You know all those distressing satellite photos of retreating glaciers and open water in the arctic? Or how about those terrible photos of the ravaged landscapes around the Canadian oil sands? Worry no more. They’re going to be gone.
Oh, we’ll still be wrecking the environment, but you won’t see pictures of it now. Donald Trump has a new vision for NASA, and it involves turning a blind eye earthward.
Donald Trump is poised to eliminate all climate change research conducted by Nasa as part of a crackdown on “politicized science”, his senior adviser on issues relating to the space agency has said.
Nasa’s Earth science division is set to be stripped of funding in favor of exploration of deep space, with the president-elect having set a goal during the campaign to explore the entire solar system by the end of the century.
This is far more political than maintaining the earth science program, which provides immediately useful information and unambiguous returns on investment. You know why he’s cutting these programs.
This would mean the elimination of Nasa’s world-renowned research into temperature, ice, clouds and other climate phenomena. Nasa’s network of satellites provide a wealth of information on climate change, with the Earth science division’s budget set to grow to $2bn next year. By comparison, space exploration has been scaled back somewhat, with a proposed budget of $2.8bn in 2017.
Revealing reality is now political, especially when your views have nothing to do with reality.
Although…maybe it’s psychological. Looking at ourselves and our own planet is too much like introspection, and we know the Donald doesn’t do that self-awareness thing.
Oh, come on now! Can’t you see how forward looking The Donald is?
Get NASA to do all of the expensive research and development to going into deep space for planetary exploration. Have NASA set pre-positioned supplies in place on exotic locales like Mars.
Then, once he’s out of office, open a new Trump resort on Mars.
Or maybe he won’t wait, the taxpayers won’t mind…
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Ah yes, the old “Burn all the evidence you can get your hands on so you look right” school of political thought.
This is at least normal for republican governments, and isn’t the special unique brand of evil that Trump is bringing.
Been there, done that.
Remember when the Bush administration announced their Manned Mission to Mars initiative? (Hint: it was 2004). In which NASA set a high priority on something that still appears, 12 years later, to be impossible? And which cannibalized funding from all other NASA missions, including Earth-bound climate studies?
So now Trump is doing pretty much the same thing, but he lacks the political finesse of George W. Bush.
Can’t make this shit up.
add – But it wasn’t all wasted effort.
Bush Still Working On Manned Mission To Mars Quietly In Spare Time (September 2010)
Cross posted from the Moments of Political Madness thread.
Trump plans to gut NASA’s climate research division. He believes the rightwing conspiracy theories that say the research done by NASA is “heavily politicized” according to Trump advisor, Bob Walker.
Talking Points Memo link
Several pundits have excitedly reported that, in his interview with the NYT, Trump acknowledged that human activities play some role in global warming. To hell with what Trump says. Cutting funding for climate research is what he will do.
Read more: http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2016/11/05/discuss-moments-of-political-madness-6/#ixzz4Qs4OpLnW
I’m surprised they haven’t gone after CDC yet because vaccine something something.
While there may not be any new satellites by NASA launched during the Trump Dark Ages, the working satellites can send data to anybody who can receive the signal. Why not the Caymans, or Bermuda?
This is a very old strategy.
Killing the messenger of bad news.
And a common one.
When Argentina ran into serious economic problems, their president just stopped reporting economic statistics.
When Brownback wrecked Kansas, he…stopped reporting economic statistics.
When Trump wrecks the US and its economy he will just…(probably) stop reporting economic statistics.
Or do what the old Soviet Union did. Just make them up
Welcome to the post-fact world.
Not surprised but still shocked.
I’ve said for years that we weren’t going to do anything about CO2 emissions.
It’s not obvious that we even can. Our civilization runs on fossil fuels and money.
There is a bright side. Sort of.
It doesn’t matter whether you believe in global warming or not. It’s irrelevant.
It will happen anyway. Reality doesn’t care what you believe.
Ironically, the areas most effected by sea level rise are all hardcore Trump areas. The southeast Atlantic coast and the gulf coast. We won’t have to worry when they flood. Just tell them it is impossible because the seas aren’t rising.
PS Don’t believe they are suddenly going to start funding deep space missions either. The budget for the next weather satellite to Jupiter will be about what I spend on drinks and snacks.
Next on the chopping block.
Biology especially evolutionary biology.
During the Bush administration, it was known to be unwise to have evolution anywhere in the title of your paper or grant application.
I’m wondering if they will appoint a creationist to head the NSF or NIH.
Naw, it will be a faith healer for NIH.
re 11:
umm, didn’t he try and Ben Carson declined saying he didn’t think he could run an entire department?
I will repeat the comment so many have already made. Dr. Carson you wanted to run the ENTIRE country but a single department is TOO MUCH??? Were you really asleep during your campaign as you often appeared? *gulp*
adding to @12:
ak
what a surprise, NOT.
from:
http://www.ifyouonlynews.com/education/trump-hires-christian-fundamentalist-who-doesnt-believe-in-public-schools-as-secretary-of-education/
Man, he’s really out to stomp everything, in every way possible; whether by defunding or putting objectors in charge of the department they hate. *barf*
tpyo: objectors –>contrarians
If all it took to talk him out of torture was a “tough guy” general, maybe one of these people could talk him out of this.
If it comes to pass, the scientists who work in the areas he wants to fund should stand in solidarity with their colleagues, the scientific enterprise, and…the entire world and conscientiously resign from or refuse to accept NASA jobs.
Unfortunately Trump and the republican party would be delighted if science obligingly gutted itself over a matter of principle. I just can’t decide where all the surplus cash would go. “Defense” or straight into their own personal pockets?
But perhaps someone could explain to Trump what global warming will do to property values, particularly where golf courses and resorts are concerned…
Yeah, like what happens when Mar a Lago floods due to global warming….
OK, I’ll concede Trump is an anti-science goon, IF HE FOLLOWS THROUGH ON THIS.
Reginald – Have you forgotten that Obama also plans for a manned mission to Mars? http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/11/opinions/america-will-take-giant-leap-to-mars-barack-obama/
Just one of many instances of Obama going along with, or even expanding on, Junior’s stupid plans. (Domestic spying, drone murders, … the list goes on and on.)
If Robert Walker is a former chairman of the U.S. House Science, Space and Technology Committee this does not say much for the knowledge base of Republican congressman. Well he might not be as bad as Lamar Smith but, somehow a Congressman on the U.S. House Science, Space and Technology Committee who does not seem to know what the IPCC is does not give me confidence
There is a fascinating interview with him on the CBC program As It Happen. He does not even get the memes correct!
Interview and transcript available at
http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/as-it-happens-wednesday-edition-1.3864045/trump-adviser-wants-to-cut-nasa-climate-change-research-calls-it-politicized-science-1.3864051
@17 Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls
Yeah, like what happens when Mar a Lago floods due to global warming
I was thinking about that the other day. Anyone know the altitude of Mar a Lago?
It wouldn’t have to be done “obligingly.” It would need to be a form of collective action, well organized and in coordination with scientists and scientific institutions in other countries. And without research, projects couldn’t go ahead.
He already knows. He cares only about himself in the immediately foreseeable future.
According to Google Earth, about 12 feet max at the main building. The tennis courts, only 2 ft.
As an aside, I’m from Battle Creek, the Cereal City, and Mar a Lago was originally owned by the daughter of C.W. Post, of Post Cereals fame….
I was not hoping for it exactly, but I figured that if Matthew went ashore near Mar a Lago and seriously damaged it, it would be a silver lining in all the associated destruction.
Luckily, it didn’t hit Florida nearly as hard as it might have.
“The Seas Are Rising Around Donald Trump: He may deny global warming, but it’s still threatening to swamp his properties.”
There’s a good reason why feel comfortable on a bluff about 60 ft higher than Lake Michigan.
Trump doesn’t have policies, just grudges. He’s the bully in the school yard who wants to steal lunch money from the nerds. It’s not that he doesn’t believe in climate change. He doesn’t care. It’s not part of his narrative, except that scientists are part of the “elites” he detests so much.
The Trump Presidency will have consequences on geologic timescales. Stratigraphic columns and the fossil record will be different because a bunch of assholes couldn’t be bothered to get off their asses and vote for the lesser of two evils. So, you know who you are, and fuck you very, very much.
a_ray_in_dilbert_space: “because a bunch of assholes couldn’t be bothered to get off their asses and vote for the lesser of two evils. So, you know who you are, and fuck you very, very much.”
Man, here’s my chance to get in on the ground floor of today’s Pharyngula Circular Firing Squad, and I’ve got to go to bed!
No circular firing squad, Zep. Sorry to disappoint. Good luck finding your pecker tonight…
If we avoid the endless infighting of previous threads tonight, it certainly won’t be for your lack of trying to bring your self-serving party political resentments into yet another discussion where everyone is basically on the same side, friend.
Derail OT:
Trump is ranting against Wind Turbines, “…steel goes into the atmosphere…” raising lots of tweet rebuttals about “steel does not evaporate so WHA?”
I think that Trump’s mangling of the language is trying to point out that steel production, by needing lots of Heath, usually from coal burning, also puts a lot of CO2 into the atmosphere. The rebuttal to throwing that fact in, is to point out that most of wind turbines are carbon fiber, not steel.
He also rants about Turbines being killers of birds, while facts are that bird collisions are quite rare like, coal plants kill far more birds than wind turbines.
Still FACTS are a complete mystery to Trump.
re 30:
typo alert
Heath-> heatmaybe obvious from context, but gotta fix shit irregardless
nothing has happened yet and it already looks like it is too late and the result will be another failed business for trump and a shit hole for us.
uncle frogy
Also, most steel in the US has a significant amount of recycled steel. Not as bad if they use just taconite and coal to make the steel from scratch.
The carbon intensity of wind and solar and other electric production methods has been well studied. Of course they’re not neutral, and they never will be, but they’re orders of magnitude better than fossil fuels. Nuclear and hydro tend to be worse as well, but still far better than fossil fuels.
The exact numbers of course depend on the local characteristics (how much wind, how much sun, how much seismic activity, how much water flows / how much organic material is there in the water coming in to the reservoir).
numerobis, the exact numbers are changing… and therefore so are the economics.
Issue at hand is that coal and oil are fuels, and so is wind, and so is sunlight — but the latter two are free.
In every case one needs plant to generate electricity, but in the latter, that’s all one needs.
(Coal and oil companies are fuel companies, not power companies)
“Mr President, we just lost Florida. No-one saw the hurricanes coming, but we can show you some beautiful snaps of dust storms in Utopia Planitia… Mars, Mr President, Mars. Not Miami, sir, no.”
Trump even mentioned the “Climategate” emails in the NYT interview. All hail the Conspiracy-Theorist-in-Chief.
John Morales: while the fuel is carbon-free for wind and solar, there’s the very considerable bit about construction that you have to amortize over the life of the power plant.
Re: Salty Current (#21):
My impression of the Republican approach to science is that it has to have military applications or be of “immediate” economic use, such as turning lead into gold or drinking water into oil (Yay DAPL!). Anything else is useless and / or offends their delicate sensibilities and should be defunded, shut down and removed from the public eye as quickly as possible.* So I still maintain that the republicans would be overjoyed at the prospect of principled scientists all over world uniting against their policies towards oblivion.
*Lest someone starts to wonder if it might not be useful after all…
Re: Rich Woods (#36):
The future cabinet of the future US president will probably be split along the lines of “Hurricanes are a hoax”, “Hurricanes are god’s punishment” and “Hurricanes? I don’t care, I live inlands.”
On the bright side, the US would still have to maintain some meteorological satellites, if only because the military needs accurate weather reports. So Florida would still see that hurricane coming. The real problem is that the funds reserved for emergency response will probably have been plundered long before then.
Wow – this seems to be even worse than Bush Jr.’s approach.
And that’s why I specified “the scientists who work in the areas he wants to fund” as being essential to resistance. (Of course, scientists in the military can’t protest in this way.) There’s some precedent: after World War II, many US and Soviet scientists (and scientists in other countries) had a vision for global science that conflicted with Cold War ideology, and they rebelled. True, they largely lost in the end, but it was a different time. And opportunistic scientists unwilling to show solidarity or defend what needs to be defended will likely regret it – accommodating to such a regime of power can only weaken their position, and they could well be next.
What I suppose I’m getting at more generally is that science is another institution that’s already been under attack from Republicans and is now going to come under unprecedented attack. The scientific community can’t afford to be apolitical – it has to organize and prepare to collectively resist and to minimize collaboration.
Prediction: thanks to Trump’s reprioritization, we will discover extra-solar life. And Trump will insist that we become a type-II Kardashev civilization and that the extra-solar life pay for the Dyson Sphere.
Re: Salty Current (#41, 42):
Fair enough but just a tad too hopeful and optmistic from where I’m standing.* No matter how awful a regime gets, they can always find scientists and engineers and all manner of specialists willing to work for them.
There will always be someone prepared to upgrade the US nuclear arsenal or build a more powerful drone, or whatever else the US military and congress may set their sights on. Even if Trump and the Republicans gut US science and education from bow to stern, there’d be people willing to carry forward those ‘special’ projects, even if they faced universal condemnation from the international scientific community for doing so. No amount of organisation and solidarity is going to change that.
“If only..” is all we’re left with, I suspect.
For instance, if only this gargantuan idiot hadn’t won the election, things would look marginally better already.
*I indulge in occasional misanthropy and dabble in pessimism. Strictly a hobby, of course. I wouldn’t dream of letting it colour my otherwise rosy worldview. Oh, hang on..
Well, I didn’t say this or any other form of resistance would necessarily be successful – only that some form of resistance like this is a moral and practical requirement if scientists aren’t going to surrender themselves and the planet to authoritarian loons bringing catastrophe and that it could conceivably be effective. But it’s probably the case that I remain, for some reason (especially since I’ve studied more than enough scientific accommodation and collapse to cure me of it), less misanthropic and pessimistic than most.