[Lounge #406]


This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. You’re getting two platypuses, so I expect double niceness.

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread


  1. rq says

    I’m just going to replace OSC with you, mmkay? Whenever I find my copy of Ender’s Game, I’m going to scratch out the Orson Scott Card and mark down Tony the (UNdefeatable) Queer Shoop instead.
    By that I mean, you’re better at replacing people than being replaced.
    This goes for Ogvorbis, too, but I have no book about trains on which I could place your ‘nym.


  2. glodson says

    Oh, it is cuter than you would think to hear the child swear. She gets so enthusiastic. And she’ll try to expand on it too. She screws her face up into a little window of frustration, sigh and say “Daddy, I’m so frustrated at you right now. Goddamners! Rockstars!”

    They day she picks up the word “asshole” after we drive, I might be in a little bit of trouble. So I am trying to curb my tendency to curse.

    When she gets a bit older, I will likely go back. However, there isn’t much room in a three year old’s mind for tact and context.

  3. says

    ::the Undefeated Queer Shoop reaches into his desk and pulls out the notepad titled ‘Reasons Why I Want To Hang Out With Portia’. Following the last entry (which of course read: practice how to beat someone at Pictionary…again), he scribbles “she bakes cupcakes”. Shoop quickly throws notepad back into desk upon hearing footsteps. Thinks to himself “cannot let anyone see me write the next entry-“to hone my feminist snark skills under the tutelage of a true master”.::

  4. Beatrice says

    I refresh and see there is a comment by rq in the Lounge on Recent Comments. I refresh the Lounge, but there is nothing *shrug*

    I refresh the main page again and see more comments that are supposed to be in the Lounge.

    And, well, here I am, on the second page.

  5. rq says

    I love ‘Rockstars!’
    Our family has taken to using ‘Credit!’ (as in, bank loan) as a swear word, ever since Eldest overheard someone saying ‘Kretīns’ (cretin), and asked, ‘what is a kredīts?’ So, when someone is being especially annoying/frustrating, they have a whole mortgage. With varying rates of interest.

  6. glodson says

    She is awesome. She’s one reason why I’ve grown more passionate about social issues. I’ve had plenty of time to help fix problems, and now she’s got to grow up with bullshit. So I need to educate myself, I need to be better, so she’ll have a better world to grow up in.

    And it isn’t just her. I look at churches now, and my gut twists on itself. I know well what those kids are being taught. When I was in high school, I would volunteer to watch the kids. One of the few redeeming qualities I have is that I’m really good with kids. They surrounded the kids with religious icons, and piped the sermon in. I hated that. I felt it was taking the choice away from the kids, blissfully unaware of how I ended up there in the first place.

    It wasn’t quite as bad as the blatant racism of busing in kids with dark skin solely to be ringers on the Church basketball team, but it was bad.

  7. pharm scigrad says

    From the previous thread:
    carlie @ 191: That’s very cool. Though I’m biased to think anything with lasers is cool. Thanks.
    richardh @ 195: The “fallacy of equivocation” is exactly the sort of thing I can sniff out fairly well now but not call out so eloquently at all.
    The “trust me I’m a physicist” also made me smile. I do remember hearing in a physics course somewhere that light propagates itself – that probably would lend itself to all kinds of horrible mixed metaphors indeed. I haven’t thought about Maxwell’s equations in years, although my physics courses didn’t do them justice, and I probably am more familar with the quantum side, which ain’t saying much, but NMR requires it, so you suck it up and learn what you have to to get by. ;)
    glodson @ 207: That seriously made me laugh out loud. Good show.
    dontpanic @ 218: They taste terrible? Good to know. I’ll make sure not to have any for dessert.
    Mirages into miracles might be one of the funniest non-sexual autocorrects I’ve ever heard.
    I never thought about light in a vacuum experiencing no time. That is *actually* something to ponder.
    “Fully certified quantum mechanic” is better than a silly piece of paper IMHO. Then again, what do I know. ;)
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :) @223: Epic. Seeing in UV would be cool… I think.
    Tigger_the_Wing, Ranged Throngs Termed A Nerd With Boltcutters: So sorry to hear about your diagnosis, yet I am glad to hear that you are a step closer to getting some real help. I have a friend who is also a zebra and she has a website that may provide some information you might find helpful: http://medicallyme.com/ It is more US/Canada specific, but hopefully there is something there that will be geographically useful as well. *hugs* if you want them.
    Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion): You were talking about non-gays in the gay scene… and I do have to be honest, I am not sure exactly how one would be defining gay in this case. Still, it’s one of my buttons. A male-female pairing does not mean straight any more than a same sex couple means lesbian or gay. There are bisexuals, pansexuals… you know, the other letters that follow LG in the queer alphabet soup out here. Not trying to attack you, because you don’t see to have a problem with letting those who are queer-friendly into queer spaces, but it is hard for me not to sound agitated when so many identities are erased by the gay/straight dichotomy.

  8. glodson says

    @ rq.

    I love that. Here’s another one that is going to get me in trouble with my extended family. Whenever my daughter sees a picture of Jesus, she identifies him as “White Jesus.”

  9. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Awwwww, Tony, you make me want to squeeze you with a big ol’ bear hug.
    I mean, I didn’t see nuthin.

    That’s adorable! My sister’s favorite story about baby-swearing is when her boy, then 2, stuck his head out of his room after being put down for a nap and declared: “This is bullshit, mama!”

    I like using words that aren’t swears for swearing because it makes people go “huh” :) That’s a cute story, I like the versatility of the concept.

  10. Parrowing, Time For A Saucy Change says

    Thanks for reminding me of that page, Cerberus. It has helped me out in the past. I get a little bit of ASMR from it, actually.


    Noooooo, my skeptically inclined friend is officially moving back to Australia next Tuesday so I will have no one to covertly eyeroll with every Wednesday. :(

  11. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I love that. Here’s another one that is going to get me in trouble with my extended family. Whenever my daughter sees a picture of Jesus, she identifies him as “White Jesus.”

    bahahahah That’s great.

    Your daughter is lucky to have such a conscious parent.

    Tea, anyone? I’m trying to soothe the beast that is in my throat with some chai at the moment.

  12. glodson says

    pharm scigrad

    I am always happy to see my endless supply of Futurama quotes made someone laugh.

    You all might know biology, chemistry, history, genetics, sociology, psychology, grammar, and just about every other subject better than I, but I kick ass when it comes to rattling off quotes from cartoons.

    Just goddamnit.

  13. pharm scigrad says

    Finally caught up. Had lots of thread to go through, lots of time to do it in. Home after surgery and finally well enough to stare at the screen and think about things. Well enough to be annoyed by being at home and not able to be up and about doing other things or focusing on “important” things.
    Ogvorbis & Jadehawk & Cerberus: *big hugs* if you take them
    *warm fuzzies* all around

  14. rq says

    Oops! Good one. ;)

    It’s actually quite good, because nobody wants to be a bank loan. Least of all a mortgage!

  15. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I wanted to say, Cerberus, Tony is undefeated at being right about you and your admirable character. I’m so sorry that this injustice is not only so pronounced, but also protracted. I wish for your sake that I could wave a magic wand and magic you into a new job where you are fulfilled and appreciated.


  16. glodson says

    No tea right now. It is about time to get the little girl and head home. We shall be making tacos for dinner, and we might bake some cookies if I remember to get the chocolate chips on the way home.

    Thanks all, it was fun. Something I’ve not had in the past few days. Nothing serious, just assorted stress.

    If there are any gamers here, you can find me on Steam, the Playstation Network, or Xboxlive. Just added omega to the start of this nym. That should be me.

    Take care everyone.

  17. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Thanks, rq. :) Hold out your mug. I hope the sniffles and sneezes and congestion let up as well. Sigh.

    glodson: enjoy your afternoon. I might make tacos too…that’s a great idea. Glad you’ve gotten to decompress a bit.

  18. rq says

    Have a good evening!

    I made chili tonight.


    Seconding Portia @517. I wish I could hire you myself.

  19. pharm scigrad says

    glodson: Yeah, I may be really smart at lots of sciency things, but I am totally pop-culture deficient. Completely. This way, I get to hear all the best line without having to suffer through all the so-so ones. I consider that a net win. ;)
    Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire: Some chai sounds lovely. My throat is still a bit sore itself. Can I interest you in some Girl Scout cookies? I’d offer homemade, but I haven’t been up to it lately…
    In hopes of saving my former roommates’ child from my foul mouth ways, I spontaneously invented fustercluck. I now like it better than the word it replaced and it rolls off my tongue easier than the original, though it causes a great degree of WTH moments with adults when I use it.

  20. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    That sounds like a lovely trade. I have lots of Vanilla Chai to spare, it’s working its magic on my throat. Open your ports:)

  21. says

    *hugs* for all those in poor straits.
    That sucks. You have my sympathies.

    pharm scigrad

    There are bisexuals, pansexuals… you know, the other letters that follow LG in the queer alphabet soup out here. Not trying to attack you, because you don’t see to have a problem with letting those who are queer-friendly into queer spaces, but it is hard for me not to sound agitated when so many identities are erased by the gay/straight dichotomy.

    Yes, I know. I am both the person who explained why many gay people have problems with straight people in designated gay spaces and a bi/pansexual. The thing is that, in addition to the good old fashioned bi erasure, which is a problem, there are problems that happen when straight people start showing up in numbers. Many gay spaces are at least partially intended as spaces where gay people can flirt/hookup/start romances, for instance, where there is a reasonable expectation that the the person you’re approaching might be interested, and at any rate won’t freak the fuck out that some queer is hitting on them. More straight people=probabilities closer to those of the general population for both the ‘interested’ and the ‘freak the fuck out’ factors, at which point you’ve kind of defeated the whole purpose.

  22. rq says

    Portia, ports open!

    I think I get ASMR, too…
    And next Tuesday? That’s too soon, you only just discovered each other! :( I hope somebody else reveals themselves soon, to make those evenings easier to bear.

  23. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Incoming, rq!

    Parrowing, that’s so disappointing, I’m sorry! Maybe rq is right, someone else will turn up. : (

  24. says

    Good evening
    Thank goodness it’s 10 pm and the day is done.

    I think the guy failed miserably.
    Count me among the people who would very much like to have you somewhere close in meatspace. You’re one of those people here I’m very sorry about that I’m probably never going to meet you in person.

    I told Mr. he should (just for the fun of it) ask my mum. She said “well, what did my daughter say?”

    The kids use “damn” and “stupid”. We had the first round of “asshole” around here, and while I’m not opposed against calling people asshole from time to time, I think that with her 5 years she still understands too little to use such words wisely. So the word is taboo which leads to the competition of “how many times can I use the word in a way that won’t get me into trouble”?

    cute kids story:
    Actually, amazing kids story.
    Today we talked about the (geographical) end of the world. I said “well, the world is a spehere, it doesn’t actually have an end”, but #1 gave me a different argument: The world has lots and lots of ends, hundreds and thousand, very, very, very many of them. Because, you see, the world is a spehere and has a centre. And then you go outwards until the world ends.
    I never looked at it like that, because I always followed the conventional “flat earth end of world” conventions. I told her that I find it a very good and interesting idea that hadn’t occurred to me so far.

  25. says

    pharm scigrad:
    You make an excellent point. The desire to include people of all non-normative expressions of sexuality is why I usually say _queer_(I also prefer that term to the clunky LGBTQI). In the case I was speaking of, the bar in question is a “gay bar”, so I used their terminology in describing it. I do understand the need to carve out places where marginalized people can be free to just _be_. The struggles of the gay community became a social justice issue for the US quicker than other areas of the queer spectrum, which I think is why we still have the binary “gay bars” and “straight bars” (though “lesbian bars” exist as well). I have no knowledge of any other spaces for other members of the queer community, but I fully understand a need for those in, say, the trans* community to have their own space (given the discrimination they face from homo-and hetero- sexuals). I seem to have rambled a bit there. Sorry.
    I also wonder what society will be like when different expressions of sexuality are normalized to the point that there is no need for specific bars for members of the queer community. For instance, even though I am out, I still hesitate [at work] to make any comments about an attractive guy (though this applies more to interactions with non employees; IME, restaurants are very accepting to gays and lesbians-though I am uncertain if the same is true for others on the queer spectrum; sadly, I am inclined to think the answer is ‘no’).

  26. rq says

    That is an awesome kids’ story and truly a great perspective on the (end of the) world.

  27. says

    Liking ‘rockstars’ as a swear word. Would it be used in place of another? Instead of shit? Fuck? Dammit? Or would it be its own entity? Perhaps used similar to douchebag or cupcake?
    (Ex. ‘ Dude quit being such a rockstar’ or ‘that rockstar in the feminist thread is on my nerves’)

  28. rq says

    I think it could be used how you mention, but also in place of ‘dammit’ (“Rockstars!!!“) or ‘holy fuck, batman!’ and the like.
    I’m pretty sure it’s a versatile term. I’m going to combine it with my local current going swear-word, and take it to the next level – rockstars with bank loans! :)

  29. pharm scigrad says

    Dalillama, Schmott Guy: Apologies for the ‘nym confusion.
    I suppose I am just frustrated without any real answers then. I don’t disagree with you because as much as I would like the world to be different, it’s not, and safe spaces are important for all of us. I’ve been pissed myself at the assumption of heteronormativity made in queer spaces (those I’ve witnessed specifically) by white men.
    Then again, in those queer spaces, couples viewed as opposite gender are viewed as straight or heterosexual, regardless; forcing someone to choose between the queer and non-queer communities on the basis of the gender presentation of their current partner seems to me to be… divisive. One is only queer (or welcome in queer spaces) when one has a same-sex partner? I suppose that is the sort of thing I might expect from certain elements of the heterosexual community (when the situation is reversed), but it is not one I thought would be as widespread as it is in the queer community.

  30. David Marjanović says

    Part 1 of 1

    Preview does very weird things to links.


    *spoons for Pteryxx and Jadehawk and Ogvorbis and Cerberus*
    *hugs, too*
    *and calming manatees*
    *bottle of malinówka, bread, bacon, chocolate, happiness tea and sweet chai for Jadehawk*

    Work keeps my mood from sagging. So, Jadehawk, maybe start fixing Wikipedia (in several languages)? If you don’t want to deal with the reactions, just never come back to that article! There are hundreds of thousands more! :-) I’ve created one and completely overhauled… less than 5, I think; I let years pass between visiting them again, even though I’m usually more afraid of the timesink factor than the reactions.

    As far as exercise goes, it apparently has to be something I’m not doing (so not walking or running instead of waiting for the bus), because I’ve reached the point now where I have to be careful about back pain. Is swimming at all an option?

    Also, I’ll light the Happiestsadist beacon. Unlike me, they know depression very well.


    January, over here, had 22 hours of sunshine in total.

    February had just 21!

    March made up for this in a few days; yesterday was completely cloudless, for example, and I think today is, too. But it’ll be over by tomorrow.


    Marmalade/jam: I was taught that English marmalade referred to stuff made from oranges or lemons (…oh, thanks, rq, that’s what etymonline says!), something only the English would ever think of using that way, and that if made from other fruits it was jam. I was further taught that, in Germany (as opposed to Austria), Marmelade and Konfitüre were used that way (obviously from French marmelade and confiture). In Austria, it’s all Marmelade, the term Konfitüre isn’t used, and citrus fruits aren’t used to make it.

    Oh, wait, there’s also Powidl, a concoction from plums that looks and smells quite offputting indeed. As you can basically see from the p, it’s Czech.


    It is as inevitable as Death in Texas.

    Subthread won.

    I really like France. And as far as it makes sense, I like the French. But they are really snobs when it comes to language. All other places I’ve been to, people actually appreciate if you even remember “hello”, “please” and “thank you” in their language and people will praise you for your skills, even though they end there. But not the French. You either do it perfectly or you needn’t bother at all…

    Thing is, I’m sure they’re trying to help – they believe speaking English makes it easier for you. In many cases, it would, if the French and the English sound system weren’t just about as far apart as European ones can be.

    I don’t know about anyone else, but some days I feel particularly dumb. Through no one’s fault but my own, there are some things I guess I cannot grasp.

    Like what, for example? :-)

    Well, I usually keep this small bit of anonymity for myself, but if you really want to know

    Oh, sorry. You were under no obligation to answer just so I can make sense of your keyboard!

    come back soon

    All seconded.

    I have a coworker who seems to learn a new language, for fun, every year or so…

    Yeah, there are such people. I don’t understand where they take the time from, or the motivation for the effort.

    (1) I would extend this quote to include “and random words”: “English doesn’t borrow from other languages. English follows other languages down dark alleys, knocks them over and goes through their pockets for loose grammar.” ― James Nicoll

    English has actually borrowed rather little grammar. Lots and lots of words, however.

    So it’s Heiterkeit and Kindheit and every native speaker knows which to use when, but nobody can tell you why.

    I think only -heit is ever used with nouns like Kind, never with adjectives like heiter. Both are used with adjectives, though, and it doesn’t help you to know that -keit is historically from -igheit with the adjective ending -ig (shows up in English as -y), because heiter never had an -ig

    Once I read an actual scientific paper on the use of -s- between the components of compound nouns. The authors found there is no rule, though one seems to be slowly emerging…

    The pearl lab gave me an idea. Let’s strand the climate change denialists on the arctic ice

    Oh, I forgot…

    Forget the Northeast Passage and the Northwest Passage. The North Passage, straight through the North Pole, will become accessible to icebreakers by 2040 if everything keeps going as it does now, and normals freighters will be able to use the Northwest Passage. Map from the paper via German science news service; blue = passable for normal freighters, red = passable for icebreakers.

    While speaking of the Arctic, that seems to be where the camels come from. Camels in the strict sense, not including llamas and the like.


    There are… numbers in there… that… *headdesk*


    Oh, badgersdaughter, I’m sorry about Ink. Best wishes for the sweet kitty.

    From me, too.

    Hello internet peoples!

    *sees Pteryxx*
    *pokes Pteryxx*
    *waves excitedly at everyone*

    *seconds everything and sends it right back*

  31. David Marjanović says

    CBC has the predictable poll up asking “Do you think the provincial government’s new anti-bullying bill unfairly infringes on religious freedom?” Unfortunately, it’s currently got 53% ‘Yes’ responses. Anybody willing/able to help?

    Poll can be found at the end of this article: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/story/2013/02/25/mb-anti-bullying-infringing-religious-freedoms-winnipeg.html

    Almost unchanged:

    Yes 52.96%
    No 47.04%

    Reminds me of a humourous anecdotal story

    In German, that’s part of a series of jokes about “the wide-mouth frog”; in this one, he doesn’t want to look quite as wide-mouthed in a photo, is basically told to round his lips, and… fails to get the point rather epically.

    Reminds me of the time my parents thought someone was getting horribly killed out under the hedge in the front yard. Didn’t take them long to discover two porcupines, going at it quite lustily…

    … o_O Porcupines? In Latvia? Do you mean hedgehogs? Porcupines are rodents related to guinea pigs.

    (Scroll down that page for some very cute pictures.)

    Scott’s efforts were not just a failure, they were a black comedy of failure and waste. About 2% of the welfare applicants tested positive. The state of Florida had to reimburse 98% of the applicants for drug tests, (yes, Florida Republicans thought it was a good idea to make welfare applicants pay for drug testing, assuming that the state could reimburse the few innocents and keep all the nasty addicts off the welfare rolls.)

    Florida also had to pay to administer the tests and the whole thing ended up being Big Costly Inefficient Government. Oh, yeah, and Florida got into a wee bit of trouble with the courts.

    *gleeful cackling*

    Did Republicans learn anything from the Florida fiasco? No.

    *headdesk* How utterly unsurprising.

    And to make this legal (legal only in the twisted minds of Republicans), applicants would have to sign “a waiver of constitutional rights.”



    LOL! Somebody seems not to have understood what a constitution is!

    A new short-term budget bill introduced on Monday by House Republicans includes a bizarre provision banning federal funding to anti-poverty group ACORN, despite the fact that the group has already been stripped of federal funding — and has been defunct for nearly three years.


    I stood on a mountaintop and looked out over the sea. A thousand feet below me, eagles soared on thermals. Wind blew through my hair and I felt dizzy. I fell to my knees and cried. I didn’t realize it at the time, but this “white-light” experience was the moment I realized there was no God — I had been struck atheist….

    *pretends being able to raise one eyebrow* Fascinating.

    However, the next paragraph is:

    “To be accurate and appropriately less dramatic, my atheist conversion was far from immediate. It was a process that began when I got sober about five years earlier.”

    And the last one:

    “My current sponsor often reminds me of the difference between an elder statesman and a bleeding deacon, the latter vociferously fighting for what is right while the former quietly lives what is right. We all want to be Yodas, but most of us are just young Sywalkers. I still find it difficult to pass up a good fight. Today, I try simply to walk the walk and be the example of my experience. And when I pray — and I do still pray — I remind myself that if there is no God, I am certainly not him, so let me stop acting like it.”

    Oh, holy crap. A Republican daddy has gotten his shorts in such a bunch over the imagined promiscuity of his teenaged daughter, that he wants to pass more, yes MORE, anti-woman, anti-sex, anti-divorce bills.

    What a creep!

    I’m gonna put a big pot of *hugs* on the back burner, to keep ‘em warm for when Patricia can drop in. So that’s what y’all will be smelling.

    :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

    Does your counsellor know how bad it is?

    Would surprise me. And I don’t think it’s easy to convey either.

    Appropriate for anyone who needs a booster of Xtreme Cute

    :-o Bookmarked!


    That looks tasty!

    Uhm. You’re dealing with a lot of information here

    All seconded.

    I don’t know how to ride a bike.

    *culture shock*

    I don’t have anyone to go with me and tell me I’m not buying absolute shit

    What Improbable Joe said.



    Ooooffff! Oh well, I wanted to spend some time on the floor anyway.

    Hugpile !!

    That’s a brilliant way of feminist snark being taken seriously.

    *nodnod* :-)

    I got the tacit approval of my wife’s mother when she hit me with a plush snake dog toy.

    :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

    So, when someone is being especially annoying/frustrating, they have a whole mortgage. With varying rates of interest.

    Fucking awesome!

    the queer alphabet soup out here

    Has been spelled QUILTBAG.

    Whenever my daughter sees a picture of Jesus, she identifies him as “White Jesus.”

    Page won.

    Count me among the people who would very much like to have you somewhere close in meatspace.



    That is an awesome kids’ story and truly a great perspective on the (end of the) world.

    + 1

  32. David Marjanović says

    Part 1 of 1

    …Man. I should really go home. :-) There were 4 lights 2 parts.

  33. says

    Pharm scigrad:
    (Note-not making excuses here)
    Having a better understanding of sexism, privilege, patriarchy, gender essentialism, gender expression and kyriarchy than I did years ago, I can see how homonormativity exists is the gay community. The problem may be in part due to rigid gender roles. For many heterosexuals, those who express themselves in a sexual manner that isn’t “normal” upsets their concept of the roles of men and women. Many homosexuals have accepted that there is another dimension to human sexuality, but growing up in our (sorry for the US-centrism here, but I cannot speak to anything in other countries) society, they can’t remove the influence of gender essentialist ideas. So adding another dimension to human sexuality or gender expression upsets THAT cart. Upsetting these roles asks us to question our very identities and when we have so much invested in our identity, who wants to risk overturning something we may not like.

    *also note, much of this is speculation. I could be way off base here. I have been known to be wrong. Once or twice. Last year :-)

  34. rq says

    Nope, I meant porcupines. I grew up in Canada, which is where my parents caught them (no doubt) fornicating. ;)
    As for hedgehogs, the saying in Latvian goes that They do it carefully.

    I have just discovered that rockstars lends itself well to quiet muttering under the breath. Win!

  35. cicely (No further comment.) says

    I knew that Monday had to be Up To No Good!
    I am plague-ridden. My Intestinals have no Fortitude.
    :( :(

    Cerberus, your rant was awesome.


    *hugs* for mildlymagnificent, and mr.

    *cookie* for Giliell.


    Today’s church-expence giggle, as found after an actually funny picture appeared on Facebook newsfeed.

    “Catholic Simon Williams told us, “So what have I been eating all these years? It’s not bloody horse is it?””
    A lot would be explained, if it was bloody Horse….
    Just sayin’. Like you weren’t thinking that I was thinking it. Or like I didn’t know that you were thinking that I was thinking it. Or that you didn’t know, that I know, that you were thinking that I was thinking it. Or….

    *pouncehug* for JAL.

    Ogvorbis: *hugs*. A mantra in your Times of Depression—“Depression Lies, and Dipshit Failed!” His intentions for you crashed and burned. His mindset failed to take root in your tasssty braiiinz.

    Portia, Pernicious Purveyor of Pestilent Peas: *ppppppppbbbt!*
    And also, *hugs*.
    And here’s to a promising start for New Fiancee. *raising glass*

    Next Page!!!

  36. Beatrice says

    I don’t know how to ride a bike.

    *culture shock*

    Nothing to do with culture. Most people my age here know how to ride a bike. I just never learned.

  37. pharm scigrad says

    Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:
    I would be very much inclined to agree with you that in some places great strides have been made, such that gays and lesbians have achieved greater acceptance in the community at large. I would also agree that any other sort of alternative sexuality or gender identity is generally treated with much less acceptance and much more fear and stigma. The day I will feel that the queer community has really made an important leap forward is the day I see rainbow pride flags with the interlinked male and female emblems. I see the male/male and female/female at clubs and bars all the time, but what I wouldn’t give to see one with all three, or one with the trans* symbol.
    Work is the scariest place to be out. Even the loudest queers I know are quieter at work. Some are silent, some so silent you would think they weren’t queer. It breaks my heart how much of ourselves so many of us swallow to stay alive.

  38. rq says

    Also, David, I think my wide-mouthed frog story is of German origin (since you mention it as part of a series), considering I heard the story from my dad, who PhD’d in Germany (way back in the emerging science of fibre-optics, if you must).

  39. pharm scigrad says

    Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire: Mmmmmm… lovely.
    Girl Scout cookie assortment, incoming!

  40. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    U for Uncertain? I’m not sure.

    *hugs* back :)

    pharm scigrad:
    Thanks for the tasty cookies! (And you can just call me Portia, unless you particularly enjoy the subsequent silliness in my nym).

  41. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    That is NOT nice thing to say about Girl Scouts! ;)

    My favorite non-word insult is “chud.” S made it up in college and we use it liberally, though we have no set definition for it. “She’s so self-absorbed, what a chud.” “He totally condescended to me because I’m a woman. Feckin’ chud.”

  42. rq says

    I do not usually translate things that have me on the verge of tears. This would be an exception. :(

  43. David Marjanović says

    I grew up in Canada

    Oh. :-)

    (Did not know there was a ‘U’ in there)

    I forgot what it stands for; but I’m sure I learned it here on Pharyngula.

  44. says

    I did a quick search and turned up nothing on the meaning of the ‘U’, but I am inclined to think it is ‘undecided’. That matches with ‘Q’-uestioning…to a point. Undecided carries an unspoken timetable (ex. “I am undecided about my major”) IMO, while ‘questioning’ is something one can do as long as one deems necessary. Is that a needlessly fine distinction? Hmmm, maybe the ‘U’ is for ‘uncertain’.
    As I think about it more, ‘undecided’ also implies an awareness of one’s choices/options, while ‘questioning’ reaches more broadly. One can ‘question’ their gender identity or sexuality, but be unaware of their options.

    David M- look what you’ve done! I am having to think. On my day off! Curse you and your little dog too!

  45. says

    Pharm Scigrad

    Then again, in those queer spaces, couples viewed as opposite gender are viewed as straight or heterosexual, regardless; forcing someone to choose between the queer and non-queer communities on the basis of the gender presentation of their current partner seems to me to be… divisive.

    I’ve been on both ends of that one. One of the things is that straight people will often see things that way, and will perceive an environment to be more ‘their’ environment the more mixed-sex couples are present. I don’t have a perfect answer either, I’m afraid. Tony also has a point about there being some gender essentaliism and binary sexuality type stuff going on too.

  46. pharm scigrad says

    I usually copy/paste, so it is easy enough – and I must say I enjoy feminist snark wherever I find it. ;) I usually go by PSG, but apparently that moniker was not allowed by our fearless overlord for some reason… so I spell it out here. Oh, and my pleasure. :)
    David Marjanović:
    I’ve also heard BLT, catchy but obviously less inclusive than QUILTBAG. According to the Wikipedia, U is undecided – then again, I’ve been led astray by the wikipedia before…
    Seriously, don’t knock the powdered lemon cookies until you try them. I was très disappointed when I learned the old lemon cookies had been replaced but bought a box of the new ones because hope springs eternal… they were different, but sometimes my friend, different is *good*

  47. Parrowing says

    I knew I couldn’t be the only one around here with ASMR, carlie & rq :) … though I have been overstimulating myself lately by watching so many ASMR videos. It’s worth it to be able to fall asleep, though.


    I’ve been feeling horrible lately and I feel like I shouldn’t talk about it because then people will get annoyed by me and wish I would go away. I’m still new here and I only post on the Lounge so I wouldn’t blame anyone for not giving a shit about me. I don’t think I’m worth giving a shit about, so why would anyone else? Sorry for posting.

  48. cicely (No further comment.) says

    Whenever my daughter sees a picture of Jesus, she identifies him as “White Jesus.”

    Bwah haw haw haw haw!


    A good word, and worthy of wide distribution.

    English has actually borrowed rather little grammar. Lots and lots of words, however.

    Easily amended:
    “English doesn’t borrow from other languages. English follows other languages down dark alleys, knocks them over and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.” ― James Nicoll, with an assist.

  49. says

    From John’s link,
    ” Chud-
    Used to describe someone who is repulsively unattractive. Alternately, someone who is amateurish or unsuccessful in any given field.”

    Definitely not using the first definition. There is something about the bolded one I like, with the caveat that it shouldn’t be used to shame anyone for being unskilled in a field (though if one is trying to offer an uninformed opinion about a field, such as AGW, it may be applicable) Rather, my use of it would be “when it comes to social justice and awareness of why slurs are offensive, the pitters are hyperskeptic chuds” or “You’re doing skepticism wrong, you chud”.

  50. says

    pharm scigrad:
    Oh, I have tried them before. They are good, but when I discovered the other ones (now I recall the better-they are lemon creme covered cookies) I fell in love. Though come to think of it, I discovered them at a Dunkin Donuts in Orlando last year, not here in Pensacola. I forgot that some cookies are regional.
    Speaking of different, but good foods, despite working at my current job for a few months, I only recently learned that we serve Cali-Mex food, not Tex-Mex…and the two are totes not the same. I like both, but I lean towards the Cali-Mex. Especially our non chunky salsa. And our smashed, not refried beans. And our barely fried menu items.
    I was informed yesterday that Pensacola Beach ranks as the #1 beach in the US…on FOX News’ list of best beaches.
    Yeah, I know.

  51. pharm scigrad says

    You’re probably right about the gender identities coming into play here too. There is so much that comes into this, because there are very few places where being queer is treated as the unremarkable thing it should be. People are amazingly, ridiculously, wonderfully complicated creatures.
    I also think, for a time, the mere existance of poly/bisexuals was a threat to gays and lesbians who were being told they could be straight if they just “tried harder” – a divide within set up from without.
    Glad to hear that you’ve made it through this year with a clean record so far, and yet still humble. ;)
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy :
    Now that, I hadn’t considered. Who is more likely to assume heterosexuality is a mixed-couples grouping? Of course you’re right… and therein lies the problem. We all may be encultured to make the assumption, but queers are less likely to do so. Then, how does the enviroment change when an actual minority perceives itself to be in the majority. Wow. I’m going to have to chew on that for a while. Thanks.

  52. Beatrice says


    Sorry for posting.

    Don’t be! I like you, other people like you too. That includes reading your comments when you’re down and caring about your pain. You are worth being cared for and listened to.

  53. rq says

    This place is for venting. Vent away! I will not wish you away, at any rate – and I give a shit about you (Who will make me garlic cheesecake for my potential trip to Stockholm??? /whiiiiine)
    *hugs* and Portia has some lovely tea going around.

  54. rq says

    Also, my above attempt at comforting you comes across as distinctly self-centred, but I wanted to say I look forward to your posts and I value your input, of any kind. Please accept some more *hugs*.

  55. says

    Attention: Parrowing
    You need to vent? This space is perfect for that.
    You need to express frustration or sorrow? This is the place for that.
    Crying at 2 a.m. and need sympathetic shoulders? Come to The Lounge, where we are always open, always care and will always offer support and not judge.
    Please never doubt that this is a place you are always welcomed ENCOURAGED, to let off steam.
    We give a shit here.

  56. pharm scigrad says

    Forgive me Tony, if someone had taken away my lemon creme covered cookies, I would have yelled out lots worse than rockstar…

  57. cicely (No further comment.) says

    I’ve been feeling horrible lately and I feel like I shouldn’t talk about it because then people will get annoyed by me and wish I would go away. I’m still new here and I only post on the Lounge so I wouldn’t blame anyone for not giving a shit about me. I don’t think I’m worth giving a shit about, so why would anyone else? Sorry for posting.

    *assuming a Stern Look*
    Parrowing, you stop that kinda talk right now!
    1) This is the [Lounge], where we share (among other things) our miseries and misfortunes. Why should we exclude you?
    2) If you’re aiming to be an annoyance, you’re going to have to work harder than that. Put your back into it! Let rip with some racist-homophobic-creationist-antifeminist slurs, or something.
    3) So, you’re (relatively) new. So what? We were all new, sometime, and if there was a vote taken to un-include newcomers, I missed the memo, and didn’t come to the meeting.
    4) I mostly post in the [Lounge]—I find the company congenial (and that includes you, btw!), and of a caliber I just can’t get in Meatspace. They’ll have to chase me away with a big, BIG stick! In the [Lounge]-infesting-nuisance department, I rank you. They’ll have to come for me long before they come for you—at which point, you’ve got a few minutes head start, easy. Trust me, you’ll know The Time Has Come by the ruckus I’ll make.
    5) “Not giving a shit” about you? Ludicrous. I, for one, give many shits about you! :)
    6) You are worthy, worthy, worthy.
    7) *bzzzt* Inappropriate apology! Two drink penalty! And you must bake *cookies* for everyone!
    and also, *hugs*. Maybe with *waffles*.
    Mmmmm…pecan waffles with maple (REAL maple) syrup….

  58. says

    *hugs* No apologies are needed; everyone needs support when they’re having problems. You are both cared about here and worth caring about in general.
    AFAIK it’s:
    That is what Nicoll originally said; possibly someone misquoted earlier?
    You’re welcome.

  59. pharm scigrad says

    I’m a long time lurker, but this is my third thread commenting, so trust me when I say there is plenty of grog, hugs, tea, cookies/cake, sledgehammers, and whathaveyou to go around. For long timers and newbies alike. I’ve got hugs and Girl Scout cookies loaded to my USB if you want some. :)

  60. rq says

    No fair, cicely, discussing waffles and maple syrup at this hour. Nobody but me’s going to be grateful at the ruckus I’ll start causing in the kitchen, if you make me any hungrier!

    PS If they ever come for you, let me know – I’ll send over a Horse or Pony or an army to help you out. Sweet cicely, indeed…

  61. cicely (No further comment.) says

    But, rq…it’ll be the Horses that they’ll be sending after me—but it will be for nought. Because “wild Horses couldn’t drag me away!”
    And if I must suffer Crispy Golden Brown Pecan Waffles With Maple Syrup Deprivation, then I insist on company in my misery.
    (Sweet cicely…covered in maple syrup….)

  62. says

    Speaking of venting, we confirmed today (caught one, saw a second) that there are mice under our sink. I am told that peppermint oil round the entry hole is good encouragement that they should take themselves elsewhere; Anyone have any experience with it?

  63. rq says

    I’ll send the little tame ponies, then.
    Waffles. *tplrplrplrplrplrplrplr* I miss my maple syrup more (home-made, too – the season’s about to be opened back home).

    Unfortunately, Computer is doing its Overheating Dance (must be the pea-popsicles, or something…), and while I have lots to do, I fear the never-ending cycle of On/Off will drive me to even more Horses. Rockstars!!!
    So I bid good night, albeit reluctantly.
    *giantroundofhugs* with a sub-set specially for you, Parrowing!

  64. opposablethumbs says

    Ogvorbis, “he failed” – YES! I am so happy to see you write that. Hugs for the ongoing difficulty and painfulness. I am glad you’re alive. You are part of what makes this place the exceptionally great place it is.
    Yay for your snark success, Portia!
    And yay and hugs for people like Tony and JAL and Jadehawk and Cerberus and hell, all of youse lot who are so often brave and generous and funny and giving even though you’ve been through/are going through so much (and that is not meant to imply that people “ought” always to be brave and etc. Everybody has times when they cannot be those things; I am in awe of you lot because those things are part of you).

  65. Pteryxx says

    More or less threadrupt like usual –

    heya David M, heya StarStuff, good to see you both.

    JAL, sorry about the pets and damn I wish I were close enough to have offered you a ride. I’m taking it to heart though: whenever I volunteer for any vets or free spay/neuter/vaccine clinics around here, I’ll make a point of asking if they can provide any rides and volunteer my car to do so.

    re QUILTBAG, there’s also GSM… “Gender and Sexual Minorities” which at least is compact and rather less hilarious. Mostly I just use “queer” to mean the whole soup though, too. (for one thing I can *remember* the word!)

  66. cicely (No further comment.) says

    I’ll send the little tame ponies, then.

    “Falabellas can also be used as guide animals due to their small size and easy trainability.”
    “Guide animals”. To guide people precisely Where? I think that their Equine nature makes the answer obvious.
    In any case, I can’t imagine that Horse droppings (no matter how small they may be!) go over any better in a house or a grocery store, than they do in a parade.

  67. cicely (No further comment.) says

    (Imagine little pea-sized-and-shaped droppings lurking in your pot pie. Problem?)

  68. glodson says

    To everyone:

    If you need to vent, I’ll gladly read. Really. Like many have said, let loose.

    I know I’m new here as well, and pretty much just an idiot with an opinion, but I don’t mind. I don’t reply to everyone that vents, because I know I’m an idiot and my words fail me. But I still read, and I still hope for the best and want to show support.

    If you vent, I’ll do my best to be more supportive, both with words or any other means as they become available. This community seems like it is full of intelligent and, more importantly, kind people. Don’t feel bad if you need a shoulder to lean on. We all do sometimes.

    And I’ll post cute stories about my kid in the hopes this makes people smile, if just a little.

  69. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I nth the sentiments directed your way. You are a great voice here, and you are most certainly cared about. I know that feel, and I can understand how hard it is to shake. So many hugs. I’m gonna have cupcakes soon, if you’d like one. Have some tea in the meantime, like rq says.

    Tony and John:
    Huh, guess I could have googled it. I do like it as a general purpose insult and will likely keep using it as such. Thanks for the edification :)

    Tony and cicely:
    S and my table came in second place at trivia night last Friday. Because I knew that Gregor Mendel experimented with…peas. :D There was a horse question too, but I didn’t know that one. Nobody did.

    Going to trivia again this Saturday, woohoo! Being a know it all for a good cause is a win win :D

    Horseshit, I say! Horseshit!



    Got my eggs and a yummy dinner to boot. My aunt did do a little mock-dramatics that I knew of the engagement before she did, but she was still pleased to have been “asked.” :)
    The wedding will be immediate family and grandparents, only, so I’m not invited, but oh well. Having my little part in their story is enough for me.

    They said they want to see me more often, and I want to see them more too (they live three miles away and are my closest family in the area). They have so much family around so often that they expect everyone to invite themselves over, and I hate to do that. She told me to do it any time, I am never imposing when I go there. : ) I like feeling loved.

  70. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    You can, WMDKitty. You can do it. It won’t be half as scary as you think.

    When I’m nervous about something, S tells me: “Easiest thing you’ll do all day.”
    If that helps, take that thought with you :)

    You can do it. You have a cheerleading squad here when you need it.

  71. Cannabinaceae says

    Quick drive-by mouse story (sorry, no other advice than “hire professionals” if they are driving you mad, which they were us; Neighbor had just gotten a cat and lost mice while we had simultaneously acquired mice. Coincidence? I think not!):

    We had been reluctantly feeding a mouse colony for some time. There was a little hole way back in the countertop corner where some of them would come and go. Among other portals.

    Anyway, I had come home from work and was setting about doing some kind of kitchen-y thing, but kept hearing “that sound”. Sort of a “scree scree scree”. Hunting about in a murderous rage, I finally stumbled upon a Very Fat Mouse, who, upon my lumbering into the kitchen, perhaps remembered an old bolt-hole of yore and scrambled there to escape. However, so fat now was Mousie, that fitting through former escape hole was no longer possible.

    Mousie redoubled escape efforts and “scree” noises, while I calmed down and – I must say, predatorially and gleefully – grasped some tongs, gently reached over and plucked said beastie away from said bolt-hole. There’s no need to go into what happened next, other than afterwards I was known to chuckle in my “evil-mad-scientist” chuckle quite frequently for a while.

  72. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says


    ….you are undefeated at taking a week to notice my gravatar. ;)

  73. cicely (No further comment.) says

    I can see Portia’s gravatar, but resolve it into anything that makes sense, I cannot.
    I see a lot of green, so I assume that peas—with or without Gregor Mendel—are involved.

  74. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    It’s the pea ice cream that theophontes brought me via octocopter :D

  75. says

    Well… drinking wine. Had to drink something. My main monitor got smashed, bunch of busted pixels. My wife’s computer crashed and wouldn’t boot up. She’s running a live version of Fedora off an old USB drive while I try to figure out how to fix it. Saturday with the company and dinner plans? My wife is working Saturday, so I’m doing EVERYTHING without any help from her at all. She’s going to come home, take a nap, and then get up and socialize with her friend and her friend’s husband. I’ll be cooking, of course.

  76. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    May I get a little bit out of the doghouse by offering up a fresh baked cinnamon roll cupcake, cicely? Buttercream frosting is in the works.

  77. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Aw, Joe, that sucks. One of the things I would always rage about with S is his proclivity for committing us to or planning things that affected me without consulting me. That you have to do all the work is that much worse. I’m sorry : ( I hope you can at least have some fun with the cooking.

  78. cicely (No further comment.) says

    iJoe, you have my sympathies. SUCK also likes company, which is why it comes in waves.

    Portia, I’ve never met a cinnamon roll cupcake, but the concept intrigues me…and it’s hard to go wrong with buttercream frosting!

  79. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I barely let one of these cool down before chowing down. And otg….they are melt-in-your-mouth amazing. The cinnamon and sugar has caramelized just a touch where it touched the liner….heaven.

    Have three, cicely.

  80. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Just when we thought Glee couldn’t get any more tired/worn out….they pull out the Cyrano de Bergerac schtick.

  81. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Is there any cleaning she can do in advance? Any cooking prep?

  82. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Well, hugs and cupcakes for you. I’m sorry it’s such a rough patch.

  83. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    You have yourself a peace treaty, my Shoopy friend!


    …I’ve googled shoop and there are various meanings. Which one is your intended?

  84. carlie says

    I am told that peppermint oil round the entry hole is good encouragement that they should take themselves elsewhere; Anyone have any experience with it?

    In my experience, the only thing you can do is kill them. Nothing dissuades them for long, and unless you live trap and release them several miles away, they will find their way back.

    I don’t have the energy to do much more than skim – I see there’s lots of hurt and I wish comfort on everyone. I have a pile of virtual blankets here if anyone wants to build a fort. No Pillowtown v. Blanketsburgh fights, though.

  85. says


    A short time ago, Nepenthe mentioned Shoop as the singular of Sheep , and I liked the sound of it.
    Plus, you know how many of PZ’s detractors consider the Horde his *sheep*? Well I figured I’d play that up. With no irony, of course.
    Then there’s the added irony when you consider that many believers have been called sheep, just blindly following a preacher. I thought that would be another funny layer to add to my nym.
    It makes sense to my mind, not sure if it does for anyone.

  86. pharm scigrad says

    *hugs* for you IJoe. Perhaps something stronger than tea is on tap?
    I suggest you spend some time over in the fort with me and carlie. I’m bringing lots of pillows – for snuggling purposes only, of course.

  87. says

    apparently I’m radiating anxiety, because when I went to my appointment at the clinic today, all the nurses were asking me “are you ok? you look a bit stressed”

    Which made this appointment easier, since I didn’t have to convince anyone that my moods decided to do a 180.

    So I got a note excusing me for the last 2 weeks of missed classes, and my meds are being switched. We shall see if this will help any.

  88. Pteryxx says

    *leaves hugs for Joe*

    seconding Tony re Miriam’s article. I thought she made a really important point at the end: (bolds mine)

    MRAs do rightfully point out that non-male feminists don’t spend a lot of time addressing uniquely “male” issues. While I think that addressing power differentials in society will eventually bring about equality for everyone, I do think that these issues are important and should be discussed.

    But women can’t take leadership of efforts to address problems that they have never experienced. I can’t tell people what it’s like to be a male rape victim–or how to support male rape victims–because I am not one and can never be one. Men, however, can use the “toolbox” of feminism–examining power differentials, paying attention to intersectionality, critiquing pop culture, etc.–to advocate for their own causes. That’s why we need feminist men who will be allies to non-male feminists while also leading initiatives to support other men, reduce violence against men, and eradicate sexism for everyone.

    Around here we keep saying how important it is for men to speak out to other men who are being sexist towards women, and it is; but male-identified allies also can be learning from feminism how to support other men who are survivors. As far as I know there’s almost no networking that isn’t infested with MRAs, even among military survivors.

  89. Owlmirror says

    I would extend this quote to include “and random words”: “English doesn’t borrow from other languages. English follows other languages down dark alleys, knocks them over and goes through their pockets for loose grammar.” ― James Nicoll

    Those who mangle the Nicoll quote will be visited by the night-mare of pea-dantry. Woe betide you!

    The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don’t just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary.
    James D. Nicoll

  90. says

    Trigger Warning:

    It Wasn’t Bad Sex, It Wasn’t a Mistake, ‘It Was Rape’: Film Grapples with Society’s Dark Side

    Jennifer Baumgardner’s latest project, a 60-minute documentary film called It Was Rape, opens with a warning: If the movie serves as an emotional trigger, “please take care of yourself, even if it means leaving the theater.” The reason for this heads-up is that sexual violation is an abysmally common crime. According to a 2011 report issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, one in six US women and one in seven US men have been raped at least once. These numbers make the film’s admonition especially poignant since it is likely that audiences everywhere will include people for whom rape is not a theoretical issue, but a lived reality.

  91. says

    JadehawkYay for a note! It should at least take a little bit of the pressure off. One of these days, remind me to tell you about the time I got a “no stress” doctor’s note when I was in the Marines… I can laugh now.

    pharm scigrad, thanks… and I’ve switched to wine and I’m shouting at my wife on and off. Yeah, it is a lovely night.

  92. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I think I mentioned before that one of my personal heroes announced she had Lou Gehrig’s disease. She passed away at the age of 86 yesterday morning. S emailed me before I even woke up, knowing I’d want to know right away. I have a beloved professor who was close friends with her, so I emailed her. Her grief has made mine both easier and harder. That professor just emailed me two new articles about her that are behind a paywall. So now I’m processing again. Thanks for letting me do it here.

    She made time for a lowly little peon like me, one-on-one and speaking at events I organized. Dawn Clark Netsch will be missed.

    Can I have some wine, Joe? : /

  93. says

    *hugs* sounds like a pisser of an evening. Hope things look up soon.
    That’s good news about the classes, at least. Hopefully the new meds will help.
    Nope, no news on the job front, unfortunately.
    So, it looks like the FCC is trying to implement universal wifi coverage, which would be nifty. Of course, the usual suspects are whinging about the sanctity of profit and the usual bullshit.

  94. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Thank, Joe, I appreciate it. I’ll take a nip of white.

    I’m glad you don’t have to entertain this weekend.

  95. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I am. Damn. I saw offer of wine and figured it was the original offerer. My brain took a shortcut, not my heart! I’m sorry guys. I’m already drunk on melatonin :) (But not as think as you drunk I am).

  96. pharm scigrad says

    If your paywall is of the academic journal variety, I can probably help with that. If you want, just drop me the links, or send them to my nym (all one word) at the gmail.
    IJoe: Eep.
    Hope the dinner delay brings things down to a more managable simmer.

  97. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    That is so kind of you, PSG. I was unclear: she sent them via email, full-text, so that I could access them. I think she has special copies because she’s quoted in them. Again, thank you so much. Your kindness helps me feel better.

  98. says

    Well, I did it.

    I went to group.

    And I survived.

    It’s a women’s group, for obvious reasons, and it feels good to know that I’m not the only one experiencing… this. The numbness, the anger, the sadness… it’s a normal response.

  99. says

    Just so’s youse all know, there are faaaaaaaaaaar worse people that I could be mixed up with than Improbable Joe, whom I hold in high regard. I find no insult in that mixup. He is one of the good ones.

  100. pharm scigrad says

    I’m relieved to know you have a copy Portia. Some things just don’t belong behind an academic paywall. I’m glad the offer helped. *hugs*

  101. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Hugs back atcha, PSG.

    I just don’t want my friends to think I’m not paying attention when they’re talking! :)

  102. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    And now I’m going to crash. Night all, thanks again for the moral support and distraction.

    Pile o’ hugs for the taking.


  103. says

    G’night Portia!

    PSG, I hope the same thing. It certainly takes the pressure off.

    Thanks Tony, you’re a hell of a person yourself.

    WMDKitty, I’m glad for and proud of you for going to group. I’m so happy that it was an overall positive experience for you, and I know how hard it was for you to take that step.

  104. says

    Arms length hugs (me, still with the flu) for those that need them.

    I too oddly got stuck wondering why no one was contributing to the lounge for several hours, having missed the page rollover. Boy, did I feel stupid.

    Sorry Owlmirror, I couldn’t remember the exact words (just the intent) of the Nicoll quote, so I did done “The Google” and cut-and-pasted from the highest ranked page with what looked like a quote. I had thought the quote was about words/vocabulary and not grammar, so I should have looked further afield when that one looked, ah, funky.

    apparently I’m radiating anxiety, because when I went to my appointment at the clinic today, all the nurses were asking me “are you ok? you look a bit stressed”

    I had one of those days a few weeks ago (though probably not to the same extent), when one of the grad students ask why I looked like I was about to punch someone. Actually, I wasn’t feeling particularly angry, but was definitely low on spoons and a bit anxious about something. So, apparently, I can’t send out non-verbal language right.

    Spousal rant: After 24 years of marriage (and a number of years of togetherness before that) I still can’t convince my wife not to use the phrasing “Would you like to do X?” when she really mean “Please, do X“. She knows my answer is going to be “no”, but that if re-phrased I’ll do the requested task (generally), but she still says it. Even a simple change to “Would you do X?” would be an improvement. We’ve had that discussion many times…

  105. chigau (違う) says

    attempting catch-up

    I’ve missed you (and MDP).

    re: bikes
    I call those one-speed, sit upright, heavy-as-hell bicycles “Japanese house-wife bikes”.
    ’cause that’s how they go in Tokyo

    yay! for your abuser’s Failure!
    that was a skim of page 1
    I’ll never make it.

  106. says

    The phrasing of requests thing, I feel ya. My personal pet peeve there is, “You need to” phrasing. Considering the shit I’ve been through, with The Jackass and his control-freaky ways (seriously, denying someone their dietary needs?), there’s no need to explain just why that particular phrasing grinds my gears. Mom… Mom tends to forget, and just… “You need to do this”, and I’m sitting there going, “don’t RAGE at Mom, don’t RAGE at Mom, don’t RAGE at Mom” because (duh) she doesn’t deserve to have that directed at her, and it’s not her fault I’m this fucked up.

    Also, um… I can happily go the rest of my life without hearing “While you’re down there…” I don’t think I need to clarify that one, just think about where my head level is (I’m seated) next to a standing six-foot man. Yeah. Ick.

  107. rq says

    Good morning!
    It’s cold again. I suppose yesterday was spring, summer and fall, all in one.

    *hugs* for Portia
    *high-five* for Joe (and a huge sigh of relief)
    *scritches* for WMDKitty (and a huge cheer for surviving the first group session)
    *hugs* for Tony and anyone else who wants!

    This morning, I also offer *cream&sugar* with *coffee* on the side, for those who prefer the former as a vehicle for the latter.
    I had something else to say, but now I’ve forgotten what it was.

  108. rq says

    [rant] Gross. Does anyone have any special feelings about International Women’s Day? Here, it’s all about Give her flowers! and Do these things, and she just won’t say no in bed! and All women want is a man to shower them with gifts! Or the sentiment about getting a new household appliance to make her smile, because shiny dishes!!!! are every woman’s liberating dream. Whatever happened to Take the kids for an evening and give her a night off!, instead of Pamper her at the spa! (Admittedly, this last one wouldn’t be so bad if it occurred on a regular basis and not as a part of some mass-marketing corporate crap, although personally I would replace ‘spa’ with ‘bookstore’.) Ech. [/rant]
    It’s pissing me off, just a little bit*. I’m going to have to stop reading the local news until Friday.

    *This may be an understatement.

  109. pharm scigrad says

    [snark] You mean, the day that is supposed to be devoted to “celebrating the economic, political, and social achievements of women past, present, and future” has been commercialized by the megatheocorporatocracy?!? I’m *shocked* – shocked I say. So we are encouraged to buy the women in our lives trite tropes rather than have a parade or festival or do something significant. Taking something with *Women’s* in the name seriously is just much too much to expect, eh? [/snark]

  110. says

    I got my car windows tinted today. Friggin’ heat wave here had been turning the thing into a microwave oven every day, so I finally had enough. Picked up the car after work, looks awesome. Finally 99% UV protection and 60% heat reflection! But wait, what’s this? What do you mean, it’s illegal to tint the windscreen?
    So now I’ve got a tinted car, except the big fat glaring hole through which the sun and heat still enter the damned cabin, the windshield. Gah!

  111. rq says

    pharm scigrad
    Thank you for removing my rose-coloured glasses. Thankyouthankyouthankyou! I was flying too high up in those feathery clouds. /more snark
    I’m not surprised, but I’m disappointed every year. And all the nice articles about women and their achievements get drowned out by ‘But feminism causes our poor demography!’ or ‘Once women got out of the kitchen, it’s impossible to get them back, and woman’s duty is to make sammiches for menfolk (also children)!’
    For example, there’s a rather nice article about Russia sending a woman to space later this year. Out of (so far) 16 or so comments, two are about sandwiches/kitchens on the space station, one advises that a gynecologist and psychologist should be sent up with her, one reminds that women are bad luck on a ship (and thus will Ruin Everything), several nominate alternative candidates (Putin’s wife, local female politicians, etc.)… I just… ONE comment just says, what difference does it make woman or man?
    And supposedly this country is high on the non-sexism scale, and women are celebrated every day! (This, of course, means that they get flowers once (or twice, if *tee hee* the boyfriend/husband manages to remember her birthday) a year, annnnd… hmm. Oh, right, new appliances and spa-promises!)

    I’d love a festival, or at least a symposium, about women’s history and achievements (even just focussing on this country), as an educational tool. Maybe… maybe it’s worth thinking about, for next year. pharm scigrad, this is worth thinking about. Now to think about it and not lose my nerve.

  112. says

    Good morning

    Sounds like you suffer from a typical housewife depression.

    Yay WMDKitty

    Good to hear. Hope the medication switch helps

    This place is full of rants

    No, not exactly. That’s what mother’s day and Valentine’s day are for…

  113. pharm scigrad says

    As I love to say rq, sarcasm is just one more free service I offer! Occasionally, also with snark.
    Ah, those Russians, sending women to space instead of astronauts… who would, of course, be men – which is why we have to define this astronaut as a woman, so you know she’s not a “real astronaut.” *yay* implicit bias.
    I think I have a bingo game we could play in the comments section of that article if you’re bored/want to work off some of that ragey…

    The real shame of the whole thing is that there are a number of very good events being offered globally in celebration of IWD linky – perhaps just not in every place, and certainly not as widely publicized as one might like. A sort of farmer’s market-style festival with local crafts and foods for sale, historical information on women’s achievements (I would be all about some Rosie the Riveter swag), booths with local organizations recruiting new members, a place for spawn to frollic and be entertained… Yeah, that would be something in the spirit of IWD. It’s a matter of thinking about all of this and not blowing a lobe. Easier said than done.

    *Trigger Warning*
    Link to a pre-US election post on rape fatigue – a good one in general when you’re worried about rage burnout.
    Here’s hoping I didn’t bork all my links…

  114. says

    rq @653:
    You have my utmost sympathy. Days like that (or Valentines Day) are annoying for a couple of reasons:
    1- lets do this extra special thing for her on this specific day rather than frequently through the year
    2- lets not pay attention to what women want. Instead, lets give them things we _think_ they want. Nevermind the idea of listening to them to find out what they want

  115. opposablethumbs says

    Sympathies to Portia. I’m glad you had real time with your hero, and I’m sorry she’s gone.
    Glad dinner was postponed, Joe. Hope that when it happens it will be at a better moment, and that it will be enjoyable instead of a chore.
    The one I hate (and hear a lot of) is “we have to buy”. Even if it is something it would be handy for the kids to have. Because I am the one who does the money, such as it is, and I am not good at doing the money and I worry a lot about the money. Just once in a while I’d like to hear “hey we could save a bit by doing X” or “we don’t really need Y, we could manage with Z” and I’m not that enthusiastic about ALWAYS being the person who has to say no, we can’t afford that. “We have to buy” flash-freezes my trapezius muscles and makes me feel instantly and simultaneously guilty (for not being a good provider), frightened (about the money), defensive (now I have to try and argue against this. Shit.) and angry (again this!?!?!?). The daft thing is, if instead of “we have to buy” I was hearing “it would be great if we could get” or “do you think we could get” I think it might feel a lot less threatening (I don’t mean threatening-person, I mean threatening-situation).
    Jadehawk, that sounds like tentatively good news. Glad you made it to your appointment and that you got a little immediate help with the missed classes situation, and I hope the new meds help. Also yay for WMDKitty making it to group.

  116. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says


    JAL, sorry about the pets and damn I wish I were close enough to have offered you a ride. I’m taking it to heart though: whenever I volunteer for any vets or free spay/neuter/vaccine clinics around here, I’ll make a point of asking if they can provide any rides and volunteer my car to do so.

    That’s so awesome of you to do that! I can’t actually think of a place that gives/offers transportation for that. There’s a mobile clinic that is out like once a month but considering how messed up our bus system is they could be close and still be 3 buses away. And for those you have to be out super early to get in line anyways.

    Yesterday was just cruel. The poor kitty didn’t get any food the night before in preparation for the surgery he wouldn’t have, then I freaked Little One out accidentally. I asked her to find Tiger’s collar since he’s always getting it off and damn if I can find it. I said he needed to go to the vet to get fixed so we had to have his collar. Her response? “What’s wrong with him? What needs to be fixed? Is he coming back?” Oh, poor baby. Even after I explained what I meant and tried soothing her, she gave me the sideways “Uh huh, suuuuuure” look. She said she’d help find the collar but instead hid out in the closet holding and petting the kitty.

    It was cute and heartwarming and I felt like crap for making her upset. I didn’t think about saying “fixed”. I can never remember which surgery is for which gender, no matter how many times I’ve been told and looked it up. For some reason that little fact just won’t stick in my head. I just say fixed so I don’t look like an idiot if I get it wrong. *sigh*

    In other news, I read a paranormal Urban fantasy book with a transgender werewolf character that doesn’t get treated like shit. Well, the bad guys do because they are assholes. However, the new leader makes sure everyone knows to not give the said transgender wolf any shit and to refer to them as woman like they identify. I just wanted to hug them for that. The book isn’t perfect or anything (No, seriously there are some problems. Don’t hate me if you don’t like it) but it is so nice to see a good, likeable positive portrayal of a transgender person I wanted to cry. It also wasn’t known right away that the character was transgender and didn’t make it a whole “OMG DRAMA” reveal moment. Characters who knew just started talking about it (the bad guys being assholes) and that’s it. When the moment comes up with a good guy making an asshole comment, the protagonist tell him right the fuck off. And the dude doesn’t make an issue of it. No apology but the story was near the end so the dialogue got cut off.

    Trigger warning though because the bad guys really target and try to kill the transgender character for being trans.

    It’s The Trouble With Fate by Leigh Evans.

  117. carlie says

    *tw eating disorders*

    Well, this is fucking depressing.

    When Miss Seven arrived home from school I talked to her about her diet note.

    Turns out she learned about diets from one of her seven-year-old friends who was on one.

    So together we chatted about diets and beautiful healthy bodies and the gift that they are.

    I am not naive. I know this will not be the last time I talk about food and weight and bodies with my daughter. I am just ultra pissed that it had to start when she was seven.

  118. says

    Personal wooooo-hooo
    I think I just had a major “click” moment during therapy.
    I have this massive problem with anxiety (I shy away from doing things, especially when they involve contacting people and am easily discouraged) and this massive amount of bad conscience which I call the monkey brain.
    Well, my therapist played “connect the dots” by asking “what’s it good for? How and when did it help you?” And it made “click”. Whenever I have to engage people and contact them because there’s somethig I want/need/have to ask there is a chance that people might say no, reject my request and there might be conflict. Sure, in most cases (and whenever I manage to do things that’s what reality tells me) there will be a positive answer, people, especially in college, are supportive and try to help me.
    But as a child all conflicts were solved by mym mum giving me silent treatment and rejecting me until I crawled back and admitted that it was my fault and I was wrong and everything (and it would be my fault that she had to give me the silent treatment, too, because I was stubborn, you know, because it’s not like she was the adult in the situation). So, I started to avoid the conflicts and just supplied the nastiness in my head. And I projected that behaviour onto other relationships in my life.
    I behaved like somebody in an abusive relationship while being married to a wonderful non-abusive guy. I don’t call people because they could say “no” and my perspective on the probability of rejection and the effects are totally screwed, too. And I take the rejection personal, I’m the little kid again whose mummy doesn’t talk to her and who is unloved and unwanted instead of an adult who engages with other adults on the level of small things.
    To realize this is so big, I can hardly tell you.

    No. You can absolutely request that your mum avoids certain phrases.
    The way you talk about her doesn’t sound like she wants to give you shit, so in her case I would want to know. Because seriously, people who care don’t want to accidentially hurt their loved ones. It doesn’t matter if the word that hurts is “duck”. Seriously, if one of my children asked me to never use the word “duck” again because it triggers them I’d be more than happy to oblige. Because it doesn’t matter if they’re the ones who are “fucked up”. I love them and I wouldn’t want to cause harm to them.

    Have you ever told her how you feel about that phrase?
    Mr. has his little quirks that drive me up the wall, too and it would lead to ugly situations when I was hurt by what he said and he didn’t realize because he never noticed how this sounded to me.
    It got better after I told him why I hate certain phrases/ways to say things.
    Remember, women are brought up never to phrase requests directly. We mustn’t say “Honey, please do X”

  119. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says


    Sympathies to Portia. I’m glad you had real time with your hero, and I’m sorry she’s gone.

    Thank you, I am too. There’ll be a memorial next month, I think. I hope I can make it to Chicago for it.

    That’s a very sweet little one you have. Hard to understand at that age that it Must Be Done. I hop you don’t feel guilty for long though, it’s probably something she’ll laugh about later. Take joy in her compassion. :)

    Congrats on the breakthrough! I have had those moments (probably should have written them down, because no examples come to mind) in therapy, and it just…changes the perspective on anything. Self awareness was always my biggest goal of getting therapy, because knowing those things about oneself is an amazing tool at building healthier, happier interactions. Congrats again, I’m happy for you.

    Seconding Giliell’s advice about mom interactions. Could work if your mom is genuinely wanting to not hurt you and you can get up the emotional energy.

  120. mildlymagnificent says

    The MRI machine didn’t get to display the glory of mrmagnificent’s brain and other things today. He was all set up, happily transported to the really weird queueing system down in radiography – and as soon as they put him on the super flat surface, his broken ribs gave him a nasty jolt. So it’s MRI tomorrow with bonus analgesia in advance. It’s a mystery to me, but why do hospitals think that paracetamol is a worthwhile painkiller for people with noteworthy injuries? They tried to get me to take them years ago – and I couldn’t see the point. Got nowhere near any impact on the pain and if I’m to risk my liver function I’d like it to be for a good reason.

    The brain injury people had a word with #2daughter today. Because mr m was so “high functioning” before his cardiac/hypoxic event, they really, honestly feel that he’s really suitable for super duper rehab at the wondrous Hampstead facility. Hampstead!!! It’s about 35 km from here and the trip takes nearly an hour on a good day. So he hit the 40% jackpot surviving the experience. I get to drive even further for maybe a couple of months. At least they’ll be supplying any equipment he might need at home – like a chair in the shower. We’ll see what else he needs. I suspect that he won’t be all that terribly affected in general – but when he gets tired or immediately when he wakes will need some careful management.

    And it turns out that it’s not just his short term memory that’s been affected, he’s been wanting to go outside …. to have a cigarette. The girls have never seen him smoke because he gave up 30 years ago when #2 was on the way. Looks like like I’ll have to shift to patches before he comes home because we don’t want packets of smokes and lighters around the place because he’ll probably light up.

  121. Ogvorbis says

    Ah, Friday. I love me some Fridays.

    Wife and I went out for a light dinner and visited the casino (we both came out about even). When we got home, Boy was home early (his Russian History class was cancelled) and the first words out of his mouth were: “Don’t kill me.”

    One of his friends at school will be spending six months in Italy and she was looking for a home for her pet: a ten-year-old red slider. So we now have a large fresh-water turtle in our menagerie.

    Last night was okay. No scout dreams (one 9/11 dream (but compared to the terror of the scout dreams, those have become old hat)).

    A mantra in your Times of Depression—”Depression Lies, and Dipshit Failed!”

    Yep, depression lies. And I keep telling myself he failed. Sometimes I believe it.

    “he failed” – YES!

    Now if I can just convince myself . . .
    Hugs for the ongoing difficulty and painfulness. I am glad you’re alive.

    Yeah, the suicidal thoughts are, right now, a nuissance. I plan to stay alive. I’m far more annoying when I am alive.


    re: QUILTBAG:

    A few years ago, I was travelling from one fire in Northern California to a different fire in Oregon. I stopped in a little bitty Oregon town for lunch. On the menu was a bacon, lettuce, tomato and guacamole sandwich — on the menu as a GLBT. I ordered it and then asked about the name of the sandwich and it turned out that the owner’s sons were both gay and, though they’d left the small town, they were very happy with their boyfriends up in Seattle. Kind of a nice surprise considering the reputation of intollerance that most small towns have earned.

    pretty much just an idiot with an opinion,

    Hey, watch it. That’s my routine!

    Welcome, glodson.

    SUCK also likes company,

    One of the things I love about this community is that when things suck, or people are feeling depressed, the community supports the person without reinforcing or feeding off or feeding into the depression or suckitude.

    which is why it comes in waves.

    Is this that pilling thing again?

    Plus, you know how many of PZ’s detractors consider the Horde his *sheep*?

    And I wish to seven levels of purple pluperfect hell that the detractariat would decide, once and for all, whether we are PZed’s sockpuppets, or his sheep, or the echo chamber.

  122. Louis says

    Has anyone but me noticed that The Wilkins has stopped blogging and will let Evolving Thoughts die a slow death?

    Does anyone but me consider this a tragedy?


  123. thumper1990 says

    @Carlie #665

    Well that’s put me in a bad mood. The post itself is depressing, but the fact she seems to have attracted every priviledged arseclown with no idea what an eating disorder is to the comments section, all now merrily telling her how she’s overreacting, is downright infuriating.

  124. thumper1990 says

    Some Christian troll ‘nymed douglasshaver has shown up in the Michael Shermer Thread with an incredibly shit false equivalency. It could just be a drive-by, but OTOH it could turn out to be incredibly entertaining. Here’s hoping.

  125. blf says


    Ouch! That hurt … Her Penginistianess made a detour and ate the cheese you kindly hugged.

    I didn’t get a chance to ask her why she suspects there’s some Lancre Blue on the loose. (Not Horace, by the way. If it was Horace, there’d be no doubts…)

    And the English men’s cricket team is off to a grand start and, unless New Zealand makes an error (like not showing up), should loose in a sufficiently silly fashion to keep the cider happy.

  126. carlie says

    mildlymagnificent – yay for the help! Could you try mr on an e-cig? That might satisfy whatever craving he’s having to smoke.

    I didn’t see the comments on that post until after I posted it. :(

  127. pharm scigrad says

    thunk, acolyte of metatextuality:
    Ha. Silly me, reading malfunction and blaming engineers. But don’t worry we’re not sexist… cuz we said so. Harhar. m-|
    It is far too early in the day to be replacing my irony meter.
    I’m sorry, it’s probably quite mean, but I really did laugh out loud. Guess you still need one of those foldable sunblockers for your parked car.

  128. blf says

    PZed’s sockpuppets, or his sheep, or the echo chamber.

    An on-line poll is clearly required:

    PZ Myers’s mindless nauseating hoard are:

     ○  All of the above.
     ○  Sockpuppets.
     ○  Sheep.
     ○  An echo chamber.
     ○  Peas.
     ○  All of the above.
     ○  Answer number 9.
     ○  Teh Gay moolsin commie moonbat evilionistia dogmatic fascist athiests.

  129. Ogvorbis says


    You forgot:

    * Penguins
    * 42
    * A hyper-intelligent shade of the colour blue
    * Leopard seals

    All possible other options?

  130. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    One in every 17 people followed in the study died. However, those eating more than 160g of processed meat a day – roughly two sausages and a slice of bacon – were 44% more likely to die over a typical follow-up time of 12.7 years than those eating about 20g.

    Well, there’s your problem.

  131. blf says

    Bad news for you baconites!

    Nah. Neither horses nor peas are involved. Nothing to worry about.

    Which reminds me: Since she’s traveling, I haven’t been able to ask the mildly deranged penguin what the real story is behind the horse-sold-as-beef scandal in Europe. Well, Ok, she did mention something about Daleks as she was eating the hugged cheese…

  132. says

    Well, time to start “repairing” my wife’s computer.

    A good hint for those of you without the funding for a new computer or even computer repairs, and also not a lot of computer know-how, is to create a bootable USB drive. I used UNetbootin because it does all of the work. It is a lot easier to narrow down your problems if you can eliminate most of the hardware right off the bat. Plus, if it is your hard drive that’s bad, sometimes you can use a bootable USB drive to dig around your hard drive and save some of the data.

    In this instance, I think I’m just got some corrupted Windows boot files to repair, so I THINK I can use a Windows 7 disc to repair those files

  133. Beatrice says

    Yeah, yeah, and lightning struck St. Peter’s just after the pope resigned. Signs! Signs everywhere!

  134. glodson says

    Yeah, yeah, and lightning struck St. Peter’s just after the pope resigned. Signs! Signs everywhere!

    I knew it! Thor is real!

    And Thor is a Tesla fan!

  135. says

    Moments of Mormon Madness, wherein mormons in the USA rip off Canadian mormons big time.

    The LD$ Church in the USA maintains a veil of secrecy and scam-ness due, in part, to US laws that don’t require a lot of detail when reporting to the IRS or to state governments. This is not true in other countries. We have, as a result, much better documentation for what the cult does with their money in, for example, the United Kingdom and Canada.

    Here’s what they are doing in Canada: they are raking in tithing dollars and sending 99% of those Canadian tithing dollars to Brigham Young University in Utah.

    LD$ Inc. took in a total of $103,984,696 from Cdn. Mormons, and without telling them, send 99% of the funds ($102.9M) to its Brigham Young University in the USA.

    The quote above is from an ex-mormon posting on another forum.

    Backup for this claim can be found on the Canada Revenue Agency page that lists all of the qualified donees of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Canada.

  136. thumper1990 says

    @Nick Gotts #681

    It concluded diets high in processed meats were linked to cardiovascular disease, cancer and early deaths.

    Old news, and something I could have told you before it ever made the news.

    Most days, my breakfast consists of a cereal bar eaten at my desk, mainly due to time constraints but also due to the fact that, while I may be a pig-loving Baconite, I am aware that you can’t eat fried, processed meat every day and expect to live to the age of a hundred. Bacon and eggs are a weekend treat for curing the hangover. However, if you weigh up the options and decide you preferr bacon to old age, you crack on :) Jeebus knows it’s a hard choice sometimes.

  137. Ogvorbis says

    Also, I’ve installed Fedora on it, so we’ll see what we shall see.

    Cowboy Hat is much cooler than Fedora.

  138. thumper1990 says

    *Gets the massive involuntary giggles from reading the Ogvorbis and Improbable Joe double-act and dribble-sprays water all over the keyboard in a very unattractive maner*

    …thanks guys.

  139. opposablethumbs says

    Parrowing? What cicely said way back at #567!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I also rank you as a (mostly) Lounge-infesting type person and I also think you sound really nice and good company. My computer did something weird and I missed seeing a whole bunch of comments, including yours, or I would so have said something earlier. You are absolutely worth caring about, dammit!
    Giliell, yay for that breakthrough in understanding what is going on. You make me realise that despite all the inevitable issues and Stuff I was very lucky. And realise that although I think I fuck up significantly as a parent I’m glad I tell my kids I love them, OFTEN. I hope that this proves to be a big step forward for you!

    I plan to stay alive. I’m far more annoying when I am alive.

    Good. I approve most emphatically. And I really enjoy reading (or reading about) some of your forays into advanced-level, high-octane annoying-of-those-who-bloody-well-deserve-it (subsets: sexists, fundies, libertarians, assorted douchehats).

  140. Ogvorbis says

    Hush, Oggie, I’m doing important COMPUTER THINGS here.

    Sorry. I thought a little humour might help. My bad. I’ll fuck myself out.

  141. Beatrice says

    Ogvorbis’ last didn’t sound like a joke any more, so I’ll just add a (helpful?) little comment that Joe is just joking.

  142. UnknownEric is just a spudboy, looking for a quantum tomato. says

    Mark Burnett says ‘weird things happened’ on ‘The Bible’ set

    Like people believing in a dude building a boat and taking two of each kind of animal on it, except he totally forgot the unicorns.

  143. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    So I’ve been away for a few days, because OMGBUSY.

    Also, I had 3 cysts chopped off. Woohoo!

    (The incision sites ache a bit. And my hair is bloody.)

  144. pharm scigrad says

    I was liking my pre- and post-op painkillers (highly effective!) except for the whole thing where they completely rob me of any semblance of an appetite. Now that I am unsupervised – “well enough” to cut back on the meds – I go and forget to eat for 24 hours, leaving me unsure which of these things is causing my fuzzy brain. I am both annoyed that I have to eat and that I don’t know if eating will actually help with the fuzziness. Don’t mind the ‘nym, I (personally) could do without the drugs… *sigh*

  145. says

    Also, I’ve installed Fedora on it, so we’ll see what we shall see.

    The other day I had a “fuck this buggy Ubuntu shit” moment and downloaded some of the currently top-ranked distros on Distrowatch to try them out, among them Fedora 18, but I gave up on the whole rpm thing very quickly. Now happily running Mint 14, which to my surprise installed flawlessly and is even handling my exotic wireless adapter without a glitch. So far, so good.

  146. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Hooray! (?) for losing cysts!


    Went to court this morning. Withdrew from case (nbd). Judge bemoans that he won’t see my “lovely face” as much.

    Had lunch with male attorneys. Complained of judge’s sexism. They nodded along, but now I’m self conscious that I look like a feminist nag. Sigh. Can’t even cut myself a break when I know I’m totally right.

  147. Beatrice says


    I was a feminist nag (and an anti-fat shaming nag and a gay supporting nag) at my temp job last year. They still invite me for beer occasionally :)

  148. glodson says

    I’m sorry Portia.

    Here’s hoping the male attorneys get it. I will admit that I wouldn’t have gotten it a few months ago.

    But it is… insulting and a bit creepy to see a man in his position of power say something like that. It isn’t the worst thing in the world, but I can see how it would make you uncomfortable. And worse, you really can’t be snarky back.

    At least, not without a possible consequence you would be better off not facing down the road.

  149. says

    you are totally in the right, though.
    I’ve seriously considered Mint, but I just can’t be bothered to set everything back up the way I like it again.

    Feeling kind of drained, currently. D is still (understandably) on the edge of suicidal due to the situation with her daughter and her ex, while L and I are about her only support network; her ‘friends’ are taking the exes side, her family are telling her she needs Jesus, etc. So she’s clinging to L especially, as she has a much longer standing relationship with him than I do, and also they’re dating, and furthermore she has serious issues regarding cis men (three guesses why…). He’s nearly burnt out because he’s been trying to provide emotional support to both of us, especially in light of my just having lost my job, which leaves everyone constantly depressed, without energy, and somewhat irritable. What with the chronic bad finances too, it’s fun fun fun.</vent>

  150. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Thanks : )That helps. I did also include the fact that my first experience with this judge was when I was an intern and my supervising attorney made a joke about me being a stripper (I busted my knee clumsily dancing, guess that makes pole jokes hillllaarrrrious) in the courtroom, and this judge laughed along. One guy at lunch said “So, he laughed, guilty by association?” I said, “Yes.” and moved on.

    That’s exactly right. This judge makes a habit of this sort of little comment, or superficially innocuous assumption, and there’s nothing I can do about it. Except vent to understanding friends :)

    Thank you for the validation.
    I’m really sorry things are so tough right now. *hugs* galore.

  151. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    This brought a smile to my face: doing the calculations for a real estate closing, and the total closing costs are $666 :D


  152. says

    Tony, Giliell,
    No, it’s just the phrase that bugs me. And it comes up at least monthly, and is discussed why I object to it: no, I don’t want to do it; but I will. A representative case often comes up at night, she’s ready to head to bed but one of us has to go through the routine of sorting out our nightly
    pills (flaxseed/fish oil, prilosec, glucosamine, ibuprofin, niacin, etc…, yeah, we’re old). She’ll say “Would you like to do the pills“, and what she means is “I’m tired, could you please do the pills [implied: right now]“. Part of it is my spectrum-y nature — you’re asking me a question and I’m giving a literal answer to that question. Often my answer takes the form of “no, but I’ll do it anyway“.

    I not super-mad about it, it’s just that we keep having the same discussion… We have a good relationship in general, so there’s no yelling or anything about this… just a minor venting on my part.

  153. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Maybe if I didn’t sound like a twelve year old girl on the phone douchey mortgage agents wouldn’t feel free to chew me out for non-existent problems. (The lady on the customer service line he told me to call was very helpful and said I’d have what I needed within an hour! (He said he needed a damn week. (Fucker)))

    When S or I say something like that, phrased as a question, we usually give literal answers. Sometimes it’s “Yeah, I can do that.” but often it’s “No, but I’ll do it anyway.” Usually makes the asker laugh at themselves because they either didn’t realize what they were doing or know they deserve the literal answer for trying to couch their request like that. Does she respond well to the literal answer?

  154. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Nine minutes. It took her nine minutes to get it to me.

  155. David Marjanović says

    David M- look what you’ve done! I am having to think. On my day off! Curse you and your little dog too!

    Good that I don’t have a dog, then. I’m not even a dog person. :-)

    Sorry for posting.

    *pounce* *hug* *squeeze* ^_^ ^_^ ^_^ ^_^ ^_^

    *calming manatees* *chocolate* *happiness tea*

    *more hugs* :-)

    I’m trying to squeeze the depression out of you, because “sorry for posting” is exactly the kind of thing that depression always says. It’s diagnostic.


    Now some link-dumping:

    I wanted to send you all here for a discussion (in chat form) about open access, specifically the recent requirement that all research funded by the US must be made openly accessible within 12 months. But soon after it began, it was over. It lasted just an hour. WTF?

    Petition against Paul Ryan’s “budget” “plan”.

    Science remains institutionally sexist. Despite some progress, women scientists are still paid less, promoted less frequently, win fewer grants and are more likely to leave research than similarly qualified men. This special issue of Nature takes a hard look at the gender gap — from bench to boardroom — and at what is being done to close it.” Boldface added. I hope everyone has access.

    Suction feeding! An active and diverse topic in biomechanics! Here’s how giant salamanders do it: video, paper. To interpret the video, keep in mind that salamanders have one toothrow in the upper jaw and another on the palate… but the teeth aren’t doing anything in the video.

    That was 5 links, see you later.

  156. Cannabinaceae says

    I eat roughly two sausages a week. I’d eat more, but I’ve known for a long time that “processed meats” aren’t the best kind of thing to eat all the time. Oh, and sometimes I will use 8oz of andouille in a vat (5qt*) of glop**, when I’m making freezer portions of my Simple Peasant Fare.

    But the reason I’m here is, I came over from the cookie thread because I was reminded of my own “spousal-cooking-fire” sort of thing. The former poodle*** was absolutely terrified of the smoke alarm, and whenever it went off would either retreat to the farthest corner of the basement or insist on being let outside, where she would retreat to the farthest corner of the yard, shivering uncontrollably****.

    Anyway, we make popcorn – by frying the kernels in oil until they pop – all the time. I’m very good at it, having been brought up in a corn-popping household with popcorn legends going back to the time of ancestors long dead by the time I showed up. Anyway, W.U. is not very good at it, and routinely creates clouds of smoke when trying to pop, setting off the alarms.

    Anyway, it got to the point where, whenever W.U. would start making popcorn, well before any alarms went off, Daisy would proleptically slink off to the farthest corner of the basement, or, most often, insist on being let out, to go off and start shivering in advance.

    Poorest of the poodlahs.

    *yes, I know that’s not quite a “vat” to some people. Sometimes I go overboard when buying ingredients and have to use the 5gal device (also used for brining turkeys and cooking pasta). Now that’s a vat.

    **for example, when making gumbo.

    ***Daisy; I look at her picture on my desk and reminisce sadly and nostalgically. So different from the new poodle (Toby) and yet so similar in some ways.

    ****Toby doesn’t seem to care about the fire alarm.

  157. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    Oh! Dontpanic!

    Wanted to acknowledge that your cleverly disguised package arrived the other day. :)

  158. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    So, I totally was loading my gel and a co-worker glanced over and said, “Why are you humming “We Are The World”?”

    PCR, when you need to detect mutation…
    PCR, when you need to recombine.
    PCR, when you need to find out who the daddy is…
    PCR, when you need to solve the crime!

    (note: I am doing none of those)

  159. Beatrice says


    Maybe if I didn’t sound like a twelve year old girl on the phone

    We can be stupid kiddy voice-sisters!

  160. rq says

    On mobile device because computer seems to be fucked (corrupt Windows files?). Translations in progress most likely down the chute, also those due tomorrow. FUCK. Sorry for being ‘rupt, I think I will metaphorically go kill somethibg, like some aging computer hardware.

    pharm scigrad, hpoefully we can play some bingo tomorrow, if computer is resurrected. ROCKSTARS.

    Good night, *hugs&scritches* and a better day tomorrow.

    PS Tony, mobile devices for the Lounge are crap, I’m glad you got computer back.

  161. Beatrice says


    Was that planned? I mean, going to Costa Rica sounds great. Is it great?
    Have fun! *panic*


    I won’t go to bed until I do my evening workout. I don’t want to do my evening workout because I’m tired and then I’ll have to shower and I’ll never go to bed.

    Yeah, stalling will work.

  162. cicely (No further comment.) says

    The Good, Racist People by Ta-Nehisi Coates.

    *hugs* for Portia. More *wine*?

    Dinner is put off a week. BossNurse realizes that we’re both too emotionally and physically fragile this week to have people in our house.

    That must be a huge load off your mind, iJoe! Very happy for you.

    *high-fives paws with WMDKitty*

    *hugs* for Giliell, and congrats on the breakthrough.
    :) :)

    I tried one of the Nacho Cheese Dorito Tacos they had a while back…and was completely unimpressed. I don’t plan to waste time/money taste-testing the Cool Ranch Dorito Taco.


    True, that. When The Husband has to do COMPUTER THINGS, it is time for cicely to leave the room.
    ‘Cause when the air is cussed that blue, it becomes too sharp to breathe. Like Winter’s Icy Blasts, only less friendly.

    *hugs* for Dalillama, with overs to share with your Meatspace support group.

    Nine minutes. It took her nine minutes to get it to me.

    That is impressively-shorter than a week!

    in 30 minutes, I’ll be leaving for Costa Rica


    Slow, deep breaths; and maybe see if you can borrow some of David’s calming manatees.
    And have a good&safe trip.

  163. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Yes, wine, please and thank you.

    Work is being awful today.
    Wouldn’t be half so miserable if the problems weren’t my fault. : (

  164. David Marjanović says

    Petition to House Republicans to not destroy Medicare.

    “In less than one week, the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee will vote on universal background checks for all gun purchases. This is a critical moment for our campaign to reduce gun violence in the United States and your Senator needs to hear from you today.

    Fill out the form on this page, your phone will ring, and you’ll be connected with your Senator.”

    Petition to conservative congresscritters: “Birth control is a personal, medical decision, and it’s not up to politicians or employers to dictate how women use it. Republicans need to stop trying to block women’s access to birth control.”

    Petition to Congress to close tax loopholes. Comes with an example: “Despite Facebook reporting profits of over $1.1 billion in 2012, the company is expected to pay no federal or state income taxes. In fact, Facebook will receive net tax refunds totaling $429 million, because tax deductions on executive stock options can be written off as salary deductions.”


    *hugs for mildlymagnificent and Ogvorbis and Dalillama and Giliell*

    Yay for Esteleth!

    You can, WMDKitty. You can do it.

    Yes, you can! Yes, you can! Yes, you can!

    Nepenthe mentioned Shoop as the singular of Sheep

    *squee* Umlaut! ^_^

    Those who mangle the Nicoll quote will be visited by the night-mare of pea-dantry.

    So full of win! :-)

    Trigger warning:

    one in six US women and one in seven US men have been raped at least once

    One in seven men?!?

    Jadehawk Yay for a note! It should at least take a little bit of the pressure off.


    You mean, the day that is supposed to be devoted to “celebrating the economic, political, and social achievements of women past, present, and future” has been commercialized by the megatheocorporatocracy?!?

    Funnily enough, communism started this one. International Women’s Day is still a national holiday in Russia, and the traditional thing to do is… to shower the women in one’s life with flowers and the like, as described in comment 661.

    not nearly as depressing as the comments O.o

    Most of those are depressing. And on top of that, there are all the etymological fallacies… *headdesk*

    But as a child all conflicts were solved by mym mum giving me silent treatment and rejecting me until I crawled back and admitted that it was my fault and I was wrong and everything

    …That sounds really, really scary.

    Is this that pilling thing again?


    But it is… insulting and a bit creepy to see a man in his position of power say something like that.


    PCR, when you need to


    in 30 minutes, I’ll be leaving for Costa Rica


    *hug* Awesome. You can do it.

    *all the calming manatees* (but not in your luggage! Ack!)

    (BTW, cicely, carlie introduced us to them.)

    I won’t go to bed until I do my evening workout.

    It’s so late that I’ll miss the last bus as usual, so I’ll walk home from the subway for sheer lack of alternatives.

  165. says

    Was that planned? I mean, going to Costa Rica sounds great. Is it great?

    it was planned (it’s a field course), and it’s great. but, depression + anxiety + change of meds while in a foreign country + field course = panic

  166. David Marjanović says

    …Oh crap. I took so long to write this that Jadehawk is already gone.

  167. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Best of luck getting through it, Jadehawk. I hope you have a good experience.

    I forgot to respond to your Shoop-splanation! I love it :)

  168. cicely (No further comment.) says

    But, David, I’m pretty sure that you maintain a breeding program for them, you hand them around so freely! The only other option is that carlie is hogging all of her manatees to herself, and that I refuse to believe!

  169. David Marjanović says


    Or maybe I steal them from the East Zoo of Berlin. They have a large supply. ^_^

  170. says


    Wanted to acknowledge that your cleverly disguised package arrived the other day. :)

    Ooop, meant to warn you about that (using the alternate return address to keep some anonymity). Sorry to raise your hopes and then dash them. Glad you got it safe and sound.

    Does she respond well to the literal answer?

    Well, sometimes in good humor, sometimes she just gets pissed off. I only vented because she gave me the pissed off response the night before. Most of our interactions involve humorous, gentle-teasing/semi-snarking (not mean-like, or aggressive) exchanges; I guess this is a bit odd since it seems to confuse some of our friends, but it seems to work for us.

    Middle-age, white, innocuous-looking guy privilege: got off with just a warning when pulled over for doing 58mph in a 45 zone last night. Bet that doesn’t happen to everyone. Admittedly, he also mentioned my clean record, so that was a legitimate thing in my favor.

  171. says

    Impending Unemployment Update-

    Had the “follow-up meeting” with Evil HR Director from my conversation with my boss about how I understand that the institution is firing me for being transgender and that’s one level of terrible, but the whole “asking me to suck at my job” thing (not phrased like that, because I’m not an idiot) where the students were being punished to get at me was really not cool.

    I began by pointing out that I have been called “the best lab instructor they’ve ever seen at [Name of the Institution Deleted to Protect the Guilty]” multiple times now. That I’ve been called this by more than one regularly visiting school’s teachers, chaperones, and kids (all separately and without prompting from each other) as well as by other staff members in different departments and by regular volunteers. That my lab style has been seen as praiseworthy and a gold standard for the department when it was believed institutionally that I was the golden boy (emphasis on boy) and that my class was chosen to highlight our department when it was time for our new CEO to look our way and confirm the great things being said about us.

    I told her that this wasn’t to brag, but to set the context by which I was noting that I understand that the institution is trying to fire me for being transgender. She wanted to stop there and basically swim in denying that, but I politely informed her that the purpose of bringing this up was that what I really cared about was making sure the children are no longer so directly punished in the cross-fire of removing one single transgender employee.

    Once I stated that, we had a long conversation about how I could possibly think that, blah blah blah, to which I noted the way my actions were praise-worthy and given express verbal permission before skirt and then were seen as disciplinary-worthy afterwards. That my teaching style hasn’t changed and in fact my external praises have only increased in the number of people stating that my work is the best ever (and some teachers actually told me that they were planning to come back more times than they were normally going to looking for me specifically (that list is standing at 3 separate schools last I checked)), yet the institution’s reactions completely flopped. That the disciplinary actions weren’t being applied evenly (to which she tried to be all smug and say “well how do you know that” to which I responded “because we talk to each other” to which she tried to argue that the current rules are totally evenly applied and there’s procedure and everything, so yeah, it must of been evenly done then, to which I had to note that what I was talking about was before those new procedures even existed) and rules that had been one thing when last left verbally were suddenly being changed in suspicious time frames without any general meetings regarding a shift in protocol or enforcement.

    She tried to argue that the sucking at my job requests seemed to be about a “philosophical disagreement” between me and my boss about how to engage the students (I guess I “philosophically” want to not suck and am “disagreeing” that I should stop doing the the thing that’s been more engaging, more praised by teachers, and used to be a source of great pride for the department before I started wearing my calf-length black skirts). And wanted to just focus on the “trans* discrimination part”.

    I also pointed out that I’ve shown the emails to other trans* individuals who have been fired for being transgender and that they agreed that it’s trans* discrimination. I also noted how my boss let it slip that she is receiving pressure from other managers regarding my whole gender identity deal.

    There was also some discussion about my hair that had been part of the email and how that was enacted because it was “unprofessional”. Yes, hair styles I had previously gotten direct permission from my former awesome boss and the Big Boss to use in non-wet-labs and which just so happen to be more feminine hairstyles that make me look more like a girl than a boy in drag are “unprofessional” and were part of a “whole unprofessional look” that the HR director stated I had by her visual inspection on the day in question. And I just happen to look rather male in the hair-style that is the remaining acceptable style. The likelihood of this, even if it was innocent, not being the result of at least unconscious biases is nearly zilch.

    There was a lot about “what’s your specific examples” and “is it just the disciplinary thing”. There was also some shifting to try and make it seem like my complaints about changes in internal institutional treatment was all just on my Big Boss, which I countered a little bit, because even if it was, it’s clearly not just on her (especially as my Big Boss let slip a sense of a larger scale effort in building the complaints from multiple departments).

    When I talked about institutional treatment she also did this weird thing where she pretended not to understand what institutional meant or how attitudes and actions could be done on the part of the institution in general, which I’m betting has a lot to do with her being the face of the company’s interactions with us serfs, I mean, employees.

    Overall, I tried to remain professional, even-tempered and state the facts and emphasize the part I felt was most important (stop fucking with my kids to try and fuck with me, you bastards). It’s the part I returned to at the end.

    I don’t know what’s the next step. There was a lot of emphasis on checking my “facts” and a weird moment where she claimed that something in the email was brought up in the last meeting we were all together at and she can confirm it because she was there (I have no recollection whatsoever of it happening) as well as a lot of emphasis on “are you sure your style hasn’t changed recently”.

    My guess is now that I’ve called them on their shit for the purposes of protecting the students, they’re going to move to argue that I’m a vindictive, can’t take criticism (both of these were brought up during the meeting as the reason that my Big Boss just had to start immediately involving the HR director in every single conversation with me) punk, who makes false accusation because I’m a lying liar who lies (oh HAI there rape victims, yeah, I think it looks pretty similar too). I’m also suspecting that questioning my perception of reality is going to increase and it’s going to be hard because I know the stress is already making me a little scatter-brained (I keep forgetting to put on my necklaces in the morning and so forth).

    Which is why these Updates are going to be even more important for me personally and why I’m being a bit more anal and rambly than usual so I can try and put down things as they happen and hold onto them if the hard screws start coming back.

    I think I’m going to regret, more than I was before, informing them that I am on to their little game, but I couldn’t resist once they started targeting my kids.

    Speaking of which, today, the school I was teaching, all the kids started doing that “are you X” thing that I usually reward by slipping into the specific European accent or silly persona they assumed in order to create a guaranteed engagement point that gets the kids invested in the class and feeling like they have agency and control and thus want to care more. Yeah, you can see where this is going. Accents were specifically on the verboeten list (I never ventured outside pan-European so it would never be offensive racially), so I had to just sort of promise that I might be these various Xs later. I tried to slip a brief moment of rewarding accents into the beginning, but couldn’t teach the whole class like that (like I normally would and which normally would be a huge source of engagement with the kids and make it truly theirs) because of the chance of repercussions. I still did the best I could in all the other restrictions, but it hurt me that the kids were so requesting X and I couldn’t give them all the X they deserved. I did my best and as I brought them up to their next museum thing, one of the chaperones congratulated me specifically on how fun I made the class how fun I made learning.

    The last meeting I had with my Big Boss she said specifically that I shouldn’t be an entertainment figure. That we didn’t need to be edutainment, but rather that we should be professional and that it’s more important to be that for the children to associate science with seriousness. A) My entertaining persona was the reason I was hired to the department, was widely praised before it was decided that I needed to go, and is similar to other great instructors we’ve had and still have. B) We are specifically in the business of edutainment. Making California Content Standards fun for students, allowing them to “learn through play” (it’s on the company’s value statement and I pointed this and the aforementioned praise-then, but critique now bits when talking about this particular discrepancy with the Evil HR Director, I believe this prompted the “philosophical disagreement line”). C) Those kids don’t need another authority figure in their life. Another stuffy shirt looking down on them and telling them that science is serious business that serious (i.e. white) people do and that some poor little Title 1 kids are just to “unserious” and “unprofessional” to truly care about science and education. They need someone who believes in them, who’s willing to show them how understanding the world can be fun. That science can be a source of great joy and amazing discoveries and that it’s open to all, rich and poor, brown and white, child and adult. That I’m not better than them because I have a shiny badge with my name on it and a big white lab coat. Maybe it’s a “philosophical difference” now that I’ve been pitch perfect on protocols, but it’s one I’m happy to disagree on if that’s the case.

    Sorry for the massive data-dump. I just need it to be here for what comes next.

    And I’m damn proud of myself for staying on topic, saying what I needed to say, and resisting their attempts to steer it into their denials and mythology-building and faux-concern. I did an even better job than last time on it and it’s something that they need to actually hear not “oh, aren’t we being so fair” hear.

  172. says

    Evil HR Director also said to email her any additional details and I’m fighting the urge to send a super professional email noting that several other transgender individuals who were fired from their jobs for being transgender (and specifically the ones fired from jobs involving children for being transgender) report having the same stages of things happening that’s been going on, so if she wishes to claim its all a series of coincidences, it’s startlingly similar to the exact series of events used in discriminatory firings trying to avoid falling afoul of the law banning them.

    But that would be a very bad idea and I should stop while I’m ahead.

  173. cicely (No further comment.) says

    Cerberus, I think that putting it all here as an aid to future memory (especially when the Evil HR Director shows every sign of intending to “alter” your memory of the facts-as-the-happen) is very wise.
    I just wish it wasn’t likely to be necessary.

  174. says

    Re: Nacho Cheese Dorito Tacos. My son loves these. I personally can’t stand any chip (crisps for you’all across the pond) flavorings (“nacho”, onion & sour cream, BBQ, etc). Won’t eat the things. It annoys me when I’m at a sandwich shop and want to get something and all the chips are flavored; blech, yuck, we’s hates them. Something about the powdery mouth-feel and the MSG (usually), and, well, the “flavor” doesn’t, to me, taste like the flavor it is supposed to. Confession: okay, I do have a fondness for normal Cheetos, but that doesn’t count does it?

  175. says

    cicely, I want to reiterate how awesome you sound and how I wish everyone were so passionate about making science fun and interesting to students.

  176. says

    Ooops, while cicely may be awesome in their own right, the previous message was intended for Cerberus. This is why I can’t read novels with many characters; my name buffer tends to limit itself to the first letter. Books with main characters with the same initial letter (or worse the same first 2 or 3) are frustrating as hell to me.

  177. mildlymagnificent says

    dontpanic – at last! A kindred spirit. If I’m going to eat salted potato chips/crisps, that’s what I want. Not all that flavouring and coating junk.

    I also suspect I’m overly attuned to the (after)taste of artificial sweeteners and the like that creep along the outskirts of nutrition or ingredient labels in the ‘flavours’ category.

  178. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    Can I complain about how I went to FTB (on my desktop) and got the mobile page?


    Srsly, this is obnoxious.

    Also, the last time I went to FTB on my phone I got the non-mobile page.

  179. cicely (No further comment.) says

    Or maybe I steal them from the East Zoo of Berlin. They have a large supply. ^_^

    And you sneak them out under your coat?
    :D :D :D
    “Leaving a fishy-smelling trail wherever he goes….”

    dontpanic, you have mistaken me for Cerberus, who is awesome, and passionate about making science fun and interesting to students! Big ‘C’, little ‘c’, who begins with ‘c’….
    Three drink penalty, and you must muck out the manatee pens.
    As your penance.

  180. says

    Hey, I caught it right away… Three drink penalty? Of what? … though now you mention it, I might have a glass of Port. Hmm, second in the last 30 days, woohoo I’m going wild.

    Manatee pens? Is that worse than the two cat boxes I end up doing just about every time (despite agreements from both the wife and child before acquiring either cat that that wasn’t going to be one of my chores).

    I never seem to get the mobile page on the laptop, but yes, on the iPod its a crap shoot.

  181. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Once again, I have learned better than to make plans with S. Sigh. I should really be used to this. He’s going to Chicago for the third time in four weeks. The one weekend he didn’t go out of town in that number? The one time I asked and he had agreed. But it would just stress him out too much to leave town for the weekend, donchaknow? just too stressful to be away from work for that long.

    Jeezuss. I feel so…pathetic. Still asking him to do things with me and still getting rejected on the regular. Which, of course, is a big reason we’re not “in a relationship.” He got tired of dealing with my feelings I had when disappointed. Now, I have no “standing” to complain and he still gets to hang out with me when he feels like it. Gah. At least I ditched him for lunch today. Oh, no, wait, I invited him along and was turned down. Damnit.


  182. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Hehehe Manatanee Pens!

    …it took me a minute to figure out why a red squiggly appeared there and now I’m leaving it.

  183. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    I’m so sorry you’re still going through this. Good for you for getting all the details down and standing up to the gaslighting to the extent you’re able. *hugs*

  184. says

    *hugs* Your bosses are bastards, and there’s no excuse for the shit they’re pulling.
    Likewise; S is being a royal asshole to you.
    A little late, but best of luck.

  185. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    There’s a gross video going around facebook of a man “giving his daughter away” …it’s literally being called a “hand-over speech.” That people actually describe a person as a “thing to give” makes my stomach turn. It’s even worse that everyone thinks this is so fucking touching and lovely.
    Dad says: Lord, make her like my wife. And he made her loving and giving. I said Lord, make her like me, and he made her drive a tractor. And then he made her opinionated, so I said, enough of that, make her like YOU. And he gave her a desire to serve.

    …last I checked, this god of their is a demanding asshole, not interested in being subservient to anybody.

  186. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Yeah, what I got from it is that a good livestock woman is loving and giving (read: self-sacrificing), has a desire to serve (read: subservient), keeps quiet, stoic, (forgot to mention, he also said she was “emotional” among the list of things that should be changed) and yet performs traditional masculinity enough to be both useful and bragworthy, that is, not too feminine. Gotta drive a tractor and “choo tuhbackuh”. I can’t make up a more stereotypical picture of damaging gender roles. It’s mind boggling.

  187. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Thanks, Dalillama.

    it’s made worse by the fact that this was another trivia night, so now we have to find a replacement. He’s not just letting me down, it’s sort of embarrassing to me that he’s bailing on me. That’s a crappy feeling that I’m used to, too. Making excuses for his absence when he had said he’d be there.

    As well as the phenomenon where I have to *ask* and *ask* to confirm and make sure because he never volunteers the information that he is double-booked or whatever. I have to ask, and it’s usually late in the game by the time I’ve asked enough times to where he has realized he is bailing. It’s like, when was he going to tell me? I don’t merit a second thought. Fuck.

  188. broboxley OT says

    nice two paragraph description of the trials and tribs of travel ate by gnu’s Anyway, PZ if you have your ears on I will need to bypass Morris, I will wave at the turnoff when I go thru Souix Center

    hugs to those that need them

  189. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    Things making Esteleth grumpy tonight:

    (1) My PlantSim wants babies, but cannot find any Forbidden Fruit seeds.

    (2) My incisions do not hurt, they itch. Which is actually worse.

    (3) My hair is stiff and hard from dried blood.

    (4) I am forbidden from bathing. And I want to bathe. Because I feel gross.

    (5) I had one yummy and perfectly ripe clementine, then went for a second. It was all gross.

    (6) I want a beer. I have some Rare Vos in my fridge. But I am forbidden from drinking.

    *sits on floor*

  190. says


    Just because S isn’t hitting you or constantly insulting you doesn’t mean that this isn’t an abusive relationship.

    It is now apparently time for Joe’s Theory of Value-Added Relationships. In positive and healthy relationships you get back more than you give, rather than giving and giving and always coming out on the short end of things. More about emotional energy and satisfaction, rather than tallying up who does what for who. And it works both ways, so that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Otherwise, why bother?

  191. bluentx says

    Hello all! Mostly threadrupt::

    Just heard about this today (tho GoogleGod shows it been around at least a week).
    I’m so disgusted… Jim Crow era caricatures… on the cover of a national magazine… in 2013… quotation marks around the word racist in some (mostly right wing) articles… WTF!?

    Apologies if this has already been discussed but if you’re interested there is a petition at:

  192. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says


    I agree with you about value-added. My mom, who tries her damnedest to never seem judgmental, has heard my cry and rage enough about it to venture to describe it as “unhealthy.” It has crossed my mind before that it might be abusive-like*, but it’s hard for me to come to that for all the normal reasons: It’s all my fault, really; If he’s that bad then how low am I for having tolerated it for this long; He’s just got depression/anxiety/workstress/more important things to trouble himself with. You’re absolutely right about the functioning of a healthy relationship. I guess the answer to “why bother” is that I am stuck in the feeling like this is the best I’ve got right now. I know that’s not logical, but being stuck in a rut spinning your metaphorical wheels rarely is. : /

    I do appreciate the support, though. And thanks for listening and being kind even though I’m a bit of a broken record.

  193. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    *I forgot to add my footnote.Which was to be: I can’t even straight use the word “abusive” …I have to add -like so I can even mentally handle having the discussion. : p

  194. says

    *hugs* for Cerberus, if wanted.

    I have had a truly tentacular day today! Arrived in the mail: 6 octopus salad plates, 1 tentacle messenger bag, 1 tentacle t-shirt dress, 1 tentacle T-shirt. And a Dr Who lunchbox and some other less noteworthy goodies. Also purchased, a magnificent vintage Hermes silk scarf with a design of tropical fish and urchins, but no obvious tentacles. (Wait, 1992 is vintage?)

  195. says

    What iJoe said. Also,

    He’s just got depression/anxiety/workstress

    …What do you have? You can work through that shit to keep your damn commitments to him, after all. And if he has more important things to do than spend time with you, then that tells you something about how much he cares, right? Incidentally, it’s not just you; he’s being an asshole to everyone, with the chronically not keeping commitments, double booking, etc. So, clearly it can’t be your fault, because he’s doing it to other people too; ergo, he must be the asshole, right?

  196. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Esteleth, I’ll pout with you. That’s a crappy list.

    Alethea: Neat stuff! When I started reading, I thought “tentacular” was a new fun Pharyngulean way to say “spectacular” or “magnificent”, then I kept reading. I still think I’ll adopt tentacular :D

  197. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says


    One word flowed over me as I read your comment: Whoa. *lightbulb*
    I always make excuses for him…never for myself. I have (diagnosed) anxiety problems too, they just always get shuffled to the side because they sort of pale in comparison, I guess. But damn right! I do what I say I’ll do. And then some.

    As to the indication of how much he cares, I think that to myself all the time. But it becomes self-punishment because I use it as a barometer of how worthy of being cared about I am. Horrible cycle, that.

    You are right, that he’s an asshole like that in general. He must be. But mostly it’s just me that loses when there’s a conflict. (Selection/confirmation bias, anyone? (Irrational, over critical Portia, seeing the worst , playing the victim!)) Always has been. I’ve always been low priority, and complained about it. Then I tell myself well he has a lot on his plate, he can’t control that, what’ your PROBLEM?


    Your wise and kind words have shed a lot of light though.

    (Whew, rereading my comment…talk about spinning your wheels.)

  198. pharm scigrad says

    Bingo date!? You’re on! :) Never thought I’d be quoted on here as hoping for a resurrection, but there you go, I am. Life’s funny like that sometimes.
    Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits
    2. Don’t scratch it, tap it. It takes longer, but eventually you get some relief.
    *post-surgery hugs*
    Portia @763
    I’ve been in that warp zone you’re describing, where being in the relationship for so long makes it seem like it couldn’t be that bad, right? For me, it really was that bad. I had some friends I wanted to HulkSmash when they told me, oh I’m so glad you got rid of that asshole – after the fact – who never said a word the whole time I was in the relationship and apparently miserable. I usually need a good kick in the shorts to get over my inertia. But really, single is good. Casually dating is good. Both are better than the spiraling vortexes many relationships can become when we hold on long after we should have let go.

  199. says

    Alethea, that scarf: wow. My wife would love that; the theme fits with her general love of fish /ocean motif and bright “jewel-tone” colors. ::envy::

  200. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    PSG –

    Yep, hanging on too long is my specialty. : p I don’t like to be told by friends during a relationship that X person is bad because it gets me all defensive. : / My mom was able to do it by making it about his behavior, and my unhappiness.

    Also…are you kidding?! Casual dating is now kind of terrifying. I suppose I could get over that though. I just feel like I live in a fishbowl. It’s a very small community and a small professional community, too. Haven’t even told anyone we’ve broken up so as to avoid gossip mill and making explanations.

    Sigh. Detaching is hard.


    Just hit the first Mark Harmon episode of West Wing. *ogling*

  201. bluentx says

    Just hit the first Mark Harmon episode of West Wing. *ogling*

    Yeah, but the last Mark Harmon episode– *sniffle, sniffle*…

  202. Portia, Feminist Snarker Extraordinaire says

    Oh, man, TWW has made me cry many times…

    And now I’m calling it a night. Thanks everyone, for the commiseration.

    I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: this is a great community and a great space.

  203. pharm scigrad says

    @737: Yes, yes she is. Awesome linky.
    @771: Yeah, I think I should have gotten some sort of life certificate in sticking with things that just shouldn’t be stuck with anymore.
    Of course casual dating is terrifying. Isn’t that why people do it? They’re more terrified of being single? Hence why I’m single… ;)

  204. chigau (違う) says

    I’d really like to have a smoke
    but it’s -11°C out there
    I’ll pass.

    *hugs*chocolate*21g of bacon*rum*
    for everyone

  205. says

    don’tpanic, I am indeed very lucky. It was in a second-hand clothes shop, and cost me $40. I was thinking “Hmmm, pricy for a 2nd hand scarf, but whatthehell, I love it” – and then I googled it a bit while looking for the image. Faaaark, these sorts of scarves sell for $3-400 new!

  206. rq says

    everything that Joe and Dalillama said about your relationship, and then some. I think you need to tell people you’ve broken up, and not necessarily with S’ permission. That’s a good place to start, separation-wise, because it sounds like you need to split from him for real. He’s playing you all over the board, consciously or uncobsciously, and it’ll go on for as long as you let it. Yes, unfortunately, you, because he just cuts loose when he wants, so none of it is inconvenient to him.
    And will probBably take direvt and detetmined cutoff, because he’ll persistently use the ‘just friends so help me!’ card a lot. My sister had a bf like this. They’re tough to scrape off (emotionally, too), like gum, but a lot more corrosive. And it must be done, for your well-being. Yours. It’s hard to be single. But better than emotional acrobatics.

    MAJOR *hugs* to Cerberus, I admire your foryitude and, well, you. Your bosses are giant assholes.

    All hail Tpyos for Mobile Devices. Computer did not fix itself overnight. Rockstars with multiple mortgages.

  207. Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :) says

    RQ: if the OS isn’t bootable but the hard drive isn’t damaged you might be able to recover your files using another computer and a USB adapter for the hard drive, if you’re comfortable removing it (I think they’re like $10 US on Amazon, not sure if it being an international shipment creates any issues).

  208. bluentx says

    All hail Tpyos for Mobile Devices.

    You should add this^ to all your posts for the time being, rq. Otherwise some (not me, of course) will get the idea you’re indulging too early in the day (your time) ; )

  209. says

    I still have to use my phone for the internet at home, since that was shut off a few months back. When I go to work, or the bar, I bring my laptop with me so I do use it, but not exclusively.
    As for typos…argh!

  210. says

    Good morning

    Hugs for idiot judge and S.-situation.
    You know, when the people whom we have conflicts with are sick, they are wielding that like a club to hit us over the head.
    When I talked about the fact that my mum still doesn’t know what “personal boundaries” and “personal space” means* and that I’m still shying away from the conflict, I said “it is mean to fight with somebody who’s sick.” I mean, you don’t want to hurt somebody who is really that ill.

    *To be fair to her, I understand why she doesn’t: she never had any of her own. She always lived at home and my grandparents would simply come to her flat whenever they wanted to.

    Please remember to copy the things you write her into a file with the date.
    But, please, even if you’re only doing accents from non traditionally marginalized European folks, it’s still Othering people and marking them seen as defective. I’m currently doing some research in this and you wouldn’t believe how often “non-standard accent” is equated with “incompetent”.

    David M.
    Nonono. Not the East-Zoo. It’s the Tierpark. And I love the manatees.

    Hugs to you, too

  211. rq says

    shipping from the UK usually isn’t too bad, and thanks for your suggestion – I’ll try to borrow a computer, if nothing can be done (and yes it’s the os) and get an adapter, I’m pretty sure I could get everything onto our external hard drive. A learning experience. I’m not friendly with computers without a pretty interface as mediator. :/

    I won’t add that, just to keep you guessing. ;)

    and here I thought going mobile was supposed to be super-convenient. Oh wait…

    And the ipod battery is about to run out and I can’t charge it. Guess we needed a new computer anyway – this one’s practically a dinosaur at 3.5 years. *sigh* Let’s spend more money!!!


  212. bluentx says

    practically a dinosaur at 3.5 years

    Shush! My 3 year old laptop might hear you!

  213. says

    Off to bed.

    We’ll see if fuzzbutt decides to share the bed… right now she’s decided that 2:00 AM is the perfect time for a stretch and a bath. If she goes back to sleep, I might be able to sneak up on to the bed.


    She’s so cute she puts Dot Warner to shame.

  214. birgerjohansson says

    When reading novels with many characters I try to write up the names on a separate piece of paper so I do not confuse them.
    — — — — — — — —
    ” Casual dating is now kind of terrifying.”
    In one of Pratchett’s novels the king of Lancre envied the trees, who just had to shed pollen to the wind, while the actuall pollination and germination business took place somewhere else. Trees are smart.
    — — — — — — — — —
    Yes , travel is not pleasant when you have anxiety or anhedonia.
    — — — — — — — — —
    I have spent some time at physorg.com battling AGW denialists at the comments sec tion. The same denialbots turn up again and again with the same old lies.

  215. blf says

    I have spent some time at physorg.com battling AGW denialists at the comments [section].

    Repeatedly hitting yourself on head with a baseball bat has about the same effect, is perhaps easier, probably quicker, and certainly less painful.

  216. opposablethumbs says


    This is why I can’t read novels with many characters; my name buffer tends to limit itself to the first letter. Books with main characters with the same initial letter (or worse the same first 2 or 3) are frustrating as hell to me.

    In that case, never read Cien Años de Soledad/One Hundred Years of Solitude? ;-)

  217. rq says

    Shame on you for indulging in non-essential items like… ooooh, gorgeous scarf! Nice catch! ;)

    Don’t worry… I’m fond of this digital dinosaur, and in my opinion it’s perfectly serviceable, but Husband insists otherwise, and I’m pretty sure me tech-savvy brother would say it’s positively pre-historical. ;)




    Went to choir yesterday. Missed out on singing a very dramatic song about revenge and the apocalypse (drama&cymbals), but worked on an old childhood classic, a favourite among exile-Latvians due to its patriotic epic-story content. Realized once again that Latvians abroad are a big joke to most people here (right down to ridiculing their accents because of imperfect language skills), had a bit of a sad, remembered I’m trying to bring them to Canada for the Latvian Song and Dance Festival… Time for a learning experience? I think so.

  218. carlie says

    Nice story. Woman has child who has dwarfism. Notices a small pickle company’s jar with “midget” on it. Asks the company nicely to change it. Company… does so. Very politely, and when asked by media, says to stop paying attention to them and focus on the lives of people with dwarfism if they want something to write about. No muss, no fuss. (as always, don’t go near the comments)

    So just in the last week, in a volunteer ancillary position I’m in at work, I’ve had to not only put up with but actively be the causal agent in destroying not one, but two things I care deeply about that are relevant to and have a high impact on my actual paid job. That’s been fun.

  219. says

    WMDKitty, what’s Fuzzbutt doing at your place? And have you seen Fluffbucket recently? :)

    rq, sometimes I feel bad about my life of relative luxury on my part time public service wages in Australia – not exactly rich, but quite comfortable thank you. I know it’s silly, but when I hear about Americans with no healthcare I feel so privileged – it’s the personal contact here that makes it real, not just abstract numbers. I have sent the odd few $$ to the Pharynguhorde fund, and I donate to a few charities (3rd world poverty remains abstract numbers in my head).

    I still hope I’m not upsetting someone for whom $60 is a week’s groceries.

  220. carlie says

    Esteleth, I have the sneaking feeling there is a very good story that you’re not telling us.
    Also, I hope you have painkillers.

  221. says

    Oh fuck
    I just completely flooded the bathroom.
    I put on the washingmachine, but I forgot that I had removed the lint filter since something in there was starting to smell an I wanted to dry it out. So, all the water that went in at the top came out at the bottom while I was in the kitchen…
    I hope I manged to stop it before it made its way to the flat below us…

    In that case, never read Cien Años de Soledad/One Hundred Years of Solitude? ;-)

    I read that book with 5000 post-its where I noted down who was born, who died, how they were called and in what relationship they stood with each other….

  222. opposablethumbs says

    I read that book with 5000 post-its where I noted down who was born, who died, how they were called and in what relationship they stood with each other….

    I started out trying to keep track of them, but after a while I just gave up and went with it … :-D (I notice there are graphics of the family tree on the internet now. lol).
    I just accepted payment for some work from a client in another country, via PayPal for the first time. Well PP charge me for the transfer, which is fair enough (and better than the bank) but I hadn’t realised they would of course choose their own currency conversion rate (yeah, I should have thought of that). Eh, live and learn I suppose :-/

    Right, off to run errands … see you later, Horde!

  223. rq says

    Was I being too flippant? :/ Sorry.
    ($60 is nearly a week for us, but honestly, I can’t begrudge you being delighted about such a find… Also, if I came across as being sarcastic in that post, it wasn’t meant that way. I sincerely believe that the new scarf is an awesome accidental find.)

  224. says

    Hi Lounge.

    I am a depressed Kitty. Just low levels of mleh.

    Being ignored at work, systematically pushed out of the group that I was a founding member of because the new manager of said group isn’t aware of the fact I was a founding member of it. Finding out that there have been numerous meetings without my knowledge, and seeing a document describing our group without mention of mine (and a colleague’s) contribution to the group.

  225. mildlymagnificent says

    Alethea @801

    Funnily enough, despite all the stress I sometimes think of our US acquaintances and just shudder at what they’d be facing if they had someone in their family in mrmagnificent’s position. 6 days in intensive care, near daily x-rays (checking on the pneumonia) and a couple of CT and MRI scans, now 18 total days in hospital altogether, physiotherapists, dieticians, speech pathologists, all those days with a 24 hour dedicated nurse apart from a couple of morning shifts. Might seem lavish to some people, but it’s all necessary. (I half suspect they’re all so impressed that he survived at all that they’re really determined to get the best outcome possible. That also lines up with good management trying to get him out as soon as possible, which can only happen if he’s fit enough to tolerate the surgery he needs.)

    It might be that he occasionally asks about money and I reassure him that it’s costing us nothing and I thank FSM – and a sensible Australian health system – that it’s so.

  226. blf says

    I just completely flooded the bathroom.

    Quick! Flood the rest of the flat so nobody will notice.

  227. blf says

    Being ignored at work …

    More time for watching p0rnhanging out with the other louches — er, in Teh Lounge — seems like a good situation. Nibble on some cheese and you can even have a penguin (deranged, mildly) for companionship. Margaritas optional.

  228. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Oh fuck
    I just completely flooded the bathroom.

    I flooded my kitchen once.

    Wood floors and flooding = no bueno

    Still haven’t heard the end of it from my father in law and it was 4-5 years ago.

  229. blf says

    Still haven’t heard the end of it from my father in law and it was 4–5 years ago.

    Remove the batteries.

  230. blf says

    I may have missed you a little bit.

    You bought a snarky scarf as consolation?

    Well, I suppose it’s better than stuffing yerself full of peas…

  231. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Remove the batteries.

    Well it’s good natured giving me shit so I don’t mind. He’s like that. Plus he and I built that god damn house together so he has some right to give me shit for being a knucklehead and leaving the sink running, while stopped up, to go upstairs and check on something.

    i is dumb

  232. blf says

    A few choice excerpts from Papal conclave: fault lines emerge as cardinals gather to vote:

    [Cardinal Juan] Sandoval [Iñiguez of Mexico] … [t]hree years ago [“described”] same-sex unions as an “aberration” and was equally blunt on the subject of gay people adopting children, asking: “Would you want to be adopted by a pair of faggots or lesbians?” His other betes noires include at least one other Christian denomination, “you’ve got to be shameless to be a Protestant”, and women who he believes fail to dress and behave correctly: “Women shouldn’t go around being so provocative – that’s why so many get raped.”

    Many African cardinals, for example, are sceptical about using condoms to halt the spread of HIV/Aids. Wilfrid Napier of South Africa expressed doubts about the efficacy of condoms; John Njue of Kenya has blamed them for the spread of disease, while Cardinal Anthony Okogie of Nigeria has gone so far as to say: “The condom is widely known not to be a safe protector against HIV/Aids.”

    … Although Cardinal Keith O’Brien opted to absent himself from the conclave after he resigned as archbishop of St Andrews and Edinburgh over allegations that he had behaved “inappropriately” towards four priests, some scandal-hit cardinals have refused to recuse themselves.

    Cardinal Sean Brady, archbishop of Armagh, Cardinal Timothy Dolan, archbishop of New York, Cardinal Roger Mahony, archbishop emeritus of Los Angeles, and Cardinal Justin Rigali, former archbishop of Philadelphia, have all faced – or are facing – questions about what they knew about the abuse of children by priests. But all have decided to go to Rome for the conclave.

    … Cardinal Óscar Rodríguez Maradiaga of Honduras, who has proved an ardent defender of human rights and a fierce critic of capitalism and the drug trade. The archbishop of Tegucigalpa would be a perfect Latin American candidate to succeed Benedict were it not for his leftist leanings and his intemperate comparison, in 2002, of the US media’s coverage of the church sexual abuse scandals with the persecution of Christians by Nero, Hitler and Stalin.

    Then there is the Vatican’s finance minister, Domenico Calcagno, who is known as Rambo in certain sections of the Italian press because of his extensive collection of firearms, which includes a Smith & Wesson magnum, a Turkish pump-action Hatsan shotgun and a Remington. It is unclear whether he possesses a Beretta to go with his biretta.

  233. blf says

    I went horse-back riding.

    Gaaah! You’re friends with those fiends?
    Or were you just taking it to the abattoir to be turned into beef?

  234. Beatrice says


    In that case, never read Cien Años de Soledad/One Hundred Years of Solitude? ;-)

    My thought too.

  235. blf says

    Oops! Sorry, rq, I just realised it was Alethea who found the scarf. Apologies to the both of you for confusing you with you, and you with you.
    (That’s what I get for posting vin at lunch and then drinking.)

  236. rq says

    – Beef? What beef? I know nothing of any beef; I know not of what you speak. Only large beasts. Who are friendly, kind and trusting, and deserving of worship with offerings of peas, and who dispense Blessings in the shape of houses not blown up.

  237. rq says

    Where did you post vin? I didn’t get any. :(
    And I figured the snark scarf was just an accessory alternative to the MDP.

  238. blf says

    rq, I’ve no idea how much coverage this has gotten in USAlienstan, but there’s a bit of a bruhaha here in Europe over the discovery that some of the cheaper prepared dishes supposedly containing beef (frozen pizzas, readymade meatballs, frozen hamburger patties, that sort of thing) are actually, at least in part, horse. And it’s not contamination, it’s clearly deliberate. (Horsemeat is much cheaper than beef.) Hence fraudulent, since the foods in question don’t mention horse as an ingredient (and in some cases, claim “100% beef”).

    There’s a possible safety issue too, since certain drugs not approved for human consumption but allowed for use on horses have been detected. As far as I know, the levels found are so low there’s no real risk, but it does mean some of the horses/horsemeat should not have entered the food chain at all, and that the “passport” system for tracking animal’s medications / drugging / et al isn’t working very well.

  239. rq says


    I am not a USAlienstani, for one, and I am not in that alien land.
    I am, as they say, on the Continent (the only one ever worth mentioning, la!) and live in a country where the presence of Horse (or, as the linguistic hair-splitters like to affirm here, Large Beast), has also been confirmed in various foodstuffs (incl. canned peas).
    Several celebrity chefs have come forward, lauding the Wonders that are Horse-Meat (delicacy!) but many in this country are historically and emotionally attached to their labour assistants, and brouhaha has also ensued here (though not to the same degree as elsewhere). The same lack of tracking has been determined. Horses should remember to renew their passports in a timely manner.

  240. says

    “Would you want to be adopted by a pair of faggots or lesbians?”

    As long as they’re not catholic….

    Pssst, rq is in Europe

    Which reminds me:
    How do you know your frozen lasagna contains horse-meat?
    The nutritional value is given in hors-power.

    Sooo, I confessed my sin to Mr. over the phone and now I’ll leave before he comes home.
    Ohh-ohh, too late…

  241. blf says

    I am not a USAlienstani…

    Possibly a good pint in yer favour. Er, point. Unless yer an Ozzian (or are in Ozralia). Then there’s no hope.

  242. rq says

    Ozralia? Ozralia? A continent peopled by the descendants of convicts? Clearly, not a continent worthy to be named The Continent.
    I am in Grande Olde Europe. Former USSR, as a matter of fact. In all its crumbling-concrete, post-Soviet, corrupt-capitalism-embracing glory.

  243. blf says

    Clearly, not a continent worthy to be named The Continent.

    Indeed. Just a large bunny farm. I was guessing Ozralia because “the only [Continent] ever worth mentioning” seems typically Ozzian to me…

    A continent peopled by the descendants of convicts?

    What did the Aboriginals ever do to you? Feed you a pea or something?

  244. dianne says

    Ozralia? Ozralia? A continent peopled by the descendants of convicts?

    European descended Ozzies are frequently descended from people transported from Britain in the late 18th/19th century. European descended USAliens are often descended from people transported from Britain in the 17th and early 18th century. In other words, Australians are the wimpy convicts who the Brits couldn’t be bothered to kick out at the first opportunity, but only got to hundreds of years later. (I’m one of the USians descended from people tossed off into Georgia in the 17th century. I’m always careful to tell people that I’m descended from the criminals, not the religious fanatics. Wouldn’t want to be mistaken for a Puritan.)

  245. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    Oh dear oh dear oh dear

    The internet has imploded


    The New York Times has linked to TVTropes.

  246. dianne says

    The New York Times has linked to TVTropes.

    The internet has become one and skynet will be taking over any minute now. Beware if your browser says it can’t do that. Especially if your name is Dave.

  247. rq says

    I meant the imported population. Which, rabbit-like, rapidly pushed the Aboriginal (who, I add, have never wronged me) population out of its niche. :/

    When looked at like that, (nearly) everyone descended from a colonist (French, British, Spanish, Portuguese, etc.) is descended from a criminal fanatic of some kind…

    Luckily, I’m a Letto-Canadian descended from the poor oppressed tribes of Latgallia and Semigallia, later (WWII) exiled due to incompatible politics to various locations around the world via DP camps in Germany.
    (To be honest, I’m not entirely sure what that means in the larger context of things. Probably nothing.

  248. David Marjanović says

    The internet has become one and skynet will be taking over any minute now. Beware if your browser says it can’t do that. Especially if your name is Dave.

    …I’ll be in the bone basement, with the unopened crates from the pre-WWI expeditions to German East Africa.

  249. blf says

    Beware if your browser says it can’t do that.

    Amusingly, my browser just did open up a new window saying basically that.
    (I accidentally hit some keystroke combination to do something but something wasn’t right. I don’t think any peas or horses were involved.)

  250. blf says

    rq, I know you meant the exported undesirables. I’m either in an excessively vin mood today, or had too much lunch at snark.

    (Snark’s? Good restaurant name, that…)

  251. dianne says

    I don’t think any peas or horses were involved.

    You never know for sure. Tricky things, horses and peas.

  252. Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits says

    David Marjanović, I do not think that you qualify as “Dave.”

    What with:
    (1) I have never heard you addressed as “Dave,” or heard you refer to yourself thusly.
    (2) AFAIK, the diminutive “Dave” is not used for “David” in German-speaking countries.

    Therefore, Marjanović =/= Dave. Marjanović = David.

  253. blf says

    Tricky things, horses and peas.

    Indeed. For instance, the horse-is-beef scandal is just a diversion to hide the peas-are-edible abuse. Silly critters are probably jumping into the mincing machines all by themselves (albeit under the influence of peas).