I know, it’s hard, what with all the fireworks around here, but there’s a lesson to be learned.
After the Brexit vote, Boris Johnson resigned.
And now, another architect of the catastrophe, Nigel Farage, has stepped down.
I have to give them some credit for recognizing, after the fact, what a disaster they have engineered, but they get no respect at all for running away like cowards from the hot flaming mess they made.
Please, America, remember this: bullying, bigoted ignoramuses will disintegrate at the first hint of opposition. Keep that in mind until at least November, OK?
Oh, who am I kidding. This is an electorate with the attention span of a jellyfish.
Actually Boris Johnson hasn’t resigned. He’s still an MP, he has just decided not to stand as a candidate for the leadership of the Conservative Party (who will, by default, become the next Prime Minister).
Amusingly, Bloody Stupid Johnson apparently is US born and technically able to run for president of the US as well. I’m expecting an announcement that he’ll be Trump’s VP any minute now.
Farage has resigned after, apparently, becoming a questionable meme.
Cameron has resigned. No one wants to stand for Tory PM.
Who benefited from this mess?
Michael Fucking Gove on the other hand (that’s his official full name to anyone in the UK involved in education) hasn’t stepped away from the Tory leadership contest. I don’t know how much of the odious little changeling you have been exposed to across the world pond, but he was actually just as prominent in the campaign as Boris or Farage, and, as a cabinet minister who has held previous cabinet posts before, by far the most senior supporter of the leave campaign.
He won’t become Tory leader though. Even the tories can’t stand him.
Unfortunately, this is not the first time Farage has resigned, and he’ll probably be back sooner rather than later. He just likes to take a long summer holiday.
Oh, if only that were true… Sadly, there’s currently 5 utterly ghastly people going for the job. Interestingly for students of human awfulness, they each manage to be terrible in such unique and special ways that it’s practically impossible to compare them to each other, never mind decide which one is the least dreadful.
@3 cartomancer: So they’ll get Theresa May instead? I don’t know much about any of them, but May doesn’t sound, from what little I’ve heard, like any improvement. Then there’s Corbyn who appears to be collateral damage from this whole thing.
The business people haven’t benefited: the pound is still sinking, albeit more slowly, businesses are looking to leave, and the British economy is a mess. The EU didn’t win, if only because they have this mess to deal with. British science is a definite loser. Heck, even the people who wanted no more immigrants have lost since it’s been admitted that immigration policy won’t change. Can’t SOMEONE just come out and say, “We did a stupid. We need to take it back?”
@4 Dunc: Too true. Okay, no one with more brains than the average sea slug or more morals than the average mass murderer. And I may be giving them too much credit.
Johnson,* Farage and their ilk deserve everything they get. It took them less than twelve hours after the results were in to reveal – if it wasn’t already obvious – that their campaign claims were bullshit and lies. That has to be some sort of record, even in politics, and should receive the appropriate honours.
*I object to dragging the name of the ‘real’ B.S. Johnson through the mud for the sake of a cheap shot at B. Johnson. The former had some real accomplishments to his name, accidental or not.
And Farage isn’t giving up his (GBP 80K / year) seat in the EU parliament, apparently. I’d copy the text my colleague’s (English) wife just sent him, but I think if he displayed it again the phone would melt.
@5 – Theresa May seems almost a foregone conclusion from where I’m sitting. Gove is deeply unpopular within the Tory party, tainted because of his backstabbing, and suppuratingly toxic with the public at large. Liam Fox is well known as a highly corrupt self-server and commands little wider support, Stephen Crabb is more popular but inexperienced at the highest levels of politics (and from a working-class Welsh background, which has never been popular with the Tory grandees). Andrea Leadsom is a virtual unknown, but so heavily pro-Brexit that she is very divisive in the current climate. The big business element of the Tory party definitely won’t want her.
I despise the lot of them, but May seems about the least horrible choice (not much of an accolade). At the very least she’s someone who tends to shun grandstanding and controversy and just get on with things.
Of course, in an ideal world we’d do away with the political classes entirely and establish a supreme triumvirate consisting of David Attenborough, Stephen Fry and Mary Beard. I’m hoping we do that.
Hey! Show some respect for the jellyfish.
No – Johnson hasn’t resigned – I think that sounds a bit pedantic , but it does highlight the fact that non of the Brexit campaigners were in a position to do anything about it, in the event that they won.
It also seems that the people likely to be in charge of the three largest parties in the UK(Cons, Lab if Corbyn is forced out, and SNP) are probably going to be women.
As for the Conservatives, May seems to be the least “showboatey” and most competent of the candidates
@7 komarov: It’s a fair point. BS Johnson did have some actual talent, even if it was not the talent he wanted or thought he had. Boris…not so much. Sigh. This mess would be, if not improved at least more amusing, if Pratchett and Douglas Adams were still here to comment on it.
I think what got me, was the news this morning that Nigel Farage was resigning as head of UKIP but would remain on as an MEP. For someone who want to withdraw from the EU, this is a bit rich. Oh right, mentioning rich, as of 2014 MEPs earned €7,957/month with what appears to be generous expenses.
Guy Verhofstadt, the former Belgium prime minister and an MEP, speaking of Farage was reported as saying “Finally we will be getting rid of the biggest waste in the EU budget – that we have paid for 17 years of your salary.”
Sadly if Brexit goes through even reasonably quickly it looks like another 2 or 3 years of waste.
So what exactly is the attention span of a jellyfish? Is there actual data on this?
Sort of like being the best of the 2016 Republican candidates for US president?
Isn’t Theresa May the person who had the great idea that immigrants in the UK had to earn 35k or more to avoid deportation only to be reminded that the NHS would be bought to its knees due to the number of nurses who are immigrants and don’t earn nearly that amount.
The teachers’ hatred of Gove is equalled by the polices’ contempt for May. They are both utterly incompetent. Crabb is a loony who thinks gayness is curable, and Leadsom has the sensitivity, empathy and IQ of a medium-sized house brick.
Please tell me I’m not the only one whose first thought was “So that’s what Crabb did after he left Hogwarts”. Though again I may be slandering the fictional Crabb.
@komarov #7
Nope, sorry. In 2010, Wilders broke his most important promise already one hour after polling stations closed.
I was somewhat disturbed to see Leadsom’s pitch majored on her “Christian Values”
And people are still voting for him. I don’t know whether to be reassured that the US voting populace is not really the only stupid one in the world or to despair at the lack of sense shown in any voting population.
dianne @ # 2: Who benefited from this mess?
ajbjasus @ # 11: It also seems that the people likely to be in charge of the three largest parties in the UK(Cons, Lab if Corbyn is forced out, and SNP) are probably going to be women.
Next question?
Dianne, by the way, it looks like we here in Amsterdam might benefit, as the best place for all the city of london finance guys to relocate to. I’m not sure those people would necessarily enhance the quality of life here, though – and I say that as someone who’s kinda sorta middle management in a bank. They’re already trying to make Amsterdam too nice.
The one saving grace: pretty much all immigrants, even EU ones, have to ‘inburgeren’ – culturally assimilate. You have to take classes and a test. The mental image of these masters of the universe wannabes having to sit with actual working class people learning how to get on with their neighbors is at least a good one.
The prospect of any of the candidates getting the job horrifies me. Theresa May may well be shown as the most competent of all of them, but this is not a good thing. As Don Quijote points out @14, along with her less than stellar record over people’s right to privacy (google “snoopers charter”), she’s not a person I’d want to see in charge. Gove has been well covered further up the comments section, Stephen Crabb is a proponent of “gay cure” therapies. Andrea Leadsom has billed herself as the next Margaret Thatcher and Liam Fox is as dodgy as they come.
Anyone outside the UK got a sofa I can crash on until all this insanity runs its course?
ajbjasus:
Yep, two of the candidates are openly god-botherers. There’s a distinct danger that we’ll have to stop feeling smugly superior about US political religiosity.
cartomancer:
I don’t know how much support he has in the UK, but don’t overlook his American connections. He’s in bed with ALEC, for a start. I’d like to say that won’t count for anything, but in the current febrile atmosphere I just don’t know anymore.
Don’t forget: just in case you thought the current UK political situation isn’t crazy enough, this Wednesday sees the looong-awaited publication of the report of the Chilcot inquiry into the UK’s involvement in the Iraq war. You can probably factor that into Labour rebellion against Corbyn: there are Blairites who won’t want a lefty in charge when the report comes out.
Except they haven’t. Both Johnson and Farage continue to bray about this “wonderful result for Britain” which is a “historic opportunity to make Britain great again”. They see no disaster and nothing to be ashamed for. Bastards.
Derek@23: Sounds kind of nice, actually. Is it an automatic fail if someone freaks during the language exam and gives the answer in Deutsch rather than Dutch?
I wouldn’t be too sure Farage has gone for good, as Dunc@4 says. He also resigned last year, after failing to win a seat in Parliament, and UKIP don’t have anyone to replace him with. Their sole MP, Douglas Carswell, insists he doesn’t want the job, as does the leader of UKIP in Wales, the notoriously corrupt Neil Hamilton. David Coburn, leader of UKIP in Scotland, is bright enough to open his mouth when he wants to eat – but only just. The only member so far to say they want the job is former deputy chairwoman [sic] Suzanne Evans, who is currently suspended from the party.
Moggie@27,
Yes, it’s been noted that many of those prominent in the anti-Corbyn uprising were prominent supporters of Bliar and his war. The man himself has been pontificating all over the airwaves in recent days, saying the Brexit vote isn’t necessarily final. Allegedly, support among the rebels for a candidate to challenge Crobyn is shifting from Angela Eagle to Owen Smith or “Owen Who?” as he is more generally known.
Osborne has promised to tax corporate taxes to try and keep them in the UK, while also saying that taxes on regular Britons will need to be raised and social services and welfare cut. So, there you go: More of the same neoliberal crap that we knew would happen. Because it’s never the regular people who get to benefit, no, they get to bear the brunt of the damages. Right-wing populism really screwed the Brits over, didn’t it?
*to cut corporate taxes
*them = corporations who might otherwise leave for mainland EU
Re: 23 and, 29:
I’m pretty sure the self-styled British elite would fail such a test in Britain. And they would take great pride in this.
That said, it would be their loss. I spent a year in the Netherlands and is was the nicest place I’ve ever been to. Plus it was on the coast, so, wherever I go, the rain always seems harmless by comparison.
Frankfurt will presumably be in competition with Amsterdam if there is a mass exit of financial institutions from the City of London. I’m told that Frankfurt is a much less pleasant place to work than Amsterdam, though.
Marina Hyde on serial resigner Farage.
Under the ill wind blowing no one good theme, poor old Neville Chamberlain might get a break in the future as people focus instead on Farage, Johnson, and Cameron and their key role in breaking up the UK.
Speaking of Labour leaders:
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/04/michael-foot-memorial-vandalised-with-swastikas
So, what some have called the “celebratory extremism” unleashed by the referendum result isn’t limited to attacks on immigrants: even dead white socialists can be targets.
The degree of dishonesty in the Brexit campaign was so astounding that in a way it isn’t surprising that many people believed it – if you are going to tell a lie tell a big one.
https://www.brexitthemovie.com/
I have to admit that I couldn’t sit through it all.
@mudpuddles #28
That is not a proof they haven’t realised what a shitstorm they instigated. Or do you expect from such unscrupulous people to say “Uh oh we messed up and created this mess and now we do not know what to do, sorry.”?
No, such assholes always insist that the pile of shit they left behind them is smelling of lilacs and that they are giving a beautiful gift to those poor sods who have to clean up after them.
I think they both are very well aware that they plunged UK into a needlesly difficult situation and they do not want to be at the steering wheel when the shit they have thrown in the fan starts really smell.
And should by coincidence a beautiful rose bush grow on that manure of theirs, because of concentrated work of their successors, they will and try to take all credit for it, you can bet on it. And should it instead result in plague – well there is someone else to blame.
Farage is completel amoral.
To anyone who wants the City of London fruitcakes, better known as “Banksters”: Why? Do you really want a place infested with corrupt, fraudulent, people driving up prices to astronomical levels, paying astonishingly little tax, and seriously distorting the local and national governments?
Re: Charly, #40
Earlier today or yesterday there was a BBC article* saying that nobody really wants the job as prime minister right now. The expectation is that whoever does take it will go down in history as the idiot who took the UK out of the EU, and that they won’t last long beyond this single act. A sacrificial prime minister, if you will.**
The intrepid and brave Leave campaigners would prefer to sit this round out and grab power once the deed is done. All this speaks volumes as to how the Leave decision is perceived in UK politics, and to the integrity and follow-through of the Leave politicians. The Brexit vote serves their agenda, but they would never pull the trigger themselves because that is bad press. So whatever ‘good’ they claimed would come from leaving the EU is either not worth them risking their own political careers over, or was just propaganda.
Come to think of it, these options aren’t mutually exlcusive.
*Can’t find it now, Brexit articles are flying fast over there
**Whatever else you can say about Cameron, handing the exit over to his successor was a nice and well-deserved ‘… you’ to the Leavers. Brexit may be his mess as much as anybody else’s but I can still appreciate the gesture.
@ mailliw, 39:
I managed sixty seconds, and the amount of complete bullshit in that first minute alone was enough for me. All the usual lies that stir up nativists’ emotions are there.
If he clings to his seat until the end of his term, he’ll get the full MEP pension: 5672 € per month, tax-free.
@mudpuddles, 43:
What is most surprising are all these apparently well educated people saying they find EU institutions incomprehensible. The relevant Wikipedia pages have a very clear explanation of the functions of the commission, council and parliament. All legislation has to be passed by the parliament which is elected by the citizens of the EU.
Somehow out of this the Brexiters arrived at the conclusion that the EU is run by the commission with Jean Claude Juncker as dictator.
With Boris, it was pretty widely seen that he would be the front runner in the contest to be the next Tory leader and Prime Minister (though the first time I heard this, I honestly thought the person saying this was actually making quite a funny joke, until I realised what they were saying was 100% true and accurate), so it did come as something of a surprise to many that he announced he wouldn’t be running. However, opinion seems to be divided as to why – some say that Michael Gove, who was a very important ally and supporter to Boris during the whole Brexit campaign, more or less carried out a political assassination to clear the way for his own leadership bid. Others say that Boris is now realising that getting out of the EU is a spectacularly bad idea, and therefore doesn’t want to be anywhere near the fan when the shit actually hits it.
The fact that Farage has resigned (or should that be ‘re-resigned’) is quite interesting. This is a guy who has campaigned for 15+ years for Britain to leave the EU, and he’s now got a referendum vote to do just that – and he quits? He recently made a speech in the EU parliament claiming that failing to forge a very favourable trade deal with the UK after it officially leaves will be worse for the EU than it would be for the UK – and got openly laughed at and mocked. There was also a comment made that, thanks to his efforts, the EU would fairly shortly be getting rid of the biggest waste in it’s budget – Farage’s salary. I think that Farage genuinely thought that the EU would be so anxious and desperate to trade with the UK that the UK government would be able to negotiate a deal where they would basically be able to have most or all of the economic advantages of being in the EU, with few or none of the obligations and responsibilities, but he’s now beginning to realise that is simply not true – so he’s cutting and running from UK politics before he gets lynched, figuratively speaking.
#41, blf
Because they pay over 60 billion GBP in tax. If successive UK government hadn’t been so spineless, they’d have regulated the bankers and still got all that money. The financial disasters of late are pretty much the fault of the politicians who encouraged the folk who actually implemented it and had every opportunity to put the brakes on.
It seems possible that the German, French or Dutch governments who stand to “inherit” a big chunk of London’s financial business will do a better job than the previous owners. More interestingly, if France gets a big chunk of the ex-UK euro banking it’ll a) be a nice boost to their economy and b) a good weapon to use against le Pen, because the French won’t get to keep the banks either if they leave the EU, etc.
Moggie@36,
Thanks – I thought I remembered Farage resigning twice before, but couldn’t find a reference to it online.
Can Farage be kicked out of his position as MEP? The EU parliament certainly doesn’t want the deadbeat and I doubt the UK wants him much at this point either.
The pound is still dropping. I don’t think it’s quite to its Thatcherite historic low against the dollar, but it’s on track to get there. And the only proposal that the Tories can come up with to induce banks and other businesses to stay in London? Lowering taxes. Sorry, that’s not going to help: it doesn’t matter if the tax rate is in the negative numbers, you can’t have your EU headquarters outside the EU. Maybe if Scotland gets their act together quick they can pick up some business before the banks and other businesses depart for the continent.
I expect pharma to be a big part of the exodus. The EU is a bigger marker than the UK, especially when you consider that getting to market in the UK involves not just passing their regulatory requirements, but also getting approval from NICE and selling, usually, at a lower price than elsewhere. I expect many companies to say “screw this” and prioritize getting approved in the EU and the US over the UK. Heck, with India a growing market, it probably makes sense to focus on getting a drug approved in India before worrying about providing it to some little island off the shore of Europe.
If the next PM is a sacrificial PM anyway, why couldn’t they just say, “Nope. That referendum was non-binding and we’re not doing it. We are never invoking article 50, it’s just not happening. Sorry for the fuss and bother. I will now hold an election to determine whether the voters want me to stay in power after this decision, but I believe that the majority of voters regret their decision and will vote for me to stay on.” And then do so. The worst that can happen at that point is that they have to resign, which they were going to anyway.
@50
even money on that or something similar
place your bet the wheel is still in spin
uncle frogy
#29 / Dianne: Well, the way it works is that if you want to get a residence permit you have to be ‘integrated’. That means either taking a Dutch language test (which is what I did, back before I just became Dutch) or taking the cultural integration exam.
It was initially meant to prepare folks from radically different cultures (specifically Morocco and Turkey) to make sure they were prepared for things like topless beaches and guys kissing each other. The running joke is that more than half of Dutchies would fail the integration test, because it’s more like how to be a white Dutch person living in a small-ish town thirty years ago…
Idiots who got lucky, really lucky and don’t know what to do next now they’ve won. Apart from someone else picking up the pieces of course.
#49, diane
For better or worse, removing elected officials from office before the end of their term is quite tricky, unless they are actually caught doing something illegal. Driving an entire nation off a metaphorical cliff is not, alas, a crime.
#50
There are multiple problems. Firstly, the next prime minister has a reasonable chance of being anti-europe, as they’ll be the leader of the tory party and the candidates are either very much in the leave camp, or in the case of May, not really interested in staying in the EU anyway.
Ultimately, it’ll have to go to a vote in parliament, and there are no shortage of anti-EU folk there, and a whole load more who are happy to follow the will of the people as expressed by the referendum result. Chances are that the UK will leave. It might take a general election first to shake things up a bit, but a sacrificial PM who says “we’re not leaving” is likely to cause a big upswell of nasty anti-EU nationalism fueled by the inevitable “politicians don’t listen to you! the london elite don’t listen to you! vote for me!” stuff.
The end is nigh. Dragging it out probably won’t change anything.
Except that the UK, including the “leave” politicians seem to want to do just that. No one has yet to invoke Article 50. Everyone seems to want someone else to do that particular bit of dirty work. So maybe if no one wants to do it, that’s a sign that it shouldn’t be done? I know that there are a number of people, both voters and elected leaders, who are pro-leave, but until and unless one of them can get their backbone in good enough shape to actually notify the EU that they’re out, the rhetoric is really sounding insincere.
On the bright side, I suppose I now have a new way of explaining the term “Kobayashi Maru situation” to non-nerds.
What have you got against jellyfish?
@56: I’ve never wanted a “like” button on Pharyngula before.
dianne@55,
I think the point of dragging the process out is to use the damaging uncertainty to try and get some concessions before invoking article 50. Once it is invoked, the UK government loses that leverage, and if no agreement is reached within two years, the UK is out without any access to the single market – so the boot would be on the other foot. It’s an astoundingly cynical manouevre, but what would you expect? They’re Tories!
Nick @59: But it’s the UK taking the damage, primarily. What incentive does the EU have for giving concessions except for a desire to finally see the back of these guys?
dianne@60,
Well don’t underestimate that! They have after all been urging the UK government to get on with it, and have said they won’t do any negotiating until article 50 is invoked, while the UK government wants exactly that.
So the Leave’s plan is to make the UK so obnoxious that the EU will literally pay to get rid of them? I suppose it might work.
Re: Nick Gotts, #61:
No, I don’t see it. The rest of the EU would like to have certainty, yes, but surely they wouldn’t make any disadvantageous concessions just to get it? While the UK is (still) part of the EU, its influence on the EU is bound to wane now that everyone is expecting them to leave. If there ever was a time when the rest of the member states are in a position (and motivated) to minimise whatever clout the UK tries to execerise in the EU, it is now. So why would they give the UK anything they don’t have to or want them to have anyway?
The only downside for the EU is having to wait out the idiot politicians’ game of stick the knife in the back, which has already become tedious. After that things would be more or less over. Either article 50 is triggered or it isn’t. As it stands, with Cameron’s resignation, the UK has bought itself around 6 months (my guess) of procrastination, but we’ll probably know before then who’ll take over and whether or not they intend to act on the referendum.
(Even if they didn’t the UK would still have gambled away a lot of political (and other) capital for nothing. So, well done, politics?)
Having voted to “take back control”, the UK are now in a situation where a few hundred Tory MPs are whittling down a list of five odious shits, none of whom would survive a Wonka factory tour (two down, one to go), to the two most polishable turds that the <1% of the population who are paid up members of the Conservative party can choose between to be our next Prime Minister. Yay, democracy!
Much as I'd like to see a reversal of the referendum result, and much as I know the arguments for it, I think the chances of it actually happening are infinitesimally small. The distribution of the referendum votes was such that most MPs are in areas where the majority voted to leave, and they would never vote to overturn the decision as they'd never get re-elected.
There also won't be a new general election before 2020. The fixed term parliament act has two provisions for an early election. The first requires the passing of a motion of no confidence in the government, without the subsequent passing of a motion of confidence in the (probably but not definitely new) government within 14 days. There's no way the Tories are going to pass that motion. The second method is even harder – it requires passing a resolution for an early GE by a two thirds majority. Even if you could convince some Tory rebels to vote for this, most Labour MPs wouldn't. Many of the opportunist backstabbers trying to oust Corbyn and return to the Blairite "Red Tory" version of the party are being told by their local parties that they will be de-selected if they continue to act in opposition to the (still) enormous grass roots support that Corbyn has. A new GE in the near future would almost certainly see a massive churn in the Labour candidates, with the right wing of the party pushed out to make way for proper socialists. These people are cynical and self-serving players of the political game, and they won't fall on their swords.
dianne@ 62: Making the English so obnoxious other countries will pay them to go away has been a long and honourable part of British policy for centuries. I think the trend started back around the time of the Conquest back in 1066. During the 16th through 20th centuries, the practice went under the name of ‘colonialism’.