Why I am an atheist – Nyq Only »« The price of a hoax is too high

[Lounge #362]

This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. The ferret is wondering what you people are talking about.

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread

Comments

  1. Crudely Wrott says

    Butting in with a breathless announcement . . .

    Remember Butterball Jesus? Drowning Jesus? Touchdown Jesus on I-75 in Middletown, Ohio? Got struck by lightning and burnt right up back in June of 2010?
    Well, true to prophecy (or human ingenuity), he’s baaaaa aaack! Almost.

    According to the Dayton Daily News (used to be my local daily) construction of his replacement has begun. His lower legs are now in place.

    Linky: http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/news/new-jesus-statue-begins-construction-near-monroe/nRN6W/

    It appears that the reconstruction of the immortal one is proceeding apace. Ron Carter, church administrator, said of the Lux Mundi (Light of the World) statue,:

    Crews will be back out next week to install the statue’s torso section and will return a few more times to erect the arms, head and feet, Carter said. “It has to be ready by the dedication ceremony on Sept. 30,” he said.

    It has to be. Gee, I was told he has always been and will ever be. Alpha and Omega; A to Z and all that, donchano. Anyway,

    additional precautions have been taken to prevent fire from claiming the new statue. Carter said the new statue will have a higher density foam with a fire retardant and that the outside and inside of the statue will be coated with polyurea, another fire retardant. In addition, the new statue will have a lightning suppression system*.

    He said the pieces for the new statue are already shaped but not all of them have been coated with the fire retardant material. Once the statue is completed, the small lake in front of it will be refilled, Carter said.

    Having learned from hard experience Carter is moved to reassure readers:

    “We’ve been told that if lightning should strike the new statute, the damage would only be at the point of the lightning strike and the rest of the statue would not catch fire,” Carter said.

    Two thousand years on and the Jebus still can’t take care of his own graven image. Perhaps this indicates an intertriune discontinuity?

    *snicker, chuckle, guffaw

  2. says

    Portia:
    I would love it if I was Mr Darkheart’s mistress! I’d use it as an excuse to wear big ol’ brimmed hats and litttle black dresses with gloves everywhere. (Why? That’s just the mental image of a mistress that I’ve got. I know it doesn’t make any sense!)

    As it is, the Catholics in our family are the ignore the Pope kind of Catholics. Sure, they go to mass on Sunday and give something up for Lent and all that crap, but a bunch of them have been married/divorced multiple times*. Hell, I was talking to my Catholic SiL this weekend about IUDs and how the only thing that’s holding her back from getting one is problems with her health insurance.

    *One uncle is on his fourth marriage. I don’t know about you, but after the second divorce, I’d probably give up on the institution (although not dating/having a partner).

  3. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Audley:

    Then do it.

    —————-

    I’m taking a SpecFic class next semester. Until then, I am too lazy.

    ————————
    Another tropical wave seems to be rapidly spinning up today. The CV season is mighty active.

    If we get the 12th named storm by tomorrow, it’ll tie for second for earliest of that number.

  4. says

    Rorschach:

    Thanks, I didn’t know that!

    I’m rather astonished you didn’t. There are endless accounts of Leopold and Loeb, along with more movies than I can remember right now and several plays. Geez, it’s one of the most famous murder cases ever.

  5. says

    Audley
    That’s about the variety of catholics ou find in Germany the most, too (minus mass. they only show up for baptisms, marriages and funerals). They think that 99% of what the pope says is bullshit, but they still think he’s a moral authority, a man of great wisdom and insight and don’t you dare to suggest otherwise.

    Anybody seen my spray adhesive?

  6. says

    I’m rather astonished you didn’t.

    No, I really didn’t. Hence my recent enthusiasm about the Scopes trial. I’m currently transcribing the complete Darrow examination of WJ Bryan onto the blog, it is not available anywhere on the net in its entirety as far as I can tell. Give me another week to get it done.

  7. birgerjohansson says

    Scientist creates new cancer drug that is ten times more potent http://medicalxpress.com/news/2012-08-scientist-cancer-drug-ten-potent.html
    — — — — — — — — —
    Here are some excerpts I poached from other blogs:

    The blog Gin and Tonic about the RNC
    “To say that the truth was abused throughout the evening would be an understatement; the apparent theme for the convention is luring the truth into a derelict ice cream truck with promises of candy and then repeatedly touching it in the bathing suit area.”
    .
    RNC swag bag has Romney book with unaltered health care section http://washingtonexaminer.com/rnc-swag-bag-has-romney-book-with-unaltered-health-care-section/article/2506045#.UDw9s9ZlSLe
    [the book shows] … that he was lying when he said he didn’t think, at the time, that the Massachusetts plan should be replicated for everyone. He now has to pretend otherwise because that position is wildly unpopular with the base of his party. He’s simply tried to rewrite his own history and now he’s handing out a book that catches him doing it. Hilarious.

    Comment:”…Romney’s mistake was writing stuff down. It’s kind of hard to maintain etch-a-sketch opinions when you put stuff on the permanent record like that.
    .

    Timothy Egan takes a look at ignorant crackpots –usually bible-thumpers- who sit on powerful committees.
    ”We’re currently experiencing the worst drought in 60 years, a siege of wildfires, and the hottest temperatures since records were kept. But to Republicans in Congress, it’s all a big hoax. The chairman of a subcommittee that oversees issues related to climate change, Representative John Shimkus of Illinois is — you guessed it — a climate-change denier.
    At a 2009 hearing, Shimkus said not to worry about a fatally dyspeptic planet: the biblical signs have yet to properly align. “The earth will end only when God declares it to be over,” he said, and then he went on to quote Genesis at some length. It’s worth repeating: This guy is the chairman.
    On the same committee is an oil-company tool and 27-year veteran of Congress, Representative Joe L. Barton of Texas. You may remember Barton as the politician who apologized to the head of BP in 2010 after the government dared to insist that the company pay for those whose livelihoods were ruined by the gulf oil spill.
    Barton cited the Almighty in questioning energy from wind turbines. Careful, he warned, “wind is God’s way of balancing heat.” Clean energy, he said, “would slow the winds down” and thus could make it hotter. You never know.
    “You can’t regulate God!” Barton barked at the House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, in the midst of discussion on measures to curb global warming…”

  8. blf says

    Geez, [Leopold and Loeb is] one of the most famous murder cases ever.

    Can’t say I’d ever heard of this case (much less any of the plays, movies, …).
    Based entirely on what I just read in the Pffft! of All Knowledge (link added to quote), what’s so interesting about it? Pair of rich scumbugs kill someone (for, admittedly, an exceptionally vile reason), are quickly caught after competent detective work, confess when ridiculous alibis implode, and so hire a well-known lawyer to avoid being murdered in turn by the state. Yawn.

  9. says

    can this help?

    No, too many omissions(actually, this one covers the first third of it verbatim, but then just ends). I have the original transcript in a book here, and what’s available on the net is really just bits and pieces.

  10. says

    blf, a lot of what made the murder famous was the time it took place in, the fact that it was a thrill kill, the murderers were young, intelligent and privileged, etc. People were shocked.

    Mostly what made the case so famous, however, was Darrow. His argument in their defense and against capital punishment was widely commented on, with large amounts of his defense published in papers, etc. It was pretty controversial for the day and remains so. I’m against capital punishment myself, but that said, I have problems with Darrow’s defense of Leopold & Loeb.

    Also, it was pretty rare to win a life sentence rather than a death penalty in those days. People weren’t quite so troubled with the ‘off with their heads!’ view of things.

  11. birgerjohansson says

    Collagen-seeking synthetic protein could lead doctors to tumor locations http://medicalxpress.com/news/2012-08-collagen-seeking-synthetic-protein-doctors-tumor.html#ajTabs
    (It takes a long time to load)
    — — — —
    I haven’t heard the song this is a parody of, but the misheard lyrics (Open Condom Star) are hilarious

    GANGNAM STYLE in English: Misheard Lyrics Parody of PSY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXdkbL6sRic
    — — — —
    “a thrill kill” -I am surprised we have not seen a real-life version of
    “American Psycho”. It is not as if the Gordon Gekkos haven’t got it in them.
    — — — —
    If you are building a monumental statue, you should do it properly! (Futurama’s Bender with statue of him reaching out of the atmosphere)

  12. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Good morning. Good and bad last night. Got some good sleep. Awakened by a 9/11 nightmare and then I lay awake wondering who she is. If this stalls out and I am still obsessing over it in, say, a month, or a year, I’ll need some pro help. Been there before and it worked but I had no clue this shit had happened.

    They will always be there, but they’ll be easier to deal with. Just gotta fight through this storm for a bit.

    Yeah. I’m trying to take a bene gesserit view of the fear and let it pass through me.

    The one thing you shouldn’t do is give up.

    I don’t plan to give up but I do get tired.

    I didn’t specify what sort of professional. There’s doctors who have a cocktail of drugs for everyone, there’s psychiatrists and psychologists with various forms of talk therapy, and even the semi-professional help that people can get from various support groups run by people with specific training

    I figure that as long as I am progressing, not stagnating, I’ll be okay. If I find myself in the same place a month from now, that’d be the time to contact my old shrink.

    If you heard of a 10-year-old, a stranger to you, in the same situation it might be easier to see the responsibility squarely where it belongs – on the adult who abused the children, plural, both physically and mentally.

    Again, it is far harder to tell myself that I am not at fault than it is for me to tell someone else they are not at fault and believe it!

    I just wonder why socially we seem to have issues with professional mental health care that we don’t have with professional health care for the rest of the body.

    Probably because of the shame attached to mental illness — broken arms are not used as silencing insults, but mental illness is.

    Does that make sense? If not, then nevermind me. I do think it is worth fighting back against the self-blaming chorus, though. It might seem easy to just accept the guilt and the badness but myself I’ve found that, as difficult as it can be to keep struggling, living death sentences hurt way worse.

    It does make sense. My guilty feelings about what I did to her come from at least two sources. First, I enjoyed it. Both the physical pleasure and the emotional control over that little kid. Second, I don’t remember her name! I hurt her in a very personal way and I don’t even have the common courtesy to remember who she is! I know these are irrational. I know that. Really, I do. Doesn’t affect the actual feelings all that much.

    To me, there is no “putting up with” your pain here; it is about bearing witness.

    Thanks. Sometimes I feel a little bad about dumping here but typing it out, rather than saying it, helps me work out exactly what I am feeling.

    I don’t know if it is a comfort (although I hope it is) but you are heard, you are believed, and your pain and struggles are acknowledged.

    It is. I just wish that I had had the guts to remember this far earlier, back when I could still remember the rapist’s name.

    Aligning the text with the dirt on your screen is a standard function of most text formatting and display softwares.

    I once spent a half an hour trying to remove a spot from a photograph using PSP. Nothing worked. Nothing. Until I used a little cleaner and a paper towel. That worked.

    And it got rid of the white-out on the screen, too.

    Anybody seen my spray adhesive?

    Check in the fridge right next to the shears.

  13. birgerjohansson says

    “Ing, tentacled cats?”

    Van Vogt’s “Voyage of the Space Beagle” had a big fucking tentacled feline that killed off a lot of the crew in chapter one.
    A later chapter had a precursor to the chest-busting “Alien” larva (Vogt sued the film company and got $$$).
    — — — — — — —
    I think I could live with the Republicans and Tories if their brains were controlled by parasitic aliens. That way, there would be a rational agent at home. You would be able to negotiate with them. You could appeal to their logic and long-term self-interest.

  14. portia says

    Audley

    I would love it if I was Mr Darkheart’s mistress! I’d use it as an excuse to wear big ol’ brimmed hats and litttle black dresses with gloves everywhere.

    Is Audrey Hepburn perhaps your idea of what a mistress looks like? : ) Now you’ve given me an idea of attire…and my Scarlet A would take back on its original meaning haha.

    Good for your sister in law. Those sorts of religious rules make me so sad when people deprive themselves of beneficial technologies, etc. My SO’s parents are devout. Mass every Sunday, and he had to really work up his nerve to tell them he wasn’t taking the kids and he didn’t want them to do it when they had the kids. They don’t give him grief I think, but it was a hard conversation. Compared to some people’s family, though, I suppose they are relatively laid back about pushing it on us/him/the kids.

    One uncle is on his fourth marriage. I don’t know about you, but after the second divorce, I’d probably give up on the institution (although not dating/having a partner).

    You’ve described my paternal grandmother. She had one husband leave her with two small boys, then her second husband died a few years later (he was working under a car, and it fell on him), then another husband left. So she’s been living in sin for about 30 years. She’s a very cool lady. As opposed to her sister in law who hadn’t seen me in 12 years and asked if I lived with my SO before launching into how her granddaughter was “living in sin” and would have to “answer to God.” *eyeroll*

    You could appeal to their logic and long-term self-interest.

    *snicker* One can dream…

    Og, I second the thought that listening is all I feel competent to do but I’m glad that getting it out of your mind here is helpful.

    Ok, I know the answer to this but I know some of you could put it better. Can someone tell me a succinct way to explain that people who support people who want to repeal the Civil Rights Act are probably racists and at the very least racist-enablers? Actually I think those last two words may have answered my question.

    We talked briefly about rules lawyering a few pages ago, and it came to mind when I was listening to This American Life yesterday. The intro segment story is the biggest case of rules lawyering I’ve ever heard of. Absolutely outrageous: people who were suicidal in 17th century U.S. and England (I think) would kill children because if you killed yourself, you couldn’t repent before death. But if you killed a child, the child would certainly go to heaven (innocent! even though we’re born sinful! makes total sense) and then you could repent before your execution. Just wow. Religion is so perverse.

    *moar coffee need moar coffee*

  15. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Ogvorbis

    Sometimes I feel a little bad about dumping here…

    I have a past that has permanently affected the way I deal with people. Nothing as severe as yours, but bad enough to still haunt me these twenty years later. Bad enough that sometimes I can’t even bring myself to participate anonymously in as safe a place as this here lounge. Not because of how I’ve been treated, people have been very kind, but because when the cycle swings downward the flickering feelings of self-worth I harbour are snuffed beneath an ocean of self-doubt. Irrational, implacable, impervious doubt that even in my bleakest moods I *know* is unwarranted, but against which I cannot stand.

    Much of what you’ve written here has helped me, as strange as that might seem. You see, the feelings you’ve expressed are often intimately familiar to me. By sharing here you help those of us who’ve been through our own particular fire to realise that we are not alone, that we are not freaks, that we are in fact normal people dealing with the aftermath of decidedly abnormal situations. I cannot express in terms concrete and unambiguous just how important that is to me. All I can say is: Thank you.

  16. Rey Fox says

    Barton cited the Almighty in questioning energy from wind turbines. Careful, he warned, “wind is God’s way of balancing heat.” Clean energy, he said, “would slow the winds down” and thus could make it hotter. You never know.
    “You can’t regulate God!” Barton barked at the House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, in the midst of discussion on measures to curb global warming…”

    Maybe it’s time we rethought this whole democracy thing.

  17. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Nothing as severe as yours, but bad enough to still haunt me these twenty years later.

    Something that I have noticed, here, other places, some readings about abuse, is that severity and one’s reaction to it are not linear. There may be a way to rate, on a scale, the level of abuse an individual has suffered but there would have to be a completely different scale for how that person reacts to the trauma in both the short and long term.

    For instance, I spent a total of three weeks working in NYC after the terrorist attacks. I spent, maybe, three hours at the actual site (the rest of the time was up in the Javitz Center). Yet I, twelve years later, still get panic attacks and nightmares. Others that I know, who were far more intimately involved for longer, well, some have more symptoms and some have less. Severity of trauma and how it affects me, you, or Fred over there, are not fixed.

    Bad enough that sometimes I can’t even bring myself to participate anonymously in as safe a place as this here lounge.

    Discussing this pseuodonymously, with the option of walking away at any time, has made it far easier for me to ‘talk’ about what happened. And without the brutality of the Elevator threads and what came after, I probably would not remember what actually happened. I was reading comments and someone, no idea who (and I have never been able to search any comments over the entire site — cannot grok!), made a comment about rape and children and, boom, there it was (well, part of it anyway). I started writing a response and, without realizing it, began to tell my own story for the first time (hell, it was the first time I had told myself any of it!). Prior to that, I just remembered that I hated cub scouts (and boy scouts (but that was because I kept getting beaten up because I wasn’t born again)) but I had no idea why.

    Other things discussed here have struck chords and helped bring more things to the surface — the photography; the family that walked into the campground, apologized for interupting and left; the girl that I hurt — have surfaced slowly and relatively safely through the discussions in this community.

    My feelings of inadequacy, my feelings of guilt, my doubt, my dim view of me as a person stem from two years of pleasant abuse (I enjoyed it at the time because I thought it was right and my body liked it!). Being able to participate pseudonymously, with the option to run whenever I want (and I have done that) have made this, to me, far better than discussing it in meatspace even with a professional.

    If you want to share, do it. It may help. If not, don’t. The support and tolerance for self-pitying bullshit shown by the meanies at Pharyngula has been mindblowing. All of you, I can’t thank you enough.

    I cannot express in terms concrete and unambiguous just how important that is to me. All I can say is: Thank you.

    You are welcome.

    And thank you for telling me/us this. I didn’t realize that my explorations of my sanity, my depression, my guilt, my everything-that-is-broken, could help someone else. I keep forgetting, and have to remind myself constantly, that I am not alone, that there are far too many people who have gone through intentional trauma (I kinda like that term. Did I just invent something?), trauma created by someone else for that person’s own deluded reasons.

  18. says

    The problem with the binary of “hard” science fiction vs. “soft” science fiction is that the terms are imprecise, typically used as insults, and very much gendered. Check out the Talk page on the WP article for “soft science fiction”… which references this 2007 comment from some evo-psych devotee or other.

    I wasn’t aware that, as Morales says, “sci-fi” is used to denote unlikely Hollywood science fiction, while “s/f” is applied to The Real Thing™; I simply thought the former was obsolete.

    Birger, I saw that quote from Gin and Tacos yesterday, and I closed the window. Hurr hurr, child molestation jokes. How progressive. There’s also fat-shaming in the comments.

    I didn’t know much about the Leopold & Loeb case, although I’d heard the names before. I would agree with blf’s assessment.

  19. cicely says

    Anybody seen my spray adhesive?

    ‘Fraid not. I’d lend you mine, but I can’t get it to go into my machine.
    -

  20. Richard Austin says

    Speaking the truth for once.

    The tensions come amid a debate within the GOP on how best to lure new voters. The nation’s shifting demographics have caused some Republican leaders to worry not only about the party’s future but about winning in November, particularly in key swing states such as Virginia and Nevada.

    “The demographics race we’re losing badly,” said Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (S.C.). “We’re not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term.

  21. says

    Christians launch petition to stop production of “blasphemous jesus of nazareth” film.

    “The liberal media’s relentless persecution of the Christian faith shows yet again the double standard of bigotry. There’s no way a similar movie would ever be made claiming Muhammad was the product of a rape,” wrote Dr. Ted Baehr, the founder of the Christian Film & Television Commission, in a press release. The press release goes on to say:

    The movie depicts the life of Jesus, but unlike other Biblical epics “jesus of nazareth” shows Jesus performing no miracles, born as the result of rape, and when Jesus dies he does not come back from the grave.

    Baehr is urging his fellow Christians to sign the online “Stop the Blasphemous Movie ‘Jesus of Nazareth'” petition powered by Liberty Action Center, which reads:

    I demand that “jesus of nazareth” be pulled from production.

    This movie intends to declare that my Christian faith is useless and it blasphemes the precious name and actions of Jesus.

    It’s offensive to my beliefs and religion and perpetuates the double standard that it’s o.k. to ridicule Christians.

    This movie is a cruel deception targeting our children and grandchildren who are impressionable and love to go to movies.

    This type of religous [sic – religious] bigotry would not be tolerated against any other major religion in this country and we will not be silent in the face of such an attack on our faith by any movie studio, production company and/or theater.

  22. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Rorschach @ #499: He didn’t get them acquitted, he got them life plus 99. Which isn’t the death sentence people were hoping for, but still. Also, his arguments were more that they were minors, and had their brains addled by too much Nietzsche.

  23. Happiestsadist, opener of the Crack of Doom says

    Ogvorbis: Thank you. You’re pretty amazing. This place has gotten me to open up a lot more as well about what was done to me.

  24. says

    Happiestsadist:

    and had their brains addled by too much Nietzsche.

    Darrow did worse than that, he argued that L&L couldn’t be blamed for adopting a Nietzschean view (the supermen) because, after all, Nietzsche was taught in the university. Darrow did a a lot of baffling the court with bullshit and won.

  25. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    JAL:

    Cuteness from my child:

    What a wonderful child you have!
    (and what a wonderful person you are to instill such values in your daughter)
    ****
    John:
    penii, penii, penii, penii, penii, penii, penii, penii :-P
    ****
    portia:

    Can someone tell me a succinct way to explain that people who support people who want to repeal the Civil Rights Act are probably racists and at the very least racist-enablers?

    I don’t know if I could be succint.
    I know I’d have to ask such people what is gained by repealing the Act. I’d want to know exactly who benefits and whether or not they think anyone would be on the losing end of a repeal. Especially in a country where [I’ve heard tell] ‘all people are created equal’.
    ****
    FossilFishy @22:
    I don’t know the details of what is haunting you.
    I do know this:
    You are not a freak.
    You are not alone
    .
    ****
    Caine@35:
    Let me guess, the poor persecuted Christians think The Passion of the Christ is a sterling example of HIS life?
    They prefer the torture, brutality and human sacrifice of TPotC, but bemoan the rape (but not for the reasons that moral people denounce rape), lack of zombies and Magick Jesus™ in Jesus of Nazareth…FFS!
    ****

    Dr. Ted Baehr, the founder of the Christian Film & Television Commission

    Hey Mr. Whiny, you could just, y’know NOT WATCH THE DAMN MOVIE.

  26. KG says

    personally I get more concerned about the absolute slaughter of birds that these things [wind turbines] create. – broboxley

    Yes, that’s a serious problem – except they don’t.

  27. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Caine:
    I just had a random thought:
    Do you have someone to look after all the rats when you go on vacation (this presumes you take them vacations to begin with)?

  28. portia says

    Herman Cain says: “I believe the polls are wrong, based on anecdotal evidence.” *facepalm*

  29. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    ME:

    (this presumes you take them vacations to begin with)?

    learn to preview (odd, I’m pretty good at previewing long responses, but something *this* short I screw up?)

  30. portia says

    Good idea about argumentation, Tony. Unfortunately, for it to work they’d have to care about marginalized people getting screwed. Sigh.

  31. says

    Do any of my fellow Pharynguloids have a link to a good analysis of the Eurozone economic problem? I appear to have gotten sucked into an argument about its cause, but I admit I’m completely ignorant about what caused it.

    The other side of the argument is positing that the onus is on the European welfare state, with Germany standing as the Valiant Defender of All That is Good™ against the Evil Socialist Hordes in France and Spain. From what I’ve been able to find, that seems not to be the case, but almost all of it is unsourced assertions.

  32. Richard Austin says

    Holy crap.

    The federal records, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act, reveal that Romney’s initial rescue attempt at Bain & Company was actually a disaster – leaving the firm so financially strapped that it had “no value as a going concern.” Even worse, the federal bailout ultimately engineered by Romney screwed the FDIC – the bank insurance system backed by taxpayers – out of at least $10 million. And in an added insult, Romney rewarded top executives at Bain with hefty bonuses at the very moment that he was demanding his handout from the feds.

    […]

    In the end, the government surrendered. At the time, The Boston Globe cited bankers dismissing the bailout as “relatively routine” – but the federal documents reveal it was anything but. The FDIC agreed to accept nearly $5 million in cash to retire $15 million in Bain’s debt – an immediate government bailout of $10 million. All told, the FDIC estimated it would recoup just $14 million of the $30 million that Romney’s firm owed the government.

  33. ImaginesABeach says

    Threadrupt. Camping with my kids, and temporarily in town with my nook. I left my purse in the car yesterday because i had my wallet with me. Someone took my purse out of my car. Not a big deal because there wasn’t really anything in it. I suspect the thief was unhappy to get tissues, mints, and a vibrator.

  34. Richard Austin says

    shockna:
    To my understanding, the big problem is having independent economies tied to a single currency with a committee driving fiscal policy. Normally, an individual country can use currency manipulation tactics to manage debt or as part of fiscal policy. The creation of the EEC and the adoption of the EU, with a central agency to manage it, means abdication of the ability of individual nations to control fiscal policy for themselves.

    The notion of a central fiscal policy really only works if you also have a central political policy, and Europe definitely doesn’t have that. So, a bunch of different nations with entirely different goals and economies encompassing totally separate taxation and spending policies are now bound by a single fiscal policy. Ever run a three-legged race? Try doing it with 14 people instead of 2: either the strongest carry the weak or the whole thing winds up in a pile on the floor.

  35. Richard Austin says

    (Should add – I am not an economist. That’s just my layman’s interpretation of stuff I’ve been told by friends who are financial analysts and Wall Street types (mostly good guys, not Bain Capital types).)

  36. says

    Greta’s latest post finally got me to make this image.

    Nota bene: The mitosis image comes from this poster; I played with Photoshop to lighten it and change the colors. IANAL so I have no idea what sorts of copyright issues this might present. If someone else wants to play with the idea using original art, they can feel free to.

  37. says

    Tony:

    Do you have someone to look after all the rats when you go on vacation (this presumes you take them vacations to begin with)?

    No, we don’t. So, we don’t really do vacations. Our vet clinic has boarding facilities, but boarding two monster dogs, five cats and a plague of rats would eat up so-called vacation money.

  38. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Crews will be back out next week to install the statue’s torso section and will return a few more times to erect the arms, head and feet

    I think someone needs a remedial anatomy lesson.

  39. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Tropical update:

    TS Issac still producing rain in and around Louisiana. It will continue heading northward over the next few days (bringing its rain)

    Small Hurricane Kirk has developed an eye and is under good conditions. This small Cat 1 poses no threats to land.

    TS Leslie has just formed east of the Antilles; although it is forecast to head north of these islands and out to sea, interests there should be somewhat alert- this has the potential to strenghten greatly.

    Incidentally, with the formation of Leslie (12th storm of the year), we are now ahead of 2005.

  40. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Cross-posted from Greta’s:

    Speaking only for myself (and not on behalf of Teh Ghey), I’ve reached the point where I do question the motivations of people who keep objecting to A+. Greta could not be clearer or more reasonable. Ditto Jen. Yet commenters pop up and claim that the authors are saying the precise opposite of the author’s actual words. Words that are right there on the page. Not hidden, not subject to debate.

    This is right-wing-level madness. It’s calling apples sirloin steaks and failing to understand why people are telling you that sounds like lunacy.

    And I suspect Greta would disagree with me, but I think there is an built-in implication of judgment with any movement or self-chosen grouping. It cannot be otherwise. Yes, joining the Democratic party does signal that you think your political ideas are a better answer than non-Democrats. How could it be otherwise?

    That’s normal. That’s how human interaction works. So, yes, though the A+ folks are going to great pains (they really are being far more patient than detractors deserve) to clarify that they’re not exercising a top-down philosophical judgment on non-joiners, the fact remains that continuing to mischaracterize it and shriek woundedness does tell us something about your priorities. It does throw into question your professed commitment to these issues or your commitment to non-assholery.

    I can think of several possible motivations:

    1. A critic has some personal, emotional objection based on an experience somewhere else. This causes a reflexive “don’t you judge me” reaction even when it’s unnecessary.

    2. A critic (very likely not with malice, mind you) really isn’t comfortable with anything that could even obliquely suggest they might have some more examination to do about privilege.

    3. A critic realizes (again, maybe not consciously) that the culture and conversation they were comfortable with is shifting. They don’t like that, but more, they really, really don’t like that it puts them on the spot in places and with people they didn’t think they’d be on the spot with.

    There are many other possible motivations. But I don’t really care what they are. The consequence is the same. Reacting this way tells me that it’s more important to you to confabulate, double-down on your errors, perceive bad faith in people trying to do good work, and hog the center stage with your self-centered objections than you actually care about the issue itself.

    That tells me things about you. “Ally who prioritizes social justice issues and cares about wounded people being given a damned break” is not among them.

    Were I running a forum or starting a space for A+, at this point my answer to critics would be: no, you may not. You may not take up the oxygen anymore. You may not waste our time. No, you are not entitled to any more forbearance or explanation.

    And then I’d ruthlessly ban you.

  41. says

    To my understanding, the big problem is having independent economies tied to a single currency with a committee driving fiscal policy. Normally, an individual country can use currency manipulation tactics to manage debt or as part of fiscal policy.

    Part of the problem is that Germany also had a policy of very small growth in wages but very big growth in economy, thus driving export and making the curency “worth a lot”.

  42. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    I’m giving my daily allowance of ♥’s to Josh for his post @63.

  43. Ogvorbis: broken says

    . . . Ms. Ford posted a message on Twitter on Wednesday advising women to, “Stay alert, walk tall, carry mace, take self-defence classes & don’t dress like a whore.”

    So when a woman is raped, we can put the blame where it belongs, on the whore who wasn’t alert, walking tall, carrying mace or a blackbelt. Are you sure that tweet wasn’t from that terrorist group down in Florida, the GOP? This would be right in line with the ‘real rape victims don’t get pregnant and thus don’t need abortions’ idiocy. What the fuck is wrong with people? Why this need to blame the victim (it’s not as if the victims don’t do that to themselves already, why do some people feel a need to pile it on?)?

  44. says

    I’m going to go chicken and orzo, with some carrots, celery, onion, and just a pinch of the scarazy hot chili paste with the rooster on the jar. Did I mention homemade chicken stock, simmered 10 hours yesterday?

  45. says

    broboxley,

    My office cat is half fainting goat, swear to Odin! She walks to where she is close but juuuuuust out of reach of my fingers for me to pet her from my desk, and then she falls over like she’s been turned to stone.

  46. cicely says

    Did I mention homemade chicken stock, simmered 10 hours yesterday?

    You did. I *drool* enviously.
    -

  47. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Joe, on my way for the chicken soup.
    I hear it’s good for the soul :)

  48. says

    Tony, it is not sriracha but I guess it is the same brand and even hotter than the rooster sauce!

    The best thing about using homemade chicken stock is that you have all that yummy chicken fat left over, and you can use it to cook your veggies in and add some flavor with the oil.

  49. says

    So, Bill Nye has lost his shit.

    It used to be these Republicans didn’t believe in global warming or evolution. That was bad enough. Now they don’t even believe in egg + sperm = baby. Where does Todd Akin think babies come from? Does he think there are separate storks for people who were raped and people who weren’t? Hey look over there! It’s the rape stork. It drops off all its babies directly at the orphanage. He’s a fucking idiot. Just a plain fucking idiot.

    The Daily What via death+taxes
    http://cheezburger.com/6552225536
    http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/187962/bill-nye-to-todd-akin-on-live-television-youre-a-fucking-idiot/

  50. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    I love Bill Nye and now I love him even more for that. Fucking awesome.

  51. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    [This is the Official SpokesHouse speaking]–Soon SallyStrange and Esteleth will be in me.

  52. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Inorite Audley?

    BTW, I’m sorry to tell you that Bill Nye story is parody:(

  53. David Marjanović says

    I haven’t heard the song this is a parody of, but the misheard lyrics (Open Condom Star) are hilarious

    GANGNAM STYLE in English: Misheard Lyrics Parody of PSY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXdkbL6sRic

    Ooh, that was all on PET. On the one hand, there’s a Singaporean adaptation (“Singaporean style”); on the other, the original is already a satire of people who live in a certain part of Seoul and try way too hard to show their wealth off. Ask pelamun for the links; if he doesn’t appear, I’ll post them on the weekend.

  54. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Oh boy, I don’t know what I’m getting into. I’ve never watched any convention (Dem or GOP).
    Just listened to Jeb Bush. Ugh.
    He’s talking about investing in education for children. Yeah, pushing creationism into schools and trying to get rid of evolution in textbooks is a great way to get there.
    He’s talking about how America is the greatest nation on Earth. Only to a segment of the American population.
    UGH!
    Can I make it through this?
    (where’s that liquor?)

  55. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    BTW, I’m sorry to tell you that Bill Nye story is parody:(

    Awww. Boo. =(

    BTW was it just me that got errors when clicking on Audley’s link for Bill Nye?

  56. David Marjanović says

    The creation of the EEC and the adoption of the EU, with a central agency to manage it, means abdication of the ability of individual nations to control fiscal policy for themselves.

    The notion of a central fiscal policy really only works if you also have a central political policy, and Europe definitely doesn’t have that. So, a bunch of different nations with entirely different goals and economies encompassing totally separate taxation and spending policies are now bound by a single fiscal policy. Ever run a three-legged race? Try doing it with 14 people instead of 2: either the strongest carry the weak or the whole thing winds up in a pile on the floor.

    Fiscal policy is not centralized; it likely will be soon. However, you’re right about the rest: €zone member countries can’t devalue their currencies, they don’t have any control over the € – the European Central Bank in Frankfurt was specifically and explicitly created to be independent from politics and to do nothing except keeping inflation down.

    Greece, BTW, has stupidly high military spending. That’s probably caused by fear of its fellow NATO member Turkey. I’m told Greece has ludicrous amounts of tanks that it couldn’t even use because the country consists almost only of mountains and sea! If they got rid of that and managed to crack down on the richest tax evaders, not much if anything would be left of their deficit.

    Does he think there are separate storks for people who were raped and people who weren’t? Hey look over there! It’s the rape stork. It drops off all its babies directly at the orphanage. He’s a fucking idiot. Just a plain fucking idiot.

    So full of win!

  57. says

    JAL:
    Nope, I had trouble accessing the secind link too, but I thought I’d throw it out there anyway.

    Tony:

    He’s talking about investing in education for children. Yeah, pushing creationism into schools and trying to get rid of evolution in textbooks is a great way to get there.

    Don’t forget slashing education right out of state budgets, charter schools (which are paid for by taxes, at least in NY), and giving vouchers for private schools! Republicans love that shit, too!

  58. David Marjanović says

    Erg… I have the shittiest depression ever. It involves a lot of really bad dancing and the occasional injury due to clumsiness. Fucking sucks.

    Depression makes you dance???

    Anyway: have a calming manatee.

  59. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Soon SallyStrange and Esteleth will be in me.

    Great for you!

    *grumbles due to distance and youth*

  60. David Marjanović says

    Amelia is trying to wrestle my hands into submission and give me a dental check, Magrat is stalking a spider, Agnes and Artemis are practicing climbing and the rest of the girls sound like they are building a new closet.

    So awesome! What’s Dexter up to?

  61. says

    David Marjanović,

    Yeah, my depression often expresses itself as deep anxiety. So I find myself wandering around the house in loops, and when my wife looks at me funny I start dancing.

  62. says

    And here’s some good (non-hoaxy) news:

    The U.S. Court of Appeals in Washington, D.C. ruled Thursday (PDF) that a controversial voter ID law in Texas would disenfranchise poor people and blocked the state from implementing it, where the law’s likely to stay unless the Supreme Court overturns the decision.

    Attorneys for the Department of Justice argued that the state’s Republican Party was engaged in a systemic attempt to shrug off the coming effects of changing demographics in Texas, where census figures show Hispanics are responsible for two-thirds of the new population growth.

    The court agreed that the law, which would require voters to present a photo ID before casting a ballot, constituted an inappropriate burden on the poor, who are disproportionately black and Hispanic. Because of that, officials will be barred from implementing the policy, as it violates the Voting Rights Act of 1965.

    http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/08/30/federal-court-blocks-texas-voter-id-law/

  63. says

    David:

    What’s Dexter up to?

    Well, he had to have his tail washed today, he didn’t care for that at all. He’s spent most of today helping the other boys to dig out the contents of one litter box all over the table, wrestling, running away from Basil, who is being a bully and enjoying chicken rice and vermicelli.

  64. David Marjanović says

    That’s about the variety of catholics ou find in Germany the most, too (minus mass. they only show up for baptisms, marriages and funerals). They think that 99% of what the pope says is bullshit, but they still think he’s a moral authority, a man of great wisdom and insight and don’t you dare to suggest otherwise.

    Really? The Catholics in my family just snark and/or mentally facepalm when the topic of conversation turns to Ratzinger.

    Maybe it’s time we rethought this whole democracy thing.

    Democracy works pretty fine when more than half of the voters have an idea about what the fuck they’re voting for.

    Rethink the education system. Perhaps with a sledgehammer.

    “The demographics race we’re losing badly,” said Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (S.C.). “We’re not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term.

    with Germany standing as the Valiant Defender of All That is Good™

    Merkel personally is the Valiant Defender of Austerity™, Austerity™, Austerity™. Which seems to be a great ideology-driven way to prolong the problem instead of solving it. That’s part of why the French kicked Sarkozy the fuck out and replaced him by a socialist… turning Merkozy into Hollerkel.

    The way state-level elections keep going in Germany, Merkel is a lame duck.

  65. David Marjanović says

    And here’s some good (non-hoaxy) news:

    :-)

    Well, he had to have his tail washed today, he didn’t care for that at all. He’s spent most of today helping the other boys to dig out the contents of one litter box all over the table, wrestling, running away from Basil, who is being a bully

    Aw. :-(

    and enjoying chicken rice and vermicelli.

    That’s better. :-)

  66. says

    Rey:

    Ooh me next! Merlin update!

    Merlin also had to have his tail washed today. Not a fan, but very well behaved. After stuffing himself on sweet potatoes, turkey and rice baby food and watermelon, he had a nice long sleep. He’s spent most of the day on the box wrecking crew, helping to chew out the bottom of their favourite box. Very important work, that.

  67. says

    Broboxely:

    um Caine? Raises hand. Tail washing?

    Given Carrot’s megacolon problem, he tends to leak. A lot. Caked shit on tails is not a good thing. Rats use their tails to regulate their body temperature, so anything caked on it isn’t good, but it’s plain old icky too, so tail washing.

    I don’t make the rats bathe unless they are a right mess. The first time we took Esme’s crew into the clinic for their wellness check, oh man, the shit…it was everywhere. All over the carrier, all over them, so they had a bath* when we got home.

    *For multiple rats, fill the tub with warm water to about 2.5 to 3 inches of water, insert rats. They’ll swim and try to get the fuck out of the tub, but if you place a scrunched up towel or high rock in the middle, they’ll perch and start cleaning themselves. Soap isn’t usually necessary, but if it is, use a shampoo designed for kittens and be careful to keep water out of their ears.

  68. onychophora says

    Welp, the semester has officially started and the creationist dribble has started showing up in my classes, on writing assignments and in my inbox. FFS. Same old shit. “If evolution is true, then why aren’t monkeys evolving into humans” and suchlike. *sob*

  69. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    Squeeeeeeeeeee!

    Little One and I are going through the Scholastic book flyers now since Muse’s awesome donation. We both want to buy them all. So many cool things. Like I remember awesome Magic Tree House books, and the Berenstein bears, and Biscuit, and Scooby Doo, and Space books, and math books and animal books and and everything! We are super duper excited and can’t decide. It’s a nice change to be able to not know what to buy instead of knowing you can’t get anything.

    BTW Muse, the artist known as Little One has drawn a picture to say thank you for The Nice Book Lady. In the style of her previous work for The Nice Rat Lady. I’m looking for a way to take a picture of it so I can send it you.

  70. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Ok, they’re doing a video tribute to Mitt Romney??!!

    WTF?

    Can someone tell me what this man deserves a tribute for?

  71. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Caine:
    Do rats form bonds with humans in a manner similar to the way cats and dogs [often] do?

  72. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    You know, I’m uncomfortable with the way they’re using Ann Romney’s multiple sclerosis as a means to garner empathy with viewers for Mitt.
    It seems to be minimizing what she’s been through to benefit HIM.

  73. says

    Hee. I remember scrubbing my Milo’s tail with a soft toothbrush. He tolerated it really well (like he tolerated everything). Don’t know why Caine is doing it but I did it because his tail got stinky after a while.

  74. says

    I also used to have two girl rats, and one of them was totally adventurous and didn’t have much time for me but the other one was very puppylike. Her name was Mochou and while her sister was gaily running all over the apartment getting into stuff, Mochou would be gazing at me from the edge of the couch and practically rocking back and forth with indecision: “Don’t wanna climb down … but the human is over there. Ohhh but it’s so high … but the human is over there. Ohhhhhhh it’s so far … but the human is over there …” Eventually she would take the plunge and dash as quickly as she could across the scary living room to climb up my pants leg.

  75. cicely says

    Caine, I used cosmetics to “paint” a large butterfly “mask” on my face last Halloween. There are a few things I’m going to do differently when I do it again this year, but I thought the shimmery blue in particular made good butterfly wings.

    *applause* for Muse. Outstanding!
    -

  76. consciousness razor says

    I turned on the Academy Awards RNC, and Clint Eastwood was saying a lot of stupid shit.

    *shakes head*

  77. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    What’s with all the *damn* appeals to emotion?
    How about we talk about actual issues?

  78. consciousness razor says

    He was talking about how awful unemployment is, then basically implied that means Obama must not give a fuck.

    Then he rounds off with dribble like this “Possibly, it may be time to decide if someone else can do it.” Followed by massive applause, then unrelated nonsense.

    Well, sure. Possibly. In fact, that is what time it is. It’s election season. That’s how this shit works, you dissembling jackass.

  79. says

    Tony:

    Do rats form bonds with humans in a manner similar to the way cats and dogs [often] do?

    Oh yes. Very intense bonds. Amelia has been melting my heart into a puddle lately, she is so intensely attached to me. She always has been (my little facehugger), but she’s even more tightly bonded to me now and is working on that bond with Mister. When Mister is home, she insists on being in my studio, so she can spend time with him as well. She’s very much a people rat and prefers to be with someone most of the time.

    Almost all the ratlets are people rats, some more than others. Some rats are not social when it comes to humans and that’s okay, too. Sam is an example of that – people frighten him and it’s clear at this point that he’s never going to be social when it comes to humans. He is very social with the other rats, though, and loves the ratlets to pieces.

  80. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Gee, Marco Rubio, thanks for dissing bartenders everywhere!

  81. says

    Kristinc:

    Eventually she would take the plunge and dash as quickly as she could across the scary living room to climb up my pants leg.

    Aaaaw. They just steal your heart, every time.

    Cicely:

    Eventually she would take the plunge and dash as quickly as she could across the scary living room to climb up my pants leg.

    I’ve been painting with cosmetics for years on end. The trick is to use wallpaper paste for your mixing medium. :D

  82. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Oh gee. Here comes Mittens.
    I think I need the entire barrel of Grog.

  83. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    “You kept going because you’re an American. You didn’t quit.”

    That’s some lovely American exceptionalism.
    I didn’t know all you people in countries around the world were quitters.

  84. consciousness razor says

    That’s some lovely American exceptionalism.

    And we’re “the greatest country in the history of the planet.” (Nothing ambiguous about that.) That’s because…. Neil Armstrong?

  85. broboxley OT says

    Why in the unholy (insert obscenity here) is anyone watching the RNC? College football season opened today, TNA wrestling is on and the discovery channel is running repeats of “cockroaches, our friends and neighbors”

    I wont watch that drivel and I wont watch the DNC with Biden with his faux kkk hat, Charlie Christ (who I actually like) doing the wahwah shuffle. Even the Clinton’s are visiting the Central African Republic to avoid that horror show and Jimmy is mailing in a tape.

    Two of the most venal, useless, carpet bagging, Chitown, Tamanny Hall, 2 bit hustlers are vying for the position of what used to be the most important job in the western world. Headed by one party that wants to give all the cash to the rich and the other party who has the same aim while pretending to give a flying freakshow about the common man. Both of these useless political appendages from a bygone age act like a 26% of the population that votes for them is a freakin mandate to fornicate the entire population!

    The current president is doing his best to ensure that the bankers get every last dime of the populace and his opponent’s main argument is that he isn’t transferring the wealth fast enough to suit.

    Sorry, needed to vent

  86. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Caine:

    How’s the situation with Basil? Is he doing fine?

  87. dianne says

    You kept going because you’re an American. You didn’t quit.

    You keep going if you’re an American. People in other countries re-evaluate their actions, consider the consequences, change direction when things aren’t working right, sometimes even become ashamed of their past sins and change directions entirely. But Americans keep going.

  88. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    A good number of Americans have NOT supported this President in good faith.
    Birthers, anyone?
    Hey Mittens, where’s your birth certificate?

  89. says

    Thunk:

    How’s the situation with Basil? Is he doing fine?

    Oh yes, Basil is just fine. He’s gotten huge and he’s generally a very happy fellow, but he does get too rough with his little cousins, so he requires a talking to every now and then. He really loved getting in the wading pool yesterday and fishing for peas.

  90. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    broboxley:
    I don’t watch sports.
    I’ve never watched any political convention.
    I had nothing else to do, so I figured I’d bring myself some pain.
    I’m still not sure if I made the correct choice.
    At least football would have provided some eye candy.

  91. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Oh, Romney has a plan to create 12 million new jobs. What overseas countries are they going to be in?

  92. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Honor the institution of marriage.
    Protect the sanctity of life.
    Honor freedom of religion.

    I need to change the channel. I want to puke now.

  93. Jeebus says

    Oh, Romney has a plan to create 12 million new jobs. What overseas countries are they going to be in?

    This must be like Nixon’s secret plan to end the Vietnam War.

  94. broboxley OT says

  95. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    I’m still in shock there are women in the audience.
    Why would *any* woman support this guy?

  96. hotshoe says

    And we’re “the greatest country in the history of the planet.” (Nothing ambiguous about that.) That’s because…. Neil Armstrong?

    And Neil Armstrong’s great achievement was because … private entrepreneurial capitalist job creators! Obviously, space exploration can only be done by free enterprise. Anyone who says differently just hates America!

    You built that all by yourself, did you, you Thugs? No help whatsoever from taxpayer-funded programs decided by fairly-elected US gov’t representatives. Yes, you Thugs built the moon program all by yourselves, you brilliant entrepreneurs, you. Fuck all of you lying assholes.

    Goddamn I hate republicans. Even more than I hate Catholics.

  97. Jeebus says

  98. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    broboxley:
    I’ve watched UFC many times (used to work in a sports bar). I used to watch Ultimate Fighter on Spike TV. There were some decent looking men. In the last year, I’ve realized I don’t like shows like that anymore.
    The mindless glorification of violence.
    The ridiculous idea that this is “reality tv”.
    The unnecessary melodrama.
    The stereotypical depiction of men as macho.
    I can’t do it anymore.
    Thus I torture myself with something that’s actually *worse*. Republicans pretending to care about people who *aren’t* them.

  99. broboxley OT says

    Jeebus #149 although pro rassling has as much spitting as porn on the internet, the porn on the internet doesnt have as much shouting although the misogyny is about equal all things considered

  100. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Wolf Blitzer just said Romney did a good job with his speech.
    WTF?
    It was almost entirely vacuous.
    Take out all the emotional appeals and what’s left?
    A rich guy who can’t relate to the average American and doesn’t give two shits about them either.
    Romney: “I don’t like gays or immigrants. I don’t like poor people. I don’t like healthcare for everyone. I don’t care about the environment. I think women’s value is in motherhood. Seniors aren’t terribly important.”
    People want to vote for *THAT*?

  101. broboxley OT says

    Tony,

    Republicans pretending to care about people who *aren’t* them.

    then why do you go gaga over a rich white guy from Rhode Island who pretends that the wage slavery from Ikea in Danville isnt? Rangell gets it
    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57499971-503544/rangel-bidens-gaffe-was-clearly-about-slavery/

    The Democratic party mocks everyone who doesnt have an inside connection to make coin the old fashioned way, bribery, union busting, extortion and insider government loans.

    The democratic party has very few members who actually give a shit about the people any more and the republicans take pride in never giving a shit about people at all

    time for a change all right. Organize so 90% of eligible voters vote for someone else and a different party than the tired slot machines they trot out every 4 years.

    vote local to make it easier to get 3rd parties on the ballot in the local and state level. Get enough voices to break this domination of one party with 2 right wings in our national politics

  102. consciousness razor says

    Okay, broboxley OT. I’ll just go ahead do that; and while I’m at it, I’ll give everyone a unicorn.

  103. consciousness razor says

    “go ahead and do”

    Which is a silly turn of phrase anyway. I’m going to go ahead and stop using it for a while.

  104. broboxley OT says

    consciousness razor sorry just totally irritated that people think voting for tweedlevenal is better than voting for tweedlereally venal. I will shaddup if folks can drag the politics over to the thunderdome and keep the lounge supplied in rat advice. Putting washing rats that I am allergic to on my to do list as well as a brake job on the 1996 cougar

  105. ibyea says

    @broboxley
    The only way to do that would be to eliminate the electoral college system. Unlikely, since many people seem to think that the US Constitution is a document handed down to them by gods called The Founding Fathers.

  106. says

    consciousness razor sorry just totally irritated that people think voting for tweedlevenal is better than voting for tweedlereally venal.

    I’d be irritated if I was constantly wrong due to my inability to grow up and do either math or weigh ethical choices properly. Hell if I were such a person, basically a gigantic infant, I bet I’d be irritated a lot!

  107. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Broboxley:
    You’ve made an assumption about me that undermines your argument. I have not gone gaga over the democratic party. My comments tonight were in response to watching the republican national convention. I will comment on the democratic national convention when it occurs.
    I can see where this could head so I choose not to pursue this.

  108. says

    Though Broboxley’s point that they’re basically the same (a point that stands along side such pearls of wisdom as ‘stick your toungue to the flag pole” and “lets eat poo!”) is undermined by the near certainty that the DNC will not have an actor/director curse at furniture

  109. consciousness razor says

    consciousness razor sorry just totally irritated that people think voting for tweedlevenal is better than voting for tweedlereally venal.

    It is better. Even if they had the same positions on economics and classism and would do the same things about them (they don’t and wouldn’t), those aren’t the only issues for many people.

    I will shaddup if folks can drag the politics over to the thunderdome and keep the lounge supplied in rat advice.

    I’m not telling you to shut up. If you want to go somewhere else, you could, but I probably shouldn’t respond in kind by telling you what you should do to get me to shut up.

  110. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    I fucking hate Republicans. I hate you. Racist, classist, paranoid, xenophobic white scum bags. Fuck you and fuck the 1952 US you represent. I’m going to enjoy watching you age out and die like the embarrassing relics you are.

    Fuck you.

  111. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Ibyea:

    The only way to do that would be to eliminate the electoral college system. Unlikely, since many people seem to think that the US Constitution is a document handed down to them by gods called The Founding Fathers.

    And the FPTP representation system, as well as the artificially small number of representatives (435 for a nation of 300M?)

  112. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Oh that’s so cute…you think that the next generation won’t be full or greedy selfish xenophobic privileged monsters who want to screw everyone else over?

    Don’t start shit with me unless you wanna fight because I’m not in the mood. And don’t talk to me like I’m naive.

  113. hotshoe says

    I just got an email link to a Planned-Parenthood quiz about Thug attacks on women’s health. Supposedly each correct answer results in a $0.10 donation (from an anonymous supporter) to Planned Parenthood to defeat Thug candidates in Nov. I gave my name and email address and got all 5 questions right; a few seconds later I got another email saying $0.50 had been donated in my name – and to please share the quiz with my social network.

    So, here you go, folks:

    quiz page

    Hope that link works. If not, you can get there from first page of Women Are Watching

  114. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    cr:

    It is better. Even if they had the same positions on economics and classism and would do the same things about them (they don’t and wouldn’t), those aren’t the only issues for many people.

    [emphasis mine]
    Thank you.
    As a gay man, there are a few other things that concern me. Yes, I’m concerned about the economy (has trickle down economics *ever* worked; what good does it do to create jobs in another country when Americans are out of work) and I’m worried about classism (fuck the poor isn’t a good policy no matter what political party you belong to). I’m also worried that one of the GOP’s central positions denies me and every other queer the right to get married (and by extension, have children). I’m worried that one of the GOP’s central positions is a denial of global warming; which is something that affects the next generation, despite Romney’s silent assertion that it doesn’t. I’m also worried that one of the GOP’s central positions is denying women the right to access contraception or have the freedom to decide what to do with their bodies.
    ****
    Again, the focus of my comments has been on the Republicans because the RNC was tonight.
    I intend to also watch the DNC so that I can be as fair and balanced as possible.
    That said, President Obama *did* come out in support of gay marriage (yes, it hasn’t amounted to much, but simply *saying* that is more progressive than the GOP position).

  115. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    FYI Muse, the picture of Little One’s drawing for you have been sent. It’s not great quality, the picture was taken on a friend’s camera phone.

  116. says

    In all seriousness I have a thought. given that people like the Koch’s have more money than they could possibly need…why do they work so hard to get what is a relative pittance more? Im starting to suspect there’s just some psuedosexual thrill at depriving others now.

  117. ibyea says

    @Ing
    The money is pretty much them measuring their penis size. If having $1,000,000,000 means having more money than the guy who has $999,999,999, they will take it by whatever means possible. Because it will mean they have a bigger penis size than the other guy.

  118. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    kristinc:
    Ummm, torches?
    Please.
    That’s old school.
    I’ve got a flamethrower baybeeeeeeeeeee!

  119. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    ibyea:
    if penis size is determined by how much money one has, I’m in deeeeeeeeeeeeep trouble.
    Hold on, let me check…

  120. says

    In all seriousness I have a thought. given that people like the Koch’s have more money than they could possibly need…why do they work so hard to get what is a relative pittance more?

    If you’re not making more money than the other guy, how do you know you’re winning?

  121. says

    francelinoazevedo:

    What are the best articles about Mother Teresa? The girl I’ve been dating has a completely wrong idea about her, and I want to change her mind.

    You can start here. I recommend The Missionary Position: Mother Teresa in Theory and Practice by Christopher Hitchens.

  122. consciousness razor says

    If having $1,000,000,000 means having more money than the guy who has $999,999,999, they will take it by whatever means possible.

    Those are only kind of numbers they have, compared to the vast majority of people. Money is power in our society, and they want to keep it that way. So what can you do with a fuckton of money? Buy a fuckton of politicians, put a fuckton of ads everywhere, create bogus think-tanks with a fuckton of shitty apologists for your agenda, etc. And you do that because — whatever you do, for better or worse — you’re not happy unless you make a huge fucking dent in the world.

  123. rowanvt says

    I have a cranky.

    For fun, I draw dragons. I love dragons and I love drawing them and sometimes I allow individuals to use the drawings as tattoos with the stipulation that they are to tell the artist that the design is used with special permission and is not for the mass market.

    It’s something of an honor system.

    So today I get a comment on the DA page of my best drawing saying:

    i totally jacked your dragon. it was in my stacks of printed off art, and i didn’t remember where it came from. i used it as a tattoo cover up. this one one of the nicest baby dragon pieces i have seen.

    At the end, there was a link to a facebook photo.

    The person who posted that comment… runs a tattoo parlor. I am now officially in ‘pissed off amateur artist’ mode mentally, though I’m being somewhat cautious/calm in my responses to him… namely asking if he used this as a coverup on himself…. or offered it to a client.

    But yeah, SUPER CRANKY BLAERGHLE! This is not what I needed with this month + being at work an hour after closing as we attempted to remove a urinary catheter from a blocked dog… and the catheter got stuck on a stone that was itself stuck at the base of the os penis. So yeah. Hour of overtime for “plastic stuck in dog penis” and then “by the way, totally stole your art and made money off of it.”

  124. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ broboxley OT #30

    startdust is sugar!

    That’s for Her Divine Holiness Phoenicia (PBUH).

    (High Priest Josh could have told you this years ago!)

    @ Caine

    as soon as the boys are awake and out and about again.

    Wait. Teh boy and girl ratties work different shifts? (Makes sense in a way – seeing the horde never sleeps.)

    Maxxy sends her virtual brother, Theo, a lick on the snout. (I suggest substituting for skritches instead.)

    @ Tony

    Where are all the black people in the audience?

    Hell, I really noticed that as well. I did see one. The camera zoomed in on her. Yup, they sure got to tick that box. Their “token black” makes their bile all right I guess.

    *cringe*

  125. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    Oh. Awesome. He’s got the photo also posted on his website.

    o.O Oh shit that sucks!

    I’m not much help but with the artists and lawyers here hopefully someone can help you out.

  126. says

    Good morning
    So, somebody went to kindergarten in her undies and a warm coat today (and her clothes in a bag. We’re not monsters.) And since Mr. is home cause he has training today and tomorrow nearby I didn’t have to deal with it.
    I’m sorry for her, I understand that this is her way of telling us that there’s something fucking wrong and she doesn’t agree but we can’t help her there. And I’m sorry that I can’t be the fully focussed mum she needs to have at the moment either.
    *sigh*

    Caine
    Give Gytha kisses.

    +++
    RNC
    German media are fucked up not giving any actual information. No word about the war on women and just talking about “tax cuts”.

    rovant
    Sorry. People suck.

    +++
    I need a nap now. I’m just so fucking exhausted from all this bullshit in my life right now.

  127. birgerjohansson says

    Improbable Joe

    “and then she falls over like she’s been turned to stone.”

    If your cat has balance problems you should let the vet take blood samples to check the liver function.
    I know you have a poor economic situation,
    can I reach you via Paypal?
    also, you can email me at

    Dimetrodon61 “circle-a” yahoo.se

    Give me a heads-up before you use that address, I am not checking it often, (I am letting itslide because of spam)

  128. Louis says

    Ibyea, #176,

    HOLY SHIT I’M RICH!

    Oh no, wait….I’m poor, that was my leg. Bugger.

    Louis

  129. says

    Ahhh!!! *excited Kitty runs around in circles flailing*

    I am almost finished the first draft of my book!!!

    I am at the last freakin’ part of the last chapter before the epilogue!!!

    Then it’s edits, endless edits!!!

    I don’t even care, edits are exciting to me cause it means I will be finished with the book I’ve been trying to write for my entire freakin’ life pretty much!!!

    Yay!!!!! (Five exclamation marks? This person is clearly mad)

  130. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    hia all.

    Ibyea:

    FPTP means first past the post. Basically, it’s where representatives are broken into district, and the candidate with the pluralty wins.

    This means that distributed and minor voting blocs cannot get representation as they would with a proportional system.

    Again, increasing the number of reps (removing the 1917 cap of 435) to something like 800-1000, or possibly more?

  131. says

    Ahhh!!! *excited Kitty runs around in circles flailing*

    I am almost finished the first draft of my book!!!

    I am at the last freakin’ part of the last chapter before the epilogue!!!

    *gets prominent place in bookshelf ready for signed copy of it*

    ++++
    *sees Audley*
    *grins*

  132. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    but I really didn’t realize how tough it is to have 10-15 pounds of fetus/fluid/assorted other crap right on top of my bladder. Not fun, dude.

    Yeah, that doesn’t sound fun either.

  133. says

    Oh, Louis and your interminable penis jokes…

    (They’re pretty hilarious actually, even when they’re pretty much expected. And actually, very well done to the A+scribes for transcribing the recent Google hangouts… Louis’ ribald humour came across even in the impromptu circumstances of a webchat.)

    Congrats Katherine!

  134. Louis says

    Hey there is an end to my penis jokes…

    …wait, is THAT a penis joke? Oh I’m so confused.

    And I’ll take this opportunity to add my congrats to Katherine Lorraine. I has an impressed. When you’re a big name famous author type person, spare us little people a thought and acknowledge us in your soon to be published partial autobiography: Shit I Did On The Interwebs. ;-)

    Louis

  135. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Tropical update:

    Hurricane Kirk has likely reached peak intensity at about 0800 UTC earlier today. It could likely have been a major hurricane then, but that was not recorded officially. Since that time, its structure seems to have collapsed, with its eye no longer visible. Given it has little time over warm water left, it might quickly or slowly weaken.

    TS Leslie is also picking up strength; its CDO has quite cold cloud tops, and it could soon become a hurricane, or even a major hurricane. This storm should not threaten land in the next five days.

    Remnants of Issac are still producing rain, centered near Fort Smith, Arkansas. It should continue heading north, and later on to the east.

  136. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Happy Wednesday to all!

    I read

    your soon to be published partial autobiography: Shit I Did On The Interwebs.

    as “Did I Shit On The Interwebs“.

    Yes, I am that tiered.

  137. John Morales says

    thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia: you do realise you’re being verbose?

    (Both ‘may be’ and ‘may not be’ mean exactly the same as ‘may or may not be’)

  138. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Gilliel

    German media are fucked up not giving any actual information. No word about the war on women and just talking about “tax cuts”.

    A kind of reverse target fixation. The complete insanity the Rethuglicans espouse (bomb Iran? “family and faith based government…WTF?) is so fucking ridiculous, that sane people simply skip over it as if they have misheard. Their minds simply reject the idea that people can be quite so Reality Averse ™.

    @ Kitty

    Yay!!!!!

    Yay!!!!!!!!!!

    (twice as many exclamation marks indicate how in awe I am of your tenacity and dedication. Are you going to print or online? … I also want a signed copy.)

    @ ‘Tis (or other economy watchers)

    CNN comments about the incredible amount of money that is currently being pumped into the economy (in the US, but obviously also elsewhere). My question… where the fuck is that money going? It is not circulating is it? Stalling somewhere… in wealthy accounts. Poor people would be spending it and keeping the love flowing. Mmmmmmm… :/

    Of course the rich fucks love what is happening. Money will one day become more and more expensive. They must be licking their chops for the profits to come. (AFAIUI: In the US, the government is artificially lowering rates. The piper will be paid one day – a’la Spain, Italy etc)

  139. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Kat is far too classy to shit on the interwebs. The rest of us, however… . ;)

    As I said, that is just how I read it. I got almost no sleep last night. I think I am obsessing over the girl’s name. I keep feeling like I am insulting her by not remembering. I know that I am not, I know that I am not at fault, but try telling that to the part of my brain that relishes depression, guilt and violence.

  140. blf says

    I really didn’t realize how tough it is to have 10-15 pounds of fetus/fluid/assorted other crap right on top of my bladder. Not fun, dude.

    The mildly deranged penguin points out the solution is get the male to sit on the egg for months in the freezing cold whilst you fly off to the tropics and have fun. You don’t even have to bother with arranging for the daft fool to be fed.

  141. says

    @theophontes:

    My initial will likely be online (probably Amazon’s e-book market.) Assuming that the contract for said market will allow me to publish a hard copy of the book, I’ll do that when I’m able to point at my sales and tell a publisher “I have sold X copies on Amazon” when they ask if I can make them money.

    It’ll all depend, of course, on whether I’m allowed to publish hard copies if I start to publish on the e-book market. I still have to do a lot of research into it, but that’s fairly far into the future cause I have to edit what I currently have.

    And if people want a signed “copy” of my e-book then… just send me your address and I’ll sign a postcard for you XD

  142. Ogvorbis: broken says

    I really didn’t realize how tough it is to have 10-15 pounds of fetus/fluid/assorted other crap right on top of my bladder.

    After two pregnancies, Wife knew the location of every rest area and easy-access bathroom between Cape Cod, Western Maryland, and Northeast Pennsylvania (even when she was pregnant, we still visited relatives). She also kept a couple of the large McDonald’s or BK or Wendy’s cups in the car — very good vomit ‘bags’. Her morning sickness was 24/7 for about six months. With anti-nausea medications.

  143. Ogvorbis: broken says

    (Just to toment the Deragned Penguin, I annonce: For lunch today, I have some stone ground whole wheat crackers and some Havarti with dill, some earthy brie, some double cream brie, and some herbed buffalo mozzarella)

  144. says

    Oggie:
    *hugs* and ♥

    Thankfully, my morning sickness only lasted until my fourth month or so, although it was all-day-long sickness as opposed to morning sickness. Every once in a while, I still find myself dry-heaving in the shower, but it’s definitely not consistent and it passes quickly.

    Because of work, I already know where every rest stop/clean public bathroom is in upstate New York (along with every Dunkin Donuts, Tim Horton’s, and Stewart’s). :)

    Blf:
    You have no idea how badly I wish that humans laid eggs.

  145. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    *puts in ear plugs due to the Pullet Patrol running around screaming ala Kitty*

    *lays out assortment of grog, swill, popcornz, and bacon sammiches to celebrate*

  146. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    My impression of the RNC

    Total unmitigated disaster.

    We know the die-hards will disagree but hopefully that shit show will dissuade some moderates and undecideds.

  147. says

    Two questions:
    1) Why am I getting emails from Al Franken? I don’t even get emails from my own damned senators!
    2) Why does Sen. Franken’s latest email have the subject “Franni’s secret brownie recipe”? (I haven’t read the email. I guarantee that my brownies are better.)

  148. dianne says

    Ah, morning sickness. A major reason I have one child, not two or three children. Mine went for 9 months. I didn’t vomit much, but was constantly nauseated. And food was extraordinarily unappealing. Any food with a strong smell was absolutely out-I couldn’t even be in the building with it. I ended up loosing weight during the pregnancy. Unintentionally.

    But remember, pregnancy is perfectly safe and the supposed risks of pregnancy are just an excuse for getting an abortion. So declares the GOP and we all know they wouldn’t lie or distort.

  149. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Kitty

    And if people want a signed “copy” of my e-book then… just send me your address and I’ll sign a postcard for you XD

    theophontes[at]hotmail[dot]com . (When you are ready to post.)

    @ Ogvorbis

    [cheeses]

    A specialist Dutch cheese shop has recently opened in my neighbourhood. I’ve been snacking on some delicious goat’s milk and i>jonge Gouda this evening. Omnomnomnomnomnom…

  150. blf says

    Cheese? Sniff. Sniff, sniff, SNIFF! Cheeses!
    The mildly deranged penguin knows where you live your cheeseboards are.

    You. Have. Been. Warned.

  151. Nutmeg says

    Katherine:

    I am almost finished the first draft of my book!!!

    Yay! *confetti* *sparklers* *cake*

  152. says

    Dianne:
    Ick. 9 months of morning sickness sounds HORRIBLE!

    The only think I can’t stand at the moment is saltiness. It’s getting to the point where I can’t handle store bought breads, but on the flip side, it’s too hot to bake my own bread. So, I’ve been making wrap sammiches in tortillas and that seems to be working pretty well.

    Didn’t you hear? Pregnancy is a joy! It’s a special time that’s full of rainbows and Skittles, not a dangerous, stressful period like those feminazis would have you believe. They have to lie about about the risks to meet their monthly abortion quotas, don’tcha know.

  153. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ blf

    The mildly deranged penguin knows where [you live] your cheeseboards are.

    {theophontes stuffs two VERY large wheels of cheese into its maw .}

    Mwahahahahahahahahah…

  154. says

    Awwww… I missed the thing about the billionaires last night. I can explain it in one word: hoarders. Watch the show, and you’ll see the trauma, anger, and immature smirking pettiness of hoarders, and the only difference between them and the Kock brothers or Mitt Romney is that rich people have a crew that can clean every day, rather than needing a crew to work for three straight days one time.

  155. says

    Honestly, if DarkFetus ends up with any interest in baking, she’s going to want to kill me. Yeah, with more complex recipes I’ve got that shit written down, but basic stuff like brownies and sugar cookies and whatever? Pffft, either I eyeball it, or I double check with the internets and fiddle around with whatever recipe I find. Whoops.

  156. blf says

    if DarkFetus ends up with any interest in baking, she’s going to want to kill me.

    Another reason to feast on babies — get ‘em before that get you… ;-)

  157. opposablethumbs says

    Talking of morning sickness … something I’ve (very) idly wondered from time to time is – does it have anything to do with the body’s reaction to Foreign Invasion (given that the foetus shares only half its makeup with the mother)? I seem to remember hearing it tends to be worst the first time and decreases with any subsequent pregnancies – is there anything to that, or am I making shit up?
    The thing is, I never had any sickness at all – and I (very) idly wondered if this might have anything to do with the fact that my first Spawn was my third pregnancy (two IUD failures at an earlier age, and I’m another one for the “fuck yeah! What a relief!” reaction to abortion. Yay for decent access to abortion without much waiting around and no streeetching the time out to make it more difficult). All by the same bloke, so did I build up a resistance to him or something? :-)

  158. opposablethumbs says

    I am almost finished the first draft of my book!!!

    OOOOOOHHH!!!! Kitty that’s fantastic – huge, HUGE congratulations. I am so in awe of your focus and drive. (and I should probably read before I post, shouldn’t I!).

  159. says

    Talking of morning sickness … something I’ve (very) idly wondered from time to time is – does it have anything to do with the body’s reaction to Foreign Invasion (given that the foetus shares only half its makeup with the mother)?

    Morning sickness is caused by the body adjusting to the pregnancy hormone levels. Which is why after 14-16 weeks things usually get better. If it was a reaction to foreign invasion, we wouldn’t have many babies born.

  160. opposablethumbs says

    Eh, if it only makes the mother ill but doesn’t stop the pregnancy it wouldn’t affect birth rates though, would it?

  161. opposablethumbs says

    Oh, rorschach – is there any truth to the “sickness decreases with subsequent pregnancies” thing? Wouldn’t surprise me if I were wrong, I seem to have forgotten most of what little I ever learned about it!

  162. says

    Oh, Louis and your interminable penis jokes…

    I cringed.

    Wolf Blitzer just said Romney did a good job with his speech.

    I saw that and cringed again. He came across as a Mitt fanboy. At least Piers Morgan behaved like some carefree drunk hooligan during his interviews from the RNC, he was actually quite funny to watch.

  163. says

    Eh, if it only makes the mother ill but doesn’t stop the pregnancy it wouldn’t affect birth rates though, would it?

    Doesn’t work like that. If your body identifies something as “foreign”, an immune response is raised and that which is “foreign” will be attacked. The classic case is the antibodies that may form after feto-maternal blood transmission in certain blood group constellations, and that may lead to a mother’s body attacking subsequent pregnancies.

  164. dianne says

    The placenta does something or another that prevents an immune reaction to the fetus. That’s presumably why Rh antibodies form only after the first pregnancy-the maternal exposure occurs at or around birth. As far as I know, no one knows precisely how this works. (Rorschah, keenacat, usw, got any more information?) Occasionally pre-eclampsia is posited to be some immunologic problem, but that’s unproven, to say the least. As far as frequency of morning sickness in subsequent pregnancies, up to date does not identify first pregnancy as a risk factor and that’s about all I can reliably say.

  165. says

    Theophontes:

    Wait. Teh boy and girl ratties work different shifts?

    No, they don’t. The boys tend to nap after a meal, whereas the girls tend to play and run after a meal.

    Giliell:

    Give Gytha kisses.

    I shall do so, happily.

  166. says

    Rowan:

    Any advice on what to do with Mr. Jacked-your-shit?

    Sue or let it go. Whatever you decide, spread the word all over the ‘net though – make sure everyone knows the asshat steals other people’s work.

  167. chigau (違う) says

    Setár

    Derailing for Dummies is down. Bandwidth limit exceeded.

    That is funny.
    Or sad.

  168. opposablethumbs says

    The classic case is the antibodies that may form after feto-maternal blood transmission in certain blood group constellations, and that may lead to a mother’s body attacking subsequent pregnancies.

    This was me getting something considerably-less-than-half-remembered completely back-asswards, then. Thanks for the clarification.

    does not identify first pregnancy as a risk factor

    Guess I was getting my “you know, they say that …” tales from the wrong “they” . Thank you dianne!

  169. says

    As far as frequency of morning sickness in subsequent pregnancies, up to date does not identify first pregnancy as a risk factor

    Can’t look up uptodate from home, but anecdotal evidence over 15 years seems to suggest that there are as many “first pregnancy was a walk in the park” instances as there are “first one was the worst and then it got better” ones.

  170. says

    Also, for anyone interested, I have the full transcript of the Darrow-Bryan examination during the Scopes trial up now, here.

    Praise the lord for voice dictation software! I downloaded(it’s Apple, so we’re talking “purchased”)Mountain Lion the other day to test it’s inbuilt dictation function, but what a crap that is, you can’t record anything over 30 seconds without pressing the function key again, and anything you say gets sent to Apple’s servers, including the list of your contacts. No, thank you. So I got one of the leading dictation apps today, and that worked really well.

  171. says

    [pointless rant]
    So, my mum asked me out of the blue if #1 could stay with her. Ehm, of course not. From that moment I was ignored. No good-bye for me. But when I say that I was given the silent treatment as a kid, I’m making it up [/pointless rant]

    rowan
    I love your dragons. they have their very own style

  172. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    @improbable Joe: please do not make such judgements on people with a mental problem.

    Which judgments does this refer to?

  173. says

    Crossposted due to ego

    Side note: I had an idea for a blog project to be a counterpart to A+. Where A+ is positive and active A-would be self reflective and be a constructive critic. Idea is to devote a blog by positive good atheists to look at the atheist culture and movement and offer strong critique. Not what arguements do or don’t work but on whether were being shits or being blind to privledged or acting just like dogmatic sheep. Thoughts?

  174. broboxley OT says

    this weekend in the atlanta area
    2 college football games
    2 pro baseball games
    black gay pride celebration
    dragoncon

    reminds self to stay the fuck out of atlanta, the traffic will be insane even more than useal

  175. says

    More good news on the voting front: An Ohio judge has restored early weekend voting for all Ohioans!
    http://wonkette.com/482911/judge-restores-early-voting-to-all-ohioans-because-he-hates-the-troops#more-482911

    IT IS FURTHER ORDERED that in-person early voting IS RESTORED on the three days immediately preceding Election Day for all eligible Ohio voters. And specifically, for the purposes of the 2012 General Election, this Order restores in-person early voting to all eligible Ohio voters on Saturday, November 3, 2012; Sunday, November 4, 2012; and Monday, November 5, 2012. This Court anticipates that Defendant Secretary of State will direct all Ohio elections boards to maintain a specific, consistent schedule on those three days, in keeping with his earlier directive that only by doing so can he ensure that Ohio’s election process is “uniform, accessible for all, fair, and secure.”

    Anyway, I love Wonkette’s take on Romney:

    … the only things that come out of Mitt Romney’s mouth are nouns, verbs, and lies about the nouns and verbs he just used.

  176. says

    Moments of Mormon Madness may get a caffeine boost.
    Link.

    On Wednesday, the LDS Church posted a statement on its website saying that “the church does not prohibit the use of caffeine” and that the faith’s health-code reference to “hot drinks” “does not go beyond [tea and coffee].”

    A day later, the website wording was slightly softened, saying only that “the church revelation spelling out health practices … does not mention the use of caffeine….

    Even LDS presidential nominee Mitt Romney has been seen drinking an occasional Diet Coke, and Mormon missionaries in France routinely imbibe caffeinated colas — without embarrassment or consequences.

    This week’s clarification on caffeine “is long overdue,” said Matthew Jorgensen, a Mormon and longtime Mountain Dew drinker…

    Part of the confusion stems from LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, which neither sells nor serves caffeinated drinks….

  177. says

    I’m going to deep fry… everything. Chicken thighs, hearts, gizzards, skirt steak, smoked sausage, cabbage, onions, ramen, pancake batter, steamed rice, eggs, potatoes, canned corn, peas and carrots, biscuit mix, and dried soup mix if I can figure out how.

  178. Ogvorbis: broken says

    So caffeine is okay now? Wow. I grew up with some Mormons. My cub scout leader and rapist was a Mormon — a high up, one, too. Caffeine was an absolute no no. Never. Couldn’t be done. Ever.

    So now they have a chance to elect a Mormon as President of the US and he drinks caffeine so, all of a sudden caffeine is okay? Anything to elect the rich white guy.

    So if Mitt loses, does caffeine go back on the bad list?

  179. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Last night, I had to make a drive up teo the store. On the way there, I got screamed at. Twice.

    First time was as I pulled away from a stoplight. To maximize fuel mileage, I accelerate moderately. Some damn kids in a Honda Civic with Blattatatatatatttt! exhaust almost rear ended me. Then they swung out around me in a no-passing zone and, as they whizzed by, told me, “Fucking old man! Use the fucking gas pedal!”

    Then, as I drove through the lot at Wegmans, obeying the rules and not cutting across the parking spaces, a little old lady (seriously, she looked to be about 150 years old) in a (no, I am not kidding) Chrysler Lebaron, almost t-boned me as she drove through the parking lot at right angles to the obeying-the-rules-in-a-parking-lot flow of traffic. She leaned out the window and said, “You goddamn kids need to learn how to drive!”

    So. In one trip, I’m and old man and a kid. I guess I really am middle aged.

  180. Louis says

    Audley,

    Don’t you celebrate Poets Day in the USA?

    Louis

    P.S. Every Friday is Poets Day. Piss Off Early Tomorrows Saturday. ;-)

  181. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Holy Fettucine, I am tired. Four 20-ounce bottles of diet cola and I still feel sleepy. Lucky I have cruise control for the drive home.

    Wife and I, along with Boy, Girl, and FutureSiL, are going to the local high school football game. Cheap night out for us all.

  182. says

    Guys! Guys! GUYS!

    So, in my regular perusing of the random cute-and-cuddly corners of the internet during the tedious downtime at my job, I stumbled across the most adorably squid-oriented thing I have seen in a long, long time.

    And so, I show it to Dana, and after appropriate amounts of squees, she suggests that I share it.

    And so, I present you with My Little Squiddies:
    http://cheezburger.com/6550063360

    Bask. Bask, my friends.

    (http://links.laughingsquid.com/post/30461072355/my-little-cephalopod-a-series-of-my-little-pony <– source)

  183. Amblebury says

    Louis can’t help having an interminable penis. Joking about it is a coping mechanism. Have a heart.

  184. cicely says

    Kitty, congrats on the book wrap-up-in-progress.
    *imagines joining the dance; knees wail in protest*

    Joe…I don’t think that deep frying will cure what ails those peas. Best save the oil for cheese sticks.

    And so, I present you with My Little Squiddies:

    :Tentacles Is Magic

    Must go utterly destroy the Egyptian Civilisation. ‘Cause they’re hogging alla the coal, and I needs it!

    No coals, no choo choos.
    -

  185. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Wow.

    I looked up today. I saw several halos.

    Specifically, there was a 22 degree halo with a strong brightening (and possible tendrils) where an upper tangent arc would be. And sundogs flanked the sides of the halo.

    Then, when the sun lowered, there was a strikingly beautiful circumzenithal arc. That was my favorite.

    I never know such beautiful displays were possible here; now I know I just have to look up.

  186. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    My boss took the department out for lunch at Chili’s to celebrate completing a project. Since I would eat a full lunch, I planned on skipping dinner (not trying to lose more weight, just trying not to gain it back), leaving the problem of what to feed the Redhead. Saw the new grilled shrimp tacos on the menu, and talked the Redhead into having me get them after work as take-out for her dinner. Boy did they disappear in a hurry. And they worked well one-handed.

  187. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Curiosity isn’t the only rover active on Mars. From the JPL website:

    On Sol 3056 (Aug. 28, 2012), Opportunity headed almost due west in a direct approach to some exciting outcrop units. With that drive, the rover passed 35 kilometers of odometry. Not bad for a vehicle designed for only about 1 mile (1 kilometer) of distance and 90 sols (days) of lifetime.

    Over engineering can be good…

  188. says

    Dropping back in partly threadrupt. Hey, is anyone here using fitocracy? I’m trying to use it for my rehab. (Find me as Cajela.)

    Improbable Joe, how are you and bossnurse getting on?? Is there any hope about the job?

    Oggy, *hugs*, and no, it was not your fault! I do think that you are quite right to feel bad about what you did to that other child, and you probably need to acknowledge and process that. But you should not need to feel *guilty*. The whole situation was not your fault. You were a child and you were set up. It is totally reasonable to feel sorrow, regret, rage at the perpetrator (the adult, not the child!), empathy for the girl’s pain, maybe grief, disgust, anguish, sadness – all sorts of bad feelings make sense. Guilt does *not* make sense.

  189. says

    Alethea,

    We’re still in a holding pattern. Labor Day Weekend means everyone in charge this week was barely there and won’t be back until Tuesday. I swear to fuck, I can tolerate a lot of shit but if the car gets repossessed with 2 payments left I’m going to permanently lose my shit.

  190. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    kristinc:

    Oh shit, I gave myself a steam burn. It’s not blistering but I’m sure you all know how much they hurt. Any recs for topical pain management in the short term?

    I’ve only ever done the thing you’re *not* supposed to do: put butter on it. I believe that’s a folk remedy that may do some good, but there are risks involved.

    Cool the burned area with cool running water for several minutes. Don’t spray burns with high pressure, just let the water run over the burned area for as long as you can. Minor burns can be cooled with tap water over the sink. Don’t be afraid to rinse bigger burns with a hose outside.
    DO NOT APPLY BUTTER OR OIL TO ANY BURN! Butter or lard may feel cool because it comes out of the refrigerator, but the oils will trap heat and make the burn deeper over time.http://firstaid.about.com/od/injuriesathome/ht/06_burns.htm

    ****

    Many of you are a bit more politically informed (trying to work on that) than I am, so I’m wondering if anyone has checked out this site:
    http://pleasecutthecrap.typepad.com/main/what-has-obama-done-since-january-20-2009.html

  191. dianne says

    BTW, Joe and JAL, there should be something coming to you from me via Josh and the snails. If you don’t get it, we’ll meet at Josh’s with pitchforks and torches, find out that the problem is he never got the mail, reconvene at the post office, fill out 21,293 forms and certificates required to hold an angry mob at the post office, and finally find out that the problem is that I missent it, at which point I’ll slink away in disgrace.

  192. Pteryxx says

    random request of y’all with incredible memories… at some point recently I responded to a harassment minimizer by running a set of theoretical stats taking underreporting into account, and concluding something like 4% of all women attendees may have been harassed at TAM. And after all that work, now I can’t find my comment. Anyone know where that was?

  193. broboxley OT says

    tony #272

    He Fostered Greater Transparency and Better Government, After the Excesses of the Bush Years

    bwahahahaha good one.
    The guy has done a lot of good things but that isn’t one of them

  194. says

    dianne,

    Thanks a heap, it is appreciated. There’s got to be a light at the end of this tunnel, but in the meanwhile I appreciate all the candles you folks are sending my way.

    ****

    I just read a groovy book, The MVP by bestselling author and Surlyramics model Scott Sigler. Seriously, sat down and burned through all 500+ pages in less than 12 hours.

    … I’m also wearing a related T-shirt. I’m a ridiculous geek.

  195. hotshoe says

    For “dinner” I had a bag of microwaved popcorn (with about 2 tsps of extra butter melted and about 1/4 tsp extra salt sprinkled on) and a 22-ounce Red Hook ESB. That was pretty good. Now for dessert I’m having mint oreos with extra dark chocolate squares, one square per Oreo. I think I have room for one more. Then I’ll have to quit for the night.

    Catch y’all tomorrow.

  196. ibyea says

    @Tony
    And yet, Obama didn’t reform the system that will cause another financial disaster in the future. The economy is still being run by casino gamblers. While he did prevent a depression, it will only be a short term bandaid. A lot of things Obama did was either a bandaid to an ugly would that will eventually reopen or the same thing as Bush. When it comes to position, he NEVER goes all the way, nor does he make a case to the public, prefering to concede policies after policies to the Republicans. So, did he do more good than Bush? Definitely. And setting up US’s first universal health care system was a great achievement, despite not meeting expectations. But honestly, that is setting the bar low.

    Also, for every one of those points, I can point to other very bad things. For example, hiring corporate lackeys like Tim Gaitner to government position. Maintaining Bush’s tax cuts and Patriot act. He is also continuing the war on terror in his own way by bombing civilians with drone strikes in foreign countries.

  197. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Katherine: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There, I’ve used them all up, so you don’t have to. No, no, don’t thank me, it’s my pleasure. Seriously though, congratulations! I cannot imagine sticking with a project that large for that long. Very impressed. I’d also like to suggest that you make sure there’s a non-kindle means of selling the e-book. Some folks, well me at least, choose to not be tied to one provider and I’ll be all weepy-faced if I can’t read it.

    I swept the kitchen floor last night and there was still purple and pink sparkles in the pan. My daughter’s Magic Rainbow Fairy Party* was thirty-three days ago for fuck’s sake. The amount of glitter shed from the fairy costumes in those three hours was astounding.

    *I know, I know, but kinder-culture is what it is and every time I tell her that it’s okay to like something other than pink she rolls her eyes and says “Yessss, Dad. I know. How many times are you going to tell me that.”

  198. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Audley

    [alt-text:] “if the truth be told, I do the same … but then I’m ebil.”

    (Now my jig is up too.)

    @ Ogvorbis

    To maximize fuel mileage, I accelerate moderately.

    Sad to say, you are wrong there. Accelerate with more revs to give you peak torque. (The engine will be functioning optimally and be more fuel efficient.) Thereafter coast as much as you can and avoid braking/acceleration when you are under way.

  199. dianne says

    Re the economy: I despair of it ever getting better not just because rich people are assholes-though they are-but because they’re stupid. They may have theirs, but all they’ve got is a large piece of a small pie when they could be helping bake a bigger pie AND get a big piece of it. If they weren’t stupid cowards.

    I fear what we need is something like WWII: an event so scary that rich people get scared enough for their ugly butts that they’re willing to part with some of their money to avoid the danger. But where are we going to get that? There is no military threat that can reach the superrich and they’re too dumb to see the long term threats like global warming.

    So here’s my idea. Rich people, you’re going to die. Soon. Extremely soon on a geological time scale. After you die, at best you’ll be a bad joke. Most likely you’ll simply be forgotten as unimportant. The only way you can prevent this is by investing immediately and intensely, in medical research. Medical research MIGHT improve your chances of a slightly longer survival-a few more hundred years perhaps, nothing in geological time, but pretty long in biology. But only if you throw a lot of money at it. An all out war on death and aging Otherwise, forget it. You’re less than nothing alive-an active barrier to anything good happening in the world-and you’ll be nothing dead. Put up or, very soon, you’ll be permanently shut up.

    Why medical research, you ask? First, because it’s the only thing that could get through the inherent stupidity and selfishness of the very wealthy and appeal to their one emotion: fear. Second, medicine is expensive because it’s labor intensive. Even with automation. And what do high labor costs mean? Jobs. Third, duh, self interest. Both professionally and because I’m not crazy about dying in the next few years either.

  200. Rey Fox says

    Everybody wants to write a novel. I used to want to write one. I couldn’t even get started. So congrats on finishing, Kat! You rock.

  201. ibyea says

    @Rey
    I have stories ideas, but I feel too lazy to start writing. Was it the same way for you?

  202. Socio-gen, something something... says

    *stumbles in, bleary-eyed, and collapses on the fainting couch*

    What a week! I ended up dropping one of my classes today (and just before the drop/add period closed) because five demanding and high-output classes (three writing-intensives!) was a TERRIBLE idea.

    I completely burnt out after four days of just going over syllabi and doing a couple small assignments. Partly due to lack of sleep and worry over my niece*, I’m sure, but… if I’m this whooped now, I can’t imagine what’s going to happen when the end of term approaches and I have five major projects due.

    I also found out that I’m 1.5 semesters ahead of schedule, with only 7 classes remaining to complete both my degrees (after this semester) — which includes the class I just dropped. But, did the idea of early graduation thrill me? NO! I have a plan and a schedule and a very detailed roadmap to grad school (complete with multiple spreadsheets) and…I completely freaked out. I don’t like it when things don’t go in the order I’ve laid them out; panic and nausea ensued.

    And so, I added a minor in American Multicultural Studies (I only need 5 classes) just to graduate when I expected to graduate.

    * She is recovering quickly, physically, and doing as well as can be expected emotionally. But her sense of humor is already starting to peek out, so I think she’s going to be fine in the long run.
    — —

    General comment on the morning sickness discussion: for me, it was worst was with the first — and that’s taking into account that I was in severe (undiagnosed) Addison’s crisis in the first four months of my 2nd pregnancy.

    It was constant nausea and frequent vomiting, 24/7, for seven months. He actually got his name because I came home after yet another day of working/running to the bathroom at a beachside food shop and announced, “Whatever sex this kid is, its initials are going to be RC for ‘Rotten Child.'” We made up names (such as Rupertina Caravaggio) for weeks afterward and eventually put two traditional R & C names together.

    To this day, the smell of funnel cake makes me ill.

  203. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    To maximize fuel mileage, I accelerate moderately.

    …you mean people who pull away from green lights and accelerate at 1 mph/second AREN’T doing it just to annoy me? O.o

    Sad to say, you are wrong there. Accelerate with more revs to give you peak torque. (The engine will be functioning optimally and be more fuel efficient.) Thereafter coast as much as you can and avoid braking/acceleration when you are under way.

    Good to know. Makes mechanical sense. Needs to be promoted.

  204. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Thought of a good metaphor.

    If running the country was a school, Obama would be a C student, and Romney/Ryan would be the “trenchcoat mafia.”

  205. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ WMDKitty

    I’ve been working out for 60 days now!

    I’ve been working it out for 16,724 days now…

    (& I still don’t have a clue.)

    @ chigau

    I just got caught in a massive downpour and now look like a drowned rat.

  206. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Wow. Adam Lee over at Daylight Atheism discusses *why* social justice issues should be part of the atheist movement. This was a great response to all these people saying they don’t want their atheism mixed up in social justice or those saying atheism stops at not believing in a higher power.

    If we truly care about supporting reason and fighting the pernicious influence of fundamentalism, then we should recognize that religion serves to prop up political ideologies that harm real people across a broad range of issues: gay rights (too obvious), reproductive choice (single-celled embryos have souls!), sex discrimination and gender essentialism (God made men the breadwinners and women the homemakers), environmental protection (it’s OK to wreck the Earth if Jesus is coming back soon), international relations (prophecy says there will be war in the Middle East), economic equality (just think of how religion flourishes in poor, unequal countries and fades in secure, prosperous ones), and many more. By weakening religion’s influence in any of these areas, we weaken it in all of these areas, and that’s a goal that any politically engaged atheist ought to support.

    It just dawned on me that many in the ‘atheism and social justice shouldn’t mix’ crowd might not consider themselves part of the atheist movement. They consider themselves just atheists.

  207. chigau (違う) says

    theophontes

    I just got caught in a massive downpour and now look like a drowned rat.

    What did you look like before?

  208. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Tony

    just atheists

    There are the two types that recur here:

    The “dictionary atheists” who insist that there is no more to atheism than exactly what it says in the dictionary. These crop up from time to time on Pharyngula and really piss off the Squidly Ebil Oberlawd.

    The other type consists of the the libertarian misanthropes who are atheists only because they like the feeling of intellectual superiority it gives them to argue against godism. (I could direct you to such, but you do not really want to go there. Some pop up here from time to time just prior to getting ban-hammered.)

  209. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    theophontes:
    Many thanks.
    I knew about the ‘dictionary atheists’ (they seem to be the ones whining in many of the A+ threads*), but didn’t know about the other.
    Oh, and I’ll take your word for it on sites featuring the latter. I imagine it’s not pleasant to be in their pit.

    *Do these dictionary atheists not believe in, or support the atheist movement?

  210. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    theophontes:
    Just slick your hair back and you’ll instantly lose the scraggle.

  211. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Tony

    Do these dictionary atheists not believe in, or support the atheist movement?

    Worse. I suspect there is a big overlap of the two on the Venn diagram.

    There are also atheists who are very apathetic about doing anything from within atheism (non-toxic dictionary atheists). To me that is a bit of a cop-out. Adam Lee makes his points, but we should also note that a natural outcome of consequential atheism will be that we embrace social issues, science, scepticism, humanism … Reality based world views will tend to converge. The corollary of this is that people share ever more common ground and cause, leading to greater social cohesion and stability than disparate religiosity ever can.

    (The convergence you see in the religious right – particularly in the US -is also their finding common ground. And this also over reality based issues, like Authoritarianism, bigotry and running their earthly scams.)

  212. KG says

    It just dawned on me that many in the ‘atheism and social justice shouldn’t mix’ crowd might not consider themselves part of the atheist movement. They consider themselves just atheists. – Tony King of the Hellmouth

    I’m not convinced of that. If they don’t consider themselves to be part of the atheist movement, why would they care so greatly what happens within that movement? They might possibly feel that there being an atheist movement at all makes things difficult for people who are “just atheists”, I suppose, but then they would have as much complaint against those who do identify as part of the atheist movement but oppose A+.

  213. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    Hello everyone!

    Put me down as another person that wants to read Kat’s book. Congrats on all your hard work! That’s so awesome. I love authors because I love books but can’t write them. Much respect for doing so.


    We put in the order today for Little One’s books! We’re getting so many books for her. We’re all excited but Little One got bummed out that she wasn’t getting them today. Had to explain ordering them and having to wait. It was adorable. She was pouting because she couldn’t get her books right away. I’m so glad she loves reading so much. We read every day together and she sees me and Grandma read all the time. It was a nice change instead of having her pout over not getting a princess dress or barbie.

    *I know, I know, but kinder-culture is what it is and every time I tell her that it’s okay to like something other than pink she rolls her eyes and says “Yessss, Dad. I know. How many times are you going to tell me that.”

    Little One does the same thing to me. I can’t force her to wear shorts or pants unless it’s rainy or cold out, but we live in AZ so that never happens. She has plenty of pants and stuff but only wants to wear dresses because you can’t be a princess without a dress. I’ve tried so hard to explain this and nothing has worked. Goddamn it hurts to hear her talk like that. I never wear dresses and tried to explain it that way but really it’s so ingrained already. =(


    I also won more free books! Yay legitimate books and that new book smell. I love my Nook but damn does it feel good to hold books again. I don’t have book selves so we’re trying to build one out of something we have on hand. I need a book shelve again! Yay!


    In other new, my step dad is driving me up the fucking wall. Seriously drunken rambling on for hours and I can’t get him to shut up or leave. Tomorrow me and Roomie plan on having a chat with him about a lot of things. It’s just hard because of Roomie’s work schedule, the fact step dad is intoxicated a lot and I really don’t want to get into with him when he’s drunk/high or when I’m alone.

    I talked to my landlord about the drug dealer and his traffic next door. It did not go well. She said she couldn’t do shit since they pay rent on time. Like what? I’m sorry but if CPS comes here I’m going to get lectured (at least) about living in a crappy neighborhood but no one will do anything about it to change it. Well, call the cops next time you see shit. Yeah, did that tonight in fact. One of them was smoking meth beneath my window. I saw them and called the cops. They [neighbors and their clients] left by the time the cops came and not a damn thing happened. Instead, they bugged me about why don’t I have furniture and how come I let my child see a drug addict shoot up and why was she up so late and blah blah blah. She woke up at night because she was sick and coughing. She looked out the window to see if it was daytime. She thought she heard my mom’s dog barking. They people next door are dealing dope and I’m being questioned as a mother? *sigh*

  214. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Al Stefanelli has a roundup of last week’s GOP rape apologists. I knew about Akin and King. I did not know about Huckabee, Barnes, and Winder.
    He also talks about comments made by Kirk Cameron and Bryan Fischer.

    FFS, I just want to puke after reading about all 7 of them.

  215. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Katherine:
    Congratulations. Do you feel like the finish line is in sight?

    ****
    JAL:

    She has plenty of pants and stuff but only wants to wear dresses because you can’t be a princess without a dress. I’ve tried so hard to explain this and nothing has worked. Goddamn it hurts to hear her talk like that. I never wear dresses and tried to explain it that way but really it’s so ingrained already. =(

    Perhaps as she gets older, she’ll gain a deeper understanding of what you’re talking about. Oh, and how does she explain Ariel? The Little Mermaid was a princess without a dress.

    And the drug user/landlord situation…just damn. I’m puzzled about your landlord. She really thinks she can’t do anything? She thinks it’s not possible to walk over to that apartment and tell them they need to stop or there will be consequences?

  216. portia says

    JAL

    Yay for books! My nieces are bibliophiles and it makes me so happy.

    They people next door are dealing dope and I’m being questioned as a mother?

    *Boo hiss* That’s really terrible. I’m sorry no one will do anything. Is there an equivalent to a housing authority in your area? In there a habitability clause in your lease? Find a reason your landlord is obligated to fix it, if you can. I once told my neighbor “You don’t pay rent to do illegal drugs.” The landlord can at the very least talk to them!

    I’m sorry your stepdad is causing problems. I know how hard it can be to try to talk to someone in that perpetual state…

    Congrats Katherine!

    Anyone still up?

  217. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Tony

    (via linky) “Legitimate” rape.

    I notice Atkin fails to tell his fellow rethuglicans that GAWD his rocks off on “Legitimate” abortions.

    Link:

    About a quarter of pregnancies in the USA end in miscarriages. That is like a million real live persons/babies that are slaughtered in their mothers wombs by fucking misanthropic YHWH every year. That just in Xtian America! Holy Fuck, we’ll never hear about those from the reality deprived.

  218. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    There you go, free “get’s” :

    …GAWD gets His rocks off on “Legitimate” abortions

  219. says

    Good morning, or something like that. I feel a bit rested but I still look like I hadn’t slept in days. Actually I sleep like a stone, too exhausted for the mental carousel to even get into motion

    +++
    There’s something funny going on in this house. Well, not really. There are two cars with next state licence plates (next state is close), so they’re visitors here. One has a gay love bumpersticker, the other one has the “reality bites” where the legged fishy swallows the christian one.

    ++++
    JAL

    I’ve tried so hard to explain this and nothing has worked. Goddamn it hurts to hear her talk like that. I never wear dresses and tried to explain it that way but really it’s so ingrained already. =(

    Oh I know. It’s soooo exhausting, isn’t it. It drives me up the wall to see my bright daughter honestly thinking that being pretty was what matters most.
    During our holidays, the two of them played “speluncators who have their own subway in their caves”. Really cool. Shortly after that she drew a picture of a pretty woman. We asked her who that was and she said “it’s the speluncator’s wife”. Hmm, why can’t she be speluncator herself? “Because she’s pretty”.
    We’re trying to counter it from time to time, applying reason and logic and simply giving her counter examples (Mr. stocked up on colourful T-shirts)
    I’m sorry about the shit with the landlord and the cops. Assholes all around.
    I hope the talk with your stepdad goes well. I know how hard those talks are :(

    +++
    I think the “just atheists” are angry because now they’re standing exposed. They have to admit that they’re either against social justice, especially for women, or simply don’t care. It’s like the smelly guy getting angry at people moving away from him so now everybody knows that it’s him who stinks.

  220. portia says

    Socio-gen, I’m glad you are optimistic about your niece’s emotional/psychological well-being, and I’m glad she’s recovering physically.

  221. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    portia:
    I’m still up.
    Someone has to fast and pray 24/7 for you godless heathens :)
    ****
    theophontes:
    Yeah, that’s so fucked up too. I wonder how they would attempt to address miscarriage…
    “Miscarriages, while tragic, are a part of the natural world, which follows the laws set forth from God. As such, they are neither right, nor wrong. They’re a necessary outcome of the world God has created. However, abortion is decided by a human being. Since the human has free will, God cannot intervene, despite abortion being an abomination in his eyes.”*

    How close am I?

    *I really think they would use the terms *human* or * human being* rather than woman. Anything to make women feel invisible.

  222. portia says

    Tony, pray harder. I’m still not planning on going to church/synagogue/mosque/seance this weekend.

    I think you’re pretty close with that guess. So good I thought you were quoting a godbot. You are like the Jane Goodall of Xians.

  223. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    I’m puzzled about your landlord. She really thinks she can’t do anything? She thinks it’s not possible to walk over to that apartment and tell them they need to stop or there will be consequences?

    Honestly, I think it’s more that they pay rent. She doesn’t give a shit about anything else. With people leaving and not paying her only concern is getting as much money as she can. Not like the fix any fucking thing around here but her and her boss just want people to pay rent. That’s it. Who gives a shit one is a mentally ill rapist or drug dealers? Hell, she might be getting money to look the other way for all I know. Her precious grandkids live here but they are babies. I’m sure if her grandkids saw something or picked something up she would do something. Or not, I dunno. She doesn’t care. She tells all of us she wants to leave. She says “I’d get a different job if sI could but can’t due to the economy (Obama grumble). I’m too old and sick for this, I would retire if I could, (Obama grumble)”

    Oh, and how does she explain Ariel? The Little Mermaid was a princess without a dress.

    Funny thing is, Ariel is her favorite. I’ve said she doesn’t have a dress when she’s princess of the sea.
    Little One dead pans “But to be princess on land she has one. She always wears one on land.”
    I say “But her daughter Melody is a princess and she doesn’t wear dresses. She wears pants and plays in the sand and becomes a mermaid.”
    Little One,”But her mommy is queen and wears dresses. She’s princess by birth. I’m not so I have to wear a dress. I’m on land mommy, mermaids aren’t even real.”
    Well, shit.

  224. portia says

    Wow, she really makes a lot of sense. Which is impressive, because she refined a lot of nonsense to get to it. Has she seen Mulan? (which I have problems with, because she has to reject femininity altogether to have value as a person, etc, etc but still might be a good countermeasure).

  225. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    portia:

    Tony, pray harder. I’m still not planning on going to church/synagogue/mosque/seance this weekend.

    But we’re running a special this weekend:
    Buy 2 tarot card readings and get a third free.
    We can help find your soulmate, the other half of you that God created at birth. You can be whole once more. Just attend our wonderfully informative reading, where you can learn all the details of the one true love waiting for you. You’ll no longer be missing that tiny sliver of your soul. You’ll be complete. Just come, pray with us.
    (only 6 small payments of 49.95; sessions must occur every 6 days at the 6th hour past noon; for safety purposes we only accept cash; pay all at once and you’ll pay only $295, and you’ll get a free T shirt [you must pay for shipping and handling])

  226. portia says

    Tony – where do I send my credit card information. Do you need my SSN as well? Here, take it anyway.

  227. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    JAL:
    You’ve got an awesome daughter there.
    ****
    For that matter, for all those with children, so many of the stories you share about them help paint a brighter picture for tomorrow.

  228. says

    Wow, she really makes a lot of sense. Which is impressive, because she refined a lot of nonsense to get to it. Has she seen Mulan? (which I have problems with, because she has to reject femininity altogether to have value as a person, etc, etc but still might be a good countermeasure).

    I think it gets better with Mulan 2, where she can be a warrior AND a woman and a lover.
    Personally I prefer Fiona, although the main character is male, again.
    When she gets older I will give #1 Jim C. Hines’ Princess novels. Sadly they are very adult material, I wished that there was some spin like that on children’s versions of fairy tales.
    And there’s always Tiffany Aching.

  229. portia says

    Huh, I didn’t know there was a Mulan 2. I agree that Fiona is a good character, but yeah, it’s not called “Fiona.” Has anyone seen Brave? I haven’t yet.

  230. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Just came across This article on the sexual objectification of women :

    The cognitive process behind our perception of objects is the same that we use when looking at women, and both genders are guilty of taking in the parts instead of the whole. When we look at men, we use global processing to see them more fully as people.

  231. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    Wow, she really makes a lot of sense. Which is impressive, because she refined a lot of nonsense to get to it. Has she seen Mulan? (which I have problems with, because she has to reject femininity altogether to have value as a person, etc, etc but still might be a good countermeasure).

    I know right? I’ve explained before mermaids not being real and how there was real kings and queens and how royalty is all by birth. That sure came back to bite me.

    We have Mulan on dvd. I actually like it a lot. I’m okay with how much she rejects femininity just because of the pink saturation of everything for girls. But nope she argues Mulan isn’t a princess, since her mom isn’t a queen so she doesn’t count. She’s a soldier.
    But isn’t she so awesome! She’s a soldier and smart and saves the day!
    Little One “Yeah, I like her too mom but she wears a dress when she’s a girl. She doesn’t like being a girl so she wears pants to pretend to be a boy.”
    “Honey, she doesn’t like how people make her dress up and wear make up when she wants to do other thing. They make her do that because they think girls can only do those things. She’d prefer to be a samurai and have everyone know she’s a girl. She only pretends because they discriminated against her as a woman.”
    Little One “I know mommy and I know that isn’t right. You told me. But there are girl soldiers now. I don’t want to be one. I want to be a princess and be pretty.”
    =(
    We’ve gone through conversations like these a lot. It hurts every time. I can’t seem to find a good example. She likes Pocahontas but we’ve explained how that’s not what really happened when the pilgrims came and there aren’t any Indian princess. So that’s out. There’s Jasmine from Aladin. Another movie I love and have on dvd for her. She’s has a pet tiger and wants be more than a pretty face. There’s even a song where Jasmine talks about being more than a just a pretty face! No go.
    Little One “But that’s her choice mommy. She was born a princess and doesn’t want to be one and get married to be queen. I wasn’t born a princess but want to be one. Why can’t I be one? Why won’t you let me be a princess? I want to be a princess!”
    *sob*

  232. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    I think it gets better with Mulan 2, where she can be a warrior AND a woman and a lover.
    Personally I prefer Fiona, although the main character is male, again.
    When she gets older I will give #1 Jim C. Hines’ Princess novels. Sadly they are very adult material, I wished that there was some spin like that on children’s versions of fairy tales.
    And there’s always Tiffany Aching.

    Huh. Didn’t know there was a second. Going to have to get my hands on that. She loves Fiona but again, the dresses. At least she’s willing to play in dirt and will the boys in her dresses. She acts like a tomboy that way sometimes but damn if anyone denies that she’s a princess or suggest she wear pants when it’s raining. She then says things like boys can’t wear pink and that her boy friends can’t play with her dolls or dress up. But she played like that with other little boys when she was younger! She’s since agreed that it wasn’t nice to say things like that and that anyone can play with anything they want. But still I wonder and worry.

    I love Tiffany Aching so much. When she gets older I have books to recommend for her but that feels like so far away. So much damage and baggage by then. =( There’s Ella Enchanted that I loved when I was in 4th/5th grade that’s good.

  233. portia says

    What a smart cookie. Man. You did too well. Does she like to climb trees or anything? Does she ever see practical value in pants? Man. Seems like you’ve tried everything.

  234. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    portia:
    You’re in luck again.
    We’re willing to take Credit Cards if you purchase either
    A Tarot Bible
    or
    a 64 oz bottle of Tarot Homeopathic Juice.
    Both are available for the low price of 43.99.
    Call now while supplies last.
    ****
    JAL:
    your frustration makes me wish more public schools encouraged children to think critically and analytically.

  235. portia says

    You have homeopathic juice and you’ve been holding out on me? I really needed some placebo relief. I’m throwing my card at the screen but nothing’s happening.

  236. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    The worst part is she had cried because she says she isn’t pretty enough to be a princess and has to wear dresses all the time. Nothing I do or say has helped her feeling of unworthiness from all this princess pink crap. Gah. Hell, she once told me she wished for blonde hair to be pretty. At least I had examples then but damn. Then there’s the every princess is thin issue. I’m not even close to being thin and she makes comments and she’s refused things “because she doesn’t want to get fat.” Oh my fucking lord. Who says this crap to her? Her 10 year old neighborhood friend April who’s on a diet because she’s too fat to wear the cool clothes.

    *sob*

  237. says

    JAL
    Let’s sit in a corner together and cry over this.
    So far we haven’t had the word “princess” that much, but we’re dealing more with “fairies”.
    And it’s this pitfall of rejecting the pink princess crap without rejecting femaleness (I hate femininininity and masculinininity altogether. I wished the concepts would die and vanish, never to have existed) or traditionally female-associated stuff.
    I caught myself being reluctant to buy her beads to make jewelery until I realized that it’s not just fucking idleness, but actually educational as it trains fine motor skills, colour, maths, and creativity, and it let’s her be generous by making stuff for all of us.
    I suppose your little one might be fixed more on princesses since they are so rich :( Mine are privileged little prats in that respect who simply think that if you want something you buy it.)

  238. says

    Hell, she once told me she wished for blonde hair to be pretty.

    Oh shit. I’ve seen that with one of #1’s kindergarten friends whose father was an African American soldier. She painted herself as blonde and white princess all the time, too :(
    At least I managed to teach my little one that the colour is called “apricot” and not “skin”

  239. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    JAL:
    What about attacking the problem from the perspective of an occupation? Perhaps by contrasting ‘princess’ with ‘doctor, soldier, or athlete’. If she were to grow up to be a princess, what else would she do? Whereas, if you grow up and become a doctor, you know what that job entails.

  240. portia says

    Oh gawd JAL, that’s awful. Real convo at a lunch a few weeks ago:

    SO: J [who is 11] is doing a kid’s triathlon.
    SO’s horrible awful no-good person of a father: Is that because she needs to lose weight?

    Raaaaage.

  241. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    What a smart cookie. Man. You did too well. Does she like to climb trees or anything? Does she ever see practical value in pants? Man. Seems like you’ve tried everything.

    Thanks. I totally get when parents say “you’re too smart for you’re own good.” I’ve always tried to tell her the truth and reasoning on things. She’s always been big on asking “why” so we’ve talked and explained a lot.

    There’s really not a tree around to climb for her. On her bike she’s conceited to wearing shorts under her dress but she doesn’t like people to see the shorts. So the dress has to be long enough to hide the shorts but not too long to mess her up on the bike. She does climb around the jungle gym all the time at school. It’s her second favorite behind the slides. She still refuses to wear pants even with the problems of dresses and playing.

    She powers through any injuries or discomfort like a champ. Metal burning hot? No problem! Slipping, falling, bruising, bleeding? No problem! Her teachers now know to check her before she comes in from playing because she won’t tell them. She just goes on with two bleeding knees.

  242. says

    There’s really not a tree around to climb for her. On her bike she’s conceited to wearing shorts under her dress but she doesn’t like people to see the shorts. So the dress has to be long enough to hide the shorts but not too long to mess her up on the bike. She does climb around the jungle gym all the time at school. It’s her second favorite behind the slides. She still refuses to wear pants even with the problems of dresses and playing.

    I recently banned skirts or dresses only. There have to be leggins or something underneath, because dirts just gets too much into place it should not go and apart from cleaning being horribly painful, a permanently inflamed vulva surely isn’t something I’m going to tolerate.
    The new rule was met with a bit of reluctancy at first, but by now she’s seen value in not feeling the pain constantly.
    Fortunately weather here’s such that skirts and dresses are mostly a summer thing.

  243. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    I suppose your little one might be fixed more on princesses since they are so rich :(

    Oh shit. I hadn’t thought of that.
    I need a drink.

    Oh shit. I’ve seen that with one of #1′s kindergarten friends whose father was an African American soldier. She painted herself as blonde and white princess all the time, too :(
    At least I managed to teach my little one that the colour is called “apricot” and not “skin”

    Oh god that’s terrible. That hasn’t popped up for us as much because she’s only a little more tan than I am but her hair is different in texture and has curls because of her dad.
    We’ve had issues of her saying “my brown friend William”.”Honey, he’s just your friend. You don’t say “brown” like he’s different from you.””But he’s brown like [Roomie}.” “Yeah, so? We’re all the same on the inside and that’s what counts. Do you want William to say “my white friend [Little One]? That doesn’t sound right does it?”
    Fought the skin crayon color fight. She’s all “No, everyone says it’s skin. Look, it’s the color of my skin.””But honey, couldn’t [Roomie] call brown ‘skin’ since his skin is brown? The default isn’t white, honey, it’s all skin, no matter the color. This color is tan or beige , it just happens to be your skin color.”

    What about attacking the problem from the perspective of an occupation? Perhaps by contrasting ‘princess’ with ‘doctor, soldier, or athlete’. If she were to grow up to be a princess, what else would she do? Whereas, if you grow up and become a doctor, you know what that job entails.

    Oh no. She knows what she’s going to do when she grows up. She’s going to grow up and be a veterinarian. She already tries to clean up after Grandma’s animals and is always on top of their food/water/walks. She’s asked plenty of questions and understands about the dog’s testicles and the cat going into heat and everything. She’s just going to be a princess now and always wear dresses when she grows up so she can still be pretty.

  244. JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness says

    I recently banned skirts or dresses only. There have to be leggins or something underneath, because dirts just gets too much into place it should not go and apart from cleaning being horribly painful, a permanently inflamed vulva surely isn’t something I’m going to tolerate.
    The new rule was met with a bit of reluctancy at first, but by now she’s seen value in not feeling the pain constantly.
    Fortunately weather here’s such that skirts and dresses are mostly a summer thing.

    Yeah, she only agreed to the short because we said if she didn’t wear them she wouldn’t play on the jungle gym or ride her bike without them. Living in AZ means dresses can go mostly year round, until just a couple months in winter. It hasn’t gotten cold much here and is getting hotter sooner. When it gets cold or rains she knows I won’t let her get away with a dress. She’ll still pout and fight and break my hear when she says she’s not pretty in pants but I’ll be damned if she wears a dress in December.

    I’ve tried convincing her you can be pretty in pants and buying her pretty pants that she picks out and says she likes. Still refuses to wear them. I really don’t know what else to do. =(

  245. says

    The crayon discussion went well by pointing out that not everybody’s skin wasn’t the same colour and that it meant that those other skins weren’t the right colour.
    There’s a number of mixed racial children here and I guess it must be super-hard for them because there aren’t many black people in Germany in general and often their fathers are US-soldiers who have gone back to the States when things didn’t work out the way they planned :(

    #1 generally accepts my weather recommendations after I let her try it out herself. I made sure that I had something warm to wear along and she could get it as soon as she asked for the stuff. Since that day she asks me if I think it’s hot, warm, medium, cool or cold.

  246. says

    To the work experience student who designed the new RichardDawkins.net site, could you see to it that the RSS feed gets restored? Like, basic functionality?

  247. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    JAL:

    The worst part is she had cried because she says she isn’t pretty enough to be a princess and has to wear dresses all the time. Nothing I do or say has helped her feeling of unworthiness from all this princess pink crap. Gah. Hell, she once told me she wished for blonde hair to be pretty. At least I had examples then but damn. Then there’s the every princess is thin issue. I’m not even close to being thin and she makes comments and she’s refused things “because she doesn’t want to get fat.” Oh my fucking lord. Who says this crap to her? Her 10 year old neighborhood friend April who’s on a diet because she’s too fat to wear the cool clothes.

    Ouch. Damn you Disney!

    But seriously, I don’t know what to do here… I guess continue the education and be honest, but I don’t think that’ll do much to help.

  248. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Things that piss me off part 2:

    It really annoys me when people refuse help to somebody because they “deserve” it. It’s just petty and smells of retribution.

    Example 1: A hypothetical situation was explained to a group including me. Roommate was studying for a test. If you help them, they pass the class. If you don’t, they fail. However, if you do help them, you have a significant chance of getting suspended.

    I understand why some people acted out of self-interest, but other people said things like “Why didn’t they study not right then/for the week/for the whole semester?”

    Maybe they did, and just couldn’t grasp the concepts. Maybe they suddenly realized they needed help at the 11th hour. But it’s still judging someone because they didn’t do X to your satisfaction, and trying to be self-righteous while they screw over their hypothetical roommate.

    Example 2: JAL’s calling the cops, above. Again, all about the police claiming JAL didn’t do X to their satisfaction, so therefore she “didn’t need” help.

    So even if someone fucked something up, you don’t stand there, be smug, and refuse to help.

  249. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    So even if someone fucked something up

    … or you perceive them to have fucked something up..

  250. Pteryxx says

    For the linguists:

    http://www.npr.org/2012/08/29/160252153/a-linguists-serious-take-on-the-a-word

    Interested in the phenomenon of incivility, Nunberg wanted to study the word “asshole,” and quickly discovered that it was connected to a wide range of changes in American culture in the 1960s and 1970s, including feminism, self-discovery movements and changing notions of social class.

    Nunberg says the usage of the word, as not being purely anatomical, originated during World War II as a GI’s term for an officer who thinks his status “entitles him to a kind of behavior — to either abuse his men, or makes him more important than he really is.” When GIs came home, they brought the word with them, and movement radicals began to use it.

    But it wasn’t until 1970 that the A-word entered everyday language…

  251. says

    As to the helping vs not helping the roommate hypothetical, I think judging is very reasonable – because you’re being asked to take a risk for another person’s benefit. An altruistic act. You have every right to refuse.

    So, what is the relationship like? If my imaginary roommate has been a decent person and needs help for whatever reason, I might take the risk to help them. If they’ve been a self-centred party-all-session type, then they can damn well have the life-lesson. It’s not me screwing them over; they did it to themself. I just didn’t save them, and I’m not morally obliged to do so.

    The thing is, an abusive or just plain overly-entitled person could very well try to guilt you into helping them. It’s very important to be able to say no to the leeches, while not giving way to total cynicism.

  252. lexie says

    Thunk to restore a little faith in humanity for you I want to tell you about my class. I am at uni studying DVM. At my uni we are encouraged to help each other, obviously we can’t cheat on tests by telling others the answers or other cheating. But we are encouraged to study together and help each other out if someone doesn’t get something. Most of the other classes are fairly good but my year level is great. We have a Facebook group where anyone in the class can post anything that they don’t understand and someone will explain it, people post notices such as delayed or changed classes in case someone hasn’t checked the notices so no one misses the class, in addition to this if anyone misses a class someone will loan them their notes. We’ve previously been given practice exam papers but they never give the answers so we all team together to work out the correct answers so that everyone knows if they have the correct answers when they practice, it also means that if people don’t have time to do all of them they can read over the answers so that get something out of it. They are wonderful and make it me so much less stressed because I never have to worry about getting help if I need it.

  253. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Alethea:

    As to the helping vs not helping the roommate hypothetical, I think judging is very reasonable – because you’re being asked to take a risk for another person’s benefit. An altruistic act. You have every right to refuse.

    So, what is the relationship like? If my imaginary roommate has been a decent person and needs help for whatever reason, I might take the risk to help them. If they’ve been a self-centred party-all-session type, then they can damn well have the life-lesson. It’s not me screwing them over; they did it to themself. I just didn’t save them, and I’m not morally obliged to do so.

    The thing is, an abusive or just plain overly-entitled person could very well try to guilt you into helping them. It’s very important to be able to say no to the leeches, while not giving way to total cynicism.

    Eh. You’re sorta right. If it’s obvious they’re trying to guilt you, then of course, you have every right to refuse.

    But otherwise, I still have some problems; with this hypothetical, the detrimental aspects to you of getting caught would have tipped the balance somewhat, but if they were more minor, I’d still feel obligated to help roommate, even if they had been slacking (with reservations as in the first paragraph above).

    But my main point was that of jumping to conclusions regarding these topics; things where people assume that they fit into the “slacker” category without good evidence for or against.

  254. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Guilt does *not* make sense.

    Never said it had to make sense. The guilt is from the irrational part of my brain, not the rational part.

    I had a nightmare last night and woke up feeling like I was 10 years old and had just been raped. I then lay awake for about 3 hours reliving the memories. I still cannot remember her name but I do now remember that it happened more than once and there are probably hundreds of photos out there recording it for posterity. Oh, joy and happiness unforeseen! In other words, Bleah.

    Sad to say, you are wrong there. Accelerate with more revs to give you peak torque. (The engine will be functioning optimally and be more fuel efficient.)

    My car has one of the newer high-torque V^ engines and the torque curve is flatter and starts lower. Which means that I get my best fuel mileage if I keep my rpms to no more than 2k. My car also has an mpg computer and I have tested this. Zero to thirty peaking at 4k rpm yeilds 10.7 mpg; peaking at 3k rpm yeilds 12.6 mpg; and keeping the peak to 2k or under gives 14.9 mpg (all on level ground). The time difference for zero to thirty is about 5 seconds.

    Thereafter coast as much as you can and avoid braking/acceleration when you are under way.

    Already do that.

    five demanding and high-output classes (three writing-intensives!) was a TERRIBLE idea.

    This semester, Boy is only taking 12 credits. He is also working full time. Two of those classes are 400 level history courses, one is a 300 level course. And the last class is a 200 level philosophy course — Philosophy of Science.

    . . . you mean people who pull away from green lights and accelerate at 1 mph/second AREN’T doing it just to annoy me?

    Depends. Are you the 17-year-old in the souped up Honda with the Blattatatatatttt! exhaust who is also leaning on your horn and giving me the finger with both hands?

    Was I asleep?

    Judging from the continued high quality of your posts, no.

  255. says

    thunk
    That’s one of those hypotheticals where I’d say you can’t give the answer without knowing more.
    First of all, you don’t have to put yourself at risk FULL STOP.
    And then there are other questions. Why is this person in trouble now?
    Sometimes it’s not so much refusing to help, but letting people have the consequences for their own behaviour. It is an important lesson to learn: things come with consequences. If you couldn’t be bothered to learn although you had time, well, seriously, better start early next time. Why should I bail out your ass?
    It’s something different when that person has no time because they have to work full-time, or have health-problems, and so on.
    I did the odd cheating for a friend (it was a very weird sort of exam. Translations German English / English German. First of all, you could take that exam until you made it, more or less, there was no real attendance sheet either. It was also playing the lottery because the level would vary from time to time.), I spent nights on the phone rehearsing with people. I did not sign a petition to postpone an exam that had been scheduled at the first day of semester because one guy had forgotten to study* and noticed that he was going to fail like 2 days before the exam. That’s really not my problem.
    * Yes, I knew that much. He was also a kind of a friend. One who got pissed off when you told him that no, you couldn’t meet him there for a coffee/beer/whatever because actually you had some stuff to do.

  256. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Damn shift key. That should be “My car has one of the newer high-torque V6 engines . . . “

  257. says

    I just signed up for all of my necessary prenatal classes. I don’t know why, but the whole idea of taking classes makes me feel all shaky and nervous and kind of scared– like holy shit, I actually have to go through with this.

    I kind of feel like I’m gonna cry.

  258. Ogvorbis: broken says

    don’t know why, but the whole idea of taking classes makes me feel all shaky and nervous

    Enjoy the classes. They’re not even pass/fail, much less graded. Take mental notes, though, and compare what is said in the class with your actual experience. Remember, no baby is ‘average’ — each one is delightful and annoying in different ways (though most of them do look like Winny Churchill).

  259. says

    Audley
    I’d think you strange if that weren’t the case. Really, with #1 I couldn’t actually believe that all this was going to happen until it actually happened.
    Yes, it’s a moment of intense panic once you realize that one way or another you gotta get this thingy out of there.

  260. McC2lhu saw what you did there. says

    I just leave this here for y’all:

    “To restore balance to the universe, Obama must have Tommy Chong onstage at the DNC talking to a steak,” joked Patton Oswalt.

  261. McC2lhu saw what you did there. says

    Audley: I went to all the ‘here comes the babby!’ classes with my wife and I thought they were very relaxed and enjoyable, as well as necessary and informative. There are no worries, nobody tests you at the end, except maybe yourself if you’re your own worst critic. They give you tons of hand out sheets so you don’t even have to take notes.

    Pay close attention to the baby CPR. I forgot a part and dreaded existence until I was clever enough to look it up online again and reduce the stress.

  262. opposablethumbs says

    Giliell, yes a thousand times over to Tiffany Aching – a really great hero! JAL, I bet your Little One will lover when she’s old enough for those books.

    @lexie #347 Not to mention how much it helps people to consolidate their own learning by teaching/explaining to others! Win/win.

    Audley, hugs and chocolate (or Nice Cups of Tea if you prefer).

  263. Ogvorbis: broken says

    I’ve been reading the Tiffany Aching books. They are, to me, better stories than Harry Potter (which I also love) and are fun, provocative, and enjoyable. I’ve always said that good young-adult literature should be engaging to an adult — Harry Potter, The Hobbit, and the Tiffany Aching books (plus Maurice and his Rats (I think I just muujreder that book title)) are all books geared to early teens that are still engaging to an adult.

  264. says

    Thanks, guys. I had put off signing up for the classes, not because I WAS worried about them per se, but because HOLY SHIT I’M GOING TO HAVE A BABY. And it’s kind of scary, you know.

    Mr Darkheart made me a waffle to try to make me feel better. :)

  265. Ogvorbis: broken says

    HOLY SHIT I’M GOING TO HAVE A BABY.

    You just noticed? (Trying to be funny, there. I remember Wife going through this (and for part of it, I was away in the Army) and just how totally unreal it seams. Oh, she’s due in May and it is only December, wow that is so far away HOLY SHIT! IT’S ALMOST MAY AND THE BABY IS ON THE WAY OH SHIT OH SHIT OH SHIT! I understand (well, secondhand I understand (but we men have to do the tough part, right? you womenz get the easy part!)).

    And it’s kind of scary, you know.

    My experience with babies and toddlers and preschoolers and gradeschoolers and preteens and teens and adults introduced me to a link between terror and joy that I never knew existed.

  266. opposablethumbs says

    Headache and dizziness all day today, which is a pity ’cause it’s the neighbours’ barbie tonight :( We’re taking the veggie brochettes (plus wine etc.), which is funny because we’re not vegetarian (but some of the others are, and they said there’s plenty of meat already and not enough veggie stuff).

    The last one was great. Getting cooler now, though. And I may have to lay off the intoxicants if I’m dizzy even before we start :(

    (including the neighbour who it turns out knows all about Elevatorgate, yay! So lucky having great neighbours)

  267. says

    Oggie,
    “Unreal” is the perfect word. It’s like, I finally get comfortable with the concept of being pregnant and boom! TEH BABBY’S ALMOST HERE.

    WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED!?

    It is funny ‘cos Mr Darkheart’s reaction when I started crying was “you just noticed?”, too. He was also being funny. :D He’s lucky, though, as a “natural worrier” he’s already had the panic of “holy shit, baby” months ago and now he’s in the frame of mind to just get shit done. It’s helpful to me ‘cos 1) shit’s getting done (the trim in the nursery, putting together furniture, etc) and 2) he’s calm and reassuring when I have a freakout.

  268. opposablethumbs says

    There’s one called The Tough Princess that’s not too bad. Apologies for no link.

    good young-adult literature should be engaging to an adult

    Exactly! Definitely, yes!
    Ooh,
    The Amazing Maurice and his Educated Rodents! Brilliant, brilliant book!

  269. broboxley OT says

    On landlords and drug dealers. Drug dealers are never late with the rent because they have a steady income right up until the arrest. Landlords love drug dealers

  270. thunk, may or may not be onomotopoeia says

    Eh… I guess I’m weird.

    I also need to y’know… practice what I preach. E.g. help everyone out there. And that’s rather implausible.

    But if I feel a moral obligation to help people at all costs, I better be consistent. (or get rid of it)

  271. says

    Oh, dear, awkward. Republican stalwart, Sheriff Paul Babeu of Arizona, used to be the co-chair of Mitt Romney’s presidential campaign.

    In February Babeu was outed as gay and his political career (he was also running for Congress) is experiencing its own version of deep rifts

    Sheriff Babeu was also romantically involved with an immigrant from Mexico, a man who was in the US illegally on an expired visa.

    My advice to Babeu is to switch political parties. But the guy may soldier on — he quit the Romney campaign immediately, and he also dumped the bid for Congress. But he may win reelection as the Pinal County sheriff — he trounced his challengers in the Republican primary.

    Imagining the cognitive dissonance is giving me a headache.

    Babeu said in a news release after the decision was announced. “I want the media and my political opponents to know; my name has been cleared, I shall not be silenced by your slander.”

  272. says

    @Giliell and JAL

    I wished that there was some spin like that on children’s versions of fairy tales.

    You might like to take a look at Patricia C Wrede’s Enchanted Forest Chronicles, starting with
    Dealing with Dragons. Princess Cimorene, sick unto death of the endless rounds of embroidery and etiquette lessons that are a princess’ lot and due to be married to a handsome but stone-stupid prince, takes off to go get ‘kidnapped’ by a dragon, so she can at least do something interesting with her time. Twisted fairy tale tropes ensue.

  273. thunk, circumzenithal arc says

    No questions, just jealous, Sally.

    Me too; I have a noted inability to find Horde members.

  274. dianne says

    JAL: Second the Wrede books. Also, have you considered showing her a few selected google images of real princesses? Princess Mary of Denmark is often shown in pants, for example. Little One doesn’t need to give up dresses, of course, just be ready to put on pants when it’s more convenient. Like real princesses.

  275. says

    Semi-threadrupt. At a lovely lake with Esteleth, Josh, and Sally. Waiting for Esteleth and Josh to come back with a short-term fishing license so we can has fishes.

    A friend with a degree in microbiology emailed me this morning.

    Actually had someone say to me today: “Polio? Why is there a vaccine for Polo Mints?”

    And she was fucking SERIOUS.

    Sigh…

  276. thunk, circumzenithal arc says

    Audley: It’s fine. I have most of a life ahead of me.

    Someday, I’ll meet ya all.

  277. dianne says

    Audley, some time during the 8th month or so of pregnancy, I was anxious for the critter to be born so someone else could carry her around for a while. Sounds like you’re reaching that stage…

  278. portia says

    Good morning all. I need happiness and giggles, if anyone has any to spare. Or a lake house to escape to if there’s one available.

    Thunk – I agree that setting boundaries with altruism is a good idea. All the factors Giliell mentioned are good ones. Too many people try to convince you that their needs trump yours.

  279. dianne says

    She knows what she’s going to do when she grows up. She’s going to grow up and be a veterinarian.

    She should meet my little one who is also planning to be a veterinarian when she grows up. You might point out that dresses and walking through mucky pastures to see to birthing cows are incompatible pursuits. Dresses are for when you want to dress up, pants or other more practical clothes for when practicality is called for. One of the lessons I figured out too late in life is that you can be femmie and dress up when you feel like it and also climb the Alps in entirely utilitarian garb when you feel like it. I always thought-mostly based on stories that characterized girls as “the pretty one” or “the adventurous one”-that you had to choose. I’m hoping little ones these days learn that they can have both.

  280. says

    Audley
    Well, Mr. Darkheart has it easy. Nothing that he’ll have to do isn’t anything that he hasn’t done before in principle (yes, changing diapers is just an elaborate method to wipe ass), but you’re about to do something you’ve never done before and that is totally not comparable to anything you’ve done before.
    I’m not sounding helpfull, do I?
    Thing is, it’s normal to freak out, be anxious and rather panicky over this, but it’s going to be OK.
    Before #1 was born Mr.’s aunt asked me if she could be there, because she wanted to see a birth once in her life. I declined at that point. I was comfortable with her being there for the little one, when I knew what was going to happen, but #1? No way!

    +++
    Re: veterinarians
    I once saw an interview with a woman who was close to retirement who said that having been taught all the woman-stuff as a child wastly beneficial for her: she knew what a needle and thread were good for.

    +++
    So, I give the leg of our livingroom table 3 months before it will break off. Sounds like a fun project for one of the next weeks

    +++
    Thanks for the book recommendation. My amazon wishlist is getting fat

  281. Socio-gen, something something... says

    JAL
    Yay, books! I’m an avid reader from a long line of avid readers, and I give books to my kids, nieces, and nephew on every occasion and often for no reason at all.

    I have to admit, I laughed reading Little One’s responses. She is a clever girl who’s obviously put a lot of thought into this! But then, this:

    The worst part is she had cried because she says she isn’t pretty enough to be a princess and has to wear dresses all the time. Nothing I do or say has helped her feeling of unworthiness from all this princess pink crap.

    It made me cry. I hate that your daughter, anyone’s daughter, feels this way. The pretty pink princess culture is so fucking toxic to girls and women. My daughter was diagnosed with anorexia and bulimia at age 7, about a year after she hit the princess phase. It took three years before she reached a healthy mental and physical condition, almost all of which disappeared within weeks of starting junior high, and still pops its ugly head out whenever she’s under a lot of stress. (To this day, the phrase “eating healthy” creeps me out, because it was my daughter’s explanation for denying herself food.)

    portia
    I should say I’m hopeful. I don’t think her recovery is going to be quick or easy, but I want to believe these little glimmers mean she will work her way through this.

    Giliell

    And it’s this pitfall of rejecting the pink princess crap without rejecting femaleness (I hate femininininity and masculinininity altogether. I wished the concepts would die and vanish, never to have existed) or traditionally female-associated stuff.

    This. One of my pet peeves is the frequent attack on “feminine” presentation (heels, dresses, makeup, etc), particularly by other women. And the reverse, attacks for not presenting as feminine enough. We can’t just wear whatever appeals to us and not judge those who wear what doesn’t appeal to us. (I hate Crocs, but many people adore them. Just different tastes.)

    I love my heels and “dress up” clothes when I get the opportunity to wear them, but I’m just as comfortable in the cargo pants and hiking boots in which I spend most of my time. I had a professor once who, when I came in wearing dressy attire because I had an interview right after class, say — in a booming voice, in front of 80 other students — “Wow, [name], you really clean up nice. You should wear girly clothes more often.” Uh-huh. As if getting to classes in three different buildings and mostly on the upper floors would be no trouble at all in heels and skirts.

    No comment, however, on the normally jeans-wearing male classmate who wore a suit the week after.

    Ogvorbis

    This semester, Boy is only taking 12 credits. He is also working full time. Two of those classes are 400 level history courses, one is a 300 level course. And the last class is a 200 level philosophy course — Philosophy of Science.

    I’m in awe.I had three 400-levels and two 300 levels, and only work 15 hours a week. (Now two of each). I can’t imagine how anyone manages to combine school with full-time work and/or parenting. I know I’m middle-aged and coping with an autoimmune disease and busy with two committees for the women’s leadership program I work with, but…I feel like I’m being lazy. With the changes, I’ll do 4 classes/semester for the rest of my time here and have a slightly easier mix of upper- and lower-level courses after this semester.

    Acceleration/torque comment: For the longest, I could not figure out why my cars never got close to the estimated mpg. It was always 5-10 mpg under, depending on the model, though the Celica came closest. I’d ask my brother the mechanic, who’d look them over and say, “No clue.” One day, when I was around 34-35yo, I had to pick him up for some reason, and during the acceleration after the first full stop, he yelled, “OMG that’s why!”

    You see, my vehicles have always been manual transmissions; I prefer them to automatics. And, as a teenager, my driving motto was “if you’re gonna do it, do it like Dale Earnhardt.” I grew out of most of the bad driving habits that produced, but whenever I’d start moving after full stop, it was like dropping the starting flag at Daytona; I’d rip through gears. There were a lot of times when I was doing the 1-3-5 thing.

    My experience with babies and toddlers and preschoolers and gradeschoolers and preteens and teens and adults introduced me to a link between terror and joy that I never knew existed.

    Oh, yes.

    Audley
    One thing to remember with the baby classes is that your real experience will probably differ in some dramatic ways (good and bad). It’s kind of like how they say, “Now, you’ll experience some discomfort” right before they jab a needle into your arm and proceed to shove liquid fire into you.

    Yeah, I got my Tdap booster yesterday.

  282. says

    I’ve only ever done the thing you’re *not* supposed to do: put butter on it. I believe that’s a folk remedy that may do some good, but there are risks involved.

    Misterc ended up bringing me some high octane lidocaine cream. At first the burn was so painful the lidocaine didn’t help and the only thing I could do was keep it under cool running water. (It was really astonishing how much it hurt. I felt like I couldn’t breathe. And I have god pain tolerance.) After a couple hours the cream was enough.

    Then, cleaning the closet, I scraped the burned part of my arm on the shelf and peeled off a bunch of skin. Apparently it was a second-degree burn after all :( That was not a fun experience. I learned my lesson and it is covered now, with lots of antibiotic ointment.

  283. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    kristinc:

    And I have god pain tolerance.

    -Typos that are unintentionally funny are the best :)
    I hope the injury is doing better.

  284. says

    Giliell,
    Oh no doubt Mr Darkheart has it easy! But it’s nice that he recognizes this and he uses his relative comfort to help me out. I’m feeling much better now (thanks largely to teh Horde) and I won’t beat myself up if I have any other freakouts.

    Thankfully, the hospital where I’m going to give birth only allows one additional person in the birthing suite (besides mom to be and medical staff), so I’ve been able to easily say “oh hell no” to well meaning family. My mom wanted to be there DURING THE DELIVERY! ACK! She’s still a little pissy that I’m not going to call her until after DF is born, but them’s the breaks.

  285. Tony •King of the Hellmouth• says

    Re: Being in the Delivery Room-
    For a long time I’ve had this secret wish/desire (in the back of my head) to be the father in the delivery room awaiting the birth of my child. I literally cannot imagine the joy that must bring to parents.

    Anyone who says gay people want to be gay so they don’t have responsibilities is talking out of their ass. I *want* children.

  286. thunk, circumzenithal arc says

    Audley, Tony:

    When I was young, I decided to read about pregnancy. When I came to birth, my reaction was OH GOD I DO NOT WANT TO DO THAT EVER (though being male-bodied and incapable of doing that relieved)

    To this day, I don’t want to spawn– partially because I want to do Other Things, and partially because I don’t want to inflict the process on anyone.

  287. Aratina Cage says

    So I’m jumping around reading old FTB posts about Lucy Wainwright who Richard Dawkins retweeted and find this on her blog:

    One thing about it that he has been able to distill and articulate for me, though, is that people respond best when they’re made to feel good about themselves.

    The dreaded argument from tone. And yet, how many slimepitters or the like have gone out of their way to make someone talking about A+ or *gasp* FTB bloggers and commenters feel good about themselves? Assholes telling other people not to be assholes–that’s what their whole side consists of.

  288. dianne says

    @312: Based on a couple of attempts at having the discussion on miscarriage at Patheos, I’d say the typical response is crickets. This is just as well, because the response to your hypothesized response is that the stated view is only consistent if one is a member of the Christian Science sect: if one accepts medical care for oneself and born children-and therefore saves some babies and adults that “god” would have let die (i.e. who would have died without intervention), why not accept it for all?

  289. dianne says

    Thunk, there’s no reason in the world why you should have to have kids, unless you want them. Don’t worry about it.

  290. says

    Tony:

    I *want* children.

    Good for you, hope you have ‘em some day. Me, I never wanted sprogs and never had them.

    Thunk, no one ever needs to justify not wanting sprogs. Either you want them or you don’t. Most people put more thought into buying a new car than they do having sprogs. I’ve been happily childfree my whole life and have zero regrets on that score.

  291. Ogvorbis: broken says

    Personally, I hope that one day we can let go of the notion that having kids is “the right thing to do” so people can live happily with whichever decision they make.

    Having children is the right thing to do. For Wife and I. For my sister, it ain’t. For some, inflicting your genes on the next generation of humanity is, for whatever reason, right. For others, the decision not to spawn is right. One of the many reasons I detest the religious and political right is their insistence that there is only one right answer for everyone (and it happens to coincide (usually) with their personal choices).

  292. says

    Typos that are unintentionally funny are the best :)

    Bwahahahahaaa. Yes, yes they are.

    Thanks, it’s not bothering me at all today (that’s maybe the most frustrating thing about steam burns, is how agonizing they are even though they vanish fast. Knowing it will be gone by the next day doesn’t help much when you’re hyperventilating with pain, I find).

  293. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Audley:

    Thankfully, the hospital where I’m going to give birth only allows one additional person in the birthing suite

    I am so glad this family-room thing didn’t start becoming popular until long after all my children were born. Because of issues with each birth, I had too many people in the OR anyway, and that was just staff (2 pediatric teams with the last two) and I can’t imagine the “fun” that would have been my mother…

    thunk:

    To this day, I don’t want to spawn– partially because I want to do Other Things, and partially because I don’t want to inflict the process on anyone.

    While parenthood can be a source of joy for those who want it, one does not have to be a parent to have a great and fulfilling life. From the time he was 15 or so, my oldest declared his intention to remain childfree because he also wants to do Other Things. His SO is a great young woman who shares this desire. He doesn’t get nearly as much hassle as my oldest niece who is of the same mindset, but there’s still a lot of pressure on him to “grow up, settle down with a nice girl and have babies,” especially as he inches toward 30.

    And very few people understand that I have no problem with this or “comfort” me by saying at least I’ll have grandkids with the other two. Well, maybe. If they decide to become parents. (Honestly, I don’t need biological grandkids. I have several adopt-a-grands from friends of my kids and if that’s all I ever have, I’m good.)

    As Audley said, I hope we get past the idea that parenthood is a “must-do.”

  294. says

    I am so glad this family-room thing didn’t start becoming popular until long after all my children were born. Because of issues with each birth, I had too many people in the OR anyway, and that was just staff (2 pediatric teams with the last two) and I can’t imagine the “fun” that would have been my mother…

    When I gave birth in the hospital, the policy was that I could have whoever I wanted with me, but if I did NOT want someone with me, I had only to tell the staff and they would inform that person that they wouldn’t allow them in. In other words, they would take the rap for being the bad guy. (I don’t know if it would have played out exactly as they said because they did lie to me about a lot, but to be fair when they lied it wasn’t about hospital policy.)

    For me personally, dictating closely who I can and can’t have around me when I labor and give birth is too controlling for me to be comfortable with. I wouldn’t want to have to choose my partner OR my doula, for instance, or my partner OR my best friend, wtf? Having two support people was a big help both times I gave birth. It’s a somewhat scary and usually painful experience in the first place, don’t restrict who I can have with me to help me!

  295. birgerjohansson says

    Found this at Aardvarchaeology, a blog anout archaeology, skepticisn, board games, SF and lots more.
    “Ron Hubbard’s Caveman” http://scienceblogs.com/aardvarchaeology/2012/08/21/hubbards-caveman/
    For entertaining wingnuttery, a little Ron Hubbard goes a long way.
    — — — —
    I have discovered the Brit publisher “Angry Robot”. They have SF and urban fanrasy. Some is meh, but the percentage of Good Stuff is encuraging.

  296. Socio-gen, something something... says

    kristinc:

    Yes, I think parents themselves, not hospital policy, should decide who and how many they have with them.

    I was thinking of it from my experience with a small-town “everyone knows the hospital has this policy,” feeling that would be used to put pressure on me to allow people in the room whether I really wanted them there or not.

    I personally would have been terribly uncomfortable with anyone in L&D with me other than my husband, which ended up not being an issue due to the c-sections. My sister, on the other hand, had my niece this past December with her boyfriend, her daughter, her son, her stepdaughter, the step-daughter’s boyfriend, our mom, her boyfriend’s mom, our other sister, and our sister’s two daughters all in the room.

    What would have been a nightmare for me was a very positive, loving, and joyful experience for her.

  297. broboxley OT says

    JAL on princesses and book reading. Is the little one too old for Pippi Longstocking? When I was a kid I wanted to grow up and marry her

  298. says

    Socio-gen: yep. Initially when I was planning my homebirth I was really attracted to the idea of having my sister there, my niece and nephew, a house full of celebrating people with me. But as I got closer to term I realized I really wanted to be more alone. I ended up with two midives, Misterc and a doula, which could have been quite a crowd but the midwives and doula were really really good at staying the hell out of the way and if I didn’t need them they practically weren’t there.

  299. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Example 1: A hypothetical situation was explained to a group including me. Roommate was studying for a test. If you help them, they pass the class. If you don’t, they fail. However, if you do help them, you have a significant chance of getting suspended.

    …why would you get suspended for helping someone study? Or am I misunderstanding?