I’m soon to be stuffed and mounted on the mantelpiece »« Pharyngula Podcast #3

An excellent plan

We’re going to distract all attention from our horrible #FTBullies status by a well-tested expedient: We’re going to blame Rebecca Watson for everything. At last, all Deep Rifts are healed!


I must highlight a comment from kosk11348 that encapsulates the whole recent mess.

The best analogy I’ve heard yet for understanding this situation is a fire evacuation plan. Fires are rare, yet it makes sense to have a plan in place. Continuing that analogy, here’s my rundown of the “conversation” thus far:

FTB: “Fire evacuation plans are a good idea. We recommend that all skeptical events have one.”

DJ Grothe: “All this talk of fires scares away attendees. Plus TAM has never, ever had a fire.”

Stephanie Zvan: “Actually, there have been a few small fires at TAM. Remember that trash can that caught on fire?”

DJ Grothe: “Yes, I put that fire out myself. At no time did anyone feel unsafe.”

FTB: “Ok, but you just said…never mind. The point is, because there was no policy in place, we now have no record of the fire, no investigation into the cause of the fire, and no reason to think another fire might happen again. Are you currently training your staff to know what to do in the event of a fire?”

DJ Grothe: “We have a robust fire evacuation plan printed in our literature. It reads: ‘TAM hates fires.’”

FTB: “But that’s not really a plan…”

Russell Blackford: “Is there any evidence that things burn?”

MRAs: “Look, it’s the fire department’s job to handle fires. If you are on fire, call them.”

FTB: “Huh? You’re saying it’s the victim’s responsibility to alert the fire department? What about the responsibility of the organizers…”

MRAs: “#FTB bullies say TAM is infested with arsonists!”

FTB: “What? Nobody is saying that! Arsonists do exist, sure. But we have no reason to think TAM is any worse than the general population in that respect. Look, it’s really simple…”

Ophelia Benson: “You know, I was schedule to speak at TAM, but I just got this really weird letter explaining in great detail about what to do when I find myself in a fire at TAM. Like, seriously detailed. It described the flames singing my hair, peeling my flesh…”

Russell Blackford: “Way to overreact to a helpful warning!”

Thunderf00t: “I will continue to offer to light friends’ cigarettes for them and you can’t stop me!”

Paula Kirby: “The firestasi see fires everywhere because they love to pretend they are all victims of fire, just like the Nazis.”

FTB: “Ok, now this is just getting bizarre…”

Harriet Hall’s T-shirt: “I feel safe from fires at TAM (even though it still doesn’t have a fire evacuation plan)”

FTB: *sigh*

We’re done now.

Comments

  1. Ariaflame, BSc, BF, PhD says

    He’s lucky I’m not his supervisor.

    And X-rays get generated in lots of ways. I prefer Mg/Al anodes myself.

    Don’t theses in the USA have to have some sort of defense or something? Where the PhD candidate has to defend their research? Judging from today’s lack of rationality even if the thesis itself is coherent I can imagine the defense being a meltdown.

  2. Sili (I have no penis and I must jizz) says

    anyway, according to Teh Interwebs, Pauli did the exclusion principle, Uhlenbeck and Goudsmit did the electron spin; but both came years after the experiment

    So either the troll got the order wrong, or they actually meant

    The Stern–Gerlach experiment was meant to test the Bohr–Sommerfeld hypothesis that the direction of the angular momentum of a silver atom is quantized.[4]

    expecting integer spin.

  3. Sili (I have no penis and I must jizz) says

    troll sez he’s been getting himself new IP addresses cuz he’s a previously banned troll. your choice if you want to believe it.

    Ah. So they’re behind seven proxies. My bad.

  4. Paul says

    Ah. So they’re behind seven proxies. My bad.

    There are some easy ways to cut through seven proxies, if a site administrator cares to make the effort. Few end users really lock down their system sufficiently to not leak an IP address to the page they’re visiting. Few also consistently use their proxies, and tend to slip up and visit a page directly fairly frequently.

  5. Sili (I have no penis and I must jizz) says

    now now, let’s be fair. since none of us are white men, no one here had to actually do work to get their degrees and jobs. they were handed to us on a gilded affirmative action platter.

    Hey! I’m a menz!

    Luckily I live in a pinko-commie socialist fascist state, so I still had everything hand to me on a brass platter.

    And I was paid to do my post grad.

  6. Gnumann, メンズ権利活動家国家の売国奴 says

    Rebecca Watson got me to change half my nym by google translate.

    And then she refused to tell me exactly how badly it got mangled…

  7. Louis says

    Jadehawk,

    ZOMG I MISSED THAT!

    So what he’s saying is that after my wife and I pay for bills, mortgage, childcare, food, sundry insurances, repairs, maintenance, savings, charity donations, travel and commuting, taxes, an actual child, and socialising if there is time or money left over, we should expect that the government gives us a professorial salary as well as our earned salary just because WAH ENTITLEMENT?

    Impressive. I shall speak to my MP immediately, and on the first cheque clearing I shall embark on a cocaine and hooker binge so legendary that Keith Richards himself would ask me to knock it off for making him look bad.*

    Louis

    * Actual cocaine and hooker binge may not match that advertised.

  8. Gnumann, メンズ権利活動家国家の売国奴 says

    Rebecca Watson cloned wordplauge so he can fail-troll round the clock.

  9. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    Oh my.

    Another PhD under 40, here. I think your problem, wordplague, is that you lack either the talent or discipline to achieve at the level you’d like, even with the significant advantage that being a white male confers. It isn’t your advisor’s fault, for instance, that you can’t express yourself in writing, can’t be bothered to monitor your experimental conditions carefully enough to notice when you are running low on LN2, or waste untold hours being a dumbass on the internet. Nor is it your advisor’s fault that you seem so unable to take charge of your own career that you feel victimized by your predicament.

    This should disturb you greatly as a Randian, because you so clearly deserve your failure.

    The clear fact that you are the worst kind of entitled bigot, sadly, may not play a role in your failure up to this point. Lucky you.

    I would wish you ill, but you clearly seem bent on bringing that onto yourself.

  10. says

    Louis:

    So what he’s saying is that after my wife and I pay for bills, mortgage, childcare, food, sundry insurances, repairs, maintenance, savings, charity donations, travel and commuting, taxes, an actual child, and socialising if there is time or money left over, we should expect that the government gives us a professorial salary as well as our earned salary just because WAH ENTITLEMENT?

    I was thinking this ^ exactly. I’mma call the WAAAAAAAAH-mbulance for wordwhatever.

    So, in short: because I’ve paid all of my bills/expenses this month and bought a new fucking refrigerator*, the government should have chipped in for my Dark Knight Rises tickets so I could have a little somethingsomething left over after socializing? Sounds like a sweet deal to me.

  11. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    And just like that…
    *blows a handful of glitter from an open palm*
    …he was gone.

    I guess wordplague may not earn his badger of honor after all.

    A small item in a litany of FAIL, that.

  12. carlie says

  13. chigau (女性) says

    Antiochus Epiphanes
    I’m sure wordplaque will return.
    He may even feel better after his nap.

  14. says

    you guys still don’t understand. it’s ok that none of you have any money left at the end of the month. you’re not doing anything important, not working hard, and not being enslaved by an evil vagina dentata. troll OTOH is suffering all that and more, and for that they won’t give him enough money to make it all worth it. it’s just so unfair

  15. 'Tis Himself says

    Rebecca Watson killed my old fridge. :(

    Not to mention the Radio Star and Kenny.*

    *The bastard!

  16. 'Tis Himself says

    <blockquote?yabut you see, after he pays for food and sleep and socializing, he’s got no money left, which is like not being paid at all.

    As a professional economist, I know what trollplaque’s problem is. He’s an idiot.

  17. pj says

    Since learning the name Rebecca Watson I have put on so much weight I cannot fit pants I bought last summer. Coincidence? I. Think. Not.

    Rebecca Watson is Lady Gaga’s meat dress.
    Rebecca Watson drinks Earl Grey.
    Rebecca Watson invented lolcats speak.

  18. Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle says

    This thread is hilarious. well done, horde.

    only a shame I missed the foaming-at-the-mouth bigot troll. Y’all made him so angry and so incoherent so quickly. I’m jealous!

    Though, that is the first time in my life I’ve seen a bitter, incompetent useless whiny white dude refered to his crusty tube sock as his “fiance”.

  19. Paul says

    Rebecca Watson decided to use a signed integer for the Unix time data type because she thought 2038 was a good year for the end of the world.

  20. Louis says

    Owlmirror, #36,

    AND she didn’t reorder it, AND she didn’t tell anyone, AND she told people off for not ordering it themselves.

    Rebecca Watson: Lab-Monster.*

    Louis

    * She was also responsible for Jaques Benveniste’s experiments he claimed proved homoeopathy and the decline into vitamin C nuttitude of Linus Pauling. And also Kary Mullis. Just Kary Mullis.

  21. Antiochus Epiphanes says

    Re: My #14

    To prevent misapprehension: I fully realize that career success is conditioned by many factors other than merit, including socioeconomic status, race, gender, etc. Among these, I count bad luck, because shit sometimes just happens. Those who operate as wordplague do, discredit any of these factors other than merit , and thus should judge their own success or lack of it with the same lense that they would judge it in others if they wish to avoid hypocrisy. They rarely seem to want to avoid hypocrisy, however.

    So, I apologize if I seemed to be damning people in general on account of a lack of career success. The comment was intended to be read by one, rather than many. Given that this is a public forum, that was stupid of me, at best.

  22. says

    Wow, it’s almost like WordPlague is a graduate student, what with the tiny stipend, the shitty insurance, ridiculous responsibilities (pick up my advisor’s dry cleaning, listen to my advisor’s marital/relationship problems, represent the school at this conference without being compensated for expenses, do research on this and write a presentation in the next 48 hours, etc) and the enforced contact with undergraduates who have that very American hatred of learning, yet expect to be able to easily pass a 300 level course which is heavy on theory and history.

    Welcome to the fucking club, you whiny asshole. Shall I talk about being given 40 illiterate college juniors and trying to convince them that writing a paper involves using spell check and doing research on actual databases, which they should have learned as freshmen? Or maybe what it’s like to try to live on the $740 the college currently gives me to teach?

    Or, goodness, being given one week notice on what class I’ll be teaching and no institutional support? I have to write my own pedagogy and assignments.

    Or having my whiny, entitled students go to my supervisor because they didn’t get an ‘A’ for effort?

    Son, everyone gets bitter at some point, or has an advisor who they loathe (this is my second subject in graduate school, third and fourth degrees, because I have this unfortunate learning fetish).

    You have to know you don’t air that shit on public websites. Make some fucking friends in your department and cry into your beer like the rest of us.

  23. Forbidden Snowflake says

    Dear Everyone,

    1. Spectacular job making the troll cry.
    2. While you were listing the troll’s failures, you didn’t take note of this:

    but you guys have engaged me for going on 5 hours, and allowed me to purge all of this hatred and bordem.

    While I’m not a psychologist, I’m fairly sure that emotions don’t work that way.

  24. 'Tis Himself says

    allowed me to purge all of this hatred and bordem.

    Everyone needs their bordem purged every so often. There’s nothing worse than a clogged bordem when you’re trying to discombobulate the thingummy.

  25. echidna says

    Come to think of it, isn’t it a bit silly of this troll to say they’re commenting from their lab?

    Only if that’s for real. I don’t think it is, but I’ve been wrong before.

  26. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Here’s all I believed of what the troll said:










    Crickets chirring

  27. theef says

    Quite the trouncing of a Troll who started out so smug and so confident. How the tables turn when nerves are struck. I don’t doubt that he’s a grad student and secretly resents working for a women. I’ve met several individuals that profess the same attitude while I was in grad school. No doubt he keeps his thoughts to himself and is regarded as the underachieving, yet harmless s grad student. The Troll is most likely aware of what he is and how he’s perceived by his *ahem* colleagues. His outward civility keeps the inevitable catharsis at bay. His/its ilk typically squeeze by at the bottom of their class blaming everyone for their mediocrity. Something tells me he’ll be defending his thesis more than once. The other details are questionable. Well, everything about it is questionable.

    I’m intrigued by his/its physics trivia. The Stern and Gerlach experiment is a favorite trick question of physics professors, or at least when I was getting my undergrad in physics, it was. The Ag+ atoms have zero orbital angular momentum. However, that was what S&G thought they were measuring. What caused the deflection was the intrinsic ½ spin of the valence electrons. The theoretical construct that they were confirming was that of Niels Bohr who (as most of you know) postulated that orbital angular momentum of the H atom is quantized. In fact they sent a letter to Bohr congratulating him on his success after their confirmatory observations were documented. S&G confirmed a correct, albeit incomplete, model of the H atom using the wrong observation. A somewhat trivial yet interesting piece of science history. Or not.

  28. theef says

    I’ve never so thoroughly fucked up my html tags as I just did in my previous post. Dear lord, that doesn’t exist, deliver to that fictional place.

  29. dapartypoopah says

    How self serving…

    I can do somewhat the same

    And PZ Meyers answered and said to him;

    PZ: I conspire you with the living misogynist, tell us, are you Thunderf00t? The son of the MRA?

    TF: You say so, but I can assure all of you, the stuff that happens at the cons is not that terrible, its actually a non issue

    Then PZ Meyers ripped of TF’s clothes and screamed;

    PZ: He is a blasphemer!!! How many witnesses do we need? You heard it yourselves! What is your judgement?

    They answered and said;

    FTB: BAN HIM!

    Then they spat in his face and punched him in the stomach, some even punched him in the face and asked;

    FTB: Tell us Thunderf00t, who is being harassed now?

  30. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    Dapartyshitter, you got only one detail right, that Thunderfooling was part of the foolishness.

    Hardly surprising giving your track record for thread shitting.

  31. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    ‘Tis, dapartyshitter has been around long enough, I think he did that just for the little trollish touch. Not a mistake. Just like his distilling of the ThunderingFool clusterfuck was not a mistake.

    Just an other dishonest dingleberry.

  32. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    How self serving…

    I can do somewhat the same

    Minus the accuracy or wit, yes you can.

  33. Gnumann, quisling of the MRA nation says

    I can do somewhat the same

    No, you can’t. Why do you feel the need to lie to us and present evidence of your lie in your own post? Are you some sort of sick sub person* trying to con us into yelling at you.

    *(This might be misunderstood, so a little clarification: There’s nothing wrong in being a sub, so long you seek consenting doms to satisfy your desires. Trying to get your lust satisfied by unconsenting strangers on the other hand…)

  34. dapartypoopah says

    ah come on, everybody can write a self serving scenario. You have to admit it was pretty funny to use the prosecution of Jesus and superimpose that into this scenario.

    No? Not funny?

    srry.

  35. Gaebolga says

    You know, the fact that PZ outed theef as wordplague gives us an interesting opportunity for research.

    Given that the SockPuppet™ went so far as to intentionally insert a fair number of misspellings in hir “original” persona’s (i.e. wordplague’s) posts (presumably as a means of differentiating those from hir “secondary” persona [i.e. theef]) – and even tried to gaslight everyone with the whole “he was using a proxy IP like a typical script kiddie” (as theef; #12 in the Navy, you’ve got a nasty little worm in the works thread) – I have to wonder what the point was?

    I suppose it doesn’t take that much effort to post mostly incoherent ramblings with copious intentional errors for hours and hours and hours on end and then “Sock Up” and play the “he was obviously a lying troll” objective-observer role, but I still don’t understand what s/he gets out of it.

    Especially the Sock part of the plan (and it does seem rather obviously planned).

    So, wordtheef, are you willing to do your part for Science©?

    What was the point of it all?

  36. Matt Penfold says

    You know, the fact that PZ outed theef as wordplague gives us an interesting opportunity for research.

    No he didn’t. He outed someone posting as PeterHearn as posting using the same IP address as Wordplague.

  37. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    No? Not funny?

    It was the same old whining that we all have heard from the MRA defenders of ThunderingFool.

    Oh, wait, you thought that recasting the meme as a transparent passion play with PZ as Pontius Pilatus and ThunderingFool as The King Of The MRAs would be funny.

    I guess this is too sophisticated for me.

  38. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    No he didn’t. He outed someone posting as PeterHearn as posting using the same IP address as Wordplague.

    He did?

    By the way, theef…his IP address matched exactly one other person in the database. You. Which makes me suspect dishonest troll playing games even more.

    it may look that way, because it follows a comment by PZ to peterhearn but I’m pretty sure since he was talking about WP’s IP address that the teef comment was about WP ip and not Peterhearn.

  39. Gaebolga says

    Matt Penfold wrote:

    You know, the fact that PZ outed theef as wordplague gives us an interesting opportunity for research.

    No he didn’t. He outed someone posting as PeterHearn as posting using the same IP address as Wordplague.

    Hmm. I just reread PZ’s paired posts over on the Navy/worm thread, and I can see how they could be read that way (as “WP = PeterHearn”), as well.

    So now I’m confused.

    Hey PZ!

    Which interpretation is correct: wordplague = theef or wordplague = PeterHearn?

  40. Matt Penfold says

    You’re incorrect. PZ outed theef as having the same IP as wordplague.

    I missed that comment. Sorry.

  41. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    If only a wordplague were just that, rorchach. It would be funny.

  42. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    theef may or may not be wordplague, but having the same IP is not trivially a reliable indicator. There’s more to be considered.

    I am not that guy who spammed a thread to show off his skillz — I forget his nym, but Brownian may remember the incident — but we had the same IP.

    ‘Twas a time, for instance, when all AOL users had the same IP, or the same dozen IPs or something like that.

  43. Louis says

    Ixchel,

    I am not that guy who spammed a thread to show off his skillz

    Says you. I have long suspected that you are, in fact, Rebecca Watson.

    Louis

    P.S. Louis’ Law: As an argument progresses on any comment thread the probability that someone will be compared to Rebecca Watson tends towards 1.

  44. 'Tis Himself says

    I doubt PZ would have commented about PeterHearn and theef having the same IP. Considering the OP was about wordplaque’s IP, I believe PZ was connecting wordplaque and theef.

  45. Gaebolga says

    An Excellent Plan’s Law: As this thread progresses, the probability that Hitler will be compared to Rebecca Watson tends towards 1.

    At which point the slime-pitters will decry the insult done to Hitler.

  46. says

    ‘Twas a time, for instance, when all AOL users had the same IP, or the same dozen IPs or something like that.

    That’s a different animal from having the same .mil IP, though. Still may not be the same person, but it’s much more likely than two AOL accounts being the same person.

  47. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    I have long suspected that you are, in fact, Rebecca Watson.

    I confess. I am also Richard Dawkins.

  48. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    That’s a different animal from having the same .mil IP, though. Still may not be the same person, but it’s much more likely than two AOL accounts being the same person.

    Agreed, although the AOL example was an extreme, since there were millions of people with the same IP.

    I’m not aware of anything interesting at Bremerton.

  49. Paul says

    theef may or may not be wordplague, but having the same IP is not trivially a reliable indicator. There’s more to be considered.

    Consider that theef took right off after PZ pointed out he caught the sockpuppet. He didn’t even trivially deny it. He’s engaging in local damage control, most likely. Possibly trying to say that he lost/someone stole his login credentials/tokens (not sure what they use there) or some such.

  50. says

    From the Dungeon page:

    “Chris” Amazing asshole. He took offense that anyone thought his sloppy programming skills were pathetic, and went on a spamming jag, dumping kilobytes of German song lyrics on the site…apparently, being able to use copy and paste was the acme of coding proficiency to this bozo.

    That the guy you’re thinking of?

  51. 'Tis Himself says

    I’m not aware of anything interesting at Bremerton.

    There’s a fair-sized Navy base there, a large shipyard, and a squadron of missile submarines operate out of there.

  52. says

    Paul:

    He’s engaging in local damage control, most likely.

    That was my thought, too.

    There is likely someone in some serious trouble right about now. I’m probably not nice, but I want a detailed account of how this is all going down right now.

  53. dapartypoopah says

    “It was the same old whining that we all have heard from the MRA defenders of ThunderingFool.”

    It was more to illustrate how foolish writing a self serving scenario is instead of saying whether or not PZ was right and TF was wrong.

    Too bad I didn’t make it to the next round of FTB’s next top comedian.

  54. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    And yet again, the original meaning of this thread goes right past dapartyshitter’s head.

    So sorry that you failed at an event that never existed.

  55. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    Wasn’t it just chris? Then he started changing it around after the initial banning. [...] That the guy you’re thinking of?

    That sounds right.

    Consider that theef took right off after PZ pointed out he caught the sockpuppet.

    Oh, I’m not arguing against any social indicators. I just wanted people to be aware that an IP is not a trivial for-sure indicator.

    There’s a fair-sized Navy base there, a large shipyard, and a squadron of missile submarines operate out of there.

    Heh, I know. Maybe I should be clearer: I’m not aware of anything interesting on the base’s network. (Nothing off the top of my head when I posted #69, and I double checked between my #69 and #79.)

  56. dapartypoopah says

    “And yet again, the original meaning of this thread goes right past dapartyshitter’s head.”

    LOL, somebody is cranky today. I have no problem with the original meaning of this thread, I joined in the blaming party, I have no problem with that I find it a good idea actually. I just had a problem with writing a self serving scenario. I choose the name partypoopah cause I like the play the devil’s advocate. I am only here to read blogs and sometimes post a comment that might, note the word MIGHT, incite exchange of ideas. I don’t care for writing a comment that everybody agrees with.

  57. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    You’re a fucking troll, making rationalizations for trolling. It’s impossible to write a comment that everyone here agrees with, unless it is something extremely trivial like “the sun will come up tomorrow” or “bachelors are unmarried”. Don’t flatter yourself; you aren’t novel.

  58. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    Not cranky, dapartyshitter. Just amused that you think that your tired devil’s advocate act MIGHT incite an exchange.

    Here is a clue; if your attempt looks like all of the earlier attempts at trolling that has been going on, you have fucking failed.

    Idiot.

  59. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    I just had a problem with writing a self serving scenario.

    Except it does a pretty damn good job of accurately illustrating the whole big fat incident.

    I don’t care for writing a comment that everybody agrees with.

    you rebel you

  60. dapartypoopah says

    Good god, I opened a can of worms. If you think I am trolling so be it, everybody is entitled to their opinion.

  61. says

    dapartypoopah:

    I am only here to read blogs and sometimes post a comment that might, note the word MIGHT, incite exchange of ideas.

    An exchange of ideas is something like this:

    dpp: The scenario as written is a poor analogy, as it isn’t analogous to the original situation in these ways: lists analogy fails

    nTB: Ah! But you miss how a fire in a garbage can is a mild fire event, and being hit on after saying no once is a mild offense, but both should be reported and accounted for because of these reasons: list of reasons why analogy fits

    That’s an exchange of ideas.

    What you did is called assertion without evidence.

    </self-serving-scenario>

  62. Matt Penfold says

    Good god, I opened a can of worms. If you think I am trolling so be it, everybody is entitled to their opinion.

    You fucking admitted you trolled. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not to their own facts, and the simple fact is you admitted to trolling.

  63. 'Tis Himself says

    If you’re not a troll then you’re doing an excellent imitation of one. You’re playing troll so well it’s difficult to tell the difference between you and an actual troll. Congratulations, you fooled all of us.

  64. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    You have opened nothing. You were talking in a way that was indistinguishable from all of the other MRA trolls.

    Meh.

  65. Cipher, OM, Fighting Fucktoy says

    Consider that theef took right off after PZ pointed out he caught the sockpuppet.

    Well, to be completely fair, if theef isn’t wordplague, that revelation would be super awkward.
    I mean, I’m not saying xe’s not, especially after the pest was bragging about how he’d just come back under another nym, but I’m not sure I’d know how to respond if the situation occurred where I was posting under the same IP as a fuckhead troll.

  66. dapartypoopah says

    Ok thanks for the tip but I think I will keep doing it my way. More often then not if somebody writes a scenario that promotes or proves their point of view its going to be biased. I agree that the fire analogy is pretty good, the whole scenario, script, whatever you want to call it, is pretty self serving. Its always going to be biased since someone who has an idea about the whole situation is writting down what the opposition is going to say in a fictional situation, how is that not going to be biased?

  67. 'Tis Himself says

    It seems like pretty much every time someone says “I’m playing devil’s advocate” they really mean “I’m going to argue against the consensus but I don’t have any evidence to support my attempted rebuttal.”

  68. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    How is this article not one giant Burning Man?

    I know I’m drunk already.

  69. Matt Penfold says

    Ok thanks for the tip but I think I will keep doing it my way.

    Check out the rules for commenting here. Trolling is a bannable offence.

  70. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    Now where’s my tricycle disguised as a mushroom?

  71. dapartypoopah says

    Well I am truly sorry if it looked like I was trolling, I can assure you I am not. I am here to read blogs and interact with the FTB community, not for cheap attention, if I want to troll I will go to youtube or reddit.

  72. says

    dapartypoopah:

    I agree that the fire analogy is pretty good, the whole scenario, script, whatever you want to call it, is pretty self serving.

    Of course it’s self-serving. That’s the entire point. What would be the point of an analogy if it didn’t actually, y’know, serve to illustrate the problem?

    Its always going to be biased since someone who has an idea about the whole situation is writting down what the opposition is going to say in a fictional situation, how is that not going to be biased?

    What’s written down is essentially what the MRAs have already said, only in analogy form.

    What you are arguing against is the usefulness of analogies at all.

    That’s not a very tenable position.

  73. Janine: Fucking Dyke Of Rage Mountain says

    Feel free, dapartyshitter. You have enough of a track record to show that I have no reason to think that you will be able to challenge my bias.

  74. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Now where’s my tricycle disguised as a mushroom?

    Parked next to the pickup dressed up as a deep sea fishing trawler crawling with half naked fish men and women, and shrimp.

  75. dapartypoopah says

    well I really try my best to be as non trollish about this as possible, I try to give points to things I agree with and state what I don’t agree with. Maybe I am just being stupid, its a common tendency of people being stupid that they don’t know they are being stupid, but I am trying to be calm and responsive. If I broke rules of conduct I will admit I was ignorant about that and will change my attitude on this blog.

  76. 'Tis Himself says

    a deep sea fishing trawler crawling with half naked fish men and women, and shrimp.

    Parked next to the hovercraft full of eels.

  77. says

    dapartypoopah:

    If I broke rules of conduct I will admit I was ignorant about that and will change my attitude on this blog.

    I, for one, do not think you were intentionally trolling. Presenting a vague assertion with neither evidence nor specific examples, yes. Failing to clarify your vague assertions when it became obvious you had not communicated well in the first place, yes. Saying stupid things, yes.

    But not intentionally trolling.

  78. Matt Penfold says

    I, for one, do not think you were intentionally trolling. Presenting a vague assertion with neither evidence nor specific examples, yes. Failing to clarify your vague assertions when it became obvious you had not communicated well in the first place, yes. Saying stupid things, yes.

    But not intentionally trolling.

    He admitted doing it!

    I choose the name partypoopah cause I like the play the devil’s advocate. I am only here to read blogs and sometimes post a comment that might, note the word MIGHT, incite exchange of ideas. I don’t care for writing a comment that everybody agrees with.

  79. 'Tis Himself says

    dapartypoopah,

    Just as a suggestion, you might want to lurk for a few hours or a day or two to get a feel for the mores and customs of this blog. You’ll discover we care much less about how you say something compared to what you say.

  80. says

    Matt Penfold:

    He admitted doing it!

    I read that a bit differently. The whole “devil’s advocate” thing is often used by trolls as a Get Out Of Jail Free card, but the last sentence seemed to suggest he would rather post an honest but opposing viewpoint than simply post to agree with other folks.

    I just wrote it off to his poor communication abilities.

    Maybe I was being too generous.

  81. Paul says

    Well, to be completely fair, if theef isn’t wordplague, that revelation would be super awkward.

    So here’s the thing. If you know enough about networking to state that you’re behind proxies, you know enough to state that “same IP != same person” due to various network configurations. I’ve been accused of sockpuppeting before (hell, some of Mooney’s commenters accused me of being PZ!).

    If he was legitimately “not the same person” on a NMCI network with a common IP, user login data would demonstrate that and he’d have no real reason to be concerned.

  82. Matt Penfold says

    I read that a bit differently. The whole “devil’s advocate” thing is often used by trolls as a Get Out Of Jail Free card, but the last sentence seemed to suggest he would rather post an honest but opposing viewpoint than simply post to agree with other folks.

    I just wrote it off to his poor communication abilities.

    Maybe I was being too generous.

    Maybe, or maybe I am not being generous enough. To me it read like the views may or may not be ones he genuinely holds. Of course, it some ways the issue is moot, since if he really does hold them then the criticism of him being sexist holds, and if he does not, then he was trolling. Neither would reflect well on him.

  83. ixchel, the jaguar goddess of midwifery and war ॐ says

    hell, some of Mooney’s commenters accused me of being PZ!

    That’s ridiculous. Mooney is PZ.

  84. 'Tis Himself says

    That’s ridiculous. Mooney is PZ.

    I thought Mooney was Tom Johnson Wally Smith? Or was that Anthony McCartney?

  85. says

    Matt Penfold:

    Of course, it some ways the issue is moot, since if he really does hold them then the criticism of him being sexist holds, and if he does not, then he was trolling. Neither would reflect well on him.

    Same thing here. If he’s trolling, he’s an asshole. If he’s being honest, he’s being stupid.

    It would be nice to know which one it is, though, now that you’ve introduced me to that doubt. It’d change how I interact with him.

  86. Paul says

    That’s ridiculous. Mooney is PZ.

    Rebecca Watson came up with the whole idea of Accomodationism, and put PZ up to this.

  87. Gaebolga says

    Rebecca Watson decimated Europe in the fourteenth century.

    Also, she’s transmitted by fleas on rats.

  88. What a Maroon, el papa ateo says

    More often then not if somebody writes a scenario that promotes or proves their point of view its going to be biased.

    To clarify, PZ didn’t write the fire scenario.

    Also, Rebecca Watson poops parties.

  89. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    I’m not aware of anything interesting at Bremerton.

    Back in ’64 (Seattle World’s Fair), the battleship USS Missouri was mothballed at Bremerton. The Navy gave tours to civilians since the official Japanese surrender document was signed on its main deck. A nice plaque showed where the table sat for the signing. A very narrow space acually.

    The 16″ main guns were very impressive.

    I believe the USS Missouri is now at Pearl Harbor.

  90. dapartypoopah says

    Stupid, yeah, asshole, probably, but sexist? How was my comment sexist?

  91. osmosis says

    Stupid, yeah, asshole, probably, but sexist? How was my comment sexist?

    I’m going to frame this and put it on my wall.

  92. says

    ?> hell, some of Mooney’s commenters accused me of being PZ!

    > That’s ridiculous. Mooney is PZ.

    That’s ridiculous. Rebecca Watson is PZ.