It’s not on my list of required reading, but if you tried to get a copy of the latest issue of Gospel Today at your local Southern Baptist bookstore, you might have a little difficulty: it’s been yanked from circulation. The reason: it features a cover story on female pastors.
“They basically treated it like pornography and put it behind the counter,” said Hairston, according to AP. “Unless a person goes into the store and asks for it, they won’t see it displayed.”
I’d suggest that perhaps it should be treated like pornography, as a literature that can warp impressionable minds in less than desirable ways, but not because it dares to show women in positions of authority. It actually is a little sad to see smart, ambitious women take a path into inanity like that to achieve success…but to silence their efforts? Shameful.
Of course they would remove it; their imaginary god is a freaking male and they certainly don’t want to give the impression that their god is going to share ghostly powers with a mere female, fashioned from the rib of a male. Morons.
Ironic, this is the same group pushing a female for Vice President. The disconnect in the religious mind is beyond belief.
With new evidence like this, is Sarah Palin still a young earth creationist?
That is one of the reasons why I wonder how McCain’s plan to excite the religious nutts with Sarah Paline will actually work.
Also reminds me of the time my Grandfather said something that was insulting to women. My Grandmother and his sister were talking about female pastors and he stated that pastors shouldn’t be women. Although to correct himself (He was outnumbered 4 women to one) he said in a round about “Men are to preach, women are to teach.” (still sexist, but I find some sort of humor in that.)
And is it just me or is PZ on an Italic kick lately?
Unclosed tag, making Italics Run Wild!!! (Order today, and you also get “Italics Run Wild II” for free!)
Hooray for Italics. Seriously, the entire blog is now italicized. I for one welcome our new slightly-slanted-to-the-right overlords.
Aaah italics!
There’s an interesting and thoughtful opinion piece by a moderate evangelical on this very issue at the USA Today.
It’s pretty simple.
Women bleed from their Satan hole, and like mice* are unclean. This disqualifies them from preaching the loving word of god.
* http://www.dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/
Huh. I’m not getting the italics. Could this be an unlikely case in which IE is outdoing Firefox? :)
This is one (yet anther) stance that really confuses me. I’ve seen woman that are appalled at the idea of a female pastor. Is this some sort of self hate? I don’t get it.
@SC #10 … interesting hypothesis – so I tested it.
(I’m not getting the italics either) BUT I’m not getting them in either IE or Firefox.
HA-HA SC
:P
No, the Italics have been neutralized. Firefox is still da’bomb.
(I’m not getting the italics either) BUT I’m not getting them in either IE or Firefox.
Huh, I say again. Is this because it isn’t due to the browser, or has it now been fixed? Is anyone still seeing italics?
However, I opened this post before there were any comments – no italics problem. And I was looking at it when people were mentioning the italics, and didn’t see them. So there was something going on.
That said, I have no doubt that Firefox is da bomb. The only reason I don’t have it is that my creaky old OS won’t do it. :(
PZ,
I am phenomenally impressed that you even speak out against the religious censoring themselves. This is the embodiment of your “hold nothing sacred” statement, showing the religious their own foibles, not that they’ll understand.
Either we all get to speak equally and fairly, based solely upon the validity of our arguments, or we all get to shut the hell up.
Good on ya fella.
What would Jesus be worried about a bunch of dumb crap like that for! For being an all knowledgeable wisest mind in the history of all the universe for all time, Jesus sure worries about some dumb stuff. Wow.
In defence of the SBC position on this subject the bible says:
“1Timothy 3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
1Ti 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
1Ti 3:3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
1Ti 3:4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
1Ti 3:5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
1Ti 3:6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
1Ti 3:7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.” It seems that all the credible translations of the Bible use the word “man” and all masculine pronouns in this passage. It also mentions being the “husband of one wife.” That disqualifies women in itself. By the way; the terms “bishop, pastor and elder” are used interchangably throughout the New Testament.
The prohibition on women as pastors is Biblical and refers only to matters of church leadership. The Bible says nothing about any probitions against women holding office in secular society.
What would Jesus be worried about a bunch of dumb crap like that for! For being an all knowledgeable wisest mind in the history of all the universe for all time, Jesus sure worries about some dumb stuff. Wow.
Well at least if Jesus is a Baptist, he doesn’t have to worry about being trapped inside a cracker! OMG desecration OMG Jesus don’t like being desecrated run for your liiivess!!
We have much to learn from the wisdom of Jesus, and should follow his holy example, as stipulated in the holy scripture thingies, and whatnot.
Did they also protest the Nov/Dec 2006 issue?
http://gospeltoday.com/store.php?crn=259&rn=311&action=show_detail
It features a woman pastor on the cover as well.
—
I’m not sure how I feel about this issue.
On one side, the idea that a group uses their beliefs for enforcing strict gender roles on women is really crap.
On the other side, if they keep their archaic misogynistic beliefs, it may be the catalyst to allow young women to question and ultimately reject these views when compared with the more friendly humanist world view.
Female pastors? What is the big deal. My relatives church has had female pastors for, it seem, forever. Mainline and old protestant.
I’ve even met one. She is late middle age, very smart and funny, not into dogma, and very personable.
There is a church down the road that calls itself a “community” church. They seem to be desperate for bodies because they send out a lot of mail addressed to occupant. They no longer have a permanent full time minister. And might be in serious decline. As it turns out, the community name is a front and they are affiliated with the Southern Baptists. Kind of sad, isn’t it. LOL
Clive #18
Why did you leave this one off of your 1 Timothy list?
“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.” 1 Timothy 2:11-12
Aren’t women supposed to be subservient to the husbands in general? Isn’t their primary role as mothers, raising children? If Palin gets in office, by Biblical standards shouldn’t see be ruled by her husband, making Todd “snow machine racer” Palin the actual Vice-President?
Ironic, this is the same group pushing a female for Vice President. The disconnect in the religious mind is beyond belief.
No problem, after all, the Vice-President has no authority whatsoever. But a church pastor, that’s a position of authority.
LMR #20
Just my musings but if they didn’t protest that past issue then it must mean this current one is bad because it’s pointing out how hypocritical these people are. Instead of addressing it, they just tuck it nice and neatly out of sight.
Perhaps they are fans of Dr. Sam. Johnson –
I told him I had been that morning at a meeting of the people called Quakers, where I had heard a woman preach. Johnson: “Sir, a woman’s preaching is like a dog’s walking on his hind legs. It is not done well; but you are surprised to find it done at all.”
Boswell: Life
“Unclosed tag, making Italics Run Wild!!! (Order today, and you also get “Italics Run Wild II” for free!)”
Sounds like plotline in Asterix the Gaul.
“Well at least if Jesus is a Baptist, he doesn’t have to worry about being trapped inside a cracker!”
Unless one uses the definition of “cracker” as “a poor white person in the southern United States.”
The American Taliban is alive and well. I suggest that we let the Southern states secede.
hmmm… I had an odd thought.
What if… Palin is actually a bleeding heart liberal, working for the past 4 years to get to the president.
Then once she is renounces everything she was and turns out to be a progressive humanitarian…
/I can dream
Infidel! There is no OS but Ubuntu, and Firefox is its browser!! :-p
You know, I’m thinking if Jesus ever came back, he’d spend the first decade or so suing every church for libel and slander. I always found it weird that in the Bible, he seems to have a split personality: “all you need is love”-spouting, egalitarian (had women as well as socially shunned people in his following) hippie defying the authorities on the one hand; misogynistic dude on power-trip on the other. And then in revelations (you know, when the bible authors were no longer constricted by reality), they turned him into a power-crazy madman altogether. I bet he was just another charismatic hippie who got executed for defying authorities, and whose followers rewrote his life-story to make themselves feel better.
In 1920 a vote was held to determine if the US Constitution would be amended to permit women to vote.
How did we LOSE that one?
/Here all week…try the buffet.
Now I have images of Southern Baptist young men digging out their well used and rather messy copies of Gospel Today and masturbating to the idea of women leading the pulpit.
I hope that this issue is sold in a plain brown paper wrapper.
So, is the publisher of Gospel Today more like Hugh Hefner or Larry Flynt?
Good grief, the Southern Baptists still don’t allow female preachers? I thought the Catholics were the only holdouts on this one.
Seattle’s Best Coffee has bookstores?
Gospel Today has always pushed the ultimate BDSM fantasy. The lurid stuff they peddle makes anything “Quiet Desperation” has dabbled in seem like Romper Room!
“What would Jesus be worried about a bunch of dumb crap like that for!”
It is awfully funny how the concerns of Jesus so much resemble the concerns of a bunch of wagon-circling men in positions of power.
Is that what happened to the world? An unclosed italics tag and the whole planet leans to the right…
Guess these guys wouldn’t like the Vicar of Dibley, huh?
DUH. The Southern Baptists DO SO have female pastors!!! They call them “missionaries” and send them into the most dangerous spots in the world so they don’t threaten the “old boy” network back in the states where the cushy jobs are! I ran into one of their Army Chaplains (and yes, she had to be ordained as a pastor in the SBC in order to hold that job) just the other day.
The SBC whips out the Timothy scripture when it suits them – in order to keep their men in power and out of danger. Send the women out to fight for Christ instead!
Dang! I fell off my chair.
Why is it that when women become attempt to become pastors they’re smart and ambitious, but not when men try to? Reverse sexism sucks.
SC,@ 15 :
//That said, I have no doubt that Firefox is da bomb. The only reason I don’t have it is that my creaky old OS won’t do it. :( //
Hey what OS is that? Im not aware of any OS that couldnt run Firefox.Must be Windoze 95 or something….?
#2Nerd of Redhead
Let’s not forget that by biblical valuation Sarah is only worth, at most, two thirds of any male counterpart:
“And thy estimation shall be of the male from twenty years old even unto sixty years old, even thy estimation shall be fifty shekels of silver…. And if it be a female, then thy estimation shall be thirty shekels.” [Leviticus 27:3-7]
Then there should be some deductions for serious ethical character flaws.
This proves that, according to own their beliefs, the fund-a-nuts are trying to rip off the American public!