”freedom of speech”

    Pretty telling scare quotes, there.

  5. says

    a cartoon depicting the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw) and the Holy Prophet Jesus (as) having a beer (God forbid)

    Well, if beer is so offensive to Jesus and Muhammad Peanut Butter Sandwiches…would you have preferred bacon?

  6. says

    What?:

    Moreover, the Holy Qur’an clearly explains what to do when someone offends your faith. “And when thou seest those who engage in vain discourse concerning Our Signs, then turn thou away from them until they engage in a discourse other than that.” (6:69)

    “Turn away from them.” That’s all. Not violence, not anger, not insulting responses. Simply turn away. This is the example Prophet Muhammad demonstrated in his own life, and this is the example every Muslim is bound to.

    Since when does “simply turn away” mean “lodge a formal complaint and start a petition and campaign”?

  7. Stonyground says

    I know that it is an old cliche but it is still true. You don’t demand respect, you earn it. Muslims, it is now the twenty-first century, we have advanced somewhat since the seventh century. the word for people who have a worldview that is fourteen hundred years out of date is backward.

    The people that I respect are great scientists and great thinkers, I don’t care what their religion is, or even if they have one, I am interested in what they have to say and whether what they have to say has merit.

  8. says

    I’m not sure the Ahmadiyya are being threatening, y’know. The creepiest thing, for me, is how the student officials have got into such a flap after so little provocation. They haven’t faced the kind of menacing abuse that One Law For All did this week – or even, as far as I know, the thuggish bullying that Rhys Morgan’s had to deal with – but they’re still coming over all censorious.

  9. Maria says

    I’ve slowly realized that to some, the meaning of ‘respect’ as in “respectful manner” means that others need to deffer to and venerate them and their manner.

    While the word ‘tolerate’ as in “tolerance and acceptance” is stripped from that love one another idealism and means what it has traditionally meant, to endure until no longer required to.

  10. says

    All this for the sake of “defending the honour” of a couple of guys who have been dead for many centuries.

    If Jesus ever existed, that is.

    ***

    I’m not sure the Ahmadiyya are being threatening, y’know.

    Hard to say. They’re being creepy.

    The creepiest thing, for me, is how the student officials have got into such a flap after so little provocation. They haven’t faced the kind of menacing abuse that One Law For All did this week – or even, as far as I know, the thuggish bullying that Rhys Morgan’s had to deal with – but they’re still coming over all censorious.

    It is surprising and definitely signals a deeper problem. They should have considered and dismissed the complaint with a clear statement about freedom of expression, and instead they’re caving like E.A. Martel and allowing/promoting the characterization of this comic as “harassing” and an “attack.” The BBC is also treating it oddly seriously.

  11. Midnight Rambler says

    The voice of the goombah again.

    Uh…seriously, WTF? Now you’re going into ethnic insults?

  12. says

    Alllllllll right, it wasn’t intended as an ethnic insult. I thought it meant something like “bully boys.” One of those words understood from context, which turns out to mean misunderstood, or incompletely understood.

    Now I, unlike some people when told what “twat” or “pussy” or “cunt” means in a particular dialect (i.e. that of the US), am not going to argue the point and insist it means whatever I think it means. I’ll withdraw it.

    I’m not sure what the point of the “man of honor” is though. I wouldn’t think saying anything at all to a man of that type is a good idea.

  13. says

    I really don’t know what’s worse here, the Muslim theocrats who demand submission of free speech, or the “let’s just all get along” clowns at the UCLU.

  14. jeffengel says

    I really don’t know what’s worse here, the Muslim theocrats who demand submission of free speech, or the “let’s just all get along” clowns at the UCLU.

    “Let’s just all get along” is well and fine and good. It’s a noble goal. Perhaps all of us getting along would feature all of us talking reasonably, sharing views, and allowing our opinions to be changed on the basis of the merits of one another’s arguments.

    Thing is, it’s exactly that that’s being vigorously prevented when the “let’s all get along crowd” has it that getting along means that the reasonable party has to be silenced to please the threatening one. That’s “let’s all live in fear of the crazy people”.

  15. frankb says

    Thing is, it’s exactly that that’s being vigorously prevented when the “let’s all get along crowd” has it that getting along means that the reasonable party has to be silenced to please the threatening one. That’s “let’s all live in fear of the crazy people”.

    Thanks Jeffengel, for articulating this idea that I have been trying to find the words for. Very well put. When someone throws a temper tantrum, you don’t give in (parenting rule #1).

  16. Deepak Shetty says

    Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw) and the Holy Prophet Jesus (as) having a beer (God forbid)
    Well clearly Jesus needs to be depicted drinking wine.
    But hey they aren’t objecting to seeing The Holy Prophet’s image! Progress?

  17. platyhelminthe says

    As Sam Harris said, these are people that don’t have the first clue about how to live in a civil society.

  18. says

    jeffengel at #16 nails it, hits the bullseye, AND knocks it out of the park (if I may pile up metaphors). That is EXACTLY what the situation amounts to, and this is the best articulation of it that I’ve seen yet.

    ~David D.G.

  19. Midnight Rambler says

    Alllllllll right, it wasn’t intended as an ethnic insult. I thought it meant something like “bully boys.” One of those words understood from context, which turns out to mean misunderstood, or incompletely understood.

    Maybe you had to grow up in the Northeast. It refers to a type of overmuscled, underbrained Italian guy, usually with greased hair. It’s somewhat like “nigger”, in that you can use it if you Italian, but it’s still an insult. The guys on Jersey Shore are the epitome of goombahs.

    I’m not sure what the point of the “man of honor” is though.

    That was just a bit of a joke, since these nitwits are claiming to be “defending honor”. I’ve seen the phrase used in some other contexts by people who are apparently oblivious to that meaning (which is how I’ve heard it most often used), and it always causes a spit-take :)

  20. says

    I did grow up in the Northeast, but if I learned the word there I learned it (as mentioned) via context, which is an error-prone method. I grew up in New Jersey in fact but in a rather protected pocket of it, a complete stranger to Jersey Shore types.

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