You’ve managed to remove your li’l Bush clone.
Conservative Prime Minister John Howard suffered a humiliating defeat Saturday at the hands of the left-leaning opposition, whose leader has promised to immediately sign the Kyoto Protocol on global warming and withdraw Australia’s combat troops from Iraq.
Labor Party head Kevin Rudd’s pledges on global warming and Iraq move Australia sharply away from policies that had made Howard one of President Bush’s staunchest allies.
All the articles I read on the Australian elections used the lovely phrase “humiliating defeat.” I like it. Now we just need to humiliate our wanking Republican politicians here at home.
He was going to lose his seat last time i checked the ABCs website
actually it still looks like he is going to lose his seat :)
http://www.abc.net.au/elections/federal/2007/
yay, Australia finally got rid of that wanker.
And there was much rejoicing.
The puzzling thing about this election was that, yes, John Howard was an odious little vermin. But Australians kept re-electing him anyway. And they didn’t like that he was a Bush clone, but that didn’t stop them from voting for him either. About the only reason I can find for this election victory (for Labor, natch) is simple voter fatigue. Time for a change, they said. And that was that. Odd.
The thing that I have been noticing is all the positive PR that is coming out lately about “The surge is working” that passes for mainstream news. Pardon me if I seem paranoid but I fear we will not have a “free and democratic ” election. I will vote and do what I can there is no other choice. There are other dark stories that are not very well covered. The Baptist minister looks like he is gaining on the leaders in the republican campaign.
I do hope we can give them all a crushing defeat just the same.
The thing that I have been noticing is all the positive PR that is coming out lately about “The surge is working” that passes for mainstream news. Pardon me if I seem paranoid but I fear we will not have a “free and democratic ” election. I will vote and do what I can there is no other choice. There are other dark stories that are not very well covered. The Baptist minister looks like he is gaining on the leaders in the republican campaign.
I do hope we can give them all a crushing defeat just the same.
It doesn’t look good for Howard if he wants to keep his seat – the present results have him 600 votes behind. Interesting that the Greens have lost so much of the vote – I guess it’s partly tactical voting.
I told the cat that he’s going to have a new Prime Minister leading his country. I told him it was Rudd, and he thought it was great having a fish as PM – if he’s a failure, some lucky moggie can eat him.
Bob
Preferential voting means people will vote for a minority party and allow their second or third choice to get the actual vote.
I hope this is a good day…
Sounds like good news. I had considered voting in this election, though I think that one ought to live in the country that one votes in.
Pity we didn’t get rid of the lapdog in Denmark. The Danish PM does seem like he is moving in more reasonable directions (e.g. less Lomborg, more Kyoto).
Being not overly political, I was always of the opinion that, yes, I’m left-leaning, but it’s a different perspective, and there’s something valid to be said for both a liberal and a conservative point of view, depending on the issue, but the American Conservative Party in the past few years has shown itself to be just plain wrong. No interpretation, just wrong. Starting bad wars, economically stupid in the long term (which is supposed to be a strength), and scientifically illiterate, in other words, denying reality, in other, other words, outright delusional. It’s very upsetting there are enough stupid people in the US that they can get elected.
Schwarzenegger is okay, though.
From an article I read, Howard seemed to be a disaster for Australian science. It was only one article so it is hard to tell if it was factual or someone had an axe to grind.
from conversations with family in Sydney, it wasn’t just the science issues, it’s also that Howard was a right wing religious wanker. My cousin will be happy to see him gone for that reason.
That does it. I’m moving to Australia. At least, I would, if I could.
Oh, well.
The former singer of the Aussie activist Midnight Oil, Pete Garret, must be thrilled. He ran for office and is currently the Shadow Minister for Climate Change, Environment and Heritage, and Shadow Minister for the Arts.
http://www.petergarrett.com.au/
Here’s something you’ll never see from the US’s Fearless Leader…from the article (my emphasis):
Howard might be a godtard wanker but at least he can admit error.
Here’s something you’ll never see from the US’s Fearless Leader…from the article (my emphasis):
Howard might be a godtard wanker but at least he can admit error.
Yay!
Sadly Denmark held onto our Bush-brownnoser – just. His parliamentarian support is more tenuous than before the election.
Interestingly, though, he’s now favouring increased autonomy for the state church – it’s pretty much seen as a first step towards separation. I’m pretty much floored, since I’d not have expected that even if the ‘left’ had won – the socialdemocrats are ‘appeasers’ in that respect.
Secondly, he seems to be working on establishing at a better rapport with the opposition rather than build his majority on the xenophobic ‘Danish People’s Party’. I’ll not hold my breath, though.
I just heard that Rudd’s a committed Christian.
It’s too bad that a deluded, superstition-believing person is leading Oz. Canada & UK are in the same boat, & too many other countries.
Just wouldn’t it be so much better if atheists were running the show. I just can’t believe that anyone who’s fooled by such obvious baloney as Xianity is fit for any public office.
Any news on the Australian Secular Party, or did they not have any canidates up for election?
PZ Myers said:
Didn’t this already happen with the democrats taking control of congress? And then promptly continued to follow the same policies as the republicans had?
I heard that Rudd is a Catholic. But at least he isn’t a godless retard.
His speech here http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/its-time-to-fight-for-the-true-christian-principle/2006/10/03/1159641321957.html?page=fullpage is half reasonable.
Congratulations? Rudd is pious, no friend of church-state separation, and opposed to gay marriage. Let’s see how stem cell research does in Oz… They’ve simply replaced one crackpot with another.
Ross, did you mean “godly retard”? Some godless people are retarded, but what you wrote comes across, to me, as meaning that all godless people are retards.
As for half reasonable, I guess so, but there’s a lot of it written as wanting to bring Xian views into politics. Such views are founded upon delusion. Some of the views expressed are reasonable, even desirable, but I still think the guy’s potentially dangerous to democracy, as are all deluded people. At least he says supports the separation of religion & state. But does he support ‘faith schools’? They are potentially dangerous.
I think the only reason that he‘s a Republican is the fact that he would fit quite nicely into Austria’s conservative party and didn’t notice early enough that the Reptilian Party is not conservative.
I think the only reason that he‘s a Republican is the fact that he would fit quite nicely into Austria’s conservative party and didn’t notice early enough that the Reptilian Party is not conservative.
Richard (#20), only some godless people are retards. The rest are mere fools. “The fool has said in his heart, there is no God”.
John Howard instituted welfare programs for the middle class – tax cuts for those who needed it least, promised to refund education expenses of up to $800 per child regardless of the parents` income. Ordinarily such programs would have got him over the wire, as his electoral bribes did in the previous elections.
In this election, however, he had to contend with the anger of the ‘little aussie battler’, who through legislation, has been forced to accept poorer working conditions and lower wages and benefits, such as the loss of overtime rates and penalty rates, amongst other things. Six interest rate rises by the Reserve Bank of Australia during his tenure didn’t help his cause either, particularly given his claim that his parliamentry team was a great manager of the economy.
Perhaps the most outstanding event in his Prime Ministership was the forced buy-back and removal of semi-automatic weapons and high-capacity rifles and shotguns from Australian society after Martin Bryant killed thirty five people at a tourist spot in Tasmania.
Strictly speaking, that says that fools are atheists, not that atheists are fools. Given what the Bible has to say about calling others fools, you might want to be careful there.
Rudd also happens to the first prime minister to speak fluent mandarin. I think it’s clear his worldviews would be dramatically larger than those of the standard Christian politician, making his religious views basically irrelevant.. We can’t expect a politician to publicly disavow his family’s religious persuasion, but from his life experiences/ educational background I don’t think rationalists have to worry :)
http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=_KFmG06he_E
Harris: Ross Nixon is just the latest hit-and-run troll to grace this blog. Although I have to say, he’s usually too polite to call anyone a “retard”.
The fact that he seems disappointed that Rudd purchased the wrong brand of ancient snake oil says it all, really.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Bryant
Hopefully President Harper will fall next election and complete the hat-trick.
What a beautiful world it could be.
For some reason (possibly without foundation), I always thought ‘wank’ was a British (remember the Empire!) word.
Pleased to see it’s been appropriated (assuming my initial assumption was correct) by our cousins across the pond.
Bravo, PZ (said in the British ‘Pee Zed’ frame).
Unfortunately, the removal of ‘Mini Bush’ is not grounds for celebration when the new incumbent is lacking clear thought (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Rudd#Religious_views).
Hey ho, on we go.
Bush lost midget-Bush Howard who is a real slimebag, but earlier he got a new midget-Bush Sarkozy who is about the worst thing to happen to France since the war.
Ross, “The fool has said in his heart, there is no God”.
That’s in the bible, so we know it’s gotta be crap.
But I understand that you’re a religious troll. You believe in magic, & you know we don’t, so why do you come here?
“The fool has said in his heart, there is no God”.
So, scripture gives us the truth? The truth as written down by a bunch of people who want us to believe it is true? Moving on …
I strongly suspect there is no god … based on prevailing evidence. That evidence is the mountain of scientific research that explains soooooooo much about our universe … and none of it derived from ‘the good book’.
‘The Good Book’ is a set of camp fire stories, handed down, generation to generation, embellished and polished … translated and mistranslated … to produce the inerrant, omniscient, omnipotent word that so many take succour from. [sigh]
The only great legacy that religion can claim is the experiment of the success of child indoctrination. Hoo haa.
The Australian Senate has no clear majority, meaning that for Rudd to get his policies through, he may have to get the support of the five Greens, one Independent (“No Pokies” — anti-gambling, anti-drugs, but pro-Kyoto… go figure) and, even the sole wingnut “Family First” senator.
So sadly, the balance of power in the Senate could well be held by the James Dobson of Australia.
#16:
Unfortunately, the party did not get enough members to have a party ticket and therefore candidates were put on the ballot papers as independents.
In my home state of South Australia, the result for them [Group B Independents] was 0.06% of the primary vote.
As a comparison, with 78.63% of the vote counted, the Seculars received 452 votes compared to the Australian Shooters Party with 3,055 votes.
(Yes, one of those 452 was mine).
Regarding the religiosity of the new Prime Minister, a local atheist political blogger had this to say:
We just swapped one tired visionless bunch,for a slightly less tired near on visionless bunch.Eg just because they said they’re going to ratify the Kyoto accord, doesn’t mean that they will adhere to any of its protocols.
I get really tired of hearing “it’s the thought that counts” and making all the warm fuzzy announcements and doing absolutely nothing when the media and political hoo har has died down.A couple of examples of that is our humungous water problems,and none of them are game to lay a finger on the coal industry. It’s always someone elses fault or problem.
Short bus kittehs say “No Ceiling Cat!” Theyz bad.
Psalms 14:1
lolcatbible.com
While it’s good to see Howard go, I’m I little suspicious of Rudd. He’s highly educated and speaks fluent Mandarin but is also outspoken enough about his Christianity to make other polititians uncomfortable. Go figure.
#5 (Bob O’Hara)
The swing “against” the Greens in Bennelong was not an anti green reaction, nor tactical voting.
The PREVIOUS election, the Greens ran Andrew Wilkie (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wilkie)
in Bennelong, and he attracted a large anti-government protest vote – approximately an extra 11% over the Green’s previous vote.
With a viable Labor candidate up against Howard – one who stood a chance of actually winning – most of that protest vote primarily goes directly to her.
Hmmmm, I still keep getting those “emigrate to Australia” emails from their government … if the Rethuglicans win in ’08 I just might take them up on that offer.
Apart from comment 24…
What about the brain…?
Apart from comment 24…
What about the brain…?
Congratulations, Aussies!
With Blair and Howard down, that only leaves Bush.
We’d best pray that one of the saner American candidates will be guided to victory by His Noodly Appendage.
First, my equivalent thread:
http://metamagician3000.blogspot.com/2007/11/well-its-been-interesting-election.html
We may get some interesting local discussion over there, but not much yet.
Okay, Rudd is a conservative Christian by local standards, but not by American standards. Over there in the US, he would be thought of as an extremely moderate, liberal religionist.
It does disappoint me that he opposes gay marriage. On the other hand, it’s only the word “marriage” that he opposes. Most gays and gay-friendly people whom I talk to seem not to feel all that strongly about it, because he favours ending all distinctions in actual legal entitlements between homosexual and heterosexual couples. The gay marriage issue is not quite as contentious in Australia as in the US, because the additional legal rights attaching to marriage are not as great here as over there, making it a more purely symbolic issue. Symbols are important, of course, but actual rights create more urgency and heat.
I think this also makes it easier for people to take the view that I take – that ultimately there should be no such thing as state-recognised marriage. Simply have laws to ensure the welfare of children and to allocate the property and other rights of people when relationships break down.
We are heading in that direction in Australia, almost by stealth, because the distinction between the rights of married couples and de facto couples has been gradually eroded by legal reform. If de facto gay couples end up with the same legal rights as de facto straight couples, who in turn have the same legal rights as formally married couples, marriage will eventually become meaningless except as a religious ceremony.
My own position is that I support gay marriage but only on an interim basis. Ultimately, I want to see the whole institution of marriage cease as a legal institution. Australia will get there gradually, in a generation or two, without the need for some kind of big-bang reform.
Rudd’s attitude to therapeutic cloning worries me more. He actually voted against the recent reforms to allow therapeutic cloning in Australia. Make no mistake, we do have someone who will take moralistic, religion-influenced attitudes to certain issues, and I’d been going around before the election saying that he may not be much better than Howard.
But I actually feel a bit more optimistic now that the election is over.
Whatever his faults, Rudd is no wing-nut … and bear in mind that a prime minister is not a law unto himself. He does not have absolute control of his party and needs to keep the more secular parliamentarians in the ALP happy. I think that the kinds of extreme reactionary moves that we could rightly fear from the previous government are now much less likely, and that we will get some more sensible policies in the mix.
I’m not Rudd’s biggest fan, but I do think this is a great outcome for Australia.
To Back up Russell, true Rudd is a conservative and quite open in his Christianity. However, in Australia, we elect local members so in Parliament there is now 86 labor mps. These guys vary from conservative to quite left wing, so Rudd to rule Rudd will have to appease the left, which is opposite to what Howard had to do, which was appease the wingnuts.
Rudd may be a God lover but our new deputy Prime Minister is a un married girl who defiantly isn’t.
Now we just need to humiliate our wanking Republican politicians here at home.
The way things look now, we will end up replacing this god-soaked, fiscally irresponsible, war-mongering, Republican President with a god-soaked, fiscally irresponsible, war-mongering, Democratic President. That’ll show ’em.
From Rudd’s The Monthly essay;
…it must be weighed, together with other arguments from different philosophical traditions, in a fully contestable secular polity.
As long as the final criteria for the passage of legislation (or exercise of executive power) is secular, I personally don’t much care what religious motivations a politician has. YEC and ID in schools couldn’t pass a final secular criteria, but sometimes policies have both utilitarian and theological basis.
As for Rudd on gay marriage and chaplains in schools (who don’t actually get to proselytise), Rudd hasn’t indicated a theological motivation whereas the ex-PM has. I don’t like either Rudd or Howard’s positions on these matters, but at least Rudd hasn’t made a reference to Christendom in his “justifications” (such as they are).
I’m wary of Rudd and I’ll obviously be keeping an eye on him, but he doesn’t deserve the outright condemnation for church-state violations that Howard does.
Incidentally, in a policy statement released to GetUp! (and elsewhere) before the election, the ALP intend to support civil unions and repeal prior bans. It’s a step in the right direction. Also, in the interview with Kyle Sanderlands where Rudd stated against Gay marriage, he did also accept that the party position could be wrong and that it may change in future. At least he’s corrigible.
Rudd will need an eye kept on him, but let’s not jump to conclusions yet.
You’re obviously not a resident of Australia.
There’s a first for everything.
Anyone checked the temperature of Hades lately?
What an amazing victory. Finally some humanity and forward planning for Australia again.
Looking back on it, what positive impact has Howard had on Australia that we will be able to feel the effects of in the future? What investments did he make for the future of Australia?
This is a fantastic win for Australia, and it sets the standard that we hope America can follow next year.
I voted Secular in the senate, and we finished last (most people I spoke to didn’t know who we were), but the overall result was more than I was hoping for.
News is out now that Holy Tony Blair was following his xian “ethics” in going to war in Iraq, but he had to keep is religious devotion secret because the UK electorate would not have been receptive.
“Mr Campbell added that the former prime minister always asked his aides to find him a church to attend, wherever he happened to be, each Sunday.
“Because he’s pretty irreverent, he swears a fair bit,” Mr Campbell said, “if he sees a very attractive woman his eye will wander and all that stuff, he doesn’t look like your classic religious sort of guy,” said Mr Campbell.
But he added: “I think his close circle always understood that there was a part of him that was really, really important.
“On that kind of spiritual level it did inform a lot of what he talked about, what he read… what he felt was important.”
Mr Campbell said the UK electorate were “a bit wary of politicians who go on about God”. He had also been concerned that the Conservatives would accuse Labour of trying to claim faith as its own.
‘Ethical values’
Peter Mandelson, a close confidant of Mr Blair, said: “He’s not an exhibitionist when it comes to religion but deep inside him it is very, very important.
“This is a man who takes a Bible with him wherever he goes and last thing at night he will read from the Bible.”
Sir Menzies Campbell, the former Liberal Democrat leader, suggested that Mr Blair may not have been so politically successful had the relationship between his beliefs and his actions in office been better known.
“The public might have been less willing to give him the triumph of three consecutive general election victories if they’d known the extent to which ethical values would overshadow pragmatism,” Sir Menzies said.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7111620.stm
Imagine if the American electorate were wary about politicians that who go on about god.
To that Psalm quote I respond:
… but whoever calls someone a fool shall be in danger of hell fire. (Matthew 5:22; part of the Sermon on the Mount)
Wait, hasn’t Howard been around for ever? I think Bush is a big Howard clone, if anything.
The French have only elected Sarko so they can have a revolution. They haven’t had one for 40 years by the most generous count; that’s not healthy.
Yesterday the public transport strike of Paris ended after well over a week. The city of 2 million, not to mention the surrounding agglomeration, was largely shut down…
The French have only elected Sarko so they can have a revolution. They haven’t had one for 40 years by the most generous count; that’s not healthy.
Yesterday the public transport strike of Paris ended after well over a week. The city of 2 million, not to mention the surrounding agglomeration, was largely shut down…
A friend just got back from Australia. Says he saw protesters in the street with signs that said “No more Bush Howard”.
Nice to know our President is a swear word.
Yeah Howard was first elected into the government (but not as leader) when Nixon was still president. He’s been our leader since 1996. He did seem to work much better with Bush than with Clinton for some reason though.
Actually the reason why he lasted so long, and was finally voted out this time, IMO, is because the Labor opposition actually behaved like it wanted to run the country this time, not simply like it wanted to unseat the incumbent and ram through ill-thought feelgood policies to make itself look shiny.
There was a viable alternative this time, and that was what did it. The alternatives until now were either very worn out (Beazley and Crean, with extremely close ties to the Govt. that Howard himself unseated, and therefore untrustworthy), or psychologically unstable (Latham).
I always backed Howard staunchly – he had the guts to put his own values and opinions up regardless of whether they were liked or not – but towards the end I didn’t like what was happening to the Liberals.
#16 – In South Australia, the secular party got 10% of the votes that One Nation. Same against the Fred Niles Group and the Family First Party – all extreme right-wing (by Australian standards).
My wife and I make up 2 of the 400-some votes that the Secular Party received in SA. It needs much more advertisement and a few tweaks around the edges to help average people feel that it’s not about to outlaw churches.
I tend to agree, but there is ONE SLIGHT, SMALL PROBLEM.
Kevin Rudd is a “Republican” – and I don’t mean as opposed to a “Democrat” either …….
NOT a good move.
As for the rest, I thoroughly approve.
I suppose everyone has to have some faults.
Re: #22
The fool has said in the comments, “The fool has said in his heart, there is no God”.
Or, as one wag responded, “The wise man says it out loud.”
— CV
As others have said, it doesn’t look like this new guy may be much better…as culled from a really fundy board:
Kevin Rudd, the new prime minister, is a Christian. On SkyNews outgoing minister Bruce Baird who is a member of the liberal party said that although he was part of the oppossing party he knew Mr Rudd well as Rudd was a fellow “God botherer” as they are known in political circles. Mr Rudd has in the past referred to himself as “a Christian of no fixed denominational abode”. So that is encouraging.
That, and when you look at the sheer amount of “prayer power” that those loons are pouring into Australia, you know we’re bound to lose!