Anita Sarkeesian is going to speak at Utah State, and they’ve been sent a death threat.
Marc Lepine, hero to men. I don’t think so.
Games are so very, very important to these wretches, aren’t they?
New development: Sarkeesian has canceled the talk. The reason? Utah allows people to carry guns into such events, and the university refused to prohibit firearms in the auditorium.
Fucking yahoos with their precious guns.
holy shit
That is terrorism, and there can be no reason to assume this is anything but a credible threat.
Hopefully they track down whomever sent that and put him in jail for a very long time.
All of my initial responses were unprintable.
I hope the authorities take this very seriously, and that the person making this obscene threat is found and arrested quickly.
Fucking sickening.
I don’t know… I hope Anita’s talk can go ahead, but I totally understand if USU caves for fear of it’s students. Damn. Does this count as (threats of) terrorism yet?
I suspect it’s another blowhard threat, but all it takes is one idiot to double down on their stupid. Seriously, the authorities need to start cracking down on this shit. This is terrorism. Prosecute a few of these arseholes, and maybe the rest of them will have a good long think before they make threats like these.
Here’s my Million Dollar Challenge entry: I predict the current responses will be…
1) It’s just a troll, why are you taking it seriously?
2) There’s no proof he’s associated with #GamerGate or 4Chan or MRAs or anything!
3) Anita Sarkeesian did it herself to drum up sympathy/attention!
And if the asshole follows through on his threats:
1) He’s just an outlier! There’s no proof that gamer culture had anything to do with this!
2) MENTAL ILLNESS MENTAL ILLNESS MENTAL ILLNESS!
3) It’s not about misogyny, it’s about how much his life sucked! Because of women!
4) It’s not about misogyny, he killed men too!
5) Did I mention mental illness?
How many Eliot Rodgers do we need before we recognize a pattern? How far does this bullshit need to go before the assholes who are supposedly all about fighting corruption actually call some of this out?
I hope the college doesn’t cave. I’m sure Anita probably won’t. She’s incredibly brave, but she shouldn’t have to be.
And here I thought women being threatened with death by bombing for speaking in public was strictly a Muslim problem /sarcasm.
gijoel, #5,
Seriously, that’s what I want to see more than anything else right now. A few of these pieces of shit getting arrested and penalized to the full extent of the law.
I hate that this is happening to such a great public figure and that it’s taking a toll on anyone else she is involved with. What a tough situation Utah State has been put in!
It looks like the gamesters are getting real desperate. AS may not be able to get the FBI to investigate, but a university who can enlist senators and congresspeople to investigate the threat? Pitiful decision at best by the dudebro….
Marc Lepine was a murderous psycho. I don’t visit the slymepit or any other similar venues. Please tell me this threat does not reflect a commonly (or even semi-commonly) held opinion. Please.
Pathetic. He wants to kill people to protest someone complaining about computer games?
I hope he gets arrested quickly.
@#9 I know Marc Lepine is not a hero to all men, but I do remember seeing graffiti at my university that read, “Good shooting, Marc!”
No, dominance is important to them. If they really cared about gaming, they would allow criticism to come in, which would cause the medium to diversify and grow. I suspect they just want to be kings of a little niche.
I still annualy commemorate December 6th, the day Lepine shot and killed 14 women at l’école Polytechnique. I remember exactly where I was that day when I first heard the news. I remember the shock, the horror and thinking “it could have been me, it could have been any of us”. I remember these students’ names.
This is no brave hero.
I admire Anita Sarkeesian for her work, but also for her fortitude. I hope she remains safe.
GamerGate’s newest motto: The tree of game-review objectivity must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of women with opinions and those who listen to them.
“feminists have ruined my life”??? Oh, really?
Poor schmuck probably doesn’t realize how traceable emails are nowadays. I hope the university’s security team have good contacts at FBI.
“Feminists have ruined my life.” Says the person claiming to be a student at a public university. Just being able to go to college puts you in a favored minority in the US, dude. (I feel fairly comfortable hypothesizing that the letter writer is a dude).
I doubt it. No criminal expects to be caught, else Texas would be homicide-free.
“Feminists have ruined my life and I will have my revenge…” Ahh, the bleating of the privileged loser, crying out for attention. I hope he is caught and convicted of a felony, so at least he won’t be able to legally own firearms anymore.
I also hope the university has a spine and refuses to be terrorized, but my cynicism is rising a bit high at this point.
I went to the original article linked to by Skepchick. The comments didn’t take long to go “BUT EXTREMIST FEMINISM!” That reminds me so much of those ages-old “extremist atheism” complaints, equating writing blogs and making videos with hateful violent behavior. Personal anecdote time: One of the reasons why I started getting more interested in feminism is how uncannily similar the pushback against it is to the one against atheism.
Sickening….
Hope Anita is safe and does whatever she feels is best for her own well-being.
I hope they find the fucker that sent this and prosecute them to the full extent of the law
http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE76/htm/76_05_010703.htm
Since the fucker’s threats include pipe bombs and not just firearms, they get a second degree felony.
http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE76/htm/76_10_040100.htm
Now let’s add up how much they should be punished:
http://le.utah.gov/code/TITLE76/htm/76_03_020300.htm
http://le.utah.gov/code/TITLE76/htm/76_03_030100.htm
1(a)(i) — pipe bomb threat — Second degree felony: 1-15 years & $10,000
1(b)(i) — coerceing the conduct of a government organization (Utah state) — Second degree felony: 1-15 years & $10,000
1(b)(ii) — keeping people away from the building — Third degree felony: 1-5 years & $5,000
1(b)(iii) — making the cops look into this threat — 1-6 months & $1,000
Ideally, this fucker should be put in prison for 35 years and fined $26,000.
Do it Utah.
Maybe that will make these MRA trolls shut the fuck up.
Holy fuck. This guy is wretched.
I may not agree with everything Anita says, but this kind of action is terrorism, and I hope they find the guy and throw the book at him. Death threats are never OK.
oualawouzou @9:
I can’t speak for anywhere else, but that is not an opinion held by the commentariat at Pharyngula, and I daresay, the whole of FtB.
If this isn’t making terroristic threats, I don’t know what is. And yet, where are the SWAT teams with flashbangs and assault rifles? Where are the MRAPs and the snipers and the FBI sting operations and the sweeping search and arrest powers that we’ve been assured are needed to fight terrorism at home? What’s that? The perpetrator isn’t brown or foreign? The target is a woman? He’s not even some pinko or environmentalist or anything? He’s an upstanding American White Man? Why then it can’t be terrorism; it’s just boyish high spirits. Fucking hell.
I know on an intellectual level that some people receive death threats all the time but I realize that I’ve never read a detailed threat like this before. Holy shit, that’s disturbing.
Hope they catch the guy. Whether it’s a sincere threat or not, this is the definition of terrorism as Jeff S pointed out.
oualawouzou @9
Threats of terrorism, not so much. But the outright misogyny and contempt for any woman who speaks up feeds into this extremist behavior. What does a person like Elliot Rodger think when he sees women be degraded or viewed only as a conquest? It’s the same with people who cover up for rapists and/or blame the victim. They might not be rapists but they give cover and comfort to those that are.
14 names far more worthy of memory than that of a murderer:
Geneviève Bergeron (born 1968), civil engineering student
Hélène Colgan (born 1966), mechanical engineering student
Nathalie Croteau (born 1966), mechanical engineering student
Barbara Daigneault (born 1967), mechanical engineering student
Anne-Marie Edward (born 1968), chemical engineering student
Maud Haviernick (born 1960), materials engineering student
Maryse Laganière (born 1964), budget clerk in the École Polytechnique’s finance department
Maryse Leclair (born 1966), materials engineering student
Anne-Marie Lemay (born 1967), mechanical engineering student
Sonia Pelletier (born 1961), mechanical engineering student
Michèle Richard (born 1968), materials engineering student
Annie St-Arneault (born 1966), mechanical engineering student
Annie Turcotte (born 1969), materials engineering student
Barbara Klucznik-Widajewicz (born 1958), nursing student
Can we avoid constantly repeating the names of the vile shitstains who have murdered women for misogyny? They do it in part for the notoriety, we don’t have to give it to them, do we?
Why the hell do I keep seeing this in comment sections? I’m trying to remember the last time I wanted to make it clear that I had disagreements with someone before I denounced the threats against them.
Thank you, Pete Newell.
Vice wrote an article about this today, “DOES SOMEONE HAVE TO ACTUALLY DIE BEFORE GAMERGATE CALMS DOWN?”
http://www.vice.com/read/calm-down-gamergate-283
For the answer, please refer upthread to Tom Foss, #6.
You’re welcome. Thank James Nicoll. He posts that list every December 6th, pointedly not naming the man who should by all rights be lost to history.
That poor guy. His life has been ruined by women seeking equality! Never let it be said that my heart doesn’t go out for people who are only trying to increase their advantage.
Tabby Lavalamp
I was wondering the same damn thing. I find those comments highly irritating. I starting trying to think of when I’ve said it but then I realized the privileged assclams I disagree with don’t receive death threats while oppressed people do like gaters with Quinn and their simple teasing of the Dorito King. Maybe that’s why. Maybe it’s because I haven’t read a criticism of Anita’s that actually addressed what she says and isn’t sexist. Maybe because most people don’t see or care about the sexism in gaming and agree with Anita’s harassers so pointing out how they still consider her wrong is fucking grating when that’s so goddamn minor and besides the point. Maybe because it comes off like “Well, I don’t even want to appear like I agree with her even when denouncing death threats because that’d just be awful.”
I don’t know. I just wish I didn’t have to be reminded of how much opposition to feminism there’s left to fight when death threats cease (if they ever do) with the “mild moderates”. Ugh. Just, ugh.
==================
Pete Newell
Thank you both. That’s wonderful.
Well, this proves it quite conclusively. Feminism is wrong and misogyny isn’t a thing in the least.
Seriously, do people like this think we’ll stop noticing the problems in society if they can just shoot the right people? And how the fuck has feminism ruined anybody’s life? Oh no! Women can vote, and work, and even though probably nothing will happen to you, it’s technically illegal to rape them! And now they’re just going too far in thinking they’re allowed to talk – in PUBLIC – about how we’re still not treating them like real people!
Fucking pathetic, whiny little shits.
I really try not to hate people, to not see even the worst people as evil, but, fuck it, these guys make it impossible.
But, but, but …
Ebola!!!
Funny, all of a sudden the freethinking liberals find that terrorists must be caught and put in jail for a long time, now that a Feminist Heroine is threatened. Where are the protests against Gitmo and anti-terrorist legislation all of a sudden? Everyone is a liberal until mugged …
Kindly point to a comment asking for indefinite detention for the perpetrator, or fuck right off. No one has time for your strawliberals, you fucking dolt.
Typical non-sequitur from a True Believer™.
You are dismissed.
Hey fucknut, the little terrorist wannabe would be locked up in a Utah jail not gitmo and I think you’d be hard pressed to find anyone who would agree with you that terrorist threats like this should be legal.
whynotthedeer (or whoever):
Right. Because someone else’s shock and outrage at a terrible thing isn’t valid unless it includes shock and outrage at your specific terrible thing; in fact it’s evidence of hypocrisy. And you’re here opportunistically accusing people of cherry-picking issues to denounce, with no indication that you care about the issue under discussion here except as an excuse to launch your canned accusation, and with no visible signs of recognizing the irony.
Fuck off. This is getting boring.
@36
What the fuck are you gibbering about?
Who here has called for waterboarding? Citations or GTFO.
Who here is against terrorism being a crime? Citations or GTFO.
Whynotthedeer, if you want to discuss your pet peeve, try the Thunderdome. Open thread….
Oh no, nobody is calling for indefinite detention, just detention “for a long time”. Look above, there’s your good liberal buddy…
Pete Newell, James is a personal friend, and a local one.
And a bloody good ally.
True Believer, to the Thunderdome. You are disrupting this thread with your ideology.
Learn to read dumbshit.
“for a long time” = 35.5 years in prison and $26,000 fine.
Works for me.
Hell even the minimum sentence of 3.08 years in prison and a $26,000 fine would be reasonable, though the DA should only give that via a plea deal that bans the fucker from the internet for life.
3 years is a pretty long time if you’re on the inside. But for the person on the outside, who the threat was aimed at, it doesn’t feel so long.
Yeah, the minimum sentence should only apply if the fucker is just a neckbeard basement dweller, doesn’t have any guns or pipe bombs, and doesn’t live near by.
If he has the means and opportunity like he claims, then lock him away for three and a half decades for sure.
Another misogynist trying to derail a thread by bring up an irrelevancy.
@whynotthedeer #36: I’m very liberal. I think Guantanamo Bay should be shut down. I also think that terrorists should be tried and, if found guilty, punished appropriately. My problem with Gitmo is that many (if not all) of the people there, who have been labeled as terrorists and the like, have skipped that crucial “trial” step.
I think this letter-writing asshole should be tried and punished too. As it stands, there’s more evidence against him than against people who’ve been jailed for years at Gitmo. But I’m going to guess, based on probability, that he’s lily-white, so he’s unlikely to end up in a Cuban detention facility.
Actually, if they do find that he actually has a pipe bomb, then he is liable for another first degree felony which adds another 5 years to life in prison plus another ten grand.
Uh, people? I was about to jump on the anti-GamerGate bandwagon, until I read this in an article:
These predate GamerGate. Terrorism threats are just the typical cost of being a public feminist, apparently.
whynotthedeer @36:
You don’t read much…aw forget it.
You’re right. We’re wrong.
Happy?
Door. Ass. Bye.
A dumbass right-wing troll barging in to smear libruls and defend misogynistic terrorism, in the holy name of Video games? Truly a surprising occurrence.
And she’s cancelled her speech
I wish I could say that behaviour like this shocks me, but it is rapidly becoming par for the course. This is the true face of the gamerbros and their precious ‘movement’, once you strip away the obfustications about supposed ‘integrity in gaming journlaism’ – they are motivated by a desire for dominance within their niche (as mentioned upthread) and a hatred of women so strong that they will go so far as to employ terrorist tactics. I hope all those who ally themselves to things like gamergate take a good, long look at this letter and what it reveals about the mindset of the author, and then reconsider their affiliation (though that would require a level of social conscience and self awareness I fear that few of them possess).
As for the author, there is no way to know whether he actually intends to carry out his threat or not, and even if he has no intent to go through with it, he is trading on the fear that he might be another violent misogynist to try to use threats of violence to silence Anita and women like her and intimidate anyone who wishes to listen to what they have to say. Attempting to effect social and/or political change – or the maintenance of an unjust and oppressive system of privilege – through violence or the threat of violence is pretty much the textbook definition or terrorism, and this arsehat is every bit as much a terrorist as Timothy McVeigh or anyone else who would employ these tactics, and should be treated a such. I hope he is swiftly caught, tried and placed where he cannot harm anyone.
—————————————————————————————————————————————————————————–
Pete Newell @ 26;
Well said.
From the news article:
On the one hand, I’m glad to hear they’re not cancelling the event. But thinking about that last paragraph makes me sick.
Holy shit Kotaku. “There is no mention of Gamergate in the threatening letter”???
Yeah, they’re just the ones riling the dudebros up. Completely blameless, those scions of integrity.
screechymonkey @57:
They didn’t cancel it, but she chose to.
Fucking scumbag misogynist assholes.
Tony: Sad, but I don’t blame her. It really does show us how far this has gone. Silencing women with threats of violence. Incoherent outrage over petty bullshit. And they call feminists extremists during all this.
They are the gaming equivalent to fundamentalists. Dogmatic, ignorant, privileged and desperate to maintain that privilege and control. Willing to stifle and silence by any means necessary. They want everyone to be like them or at least be quiet, and they aren’t willing to use mere reason or compromise or anything so simple to reach their goals. They want their enemies to burn and will make sure that fact is always painfully obvious to everyone. Because intimidation is just as fun for them.
Jesus unholy fuck this makes me sick and angry at the same time. I really don’t know how to live in this world.
@HJ Hornbeck: Not entirely surprising. Anita said basically the same thing yesterday:
I didn’t realize that she had a bomb threat earlier this year too.
She asked them about it and all the university had to say was that they weren’t going to disallow concealed weapons.
Great jabbering jesus, Utah.
jodyp:
Fuck. Them.
Holy fucking shit.
She shouldn’t just not go, she should encourage everyone to put that hell-hole on their blacklists.
Christopher at #19 speaks for me here.
Apparently she has decided not to speak, since they’re not interested in even the most basic security actions.
http://www.usu.edu/ust/index.cfm?article=54178
Hey, there’s a commenting thingy at the bottom of that page, and contact info for an official of the university.
The slymepit and misogynists generally thinks these shitbags have their hearts in the right place, but go a little overboard. The shitbags think “everyone FEELS like I do…but I’m the one who’s gonna DO something about it!”
Sarkeesian @Twitter
Huh. I take it back, then, we can lay this at the feet of GamerGate.
What a fuckwitted policy, letting concealed into a talk with threats of a mass shooting. Those are some stupid administrators without courage.
Gitmo was a facility specifically made for detention without trial and to practice torture on the prisoners. Wanting people to be prosecuted and arrested according to the law is not the same thing.
Does the gun-nut law have any exemptions for times when someone has made an explicit threat? Probably not…
Of course we can. ZQ helpfully documented the dawning of the bullshit, and it consists on the same assholes who were already upset that women dared to care about video games in their own terms.
….and the slymepitters and other misogynists, for the most part, are happy to let them think that.
I’m surprised that when the university said they’d allow armed people to attend her speech that they didn’t offer to paint a target on her chest.
How does a male student shooting up the place show what feminism has done? How can a man in college have had his life ruined by feminism?
How can a woman cancelling a talk make a case for men?
Fuck. I feel dirty. I decided to blog about this bomb threat and went looking through Google for an image of Anita Sarkeesian to add to the post, and I came across some of the most vile, degrading images I’ve ever seen. People took images of her and photoshopped them to make it look like she was beaten. God it was horrid.
Tony:
Sounds like Anita’s “critics”, alright. Fucking fuck.
jodyp @64:
Jesus fuck. I guess they think the only thing that can stop a misogynist with a gun is someone else with a gun?
****
frog @67:
Thanks for noting that. I left a message for them.
CatieCat #44: Too right he is. Nice to hear another voice from home.
WRT to Anita Sarkeezian and USU, respectively, what a hell of a choice to have to make, and Christ what a bunch of asshole. Gun culture in America trimphs agian – although without any blood this time. Yeehaw.
I’m gonna assume – because I’m cynical – that this means they won’t be hunting the little asshole down and prosecuting him, so they won’t have to navigate the political minefield of whether this kind of threat – that’s only against women, after all – could possibly be terrorism when it’s perpetrated by a gen-u-ine Amurrican. To be sure, if this little fiasco costs them enough money and bad press, that could change. Recent history suggests not, unless he turns out to be from an ethnic or religious group that already has a built-in demonized narrative handy.
Welp, time for whisky.
If you search for my name and “hague” on freethoughtblogs, you’ll find me referring to Barack Obama (along with Bush and Cheney et al) as just such.
E.g.:
http://freethoughtblogs.com/dispatches/2013/05/05/obama-and-gitmo-again/
Maybe, in the wake of Sarkeesian cancelling her appearance, somewhere in a dark corner of the internet there’ll be a little celebration cheering that they’ve successfully silenced her… and that will leave sufficient evidence for the criminal investigation to connect the threat to the poster, and lead to a successful prosecution.
However unlikely that may be, I find myself casting about for whatever silver linings I can find these days.
I hope that Sarkeesian is able to record her talk and put it up on the internet. More of us would be able to see it, then, and she can start off by explaining about the death threat. It’s lose/lose for the asshole who made that threat; what’s he gonna do threaten to kill everyone who watches a video on youtube? What fucking media savoire-faire is this.
Tabby Lavalamp wrote:
I believe I said it once after hearing reports that a homophobic pastor received death threats over an invitation to speak. In that case, I did feel that I should distance myself from him, while also speaking out against the threat. In regards to this particular threat, I have no reservations in denouncing it without trying to distance myself from Anita Sarkeesian. I do sincerely hope they find the little asshole who sent this.
Tabby Lavalamp @28:
I’m with you.
I’ve seen that comment a few times in threads about Anita Sarkeesian too.
@ #3 Anne, Lurking Feminist Harpy & Support Staff
FWIW, this was my initial reaction:
But, huh? You mean, wait, what? Who did what to you? When? Wronged how?!
Angry. Little.
Manboy.@ 72 nuerobis
To the best of my understanding, the gun-nut position is that if everyone brought a gun everywhere we would all be safe because if someone tried to take a shot at her then Sarkeesian (who, in this alternate reality, would be armed herself) and the other people would be able to shoot back. This is supposed to act as a “deterrent.” The expression “an armed society is a polite society” is one of their mantras. It’s really the turtles-all-the-way-down of public safety policies — magical thinking at its finest.
this means they won’t be hunting the little asshole down and prosecuting him
Hugely unlikely. That’s a very clearly worded threat and shows several of the warning signs that would indicate more than just random crankiness. Whoever sent that crafted it deliberately to look like a serious threat, by putting in several key indicators of intent – the FBI’ll take it seriously. Backtracking something like that can take a while. If the guy who sent it (I am assuming it’s a guy, OK?) was careful, and used something like TOR, there may still be giveaways that would allow it to be backtracked (e.x.: whoever sent that probably did internet queries about the montreal massacre within 1hr of hitting ‘send’; that will be in google’s logs). That’s without getting the “metadata” collection in Utah involved … which could well happen, and the FBI would then have to do a parallel construction to avoid having to admit the methods. I’d rate it as about 50/50 that they’ll catch the sender within 3-4 months. Shorter, if the sender was dumb enough to brag about it.
On facebook, this seems to be the winning response by teh gamerz atm.
There’s no proof he’s associated with #GamerGate or 4Chan or MRAs or anything!
All the more reason to catch him. Because then there’ll be a scramble to rewrite some established positions.
Can I ask out of my gender? I mean, I’m fine with being a man and all, but some of my fellow men….
See, guns don’t just deter, they actually deflect bullets.
But only if you’re one of the good guys.
I don’t go in much for heroes, but if I did, Anita Sarkeesian would be near the top of my list. I really have to admire people like her who keep on despite the danger and the constant shit being flung.
Reading that left me feeling hollow and very sick. I don’t blame Ms. Sarkeesian for canceling, I wouldn’t want to take the chance either, especially with the university having no problem with allowing weapons (that’s pure WTF), and I wish like hell this wasn’t being treated as “normal for this woman”. This isn’t a case of “normal for this woman”, it’s getting to be ‘normal’ for any woman who speaks up for any reason at all.
Christ, absolutely terrifying.
Uh, tony?
it’s worse than that.
those images came from this game:
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/07/06/internet-trolls-online-beat-up-anita-sarkeesian-game_n_1653473.html
yes, they felt it somehow necessary to make beating up a woman they disagree with… into a game.
I just… it’s beyond me.
Just out of curiosity I pushed the threat screenshot through an ocr, rendering it into text then checked it against a plagiarism detector (comparing it with loads of other papers and writings for key paragraphs, etc) Came up dry. But that’s just the freeware off the web. I’m assuming that whoever is investigating the threat has better stuff than I’ve got here. Good hunting!
Something I’ve noticed is that denouncing poor behaviour of a group is often taken as support for the “antagonist” group.
“Harrassing muslims isn’t acceptable.”
“Oh, but muslims killing christians is totally ok? Yeah, right, you’re such a hypocrite.”
I see it so often that I do want to distance myself, just to avoid it. I try not to, though; denouncing death threats shouldn’t involve political manoeuvring.
I sure wish they’d published the message headers. ((sigh))
Marcus Ranum @ 87:
Given this, by the authorities, I doubt they’re going to be scouring about for whoever wrote that threat:
That reads like a write-off to me.
Free speech has now been held hostage to “gun rights”.
Thanks Obama!
er,
Thanks Utah!
God, the HuffPo article has a slideshow of comments about the “game” and it is almost all slimy apologists.
it reads like she was right to cancel. It reads like OSU should be very low on the list of universities anyone should want to attend.
It reads like another page in the ever more rapidly rising tide of fascism in the US.
Iyeska:
That reads like a write-off to me.
OMG yes. Fucking lazy fucking fucks.
So there are several things that ought to red flag that threat: awareness of time and place, clear statement of intent, clear statement of having the wherewithal, organized and coherent (doesn’t read like it was written by someone who was high or drunk) and an indicator that the threatener researched the target. When you’re doing a threat assessment, those are indicators that someone has gone to at least a planning stage – even pretending to be at the planning stage requires doing some planning. That’s absolutely not something that should be blown off.
Add item #278,282,918 to the list of “reasons Marcus does not respect the FBI”
then again, maybe some of them are afraid the death-threat water cannon will get turned on them as well.
I hope not. I’m trying to imagine a similar situation at, say, a French university in the 1930s concerning a threat against a Jewish speaker. I think this calls for a response from the university administration and community. On the other hand, this person sounds very dangerous and the threat isn’t just to Sarkeesian, so I would hope the response wouldn’t put anyone in danger, especially students. Some creativity is in order.
Ichthyic @92:
Ye godz. I didn’t think it could get worse. You’ve shown that I was wrong.
Imma gonna go weep for a minute.
If the university does in fact cave to this blatant act of terrorism, I’d suggest (I would hope that) Sarkeesian film her talk ASAP, straight down the barrel of her video camera, and upload it everywhere. This delusional little creep *might* be able to prevent a woman talking to a live audience, but if he thinks that’ll be the end of it he’s sadly mistaken.
Now, true to Streisand, I doubt I’d have even known about this public appearance if this bellowing manchild hadn’t brought it to my attention by threatening to murder its attendees. Now I’m not only aware, I can’t wait to hear what Sarkeesian was going to say. Well done, little terrorist, you’ve increased Sarkeesian’s audience better than she could have herself.
Finally, I know I shouldn’t be but I am once again astounded that a woman who’s most famous for calmly highlighting common (like, so common that you’d have to be delusional or incredibly obtuse or Phil Mason not to recognise them) narrative tropes in fucking video games, of all things, can attract such mind-warping hatred. I’m frequently told that men are stronger, more resilient and that women should grow thicker skins in response to abuse or just ignore the trolls – but an unhinged threat of mass murder in response to a woman speaking in public is the mark of a profoundly weak and pitifully weak-minded individual.
Truly, the person who made this threat is little better than the Taliban thugs who shot Malala – not only that but the ideology behind it is just as intellectually bankrupt and just as deeply-rooted in a toxic culture supported and informed by mythology and wishful-thinking.
Iyeska:
“The threat we received is not out of the norm for (this woman).”
It took a few minutes for the meaning of that to sink in. And now my head is all asplodey.
sorry :(
this shit needs to be rooted out though; all of it, now, before it becomes even worse! People need to know exactly how far this shit is going, and that it needs to be taken seriously before it gets even more out of hand than it is already.
you missed it, Hank. they already did. speech was canceled because they refused to provide basically any security, or take the threat seriously.
@Ichthyic:
QFT, unfortunately. That really nails it. Fuck.
I just tweeted:(@mjranum)
I pledge to watch any video Anita Sarkeesian ever makes.
And to help fund them if I can.
(link to a news story about the cancelled talk)
I was probably going to watch them anyway, but excuse me I’ve got to go drop some more cash on her ‘donate’ button on FeministFrequency.com Because, it’s the only way I can scream a big “FUCK YOOOOOOO” at the anonymous coward.
@107 Ichthyic: Yup, I saw she’d cancelled just now (because I did my usual thing of commenting, then reading the comments).
It’s a goddamn shame, but as some said upthread, if Sarkeesian tapes her talk and uploads it everywhere, at the very least the yawping dumbfuck who threatened her will have failed to silence her and might even increase her audience. The failure will be compounded if he didn’t cover his e-tracks and the feds nab him.
Now I’m waiting for the douche-o-tron to activate and start generating apologetics of the sort also mentioned upthread: “It wasn’t #whinergate/MRA/4chan! It was false flag! It was for the clicks!”
Sarkeesian cancelled her talk at USU.
Not because of the terror threat.
But because USU was going to allow people to allow concealed firearms at her talk.
http://www.standard.net/Police/2014/10/14/Feminist-speaker-cancels-appearance-at-USU-after-terror-threat.html
If I was Sarkeesian, I would have done the same thing. It’s intolerable to suggest that being able to conceal carry into a situation where a death threat has been issued is a “right.” I couldn’t even imagine getting up and talking and not knowing if someone had a secret gun and was going to engage in a “Montreal-style” massacre (as the death threat stated).
Iyeska @91
Hollow is a great description of how I feel reading about this crap, too. And yes, though I think she has stood up to threats before, this time, the threats were against more than just her and very specific, and it seems the police were really off-base by not controlling concealed weapons.
I hope they can find this person.
Why do I have the funny feeling that the administration at Utah State didn’t want Ms Sarkeesian there in the first place, and were perfectly happy to make things as unpleasant as possible for her?
Yeah. Hollow.
It has been a really frustrating day, especially as I was sitting at the computer using my game dev Twitter account for much of the day watching what has been going on. Tonight there has been a ton of activity on the #stopgamergate2014 hashtag, which has felt nice, I think this has really angered a lot of people, but unless it keeps up I fear tomorrow will be another day of wondering what other horrible thing will happen.
I have no idea what is really going on in the heads of USU admin, but I fear their hands are rather tied on the security issue, at least when it comes to concealed firearms. I had never looked up Utah law before so maybe someone more familiar with it can correct me, but it appears they really cannot do anything to stop people from carrying concealed firearms.
From http://www.armedcampuses.org/utah/
I found this interesting:
I wonder what that law really means and how it would hold up. If the President were speaking in that venue, no one would be allowed in with a weapon, period. Are they just forced to turn down the opportunity to have Ms. Sarkeesian or the President speak at their venue, ever? Would they find a way around the law for the President, but not for Ms. Sarkeesian?
As Ichthyic said, gun rights beat free speech rights. A sad day for America, truly.
Yeah, it seems the police and USU had very little they were able to do about concealed weapons. This post has updates with the relevant Utah statute language.
Knowing the school couldn’t do anything about the concealed carry makes me feel a little bad about the email I sent them. It wasn’t scathing, but I did express my disapproval.
So the next time an MRA breathlessly proclaims something like ‘but but Peezus said all MRA are psycho killers! How dare he!’ we now have a data point noting that, actually, there are MRA arseholes freely associating with the name.
Also, anyone that still thinks this is about games journalism at this point is a fucking moron.
bah.
if there was ever a time for civil disobedience, universities in states that allow concealed (or open) carry have the MANDATE to do so.
Universities are supposed to be strongholds of free speech. To allow free speech to be quashed by the threat of gun violence is anathema to the mission of ANY university.
USU, and all universities that have and are allowing this to happen, should be ashamed.
Things in the US are worse now than they were during the civil rights movements in the 60s, as far as free speech is concerned!
…and they didn’t even have to call in the national guard to quell those uppity students.
fucking sad is what it is.
Allow dormitory residents to request only roommates who are not licensed to carry a concealed firearm; or
Fuck that noise. I slept in every class I attended, so that makes a lot of those rooms “dorms” … And maybe a couple of sleep-ins in the cafeteria and library and presto, magic dorm-dust.
Utah’s got some messed up priorities: it’s hard to get a beer but it sounds like you can get a shot pretty much anywhere. In Utah, it’s against the law to have sex if you’re unmarried, but your class could be full of college students with guns. Just typing “college students with guns” makes me nervous. Because I was one, once upon a time, and I know now how stupid I was.
a great many people would agree. and that agreement would stretch back into history quite a long way.
Marcus #119
That’s just so beyond the pale I can’t even. We can send a 17-year old* kid to war and have them put rounds into other human beings, but drink and vote and rent a car? Nosirree, those are GROWN UP activities.
*With parental consent.
ajb47 @116:
Good thing you posted a link to that update, because it now contains a second:
femfreq @Twitter:
Worse than initially reported, then. Wow.
I’m glad that I was able to see Anita give a talk in person last weekend. And by that I mean I’m glad that I was able to see her talk despite a bomb threat, but only after being searched before walking into the room because Washington state isn’t as mind-numbingly stupid as Utah seems to be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvzDwvMmUTM
By one of my favorite feminist singers, Australian Judy Small:
A man behind her in the line, he started getting steamed,
He said, “It wasn’t because he was a man, this guy was crazy, mad, obscene,”
“Yes, that’s true,” the woman replied, “but women go crazy too,
And I’ve never heard of a woman shooting fourteen men, have you?”
And so I wonder why, as I try to make sense of this,
Why is it always men who resort to the gun, the sword, and the fist?
Why does gunman sound so familiar, while gunwoman doesn’t quite ring true?
What is it about men that makes them do the things they do?
Jennifer Burdoo @124
Your song quote is at least partially answered by Greta Christina. You’ll need to click through to the link to AlterNet to get the whole story.
Short answer — patriarchy hurts men, too.
I like the idea of donating in support of Anita. Speaking out on her behalf, too.
Can’t say I ever foresaw anyone would stand for justice on a barracade labeled “video games”.
It’s technically correct the letter makes no reference to #GamerGate, which means this person could simply be one of the vast teeming hordes of entitled misogynistic scumbags which #GamerGate draws its population from. This is not an improvement, either for civil society in general or for the misbegotten people who wave the flag of #GamerGate in particular.
Hearing how common these types of terrorist threats are makes me once again wonder if the flow of this shit will ever begin to slow down, let alone stop.
It appears that the Second Amendment’s purpose is to silence speech that is otherwise protected by the First Amendment. I’m sure that was the intent of the Founding Fathers.[end sarcasm]
A few days ago, Anita tweeted: “today marks the 3rd time I’ve gone on stage after specific death and bomb threats were issued to an event where I’m scheduled to speak”. The difference is that those events had adequate security.
I posted this elsewhere, but you can vote for Anita Sarkeesian as Gaming Personality of the Year in the 2014 Golden Joystick Awards:
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/joystick/
Cancelling in the face of threats is disappointing but she has the right to protect herself…
but I was also thinking, after the initial disappointment, that beyond protecting herself, it was the responsible thing to do, because the university and police reaction meant that the attendees would also be at risk… so cancelling was the only responsible thing to do in the face of the proper authorities’ abdication of their OWN responsibilities towards public safety.
They were not only refusing to protect her, they were refusing to protect anyone who attended.
They are refusing to protect a visiting speaker, but also their own students and staff.
People need to get fired.
I hope students and staff at USU don’t let this drop. If you take that death threat at face value — and how can they afford not to? — they will all continue to be at risk, even with the talk cancelled. They have in their midst an armed man who fantasises about becoming famous by committing mass murder. Who knows what will set him off? They can’t afford to think they can forget about him now that the talk isn’t going ahead.
Ok, pardon me, I just stated the obvious.
I hadn’t read the threat… I didn’t have the stomach for it, so I assumed it only named her as the target. I just read it and of course it directly threatens all attendees, etc., which makes my preceding comment pointlessly obvious.
I cannot possibly disagree more strongly with those who are assuming the authorities are investigating, however.
They specifically stated that they are not providing security because she is routinely threatened to this degree (as if that’s not horrifying enough), and in doing so they completely and I assume deliberately ignore the overt threats to everyone else who is present.
The message is clear – they do not give a flying fuck if feminists or anyone who associates with or is interested in listening to them are threatened with death. Terrorist threats against feminists and their audiences are not worth responding to, not worth the time for a couple of guards at the door, not worth the protection of free speech (as others have stated).
As if it weren’t clear enough beforehand… the government has chosen a side. The wrong one.
Two more tweets before I conk out:
femfreq:
Joss Whedon:
Wish I had half the courage of Sarkeesian. And I think it’s safe to say this story is gonna dominate the headlines tomorrow…
Moggie @128, puts a whole new light on her nervousness on stage in that video PZ put up a few days ago.
Where are all the Freeze Peach warriors now, eh?
Aaaaaahhhmmmm hello world, what a lovely morn……oh shit…..
Kindly point to a comment asking for indefinite detention without trial and torture for the sake of extorting forced confessions for the alleged perpetrator: Gitmo is all about lawlessly detaining people including many who never were terrorists or Al Qaeda affiliates and who remain imprisoned because the US military establishment refuses to admit its own callousness and incompetence.
And let’s be blunt here, the reason whynotthedeer complains is because he suspects the guy sending terrorist threats this time shares an ethnic/cultural/social social background with him and favor authoritarian policies only insofar as they don’t target people like himself: this is a would-be aristocrat reasoning: for him the Law exists only to keep the plebs in their place and protect him from them.
***
Oh, but they are not ignorant: stating egregious, mind-numbingly, stupid, easily debunked claims is a defense mechanism: when your goal is to enforce a social hierarchy that benefits yourself at the expense of everyone else, looking like the village idiot provokes a lot less anger -and therefore limit the risk of retaliation- than candidly stating your endgame.
***
It’s the consequence of attempts by the nerdy dudebros to deny any and all nuance and turn debate into tribal warfare: “You disagree with the threats and murderous fantasies? Then you’re on the Radical Extreme Feminist She-Devil‘s side and agree with everything she said and since you agree with everything she said it shows that you’re nothing but a parroting toady of the Radical Extreme Feminist She-Devil and this clearly Proves that we’re way more intelligent than you so shut the fuck up and let your intellectual betters alone to talk among themselves“: remember that the basic, instinctive, hardwired behavior is to avert conflict, so non-sociopathic people will -at least at first- intuitively react by saying “But I assure you, I don’t agree with everything she says“
I’m sure they’re all shocked into silence by this…
no, I can’t keep a straight face and say that.
some STILL without EVER being formally charged, or allowed to see a lawyer, or contact anyone.
…13 years later.
FWIW, I actually had to unfriend a KIWI today because they were a gamergater and decided to spew on my FB page on this issue!
that kinda shocked me.
evidently dudebromisogynistgamerfucks are a global phenomenon.
A very small crumb of good news in this: when KUTV (a Salt Lake City TV station) covered this story last night, they had a graphic in which the word “terrorist” was prominent — and it was referring to the threat and the creep making it, not to Ms Sarkeesian.
They also stated that county, state, and federal folks are still investigating. Yes, I know not to fully believe TV (or other) newscritters.
This is what really blows my mind.
CNN article
See, guys? Guns kept her safe.
Fuck this society.
I don’t know how you guys deal with this kind of stuff. It’s not even 8 am and I’m just starting my day at work. What a shitty fucking depressing day it’s going to be.
Some misogynist, criminal, low-life asshole just ruined the chance of social progress by a great activist simply by writing a few shitty sentences. I’m sure Sarkeesian had a great well thought out speech planned and it all went to shit by someone who is probably not even 1% of the person she is.
Evil won. Good lost before it even got a chance to be heard.
I’m pissed and really sad at the same time.
Where are the terrorism laws now?
3 Poems:
words self-healing
not a birthing debt
paid in full at puberty
woman of your dreams
love is always
first prize material
without award
unbidden love
placating self esteem
back to the source
A commenter over at Skepchick posted a copy of the message the USU administration sent around, after Sarkeesian cancelled. This included:
Don’t you feel safer already? Even though their investigation isn’t complete, they just know that there was no danger from all those people allowed to carry guns into the venue.
Pathetic and horrifying. Hope the aftermath gets publicized really well if they catch him. In fact, one should maybe petition some public figure to bring this to attention to a far larger audience than Anita’s talk was originally intendend for (and even beyond the audience of interested parties like this blog community).
As a side note, and please correct me if this is a deficient opinion: Is it really a prudent idea to disseminate information of how law enforcement might go about looking for the person issuing the threat? I am specifically thinking of your posts #87 and following, Marcus Ranum, like how to research your references or which softwares to use. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy this sort of information immensely and thank you for it, but it’s just that I’m not sure if it would be more pragmatic to keep it to yourself. The reason being: The more disseminated it gets, the more likely it is that people normally too ignorant or impulsive to research such methods before issuing a threat might know them by default.
Of course, knowing about it also helps you to see if law enforcement falls short by not employing a method clearly at their disposal… but I’m not sure that outweighs the potential for informing people about it that really shouldn’t know.
Saad @144, Sarkeesian is still alive, she still has the words in her head and written down somewhere, she can speak them at another venue any time (hopefully one with a better sense of security for its guests). It’s unfortunate news, but it’s not the end.
I’m crossing Utah off the list of place I want to visit, ever, and frankly, I have my doubts about even traveling through or flying over the state.
NelC @148, you are right, but still, it’s discouraging to be reminded of how bad things still are in some parts of the US.
From reading the law quoted above it looks like the university could have declared the place she was to speak a secure area and then banned guns from that area but they chose not to do this and hid their ass under cover of law.
NelC, #148
Yes, that’s the right outlook to have. It’s just that violence gives the bad people SUCH a huge advantage in being able to close off conversations. It’s like knocking all the chess pieces over when you realize the opponent is making a good move. That’s the part that’s really, really discouraging. It’s like they always have at their disposal a button which they can press effortlessly to make people like Sarkeesian back off no matter how great of an argument she had ready to present and how many countless days she had spent on putting it all together.
I don’t understand why you have a problem with this. Don’t you think it’s important to show that it isn’t only those who support her 100% on everything she says that are horrified by these kinds of threats?
They never word it “I don’t even agree with her on many things but even I can see that…”
They always word it as “I don’t agree with her on many things, but…”
Do you get the distinction?
The first, the one you never see, would indeed be a way of showing that it isn’t only those who support her 100% that are horrified.
The second is not. The second is a way of saying “I’m horrified but please let me say that without risking my name being tarnished by being seen as some sort of…” etc.
In case y’all didn’t know, a few weeks ago the Utah police shot a black guy six times in the back because he was cosplaying and carrying a sword: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/16/us/utah-victim-was-fleeing-autopsy-finds.html?_r=0
So: black man with a toy sword=shoot to kill. White woman threatened with mass murder=enh what can you do?
The Utah police’s priorities at work.
An appalling thought just occurred to me.
We’ve seen how vicious lunatics can come from any walk of life.
I have to wonder how many cops are, at least peripherally, involved in “gamergate” and the general harassment of feminists. Not necessarily with the threats (Though that wouldn’t surprise me), but with reading, commenting, and so on.
Based on how they so often “respond” to things like rape and sexual assault, I can’t help but see that same dynamic in this case.
Maybe everybody already got there before me, but the notion of the police we call for help agreeing, in principle at least, with the people making the threats is seriously scary.
It would be good to DO something about this, depending on how it evolves. If only petitioning the competent authorities (who are they?) to actually try and find the terrorist. Would be good to keep this thread open for a long time so we can update and follow developments (like the Ferguson thread). Other ideas: contacting news media and encouraging them to give it coverage. Does anyone here know how to do that? I often email and twitter agencies and journalists but it’s like pissing into the wind. Let’s do something, let’s organize.
Nothing will come of this. The writer will remain unknown. The authorities will ignore it. The uppity woman will not be missed in Utah.
End of story.
Well, the guy who threatened Sarkeesian and the people willing to listen to her may be white and even, gasp hailing from a well connected family: we can’t ask law enforcement to treat patricians’ sons like they treat the plebs, no siree.
And once again, the Second Amendment trumps the First.
“The threat we received is not out of the norm for (this woman).”
I seem to remember that it was rather normal for Abraham Lincoln, Gandhi and Martin Luther King to get death threats too. “Normal” doesn’t mean “harmless.”
And this is over games. Not over who gets a gold mine, or who gets exiled with the clothes they stand up in. Games.
sheila @ 161 – a woman in the UK was doxxed and threatened with rape for suggesting that the government keep a woman on their currency. She started a petition to get a non-royal woman on currency somewhere and the govt put Jane Austen on a 10 pound note for the new cycle. She was getting 50 rape and death threats an hour. http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/07/29/caroline_criado_perez_is_harassed_because_she_petitioned_to_have_jane_austen.html
The guy responsible for the worst of it was jailed, as were two other people, thankfully: http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/228779/internet-troll-gets-jail-time-for-tweeting-rape-threats-in-protest-of-jane-austen-banknotes/
“Putting Jane Austen on a bank note” deserves rape and death threats, as does commenting on games, making games, having sex, etc. Existing while female and having an opinion is clearly deserving of rape and death threats for these people. Nothing is beneath them.
Question to those who know, how does this compare to violence against feminists in other time periods? More, less, different?
Exactly. All this is is same shit, different day. Sometimes I just want to crawl into a hole and pull it in after me…
I see huge throngs of people (some of them my friends!) who deny it’s a big problem, or who victim-blame, or who claim they’re making up false-flag blah blah, etc. More such comments than I suspect can be explained by a small clique.
But how many people are actually making the threats — is that at least a small number of people we could feasibly round up?
Well, I will never be invited to speak at a Utah college — but I’m going on record as saying “thanks, but no thanks” just the same.
In this particular instance, I’m quite sure the threat was meaningless and that the person who made them was frankly lying about his (yes, it was a dude) capabilities and intention. That’s the way it is with
cowards#braveheroes. However, that doesn’t mean some other dude with actual capabilities might not be looking to make a name for himself.Yeah, that’s what everybody always thinks until the lead starts flying.
Yikes! Jane Austen on a bank note?!?! That set enough idiots’ hair on fire for 50 rape threats an hour?! With all the hideous crap happening all over the world some sizable number of people decide that a 19th century author’s picture on money constitutes some sort of existential crisis. Really?! Real-life eclipses satire yet again.
At least someone received some jail-time but I noticed that one of the persons threatened is an MP. I guess you have to be a government official to have threats taken seriously?
Oh, and on a somewhat tangential point regarding a comparison between Obama and Sarkeesian and security measures: Federal law “takes precedence over” state law when the two conflict. That’s why a U.S. President would have security measures in place anywhere in the country he visited. Now if it were the Governor of Utah receiving death threats, that would be a better comparison with Sarkeesian’s experience.
Dunc @167
Yep, the threat is very reminiscent of Eliot Rodger’s prose, only less glib.
It’s not a definitive tell, but the phrase “bear witness” is used by mormons all the time. It’s likely that some fellow student who is also a mormon knows this guy, attends the same ward.
Anne @ 164 – yep. Some days there is just not enough chocolate in the world.
I think its time for anyone who gives talks/lectures etc at universities who’s state laws allow open carry and who’s police force will not enforce a no gun policy at a public talk to be boycotted for all future talks. Especially when it has been requested after a threat of violence.
I’m a nobody, but I do give the occasional talk/lecture at universities. I WONT be giving one at USU ever until they reverse this policy.
Land of the free. Home of the brave. (What a lot of piffle that is.)
Curt Oda is one of the Utah legislators responsible for this situation in which speakers at a Utah University are not safe. Oda is a Republican and a mormon.
Wow that is easily the most stupid argument I have heard for anything for quite a while really. I am sure he is fighting bravely against security checks at airports, as well? Or, say, fire drills, personal hygiene and… ah nevermind.
Kevin @166:
Wishful thinking much?
How on Earth can you be “quite sure”? Especially given that Sarkeesian has gotten threats like this before.
Given the world we live in-one where violence against women happens all the fucking time all over the globe…where men feel entitled to women’s bodies and when they don’t get the attention they desire, they turn in misogynistic assholes-how you can reach the conclusion, based on *no evidence* that this was a meaningless threat?
Regarding Mr. Oduh: Is concealed or open carry allowed in his workplace?
Really sick and tired of this shit. I cannot believe there are dimwits who think feminists are a bunch of brutal freedom hating authoritarians when misogynist terrorists like this ass pimple are making threats to silence her. I also bet the slymepitters and other misogynist assholes will still victim blame the shit out of Anita and make all sorts of excuses for the scumbag but cry about OMG!! CENSORSHIP!! when they are banned from a forum for being a bigoted shitstain. It is absurd how one woman criticising an aspect of gaming in a calm manner has generated this bile and thuggery. Fuck MRAS, fuck GamerGate and fuck every manchild who will try and belittle the harrassment woman face online merely for having an opinion. I have got a pretty nasty cold and was already in a shitty mood, reading about this has definitely not helped things.
yeah, good guys, like the retired sheriff in florida who shot someone for texting during the previews for a movie.
well, clearly it’s another case of projection by the right. projecting IS, after all, the most utilized tool in their tiny toolbox.
quickly followed by denial.
Hey, Kevin?
The Department of Homeland Security just called with a job offer for you.
Holy hell. @ Utah generally, @ the state legislator quoted above, and @ the feds if they don’t take this seriously, go fuck yourselves.
Following Marcus Ranum to Sarkeesian’s “donate” button.
This is a followup to comment #174, in which Republican legislator and mormon doofus, Curt Oda, made some really stupid remarks.
A commenter on the Salt Lake Tribune site pointed out:
General Conference is the twice-yearly meeting that mormons hold in Salt Lake City, and that they broadcast all over the world. The October GC recently wrapped up … safely. No gunshots were fired.
That’s a telling comparison. Mormon leaders do not allow guns at General Conference, not even if church members have a concealed carry permit. The Utah legislature is made up of more than 80% true believing, active mormons. They make laws for a population that is about 60% mormon. They protect themselves, but not Anita Sarkeesian. She faces very specific threats of gun and bomb violence, but authorities not only insist on allowing guns at Sarkeesian’s speech, but they cite state laws to excuse that irrational act. That’s not right.
The University could have declared the venue a “secure zone” and then used metal detectors to screen attendees for guns.
shadow @177:
I don’t know. I will try to find out.
This article” includes a photo of Curt Oda speaking to a Utah citizen who is openly carrying his rifle. The two men are in the lobby of the Utah State Capitol.
Dunderheads weigh in on the Salt Lake Tribune website:
Lynna is on the ball again!
egads I love you.
AND YET WE CAN’T STOP RAGING ABOUT IT. OVER. AND OVER. AND OVER. AND OVER…
Huh.
femfreq @Twitter:
Now I feel bad for giving the administrators a pass over gun laws.
Ichthyic 187, I love you too.
Hj Hornbeck @189, quoting the Twitter feed:
Holy crap. USU was going to let her walk into the lecture hall without knowing that some presumably local doofus had threatened her life?! I am not a frequent user of exclamation marks, but, jaw drop!, that seems actionable.
HJ@189:
Now not only do I not feel bad for criticizing USU about not banning concealed weapons, I don’t think I went far enough.
More synaptic sludge from doofuses posting comments on the Salt Lake Tribune website:
I don’t think the administrators get a pass because of the Utah gun laws. Mormons leaders don’t observe those laws inside their own office and conference buildings. Obviously, there are some workarounds. USU administrators could have declared the lecture hall where Sarkeesian was scheduled to speak a “secure zone,” right?
Guns are okay in the lobby of the Capitol building in Salt Lake City. Guns are not okay at mormon General Conference meetings. Gun are okay in university lecture halls. I am sensing some lack of consistency here.
Yeah, I don’t buy this. In addition to Lynna’s comment #183, which states that guns aren’t allowed at General Conference, if they had a high profile speaker like the President, a presidential candidate, a foreign leader, etc., we all know they would have found a way to beef up security, and guns or weapons of any kind would NOT be welcomed. Were weapons allowed at the Salt Lake Olympics? Doubt it. Feminist who receives horrific threats to her life, including a threat to massacre the very event you’re hosting? Apparently not worthy of extra precautions. Fuck all of them for their disregard for the safety of Anita Sarkeesian and all of her guests.
I’m sure it has nothing to do with the fact that she’s a feminist and UT is a very conservative state. /s
HJ @189,
And an additional “Fuck USU” for not even warning her that her safety had been threatened. How can anyone possibly feel this is ok? I hope there is public outcry to change the way the handle things like this.
It’s funny to see conceal carry fetishists accuse others of being irrational. After all they’re the ones who believe possessing a gun somehow makes you fearless in all situations, capable of instantly determining who’s a bad guy and who isn’t, and able to flawlessly use a firearm so it won’t add to an already bad situation by harming the wrong people. They also believe that there’s a hard line between law abiding citizens and criminals, a line no law abiding citizen will ever cross.
not if you consider it’s just the usual projection employed as communication by these folks.
then it makes perfect sense.
disgusting still, but not at all unexpected.
More wildly disturbing comments from the readers of the Salt Lake Tribune articles:
As for that last one, I think finding out USU didn’t inform Sarkeesian about the threat, and that she found out about it from other sources after landing in SLC … well, that makes the claim that she made up the threat completely bogus.
Looks like the bogus part is the myth that Sarkeesian makes up threats.
A commenter in another forum made the point that you cannot bring a loaded gun to a gun show in Utah.
Well, I received a response to my last email that I sent to USU which was a scathing condemnation of their failure to inform Anita Sarkeesian of the bomb threat. Here’s their response:
LOL
yeah, everything except prevent people from taking guns to a talk where the speaker had multiple death threats.
not buying what they are selling. nope.
?? Lolwut?
… more projection. obviously.
seriously, you can explain over 90% of right wing nut job commentary with the simple assumption that it’s all projection.
9/10.
yeah, really.
“Sarkeesian” should start seriously thinking about suing some of these asswipes for libel.
BS.
Tony! @200
Wow. I’m not a person who normally criticizes spelling, grammar, or writing ability in internet forums, as long as the comment is understandable. But I would expect better from an official email from a representative of a university. It was rambly, disorganized, contained frequent typos, and occasionally used all caps for emphasis. It certainly doesn’t reflect well on the university’s professionalism.
I’m glad someone read your email though. I’m going to send my own email about the situation. Their consideration for the safety of Anita Sarkeesian and her guests is beyond deplorable.
@ 201 Ichthyic
I may have missed something, in which case I apologize, but my understanding is that it is not actually legal for the university to disallow firearms. (Which is all sorts of fucked up, but not the university’s fault.)
toska @206:
I sent a follow-up email referencing the fact that she didn’t feel the safety measures were adequate enough and why USU didn’t attempt to better ensure she was safe. Wonder if I’ll get a response this time.
How about this, open carry activists, why don’t you offer to protect her?
@ 209 Ranzoid
Yeah, that’s what we need. The shootout at the OK Corral. :-/
that’s debatable, since the state HAS made exceptions for other venues, but technically correct.
but even then, that wasn’t my point.
surely you understand what civil disobedience is, and when it is best applied? In my view, it’s the mandate of a university to promote free speech, not allow it to be curtailed because of a poor law written by complete idiots.
In the past, universities HAVE taken stands against poor laws. evidently, a lot of Americans have forgotten that to the point where they can’t even BEGIN to think of questioning authority, and yet, it was a mere generation ago.
sorry, I hope I’m wrong in your particular case, but if not, I weep for you.
oh, yeah, and you probably did miss some earlier context that would explain why i didn’t elaborate in 201 (because I already had upthread).
yeah, I have to admit to wondering what the logic is behind thinking this would be a good idea.
a shooter who intended harm would lie, and someone who genuinely thought they wanted to “protect” someone would very likely fail to do so, or cause further injury.
what on earth would be the upside?
There’s an NYT article about this. Not as good as PZ’s of course or the coverage on Skepchick or your good comments. Still, I’m glad it’s there.
Lynna @195,
Is the ban at the Mormon General Conference an exception granted by the Utah state legislature? (Since they are the only body allowed to make changes to these laws.) Is that the only religion which has such protection? If so, I wonder if it can be challenged as favoring one religion over another.
Another way to challenge it, is for a Mormon to attend the conference armed. If he is disarmed or kept out, he can sue for having his “rights” taken away. It would be interesting to see the legislature squirm about this “principle”.
And as for the guns in the state capitol…. Maybe the building needs to be patrolled by the Black Panthers for a few years, just in case, you know. I wonder how many legislators would start to feel the way the rest of us feel all the time.
Because holding a permit means you’re an impartial robot free of all political and personal grudges.
Then you bloody well put each and every person who issues such a threat in prison until it becomes “out of the norm.”
Comments from mostly local Utah doofuses are still coming in to the Salt Lake Tribune website:
http://www.sltrib.com/pages/comments?cid=58521856
Meanwhile, the SLT has published Anita Sarkeesian explains why she canceled USU lecture”. Emphasis in the excerpt below is mine.
More from the latest Salt Lake Tribune article (link in #220):
In all of this Utah just looks worse and worse. Vitale should be fired.
Lynna @221, well, that settles it for me – USU took full advantage of the threat to rid themselves of this meddlesome woman. I’m sorry for the people who actually wanted to hear her talk, but Ms Sarkeesian can do better, and I hope she does.
needlessly invasive for the audience
needlessly invasive for the audience
Unlike, you know, getting shot, which isn’t invasive at all.
The above statement quoted by Lynna, OM reads for all the world as “We’d rather protect the feelings of an anonymous potential mass murderer than protect the lives of women.”
Following the new article in which Sarkeesian explains why she cancelled, there are lots of comments from dunderheads, but it is encouraging to see comments from reasonable people as well. Here are a few examples:
I haven’t received a response back from Vitale yet (I’m surprised I got the first one).
Regarding the response Tony received from an earlier email, (comment #202), I was appalled by the unprofessional attitude, by the cherry-picking of one aspect of the problem (timing of notifications to Sarkeesian’s assistant), by the spelling and grammar errors, and by the general cluelessness.
More fodder for firing Vitale. Maybe Tony should send a copy of that email to the Salt Lake Tribune?
This whole “she gets these threats all the time therefor we decided it’s no big deal” thing is just blowing my mind. How often she’s been threatened in the past has exactly zero bearing on whether any particular threat is credible. What the actual fuck.
Seven of Mine, #227
It seems to me like they’re saying, “Ohhhh, you know that silly Anita… always getting death threats!”
Even if this threat was a bluff, it did its job. It accomplished exactly what it wanted. So they’ll do it again and the authorities will downplay it again, thus making it work again. I hope not, but that’s what will happen unless the police or school officials start doing their jobs and making sure they’re providing a safe environment for speakers and the audience. Utah State should be absolutely ashamed of itself.
Lynna @226:
Hmm, I think I’ll do just that. Thanks for the suggestion.
Email sent to SLTribune.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/09/concealed-carry-permit-guns-utah
So much for the myth that persons with concealed carry permits are not a threat.
Tony @230, Thanks. I think the people of Utah and USU need to see who they are paying, and how badly he is doing his job.
From a commenter on another forum:
Yes, a teacher did shoot a toilet.
Seven of Mine #27:
My inclination is to wonder wouldn’t it be *more* likely, given a frequency of past threats, that this severe and detailed threat is a credible one. I mean, if someone is a target of widespread harassment and threats of violence coming from many individual sources, it raises the probability that a single one of those harassers will be the kind to actually resort to physical violence. “The threat was not imminent or real” my ass.
Another point which the commenters on places like Salon (don’t read the comments) are ignoring is that Ms Sarkeesian didn’t cancel the talk just in fear for her own safety. That was a threat of mass murder; her audience and anyone else near the venue was also at risk. She made the right call. The people in charge? Not so much.
I’ve got to stop reading all these articles. It’s just making me angry and there’s nothing I can do to help,and I’m getting a headache from banging my head against things out of frustration. Anita Sarkeesian is a good and brave person, and she’s one of my heroes even though I am not into video games.
It still burns me that the people of Missouri voted down concealed-carry, and a few months later the state legislature passed it anyway. One of the few times this state has voted for sanity, and fuck us all, anyhow.
Now if the toilet had been armed, that would never have happened.
Ibis3 @ 234
Well, yeah I would think the probability goes up that someone will turn out to be serious. But that still doesn’t bear on whether a specific threat is credible. For example, knowing that 10% of people are left handed doesn’t tell you anything about whether a specific person is left handed.
Menyambal @236:
I’m sure the Right Wing was first in line to scream about how the will of the people was defied…right?
All hail the Second Amendment, which gave us the right to arm ourselves against rogue… plumbing fixtures. Only in the good old US of A…
The Second Amendment rights of toilets have been restricted, ignored even. It’s a disgrace.
http://bearingarms.com/toilet-trouble-utah-teacher-shoots-self-inside-school-bathroom/
Toilets do have a way to fight back:
http://www.kptv.com/story/24029196/sewer-cleaning-causes-water-to-shoot-out-of-toilets
Oh, I did forget to point out that the toilet shot by the Utah teacher fought back with shrapnel. Porcelain shrapnel.
Same thing happened with the anti-puppy mill bill a few years ago. It’s a gerrymandered mess of political hacks, like pretty much any other state legislature.
Tony @239: Here are a few rightwing protestations from Utah, and yes, the Bill of Rights is mentioned:
Someone mentioned earlier that, in an online search, they couldn’t find the phrases used in the threatening letter. Here’s an article from someone who did find those phrases. Excerpt below:
More links to sources for the phrases used in the threatening letter can be found at the link. “Misandrist harpies” and “feminist poison” or “cultural poison” (as well as other connections of feminism with “poison”) are all covered. “Whore that she is …” is also sourced in this article.
Feminists have ruined his life? Oh, okay.
I wonder why he’s not being called a domestic terrorist for this—then again, misogynistic fundamentalist Christianity never gets called out. Just those little brown Muzzies—after all, the nineteen of them and Khalid Sheik Mohammed represent 1,600,000,000 people, right?
Like the Prima Donna with guns that managed to get someone he didn’t like to shut up?
Seven, #227
I can’t understand this line of reasoning. Civil rights leaders like MLK received numerous death threats too…. and that’s exactly what ended up killing him, even if not every single threat had a chance of being played out. Anita Sarkeesian and others like her risk their lives every time they keep speaking up for equality. Anita is a goddamn hero, and I hope none of the threats against her are even attempted. I admire her so much for the work she does and the risks she has to take to do it. I just wish the world wasn’t like this.
[cross-posted on Butterflies and Wheels]
Hoooo-lee. Turns out GamerGate noticed Sarkeesian’s talk six days before it happened, and schemed about how to shut it down. The last comment in the two screencaps?