I met an atheist the other day. He did not say he was an atheist, but I could tell by the horns on his head, and dried baby’s blood on his shirt. He was still picking his teeth with a pink plastic rattle.
Daniel Fredericksays
Wow, she beat out some pretty awesome contenders!
I didn’t honestly expect this would get any national attention.
Silisays
I like that guy! And he looks good too.
What sorta reach does he have? I’m glad that travesty is getting a wider airing, but is anyone who needs to see it, gonna?
Lagosays
I met an atheist the other day. He did not say he was an atheist, but I could tell by the horns on his head, and dried baby’s blood on his shirt. He was still picking his teeth with a pink plastic rattle.
Keith!
I “knew” him when…back when he was doing local LA TV sports. I liked him as a sports guy, but had no idea he was going to go all Edward R. Murrow on us.
Sure glad he did though.
Daniel Fredericksays
Wow, she beat out some pretty awesome contenders!
I didn’t honestly expect this would get any national attention.
Yeap, good man, that Olbermann. Good to have him on our side.
I’m especially tickled that Ms. Davis beat out both Coultergeist and O’RLY for the gold. That’s some fine company there.
True Bobsays
It sure seems that KO and his staff read a lot of good blogs. I see some fairly obscure stuff on different blogs, and then lo and behold, KO is all over it like a cheap suit.
Anyway, I was glad to see that, since she really played an ‘A’ game, against some usually pretty stiff competition.
Ted H.says
I also remember Keith when he was a local LA sportscaster. I always liked that he called long home runs ‘parabolas’. His attitude rubs me the wrong way sometimes, but I’m glad he picked up on this story. It will be interesting to see if it gets any more play.
M. Leesays
That’s beautiful . . . I was thinkin’ this wouldn’t get any further than a few blog posts, and now it’s national news. Oral diarrhea gets no finer, or as explosive, than that which gushes forth from a righteous theist. And Lincoln she mentions! What a maroon. Next she’ll speak of the Union Colonel and highly esteemed orator and lawyer, Robert Green Ingersoll.
Crudely Wrottsays
I always look forward to the Worst Person in the World segment of this otherwise predictable news program. Best Sound Track Ever in an Evening News Program! Man, it rocks!
Holbachsays
I would love to see that Davis cretin plastered on billboards all over the country in the same manner as that
billboard in Florida pertaining to “All religions are fairy
tales”. This one will proclaim with her ugly face,”This is the land of my god and I will rant it in state assembly chambers, public toilets, Fantasyland, and wherever the insane gather to have their brains cleansed of reason. Screw you Abe; you may have liberated my race, but you did not do so with my demented brain and mouth.”
steve8282says
Doesn’t this just beg for a little Daily Show treatment?
Possibly even a Back in Black segment?
I think Lewis going off on this could be priceless.
Keith is a patriot; I’ve been a fan (a fan!) of his since the SportsCenter days, but his commentaries have convinced me that he is one of the sole journalists not worried about being able to secure his next interview. He hits politicians hard, and many of them absolutely refuse to appear on his show. Perfect example of what’s wrong with the mass media in the United States. And because every other outlet doesn’t want to stick up for atheists, you probably won’t see this on any other major news program. Hell, if you search MSNBC’s website right now, you won’t find a single mention of Monique Davis because it hasn’t been covered as a news item by any of their “news” shows (rather than “opinion” shows… yeah, right).
For instance, Fox & Friends spent a good deal of this morning playing host to the “non-partisan” group of soliders, Vets for Freedom. After a very nationalistic introduction that would have made Goebbel’s a bit jealous, the brown-haired-guy-who’s-not-Steve-Doocy introduced them and let them state their message: stay the course because we don’t want our friends to have died in vain. It’s sad, I know, because my brother has lost some of his friends while in Iraq, but he’s rational enough to know that throwing more innocent kids into harm’s way isn’t the best way of honoring their sacrifice.
I get so fed up with the mass media sometimes. Makes me want to go open up the window and start screaming the Network line.
Toddsays
jfatz: …is this “framing?”
No, framing is when atheists apologize for scaring Monique Davis.
bernardasays
The only thing I don’t like about Olbermann is his anti-Clinton Obamania.
True Bobsays
Kyle, everyone who has died in Georgie and Dick’s Not-so-excellent adventure in Iraq have died in vain.
Ralphsays
“Next she’ll speak of the Union Colonel and highly esteemed orator and lawyer, Robert Green Ingersoll.”
Is this the guy you’re talking about?
Kaysays
It’s time to give Olberman some love for saying it and MSNBC some love for broadcasting it before the hate-mongerers deluge MSNBC with their hate-mail.
Ouch. You have to have really screwed up to beat out Bill-O and Coultergeist for worst person in the world.
But it’s well deserved.
Kyle W.says
True Bob,
I’m not sure I understand why you’re telling me that- I understand it fully. But, sadly, many soldiers do not. Their misconceptions about the reasons for beginning the war (and continuing it) cause to them to believe that the war is “winnable” and it will vindicate their friends’ deaths. A few, like my brother, don’t want to be there and don’t want any more of their friends to die in vain. Fox News doesn’t like to give similarly-minded soldiers much air time.
Would it be inappropriate to say that K.O. is “my own personal Jesus” in this space? ;-)
Oh, and representative Davis: “An Atheist knows that a hospital should be build instead of a church.” Madalyn Murray (later O’Hair), preamble to Murray v. Curlett, April 27, 1961
Alexandersays
I’ve been watching Countdown for a couple of years now but this will be the first time I will write to Mr. Olberman personally to thank him for giving this issue national attention.
Briansays
I’ve been watching KO for a long time, and this isn’t the first time he’s sharpened his claws on some religious douchebag in defense of atheism. It kind of makes me wonder if he might be part of our team……
Steve_Csays
I suspect that KO is an Atheist.
Raynfalasays
Time to paraphrase a little American Beauty:
Mr. Olberman, I think you just became my personal hero.
Endorsays
It’s rather ridiculous for a misogynstic bigot to be railing on a theocratic bigot, isn’t it?
Robertsays
How is Kieth Olberman a “Misogynistic Bigot?”
I’ve never heard anyone accuse him of such before. I hope you have some evidence.
it whom I’m referring to . . . though that vid IS amusing. Dunno just how much honor it does to his memory, however :/
Steve_Csays
If you were talking about Bill-O you would have a point.
But you don’t.
Milessays
When you have some time to kill, and I do mean kill, read up on when dembski’s publisher was asked by Olbermann’s producers:
As I’m sure you know, one of the main claims any scientific theory can make is predictive prowess. In other words, if a theory is true, then other things should also be verifiable experimentally, or by research. Before we make a call on your clients, can you or they provide any samples of things that intelligent design theory has predicted, which researchers have later determined to be true?
The best part of Keith Olberman’s show is when he has Rachel Maddow on, which he has been doing a lot lately (she was even guest hosting for him not long ago). She’s awesome. In fact, she is the only one on Air America that even I can stand (and I am decidedly left of center).
Milessays
And here are the “predictions” made by ID that dembski provided to Olbermann’s producers:
“Dear SNIP,
Please pass the following examples of ID’s predictive prowess on to [Keith Olbermann’s producer]:
(1) ID predicts that although there will be occasional degeneration of biological structures (both macroscopic and microscopic), most structures will exhibit function and thus serve a purpose. Thus most organs should not be vestigial, and most DNA should not be “junk DNA.” ID proponents have been saying this from the start, and they are now being vindicated. The human appendix, just in the last months, has been found to serve as a repository of friendly flora to keep the gut healthy. Similarly, seemingly useless “junk” DNA is increasingly being found to serve useful biological functions. For instance, James Shapiro and Richard Sternberg (2005) have provided a comprehensive overview of the functions of repetitive DNA-a classic type of junk DNA. Similarly, Roy Britten (2004) has outlined the functions of mobile genetic elements-another class of sequences long thought to be simply parasitic junk. In this case, ID has made potentially falsifiable predictions and neo-Darwinian theory has shown itself to be a science stopper.
(2) Many systems inside the cell represent nanotechnology at a scale and sophistication that dwarfs human engineering. Moreover, our ability to understand the structure and function of these systems depends directly on our facility with engineering principles (both in developing the instrumentation to study these systems and in analyzing what they do). Engineers have developed these principles by designing systems of their own, albeit much cruder than what we find inside the cell. Many of these cellular systems are literally machines: electro-mechanical machines, information-processing machines, signal-transduction machines, communication and transportation machines, etc. They are not just analogous to humanly built machines but, as mathematicians would say, isomorphic to them, that is, they capture all the essential features of machines. ID predicts that the cell would have such engineering features; by contrast, Darwinian theory has consistently underestimated the sophistication of the machinery inside the cell.
(3) Conservation of information results (also referred to as No Free Lunch theorems, which are well established in the engineering and mathematical literature — see http://www.EvoInfo.org) indicate that evolution requires an information source that imparts at least as much information to evolutionary processes as these processes in turn are capable of expressing. In consequence, such an information source (i) cannot be reduced to materialistic causes (e.g., natural selection), (ii) suggests that we live in an informationally open universe, and (iii) may reasonably be regarded as intelligent. The conservation of information counts as a positive theoretical reason to accept intelligent design and quantifies the informational hurdles that neo-Darwinian processes must overcome. Moreover, ID theorists have applied these results to actual biological systems to show that they are unevolvable by Darwinian means. ID has always predicted that there will be classes of biological systems for which Darwinian processes fail irremediably, and conservation of information is putting paid to this prediction.
As I’m sure you know, one of the main claims any scientific theory can make is predictive prowess. In other words, if a theory is true, then other things should also be verifiable experimentally, or by research. Before we make a call on your clients, can you or they provide any samples of things that intelligent design theory has predicted, which researchers have later determined to be true?
Look to the webpage and check out the answers. I like this one:
(1) As already mentioned, “junk-DNA” would completely undermine ID if it turned out to really be “junk”.
I don’t think these folks really grasp the concept of a “prediction that results from the theory.” I mean, how thick do you have to be to recognize that a designer capable of creating “irreducible complexity” or whatever is perfectly capable of creating/including junk DNA?
This seems to be the part they don’t get: they aren’t just positing a designer, but are implicitly imposing motivations on said designer with absolutely no basis. There is one guy there that seems to get this, but they others just run the party line.
The problem, of course, is that when they talk about “designer” what they really mean is “God of the bible who created man in his image,” and God don’t have no junk DNA. Again, they are trapped by their religious paradigm, and not looking at it scientifically.
(3) Conservation of information results (also referred to as No Free Lunch theorems, which are well established in the engineering and mathematical literature — see http://www.EvoInfo.org) indicate… blah blah blah
Mark Chu-Carroll does a good job of refuting this nonsense, if anyone’s interested.
Kyle W.says
I’m waiting to hear more of Endor’s accusation of misogyny. As a regular viewer of Olbermann’s show, I can’t say that I’ve witnessed any bigotry from Keith. Rachel Maddow is one of his most-frequented commentators, and she even hosted his show on April 4th. Sure, Papa Bear O’Reilly lets Laura Ingraham host his show but, hell, she’s a misogynist- a label you’d have trouble applying to Maddow.
J. D. Macksays
Yay! That was great!
Now I’m looking forward to this week’s episode of NPR’s “Wait Wait Don’t Tell Me” – which is taped in Chicago.
J. D.
stogoesays
The only thing I don’t like about Olbermann is his anti-Clinton Obamania.
Sorry, bernarda, but Clinton can’t win the nomination without:
a) having the party’s ruling elite negate the elections;
b) destroying the Democratic party; and
c) sabotaging her own chances of winning the general election.
She fought well, but she has lost the primary. The only thing left is for her to admit it.
hammerfacesays
I suppose us people from the mythical Outland (as in not from the US) should be flattered, but I’m sure there are SOME bad people outside of America that would qualify for that list. I mean Jeez, it’s like your World Series. It isn’t.
Brian Knoblocksays
I’ve only been watching “Countdown” after he gave a birthday greeting to Joel Hodgson of MST3k. I’ve liked this guy since his Sportscenter days (the Big Show still the best combo in SC history) and giving us Atheists a nod, being a MSTie and former sports reporter makes his show better. I don’t agree with him on everything (especially his take on the Subprime mortgage mess), but his constant ripping of “Bill-O” and “Coultergeist” is the best. Gotta’ love that Steve Doocy impression.
David Marjanović, OMsays
Dembski:
(1) ID predicts that although there will be occasional degeneration of biological structures (both macroscopic and microscopic), most structures will exhibit function and thus serve a purpose. Thus most organs should not be vestigial, and most DNA should not be “junk DNA.”
So he says ID is wrong — over half of our genomes consists of retrovirus corpses in various stages of decay.
I mean Jeez, it’s like your World Series. It isn’t.
The World Series is named after the newspaper that originally sponsored it, the New York World.
David Marjanović, OMsays
Dembski:
(1) ID predicts that although there will be occasional degeneration of biological structures (both macroscopic and microscopic), most structures will exhibit function and thus serve a purpose. Thus most organs should not be vestigial, and most DNA should not be “junk DNA.”
So he says ID is wrong — over half of our genomes consists of retrovirus corpses in various stages of decay.
I mean Jeez, it’s like your World Series. It isn’t.
The World Series is named after the newspaper that originally sponsored it, the New York World.
David Marjanović, OMsays
Great video.
Is the pronunciation “ay-thee-est” normal?
David Marjanović, OMsays
Great video.
Is the pronunciation “ay-thee-est” normal?
True Bobsays
David, I prefer the emphasis on the first syllable, myself, used as an adjective. It describes me but doesn’t name me, that way.
Alexandersays
For those who suggested that KO might be non-religious, here’s a quote i found from him:
“And not to let the facts get in the way of FOF’s (Focus On Family) prejudice, but I happen to be a religious man. I believe in God, I pray daily, and if I’ve ever gotten any direct instructions from my maker, they were that I’ll be judged by whether I tried to help other people, or hurt them. Also, that true belief should not be worn like a policeman’s club, nor used like one.”
I’m afraid that I’ll have to dissent from Olbermann’s analysis. As disgusted as I am by Davis, she really doesn’t compare to the ironically named JohnBest.
noncarborundumsays
I mean Jeez, it’s like your World Series. It isn’t.
The World Series is named after the newspaper that originally sponsored it, the New York World.
The big problem is how she might take the whole Democratic presidential push down with her.
hammerface: A little hyperbole for alliteration, that’s all it is.
wrpdsays
I have been an Obermann fan for several years. Being totally and wilfully ignorant of sports, I never knew him before Countdown. And Rachel Maddow is the best. She has a real doctorate. Her dissertation was on women’s prison movies from the 30s, I think. But I could be wrong. She did a killer job subbing for KO last Friday.
MelMsays
See the Lincoln page at “Positive Atheism”. It’s quite amazing.
My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures, have become clearer and stronger with advancing years and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them.
And, the above link contains many more quotes from and about Lincoln and his view of religion.
Also, this essay ( Religion vs. Free Speech ) by Craig Biddle at “The Objective Standard” is a warning about what’s ahead.
…there is no way for a serious religionist to take a principled stand against obeying His will. This is why even the most rational theologian of all time, Thomas Aquinas, insisted on the death penalty for verbal or written offenses against God. “Blasphemy is vilification of God’s excellence and goodness,” wrote Aquinas. “Of its nature, vilification of God’s goodness is a fatal sin. . . . [B]lasphemy which intends to harm God’s honour is graver, simply speaking, than murder, the gravest sin against our fellowmen.”
Roger Scottsays
Wow! Being an Australian I have not seen this chap before. It is very encouraging that he actually manages to get airtime in the Christian Republic of USA.
MelMsays
Although the nutters have made some holes in the wall-of-separation (the court system), the U.S. is not a Christian Republic (if it had been, the Kitzmiller v Dover case would not have gone in our favor–as have other cases since then). The nutter’s “Christian Nation” cult propaganda aside, the U.S. is still a secular government. The Founders had plenty of theocratic models to choose from but they did not create a theocracy.
I do not believe that the majority of Americans fully understand what the “Christian Nation” fanatics or doing. As we see exposed in the book (Liars For Jesus), and in many other ways (ID, “teach the controversy”, “academic freedom”, “moment of silence”, etc) the movement is a huge fraud–it takes my breath away with the brazenness of it’s spin and lies (look up doublethink). We must do everything we can to expose the nutters and their “Christian Nation” goals.
We are trying to save reason, science, the U.S., our freedom, and–I believe–our lives. Make no mistake, it’s that serious but it’s not over yet by a long shot.
I’m shocked this hit Countdown so quickly – I didn’t think this would hit anybody’s radar outside the blogosphere. Excellente! And it’s possibly going to be highlighted on Carpetbagger’s “This Week In God” – I sent Steve Benen the story, and he said it was a story that has “TWIG” written all over it. Happiness!
LeeLeeONesays
Second Hit for Davis!
Yet ANOTHER WPITW vote!
In the msnbc website that titles KO’s WPINTW, Titled Lamont blameless in lieberman case.
Ms. Davis – whilst no longer holding the #1 spot on 04/09, nonetheless holds a #3 spot with WPITW with KO on 04/10!
Thank you Keith Obermann and thank you MSNBC.
wrpdsays
I just heard on Olbermann that the legislator, Monique Davis, has apologized to Rob Sherman. The quote KO gave sounded like a cop-out. She says she was upset at hearing about shootings in a school that same day and just lashed out. I’m not sure if I buy that. I’ll have to hear more.
Loves me some Olberman.
I met an atheist the other day. He did not say he was an atheist, but I could tell by the horns on his head, and dried baby’s blood on his shirt. He was still picking his teeth with a pink plastic rattle.
Wow, she beat out some pretty awesome contenders!
I didn’t honestly expect this would get any national attention.
I like that guy! And he looks good too.
What sorta reach does he have? I’m glad that travesty is getting a wider airing, but is anyone who needs to see it, gonna?
I met an atheist the other day. He did not say he was an atheist, but I could tell by the horns on his head, and dried baby’s blood on his shirt. He was still picking his teeth with a pink plastic rattle.
I concur.
Keith!
I “knew” him when…back when he was doing local LA TV sports. I liked him as a sports guy, but had no idea he was going to go all Edward R. Murrow on us.
Sure glad he did though.
Wow, she beat out some pretty awesome contenders!
I didn’t honestly expect this would get any national attention.
Yeap, good man, that Olbermann. Good to have him on our side.
I’m especially tickled that Ms. Davis beat out both Coultergeist and O’RLY for the gold. That’s some fine company there.
It sure seems that KO and his staff read a lot of good blogs. I see some fairly obscure stuff on different blogs, and then lo and behold, KO is all over it like a cheap suit.
Anyway, I was glad to see that, since she really played an ‘A’ game, against some usually pretty stiff competition.
I also remember Keith when he was a local LA sportscaster. I always liked that he called long home runs ‘parabolas’. His attitude rubs me the wrong way sometimes, but I’m glad he picked up on this story. It will be interesting to see if it gets any more play.
That’s beautiful . . . I was thinkin’ this wouldn’t get any further than a few blog posts, and now it’s national news. Oral diarrhea gets no finer, or as explosive, than that which gushes forth from a righteous theist. And Lincoln she mentions! What a maroon. Next she’ll speak of the Union Colonel and highly esteemed orator and lawyer, Robert Green Ingersoll.
I always look forward to the Worst Person in the World segment of this otherwise predictable news program. Best Sound Track Ever in an Evening News Program! Man, it rocks!
I would love to see that Davis cretin plastered on billboards all over the country in the same manner as that
billboard in Florida pertaining to “All religions are fairy
tales”. This one will proclaim with her ugly face,”This is the land of my god and I will rant it in state assembly chambers, public toilets, Fantasyland, and wherever the insane gather to have their brains cleansed of reason. Screw you Abe; you may have liberated my race, but you did not do so with my demented brain and mouth.”
Doesn’t this just beg for a little Daily Show treatment?
Possibly even a Back in Black segment?
I think Lewis going off on this could be priceless.
What is with all the double-posts?
Don’t people know to hit ‘post’ and wait?
Rarely miss his show. To see him at his best, checkout his commentaries.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16270176/
…is this “framing?”
Keith is a patriot; I’ve been a fan (a fan!) of his since the SportsCenter days, but his commentaries have convinced me that he is one of the sole journalists not worried about being able to secure his next interview. He hits politicians hard, and many of them absolutely refuse to appear on his show. Perfect example of what’s wrong with the mass media in the United States. And because every other outlet doesn’t want to stick up for atheists, you probably won’t see this on any other major news program. Hell, if you search MSNBC’s website right now, you won’t find a single mention of Monique Davis because it hasn’t been covered as a news item by any of their “news” shows (rather than “opinion” shows… yeah, right).
For instance, Fox & Friends spent a good deal of this morning playing host to the “non-partisan” group of soliders, Vets for Freedom. After a very nationalistic introduction that would have made Goebbel’s a bit jealous, the brown-haired-guy-who’s-not-Steve-Doocy introduced them and let them state their message: stay the course because we don’t want our friends to have died in vain. It’s sad, I know, because my brother has lost some of his friends while in Iraq, but he’s rational enough to know that throwing more innocent kids into harm’s way isn’t the best way of honoring their sacrifice.
I get so fed up with the mass media sometimes. Makes me want to go open up the window and start screaming the Network line.
jfatz:
…is this “framing?”
No, framing is when atheists apologize for scaring Monique Davis.
The only thing I don’t like about Olbermann is his anti-Clinton Obamania.
Kyle, everyone who has died in Georgie and Dick’s Not-so-excellent adventure in Iraq have died in vain.
“Next she’ll speak of the Union Colonel and highly esteemed orator and lawyer, Robert Green Ingersoll.”
Is this the guy you’re talking about?
It’s time to give Olberman some love for saying it and MSNBC some love for broadcasting it before the hate-mongerers deluge MSNBC with their hate-mail.
Write MSNBC at: letters@msnbc.com
Include the refering URL for the video: http://www.msnbc.com/#23174985 – msnbc.com video: Obama or Hitler?
Ouch. You have to have really screwed up to beat out Bill-O and Coultergeist for worst person in the world.
But it’s well deserved.
True Bob,
I’m not sure I understand why you’re telling me that- I understand it fully. But, sadly, many soldiers do not. Their misconceptions about the reasons for beginning the war (and continuing it) cause to them to believe that the war is “winnable” and it will vindicate their friends’ deaths. A few, like my brother, don’t want to be there and don’t want any more of their friends to die in vain. Fox News doesn’t like to give similarly-minded soldiers much air time.
Would it be inappropriate to say that K.O. is “my own personal Jesus” in this space? ;-)
Oh, and representative Davis: “An Atheist knows that a hospital should be build instead of a church.” Madalyn Murray (later O’Hair), preamble to Murray v. Curlett, April 27, 1961
I’ve been watching Countdown for a couple of years now but this will be the first time I will write to Mr. Olberman personally to thank him for giving this issue national attention.
I’ve been watching KO for a long time, and this isn’t the first time he’s sharpened his claws on some religious douchebag in defense of atheism. It kind of makes me wonder if he might be part of our team……
I suspect that KO is an Atheist.
Time to paraphrase a little American Beauty:
Mr. Olberman, I think you just became my personal hero.
It’s rather ridiculous for a misogynstic bigot to be railing on a theocratic bigot, isn’t it?
How is Kieth Olberman a “Misogynistic Bigot?”
I’ve never heard anyone accuse him of such before. I hope you have some evidence.
re: Fred and the Onion
No, this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Green_Ingersoll
it whom I’m referring to . . . though that vid IS amusing. Dunno just how much honor it does to his memory, however :/
If you were talking about Bill-O you would have a point.
But you don’t.
When you have some time to kill, and I do mean kill, read up on when dembski’s publisher was asked by Olbermann’s producers:
read the whole fiasco here:
http://www.uncommondescent.com/the-design-of-life/ids-predictive-prowess/
The best part of Keith Olberman’s show is when he has Rachel Maddow on, which he has been doing a lot lately (she was even guest hosting for him not long ago). She’s awesome. In fact, she is the only one on Air America that even I can stand (and I am decidedly left of center).
And here are the “predictions” made by ID that dembski provided to Olbermann’s producers:
“Dear SNIP,
Please pass the following examples of ID’s predictive prowess on to [Keith Olbermann’s producer]:
(1) ID predicts that although there will be occasional degeneration of biological structures (both macroscopic and microscopic), most structures will exhibit function and thus serve a purpose. Thus most organs should not be vestigial, and most DNA should not be “junk DNA.” ID proponents have been saying this from the start, and they are now being vindicated. The human appendix, just in the last months, has been found to serve as a repository of friendly flora to keep the gut healthy. Similarly, seemingly useless “junk” DNA is increasingly being found to serve useful biological functions. For instance, James Shapiro and Richard Sternberg (2005) have provided a comprehensive overview of the functions of repetitive DNA-a classic type of junk DNA. Similarly, Roy Britten (2004) has outlined the functions of mobile genetic elements-another class of sequences long thought to be simply parasitic junk. In this case, ID has made potentially falsifiable predictions and neo-Darwinian theory has shown itself to be a science stopper.
(2) Many systems inside the cell represent nanotechnology at a scale and sophistication that dwarfs human engineering. Moreover, our ability to understand the structure and function of these systems depends directly on our facility with engineering principles (both in developing the instrumentation to study these systems and in analyzing what they do). Engineers have developed these principles by designing systems of their own, albeit much cruder than what we find inside the cell. Many of these cellular systems are literally machines: electro-mechanical machines, information-processing machines, signal-transduction machines, communication and transportation machines, etc. They are not just analogous to humanly built machines but, as mathematicians would say, isomorphic to them, that is, they capture all the essential features of machines. ID predicts that the cell would have such engineering features; by contrast, Darwinian theory has consistently underestimated the sophistication of the machinery inside the cell.
(3) Conservation of information results (also referred to as No Free Lunch theorems, which are well established in the engineering and mathematical literature — see http://www.EvoInfo.org) indicate that evolution requires an information source that imparts at least as much information to evolutionary processes as these processes in turn are capable of expressing. In consequence, such an information source (i) cannot be reduced to materialistic causes (e.g., natural selection), (ii) suggests that we live in an informationally open universe, and (iii) may reasonably be regarded as intelligent. The conservation of information counts as a positive theoretical reason to accept intelligent design and quantifies the informational hurdles that neo-Darwinian processes must overcome. Moreover, ID theorists have applied these results to actual biological systems to show that they are unevolvable by Darwinian means. ID has always predicted that there will be classes of biological systems for which Darwinian processes fail irremediably, and conservation of information is putting paid to this prediction.
Best wishes,
Bill Dembski”
Read more here
http://www.uncommondescent.com/adminstrative/what-happened-to-colson-praises-peta/
Miles provided
Look to the webpage and check out the answers. I like this one:
I don’t think these folks really grasp the concept of a “prediction that results from the theory.” I mean, how thick do you have to be to recognize that a designer capable of creating “irreducible complexity” or whatever is perfectly capable of creating/including junk DNA?
This seems to be the part they don’t get: they aren’t just positing a designer, but are implicitly imposing motivations on said designer with absolutely no basis. There is one guy there that seems to get this, but they others just run the party line.
The problem, of course, is that when they talk about “designer” what they really mean is “God of the bible who created man in his image,” and God don’t have no junk DNA. Again, they are trapped by their religious paradigm, and not looking at it scientifically.
Mark Chu-Carroll does a good job of refuting this nonsense, if anyone’s interested.
I’m waiting to hear more of Endor’s accusation of misogyny. As a regular viewer of Olbermann’s show, I can’t say that I’ve witnessed any bigotry from Keith. Rachel Maddow is one of his most-frequented commentators, and she even hosted his show on April 4th. Sure, Papa Bear O’Reilly lets Laura Ingraham host his show but, hell, she’s a misogynist- a label you’d have trouble applying to Maddow.
Yay! That was great!
Now I’m looking forward to this week’s episode of NPR’s “Wait Wait Don’t Tell Me” – which is taped in Chicago.
J. D.
Sorry, bernarda, but Clinton can’t win the nomination without:
a) having the party’s ruling elite negate the elections;
b) destroying the Democratic party; and
c) sabotaging her own chances of winning the general election.
She fought well, but she has lost the primary. The only thing left is for her to admit it.
I suppose us people from the mythical Outland (as in not from the US) should be flattered, but I’m sure there are SOME bad people outside of America that would qualify for that list. I mean Jeez, it’s like your World Series. It isn’t.
I’ve only been watching “Countdown” after he gave a birthday greeting to Joel Hodgson of MST3k. I’ve liked this guy since his Sportscenter days (the Big Show still the best combo in SC history) and giving us Atheists a nod, being a MSTie and former sports reporter makes his show better. I don’t agree with him on everything (especially his take on the Subprime mortgage mess), but his constant ripping of “Bill-O” and “Coultergeist” is the best. Gotta’ love that Steve Doocy impression.
Dembski:
So he says ID is wrong — over half of our genomes consists of retrovirus corpses in various stages of decay.
The World Series is named after the newspaper that originally sponsored it, the New York World.
Dembski:
So he says ID is wrong — over half of our genomes consists of retrovirus corpses in various stages of decay.
The World Series is named after the newspaper that originally sponsored it, the New York World.
Great video.
Is the pronunciation “ay-thee-est” normal?
Great video.
Is the pronunciation “ay-thee-est” normal?
David, I prefer the emphasis on the first syllable, myself, used as an adjective. It describes me but doesn’t name me, that way.
For those who suggested that KO might be non-religious, here’s a quote i found from him:
“And not to let the facts get in the way of FOF’s (Focus On Family) prejudice, but I happen to be a religious man. I believe in God, I pray daily, and if I’ve ever gotten any direct instructions from my maker, they were that I’ll be judged by whether I tried to help other people, or hurt them. Also, that true belief should not be worn like a policeman’s club, nor used like one.”
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6844293/
I know, i’m a bit disappointed myself. Nevertheless, he points out religious bigotry and stupidity when he sees it.
This is only the second video of Olbermann that i’ve seen, but i’ve really liked both.
Also, i’m loving the word “Coultergeist”
So shines a good deed in a weary world.
Thank you, Keith Olbermann.
I’ve celebrated Mrs. Davis’s contributions to our National Discourse on Religion in a new song called “Even Know.”
Pull it down here!
http://chelicerata.org/ratio/
“Get Out of That Seat!”
I’m afraid that I’ll have to dissent from Olbermann’s analysis. As disgusted as I am by Davis, she really doesn’t compare to the ironically named John Best.
Sorry, David, but that’s an urban legend.
“She fought well, but she has lost the primary.”
The big problem is how she might take the whole Democratic presidential push down with her.
hammerface: A little hyperbole for alliteration, that’s all it is.
I have been an Obermann fan for several years. Being totally and wilfully ignorant of sports, I never knew him before Countdown. And Rachel Maddow is the best. She has a real doctorate. Her dissertation was on women’s prison movies from the 30s, I think. But I could be wrong. She did a killer job subbing for KO last Friday.
See the Lincoln page at “Positive Atheism”. It’s quite amazing.
And, the above link contains many more quotes from and about Lincoln and his view of religion.
Also, this essay ( Religion vs. Free Speech ) by Craig Biddle at “The Objective Standard” is a warning about what’s ahead.
Wow! Being an Australian I have not seen this chap before. It is very encouraging that he actually manages to get airtime in the Christian Republic of USA.
Although the nutters have made some holes in the wall-of-separation (the court system), the U.S. is not a Christian Republic (if it had been, the Kitzmiller v Dover case would not have gone in our favor–as have other cases since then). The nutter’s “Christian Nation” cult propaganda aside, the U.S. is still a secular government. The Founders had plenty of theocratic models to choose from but they did not create a theocracy.
I do not believe that the majority of Americans fully understand what the “Christian Nation” fanatics or doing. As we see exposed in the book (Liars For Jesus), and in many other ways (ID, “teach the controversy”, “academic freedom”, “moment of silence”, etc) the movement is a huge fraud–it takes my breath away with the brazenness of it’s spin and lies (look up doublethink). We must do everything we can to expose the nutters and their “Christian Nation” goals.
We are trying to save reason, science, the U.S., our freedom, and–I believe–our lives. Make no mistake, it’s that serious but it’s not over yet by a long shot.
Faith is a vice. Reason is a virtue.
A
It’s funny how Dembski “predicts” things that are already known.
Michael @ #52 – neat! I’m enjoying very muchly.
I’m shocked this hit Countdown so quickly – I didn’t think this would hit anybody’s radar outside the blogosphere. Excellente! And it’s possibly going to be highlighted on Carpetbagger’s “This Week In God” – I sent Steve Benen the story, and he said it was a story that has “TWIG” written all over it. Happiness!
Second Hit for Davis!
Yet ANOTHER WPITW vote!
In the msnbc website that titles KO’s WPINTW, Titled Lamont blameless in lieberman case.
Ms. Davis – whilst no longer holding the #1 spot on 04/09, nonetheless holds a #3 spot with WPITW with KO on 04/10!
Thank you Keith Obermann and thank you MSNBC.
I just heard on Olbermann that the legislator, Monique Davis, has apologized to Rob Sherman. The quote KO gave sounded like a cop-out. She says she was upset at hearing about shootings in a school that same day and just lashed out. I’m not sure if I buy that. I’ll have to hear more.
On Keith Olbermann being a misogynistic prick…
http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2007/02/23/everyone_loves_keith_olbermannexcept_me.php
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/626991/can_msnbcs_keith_olbermann_chris_matthews.html
There’s more, but frankly it’s late, the Daily Show is on, and if you want to find more, you have access to Google too.