An email FYI »« Oh, FoxNews, you are so two-faced

That’s a new one

Apparently, I am now a whore. I can’t be insulted by the accusation, though, since it seems to be applied in the same way as the frequent accusations that I’m gay and Jewish — neither true nor particularly offensive to me, although it does say a lot about the person trying to do the insulting.

Also, it comes from the awful Paul Elam, who seems to use “whore” as every other word. He has…issues.

Comments

  1. says

    In fact, he called you a “whore that rigorously abandons intellect, rationale, evidence, decency and compassion, and also fosters much deserved hostility toward themselves.” I’m not sure whether the sentiment or the grammar is worse.

  2. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    PZ, you are all the things. A gay nazi jew self-hating-jew Whoretta McStrumpetStilts frigid lying bitch whore gold-digging feminazgul whore stupid whore.

  3. Louis says

    I read Manboobz.

    I even went to AVFM and read a few things there.

    I listened to the first minute of the “song”.

    I wept.

    I leave the internet now. I think some drinking and reflecting on happy things is in order before I come back.

    Louis

  4. says

    who seems to use “whore” as every other word.

    I can do better than that. How about “Whores whores whore whore whores“? It’s a syntactically correct reduction of the sentence “The whores which other whores whore-out, themselves whore-out whores.

  5. chigau (違わない) says

    gay nazi jew self-hating-jew Whoretta McStrumpetStilts frigid lying bitch whore gold-digging feminazgul whore stupid whore fat smelly

    Do all of us sockpuppets hafta do this, too?
    I don’t think I have the time…

  6. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    L’il punkin Robert Fisher’s FB page indicates he has Michele Bachmann among his favorites. A. DORABLE.

    #kawaii!!!

  7. kbonn says

    The post you link to (at least the part quoted that insults you) seems rather poorly written and idiotic, I have to ask… Why respond to it?

  8. Akira MacKenzie says

    Soooo… How much ya charge for a “Rusty Venture?”

    ;)

    Honestly! Can’t these Dudebro asshats think of anything more clever?

  9. PatrickG says

    @ Louis:

    I think some drinking and reflecting on happy things is in order before I come back.

    Seconded. Why the fuck have I not internalized the lesson: never, ever, ever click through a link on manboobz. Just too fucking depressing.

    Our neighbor has a really adorable dog who loves to play. Maybe I’ll see if I can borrow her.

  10. says

    robertfisher:

    Slee Z. You are not a gay Jew. You are just a dishonest, simpleminded cretin.

    It’s cogent and well-reasoned arguments like this that demand my grudging admiration and respect. Why, the sheer economy of words, while devoid of any real meaning, is truly astonishing.

  11. Brownian says

    Care to get into specifics, Robert Fisher?

    Or are you content to simply hit ‘n’ run, you pathetic fucking coward?

  12. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Oh, Zinc Avenger, that’s aces.

    Now I have this running through my head (hear the melody of The Nutcracker Suite):

    ♫WhoreBerry Crunch is fun to eat
    A Whorey fruity breakfast treat
    Made by Whores so happily
    It tastes like crunchy Whore Berries
    It’s berry shaped and crispy too
    In berry red and Whorey blue.♫

  13. subbie says

    A Bachmann fan calling someone else a simple-minded cretin? I think the explosion of my irony meter took out two city blocks.

  14. says

    “Care to get into specifics, Robert Fisher?”

    As soon as Slee Z does.

    I could dig into any number of his past posts. But why bother if he doesn’t care?

    If he has even enough integrity to try to justify the nonsense he spouts, I’ll pull back the curtain.

    As of now, all we have are mere assertions on his part.

    I suppose you think your mindless support of him in absence of supporting arguments is somehow virtuous, or logical? You’re just a fundamentalist idiot rooting for a different team.

  15. says

    Slee Z. You are not a gay Jew. You are just a dishonest, simpleminded cretin.

    You don’t seem to get PZ’s point about being gay or Jew do you?

    Also: please don’t leave yet! We’re just getting to know you (a Bachmann fan, that should be fun).

  16. Brownian says

    As soon as Slee Z does.

    I could dig into any number of his past posts. But why bother if he doesn’t care?

    Because I asked you to support your contention, fuckhead.

    So, in other words, you got nothin’.

    That’s what I thought.

    A coward.

    I suppose you think your mindless support of him in absence of supporting arguments is somehow virtuous, or logical?

    Don’t make assumptions about me. You’re not fucking smart enough.

    You’re just a fundamentalist idiot rooting for a different team.

    Yawn.

  17. pedantik says

    Wow, PZ; you sure do attract the best the human species has to offer. Be careful of the stuff you post links to. After reading that lunacy I now have to go autoclave my eyes.

  18. David Marjanović says

    L’il punkin Robert Fisher’s FB page indicates he has Michele Bachmann among his favorites. A. DORABLE.

    #kawaii!!!

    :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D

    Day saved!

  19. kbonn says

    @20 and @25. Thank you! I haven’t thought about Venture Bros. in a long time. Any idea when new episodes are out?

  20. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    “Care to get into specifics, Robert Fisher?”

    As soon as Slee Z does.

    I could dig into any number of his past posts. But why bother if he doesn’t care?

    If he has even enough integrity to try to justify the nonsense he spouts, I’ll pull back the curtain.

    As of now, all we have are mere assertions on his part.

    I suppose you think your mindless support of him in absence of supporting arguments is somehow virtuous, or logical? You’re just a fundamentalist idiot rooting for a different team.

    This is such a giant pile of diversionary nonsense.

    Point out some specifics.

    Hand-waving over “the nonsense he spouts” without pointing to anything anyone can actually use to answer you is just stupid.

  21. d.f.manno says

    @ #30 robertfisher:

    Yours is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

  22. says

    …As in, from the Venture Bros, Rusty Venture? Or just happy coincidence?

    RE: OP
    The weird thing is that Elam isn’t even the Men’s Rights Asshat who spams whore; it’s weirdly out of character for him to use it that much, that’s more Tom Martin.

    Also he has this bit like halfway through there where he talks about how the miscreants trying to threaten Rebecca Watson are ‘less than sophisticated’. Because remember, threatening people with violence is fine at AVFM!

  23. says

    I gotta admit, I ♥ the trolls who use facebook to log in. It’s the #1 sign that they’re not the sharpest tool in the shed.

    Weytwut? Because their interests identify them as trolls, or was there something bad about being too lazy to get a wordpress account? XD

  24. says

    robertfisher:

    I suppose you think your mindless support of him in absence of supporting arguments is somehow virtuous, or logical? You’re just a fundamentalist idiot rooting for a different team.

    Of course! How blind I’ve been. Thanks to your vigorous use of insults in lieu of specific claims, the scales have fallen from my eyes. I can see now that I have been mindless in my defense against unstated accusations!

    I shall now grovel at your feet and plead blind, unthinking devotion had the better of me. In the future, I shall only mindlessly defend PZ when actual claims are made.

    You, Sir, are a schol… well, a gentlem… a person.

  25. Brownian says

    You, Sir, are a schol… well, a gentlem… a person.

    I know this puts me at odds with other commenters here, but I wouldn’t even go that far.

  26. anteprepro says

    I suppose you think your mindless support of him in absence of supporting arguments is somehow virtuous, or logical?

    Obviously not. It is only mindless opposition to PZ in the absence of supporting arguments that can be considered logical and virtuous. Like, duh.

  27. says

    Do all of us sockpuppets hafta do this, too? / I don’t think I have the time…

    Oh, sure you do. You can even fit it all in pretty compactly, if you work things through…

    It’s all a matter of good time management, prioritizing, and having a proper can-do attitude. Allow me to dump some excerpts from my personal schedule, in the hope that it gets you thinking proactively about your commitment to this thing:

    Monday 8h: Yoga
    Monday 9h: Hit on Nazis of my sex, whilst deploring myself for doing so
    Monday 10h: Lie about the above on Facebook
    Monday 12h: Lunch break
    Monday 14h: Synagogue

    Tuesday 9h: Cardio
    Tuesday 10h: Holocaust denial and MRA castration slot (alternate weekly)
    Tuesday 12h: Sleeping around
    Tuesday 16h: Cruelly seduce gullible rich white guy to get his money

    Thursday 10h: Flirt shamelessly and coquettishly and then turn cruelly cold
    Thursday 12h: Seduce Sampson, then cut off his hair while he’s sleeping
    Thursday 14h: Stab the MRA ringbearer with a Morgul blade
    Thursday 16h: Pilates

  28. bruceheerssen says

    robertfischer: when you don’t have an actual argument, fling shit on the walls. Amirite?

  29. vaiyt says

    Also he has this bit like halfway through there where he talks about how the miscreants trying to threaten Rebecca Watson are ‘less than sophisticated’.

    Hate is OK as long as it’s passive-agressive enough.

  30. Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle says

    This is all anyone needs to know about Elam:

    He is on record saying that, were he ever on a jury of a rape case where the victim is female and the criminal male, he would refuse to vote guilty – even if he thought the man were guilty – because there is, according to him, an epidemic of false rape accusations. And, of course, rape accusations are always taken so seriously by law enforcement that most of convicted rapists are actually innocent.

    Search his page and you will find it. If you’re in the mood to literally hate the human race for a while anyway.

  31. Brownian says

    If you’re in the mood to literally hate the human race for a while anyway.

    There are other moods possible?

  32. A+ Hermit says

    Elam reminds me of a character in a book I read, some potboiler of a thriller. The protagonist’s father was a senile old man who kept escaping from the home and wandering around muttering “bitch, bitch, fucking bitch” under his breath…

  33. hypatiasdaughter says

    As of now, all we have are mere assertions on his part.

    Sort of like the pot calling the jug of milk black……

  34. Amblebury, I doesn't afraid of NOTHING! says

    I’m a whore. I’m going to keep announcing I’m a whore. I’m going to listen for the barely perceptible soft “piff” and subsequent thump, as the bodies of misogynistic bigots drop to the floor following their aneurysms. Aneurysms brought on by my proud declaration that women enjoy sex, earn their own good money and don’t give a flying fuck what they think.

    I’m going to get a T-shirt with WHORE on it. I’m wearing it with a grin.

  35. Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle says

    There are other moods possible?

    There are! I mean, you can’t watch this without smiling and that’s only possible because a human posted it.

    See? We’re good for something.

  36. Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle says

    Whats wrong with being a whore?

    I can’t say from experience, but all the whores I know* like their jobs.

    more than I like mine, might I add.

    * of course, they’re all “upper level” prostitutes as opposed to the street-walking variety, so Nigel’s point is beyond valid.

  37. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Josh:

    ♫WhoreBerry Crunch is fun to eat
    A Whorey fruity breakfast treat
    Made by Whores so happily
    It tastes like crunchy Whore Berries
    It’s berry shaped and crispy too
    In berry red and Whorey blue.♫

    You good sir, are my hero. Perhaps you should send a nice care package of Whore Berry Cruch to Paul Elam.

    ****
    roberfisher:

    Slee Z. You are not a gay Jew. You are just a dishonest, simpleminded cretin.

    “I’m rubber, you’re glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you!”

  38. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Amblebury:

    I’m going to get a T-shirt with WHORE on it. I’m wearing it with a grin.

    If PZ had a shirt containing all the ridiculous insults people have lobbed at him, I wonder what it would look like (it could even have little wings on it, or perhaps some tentacles…)

  39. PatrickG says

    @nigelTheBold, Venomous Demonic Hater:

    Rebecca Watson holds him at gunpoint

    O Naive One! The Watson needs no such tools to dominate others! Her essence permeates the noosphere, bending Myers to her will as a natural byproduct of her existence.

  40. klatu says

    Whats wrong with being a whore?

    Their clients.

    http://secretdiaryofadublincallgirl.wordpress.com/2012/01/18/empowerment/

    Having a lot of money didn’t make me feel better, that is irrelevant, but getting paid for sex gave my self worth (of which so much lies in our sexuality) a kick and I felt briefly better. I simultaneously also felt cheap and used and manipulated, so it was a strange mix of emotions going on. To feel better again, I’d accept another appointment. It was kind of like a drug.

    What is empowering about having a dick shoved down your throat and you can’t stop because unless he is really really kind, he will blame you for having a bad ‘attitude’ or whatever, when all you did was ask him to give it a wash first, or stop face fucking you, or stop trying to make you gag? What is empowering about the ‘let’s see how much she can take’ game? What is empowering about four men standing around you coming all over your face, in your eyes, in your hair, and then smirking at your mascara eyes and sticky hair?

    [...]

    Escorts are vessels, utensils, cum receptacles, fuck toys, whatever else you want to call them. To the punter, they are not entirely human, because no one entirely human would put up with such abuse, every day, every week. You are one dimensional to a punter. To see you as a three dimensional complex being would be very off putting for a punter.

    (Emphasis mine)

  41. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    nigel:

    Literally. Rebecca Watson holds him at gunpoint and forces him to echo her twisted ideals on misogyny.

    True story.

    I thought Rebecca and Jen took turns forcing PZ to write about misogyny and A+…

  42. says

    @70: When I worked customer service for a major department store, I don’t recall that any of my customers respected me, but no one felt the need to shame me on the Internet for this fact. Your attitude is exactly why several prominent YouTubers who I’m rather fond of have labelled FTB and atheism + as patronizing, if not outright hostile, to sex workers.

  43. klatu says

    @Ace of Sevens #72
    Is that what my comment looks like?
    I wasn’t trying to shame dublincallgirl, or any other (former) sex workers.
    I wasn’t saying that being a “whore” is wrong, but trying to point out that the treatment of sex workers and the behaviour and attidutes towards them (i.e. their sub-human status in the eyes of their clients) are what’s wrong.

  44. says

    Literally. Rebecca Watson holds him at gunpoint and forces him to echo her twisted ideals on misogyny.

    Pft, guns are phallic symbols of the MAN, bro. In true maneater fashion, she holds him at labryspoint. Well, labrysblade.

  45. says

    @73: Yes: you are basically telling them that contrary to what they may think, there’s no dignity in their work and prioritizing your speculation about how their clients feel over their lived experiences. Your also telling them that their chosen profession is dehumananizing women, which makes them think you are being disingenuous or patronizing when you say you aren’t blaming them. The blog you linked to is a former sex worker talking about her experiences, and there’s nothing wrong with that, but you shouldn’t use them to tell other sex workers what their experiences are.

    I have plenty of friends who are current or former sex workers. They like most of their clients fine and don’t appreciate being told that they are fucktoys and no one respects them when they think they are making an honest living doing something they like and have a talent for, which is what most of of us hope for in life.

  46. says

    Hey, Ace of Sevens, the post to which Klatu links was written by a sex worker. Is reposting the words of a sex worker “hostile” and “shaming” to sex workers now? I mean, as long as it’s a sex worker who disagrees with the Happy Hooker mythology?

  47. PatrickG says

    @ Klatu/Ms. Daisy Cutter:

    Don’t want to speak for AoS, but I will say Klatu’s initial response read more as a general indictment of being in sex work, rather than an indication that there were tremendously important issues w.r.t sex work… I mean, AoS DID say:

    The blog you linked to is a former sex worker talking about her experiences, and there’s nothing wrong with that, but you shouldn’t use them to tell other sex workers what their experiences are.

  48. says

    Patrick, Ace has family in the porn industry, and he is always eager to tell any feminist with a critique of sex work that they’re “speaking for” all sex workers and how dare they.

    I’m not categorically anti-porn or anti-sex work, and I’m not fond of the radical feminists who condemn all of it on ideological grounds, but I think there is a lot to criticize about the sex industry.

  49. PatrickG says

    @ Ms. Daisy Cutter:

    Fair enough. I’m still relatively new here, so a lot of the background in these threads goes right over my head.

    No argument here whatsoever that there’s a lot to criticize. That said, I’d still say that Klatu’s post was extremely ambiguous and could be interpreted as exactly a condemnation on ideological grounds. Klatu, if that’s not what you intended, please take that strictly as a stylistic critique from someone who legitimately misinterpreted you.

  50. says

    @*0: Yes, that and the thread-jacking. It went from some semi-literate man with a keyboard making an incoherent mash of insults to “here’s why whoredom is bad.”

    Also, I don’t have family in the sex industry. I used to be a stripper. My almost-fiancee was a stripper who occasionally did prostitution. Her sister did it fairly regularly as did quite a few of her friends.

  51. says

    Ace, fair enough, and I appreciate the correction, but you really do seem to have a knee-jerk reaction to any criticism of sex work. I have never worked in the industry, so I am loath to say whether your experiences or those of the woman Klatu quoted are more representative, but I have read enough of the latter that I do not think they are an insignificant minority.

  52. says

    @83: I know people who’s experiences weren’t much better than hers. Hell, my ex-girlfriend died as an indirect result of getting hooked on coke when ti was offered as payment in lieu of cash. I’m just saying that in my experience, people who need help often get it from other sex workers, their SOs, families, bouncers and sometimes even the police. I haven’t seen the anti-sex work squad do much except try to put them out of a job and take custody of their kids and tell them what they are doing is shameful and they need to find a real job.

  53. Ichthyic says

    If he has even enough integrity to try to justify the nonsense he spouts, I’ll pull back the curtain.

    please, keep it zipped. this is a family blog.

    besides, the eye strain likely would induce headaches.

  54. PatrickG says

    @ Ace of Sevens:

    From my perspective alone, thanks for clarifying your position. I’d like to hear from Klatu too, but really, this is an area I have very little experience in, and I really don’t want to be misinterpreted as someone from the anti-sex work squad.

    The little I do know (in an affirmative sense, i.e. I can talk about that) comes primarily from the adventures of the Lusty Lady and related union issues in San Francisco.

  55. DLC says

    Well some guy claims PZ is a whorey-Mcsluttypants-whorey-Jew-mcwhore. Because rational arguments in favor of a position — in this can an untenable, patently ridiculous position — won’t work. So what’s left ? cheesy namecalling.

  56. PatrickG says

    And as always, I fail to be clear in my first post… Klatu, I’d like the opportunity to apologize if I’ve misinterpreted you. I might have implied I was looking for you to defend yourself, instead.

    I’m just not good at this text-only thing. /sigh

  57. DLC says

    oh. tpyos , cruel dog! Did not my sacrifice of a typewriter appease thee ? : the above should be “in this case an untenable. . . “

  58. says

    @Josh: “Whoretta McStrumpetStilts”!!!
    Total LOLLercoaster with ROFLcopter overhead! BTW, you forgot “nigger” in your list. As in the latest weird nasty “jewnigger” that’s been cropping up all over.

    (Ew, I typed that. Ick. Hand sanitiser stat!)

  59. klatu says

    @75
    I concede that I was being inadvertently patronizing a lot of sex workers by over-generalizing from just one account/opinion.
    I apologize for that. That was shitty of me. Thank you for making me realize that.

    But at no point was I blaming anyone for their occupation. Maybe I’m just ill-informed, but the vast majority of sex workers around the world have little choice when it comes to their profession.
    Your friends are lucky in that they do have a choice and can persue their profession freely.
    And they are lucky in that they (I’m guessing) can decide who their clients are.

    In other words, your friends are privileged.

    But for others this is not the case.
    Prostitution is a very hazardous occupation, for various reasons. High risk of STDs, unwanted pregnancies, high risk of (sexual) violence, bad workplace conditions, barely any legal accountability, non-consensual (i.e. under duress) participation in degrading or abusive sexual pratices, involuntarily induced chemical addictions, compromised access to legal measures in cases of violence (because of social marginalization and/or non-existence of said measures).
    These are parts of the every-day experience of a whole fuck-ton of women. Women whose clients exploit this social weakness.

    So, excuse me, but I cannot take seriously your insistence that sex work is an occupation to be proud of.
    I would be elated if it was, but it just isn’t the case.

    It is a mixed bag. There are instances of genuine empowerment, and there are instances of slavery (in so many words).

    But until the slavery is gone, how can anyone be proud of it?

  60. Akira MacKenzie says

    Yeah, I was originally going to ask for something like a “Cleveland Steamer” or a “Rusty Trombone” but I realized I’d get more geek cred with a Venture Bros. reference.

  61. says

    How can anyone be proud of their custodial work when unions have lost their power and there are no living wage protections? For that matte,r there’s a good deal of effective slave labor in that industry, too. Bad shit happening to people is a reason to fight for protections for them, not to shut down their industry and tell them they shouldn’t enjoy the work.

  62. Stacy says

    I didn’t realize that McSluttypants was a Jewish name. It sounds Scottish to me.

    No, no. Mac is Scottish; Mc is Irish.

    I believe the MacSluttypantses have an ancestral castle in Ayrshire.

  63. says

    @96: How am I attacking you? The closest I’ve come is saying that posts like yours are driving some sex workers away from FTB and A+, which is negative, but factually correct. See Feminist Whore’s comments here. I don’t think that all her criticisms are fair. She’s overgeneralizing based on what a small subset of movement supporters have said, none of whom are Rebecca Watson or A+ leaders, but I do think that it should be a big concern for a social justice movement when some of the people you’re trying to help say you are ignoring what they have to say.

  64. pedantik says

    It looks like this same psycho has been spamming Jen McCreight. How is it possible for someone’s brain to generate this sort of stuff?

  65. birgerjohansson says

    If Paul is from Elam, shouldn’t he be writing in cuneiform?
    .
    Re. repetitive use of words.
    Beavis & Butt-head watch “Addicted to porn”, Butt-head goes “porn, porn, has lunch, porn, porn, porn, has lunch,, porn, porn, has dinner with family, porn, porn…

  66. David Marjanović says

    If you’re in the mood to literally hate the human race for a while anyway.

    Why would I “literally hate the human race” for just one more moron?

    PZ is the bearded whore of Babylon!!!

    *steal*

    O Naive One! The Watson needs no such tools to dominate others! Her essence permeates the noosphere, bending Myers to her will as a natural byproduct of her existence.

    FTW!

    If Paul is from Elam, shouldn’t he be writing in cuneiform?

    Yes, and in a particularly awesome language!

  67. twincats says

    If you’re in the mood to literally hate the human race for a while anyway.

    There are other moods possible?

    Oooo, squee! Now, where is the end of that line?

    Has everybody else noticed this and it just goes without saying? It’s ‘male’ backwards.

    So, it’s pronounced ‘lame’ then?

  68. lpetrich says

    A whore? Seems like Paul Elam didn’t think through his insults very carefully, because that would imply that PZ is a Rent Boy, a gay male prostitute.