[Lounge #367]

This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. Careful! Don’t squeeze the platypuses!

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread


  1. dianne says


    The first time I saw this quasi-word, I thought it stood for something else. Something small, blue, and apt to be blocked by spam filters. There are all sorts of dirty jokes to be made about this confusion.

  2. thunk, circumzenithal arc says


    Sort of awestruck at Typhoon Sanba right now. T numbers at 7.5, which means “quite powerful Cat5”. Bad news, it seems, for Okinawa and South Korea.

    And also, the dubious world high temp record of 58 C in Libya was struck down; now the record is 57 C in Death Valley, California, USA.

    Hot– but it was in 1913, so AGW isn’t real, obviously.

    And it snowed a lot last winter! And stuffs!

    *note; snark*

  3. Vall says

    I updated my Gravitar profile to reflect support for A+. Sometimes the “hover” feature works, and sometimes not. Is that blog specific, or me doing something wrong?

  4. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    And also, the dubious world high temp record of 58 C in Libya was struck down

    Rightly. There are a couple classrooms at Sacramento State that can beat that handily through most of September. >.>

  5. dianne says

    I need some motivation. Louis, when is your company going to get po motivation to market? I’m sure it would be a huge seller.

  6. cicely (presented without quantification) says

    *hugs* for Kitty.
    What are “straight 8s”?

    Piffling amateurs. Dr Myers (and his even-more-nasty side-kick, Dr Meyers), Dr Poopyhead, et al., are examples of true evviiillll…

    You must be thinking of Dr. PeaZee Myers.

    Would it be better to explicitly say “Ona was a 44-year old tallis woman?” Or leave it up to the following sentence, “Age had treated her well, with a still youthful appearance despite a few streaks of grey hair through her long, black hair” to explain how old she is?

    I like the “Age had treated…” approach better.

    On that note, I’m working on a tabletop rpg where you play as cephalopods!

    Sounds interesting!

  7. says

    I can’t figure out MRAs. One day they’re complaining that women who expect men not to shit their britches are too uptight. Another day, they’re lamenting how women shit and piss everywhere.

    Here we have another example of how a toilet is becoming a completely foreign object to women. Eventually, women will have no idea what a toilet is. We’re going to need litter boxes for women in the future. Women litter will be next to kitty litter in the grocery store.

  8. broboxley OT says

    #2 Thunk, good thing it is still snowing in Okinawa and S Korea, would be in deep kimchee if that was not the case.

  9. A. R says

    I just posted this to PET with the comment: “You know what’s sad? Until I saw that it was from The Onion, the idea that this was a parody never crossed my mind… ” I believe it to be the prefect Poe…

  10. stevem says

    Isn’t the platypus the perfect transitional form the inti-evolution fans are searching for? I mean a mammal that lays eggs, a “beaver” with a duck’s bill and a reptile’s poisonous spur? An effective “croco-duck” after all. Just sayin…

  11. A. R says

    stevem: I’ve tried it. It didn’t work. With the hardcore creobots, you can eventually wear them down to “God did it to test our faith,” or “Satan planted/changed/took it to draw us away from God”

  12. says

    Goddamnit. Fuck you RIM for making a half-reliable piece of shit and then abusing your fucking corporate power to say “this is a Nice Thing and if you can’t afford to pay extra to protect it from misfortune, you deserve anything that happens if you happen to fumble it”.

    Now I need a new phone and have little to no idea of how I’ll actually get one. Can’t go through my carrier because I’d need to deal with my mother and am in no state to hear another fucking You Always Break/Lose Nice Things lecture from her (or, really, deal with her at all). Can’t use craigslist etc because I’m terrified of people. Aaaaargh…

  13. birgerjohansson says

    “Study of giant viruses shakes up tree of life” http://phys.org/news/2012-09-giant-viruses-tree-life.html

    “Scientists discover planetary system orbiting Kepler-47” http://phys.org/news/2012-09-scientists-planetary-orbiting-kepler-.html The planet is Jovian, but it could well have big moons following it in the habitable zone around a binary star. The system requires models for planetary system formation to be revised.

    “Chemists develop nose-like sensor array to ‘smell’ cancer diagnoses” http://phys.org/news/2012-09-chemists-nose-like-sensor-array-cancer.html

    “Scientists use levitation to create better pharmaceuticals with fewer side effects” http://phys.org/news/2012-09-scientists-levitation-pharmaceuticals-side-effects.html
    (amorphous vs chrystalline forms of the medicines)

  14. broboxley OT says

    Setar locally we have fleamarkets and 2nd hand shops that sell used gear. Is there something like that locally? We also have a thriving cell phone repair market by young handy entrepreneurs that are extremely good and reasonable. Unfortunately they advertize on craigslist but usually have a mall hut for a location

  15. Old At Heart says

    Just throwing this out here as an off-topic:
    This is what a religion should do. These are those “good Islam” people everyone’s been looking for in the past few years.


    Protesting at the scene of terrorism in Libya and decrying the perps as un-Islamic. It’s a step in the right direction for the Religion of Peace. Many more to go, but as that one fellow once said: The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.

    …Their spelling could use some work though. It’s prophet, not profit. ;) Thanks Libyans, it is a goodly gesture.

  16. F says


    Yeah, I’ve seen the armies of the unemployed doing their welfare work cleaning up women’s shit off city streets. Riiiiight. Relieving oneself outdoors (or drunk; in a hamper or corner or wherever) is something men never do.

  17. birgerjohansson says

    Katherine Lorraine,
    Are you familiar with Wen Spencer’s Ukiah Oregon novels?
    The protagonist is adopted by two women (yes, they are a couple) who also work with finding new homes for dogs.
    The protagonist is btw revealed to be the result of alien genetic engineering. A lot of quite interesting ideas in the series.

    Wen Spencer has also just finished the triology that started with “Tinker”.

  18. Sili says


    Goddamnit! Beat me to it!

    Nothing left for me to do but shit on the rug then.

  19. petermountain says

    I’m currently in a discussion concerning evolution vs Christian faith. Usually the TalkOrigins website is a valuable resource. However, this time I think I’m going to get a lot of the “same facts/different interpretation” argument. Can anyone point me to a website that discusses this line of reasoning?

  20. says

    More proof, as if more were needed, that Republicans, (and particularly Mitt Romney), do not know how to vet their sources:

    Robert Rector, the Heritage Foundation’s in-house welfare expert, is the source for Romney’s lie that Obama “gutted” the 1996 welfare reform law and waived work requirements.

    This the same Robert Rector who thinks the poor in American are not truly poor because most of them have refrigerators. He also notes that the poor are “more likely to be overweight” and this proves they are not really poor. (He apparently doesn’t understand that one can be overweight and also malnourished, nor that lack of access to fresh fruits and vegetables is a common problem in poor neighborhoods.)

    Rector claimed that 22,000 Americans below the poverty line had hot tubs. It took the conservative Cato Institute to debunk that one. [Cato Policy Report, January/February 1995]

    Rector thinks the poor have made a choice not to “behave more like middle-class people” and that’s why they are poor.

    Rector believes in abstinence-only sex education, and dismisses studies showing it is not effective as “bogus.”

    Rector is also affiliated with the Richard and Helen DeVos Center for Religion and Civil Society, which is involved in GOP politics and fundraising. He was very successful in raising funds for abstinence-only programs, and wanted to extend them to unmarried young adults.

    That’s just a few of the telling details that would cause any reasonable person to question Robert Rector as a source.

    This is the source Romney trusts for his inaccurate ads claiming Obama removed work requirements from welfare laws.

  21. Brownian says

    Tell me this isn’t the best response to a PUA-type ever. In the comments on the Cracked article “The 6 Most Accidentally Creepy Movie Romances” in which the forced sex scene between Deckard and Rachael in Blade Runner is discussed, some dip wrote:

    Harrison ford wasn’t raping the chick… he was just displaying his manlyness….

    You don’t just ASK for panties to drop you know… sheesh.

    “So honey, you look quite wonderful this afternoon. And the weather is prime for intercourse! Shall we?”

    to which another commenter replied:

    Manliness is like evolution. You hear the most about it from the people who know the least about it.

    Awesome. Just awesome.

  22. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Threadrupt for the first time in a while (not working affords one plenty of time to stay current; that should be changing in the next week or so as my boss gets some things worked out).

    Will get caught up in a little while.

    I need to kinda sorta vent first (it may sound bad initially, but things wind up at a decent point by the end). This is a bit longwinded too, but when talking about important emotional matters, I don’t do concise.

    Warning: This will include some talk about sex. There are no graphic details.

    I’ve been single 10 years. A portion of that time was spent dating or trying to date. A few years ago, I effectively gave up. I stopped going to bars, and stopped checking out dating sites. I just got frustrated with the lack of any decent people coming my way. I just engaged in the occasional hook up with an old fling, though even sex wasn’t a big priority any longer.
    One of the unfortunate things I began noticing in my sporadic sex life were self centered guys. For many of the interactions I had, I showed them attention and affection, but it wasn’t reciprocated.
    ::TMI warning::
    Largely owing to the fact that I typically have been the bottom in sexual interactions (I don’t enjoy being a top much, and it’s happened a small % of the time in my sexual interactions), most of the guys have been able to lay there, fuck, then get off and be done. As I came to understand this, I accepted it somewhat-largely because I just wanted *some* kind of interaction with someone. I figured settling was better than not having any intimacy.
    At some point in the last year, even that got tiresome. I stopped having occasional hookups and my sex life became virtually non existent.

    When I decided to check out Grindr back on Aug. 6 of this year, I didn’t have any major hopes. I’d checked out the app before, and for the most part, the app seemed to exist as a means to hook up. I don’t begrudge anyone using it for that, but like I said, I wasn’t much in the mood for random hook ups. That’s when I encountered K.

    He and I have been dating for about a month. Financial stress on both ends have limited our time together (he lives an hour away, and stays with his parents, so that’s added more stress), but we’ve made the most of what time we have shared. Early on he mentioned that he was taking a job on a cruise ship soon. Well that day is pretty much here.

    On Saturday, he leaves for 4 month aboard a Norwegian Cruise ship out of Honolulu (jealous!!!!). Last night was the last time we had to spend together before he leaves.

    I *almost* ended things with him today.

    From the start, we’ve had a good amount of personal chemistry and mutual sexual attraction. Despite talk of hanky panky, I didn’t ask or push for anything for a few weeks. It was nice to talk to someone as a person, even about sexual topics, without any pressure *to* have sex. When we started to discuss things, he indicated he wanted to take the plunge before he left for Hawaii.

    The last 3 times we spent together, I’ve tried to initiate sex, and it hasn’t happened-and I couldn’t figure out why. I made my intentions clear, and at least physically, I could tell he was very much interested. It seemed the barrier was mental.

    One of things that frustrates me about K is a lack of communication. Last week, I hit a significant point of frustration because I wanted to discuss where we were heading, as a couple, but he kept avoiding it. He would deflect with jokes or flat out ignore me. I finally looked him in the eye and asked him to please be serious with me for a moment. I suspected what he was doing. I’ve done it before. When something uncomfortable is being discussed, I’ve deflected with humor. I’ve tried to steer conversations away from subjects I don’t want to discuss. That was what I did-years ago-so I was able to see that he was doing the same thing. I told him I’m fine with kidding around and joking, but that there are times I need to engage him seriously, and I would appreciate it if he would respect that. I’ve spoken openly about what I want in a relationship and what I want sexually. I told him that I want to date him, and see how things progress. I told him I want to be in a relationship-at some point-with someone (possibly him), but I’m not going to jump into something like that. I’ve told him that it’s important to me that when I’m with someone that we talk-openly and frankly-about something if it’s important to us. So I was becoming irritated when he was following the pattern of many of the guys I’d have had sex with in the past. To be fair, he’s expressed interest and has shown some degree of affection, but I’ve still been the instigator and done the lions shares of the ‘work’. Knowing that he’s going to be gone for 4 months, he’s repeatedly said he wanted to make it happen before then.

    Given that last night/today was the last time we would see each other, I was hopeful that would be the case.

    It wasn’t.

    Now, I’m not angry that we didn’t have sex, per se. I’m disappointed, I can’t lie. I’m frustrated that it doesn’t feel like he wanted to. Once again, I started things (tried to twice), but other than kissing, there was no reciprocation on his end. This was the fourth time I’ve tried with him following my discussion about communication. He wouldn’t talk to me about what he was thinking, so my frustration was building. I was at the point today that I was just going to say “see ya”.

    But I didn’t.

    I decided to be direct and say what I was thinking. I told him it felt like he didn’t want me sexually. I told him that I’ve been with several guys who were there just for themselves and my needs were secondary. I told him that I like him, and I want him, and that I think he’s attractive. I told him that I want to continue dating him, but if he doesn’t want to do anything other than kiss then it won’t work out. I told him all this as I tried unsuccessfully to hold back the water works.
    I finally reached him. I think when he saw how I was feeling he realized he needed to open up. He could see how hurt I was. FFS, here we are dating, and I was being made to feel like he only wanted me to make him happy. That was contrasted by the fact that we have chemistry. We talk about sexual activities. We flirt. We’re comfortable being naked. We’re affectionate. But when it came to sex, it’s like there was a barrier. I had my suspicions why, but he never gave me an answer until today.


    He told me that the last boyfriend he had-of four years-cheated on him after the first four months they were together. He told me that the guy tried to smash his head through a car window while K was driving. I didn’t push for any information. I could tell that this was tough for him to talk about. I just listened. The only indication of abuse he mentioned was the above, but given that action, and his hesitation to discuss the topic at all, I get the impression that there was more. Again, I didn’t press. I didn’t ask. He told me that he has difficulty opening up. He told me that he was hurt pretty badly by this guy he cared about deeply and that even though he likes me, and wants to have sex, he’s just not there yet.

    I thanked him, hugged him, and apologized. I told him that I’m sorry for what his ex put him through. I told him I’m sorry for bringing those bad memories back. I also told him that I wish I could make a promise never to hurt him, or to bring any physical, emotional or sexual abuse to him. I told him that as it stands now, and has been the case with me for my entire life to this point, that I have never physically hurt someone. I’ve never engaged in emotional abuse. I’ve never engaged in any form of sexual abuse. He looked at me and said “…but you’re human.” He acknowledged that unfortunately, for all that some people say they won’t abuse someone, there are times that proves false. No one can know the future. I told him that I know nothing I *say* could make him trust me. Nonetheless I told him that I have no intention of abusing him in any way, shape or form. I added that I knew those were just words, and that my actions would have to prove that to him. I told him that I understand that will take time. I also told him that I’m ready to call him my boyfriend and that part of what that means is that from now on, he’s the only object of my affection. Even though four months without someone can be tough, I needed to express to him that he’s important to me and that I fully intend to be faithful to him.

    So today was an emotional fucking rollercoaster. I was so close to ending things with him because I was so caught up in feeling undesired. I’m incredibly glad that I was able to put that aside long enough to express myself in a way that he was able to understand. I’m incredibly glad that he opened up to me so that I can better comprehend where he’s coming from.

    In the end, it all came down to communication.

    I’m still uneasy, but that has more to do with the lingering effects of the intense talk we had.
    Despite his departure in two days, I’m hopeful that our relationship will deepen and blossom into something wonderful.
    On a completely positive note, we watched 3 of the Wallace and Gromit shorts last night. Damn that animation is fantastic. The creators are amazing.

  23. dianne says

    Brownian @28: I agree about the comment and response. But I don’t think the scene itself was accidentally creepy. My impression was that it was supposed to be creepy as hell. I also wondered if there wasn’t some programmed coercion going on. Was Rachael literally made for Deckard?

  24. Duckbilled Platypus says

    Careful! Don’t squeeze the platypuses!

    Awesome! I should use this once-in-a-blogtime opportunity to say something truly obnoxious, and get away with it.

  25. PatrickG says

    @ Tony: I really have nothing to say (really, what can I say), so I’ll just offer good thoughts and hope it all works out!

    Well, I’ll say one thing: if someone who’s experienced abuse were to pick a partner and try to work through that, uh, yeah, picking you seems to me kind of like winning the lottery. I hope that doesn’t sound snarky, because it’s not at all.

  26. says

    I made this for you, Ophelia Benson. This MIGHT be the bravest, or stupidest, YouTube video I’ll ever make, unless I screw up the courage to actually speak of the PHYSICALITY of why I identify as a GenderQueer, but I’m not sure I’ll EVER make THAT video! http://youtu.be/hdnLaClXmEw

  27. says

    FUCKING HELL. The “Atheism, philosophy and science” FB page just posted a super racist political cartoon about the embassy attacks, depicting an empty podium marked “The Moderate Muslim Response”.

    Take a guess as to what they did when people pointed out the mass protests in Libya yesterday denouncing the attacks. Your hint: no, it was not “delete the image and issue an apology”.

  28. says


    That’s no surprise. Actually thinking about things when it comes to Muslims is simply too hard. Better to stick to the simple narratives that make people feel good about themselves for not being like “those people” and don’t dare suggest that there’s any bigotry involved.

  29. says

    Setar locally we have fleamarkets and 2nd hand shops that sell used gear. Is there something like that locally?

    Flea markets: only open on weekends, lots of people, not trustworthy

    Second hand stores: …you mean pawnshops? maybe one will have something.

    We also have a thriving cell phone repair market by young handy entrepreneurs that are extremely good and reasonable.

    I don’t know how much water damage will be fixable and at any rate I NEED THE DAMN THING RIGHT THE FUCK NOW FOR WORK.

  30. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    I hope that doesn’t sound snarky, because it’s not at all.

    Not only does that NOT sound snarky, that’s an incredibly nice thing to say.
    Thank you so much.

  31. says

    Okay. Maybe not right the fuck now. But, gah, still majorly stressed over this whole phone thing.

    Mainly because I don’t want to waste money and effort dealing with people only to find out my replacement phone just doesn’t work because of being locked to some carrier, or some other fucking contrived bullshit that exists because nationalizing communications infrastructure is COMMUNISM!!!!!

  32. opposablethumbs says

    Tony, you strike me as an exceptionally sensitive-to-the-needs-of-others and emotionally honest person. I really hope this does work out for both of you – no knowing, of course, but tentacles crossed; I hope K is at a point where he’s ready to work towards something, and work through what he has experienced before. And I agree with what Patrick said!

    Good luck with new work horizons getting sorted out soon, too.

  33. Beatrice says


    I wanted to second Patrick, but I see opposablethumbs came in first, so I’ll just third what they said.

  34. jeepeep says

    Honestly, you could never pursuade me to hold a male platypus. Those fecking creatures secrete a venom that’s agony juice – and not even morphine works!


  35. says

    Okay, just saw the gameplay trailer for ACIII. I hope they do as good a job with their research for this game as they did previously.

    But, am I the only one who finds the technique of wrapping the rope dart around an enemy’s neck and then looping the rope around a tree potentially problematic?

  36. says


    1. whatever the fuck that is it doesn’t exist in Canada because I damn well haven’t heard of it.

    2. I cannot afford to be burdened with any extra costs right now because any money I have that does not go to living expenses has to be saved because my job is extremely sporadic, and moreso in winter. As I said above, going through my carrier would require going through my mother, which I’m in no state to do right now. If I could afford to have it differently, I damn well would, and it’s quite frustrating that you missed this because it comes off as very privileged for you to assume that I can just afford another monthly bill.

  37. PatrickG says

    @ Tony: Phew. I’m even worse at communicating sincere thoughts than I am at sarcastic ones, so I’m glad it came across correctly. :)

  38. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    So I just updated my Facebook status to say that I’m in a relationship and several people have responded on there or in text.
    My sister just asked me about K. As I respect his privacy in public areas like Facebook, I don’t mention his name. I texted her instead to respond. Then, when she asked what he looked like, I sent her a picture of the two of us about to kiss, with our shirts off in bed. Nothing sexual, or anything more out of the ordinary than you’d see on television.
    Her response: I need to see a different picture later in the relationship where I don’t have to see my brother and his boy naked or even a little naked.

    What the fuck.

    I told her we need to chat another time because I have no interest after she made such a rude statement about an innocuous picture.

    Her response just now: I was just kidding. I’d rather see one that’s not as intimate.

    I’m so fucking pissed off at her.
    I just sent her the last response I will send for a few days:
    “Can we please talk about this another time? Whether you intended to hurt my feelings or not, the effect is the same.”

  39. says

    /nigel barges in, pushing better folks aside

    Well. I suppose you all are wondering why I gathered you together here tonight.

    Well. ahem I have an announcement to make:

    My daughter gave birth to a lovely boy. He is 9 pounds, and has all limbs and digits in the appropriate number. His name is yet unknown: it will be either Nehemiah, or Gavin. I really hope it’s Gavin, but that’s not my choice to make.

    Also, I shall be known as Avo, which is, apparently, Esperanto for grandfather.

    My daughter is doing well, as is her shell-shocked husband, who is by her side.

    That is all.

    /nigel pushes his way out the door.

  40. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    You and your family have my utmost congratulations!!!

  41. says


    You and your family have my utmost congratulations!!!

    Thanks! Have a virtual cigar. It’s less carcinogenic than the real ones.

    Also, too, I love your name. It’s my real one.

    And, I can only imagine the picture you sent your sister, but in my imagination, you and your SO are fucking awesome.

  42. ImaginesABeach says

    Tony – I don’t know your sister (obvious Beach is obvious), but I would rather see a picture of my brother and his wife sitting fully clothed on the couch than lying on the bed, him with his shirt off and them about to kiss. Frankly, that’s the way I feel about everyone I know. It’s a strangely prudish reaction I have when it’s people I know. I don’t have a problem with nekkid pictures of strangers, even enjoy them, but if it’s people I know, it’s different.

    That being said, you know your sister and she should have backed off when you told her it hurt your feelings.

    AND I’m really happy for K that he found you! He couldn’t have made a better choice. And, of course I’m happy for you.

  43. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    That’s a reaction I can understand, and quite possibly it’s the way she intended it. That wasn’t how it came across to me though and she offered no follow up explanation to clarify what she meant.

  44. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Conga rats to Nigel and his daughter!

    And here’s to you too Tony. You deserve every happiness in life and here’s hoping that K can be a part of that for a long time to come.

  45. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    Ha! Today kids got their pictures back and they sent home a sample photo with a last chance form. Now with the donation, I can get Little One’s pictures!

  46. says

    Congratulations, Nigel!


    Today in interesting product names…


    I’d say “ill-advised” but of course the choice wasn’t accidental.

    The original oversized Sac

    There’s nothing on earth as comfortable as a freshly fluffed Lovesac.

    The Shrink-Kit allows you to use your household vacuum to shrink your Sac for easy travel or relocation.

    This unique, patented Durafoam blend guarantees that your Sac will always fluff back up to its original, immaculate fullness.

    Compare Sac sizes: It’s pretty important to get the right-sized Sac for your space.

    The founder’s bio includes this:

    Shawn D couldn’t help but take his Sac everywhere. It was perfect at parties and dangerous at drive-in movies. He became known as “the kid with the big Sac”–not a bad reputation for a kid at his station in life . Word spread as fast as a rumor in a small town, and soon neighbors and friends were desperate to get their hands on their own Sac.

  47. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Tony, I wasn’t going to say anything because these situations are unique, and just because I have an anecdote doesn’t mean that my opinion is worth anything. So that disclaimer noted, I dated a woman for 6 years who believed she was the survivor of sexual abuse. It turned out that she was caught up in the repressed memory syndrome idiocy of the 90’s and had been convinced by her therapist that her father had sexually abused her. She had all the symptoms of an abuse survivor, plus the added bonus of hating herself for not being able to remember detail of that abuse. But all that’s just context.

    Reading your long post above I see that you understand that your needs are just as valid in a relationship as your partner’s. This is where I fell down. Over time I set aside my needs more and more until I was just another part of her therapy team rather than any kind of real partner. And to be very clear: this was not her fault. I didn’t know how to be in any kind of relationship, let alone one that had the added complications that abuse brings. The failure was mine and mine alone.

    For what it’s worth from someone who’s no expert and who has failed more often than he’s succeeded in relationships, I urge you to keep your needs firmly in mind, to set your own boundaries and hold to them, just as K should set his boundaries and expect you to respect them.

  48. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    I didn’t know how to be in any kind of relationship, let alone one that had the added complications that abuse brings.

    I can relate.
    I really don’t know how to be in a relationship. I haven’t been involved in a long term relationship in my life. All I really have to go by are watching friends and family, as well as listening to anecdotes such as yours.

    Over time I set aside my needs more and more until I was just another part of her therapy team rather than any kind of real partner.

    Have things changed for you since the time you two were dating? Do you place more importance on your needs in a relationship than you used to?
    Is she in a better place too?

  49. Nutmeg says

    Tony: Best wishes for you and K. You seem like you would be a great boyfriend for the right guy, and I hope it works out for you two.

    Nigel: Congrats on becoming a grandparent!

  50. hotshoe says

    Is it less addictive too? My mom’s already claiming that I should stop drinking strong tea.

    Why stop? Because addiction? That’s not actually a sensible reason, because being “addicted” to something which is not harmful in itself is also harmless, except for the minor, very minor, problem of withdrawal from your desired substance if you are deprived of it.

    Caffeine is well known as physically addictive as well as mentally addictive. WIthdrawal symptoms physically can include headache, general muscle aches, and nausea for a day or so. So what. Either deal with it for a day, or give in and have a cup of tea rather than withdraw. What will be the worse possible thing that can happen? That you won’t ever willingly leave civilization because you might have to leave your tea behind?

    It’s not as if strong tea and/or caffeine have serious negatives for your health (unlike some other addictive substances). The negatives which do occur are easily reversible – if you get jittery, irritable, or even have a caffeine-induced auditory hallucination (I never have, but research suggests a few people do) then just cut back on your tea/coffee/Red Bulls. They don’t leave permanent damage.

    Caffeine is almost certainly good for you, on the whole. And black tea is full of antioxidants and flavonoids that may help prevent heart disease and stroke. Don’t tell your mom she’s full of shit, but you might tell her it’s okay to stop worrying.

  51. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Nutmeg, Improbable Joe, Beatrice, carlie, opposablethumbs:
    Thank you for the well wishes and compliments.


    Dan Fincke is leaving FtB for Patheos (though his post says ‘for the foreseeable future, which indicates that he may stay. I’m not sure, since I won’t check his blog out for further details).
    Interesting. He’s the third (?) blogger to leave within the last few months. I wonder if we’re going to get some new people to replace them. I also wonder if we’re going to lose any more bloggers.

  52. lpetrich says

    #19 birgerjohansson:

    “Scientists discover planetary system orbiting Kepler-47″ http://phys.org/news/2012-09-scientists-planetary-orbiting-kepler-.html The planet is Jovian, but it could well have big moons following it in the habitable zone around a binary star. The system requires models for planetary system formation to be revised.

    I’m afraid that “Hot Jupiters” are old news to me. They continue to be a puzzle — they are not where one would expect a planet composed mostly of volatiles to be.

    The usual solution I’ve seen to this conundrum is that they had formed at some greater distance, then interacted with the protoplanetary disk and spiraled inward. Some of them may have had near-collisions or even glancing collisions, giving them very eccentric orbits — some of the “hot Jupiters” have orbits with eccentricities around 0.8 or 0.9.

    Our Solar System? I’ve seen a serious proposal that Jupiter and Saturn spiraled inward, then spiraled outward again: NASA ADS: Two phase, inward-then-outward migration of Jupiter and Saturn in the gaseous solar nebula, NASA – Jupiter’s Youthful Travels Redefined Solar System

  53. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Ah Tony, I can’t say for certain how she’s doing now. I live on a different continent these days. She was better when we broke up, better in every way. That was the thing that allowed me to leave, and it still causes me pain to think about it. You see, I stuck with the relationship because I didn’t want to hurt her. But when she was finally well enough to handle me breaking up with her she was also well enough for me to begin to assert my needs. But I was too tired, too burned out to make the effort to do that. I’m not proud of that.

    But to be fair to myself, when we broke up I didn’t change anything about my life. I didn’t stop doing any of the things I enjoyed doing, I didn’t avoid any of my friends, I didn’t change jobs or move, nothing changed except we weren’t a couple anymore. Nor did she change anything about her life, at least not during the time we kept in touch anyway. And yet I never saw her after that. We never ran into each other and I realised that our lives had never connected in any meaningful way beyond the time we chose to spend together.

    As for myself, I’m better, I guess. I still subsume my needs as a first instinct and that’s not healthy. But my life with Mrs. Fishy is a much more balanced one, and our needs, beliefs and interests coincide well enough that that instinct doesn’t often cause problems.

  54. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    As for myself, I’m better, I guess. I still subsume my needs as a first instinct and that’s not healthy. But my life with Mrs. Fishy is a much more balanced one, and our needs, beliefs and interests coincide well enough that that instinct doesn’t often cause problems.

    It sounds like your relationship with the Mrs. is working well. I’m glad. You deserve it.

  55. cicely (presented without quantification) says

    Giliell: eMessage for relay to Jen headed your way.

    Manliness is like evolution. You hear the most about it from the people who know the least about it.

    Awesome. Just awesome.


    *hugs* for Tony. I hope this relationship works out…for you both.

    And I agree with PatrickG; K is incredibly lucky, and I hope he appreciates that. And you.

    Congratulations to the TheBold family, and all derivative members thereof!

    Now with the donation, I can get Little One’s pictures!


    Son had an ugly habit of “losing” school picture paperwork; we generally only knew they had happened after the fact, and had nothing but the sample pic. Unfortunately, in view of my life-long avoidance of being captured on film, I did not feel that I possessed the moral High Ground from which to issue more than expressions of sorrow.

  56. markr1957 Inc. says

    @ Setar and your water damaged phone. Of itself (clean) water won’t harm the electronics, though it won’t do the lithium ion battery much good. You can wash the whole phone in distiller water to remove any dirt, though dismantling the thing as much as you can without breaking anything will help. Shake out any excess water, pat dry with absorbent lint free towels or kitchen roll and leave your phone to dry somewhere warm such as over a water heater – just not directly on top.

    Leave it overnight (leave the battery out), and when you put it all back together there’s at least a fair chance it will burst back into life. I work in product development for an electronic instrument manufacturer, and I wash my new boards all the time. If there’s any sticky residue you can even start by using detergent and warm water, as long as you rinse everything with instilled water afterwards.

  57. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Cheers Tony. And thank you for making me think about this. My take away from that time is that I have a responsibility to be clear about my needs within a relationship. Expecting the other party to divine them on their own is unfair. It’s also one’s responsibility to occasionally confirm that your partner’s needs are also being met. In my case she was in no place to be able to do that. That combination of our respective inabilities inevitably led to us breaking up.

  58. Hekuni Cat, MQG says

    Welcome, Rodney!

    Katherine – *hugs*

    Improbable Joe, congratulations! And good luck to your wife in her new job.

    nigel, congratulations on becoming a grandfather. (I also hope your grandson is named Gavin.)

  59. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Re baby names. We wanted to name our daughter a traditional name, spelled normally. Our list at birth contained five such names and one unusual one. While Mrs. Fishy was being stitched up and I was introducing the bub to her nanna I decided that this little thing was so unique, this whole event so unique that I couldn’t name her a common name. Fortunately Mrs. Fishy agreed and we doomed our daughter to having to explain her name for the rest of her life. Mind you, it is spelled exactly how it sounds and once you spell it for people they have no trouble remembering how to pronounce it. Anyway, perhaps they won’t see it the way we did, but Nehemiah is still a real possibility.

  60. PatrickG says

    @ Josh, Official SpokesGay:

    Just a random thought, not to be taken very seriously. I was reading the Repudiation thread (missed most of it in real time) and came across your excellent response to peterhearn (“Oh fuck off peterhearn”).

    Might it be useful to add some sort of “You’re a known troll”, or even a “Known Troll” with a ™ symbol* to that kind of thing? Just me sort of remembering that kind of comment when I was new and totally ignorant of the actors involved…

    Again, a very minor note, with no real substantive value. Feel free to disregard.

  61. chigau (違わない) says

    Best wishes for you and K.
    Yay grampa Nigel!
    (and your daughter and SIL, of course)
    (I kinda like Nehemiah. But the diminutives frighten me…)
    In a case of serendipity:
    About an hour ago the SO sez, “So, where did cigars for a birth come from?”
    I confidently begin to google and yahoo and pfft and…
    The answer is,
    “I dunno.”

  62. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    It turned out that she was caught up in the repressed memory syndrome idiocy of the 90′s and had been convinced by her therapist that her father had sexually abused her. She had all the symptoms of an abuse survivor, plus the added bonus of hating herself for not being able to remember detail of that abuse. But all that’s just context.

    Semi-gf’s mom’s ex GF was caught up in that shit, as well as the whole ‘underground ritual satanic abuse’ craze. It’s kinda hard because I know better than to instantly doubt stories of abuse, and yet the stuff I was hearing through semi-GF was like a textbook case of that whole thing.

    She was a very strange and manipulative woman, and though I don’t like semi GF’s mom very much, I feel very bad for what that woman put her through.

  63. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    The book that was at ground zero for the repressed memory syndrome movement was called “The Courage to Heal”. My ex’s copy was dog-eared and annotated to near illegibility. One of the hardest parts to deal with was when she began to question if the purported sexual abuse had actually happened. Despite years of “guided” visualisations done by her therapist, she just couldn’t remember any details of sexual abuse. No one did. This was a few years before the ridiculous nature of the “Satanic Panic” was exposed.

    I didn’t know enough at the time to be any help. I used to tell her that even if she hadn’t been abused she had all the symptoms of abuse and that the best course of action was to treat those symptoms. I fear that that reassurance prolonged her suffering. If I had it all to do over again I would encourage her to get another opinion, a multitude of opinions even.

    I heard that her therapist did apologise in the end. Perhaps it was motivated by fear of legal action, but she sent a letter to all her clients admitting that what she had done was wrong and that she was no longer going to counsel people.

  64. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    The 52-year-old Ahwatukee Foothills woman had never felt a scorpion sting before that day. She had no intention of seeking medical help, but within an hour of the sting, Edmonds’ mild tingling sensation worsened with throat tightness, blurry vision, darting eyes and tense muscles. She could not walk and had trouble breathing.

    Weeks later, she received a bill for $83,046 from Chandler Regional Medical Center. The hospital, owned by Dignity Health, charged her $39,652 per dose of Anascorp.

    Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/business/articles/20120831scorpion-sting-leaves-woman-big-bill.html#ixzz26QNBBeSX



    I finally found a cute cephalopod: http://deepseanews.com/2012/09/giant-pacific-octopus/

    The Language of Mental Illness Stigma. Page saved.

  65. opposablethumbs says

    Conga rats ululations to NigeltheBold, new Avo! So glad to know that all those involved are in good health and have all their tentacles fingers and toes :-D ::raises glass Nice Cup of Tea:: (it’s early morning here)

    Sorry about the contretemps with your sister, Tony, and I hope you’ll soon be back on happy terms with her. (fwiw I can kind of feel what JAL said – I’d probably love to have a photo like that of my nephew and his boyfriend, but might feel more awkward if it were one of my own Spawn with their boyfriend/girlfriend just because of my relationship with them, not the picture per se. Anyway I hope it doesn’t come between you, and that she is happy for you!)

    JAL, yay for Little One’s photos! It’s so hard with things like that when they’re really young, there’s a lot of pressure on them to get one and you hate to disappoint them. It was a relief when mine got old enough not to care about school photos any more!

    markr1957 Inc., got any advice for a phone that’s been in seawater? :-(((

  66. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    Anyway I hope it doesn’t come between you, and that she is happy for you!

    I wish that were the case (not coming between us). Sadly, she opted not to apologize, and instead has expressed how pissed off she is at me for not apologizing for situations in the past when I was insensitive to her (none of which I remember-bad memory here-nor was she specific). I’ve cooled off now, and can see the perspective that you mention. It doesn’t change how I first felt, but I think my emotional day shook me up enough that I overreacted.

  67. says

    “Been” in seawater? Did the battery boil? If you rinsed it ASAP in clean water and then maybe left it in a bowl of uncooked rice overnight it might be OK.

    Katherine Lorraine, I second the idea of going to a GP, explaining the panic attacks, and trying to get a note for short-term disability or adjusted hours — and ask for recommendations to therapists. He should give you a list. Also your local mental health center can give you a list of people who are accepting patients. I agree that you don’t need to tell them what the problem is, just that you’ve been under a lot of stress and are seeking treatment.

    I remember lugging one of these home so I could work at home and take care of a sick child.

    Tony, good for you and I hope it works out. I hope that a lot of sensual cuddling will bring K out of his shell. Slow & steady wins the race.

  68. says

    Vodka. Tampons. OH HELL NO! I speak sort of from experience. Once when we were young and foolish, my partner and I considered thus: “Chocolate sauce? Damn fool fluffy stuff. WHISKY!” That was a very bad idea. Lucky there was a shower close by.

  69. says

    OK, more caught up now.

    Congrats to Nigel on the grandbub, and best wishes to Tony. Good luck also to Joe & Bossnurse. Crossing my fingers and all!

    Katherine, have some hugs, and never forget to breathe! Take it slow and deep. (ooh err) Seeing a therapist isn’t a commitment to the very last step, and doesn’t commit you to coming out to anyone except the actual therapist zerself. I’m sure you know that perfectly well, but your panicky brain isn’t listening and instead is spamming you with shouty nonsense “Step foot into therapist door = ZOMG COMING OUT & LOSING JOB & FAMILY DISOWNING ME!!!” This is not actually true. Seeing a therapist can help you to separate the helpful and unhelpful thoughts, so go already! Make “just go see the therapist” into your first goal.

    Also, would you really lose your job if you came out as transitioning? It could well be true, but it *need* not be. If they truly appreciate your expertise and aren’t a bunch of total asshats, you might be OK. (I don’t know, obviously, but might you perhaps be catastrophising?)

  70. says

    Good morning
    Oh dear, I suppose my mum in law is the world champion at making herself feel bad. They took the kids to a birthday on Wednesday. She was very worried before that the kids wouldn’t like it.
    They loved it because there was a trampolin in the garden.
    Then she was very worried that they’d fall asleep in the car.
    Well, they didn’t, they were still too exited.
    Now she’s sorry that they were still too exited and didn’t sleep the minute they were put to bed…

    Hmm, I have nothing clever to say, but hugs. That must have been tough for both of you.

    Nigel the Grandpa
    Yay for you, daughter, freshly minted dad and little nameless boy!

    Well, we’d decided on a name long before the kids were born (OK, I had decided on one, Mr. was allowed to agree ;). No, he really did agree with girl-names, we only had big troubles fiding boy-names)
    #1’s pretty unusual (actually, it’s Portugese), but it’s pronounced the way it’s written. It’s amazing how many people can simply ignore a written N or assume that the child’s own mum can’t spell the name correctly and turn it into a more common name with an L in that place..
    The little one’s is easier ’cause it’s the heroine of a children’s book by Astrid Lindgren (and actually no real name at all but the version the German translators made up).
    Come to think of it, both kids have not-names.

  71. says


    The BossNurse is now the DrivingNurse. She’s packed her shit and left the building, off for a 30 day adventure in parts unknown, with the option to renew. Sweet crispy chocolate covered caramel Christ on a stick, I’m going to miss her. Skype is our friend! That is, if I can find my webcam and fix my headset.

  72. blf says

    Malaysia holds seminars to help teachers spot ‘gay children’:

    Light-coloured clothes and large handbags for boys listed as signs, as government forges ahead with anti-gay agenda

    The Malaysian government has begun holding seminars aiming to help teachers and parents spot signs of homosexuality in children, underscoring a rise in religious conservatism in the country.

    The federal government said in March that it is working to curb the “problem” of homosexuality, especially among Muslims who make up over 60% of Malaysia’s population of 29 million people.

    According to a handout issued at a recent seminar, signs of homosexuality in boys may include preferences for tight, light-coloured clothes and large handbags, local media reported.

    For girls, the details were less clear. Girls with lesbian tendencies have no affection for men and like to hang out and sleep in the company of women, the reports said.

    The latest seminar for the teachers and parents was run by deputy education minister Puad Zarkashi, his office confirmed.

    Zarkashi wasn’t immediately available for comment but national news agency Bernama quoted him as saying that being able to identify the signs will help contain the spread of the unhealthy [sic] lifestyle among the young, especially students.

    As one of the commentators pointed out, the “unhealthy” really should be quoted, even if it is in the context of a paraphrase of a bigot’s quote.

  73. blf says

    US election system criticised over finance rules and voting restrictions:

    US campaign finance rules, which have allowed wealthy individuals to pour millions of dollars into the 2012 presidential election, have shaken public confidence in the political process, according to a report by the Global Commission on Elections, Democracy and Security.

    The report singles out the US as an example of a country where lack of transparency and controls in political finance have left it struggling to restore the public’s confidence in its elected officials to act in their interest.

    The commission blamed a series of court decisions — in particular the controversial Citizens United ruling, which turned campaign finance reform on its head and spawned Super Pacs, effectively removing barriers to corporate and union spending to influence elections

    Citizens United has “undermined political equality, weakened transparency of the electoral process and shaken citizen confidence in America’s political institutions and elections”, the report said.

    It also criticises US states which have sought to introduce voter identification laws and other measures that have the effect of suppressing African American participation in the political process.

    The report cited a national survey this year by the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University law school, which found a majority of people believe nominally independent Super Pacs to be a danger to democracy.

    It concluded that, although Super Pacs must disclose their contributors and may not coordinate directly with candidates by law, in practice, “both constraints have been flouted”.

    I suspect the wingnuts will probably go apeshite whining about furiin interference and so on. In fact, they’re already showing up in the comments; e.g., “Kofi Annan in charge of a ‘commission’ assessing US elections? What a joke” (also note the ‘scare quotes’ around commission). Not sure if the UN’s black helicopters have shown up yet, but there is nonetheless a good collection of lies.

  74. bastionofsass says

    Oh, hi, everybody. Just wanted to see if I can post in this thread because the last two comments I tried to post in other threads went *poof* into the void after I hit “submit comment.”

  75. blf says

    Europeans are finally considering taxing church properties.

    Italy’s current government of technocrats announced plans to actually do so — at least for “commercial” properties — back in c.February. (I have no idea of the current status.) The possible limitation of just “commercial” properties would seem to leave open an escape route so large the entire Starfleet could wrap through, especially when dealing with the extremely arrogant, profoundly dishonest, and wealthy Rape Children Cult.

  76. says

    I am empowercorded again.

    Carrot died yesterday. I’m fine, this was not unexpected. He was a very intelligent and sweet boy and we’re lucky to have had him for the 64 days he lived. He bruxed and boggled right up to the end.

  77. blf says

    Sympathies about Carrot…

    (Wonders what is done with a forty-foot long corpse.)

    Did youIgor get enough powercords to feed all the monsters this time?

  78. Nick Gotts (formerly KG) says

    Congrats to Nigel and all concerned, and to Improbable Joe and wife!

  79. says


    Did you Igor get enough powercords to feed all the monsters this time?

    No, Igor spent a bit of time ingeniously using duct tape to make sure there would be no jacking on when it comes to the laptop cord.

  80. birgerjohansson says

    Zombie Apocalypse Training Offer At Combat Zone In Surrey http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/09/13/zombie-apocalypse-training-surrey_n_1882630.html
    — — — — — — —
    Bah! Get motorcycle gear, and supplement the helmet with a “flange” of leather to protect the neck, and you are practically zombie-proof.
    It is worse dealing with big critters that can crush you with their jaws without breaking your skin. Mutant ursines with a bit of primate DNA is what I am currently working on
    — — — — — —
    I think the big deal about the new Kepler discovery was that there is a whole multi-planetary system orbiting a binary star. While single planets have been found orbiting binaries before, this new discovery means binaries may have as big and diverse planetary systems as other stars (providing the binaries orbit each other at close range).

  81. opposablethumbs says

    Oh Tony I’m sorry :( Maybe her anger will cool … dunno, it doesn’t sound to me as if what you did was anything more than potentially slightly annoying, but of course I don’t know your history with your sister. Perhaps if she had some idea of how much upheaval you’d been through … ?
    Markita Lynda, I’m not 100% certain about the battery, but there are corrosion marks visible on some contacts so it’s probably knackered. This was my dearly beloved SonSpawn who was far far away from home at the time; I didn’t know about the accident until considerably later – they did the bowl of rice thing, but hadn’t rinsed it. Oh well, at least it was the only casualty of his trip – all humans involved are safe and sound :). And he just has to do without now – the SIM survived, fortunately, and he’s using an old brick-type handset for emergencies now he’s at his new school. He really loved that phone (it was a combined birthday-plus-doing-really-well-in-an-exam-he-worked-hard-for present), and I’m glad to say he has not breathed one peep about it – completely accepts the consequences of his mistake (he forgot he had it in his pocket for a moment, at the beach).
    Caine I’m so sorry about Carrot. You made his short life as happy and as comfortable as it could possibly have been {{hugs}}

  82. says

    I’m sorry to hear about Carrot :(

    In good news, France is at least shutting down the Fessenheim nuclear plant within the next four years. Oldest one in France, constantly producing small accidents and built on the fucking Rhine-split, potential earthquake territory. Just because the last major earthquake has been a few hundred years ago doesn’t mean they won’t happen ever again, duh.
    Now, if they could please close down Cattenom next? One of the biggest plants in France, very effective at producing emergency shutdowns…

  83. birgerjohansson says

    ‘Moving to Sweden doesn’t mean winning the romance lottery’ http://www.thelocal.se/43164/20120911/

    Hmmm…In the northern rural parts a lot of the girls have moved to the cities in the south. There is a huge surplus of more or less desperate guys. But many of those guys might be uncomfortably close to the stereotype of American Southern rural guys named “Bubba”.
    (which reminds me of the rapper version of “We Are Farmers”)
    — — — — — — —
    The immense cost of a nuke plant is currently a strong argument against nuclear power.
    Is the plumbing of the heat exchangers the most costly part of nuclear powerplants?? If there was a standardised design, you could probably bring cost down by assembling the heat exchangers in a factory environment (with lasers to ensure minimal tolerances) move the stuff to the construction site on the back of an Antonov-225 or a hoovercraft capable of lifting 200 tons.
    The reactor vessel might likewise be prefabricated in segments.
    And none of these umpteenth-generation powerplants that may have technological frills but cost as much as the budget of a medium-sized nation.

    The mid-life upgrade might likewise be achieved by ripping out the heat exchanger and slotting in a new “cassette”.
    Not a panacea, but might take some of the load off solar power until that technology is fully competitive.
    (yes, I know the technology is developing fast, I was thinking “belts and suspenders” in case one energy system does not evolve fast enough)

  84. puppygod says

    markr1957 Inc., got any advice for a phone that’s been in seawater? :-(((

    I heard from a pretty reliable source (guy that operates lab electronic equipment), that isopropyl alcohol can work wonders in cases like this. It’s apparently a good solvent for removing salt deposits, but not aggresive enough to solve phone itself – at least not immediately. Also it evaporates fast and without forming droplet with high concentration of salts (like water tend to do). You should dunk the phone into isopropyl alcohol (obviously, removing battery first) and let it soak for hour or so, so it will flush any deposits and then let it dry for a day. Battery probably needs replacement. It probably won’t help much if metal parts are corroded, but if the problem is salts deposited on electronic parts, it migh help.

  85. thunk, Blob Alert! says

    Carrot, ouch. It was good while you lived.

    Giliell: partially; it is the old nuclear plants that are problematic (but less so than spewing radionuclides from coal) But they do provide a base load. The new ones, however, are expensive. :/

    Nub Flag: ON

  86. birgerjohansson says

    Excavations in Jaffa confirm presence of Egyptian settlement on the ancient city site http://phys.org/news/2012-09-excavations-jaffa-presence-egyptian-settlement.html -It seems to me that the only well-organised polity (beyond city-states) to exist in the area prior to the ninth century was Egypt and its garrison settlements.

    Surgery has a more profound effect than anesthesia on brain pathology and cognition in Alzheimer’s animal model (an inflammatory process?)
    http://medicalxpress.com/news/2012-09-surgery-profound-effect-anesthesia-brain.html -I know elderly that have rapidly lost cognitive function after surgery.

  87. opposablethumbs says

    Thank you, puppygod, might be worth a try! (though it looks too far gone – probably some corrosion :( ).

    Where/how can a person-in-the-street get hold of isopropyl alcohol, will they sell me half a litre at the chemist’s in the high street?

  88. opposablethumbs says

    Oh, and completely unrelated – can any of our francophones help me out with the meaning of “RR“?

    I’m familiar with RAS = rien a signaler, but dunno this one and can’t find it anywhere yet. Context is answering a survey question about your opinions of various different advertisements/packaging designs for a product.

    Yeah, it’s riveting stuff :)

  89. says

    Re corrosion: I once successfully rehabilitated a phone that had been out in the rain by taking it apart and gently rubbing the rust off the thin metal bits under the keyboard with fine steel wool.

    But it was a Nokia of some generations back, with rather big keyboard bits compared to today’s Blackberries, so that’s probably only practical now if you’ve teeny, tiny fingers and incredible patience.

  90. trinioler says

    Caine, sorry to hear about Carrot. I;m glad he had you to take care of him for his short life.

    How are the other rats taking it?

  91. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Two thoughts: Why the hell am I watching tennis? And, the theme from the Spiderman cartoon really is a fine bit of composition. Must go to bed….

    Giliell, People here most often add an extra vowel to the small fry’s name when saying it out loud. Spelling it usually fixes that. It seems to be an Australian thing, I don’t remember it happening back in Canada. I don’t regret our decision at all, and truth be told, many of her cohort’s names sound just as strange to my ear as I’m sure her’s does to their parents. Hearing all her kinder class’ names the first time I volunteered there brought on a sudden ‘Where the hell am I?’ moment of disorientation. Mind you, so do the upsides down light switches even after being here almost five years.

    Caine, very sorry to hear about Carrot.

    Tony, best of luck to your travelling nurse. Being apart can be hard, but comng back together again rocks. Here’s hoping that this is the beginning of the end of your financial woes.

  92. markr1957 (Patent Pending) says

    If a phone wasn’t underwater too long you might be lucky enough that soaking it in distilled water will remove any salt deposits, but added shaking will help there – we use an ultra-sonic cleaner similar to the machine used by jewelers and opticians. Alcohol might be risky since it may attack plastic parts, so test it somewhere unimportant before soaking your phone in it. Acetone (aka nail polish remover) is great too but that really can dissolve some plastics, so again use caution and test somewhere it wont matter. Warm soapy water is always safest – just rinse with distilled (or de-mineralised) water after cleaning and before drying.

    Batteries have the problem that the contents (Lithium in particular) overheat and possibly explode when water is added, so if there is any crack or split in the battery you’re SOL. Minor corrosion on contacts or terminals can be removed with a very fine emery board or wet & dry grade sandpaper – just remember you want to remove the corrosion, not the contact.

    On the upside of life the legal department of the evil corporate empire that owns my soul has decided to apply for a patent for one of my crazy WTF ideas! 55 years old and finally my evil genius gets some recognition :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

  93. markr1957 (Patent Pending) says

    If a phone wasn’t underwater too long you might be lucky enough that soaking it in water will remove any salt deposits, but added shaking will help there – we use an ultra-sonic cleaner similar to the machine used by jewelers and opticians. Alcohol might be risky since it may attack plastic parts, so test it somewhere unimportant before soaking your phone in it. Acetone (aka nail polish remover) is great too but that really can dissolve some plastics, so again use caution and test somewhere it wont matter. Warm soapy water is always safest – just rinse with distilled (or de-mineralised) water after cleaning and before drying – this will prevent spotting.

    Batteries have the problem that the contents (Lithium in particular) overheat and possibly explode when water is added, so if there is any crack or split in the battery you’re SOL. Minor corrosion on contacts or terminals can be removed with a very fine emery board or wet & dry grade sandpaper – just remember you want to remove the corrosion, not the contact.

    On the upside of life the legal department of the evil corporate empire that owns my soul has decided to apply for a patent for one of my crazy WTF ideas! 55 years old and finally my evil genius gets some recognition :D:D:D:D:D:D:D

  94. says

    I’m not that much worried about the cost, I’m worried about the damn things melting down.
    You’re pretty young, but I grew up in a world where nuclear power was safe.
    Then it became a world where western/capitalist nuclear power was safe
    Now it’s a world where non-Japanese western nuclear power is safe.
    I have no interest in seeing it become a world in which nuclear power non-Japanese, non-French, no older than 30 years, western nuclear power is safe.
    Especially not living in one of the evacuation zones…

  95. says

    … I could add: the general disposability and semi-serviceability of modern high-tech always kinda bothers me. As an inveterate tinkerer, my first impulse is always to repair stuff. For a host of reasons. One is not so much practical… Tho’ I guess I could argue it has some benefits, it’s really mostly just that I like taking stuff apart and reassembling it (see also Pirsig). Another is, y’know, any good tool does slowly become a part of you, mold to you (and you to it) as you work with it, and breaking something else in, customizing and so on and making it work with my fingers and brain is a whole process…

    And then the part of my brain that does math steps in to say: ‘yes, you can get a replacement bit for this shipped for this much (or crazier still machined) for this much, or you could hack up a driver or whatever for this bit here yourself, but you do realize a whole new unit of later generation with twice the clock rate is now available on Ebay for like $50 less than that, right?’ And the two bits get into this whole philosophical thing, and I have to ask: okay, cost versus benefit, and how much am I discarding if I just say to hell with it and go new, how much trouble is it going to be making the new unit work my way…

    There was a William Gibson novel had some ruminations on this a while back. Think it was Idoru, tho’ I’m not sure now. One of the bizarre and loveable artifacts was an oddball laptop with a custom case and external keycaps made out of, if I recall correctly, cut stone. As my current laptop is also a bit of a chimera now (tho’ less dramatically than that), the notion has always held a special place in my heart.

  96. says

    On behbeh names:
    *fingers crossed for ‘Gavin’*, but if he’s going to be Nehemiah, here’s hoping for a “plain” middle name. :)

    Mr Darkheart and I have already picked a name for DarkFetus– the hardest part was whittling out all of the religious names. Thankfully, I’ve got some really good family names of long dead relatives (she’ll be named for my great-granddad and my grandmama).

  97. opposablethumbs says

    Thank you very much, markr1957. The battery looks ok, but there seems to be damage to the [eh, goldy-looking bits and stuff inside, what do I know] in the form of powdery greenish deposits (could maybe rub these off w ultra-fine wire wool or something) but, worse than that, something oily has ruptured somewhere and there’s one spot that looks like an electrical burn (like inside a shorted-out plug). As you can see, we’ve opened it up already on the grounds that there was almost certainly nothing left to lose :-/

    Hey, congratulations on your patent pending!

  98. opposablethumbs says

    AJ Milne, yes! I hate throwing things away when 90% of them still works, hate it with a passion. My OH is totally into taking apart the two-and-a-half broken ones and cobbling the bits together into one that works (and a leftover quarter for next time). But also yes, if it’s something you really need and the new one is (sometimes massively) cheaper than repairing the old … but I hate what it does to our “relationship” with the material world generally and my little scraps of tech in particular :(

  99. Nutmeg says

    *hugs* for Caine. I know you gave Carrot the happiest and most comfortable life possible.

  100. says


    On behbeh names:
    *fingers crossed for ‘Gavin’*, but if he’s going to be Nehemiah, here’s hoping for a “plain” middle name. :)

    Sadly, no.

    Nehemiah Isaiah Ezekiel. Yep. A triple-scoop old-testament helping of schoolground pain.

    Strange thing is, it’s not exactly because of religious reasons. Sure, they’re both Christians, but that’s not the reason. It’s because a rabbi friend of theirs said it means something along the lines of, “The generation of change.” Near as I can tell, it’s one name meaning “Comforter,” and two names roughly meaning, “God bless.”

    On the plus side, he has a fairly uncommon name. He won’t run into too many other Nehemiahs in his life.

  101. opposablethumbs says

    That’s quite some triple-scoop. My Spawn have three too, but including at least one “plain” one each. If he were to want a “plain” option later, would it work where you are to go by Zeke? (I have no idea what that sounds like to most people’s ears, so I hope it doesn’t sound all wrong in any way).

  102. says


    I’m picturing a bearded toddler, here.

    Now I am, too. And smiling. Thanks for that. (Not that I’m disappointed — I’m really not. Just a bit confounded.)


    If he were to want a “plain” option later, would it work where you are to go by Zeke?

    Zeke. That’s an excellent suggestion.

  103. opposablethumbs says

    Um, that was :-D @ Nigel. I didn’t know about the German homophone. (intra-linguistic homophones, the bane of would-be name-suggesters everywhere!)

  104. says

    Thank you all for the sympathies. ♥

    Trinioler, the other rats are fine. They knew Carrot was ill. They were all caring and protective of him while he was alive.

    Chigau, I don’t know if Tethys knows about Carrot. I feel worse for her than I do for myself.

  105. says

    I’ve been confounded by baby name choices, too, but that’s okay. :) I’m thinking of a friend of my 4 year old niece whose name is ‘Dashiell’– yes, it’s a famous author’s name, but no one actually liked The Maltese Falson that much.

    But, this isn’t exactly a new thing. I went to high school with a girl named ‘Sparkle’.

  106. carlie says

    I’m so sorry, Caine.

    Every time I see Nehemiah, my brain follows it up with Esther and Job. Thanks, Bible memorization lessons.

  107. David Marjanović says

    *sees photo on main page*
    *squees and squees and squees*

    That’d be pronounced “zek-eh” though, correct? Rather than “zeek”?


    Tick like the blood-sucking insect (or is it an arachnid?)

    Yes; and yes, it’s an arachnid. A mite, to be exact.

  108. opposablethumbs says

    I went to high school with a girl named ‘Sparkle’.

    Now that’s downright cruel and inhuman. As a name a person has to live with all their life? Ow.

  109. says


    I went to high school with a girl named ‘Sparkle’.

    In high school, I knew a Moonglow (girl) and Starshine (boy). Moonglow never had one nice thing to say about her parents. Starshine didn’t seem to give a shit about his name, he was a jock (possibly contrary to his parents’ expectations, eh?)

  110. broboxley OT says

    Nehemiah=nini (pronounce neenee)
    Zecke could have issues if he/her wants to do business in Russia

  111. says

    In response to the post @38, I’ll back up comments I posted to the Let’s Not Get Confused thread yesterday with more info noting that we need to separate the attacks in Benghazi from protests at other embassies.

    Most of the other protests, while they look pretty bad, are fairly moderate. They don’t have rocket-propelled grenades and they are not murdering people.

    On NPR this morning the reporting still blamed all unrest on the stupid affront to art that was the anti-muslim film (my summary of dubious dubbing).

    In Benghazi, that’s not true.

    History, previous attacks in Benghazi, eyewitness accounts and more:

    Backing up the above, Richard Engel in Cairo:

  112. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    There’s a woman in my lab named Echo.

    It is not a nickname.

  113. says

    More backup for the news that the Benghazi attack was not a protest against the film:

    A Libyan security guard who said he was at the U.S. consulate here when it was attacked Tuesday night has provided new evidence that the assault on the compound that left four Americans dead, including the U.S. ambassador to Libya, was a planned attack by armed Islamists and not the outgrowth of a protest over an online video that mocks Islam and its founder, the Prophet Muhammad.

    The guard, interviewed Thursday in the hospital where he is being treated for five shrapnel wounds in one leg and two bullet wounds in the other, said that the consulate area was quiet – “there wasn’t a single ant outside,” he said – until about 9:35 p.m., when as many as 125 armed men descended on the compound from all directions.

    Meanwhile, the Romney team is saying that if he had been president things would have been different.

    There’s a pretty compelling story that if you had a President Romney, you’d be in a different situation,” Richard Williamson, a top Romney foreign policy adviser, said in an interview…. Williamson added, “In Egypt and Libya and Yemen, again demonstrations — the respect for America has gone down, there’s not a sense of American resolve and we can’t even protect sovereign American property.

    The killings of the US ambassador to Libya and three of his staff were likely to have been the result of a serious and continuing security breach, The Independent can reveal.

    American officials believe the attack was planned, but Chris Stevens had been back in the country only a short while and the details of his visit to Benghazi, where he and his staff died, were meant to be confidential.

    The US administration is now facing a crisis in Libya. Sensitive documents have gone missing from the consulate in Benghazi and the supposedly secret location of the “safe house” in the city, where the staff had retreated, came under sustained mortar attack. Other such refuges across the country are no longer deemed “safe”.

    Some of the missing papers from the consulate are said to list names of Libyans who are working with Americans, putting them potentially at risk from extremist groups, while some of the other documents are said to relate to oil contracts….

    Link to Indepenent (UK) source.

  114. says

    Kansas is going full bore Birther. The state election board is considering removing Obama from the ballot.

    Kris Kobach is the guy responsible (Link is to Talking Points Memo article). Like Arizona Secretary of State Ken Bennett who also threatened to keep Obama off the ballot, Kobach is a mormon. Maybe he’s just stupid without mormonism, but it is hard to tell.

    Huff Po version of the story.

  115. says


    Kansas is going full bore Birther. The state election board is considering removing Obama from the ballot.

    Is it just me, or is the entire country nuttier than a Planters factory?

    This election has really brought out the industrial-grade stupidity.

  116. blf says

    …a customer named “Sunday”. She goes by “Sunny”.

    So would someone named “Monday” go by “Loony”?

    There actually was a sort-of famous guy named “Looney”. Perhaps appropriately, he was a religious nutter, but is best-known for being one of the leading fools in the Shakespeare-didn’t-write-Shakespeare mob.

  117. says

    … I hate what it does to our “relationship” with the material world generally and my little scraps of tech in particular.

    Very much so.

    I sometimes wonder what might be the overall effect on our brains of the pace of material change in the world. And what you can actually do about it…

    Thing is: processors do get faster and more capable in other ways, and insert essay trying and failing to describe the general pace of this and the general pace in other innovations at present here. And, actually, as I make my money making them, actually, it’d be a mite hypocritical to complain much. And, realistically, opting out isn’t really an option. The world will move on, and the new stuff will have benefits, too…

    But I wonder if it doesn’t create a sense (and reality) of impermanence about everything. It’s riding a metaphorical wave, and while it’s fun and exhilarating and you can go far, it’s also pretty scary. And wasteful, much of the time. And as I think we do form a sort of relationships with our tools and/or toys, it’s a bit like having to attend regular funerals…

    My way of grappling with it has generally been to try to get to know my technology as well as I can, work with it, customize it, make it more my own, make it last a little more than it might otherwise. My phone is rooted, and run some of my own software. Got Debian on this laptop, also running lots of bits I actually wrote. Try as much as possible to make the technology work for me, rather than letting it dictate the terms too entirely. Works for me partly because I’m in the industry and capable enough in those domains; not everyone has the time or resources.

    It’s like it’s almost a luxury in this world spending time on things, finessing them, making them to last. That laptop enclosure Gibson’s describing would actually be an insanely luxurious indulgence in terms of cost, whether you made it yourself or commissioned it. And who knows how long you’d really keep it running as peripheral standards moved and it got harder and harder to fit the guts into it (in his vision, I believe, the innards got upgraded sorta haphazardly, a bit like with desktops and servers built on standard boards, and, of course, exactly the same thing happens with those–you can upgrade for a while, but eventually the only bit you’ve got left from the beginning is one effectively obsolete hard drive running on a legacy card in a legacy slot because the disk interface isn’t even available on modern motherboards, everything else goes out in sporadic fits as the standards move too far to accommodate).

    Sure, the longer-term reality of the universe is impermanence. It all burns out anyway; you’re kidding yourself if you forget that entirely. But our current era has a way especially of keeping that so very much right in our faces. And you can’t even get to know things before they’re on the way to recycling or the landfill.

    Get to thinking my dream job would be doing something like making those enclosures, or stuff in the general category. Things made almost pointlessly beautiful and durable, made to last as tho’ you might be using it 300 years from now, just to take it a little easier on people, in doing so.

  118. Beatrice says

    Just the other day I was reading an article about Jamie Oliver (wiki bio). His four kids are named Poppy Honey Rosie, Daisy Boo Pamela, Petal Blossom Rainbow, and Buddy Bear Maurice.


  119. Beatrice says

    At least the other three have one regular (and quite nice) name each, but Petal Blossom Rainbow is fucked.

  120. says

    Whoops! And Apologies. In my comments at #166 I identified Kris Kobach as mormon. He is not. He is Anglican.

    Bennett is the mormon dude.

    Kobach is a Harvard grad. Southern Poverty Law Center has a long bio on this guy.

    He served as president of the Harvard Republican Club and found a mentor in the late Samuel Huntington, an influential political science professor who came to see Latino immigrants as a scourge on American culture.

    With Huntington as his advisor, Kobach earned the Harvard prize for the best student thesis in 1989. He analyzed how the South African business community functioned within apartheid and took the unpopular position that investors should not divest their holdings in that country but rather remain as agents of change. A year later, he published the thesis as a book.

    Kobach graduated in 1988 at the top of his class in Harvard’s department of government, according to his website. With a Marshall Scholarship from the British government, he attended Oxford and completed a Ph.D. in political science in 1992….

    Mitt Romney also has a Huntington connection.

  121. blf says

    is the entire country nuttier than a Planters factory?

    Salted or unsalted? Or otherwise flavoured?

    (Probably pea-and-horse flavouring…)

  122. says

    Another excursion into the back alleys of Mitt Romney’s brain:

    Mitt Romney said that “middle income is $200,000 to $250,000 and less,” in an interview with “Good Morning America’s George Stephanopoulos.

    According to the Census Bureau, the actual median income in the USA is about $50,000.

    Romney followed up his misinformation on middle income with this:

    “I said that there are five different studies that point out that we can get to a balanced budget without raising taxes on middle income people,” he continued. “Let me tell you, George, the fundamentals of my tax policy are these. Number one, reduce tax burdens on middle-income people. So no one can say my plan is going to raise taxes on middle-income people, because principle number one is keep the burden down on middle-income taxpayers.”

    This is one of Romney’s “because I said so” moments.

    Almost every economist says the numbers don’t add up in Romney’s tax plan. Several economists have tried mightily to make the numbers work. Yesterday Harvey Rosen, an economics professor at Princeton, weighed in.

    Excerpts from Bloomberg article.

    The Republican presidential candidate has refused to say which tax breaks he would eliminate. Rosen’s illustration abolishes those for home mortgage interest payments, employer- provided health insurance, state and local taxes, charitable donations and the unrealized increase in the value of life- insurance policies for households with six-figure incomes.

    Romney has done this before. He makes the assumption that stating general principles obviates the need to state specifics. And he assumes the universe will magically conform to his general principles.

  123. says

    Steve Benen, writing for The Maddow Blog, summarizes Mitt Romney’s problem with taxes, expenditures, details, and Harvey Rosen:

    …here’s where Romney runs into real trouble.

    On the one hand, the Republican intends to approve a massive, multi-trillion-dollar tax cut, while increasing government spending on defense and entitlements. On the other hand, Romney says he can pay for all of this by cutting deductions. Which deductions? That’s a secret — the GOP candidate refuses to tell anyone until after the election — but Romney cites Harvey Rosen to bolster his case.

    But Rosen’s analysis says Romney’s plan only makes sense if he eliminates popular measures such as the home-mortgage-interest deduction, the health care deduction, and the charitable-contribution deduction. And wouldn’t you know it, Romney has specifically said he’ll protect the home-mortgage-interest deduction, the health care deduction, and the charitable-contribution deduction.

    The man Mitt Romney cites as proof that he’s right is the same man who offers proof that Romney is wrong.

  124. blf says

    [Rmoney] assumes knows the universe will does magically conform to his general principles de jour.


  125. opposablethumbs says

    AJ Milne, I only wish I had the skills/knowledge to do even a fraction of that.

    I also wonder (um, get off my lawn?) whether it affects people’s attitudes to conservation and natural resources generally, if we unconsciously start to see the whole material world as “throwaway”. Maybe we start to expect or assume ultra-fast obsolescence in other fields too; it might actually make sense not to fix some types of appliance, but does that distract us from the fact that it does make sense to make other types of things to be longer-lasting.

    Maybe the thing to focus on is quality of content, and I’m just being hung-up on the throw-away nature of the support media.

    We probably need much more emphasis on recycling … preferably not by exposing kids in some parts of the world to toxins as we ship out mountains of broken computer parts :(

  126. says

    Remember those dishonest ads from Romney that depicted Obama as gutting the work requirements in the welfare act? Well, now the Republicans are really trying to gut the work requirements. No irony here, nope, none at all.

    Republicans have embraced a widely debunked premise to attack President Obama for “gutting” welfare reform. But a House GOP bill that has already cleared a major committee would actually ax the welfare program’s work requirements, according to Congress’ nonpartisan referee.

    The legislation — H.R. 4297, The Workforce Investment Improvement Act — was unveiled in March by Rep. Virginia Foxx (R-NC) and cosponsored by six Republican colleagues. Among them was Education & Workforce Chairman John Kline (R-MN), who passed the bill through his committee in June.

    The measure is aimed at streamlining workforce training by letting states slash redundant programs and consolidate them with the Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) welfare program — into one Workforce Investment Fund (WIF). States would be given so much flexibility that the restrictions in the 1996 welfare law need no longer apply, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service….


  127. says

    More Republicans seizing on conditions in Egypt to out themselves as dimwits.

    Rep. Allen West (R-FL) accused President Obama of practicing “dhimmitude” — a submission of America to Islam — by continuing to give foreign aid to Egypt.

    “What you see coming from President Obama and the Obama administration is what they call dhimmitude in the Islamic world,” West said Thursday night on Fox News. “When you look at the speech he gave at Turkey, when you look at his bow into the Saudi king and the interaction there, when you look at the speech that he gave at the University of Cairo, they see weakness, and as Gov. Palin said, they see a policy of appeasement.”…

    Uh …. whut?

  128. says

    Here’s how Romney is preparing for the debates: he is telling everyone that Obama is going to lie.

    Mitt Romney told Good Morning America that he expects President Obama to “say things that aren’t true” during the presidential debates this fall.

    “I’ve looked at prior debates,” Romney said. “And in that kind of case, it’s difficult to say, ‘Well, am I going to spend my time correcting things that aren’t quite accurate? Or am I going to spend my time talking about the things I want to talk about?’”

  129. says

    “I just pray that Americans will open their eyes between now and November when they know that they’ll have to make that choice between free stuff or freedom. You can’t have both.” — Sarah Palin

    “I hope people understand this, your friends who like Obamacare, you remind them of this, if they want more stuff from government tell them to go vote for the other guy — more free stuff.” — Mitt Romney

    Since portions of Obamacare have gone into effect, seniors and disabled people have saved about $4 billion in reduced prescription drug costs, and nearly 13 million families received about $1 billion in rebates from insurance companies that were spending too much of their premiums on CEO salaries, etc. and not enough on health care.

    I guess you could call that “free stuff,” but is looks more like “reasonable stuff” with no loss of freedom unless you count the loss of insurance company freedom to run what are basically scams.

  130. broboxley OT says

    #186 Lynna

    Since portions of Obamacare have gone into effect, seniors and disabled people have saved about $4 billion in reduced prescription drug costs, and nearly 13 million families received about $1 billion in rebates from insurance companies that were spending too much of their premiums on CEO salaries, etc. and not enough on health care.

    I have no idea about senior drug savings but please give a cite for the $1 billion in rebates since it is my understanding that it hasn’t taken effect yet.

  131. Patricia, OM says

    *twirls back in*

    Audley – I can’t even imagine that… O.o

    Now that I’m on a two consecutive day work schedule, I remember why I hated work. Pay is about the same*. Smirk.

    *slave wage vs volunteer

  132. says

    Caine, I’m very sorry about Carrot.

    TLC, I can’t watch video at work, but (1) tampons soaked in alcohol are not new, and (2) a lot of bullshit about “the latest teen fads” gets circulated to hype up moral panics.


    There’s a woman in my lab named Echo.

    It is not a nickname.

    Echo was a nymph in Greek mythology, so it’s not as “out there” as Sparkle or Moonglow.

    Nigel the Bold:

    In Ketchikan, there was the Balls twins, Red and Harry. (True story!)

    For a minute I thought you were talking about Harry Baals.

    Just remember, everybody, we’re not supposed to criticize people with stupid names. Natalie Reed sez THAT’S OPPRESSIVE. (Yeah, right… then again, she also once claimed that furries and “otherkin” should be countered as “queer” and therefore oppressed. So, uh, yeah.)

    Art Vandelay never seems to say anything that isn’t bigoted. Perhaps he could go work for the government of Malaysia (see blf’s link at #103 above).

    Shockingly, the Boston Heil-ald wrote about Glen Doherty without mentioning the MRFF at all. And they’re not alone. If you Google news on “Glen Doherty MRFF,” the only news site that mentions the affiliation is HuffPo.

    I caught the end of a news segment about Glen on Nice Polite Republicans this morning. Nothing about the MRFF. That would’ve given Babs Bradford Hagerty a big ol’ sad, I guess.

  133. birgerjohansson says

    Studying biosamples at ‘supercold’ temperatures—without freezing—now a reality http://phys.org/news/2012-09-biosamples-supercold-temperatureswithout-freezingnow-reality.html
    A lithium chloride solution like this is almost certainly toxic, but it would be fascinating if some organs or tissue types could be stored at -200 without frezing, and without being ruined by toxicity.
    Of course, the first application will be the study of proteins.

    (some evil application for octopi fetuses?)
    — — — — — — — — —
    “Well, am I going to spend my time correcting things that aren’t quite accurate? ”

    Romney could cut down on debate falsehoods by 90% just by being silent.

  134. Patricia, OM says

    Audley – Ugggh! No wonder women get to a certain stage and constantly say, I just want this over!

    We have a staff meeting today, which means I could fill three bingo cards in an hour. My schedule got changed so I can fill in for our future mayor. Brings on a chuckle every Wednesday, I’m filling in so he can run his flashy campaign, unopposed .

  135. says

    Audley, I AM super jealous of you!

    And if I believed in luck, I’d say all of you saved my wife’s life this morning, since there was a ridiculously horrendous crash that happened right in front of her this morning on her way to Parts Unknown. A pickup truck pulling a trailer lost control, the truck barrel-rolled to the left, the trailer swung to the right and off the overpass into traffic below, and my wife managed to slow down before hitting either.

  136. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    (Yeah, right… then again, she also once claimed that furries and “otherkin” should be countered as “queer” and therefore oppressed. So, uh, yeah.)

    …why not?

  137. Patricia, OM says

    *smirk* I have a very quitelarge BAZINGA! on the front of my t-shirt. Does that count?

  138. cicely (presented without quantification) says

    Caine, sorry about Carrot. Sad, even though expected. *hug*

  139. Aratina Cage says

    This is old news about James Randi’s partner (effectively his husband for a quarter-century now), but I just learned about it and wanted to share that he, Deyvi Orangel Pena Arteaga, was sentenced to six months of house arrest plus three years of probation in late May 2012 for committing identity theft/U.S. passport fraud under the name Jose Luis Alvarez (via Sun Sentinel). So many freethinkers and skeptics came to his side in court, and it was demonstrated even to prosecutors that he had never used the passport for anything other than foreign travel and not getting deported, that the judge’s heart was softened enough to hand down such a light sentence. It’s so sad that Randi had to go through all of this.

    Randi, 83, a native of Canada, told the story of how he proudly became a naturalized U.S. citizen and cherishes this nation’s freedoms. He said that opportunity was foreclosed to Pena by U.S. immigration policies at the time.

    “He was tempest tossed. He was cruelly treated,” Randi told the judge. “This was a crime of desperation in which no one was hurt.”

    According to the article, there is still the threat of a deportation to Venezuela looming over Pena’s head, but at least this awful part of it is over.

  140. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    Fuckital. Need to rant.

    It is that time of year again, so I went by the Handy-Dandy Local Convenience Store / Pharmacy, marched up to the counter, and requested an influenza vaccination. The clerk nodded agreeably and requested that I step around over this way and talk with the pharmacist, oh and here are some forms to read, please check here, here, here, and here, and sign there.

    Done and done.

    Hand over my insurance card, it is run, and…

    “I’m sorry, this seems to have terminated August 31.”


    She re-runs it, then gets on the phone. Confirmation: my insurance terminated August 31.

    Paid OOP for the vaccination (only $10, am agreeable), then marched over to University Health Services and demanded an explanation.

    Oh yes, they said, post-doc insurance now runs September 1 – August 31. Why wasn’t I told this (say in mid-August)? Well, they’re very busy, don’t I know, and besides a notice was posted on their website.

    One flurry of paperwork later, including having to dash over to the Department office to get a few signatures and a requisition form (because the Dept. pays the bill, nice of them), and the nice lady at the insurance office was very apologetic, apparently there’s a liaison to make sure the undergrads are kept in the loop, and another for the grad students, and another for the med students, and another for the faculty, and another for the staff, but the post-docs are left to fend for themselves. Because. The lady at the office agreed this doesn’t really make sense, but she’s not in policy-setting position. However, she’ll run the paperwork today, and I’ll get the new card in 5-10 days, and not to worry if I have a need before then, because I’ll have coverage.


  141. broboxley OT says

    geographic anomaly, more beetles per square measurement than flies on a northern prairie, any real bug watchers want to chime in?

    Entomologist Amanda Fujikawa of the University of Nebraska-Lincoln made her discovery while analyzing how the decomposition of mammal carcasses affects nearby ecosystems in Valentine National Wildlife Refuge in the Sandhills region in Nebraska, a unique prairie environment with grass-anchored sand dunes. She chose the area for its limited access. With only a few roads leading into the area, she was confident her experiments would not be interrupted. In late spring and midsummer, she placed dead rabbits and roadkill in various areas around the refuge and then set up traps to collect carrion insects as they were attracted to the carcasses. She soon noticed that beetles led the parade, not flies.

    “It’s too early to say if it’s a game changer, as it could just be a geographic anomaly,”

  142. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Azkyroth: You have got to be kidding me. Seriously?

  143. Aratina Cage says

    Hrm, I tripped the spam filter somehow trying to share old news. What I wanted to say was that James Randi’s partner, Pena, was sentenced in May 2012 to six months house arrest and three years probation after his conviction for identity theft of Jose Alvarez, which to me is good news. I don’t think it could get any better than that. Pena could still be deported, though. Would post the link, but I’m not sure if that is what caused my attempted comment to be eaten as spam.

  144. Beatrice says

    and besides a notice was posted on their website.

    Oh, I love the “it was on our website” excuse. You get it everywhere. Apparently, one is supposed to regularly check websites of every government office imaginable, in case there is some important news.

  145. Muse says

    Kink isn’t sexual identity or orientation.

    I’d argue that for some people kink is absolutely orientative. It may be relatively easily hidden, but it’s still orientation for a substantial portion of those who practice kink. That said, it’s a relatively minor axis of oppression, to the point that I think bringing it up is often derailing.

  146. broboxley OT says

    E, USSC has explained that changing terms and the only notice is an update on a website is a nono

  147. says

    Good evening

    What David said. Probably one of my better Tpyos


    Just the other day I was reading an article about Jamie Oliver (wiki bio). His four kids are named Poppy Honey Rosie, Daisy Boo Pamela, Petal Blossom Rainbow, and Buddy Bear Maurice.


    I always thought that children should have the right to sue their parents over ridiculous names…

    Worst one I’ve seen: Malicia
    Another trend seems to be to use one and the same name for your daughter and you son. Like they’re not really individuals…

    #1 had the tendency to kick me in the liver and punch me in the bladder at the same time. Still love her…

    Ms. Daisy
    I think we should show compassion for people with very stupid names. Unless, of course, they chose them themselves.

  148. carlie says

    According to the Census Bureau, the actual median income in the USA is about $50,000.

    Only 5% of Americans have a total household income (not individual, but total household) of $200k and up according to the 2010 census. Maybe Mitt’s not using “middle” in the way that anyone else uses it.

    Community starts up again on Oct. 19, same as Rhinebeck.

  149. says

    Muse, I’m kinky myself and … let’s say, it started emerging in early childhood, so there may be something to your claim about it being orientative. But, yes, it’s relatively minor in the grand scheme of oppression.

    It’s also not inherently gender-nonconforming. Male dom with female sub is very patriarchally compliant.

  150. says


    I think we should show compassion for people with very stupid names. Unless, of course, they chose them themselves.

    Oh, sure. If their parents chose the names, their parents should be the target of contempt. Jamie Oliver, for example.

  151. says

    Caine: I’m so fucking sorry about Carrot. You did everything you could for the poor kid.

    Daisy: Fucking furries*!! The only ones I’ve ever run across are on the net, and they uniformly had a chip on their shoulder about their so-called persecution. It is something I’ve seen with… furries, trans people, and libertarians** are the big three that I’ve seen pull the same sort of odd “I’m being oppressed” thing.

    Here’s the script: show up on a message board devoted to general topics, and lead off within their first 20 or so posts with “I’m a furry, and I don’t know why people don’t like me. I hope you people don’t discriminate against people like me because I face so much discrimination boo-hoo woe is me. The ‘nilla world doesn’t have room for us furries why aren’t you people more understanding and open minded?” Then the person waits for the first not-100% positive response(like “we don’t care about your kink” or “who are you again?” or “this is a website devoted to cooking… are you sure you’re in the right place?”), and then starts calling names until someone tells them to fuck off. At that point? PERSECUTION CONFIRMED!!

    *I’m sure most furries are perfectly nice people who do what the majority of us do, which is keep our sex lives to ourselves when it isn’t directly relevant to the discussion at hand.

    **Again, I’m bagging on the “I’m looking to provoke a negative reaction to confirm my victim status” type of person, not furries, trans people, or libertarians***.

    ***OK, I’m TOTALLY bagging on libertarians.

  152. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Muse @ #215: I’d argue very strongly against it. Orientation is not how you fuck. And to go that way leads to some wonderfully homophobic stereotypes. Also, kinky straight people are not the recipients of the specific homo/transphobia that LGBTQ+ people have been.They do not need to appropriate queer space.

  153. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Improbable Joe: Furries, trans* people and libertarians? One of these things is not like the others. Your disclaimer does not help. Like, a lot.

    I know plenty of furries irl, and only one was a horrible drama-addled shitheap.

  154. opposablethumbs says

    Joe, I would not group trans people in there. Violent discrimination is all too real, and unlike furriness this is not something people can (or should have to, obviously) keep hidden behind the bedroom door.

  155. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    Technically, bobroxley, this isn’t a “change in terms” or anything. New insurance is the same as the old. They just changed the dates.

    Also: I’m one of those people who reacts poorly to vaccinations. So now my left arm is stiff and painful.

    In other WAY EXCITING news, it is “get your TB test” time. So in addition to a sore arm, I also have one of those little nodules subcutaneously on my forearm.

  156. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    Joe, there is a difference between trans people, furries, and libertarians.

    All three groups may in fact make statements to the effect that they are oppressed.


    One of those groups actually IS oppressed.

  157. carlie says

    Joe- the homicide rate for trans people is huge, as is the suicide rate (1 in 3). And many of the murderers get acquitted or light sentences because hey, can’t blame them for being mad when they found out that person they were talking to was trans! And they are often legally denied the right to do simple things like use the proper bathroom facilities. There is definite oppression there.

  158. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Oh so threadrupt! The mega-fuckton of work due for my classes is limiting my ability to do anything outside of homework and the occasional break for the bathroom or a quick soup and sandwich.

    Congrats and condolences, as needed.

    My mother’s first choice for me was “January Joy.” *shudder*

    My father wanted to name me after himself — two very old-fashioned male names that, no matter what you do, sound horrible when feminized and even more horrible when combined. *shudder*

    Thankfully, my grandmothers prevailed and gave me one fairly common English female name (which Tommy Tutone managed to ruin completely for all of us) and one not-so-common French female name.

  159. Beatrice says

    Aratina Cage.

    I’m glad Randi’s partner wasn’t deported and I hope he won’t be in the future.

    When José’s identity theft first came out, I remember people gleefully calling Randi a liar or saying how very disappointed they were in him. Seriously? Call me a romantic, but I found the story heartbreaking and if anything, helping his partner was a plus for Randi in my book.

  160. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    My given name is a pair of old family names, showing up all over the family tree.

    It is also one of those names (due to changing fashions) that pretty much flat-out says O HAI MY PARENTS ARE SUPER-RELIGIOUS!

    Which, TBH, they were at the time.

    One of my sisters, when she was still a fetus, was going to be named Jonathan Michael. Because the sonogram tech was a moron.

    When the time came, there was a sudden, “…oh.”

    The doctor suggested naming her Jane Michelle, because that’s a nice name and it is essentially the female equivalent of Jonathan Michael.

    My parents disagreed, because they already had a daughter with a name very similar to Jane.

    So they reached into left field and went with a traditionally Welsh name, one with essentially no vowels.


    (my sister is always telling me about how she has to spell her name to people – and about how when she talks to her Spanish-speaking clients she uses her middle name, because the “gwy” sound does not exist in Spanish).

  161. carlie says

    Spouse and I jokingly toyed with the idea of using our respective great-grandmothers’ names for a girl, but would never think of actually saddling a poor child with it.

    She would be Daisy Mae.
    (non-Americans: see Lil’ Abner, and see The Dukes of Hazard)

  162. says

    Articles on Insurance rebates, beginning in August, 2012:


    July 30:

    Lucia Harkenreader’s check landed in her mailbox last week: a rebate of $456.15 from her health insurance company, with a letter dryly explaining that the money came courtesy of the federal health care law.


    By August 1, health insurance companies have to refund $1.1 billion in premiums to about 12.8 million customers, thanks to the Affordable Care Act.

    The “80/20 rule” in the ACA mandates that health insurers spend at least 80% of their customers’ premiums on health services, leaving no more than 20% for administrative costs and advertising. That means if an insurance company spends 78% of the money it collects on health benefits for customers, it has to send rebate checks for the additional 2%.

  163. Esteleth, Who Knows How to Use Google says

    Carlie, if I were named for my great-grandmothers, one of my names would be Zella.

    In all honesty, I think I’d be okay with that.

  164. The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa) says

    Improbable Joe, I seriously thought you lumping trans people in with furries and libertarians was a typo at first. Apparently not.

    I’ll also add, as a guy who used to rip on furries a lot… they don’t suffer anywhere near the oppression trans people do and many of them are insufferable with the ‘fursecution’ stuff, but I’d argue that maybe they deserve a tiny bit more slack than they’ve been getting.

  165. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Azkyroth: You have got to be kidding me. Seriously?

    Well, it’s not obvious to me why it would be either, but given the reaction the last few times I’ve tried to reason from what wasn’t obvious to me….

  166. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    Ooooh, platypi! Almost as cute as octopi! (yeah, I know, I know…)

    I was almost named after my grandmother. She was called Helmi, which means Pearl in Finnish.

    But I wasn’t, and things have been going to hell ever after.

    Improbable Joe: I haven’t been commenting much here lately, but I’ve lurked whenever I have had time, and so far you have sounded like a very admirable character. So, shall we agree that your comment lumping trans people (and furries) with the libertarians was just a silly slip of your privilege? Happens to the best of us (well, happens to me often, but less now than before, because the nice people of Pharyngula have donated their time to try and educate me every now and then – not an easy task, but not impossible, either).

  167. Aratina Cage says


    I remember people gleefully calling Randi a liar or saying how very disappointed they were in him. Seriously? Call me a romantic, but I found the story heartbreaking and if anything, helping his partner was a plus for Randi in my book.

    Yeah. A lot of people (even gay people) do not realize that binational same-sex relationships where the foreign-born half is not a permanent resident are actually illegal in the USA. Whereas an opposite-sex couple in most cases can marry each other if one is a citizen and allow the foreign-born spouse to become a green card holder, a same-sex couple simply declaring they love each other is grounds for deportation of a non-permanent resident (although President Obama has directed his administration to move such deportation hearings to the end of the list and to fight DOMA in court). And back when Randi and Pena fell in love, you can be damn sure Pena would have had to be in hiding or be deported! So it doesn’t matter how Pena would have stayed in the USA, it would have been illegal regardless. It’s sick and inhumane to treat people like that. So people who are disappointed in Randi really need to get a clue; this is one of those cases where “lying” before the law was necessary!

  168. says

    Just popping in for a quick hello to everyone. Haven’t been commenting much lately, since I’m very busy at the moment.
    I’ve got a lot of catching up to do.

  169. says

    Well… looks like I stepped in it.

    It wasn’t a slip of privilege, mind you. It was a description of a phenomenon that I’ve seen on the Internet specific to individuals belonging to certain groups… but I clearly did a shit job explaining that I don’t think that membership in those groups has anything to do with the behavior. And since the group ID doesn’t matter to the thing I’m describing, I should have been more careful about the association I made. The people being assholes and picking a fight was the point, and being trans really has nothing to do with the larger point at all.

    I was dumb, and I apologize to anyone I managed to splash my dumbness on.

  170. markr1957 (Patent Pending) says

    In response to several requests for advice on what to do with cellphones that went swimming in salt water first I’m sorry for taking so long to reply and for not linking to whoever was asking – work does take up way too much of my time :(

    Anyhoo – since you dropped your phone in the sea chances are it’s totally goosed, so anything you try can’t make it any worse than it already is. You do need to check the battery for splits in the case or any kind of bulge – either way the battery is now useless and potentuially dangerous so dispose of it safely – preferably at the dealer who sold it to you since they have proper disposal facilities. It contains lithium and if it gets wet it can explode!

    For the electronics whether they can be saved really depends how long it was since you dropped it in the sea. Too long and the damage can be too far gone, but since you have nothing to lose remove the battery, dismantle as far as you can and drop the entire thing in a bucket of warm soapy water. Shaking it around will help dissolve any salt deposits. At this point plain old tap water is good enough and a lot cheaper than isopropyl alcohol. Do not try acetone (nail polish remover) – it will dissolve the plastic case and the screen will go all misty.

    If you own a jewelery cleaning machine it will work great for dissolving out any salt or other deposits – even the ones you can’t see. If not lots of shaking will do the same thing with a lot more effort. When you think you’ve done enough shaking drain out as much water as you can and dunk the phone in distilled water – again a lot cheaper than isopropyl alcohol and it dissolves salt much better too – also doesn’t leave any deposits or spots. When done shake out any excess water and pat dry with anything lint free – don’t rub or you’ll scratch the case and window (soft plastics)!

    Now you can dry the thing out – slowly but not too slowly. Over a water heater but not right on top is okay but an airing closet is better – IF you can set your oven to below 150F you CAN use that, but don’t try using your microwave (no,no,no,no,no!!!!!!!). An this point the worst thing that can have happened is you wasted a day cleaning and drying a dead phone, but you do at least have a chance that you brought it back from the dead, and you now have a jeebus phone. If it remains dead remove the SIM card and go shopping.

  171. says

    A new version of Chronicling Mitt’s Mendacity was posted today.

    Some items on the list are familiar because Mitt recently repeated the same lies, but some are new.


    26. Romney went on to argue, “The Chamber of Commerce carried out a survey. They asked businesses all over America, ‘What’s the impact of a particular piece of legislation?’ And the people came back, 75 percent of the people surveyed said, ‘That piece of legislation keeps us from hiring people.’ That legislation we have to get rid of is known as ‘ObamaCare,’ and I’m going to get rid of it.”

    The “survey” is a joke. The Chamber, a pro-Republican lobbying institution heavily invested in helping Romney, put up an unscientific online survey. Treating this as a legitimate poll of businesses is fundamentally dishonest….

    29. Romney added, “The other party will promise you lots of free stuff. But then ask them, how are they paying for it? And they’ll say, ‘Oh, we’re borrowing money from China to do that.'”

    First, Democrats actually intend to raise taxes on millionaires to “do that.” Second, the implication here is that U.S. debt is financed by the Chinese, but this isn’t true — China only holds about 8% of the nation’s debt….

    31. On “Meet the Press,” Romney told David Gregory that, in his tax plan, “we don’t lower taxes on high income people. We’re not going to have high income people pay less of the tax burden than they pay today. That’s not what’s going to happen.”

    That’s extremely misleading. Romney’s plan, according to independent analysis, will sharply reduce taxes for the wealthy.

    32. In the same interview, Romney added, “I’m not going to increase the tax burden on middle income families.”

    There’s ample evidence to the contrary.

    33. Romney went on to say, “I’ve demonstrated that I have the capacity to balance budgets. I balanced them four years in a row in Massachusetts.”

    Actually, Romney left his successor with a deficit….

  172. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Azkyroth: Well, start with my comment as to why kinky people are not automatically queer either. (Except for the ones who are also queer, obviously.)

    Furry, otherkin and other such hobbies are just that. They’re not orientations like the LGBQ, and they’re not the T* umbrella that’s long been receiving the same homophobia the LGBQ has on top of the long-time historical association. The association itself is pretty disgusting and appropriative, and attempts to position furries and otherkin (including straight cis ones) as suffering from the same oppression as actual queer and trans people.

  173. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    Improbable Joe: for what it’s worth, it’s all ok. I’m not a furry, nor trans, not even a libertarian, so I can only speak for myself, but as I said, you’ve always seem like an admirable character, and your apology is well in line with that. Others may disagree, as is their right. I can only speak from my own, admittedly very privileged, point.

  174. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Minnie: Do you not see why claiming that trans people falsely claim oppression for attention is kind of fucked up?

  175. says

    Minnie The Finn,

    Thanks for the compliment… not as well-earned as it seemed though.

    Privilege is a tricky thing, since it can be largely invisible to the people who have it. This is one of those cases where I am relaying a story that is factually true, and yet can’t really be defended as useful to tell… so even my previous apology probably didn’t go far enough since I DID try to defend it. Being technically correct or honest about your intent is no excuse for being an insensitive asshole, and that’s what I was doing by saying “yes, but here’s why I’m not actually as wrong as you think.”

  176. Beatrice says


    Maybe you should put that shovel down, get away from the hole and read what people have been telling you.

  177. says

    The situation in Egypt has caused Fox News to wet its pants with glee. It’s an opportunity to formulate new lies about President Obama. I think even Fox News pundits must have been getting bored with the old lies. They are really hopping on this new stuff.

    Michelle Bachmann started it off by painting the President as “dangerous” on foreign policy when she spoke at the Values Voters Summit.

    More fodder was produced when a false rumor spread that Marine guards at the Cairo embassy were required to go without live ammunition. Truth is “The Marines on duty at Embassy Cairo had ammunition in their weapons, as they always do at all our Missions overseas when they are on duty,” as confirmed by a senior State Department official.

    Mother Jones journalists obtained a memo saying pretty much the same thing, and a Pentagon spokesperson even told Fox News, “The ambassador and RSO (Regional Security Officer) have been completely and appropriately engaged with the security situation. No restrictions on weapons or weapons status have been imposed.”

    Do you think this stopped Fox News from spreading the false rumors?

    The other Obama-is-dangerous-and-negligent meme I’ve heard a lot over the past few days is that Obama plays golf while Benghazi and Cairo burn, and that Obama has skipped about half of his presidential daily intelligence briefings.

    Columnist Dana Milbank debunked that last bit in the Washington Post:

    In reality, Obama didn’t “attend” these meetings, because there were no meetings to attend: The oral briefings had been mostly replaced by daily exchanges in which Obama reads the materials and poses written questions and comments to intelligence officials. This is how it was done in the Clinton administration, before Bush decided he would prefer to read less. Bush’s results — Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction, and the failure to find Osama bin Laden — suggest this was not an obvious improvement.

  178. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    Happiestsadist: I did see it, I wouldn’t have commented otherwise. It’s not just kind of fucked up, it’s totally fucked up.

    But Improbable Joe’s apology seemed quite sincere, so I’m willing to give him a pass rather than tearing him a new one straightaway. And as I said, it’s only from my personal privileged point of view, so I’m not in the position to talk for anyone else.

  179. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    cicely: here, have this flaming goat, they’re great for warmth.

    Seriously, hope you’re okay?

  180. says

    Hi! I slept in late and then I had coffee and peanut brittle for breakfast and I am bouncing off the walls!

    There was a William Gibson novel had some ruminations on this a while back. Think it was Idoru, tho’ I’m not sure now. One of the bizarre and loveable artifacts was an oddball laptop with a custom case and external keycaps made out of, if I recall correctly, cut stone.

    How funny, I was thinking of exactly that at the beginning of your comment. Yep, it’s Idoru, and the backstory is that a jeweler got tired of how disposable tech goods were so he started a company making cases out of things like reclaimed aluminum, sea coral and semiprecious gems where the upgradable bits could be switched out.

    a lot of bullshit about “the latest teen fads” gets circulated to hype up moral panics.


    Kink isn’t sexual identity or orientation.

    Well, muse responded to this better than I can, including the part about how generally bleating on about it is counterproductive, privileged and inappropriate. Such all-encompassing statements still get in my craw though. As someone in a hetero relationship where both of us are cis can I claim to be queer in any way? Nope, but the “kink” is definitely my sexual identity and orientative. (Part of the problem, I think, is that “kink” spans a huge spectrum; statements like Daisy’s can be true for some while not being true for others.)

    I am laughing so hard at the Wonkette Dr Pepper post that I can’t breathe.

  181. says

    They let Michelle Bachmann speak?

    I sorta thought they’d be of the don’t let women speak variety with the flat-out nutbars that are apparently in attendance.

  182. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    kristinc: As a kinky person who is also queer, I just find the claims that how you fuck being in any way an orientation to be absolutely disgustingly homophobic.

  183. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Oh, hi, everybody. Just wanted to see if I can post in this thread because the last two comments I tried to post in other threads went *poof* into the void after I hit “submit comment.”

    I hope you know what the problem is.

    Rebecca Watson did it.

  184. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    Carrot died yesterday.

    Damn. I’m so sorry.



    I would just like to mention that there is no evidence that I exist.

    But you just posted.
    Your name is there for all the world to see.
    You *have* to exist.
    All this time I was wrong.

    Hey Horde! Can we sell God and make some money?



    So would someone named “Monday” go by “Loony”?

    “We’re tiny. We’re tooney. We’re all a little looney. And in this cartoony, we’re invading your tv….”
    Someone else take it away!

    (just realized there were no penguins in Tiny Toons)

  185. says

    kristinc: As a kinky person who is also queer, I just find the claims that how you fuck being in any way an orientation to be absolutely disgustingly homophobic.

    I want to be clear that I’m not saying it isn’t homophobic, just that I don’t understand how it is (and I don’t want to say something homophobic so I am open to gaining that understanding). As far as I understand, when something shapes not just “how you fuck” but who you respond to sexually and emotionally in the context of an intimate relationship — when one is unable to have a fulfilling and happy sexual/intimate relationship without something — that’s pretty much sexual orientation in a nutshell.

    I don’t think it’s as … major an axis? … on the sexual-identity graph? (crap I do not have nearly the vocabulary for this) as position on the same sex/opposite sex scale, but for SOME kinky people, my experience absolutely does lead me to conclude that it’s orientative.

    Now, is it gross and whiny when (mostly) straight cis leather clubs march in parades claiming they’re oppressed by societeez? Completely.

  186. says

    More news from the Values Voter Summit, (you know this is going to be bad), this time from Gary Bauer:

    Conservative pundit Gary Bauer, the former president of the Family Research Council, which puts on the Values Voter Summit each year, told the crowd at the 2012 conference Friday that it needs to turn out in great numbers to defeat President Obama’s army of welfare recipients and fraudulent votes.

    After his speech, Bauer told TPM “voter fraud is rampant in urban areas” and he expected that to help Obama.

    Bauer also told TPM that “there are a lot of people who will vote this November because they depend on government largesse,” meaning checks from Washington. He expects those voters to go Obama as well.


    Nope. Nobody has found rampant voter fraud anywhere in the USA. Nada. None. But the right is using the fake issue of voter fraud to pass laws that restrict voting rights.

    As for the dog whistle about all those urban folks sucking down welfare dollars, I’m too fed up to even comment.

  187. Stevarious says


    I would just like you all to know that I’m at the stage in my pregnancy where DarkFetus can kick me in the bladder and punch me in the diaphragm at the same time. O.o

    Would you like an interesting anecdote?

    My parents wanted a girl more than anything but never had one. I was the third son and last child they had by their choice. The reason? When I was prenatal, a punched a hole in my mother’s diaphragm that never healed. Still bothers her, over 30 years later – she can’t go on roller coasters!

    She used to guilt the CRAP out of me over it.

  188. PatrickG says

    General question for all, girlfriend and I can’t find a good answer as to what to call a person who suffers from growth hormone deficiency (pituary problem). Googling has proved unhelpful. Any help?

    Midget, dwarf, little person.. these seem to be problematic, at least from some sources.

  189. opposablethumbs says

    markr1957 (Patent Pending), it was I who was wondering about the chances of resurrecting a phone from Davey Jones’ Locker/the Kraken’s maw. Thank you very much for the plan of action – advice much appreciated! I suspect this phone’s a goner, but might give it a try anyway just for the hell of it :)

    If it’s no dice, I shall just have to consider it a sacrifice to Cthulhu.

  190. strange gods before me ॐ says

    The term sexual orientation refers specifically to attractions involving gender identity and biological sex. It is a little bit confusing to hear it used more expansively.

    I don’t have any objection with the ethics of highly qualified statements being made by Ms. Daisy Cutter, kristinc and Muse — and I understand what y’all mean by “orientative” and I suspect you’re correct — but for the sake of clarity and consistency with established meanings, another term besides sexual orientation would be helpful.

  191. Socio-gen, something something... says

    PatrickG: I wanted to add that I don’t know if that necessarily applies to someone with a growth hormone deficiency. They may just be a person with [name of deficiency], but not a little person.

  192. says


    Brace yourselves folks: Someone On The Internet Still Doesn’t Understand The Need For A+


    (Actually I read that earlier. Mikmik left another long, pretentious comment here. His argument that “atheist” is a core identity and the A* crowd feels that the A+ crowd is destroying their identity is kind of an own goal. The bit about equality for anyone but straight white cis d00dz being “special interests” is a nice touch, too.)

  193. thunk, Blob Alert! says

    Also, “teen fad x”

    No. Again, this is just an attempt to start moral panic. Whenever something comes out saying “ZOMG those crazy youngsters are doing stupid shit”, that’s more stigma. We’re already portrayed as hooligans etc…

    But using massive quantities of vodka for ingestion is a Bad Idea.

  194. says

    Also, “teen fad x”

    No. Again, this is just an attempt to start moral panic.

    Watch for the tell-tale signs of corruption!

    The moment your son leaves the house, does he rebuckle his knickerbockers below the knee?

    Is there a nicotine stain on his index finger?

    A dime novel hidden in the corn crib?

    Is he starting to memorize jokes from Cap’n Billy’s Whiz Bang?

    Are certain words creeping into his conversation? Words like SWELL? And SO’S YOUR OLD MAN?

  195. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Joe: You don’t know what a corn crib is? But…but…all the cool kids had corn cribs when I was a young’un.

  196. broboxley OT says

    we with all of the fur flying upthread I didnt have a clue what a furry was. No Trans folks are not comparable to them or libertarians, the few trans and hermaphroditic people I have met just want to pass without comment

    Looking at what a google search gave me as a description of furries makes me want to ask a question. Someone who is wolf clan, and talks to ravens and wolves to assist in hunting endeavors and has been a pack member, that’s not a furry is it?

  197. broboxley OT says

    Well joe, I am assuming you know where the cornhole description originated? First you take a bucket of corn husks, wet them down in the bucket and place the bucket within handy reach of the seat in the outhouse. When you run out you go to the corn crib to get more corn husks.

    With that out of the way I will leave piehole to your imagination

  198. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    That sounds tasty.
    Even better, let’s add some flavored RUM!

  199. Tethys says

    Ed Kagin seems to be manifesting symptoms of privileged old white dude syndrome. You can always count on men to get all testerical and start throwing straw arguments around when people refuse to respect their authority. /bitter sarcasm

  200. says

    Oh, Edwin. I have a hard time getting worked up about him anymore; he’s such a self-parody.


    OH GOD WHY?!

    Because people ain’t right.

    I laughed so hard I nearly cried at this comment:

    I would use this shirt for a Halloween costume. Take an open container of cottage cheese over your head and call yourself a Yeast Infection.

    Broboxley: What used to be called “hermaphroditic” is now called “intersex.”

    “Wolf clan” – are you talking about Native American totemism? Because that’s unrelated to furrydom.

    Also, I understood that “cornhole” originated from the hole in the ground whence a stalk of corn was pulled, but I’m a suburban-bred damnyankee so I’ll defer to you on that.

  201. strange gods before me ॐ says

    A national leader of American Atheists Inc is attacking a straw man?

  202. says

    Poor (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin. He’s a person in power, and like the majority of people who claw their way into power, he is protective and jealous of his power. The idea of Atheism Plus, which is more or less leaderless and bottom-up activism, leaves no room for him and his fellow authoritarian top-down types.

  203. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Racist Hooter’s hostess

    The hostess even used the wrong damn slur!

    Even more stupidity:

    Chains that reproduce these descriptions on customer receipts are taking a huge risk.
    Thankfully there’s an easy solution. At my restaurant, descriptions of customers were seen by no one except for the host. Restaurants that adopt a similar system won’t get sued.

    Yes, ladies and gentlemen; the solution to the problem of employees using racist terms as descriptors for customers is to not let the customers see the descriptions.

    I need a big bucket for that FAIL.

  204. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Ms. Daisy:
    There’s probably no chance we’ll lose Edwin or Taslima to Patheos, huh?

  205. says

    … and the evidence, as if we needed any, is that (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin doesn’t respond to any comments on his blog, since he’s not having a conversation with us. He’s making pronouncements from the pulpit, like the sort of tinpot religious leaders that we are to assume he’s against. Seems to me more along the lines that he’d like to simply take the place of a Pat Robertson or a Rick Warren, and enjoy all of the same perks.

  206. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    In his defense, he could be busy and hasn’t had time to read and respond.

    I’m only half joking there. After reading that nonsensical B.S., I really don’t know what point he was trying to make. Perhaps he’s trying to poke fun at feminism? A+?

  207. thunk, Blob Alert! says

    Kagin’s thinking is about equivalent to mine when I was an MRA. Nuff said.

  208. says

    Tony, I mean he DOESN’T REPLY TO COMMENTS. Three replies I can find so far on two pages of blog posts. Of course, hardly anyone comments on most of his posts, so maybe this is all just sour grapes because we don’t see him as the VERY IMPORTANT MAN that he considers himself to be, and as a group more people here respond to the least posts by “amateurs” like Jen McCreight than to any ten of his non-trolling posts.

  209. ImaginesABeach says

    I’m sorry to hear about Carrot, Caine. Please offer extra hugs and kisses to Zoe for me.

    On a lighter note, BoyChild’s friend came over today carrying a lunch box, proclaiming “it’s science, it’s science.” His science teacher had done some experiments with dry ice, and had sent the extra dry ice home with the students (Friend is in 8th grade). BoyChild’s friend’s mom was very unhappy and worried that it would cause an explosion (apparently is going to call the teacher to scold him), but friend knew that we would welcome him and his dry ice. So we played with it for a while – watched it bubble and steam in water, froze a leaf and shattered it, put it in some water in a ziploc bag and watched the gas fill the bag. We told him that science is always welcome at our house.

  210. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    It’s awesome to hear of children getting exposed to and excited about science!

  211. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    I used to be angrier about Kagin, but he’s so ridiculous, he just goes into “old man yells at cloud” territory.

    ImaginesABeach: That is so cute. I love when kids are all excited about science.

    And, though I for some reason seldom say so, thanks to SG @ #282, that was a good phrasing of what I was trying to say.

    Went out for Ethiopian food with The Mr., and I am so, so full of tasty veggie food. *unbuttons top of pants*

  212. Rodney Nelson says

    I don’t read Kagin very much. Does he always build strawfeminists whenever he’s feeling cranky?

  213. Muse says


    As a kinky person who is also queer, I just find the claims that how you fuck being in any way an orientation to be absolutely disgustingly homophobic.

    As a kinky person who is also queer, I’d like you to explain that. FWIW I think SG may be right, and I’m pretty sure kristinc had a point about it as well.

  214. says

    Rodney Nelson

    I don’t read Kagin very much. Does he always build strawfeminists whenever he’s feeling cranky?

    Impossible to say. No one has ever read enough of his blog to know how often he does anything. Ba-dum CHING!

  215. Nutmeg says

    Oooh, dry ice fun! In my lab, one of the standbys is “dry ice bombs”. When we get a shipment in on dry ice, we take little chunks of the ice and put them in 1.5mL tubes. If you close the tube up and toss it surreptitiously under someone’s desk, it will make quite a loud bang when the pressure inside pops the lid open. Good for startling the new summer students.

  216. MissEla says

    Okay, I had to share this one.

    Possible trigger warning: (I’m still kinda new at these, so I figured I’d stick it in there.)

    So, what do you do if you’re a respectable, responsible Menz when you see a pregnant woman, minding her own business, smoking on a sidewalk? You point a gun at her.

    Now, I think we can all agree* that smoking is Bad For You, especially while pregnant. I think we can also all agree* that smoking is incredibly addictive, and most people find it very difficult to quit, especially cold-turkey. But how is this an appropriate response, in any plane of reality, to someone else’s smoking?!?!?!! It’s not like Bellingham is some redneck, backwater, deep-South town, either–it’s a liberal, granola-munching, tree-hugging, hippie-ass college town, for chrissake. What the fucking fuck, people?


    Guys, don’t do that.



    *At least, for the purposes of telling this story.

  217. says

    Giles and Vasco have recently formed a very tight partnership. They are almost always together and even tag team jumping on girls. Right now, both of them are in their superhero tissue box on my desk (it’s right behind my laptop.) They have dragged my small tin of bag balm in there and are working on opening it.

  218. says

    Experimenting with a recipe that’s supposed to produce a chunk of meat somewhat similar to döner kebab. I kneaded about 1 kg of ground beef and spices into a homogenous mass with no air bubbles, and wrapped it tightly in foil to form a sausage. It’s now been in the oven at 125 C for an hour, and will need three more hours, so I have plenty of time to prepare tzatziki, salad, rice and whatnot.

    The heavy kneading and wrapping it tightly supposedly makes all the difference between meat loaf and a firm piece one can carve into nice slices. I haven’t tried this before, so this remains to be seen. Luckily I have no shortage of beer or Buffy episodes while waiting.

  219. says


    I’m a gun guy, formerly a professional gun guy. As a gun guy I feel relatively safe saying that most people who have guns, shouldn’t. I almost feel like my handgun is like one of those legendary swords that once drawn must draw blood before being returned to its scabbard. You don’t draw to threaten, or to intimidate, or in jest. You draw to kill, because it is the only action you see available to you in order to preserve your own life, and you have a duty to do everything in your power to avoid that moment.

    Sure as hell you don’t pull out a gun because someone does something that annoys you!

  220. A. R says

    Nutmeg: If only I could do such things in my lab without being screamed at by more people that is generally healthy. In addition, I have access to copious amounts of LN2, which truly ups the ante…

  221. says

    Weed Monkey,

    As per making non-standard “döner kebab”… I’ve done it before, and I got the texture if not the flavor dead-on. Oh, look, I blogged about it!


    I think I would have used a lamb/pork mix rather than lamb/beef. But long experience in the kitchen confirms that throwing the meat in a food processor is a good idea. You know how they say that overworking dough makes your bread tough, and over-mixing your pancake batter or biscuit dough will keep it from being light and fluffy and airy? The same goes for meat: tossing your meat in a food processor for just a little too long will produce a solid mass that will slice well once it is cooked and dried out a bit.

  222. says

    Tony – I haven’t looked at Taslima’s blog in months. I don’t find her readable.

    If Kagin went to Patheos it’d be kind of hilarious.

    Ibyea: Any time. As I was just saying to Happiestsadist, sharing vile things on the internet is how I show my lurve for y’all.

  223. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Muse: Pretty much what SG said. Not to mention the historical background of queerness, the fact that straight, cis people do not ever belong under the umbrella, and that likening gender identity and the gender to which you’re attracted to how you fuck is pretty vile, especially when you’re looking at queer people, who are sexualized and dehumanized for it.

  224. says

    Oh! And speaking of cute and furry…

    So, for those of you who have been following (and helping to finance!) the drama that is my life, my wife left for Parts Unknown this morning in search of adventure, career opportunity, and enough cash to keep us from being homeless in the immediate future. Yesterday she filled up our suitcases with most of her clothing and lots of odds and ends for a month away from home, and I carried it all downstairs and staged it in the foyer.

    Well, we woke up too early this morning and discovered that at least one of our four-legged children had travel plans of his own. I guess Randall decided that Mommy wasn’t leaving without him!

  225. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Good day for the Redhead. There was the first neighborhood tea of the season, and she showed up with my assistance in a nice sweater and hat for the occasion. Stayed the full time. Socialized like the social animal she is. Now to get her set up in bed and I expect she will sleep well, with the typical commode breaks.

  226. says

    Wake up maintenance gnomes, it’s time to give the cache server a new coat of varnish!

    Looks like this one didn’t get posted:

    Improbable Joe, oh yeah, that looks really nice! And a bit of pork to moisten it up a bit is probably a good idea, the mixture looked quite low in fat even if I picked the fattiest (and cheapest) bits of pre-packaged meat the nearest supermarket had.

  227. says

    Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom:

    Also, kinky straight people are not the recipients of the specific homo/transphobia that LGBTQ+ people have been.They do not need to appropriate queer space.

    I just wanted to second this. For whatever amount of “appropriating queer space” that kinky straight people might want to do, the reality is that for the majority of us society doesn’t care what we do as long as it is “one man, one woman”, or at very least that the man is the one penetrating the woman. Anything that falls within that spectrum is considered “variations on a theme” rather than something separate and other.

    A straight couple would have to do something pretty fucking extreme in public to garner the same cultural disapproval that a gay couple gets for holding hands, or a trans person gets for just existing openly. It isn’t fair for kinky folks to try to coop queer space for their generally mild issues with society.

  228. says

    … how is this an appropriate response, in any plane of reality, to someone else’s smoking?!?!?!! It’s not like Bellingham is some redneck, backwater, deep-South town, either–it’s a liberal, granola-munching, tree-hugging, hippie-ass college town, for chrissake. What the fucking fuck, people?

    (Holds head…)

    Well, y’know… Ma’am… That sort of thing, it could hurt the baby…

    So let me just point this gun at you. To make all this, y’know… Safer…

    … and this is completely lateral, but for some reason your description of the ‘liberal, granola-munching, tree-hugging, hippie-ass college town’ gave me the weirdest picture of the assailant. He was in paisley, and wearing love beads, heavily armed, and had buttons all over his shirt. One of them advertised Lamaze classes…

    … which brought to mind this equally jarring classic This Modern World.

    No, I don’t know why. Weapons, in particularly odd contexts. Anyway: I think we can safely say that whole ‘pregnant bodies are public property’ thing, it’s still very much out of control. Not that this is so much news.

  229. says

    Weed Monkey,

    Absolutely you’ll want a little extra fat in the recipe. Barring putting the meat on a spit and cutting off the exterior as it cooks, what you’ll wind up doing is slicing off a bit at a time and frying it up. Since you’re sort of cooking it twice, once to make it set and a second time to get a nice crust on the slices, you’ll want to make it nice and fatty. The next time I do it, I’m going to do equal parts lamb and pork, and then toss a half-dozen slices of pork jowl into the food processor.

  230. Muse says


    Pretty much what SG said. Not to mention the historical background of queerness, the fact that straight, cis people do not ever belong under the umbrella, and that likening gender identity and the gender to which you’re attracted to how you fuck is pretty vile, especially when you’re looking at queer people, who are sexualized and dehumanized for it.

    Ah – okay, I think we have a definition disconnect. By saying that it’s orientative, I’m not saying it’s the same as being queer. That said, I don’t think kink is how you fuck, at least not for everyone. As kristinc said, it’s a lot about relationships in intimate relationships. I find that a bit dismissive.

  231. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    I figured that’s what you were getting at, I just wanted to be clearer. SG put it well.

    I get rather touchy at kinky people getting into the orientational model, because I still disagree, and because of the history of terrible people making terrible analogies. As far as the relational factor, that’s kind of a broad spectrum, in a lot of ways when it comes to how the kink influences. I will say I think there can be a lot of emotionally unhealthy stuff that gets swept into the kink as orientation thing, because it excuses a lot of nasty shit as “innate”, so I tend to side-eye it.

  232. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Weed Monnkey:
    Ooooh, I can’t wait to hear how that food turns out! It sounds positively delicious!
    My lunch & dinner were the same thing. Roasted ground beef with herbs and spices over pearled couscous and spicy black beans.
    What Buffy eps are you watching?

  233. says

    I figured I should cross-post this here, since (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin would be wise to delete it before he moves himself to a Patheos blog:

    Well… I would say quite a few THINK they are onboard with feminism and social justice. The truth is that they approve of it in a notional sense, as long as it is a hypothetical thought experiment with no relation to the real world. As soon as feminism or more general social justice concerns start requiring action and effort and potential costs to them personally or professionally, all of a sudden it becomes ‘divisive’ and needs to be suppressed as strongly and quickly as possible.

    For instance, (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin works for and has to deal with other middle and upper-class white men for the majority of the fundraising and political hobnobbing/knob-polishing that he does professionally and personally. He wants a seat at the table of the people who have power in our society, so his basic instinct is to find people without power, find a bus, and throw the former under the latter, just like any other status-grubbing politician.

  234. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    You should start living up to your ‘nym and work at being divisive. Separate those ratlets. Plussers on the left (Pearl is definitely on that side). Those that eat peas on the right.

    Wait, that wouldn’t leave any of them on the left, would it?

  235. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Ms. Daisy:
    re: Taslima- even aside from the issues I have (many of which I believe you and I agree on), I find it difficult to actually read her posts. There’s something about her particular writing style that makes it difficult for me to parse.

    Btw, if sharing those types of things on the ‘net shows your looooooove, how would you should your dislike :)


    Randall sure looks comfy!


  236. says

    A straight couple would have to do something pretty fucking extreme in public to garner the same cultural disapproval that a gay couple gets for holding hands, or a trans person gets for just existing openly. It isn’t fair for kinky folks to try to coop queer space for their generally mild issues with society.

    Agreed on all points, FWIW.

  237. says

    Tony, all of them, actually. :) I’d been watching Buffy on TV, missed a few episodes here and there, reruns out of order… So this time I started with Welcome to the Hellmouth and have been working my way from there. Right now I’m at the sad place where Joyce just died in the 5th season.

    It is an impressive series: so far I can name only one episode that’s been really bad – Beer Bad.

  238. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Joe, I love that you’re including his (c)1212. That’s another tell–the archaic blatant copyrighting.* It’s like signing one’s own post when your nym is already there. Or referring to everyone as Mr. X and Ms. Y. Or using the term “Weblog”—note the caps.

    *Copyright is automatic under the Universal Copyright Convention on the creation of the work. It does not require specific denotation or symbols.

  239. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    You should start living up to your ‘nym and work at being divisive. Separate those ratlets.

    But to separate them, you might have to pull one over on the rat. And then if you divide by one over a rat, they’ll multiply!

  240. says


    First off, I don’t think anyone has noticed or specifically stated yet, but (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin. is claiming an 800 year old copyright, that pretentious assclown!

    Secondly, I have to extend my regrets to you in particular, and the Horde in general. The Official SpokesGuitar has been sold, and not to me. I’m not sure if I’ll be able to find another, since that model seems to have been discontinued.

  241. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Damn. Joe, I’ll send you a bottle of champers to christen the new one.

  242. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Oh, and with Bossnurse off to work does that mean y’all get to stay where you are and not have to move?

  243. cicely says

    Minnie, I got your goat. Thanks.

    Nothing really wrong, as such; it’s just that it was a perfect combo of the fact that I’m almost always the coldest person in any given room, together with extreme tiredness (allergies, weather change) with inadequate caffeination to off-set it (since I am no longer allowed to carry hot liquids, especially in glass/ceramic containers, and The Husband was most inconsiderately trouble-shooting for a customer), empty stomach, and the Dance of the Seasons (currently being performed in a parka and fur-lined boots, as far as my external temperature sensors are concerned). Sitting at my desk, teeth chattering, trying to warm my hands at the feeble warmth of my computer—not pretty.

    for the sake of clarity and consistency with established meanings, another term besides sexual orientation would be helpful.

    Sexual proclivities? Or does that mean something else?

    Dry ice is some good, clean fun. Especially when confined in small plastic bottles and hurled down-range.

    The Official SpokesGuitar has been sold, and not to me.

    I has a sad.

  244. says


    We’re probably going to move, but it will more likely be on OUR terms. We probably won’t be evicted, but my wife has also been looking for permanent work alongside the temp jobs like the current one. With a permanent job, they will most likely pay for our move and give her a sign-on bonus that will cover the security deposit on a new place. So moving won’t be all that painful, if things work out the way we hope.

    Also, my birthday is coming up in a few weeks. I’d be happy to accept a bottle of something or other, since it will be me by myself and no money on my birthday this year. If I’m lucky my dad will send me $10 and I can get myself some Chinese take-out. My in-laws are going to send me a mostly-useless gift card for Best Buy or something, since they refuse to accept that we’re actually poor and desperate for the next few weeks.

  245. chigau (違わない) says

    re: (c) 1212 by Edwin Kagin.’s male eliminated thingy
    John Varley, in the mid70s, wrote a short story Manikins.
    If you go looking, DO NOT read the reviews before you read the story.
    I don’t mean to be cryptic but I’ve tried but I cannot find the text online.

  246. says


    I has a sad as well. I was sort of married to that particular wood grain pattern. I hope I can at least find something similar, whenever there is money to do so.

  247. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Joe, will you still be in the same general area? Cuz if so you know I’ll be around there at Thanksgiving.

  248. says

    Ms. Daisy,

    The problem with Randall is that he KNOWS he’s adorable. He then cries out “OW! OOOOWW!” from upstairs, because he insists that we climb the stairs and pet him on the patch of rug that he’s designated as “his spot” and no other spot will do.

  249. says

    Josh, I just don’t know at this point. I could be anywhere by November. And no, I’m not planning on uprooting my life just to avoid buying you a beer. :)

  250. says

    I want to photoshop the 4chan trollface with Kagin’s sunglasses and beard.

    Also, for some odd reason I am reminded tonight how, on LiveJournal, the people who stamped every icon, photo manip, animated .gif, etc. they ever made with “©[year] [username],” and who would shit their pants and declare war on anyone who reposted any of those images without their permission… were typically the same people who created *THE * most butt-ugly images on LJ.

  251. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Ah, you’re right, SG.

    I know there are valid reasons for it, but they’re not usually what people think they are. And they’re not that strong (I say this from professional experience).

  252. says

    They all do. They’re cats. Getting away with everything by looking cute is their shtik.

    Lucy needs to work harder. Her watery shit all over the kitchen is getting on my nerves.

  253. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Weed Monkey:

    Have you not watched all of

    Yes, Beer Bad is not one of my favorites, although it does have the classic line: “Fire bad. Tree good.”*
    If you haven’t seen it yet, “Doublemeat Palace” in Season 6 is another groan worthy episode.
    That said, a bad episode of Buffy is *still* enjoyable.
    “The Body” is absofrickin’lutely !!Fantastic!!
    The masterful use of Anya as a way of exploring/explaining death to those that can’t understand it (she provided an excellent POV character for audience members who may be unable to understand death) was superb. I love the opening of the episode.

    The first full episode I watched of Buffy was Graduation Day pt. 2. Watching the Mayor go full on Slither as he devoured the graduating class, but got bombed to death is cool to me now, but when I first watched it-enh. I didn’t watch an episode again until the penultimate episode of Season 5. Then I was hooked. Having the next episode be the season finale was rough. There I was enjoying the show and I had no new episodes to watch anymore. Thankfully, it was shortly thereafter that FX started showing reruns of Buffy, so I was able to get caught up. Then the DVD box sets came out and I gobbled them up with swiftness.

    When I watched the show while it was still airing first run episodes, I remember disliking Season 6. I won’t spoil anything for you, but it just didn’t gel with me. I think I was watching S6 concurrently with S2 and 3, which were far superior, IMHO. It wasn’t until I’d seen the entire series that I was able to appreciate Season 6. I maintain that the latter half of Season 2 and virtually *all* of Season 3 provided the best Buffy enjoyment for me. A huge part of that is Buffy being in high school. Joss Whedon’s simple theme “High School is Hell” provided the perfect way of dealing with the shit many of us had to during our teen years by way of monster of the week metaphors. After she graduated high school, the show was still enjoyable, but it lacked that spark (I was disappointed to learn-way back when-that the animated Buffy series didn’t get off the ground, because it was supposed to have many of the same voice actors and was meant to be set in her high school years).
    Another huge part of my enjoyment for that period of Buffy time-Eliza ‘Fuckin’ Dushku. That woman rocks. I love her acting. I love her on screen presence. I love the character of Faith.

    Since you’ve made it that far, what did you think of ‘Hush’?

    *I like to use that line when I’m too drunk or high to really function well, let alone think coherently. Therefore if someone asks how I’m doing-that’s the perfect response. Either that, or “I’m five-by-five.”

  254. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Joe: Yeah, cuteness can only get you so far. The Mr. only affords Cinnamon the love he gives to all cats because of her spite-messes and the fact that she makes stinks like an Elder God’s butthole(s), but she’s not fond of men in general, so doesn’t snuggle him like she does me. I adore her, because cute, and snuggly. I swear the other cat, Gatsby knows exactly how much he can piss me off before he has to switch to being ridiculously cute again. Ms. Daisy Cutter can attest to his being maddening, but incredibly charming and soft.

  255. says


    Her watery shit all over the kitchen is getting on my nerves.

    *snort* Teh Kitteh shat in the bath tub yesterday. It’s the easiest place to clean in the apartment so it was not too bad, just not something I hope she will make a habit of.


    Have you not watched all of

    Not quite yet, but it wont take long at this pace. :)

    Yes, Beer Bad is not one of my favorites, although it does have the classic line: “Fire bad. Tree good.”*

    BZZZZZZZZT wrong! In Beer Bad Buffy only said “fire bad”, and the whole quote was “Fire bad. Tree pretty”, which she said to Giles in the aftermath of season 3 finale Graduation Day explaining how exhausted she was. ;)

  256. ednaz says

    Nigel the Bold – Happy Grandpa Day! So great to hear such good news. Wow. That’s quite a name.

    My Hoodlum and I were worried when we found out our grandson was going to be named Noah. Turns out, biblical names are very popular in his school.
    Not sure what I think of that. ;)

    Hooray for BossNurse and Improbable Joe!

    Tony, I’m so glad you are communicating with K. You deserve much happiness.

  257. chigau (違わない) says

    I worked a late shift (3AM) and whilst driving home, saw this in the marquee at a hamburger chain:
    C’MON IN
    I was not alone.
    The other person saw it and we laughed.
    That text was not there the next time I saw the marquee.

  258. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    Randall was not happy to be displaced. NOT HAPPY!!

    Uh oh.
    How deep were the rifts?

    Lucy needs to work harder. Her watery shit all over the kitchen is getting on my nerves.

    How many felines keep you and your wife company?

    We have four here.
    Kayta and Cassie are mine.
    Woo and Ike are T’s.

    Kayta is the adorable female tabby who has decided in the last year that she’s *always* hungry. I can feed her and 10 minutes later she’s running back to the empty food dish. She also loves attention. It doesn’t matter who it is from. Me, T, E, K, a stranger…as long as she’s loved on, she’s good.

    Cassie is the embodiment of ‘fraidey cat’. She runs from *everything*. I’ve had her since she was six weeks old (from the Humane Society), yet she runs from crumpled trash bags, a vacuum cleaner, ME…even the cat food container. I keep her dish on a small desk. The food container has a twist off lid. When I grab it and start twisting, she jumps on the desk. If I place the container on the ground, she jumps down and runs away. As I scoop the food into her bowl, she runs back. It’s the strangest thing!

    Ike is the food hog. He doesn’t wait til the dish gets food. He’s right there waiting. He’s also rambunctious and wild. Once he eats, he’s ripping and running.

    Woo, OTOH, is so damn chill. He and Ike share the same dish, and Woo is perfectly fine waiting for Ike to eat his share before jumping on the chair to have his portion. In the rare event that Woo is on the chair first, Ike will edge him out of the way. Woo doesn’t freak out though. He waits patiently. Slow and steady fills his belly.
    Woo is much like Kayta, in that he appreciates being loved on. He takes that to extremes. If you start to pet him, he will literally follow you around the house. He rubs against your legs and your arms. He’ll paw at your hands if they’re just out of reach. I’ve developed a new petting technique for him that I call “The Superman”. If he’s on the couch (we have a leather sectional), I’ll swoop in low with my hands extended, palms down, side by side and glide over the top of his head and back and continue moving. He will get up and walk towards me, and I’ll repeat that. It’s so much damn fun!

    Fun fact about Ike and Woo: if I break out the catnip, their personalities seem to switch. Woo gets wild and rambunctious, while Ike gets chill and relaxed. It’s hilarious watching them get high on catnip.

    I’m unfamiliar with Mr. X and Mrs. Y


  259. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Tony: Cinnamon is the same in being scared of everything. Open doors, loud noises, people standing up suddenly, wind, the microwave and frequently her own farts.

    She’s sweet but not the brightest of creatures.

    Gatsby seldom snuggles, except first thing in the morning when he demands them from me, and when we’re all in bed and sleepy. Otherwise, he’d rather just sit near you.

  260. says


    We’re up to four. There’s Randall, the oldest, the alpha male, the Kitty-Boy. Also known as Boobie, Boobster, Boobs, and occasionally Boobilicious. He and me, we’re the only guys in the house… and they already took HIS balls, so I don’t feel too safe.

    There’s Ellie next. Kitty-Girl, and our Sleepy-Time Snuggle Buddy. Ellie is always up for a nap, day or night. She’s also got a speech impediment, she doesn’t really purr or meow much, she lets out this weird high-pitched “eeeeeeegggrrrrrggg” noise instead.

    Lucy was originally “Oreo” and we rescued her from a home that had too many children to deal with a cat. She’s HUGE and we can’t figure out how to help her lose weight. When we have money, even before I start looking at new guitars, I’m getting her to the vet. Lucy is really really sweet though. She also seems to love the flavor of a Joe, because she licks my arm while I pet her.

    #4 cat is Lily, who we rescued from the abandoned house across the street. The first time we saw her she had been run out of a second story window out onto the roof over the porch across the street, and the trapped there for a couple of nights. The people living there were evicted a week or two later, and they just left her there. We had seen her around the street for a few days, and one night after it was obvious that no one was coming back to live in that house, I crossed the street to see if she was OK. She ran right up to me and started rubbing against my leg, and it was over. She was my cat from that moment on, even though she still sometimes bites me and she’s not completely socialized.

    And then we have a dog, Ginger. Ginger is too sweet, too loving, and too protective to ever be 100% healthy, but what can you do? She’s my wife’s dog, even though when we got married she was the cat person and I was the dog person. Ginger sleeps in the bed, she guards us from any perceived threat like people living in the other houses in the neighborhood, and all of our dinner plates belong to her to be licked clean.

  261. says


    Wait, that wouldn’t leave any of them on the left, would it?

    Nope. :D

    Thank you again for all the commiserations on Carrot. He was an adorable little boy and he’s missed. The rest of the crew is keeping me busy though, to say the least. Little monsters.

    On the other side of the Carrot coin, Zoe is doing so well, it’s close to miraculous. Everyone is back on a regular diet and she’s handling it fine (so far, anyway.) We’ll probably always have to keep a sharp eye on her for potential problems, but right now everything is great. Zoe is also a favourite of the boyz and she likes them, too. :D

  262. chigau (違わない) says

    I depend on my kitteh as an intruder alert.
    People up the front step (letter carrier). No reaction.
    Cars in the back ally. No reaction.
    Person checking the gas meter. Running in the house!!!!
    People in the back ally. Running in the house!!!!
    Magpies. *murp* *murp* *meo…* eh fukkit.

  263. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    There’s a news clip tonight that I found sweet. President Obama was giving a great eulogy for the four Americans whose bodies were arriving at Andrews airbase. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton was also there, and also made a speech.

    When the president made a beautiful and emotional closing, he stepped back from the podium and to the opposite side from Clinton. You couldn’t really see it for the podium being in the way, but she reached out to clasp his hand for a second, and she gave it a little shake. It looked like a gesture of sympathy and emotional support. I thought it was beautiful.

  264. says


    That highlights one of the things I find so bizarre about the Romney campaign, is that they don’t even try to manufacture phony human moments for their candidate. It is as though the Republican Party has said “Fuck it, we’re a bunch of racist, sexist, religious fundamentalist, sociopathic lying greedy assholes. We’re not even going to bother to pretend otherwise anymore.”

  265. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    No good deed goes unpunished. Especially by cats.

    I am slouched in “my spot” on the end of the couch, next to the bookcase. I used to keep my ukulele lying on the top of the bookcase, where I could reach the neck of it by making a long arm up. I had a folded tea towel up there to protect the back of the uke.

    Well, I was picking the uke the other night, and the girl cat found the towel and assumed it was her spot. It is now, after I installed a hook for the uke and another hook for the Haitian metal art.

    But now there’s a cat over my head, thumping around, or staying ominously silent. Plus, she clonks the ukulele on her way down to land behind my head—it sounds ominous.

  266. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    Improbable Joe, the Republicans have their human moments, but they are bizarre. Maybe it’s the repression.

    I’m thinking of the picture of John McCain checking out Sarah Palin’s backside while tugging at his wedding ring.

    Tonight, Rachael Maddow was talking about some right-wing nuts accusing Obama of being secretly gay. (And still all the other secret stuff, just adding teh ghey to it.) She said something about “gaydar”.

    My wife then said that her gaydar has been going off for Romney and also for Ryan. Repressed, but there, she said.

    I then told her about a set of photos I’d seen where Romney and Ryan were together on a bus tour (or some event). It looked to me like they really liked each other. I mean REALLY, in a totally manly way, liked each other … a lot. My gaydar was buzzing, there.

    I’m assuming they’ve got it well repressed, if it’s there.

    Anybody else noticing anything?

  267. ibyea says

    I am pretty sure that at this point, some conservative out there wrote a slash fic between Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan.

  268. says


    I don’t generally think it is cool to speculate about someone being a closeted homosexual when you think poorly of them, mostly because it tends to be used as an attack based on the whole “homosexual=bad” thinking in our culture. Just as importantly, I don’t need to (and don’t see why anyone else needs to) go after Republicans for things that are speculation when the things that are overt and openly obvious are damning enough.

  269. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    Lucy was originally “Oreo” and we rescued her from a home that had too many children to deal with a cat. She’s HUGE and we can’t figure out how to help her lose weight.

    Kayta used to have that problem.

    I discovered her outside my apartment 12 years ago (damn, it’s been that long; wow). When I couldn’t find her owner, I opted to keep her rather than take her to the pound or leave her outside.
    Within a year or two, she gained a *lot* of weight. I don’t know her exact age when I adopted her, but she was probably under a year old (she wasn’t kitten size, but I know she was young). E and I moved to Pensacola in 2003. By then, she was big. Her belly dragged the floor when she walked. I asked the vet one time about kitty gastric bypass, and was told there was no procedure like that for cats. Kayta and Cassie are both indoor cats. I cringe/cry when I see road kill. It breaks my heart to see cats or dogs or squirrels dead on the road, so if I own a pet I don’t want them to be outside animals that come and go as they like. One of the problems with indoor cats is the lack of exercise. Thankfully, Kayta and Cassie play together enough to keep their weight from getting worse (that’s stopped a bit as they’ve both gotten older). Within the last 3 or 4 years, I’ve noticed Kayta’s weight going down. Her belly doesn’t drag the floor any longer. She still has a little excess belly fat, but people no longer ask if she’s pregnant (she’s been spayed for years, so I don’t know how that would work).

  270. ednaz says

    Caine, I’ve been meaning to ask you – How do you get anything done? ;)

    I really enjoy the ratlet stories.

  271. ednaz says

    chigau, I just dropped off a bottle of rum. It can’t be gone already!

    Unless your question is philosophical, then I am at a loss.

  272. mythbri says


    I’m sorry to hear about Carrot, and I hope the rest of the ratties are doing fine.

    Re: Kagin’s utterly confusing “eliminate males from the gene pool”.


    First time I’d ever viewed Kagin’s blog – I saw “by Edwin” and thought it was a guest post over at Crommunist, and I clicked through wondering “What the hell?”


    I like men. I haz teh secks with them, and I like it. Plus, you know, they’re people. I’m also a feminist. This is not a contradiction – what is he trying to say?

  273. chigau (違わない) says


    I just dropped off a bottle of rum. It can’t be gone already!

    You don’t know me.
    and Thanks!

  274. says

    I have a new fan.


    He thinks that because I tweeted that it’s cool that The Doctor is a Sagittarius, probably, that means I believe in astrology.

    I haven’t seen a better example of someone using skepticism to prop up his ego. “[Nelson laugh] Ha ha, you believe in astrology, neener neener!” Only I don’t.

    He’s taken to tweeting at me and obsessively following my tweets.

    Also he says I’m a star of Atheism+. Woohoo! I always knew I’d see my name in lights!

  275. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    Improbable Joe, thanks. I apologize for my carelessness.

    I will make clear that I wasn’t meaning to imply that there is anything wrong with homosexuality, closeted or otherwise, nor was I saying that anybody should be shamed for repressing, if they happen to be. We are all what we are, and that’s good.

    There is plenty to knock Romney for, and I wasn’t looking for anything to add to the mess. I apologize if I seemed to be saying so.

  276. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    My wife then said that her gaydar has been going off for Romney and also for Ryan. Repressed, but there, she said.

    You know, I don’t think I believe in ‘gaydar’ any longer. When I first came out it took some time to learn the gay stereotypes. I know there is truth to some of them, but there are simply too many traits associated with being gay that are also shared by heterosexuals for those traits to automatically mean someone is gay.
    Actions are another thing.
    I worked with a guy-J-several years ago. Several things he did made me think he wasn’t completely straight.
    The first time I saw him, I thought he was gorgeous. We struck up a friendship and chatted about many things. J was deeeeeeeeeeeeeply religious, but didn’t display any animosity towards gay people. I never heard a disparaging word from his mouth. He never denigrated me, or the lesbian couple we routinely hung out with. There are 3 incidents that convinced me (to this day) that he’s repressed his sexuality (not that he’s gay, but I’m convinced he at least has *some* same sex attraction).
    1- After a conversation one time, we shook hands as he was leaving. As I tried to turn around and release his hand, he didn’t let go. He kept holding on, going so far as to rub one of his fingers across the palm of my hand repeatedly for several seconds before finally letting go. By itself, this was odd, but not significant.

    2-The second incident was multi pronged. He mentioned that he’d done gay porn. Of course I was interested in which company. When he told me, I had to check it out (yes, I still own the DVD). I told him that I’d purchased it, and he said he’d have to come over one day and watch it with me.
    Some time later, a friend of ours was going out of town and wanted someone to watch her house. J and I, as well as two women from work elected to do so. J came to my house to pick me up one night before going to our friends’ home. He chose that time to watch his video (just a solo vid). I decided to see how far I could push things, because I’d suspected he wasn’t fully heterosexual. He didn’t mind me massaging his back while he sat in a chair at my computer and we both watched his video. Shortly after that, we got to wrestling around on the floor and at one point, I had him pinned to the ground and I leaned in to kiss him. It didn’t happen, as he lept up, saying “I can’t do that man. I can’t be gay.” His choice of words stuck with me to this day. It seemed odd to me then and now. He didn’t say “I’m NOT gay”, he said “I can’t be gay”. He also didn’t express anger at me, or disgust that I tried to kiss him. I dropped it.

    The third incident was the most significant.
    This was the same night as the aforementioned wrestling. J and I, along with our friends jumped into a hot tub and afterwards, decided to take a shower. Imagine a shower with two girls (who I realized were bisexual, because they were making out), J (who had his back to me) and me. We all kept our trunks/bikinis on.

    To any straight men out there:
    If you were in a shower with a gay man (assuming you’d even *get* to that point)-a gay man you *know* is attracted to you-would you let that gay man lick your neck down to the base of your back and not say one single word? Not during the act. Not after. Not weeks later. Never?

    Nothing ever happened with J. He was so deep into his ridiculous Christian religion and then he got mixed up in some pyramid scheme thinking he could make millions. I don’t know what happened to him, but I do still remember the shower.

    All of that is to say that gaydar is fairly worthless these days. More people are rejecting traditional masculine roles and attitudes. That doesn’t mean more guys are becoming gay (though perhaps it does mean more men are feeling comfortable expressing their sexual desires), but it does mean that the characteristics normally associated with gay men can no longer be used as the barometer to figure out if someone is gay or straight (hell, to this day, people still think I’m too “straight acting” to be gay-love that insult). Each individual has to be judged on their own merits, and by what they say and what they do. It’s not helpful to try and read into a limp wrist, or high pitched voice, or appreciation for show tunes (K was shocked when I told him I don’t care for musicals). Non Gay men like those too.

  277. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    I haven’t seen a better example of someone using skepticism to prop up his ego. “[Nelson laugh] Ha ha, you believe in astrology, neener neener!” Only I don’t.

    Wait, you don’t believe that the alignment of the planets and stars are significant and have an effect on people while they’re in the womb, to the extent that they determine personality characteristics?
    You heretic!

  278. says

    Wait, you don’t believe that the alignment of the planets and stars are significant and have an effect on people while they’re in the womb, to the extent that they determine personality characteristics?
    You heretic!

    Shocking but true! I ought to be stoned for this, right?

  279. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Stoning is so 10th century.
    These days, we like to draw and quarter.
    If you’re a good, you can walk the plank.

  280. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    Speaking of fat cats—real cats, I mean.

    Our (formerly) boy cat had an urinary infection a few months back. The vet suggested we start feeding him wet food, just to add moisture to his diet. It may have been water weight, but that cat ballooned up, possibly because we were so glad to see him alive that we fed him whenever he asked. We put him back on dry food, and he has never forgiven or forgot. He still remembers the interval where we fed him only in the morning and evening, and increases his demands then. Add in the dog that remembers the time he found a piece of bacon on the floor, and it isn’t safe to walk through the kitchen.

    But the cat is back to a healthy weight.

  281. says

    I’m a Libra, which means… that my parents were having sex around Xmas/New Year’s Eve, and just a few weeks after my older brother was born. Go young Mom and Dad!!!

  282. chigau (違わない) says

    Rey Fox
    Somewhere in my youth or childhood, Cancer became Moonchild and then it all went away.

  283. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Because of the part of society I was in there were a lot of people in my social group that believed in astrology. I used to challenge them to figure out what sign I was. I’d answer any question they cared to ask bar when I was born. No one ever got it right. Then I’d hit ’em with the notion that astrology is merely another form of prejudice.

    Truth be told, I have a more visceral reaction to astrology nuts than I do to fundies because I’ve had to deal with way more of them.

  284. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    By all the clouds ’round Mt. Olympus, Edwin Kagin’s blog just cranked the stupidity dial past 12. That nitwit PG makes me want to rip my hair out–and I have none.

  285. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    interesting. I’d be curious to hear about any astrology related stories. I’ve become so used to talking about sexism/misogyny in the movement, I’ve almost forgotten that sometimes we even talk about irrational beliefs!

  286. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Thanks for the link to the toupee fallacy.
    I learned something new!

  287. Beatrice says


    re: astrology

    I was astonished when I found out that the physics professor from my high school believes in astrology. It made me remember how he was convincing me that my boyfriend in my second to last year wasn’t good for me because our signs don’t go together (putting aside the fact that he really had no business commenting on my relationship at all). The woman who told me about their shared love of astrology says that he believes that if there can exist tidal forces, then gravitational pull of the moon could also have effect on other things like the development of the human brain.

  288. says

    (Blinks at Kagin’s thang…)

    What is this I don’t even…

    Actual points in favour of Kagin’s doing this: following a weird chain of serendipity touched off upon reading this latest weirdness, I discovered that in fact the single gender world is actually–to quote the Pfft!–a pretty common motif*… and… umm…

    Okay, so so far, it’s only one point in favour.

    (Files under ‘stick a fork in his ass and turn him over’.)

    (*/And, come to think of it, I’ve read a few of the works cited, so I guess I kinda already knew, actually. So, now, we’re at more like half a point.)

  289. strange gods before me ॐ says

    I see toupee fallacy is Rebecca Watson’s fault.


    Perfect execution, Beatrice.

  290. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says


    Uh, are you talking about Kagin’s ‘Thang’-dangly bits
    Kagin’s ‘Thang’-nonsensical “kill the menz” parody?

  291. says

    Hi there
    Last night, Mr. and I opened 4 bottles of wine and then had a glass out of the bag. Turns out he and a friend had both forgotten about some bottles of wine he’d kept at his friend’s place and sadly they were not the kind of wine that lasts for 15 years.

  292. Nick Gotts (formerly KG) says

    “Little people” is the preferred term among people of short stature – Socio-gen

    Only in the USA, AFAIK. It sounds tooth-grindingly twee to me, but I admit there’s no very good alternative. In the UK, “person of short stature”, “person of restricted growth” and “small person” are all used by the Restricted Growth Association. (I have a close relative with achondroplasia, the commonest genetic cause of short stature.)

  293. opposablethumbs says

    Also a problem with the term “little people” in the UK because it has a very strong association with Irish leprechauns. I’d definitely be guided by Nick on this one.

  294. says

    Talking about growth, in my immediate circle of friends I’ve noticed something: In siblings of the same sex, the firstborn is usually taller than the second born.
    Is this just a funny coincidence or is there something to that?

    Also, dear doctor: If a boy’s mum is only 1,50m, don’t you think that worrying a lot about the kid being too small and therefore very likely sick in any way (scary music) might be a bit overdoing things?

  295. says

    Grmpf. Mr. can’t finish the repair of the caravan in time, trip to Ikea got cancelled, living-room table is threatening to break down but, hey, it’s not like we’re going to get a chance to get looking for another table in the next weeks, so let’s just hope that when the fucking thing breaks down nobody has their toes underneath it.[/whine]

  296. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    Up the airy mountain,
    Down the rushy glen,
    We daren’t go a-hunting
    For fear of little men;
    Wee folk, good folk,
    Trooping all together;
    Green jacket, red cap,
    And grey cock’s feather!

    — yeah, leprechauns.

    People of restricted growth is preferred in Finland. Sometimes shortened as PORG, although some find that a tad offensive.

    Giliell: My sister’s about 1,5 m and has two tall, strapping sons. I’m 1,57 m, ditto. And yeah, the firstborns are both taller than secondborns.

  297. Beatrice says

    Fuckity fuck.

    I borrowed a book guide to Florence when I was traveling there. I returned it to the library this morning, but now I’ve realized I haven’t checked that I hadn’t left anything inside. I was carrying it around Florence, so it isn’t impossible that I’ve put something between the pages. Even if there is something, it shouldn’t be anything important, but now I’m thinking about it.

    Damn. I’ll have to go back to the library on Monday and casually leaf through that book, just in case.