I didn’t. I know next to nothing about her. Apparently, she’s facing all kinds of health problems now that she’s in her late 50s and did the usual thing we Americans do when facing a health crisis: go online and ask for donations. Given that simple story, I, a liberal weirdo, would think it deplorable that anyone would have to deal with our lack of a sane health care system. But no. Now the libs are coming for Mary Lou Retton, according to one far right web site.
From America’s Sweetheart to the libs enemy list.
That’s where American hero gymnast Mary Lou Retton, who turns 56 on Tuesday, finds herself after facing death in the fall after battling what her family is calling a rare form of pneumonia. When the public first found out about Mary Lou’s battle, it was also revealed by her daughters that their mother was uninsured.
At that time, the libs, who have no problem with hundreds of thousands of uninsured illegals pouring over the Mexican border, were livid. How dare Mary Lou not have insurance, they screamed on social media.
Now that Mary Lou has survived and appears ready to get on with life, albeit with an oxygen tank and looking like she’s in her mid-60s, the libs want blood and they appear ready to destroy the gold medalist darling because her family won’t disclose what they did with financial donations that were sent to Mary Lou to pay for her medical bills.
She’s not on my enemy list. If I were to scream “How dare Mary Lou not have insurance!” it wouldn’t be a complaint about Retton, but about how we’ve outsourced health care to MBAs in suits running for-profit insurance companies, and about the failure of the American state to provide a reasonable social safety net. I don’t understand the complaint by this far-right yahoo in the slightest.
What does the plight of immigrants have to do with that? They all ought to get basic health insurance applied to them, too.
He actually seems to be upset at one specific columnist for USA Today.
On January 8, super lib USA Today columnist Christine Brennan went on the attack in a column titled, “Months after hospitalization, Mary Lou Retton won’t answer basic questions about health care, donations.”
Brennan wants an accounting of the $459,324 that was raised for Mary Lou.
“Asked in several text messages and a voicemail on Monday about her lack of health insurance until recently, her financial situation and why she refuses to divulge where she was hospitalized or the name of her doctor(s) more than two months after she left the hospital, Retton, 55, declined to reply,” Brennan wrote.
Oh, Christine Brennan is a super lib
, however that is defined. All I can see about Brennan is that she writes about sports, nothing but sports, and about the impact of sports on people’s lives, and it’s no wonder I never heard of her. There’s nothing particularly liberal about her output, so that’s mystifying.
However, she has written multiple articles demanding an accounting from Retton about how she is spending the money that was donated to her, which is a) none of her business, and b) not at all liberal. It’s more Karenish than anything. Beyond that, she has written about drug abuse and spousal abuse and discrimination in the sports business — is that what has outraged the right-wing pundit?
He really has a weird idea about super lib
values.
Super Libs don’t want to help people like Mary Lou. They want them to repent and admit they don’t live life the right way like a Super Lib like Christine Brennan lives life and hence it’s time for Mary Lou to be dragged.
I guess Retton was a pro-Reagan conservative, but I don’t care. Everyone deserves basic human rights, and I don’t appreciate a frothing MAGA nitwit telling me, incorrectly, what my opinion on helping people is. But this is what people like him do, misrepresent and lie and get everything wrong.
Well, he sure owned himself a bunch of libs!
PZ doesn’t mention the right wingnut’s name.
From the link it is Joe Kinsey, a nobody I never heard of.
Joe Kinsey is a serial killer. Of strawpeople.
None of what he said about his imaginary “libs” whoever they are is true.
It’s also just gibberish. He just strings lies that don’t make any sense together and slaughters strawpeople.
This is a mystery.
It’s not a rare form of pneumonia.
It is pneumonia of unknown cause.
Why she didn’t have health insurance is also a bit of a mystery.
Even if she was broke, there is always Obama care also known as the Affordable Care Act.
This program passed by the “libs” was designed for people like her.
My guess is that she thought she was healthy and wasn’t going to need health care insurance. That always works. Until you have an accident or get sick.
As PZ notes, no the libs aren’t coming for May Lou Retton, who most of us have never heard of.
What we did was design a health care program called the Affordable Care Act for…people like Mary Lou Retton, so they could get affordable health insurance.
Over the strong opposition of right wingnuts like…Joe “strawpeople killer” Kinsey.
I thought the main complaint about Obamacare was everyone had to have insurance whether they wanted it or not? How can she be uninsured?
Child stars (and Olympic athletes) still deserve health care. Even Kirk Cameron.
From what I’ve read, the lady is still wealthy enough to live in a 9000 square foot mansion, and simply chose to roll the dice and fund her own health care. While the insurance industry will never be the best way to fund health care, had she chosen to buy insurance the money she put in would have helped others, until she got sick, at which time it would have helped her. Instead, she chose the path of soliciting donations online, which will only help her.
I wouldn’t wish ill health on her, but her support of Republican politics includes opposing things like the ACA. Apparently she also doesn’t like paying for insurance. But the “system” she ended up relying upon, in my opinion, is even worse, as the amount of money one can raise for a health emergency seems to depend on how beloved you are, how well you did in the Olympics, how many followers you have on social media, and how cute your profile picture is. On such weighty matters, we decide who is deserving of health care.
Some of us pull it off better than others.
This dude needs to be told that super libs can hold their breath for 75 minutes. If he can try to make it to 80, he’ll sure own me… 😏
I think it’s her business. She’s a journalist apparently, and she’s asking questions about how almost half a million dollars in crowdfunded donations was spent.
Yes, who could ever imagine a woman in her mid-50s could possibly ever develop a medical condition needing treatment? WTF?
Hey, where can I get my Super Lib™ Badge?
GoFundMe fraud is an actual thing. If you want to be ‘America’s Sweetheart’, demonstrating that you are not committing fraud seems a low bar to clear.
Mary Lou Retton: She may not be the enemy we deserve, but she’s the enemy we need.
The terms, “Lib” and “Woke” seem to be interchangeable to these RW idiots. It seems to mean, “I don’t like you because you’re not as bigoted as I am”.
SC and Reginald Selkirk were reading my mind. While there may be other issues going on with this journalist and MLR, I do think it is appropriate that a sports journalist investigate where the GoFundMe money sent to a sports star (is she still? I know she won gold medals and Hank Venture had her poster up, but that’s all I know about her.) actually ends up. Especially if the gold medalist is still able to afford housing and food, as she seems to be doing.
If Bill Clinton started a GoFundMe for doctor bills, it would be reasonable to ask for a basic accounting.
If she were living on the streets or something like that, it would make a little bit of a difference. Then your story angle would be olympic medalist can’t afford hospital care and is living out of a van down by the river. But that doesn’t seem to be the case here.
So how much money does Mary Lou Retton have anyway?
I put the question into Google.
and
Mary Lou Retton’s estimated net worth is all over the place.
Most estimates are currently at $2 million.
Some estimates are as high as $8 million.
.1. Mary Lou Retton is fair game here.
She is a public figure.
This is voluntary.
She makes her money by…being a public figure.
Commercials, endorsements, Dancing with the Stars, as a motivational speaker, etc..
She also chose to disclose her medical bill problems in public by setting up a GoFundMe account.
.2. Those net worth estimates are just that, estimates.
Only Mary Lou Retton and her accountants and bankers know the actual number.
First, there is a reporter and to MAGA morons (but, I repeat myself), everyone that is in any form of media is a super lib. Clint Eastwood is a super lib to them.
Second, a half million dollars? A week in ICU, that’s gone and more, but hey, we can’t have reality intrude on MAGA outrage mechanics or super lib cape flapping or something.
Third, the hospital name and physicians names is none of the reporter’s business. Want a copy of the medical bill, we can talk. What I don’t want is to publicize a hospital for some nut case to burn it down. Or have innocent physicians under threat for their very lives, as well as their families at risk.
rietpluim @ 10, I’d settle for a bit of super lib rage or something. I’m fresh out of whatever super lib is and my rage supply is dwindling rapidly.
Autobot Silverwynde @ 8, I volunteer to assist the idiot in achieving such a lofty goal, with an eye for overachievement, say for 90 minutes.
I’m also trying to figure out how she’s uninsured, as if she was intestate, medicaid still exists, despite the MAGA crowd’s desire to eliminate their own health insurance. I can testify honestly that pneumonia and CHF are both covered 100% under medicaid, given two of my hospitalizations for hyperthyroid crises. Mine, a bit more fun, mixed partial collapse of lungs, part pneumonia, SPO2 starting to dip below 80 the last time.
Well, off to make some stew, which is of much greater importance. Neighbor gave me a bottle of “mystery spice”, Tajin (chili peppers, lime juice concentrate and (grrrr) salt), that’ll go in, some other spices and whatever’s on hand, broccoli being left over is definitely going in and the guest of honor, a chicken leg or two. Obviously, a small batch for a change.
How big is Mary Lou Retton’s house in Texas?
OK, people.
Control your crying and wailing over Mary Lou Retton’s dismal housing situation.
Do you have any idea what a maid costs in Houston, Texas these days?
There is no way a sick, 55 year old woman is going to be cleaning a 9,000 square foot mansion with 6 bedrooms by herself.
Plus, the pool boy.
“How dare they not have insurance” My wife has insurance. Following a cardiac tress stest she was admitted to hospital for an angiogram because the specialist believed she had one or more blocked arteries. The 23k cost was met with support from family members. To our relief no blockages were found but further tests are needed to find the problem. So we lodged a claim with the insurer who required a medical report from the hospital which we had to pay for. The insurers verdict: No refunds as an angiogram is not essential critical care unless blockages are found and stents inserted. In what universe is a healthy, functioning heart not critical for survival? I guess not the insurers because they don’t have one.
Fraud in Medical Crowdfunding: A Typology of Publicized Cases and Policy Recommendations
https://doi.org/10.1002/poi3.188
Hey PZ, is there a super lib club I can join? Are you running it? Or are you just in charge of the ultra super lib club? I lose track…
As others have pointed out here, it’s not unreasonable to demand accountability for funds raised via charity. But then America’s right wing don’t want to be accountable for their actions.
@3:
Eh, no, I wouldn’t go that far. The Affordable Care Act certainly was an improvement, but it did not mean that everyone could get insurance. Even with the Affordable Care Act, there are still costs involved that may be higher than people are able to pay. I do fortunately have insurance right now, but I haven’t had insurance for much of the past few years because I just couldn’t scrape up the money to pay for it, even with the cost reduction due to the ACA. (This was also true during part of the time the mandate was in place, which meant that because I hadn’t had enough money to pay for insurance for part of the year, I was hit with additional fees come tax-time.)
Again, I’m not denying that the ACA is an improvement over how things were before. But I can say from personal experience that even under the Affordable Care Act, insurance is definitely not affordable for everyone.
(Though, on the other hand, yes, I’m sure Mary Lou Retton has a lot more money than I do, and particularly in light of the information in @6, @15, and @17 it is perhaps a bit harder to see how she would have been unable to afford insurance.)
raven and Reginald Selkirk are dead on correct.
Crowdfunding fraud is high. Mary Lou Retton is a public figure, which in and of itself is not a reason to question her medical bills but her claim to poverty and dire need are questions in the public interest. Reporters report on news in the public interest.
Mary Lou Retton could have absolutely gotten the Affordable Care Act insurance. Even if she didn’t have insurance previously or sign up during the open season dates, her divorce is considered a qualifying life event, so she could have applied and received Obamacare if she wanted to.
Just for kicks, I went to the website and threw the Houston TX zip code 77001 for a 55 year old woman, for herself only, into the “find health care plans”.
Here is the link
https://www.healthcare.gov/see-plans/#/plan/results
The max yearly premium cost for the most expensive healthcare plans is $15,207.00. Most of them cost less than that. The maximum TOTAL out of pocket cost is $9,450.00 and many plans have lower total out of pocket costs.
So to be clear, she could have solved ALL of her medical issues for under $25,000.00.
She got $459,324.00 from crowdsourced charity for her medical bills.
Christine Brennan isn’t exactly wrong to ask “so, what happened to the rest?”
Hospitals and other healthcare providers are never going to answer questions about Mary Lou Retton’s medical bills because of doctor-patient confidentiality laws and HIPAA.
Mary Lou Retton got divorced. Divorce is expensive. Divorce lawyers are not cheap and Mary Lou Retton has a lot of potentially valuable IP (her fame as a gold medal Olympian for women’s gymnastics is likely worth a lot of money), so my guess is that she got some expensive lawyers to protect her financial interests. I’d also like to note that SHE is living in a 9,000 square foot house, not her ex.
She must have gotten some good lawyers.
She must have also had money to pay those lawyers. A lot of money. Lawyers are allowed to drop their clients if they are not getting paid. So I’m guessing they got paid, since MLR still has that house.
To be fair, MLR should not be excoriated for owning that house and needing financial help. There are a lot of people who lead comfortable lives, with money left over, only to have it all come crashing down if they get sick or lose their job. No one should be mocked for say, applying for SNAP or welfare in a luxury car. What exactly do you expect them to do–sell the car immediately and get a beater car that will cost them more in the long run, just to satisfy the public’s thirst for seeing people brought low? People hold on to their assets as long as they can, for what they hope is a temporary problem, one that they are hoping they can recover from and go back to their lives.
That said… she did not get divorced in a week, by surprise.
She almost certainly had a good idea of what her financial circumstances were going to be post-divorce. If she got her healthcare insurance through her ex, she would have known that in advance too, and would have known that she was going to lose that insurance.
Enough in advance that she could have signed up for the ACA healthcare (aka Obamacare).
So why didn’t she?
Mary Lou Retton may not have to answer Christine Brennan’s questions but she will certainly have to answer the IRS’s.
Crowdsourced charity is not tax free.
Sure you can itemize your medical deductions on your tax return but you will still need to provide proof. Proof like bills from doctors, hospitals, etc.
You will also have to pay taxes on those crowdsourced charity dollars.
I’m kind of wondering how much money it takes to maintain that big house, along with the lifestyle that accompanies it.
@22 Nothing I said was aimed at you. Given that the federal poverty level for a single person in 2023 was $14,580.00, it is not hard to be unable to afford the ACA healthcare premiums and yet somehow not be considered “really poor”.
(Yeah, I know. I’m rolling my eyes too.)
For anyone interested:
https://aspe.hhs.gov/topics/poverty-economic-mobility/poverty-guidelines
and as it relates to ACA healthcare premiums
https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/federal-poverty-level-fpl/
@4 The mandate that required people to have healthcare insurance was struck down in 2018. Prior to that, you either had to have health insurance, buy it from the ACA, have an exemption from the requirement to have health insurance or else pay the fee for NOT having it on your tax return. So yeah, if you couldn’t afford the insurance premiums, you got socked with an additional $700.00 fine for being poor but not poor enough at tax time.
Did Joe Kinsey donate any money to the cause?
Is there a sign up sheet? Should we? Who is she again?
Yegods healthcare is so messed up over in the USA, so costly and so cruel.
A liberal who originally from Krypton now living on Earth?
Yeah, that seems an odd niche and in scheme of things pretty minor thing to focus on. Meh. Can’t say from reading that linked article and the OP that I particularly care for or about either of them. I did npotice tho’ from Joe Kinsey’s piece :
Huh. it says specifically elsewhere that she tested negative for covid and so that’s not an issue but is being dragged in here for some reason.. Also :
So tips are equivalent to charity? Not American and we don’t do tipping here in Oz becuase staff get paid wages which are supposed to be adequate but .. that’s a whole other different thing entirely and seems weird to me to equate them. Strange set of example swith lttle if any relevance here..
Sure. Personally, I’m not going to go after her personally or do anything to her at all. Hadn’t reallyheardof her tillnow nor do icare what she does with her money.
Its just I gather she’s a Trumpist and thinks she’s above scrutiny and I don’t think asking questions about that is particularly unfair and ithis does remind me of the rich and repugs demonising poor families for any cent or even welfare voucher they spend on anything that, shock, horror might be pleasurable for them and reduces the grinding misery of their lives and calling out hypocrisy and making people accountable seems fair enough too.
Don’t think it needs to be quite such a personal crusade on Brennan’s part so wonder if there’s more to this here on that but anyway, I wouldn’t call it “war” nor Brennan or “Super Lib” nor do I think Kinsey is doing anything worthwhile or fair by whipping this up into a reichwing outrage Oh noezz Teh Libz! Teh poor Trumpist havin Quezzztions Questions I tellz ya asked of them! culture wars story.
StevoR:
Yes. Yes, indeed. That is to what the term refers.
A gratuity. A gift. Largesse. A bonus. A present. A handout. Entirely optional, supposedly.
A way to be ostentatious about one’s wealth, back in the day, now perverted into part of server’s wages in the USA. You know, the place you love, from a distance.
(You did ask!)
PS [and OT, obs]
Actually, one can tip in Oz anywhere any time, but it’s only normally done at high-end restaurants and suchlike. Though many lesser places do have a tipjar. Still, point — tipping is actually tipping, not a social obligation here. I love that about us, that here we don’t expect people to work for fuck-all but get their main income from tips.
—
Mind you, last two times I went to Spain, I got caught in that trap; gotta tip, it’s a thing, but tip too much, the staff sneer at you for being a sap, tip too little, they give you the evil eye for being a grinch.
Fucking fraught, I hated that. I wanna know what I have to pay, then I’m very happy to either pay it or go somewhere else.
(Can you tell how stressed I got about it? Fucking tipping culture, I hate hate hate it)
I do admire our system in Oz, no stress when going out. You see the prices, that’s what you pay.
Should you be extra happy with the service being stellar, or should you want to impress others, of course you can tip. But it’s not an expectation, it’s not a social duty.
I reckon USAnians don’t get how refreshing that freedom can be.
(And normally, one pays up front, the service is fucking obviously part of the price of the drink/meal — not that I’d personally have a problem going to the counter/kitchen and picking up my dish or drink)
@27. John Morales : “A gratuity. A gift. Largesse. A bonus. A present. A handout. Entirely optional, supposedly.“
Emphasis added onthe “supposedly because inpracvtice everyoen knows you “neeed”to tip becuase that’s how the staff get a lot of their money that the employers shoukld actually be paying them,
I share your absolute hatred for this tipping system & culture. Workers should be paid by their bosses and NOT the customers and the price you see on the menus (etc..) should be the one you need to pay.
Emphasis added on the “supposedly” because in practice everyone knows you “need” to tip
Wtf is a hero gymnast? Cartwheeling crimefighters?
Snort.. So, much like MAGA labels everyone that is Republican, but won’t kiss Trumps ass as a “Rhino”, is it really a surprise at all that someone with no clear connection to Republicans, and annoys one of them is not just automatically a “liberal”, but a “super lib”? Its literally all they have left as a party platform, “I know I am, but you are worse, except I really am not that, you are!” Its like literally watching cartoon characters playing the game of, shooting another character, standing their with the gun in hand, and pointing at the next character in line and going, “He did it!”, and expecting everyone, not just their MAGA base fellow cartoons, to nod and go, “Get them boys! They shot someone!”
Its literally all they have – “I didn’t do it, they did!”
Excising the distraction about tipping; if someone were selling laundry detergent at a premium to support the cheerleading team, and then I found out they were instead spending all the money on hookers and blow, I certainly would be upset.
And I wish I were at a place in my life where $5 – $20 was seen as equivalent to $459,324, but I’m not.
The poster child for crowdfunding fraud:
Belle Gibson
What, you’ve never seen Gymkata?
@feralboy12 Never seen Gymkata? Impossible.
I don’t get it . why is Mary Lou Retton’s doctor’s name or her private health issues this reporter’s business ? I don’t blame her for not answering questions. I remember a few decades ago some wealthy politician was shocked when he got the medical bill for a family member. He changed his mind about supporting public healthcare quickly
John Morales @ 27, I take exception! I can’t afford to love from a distance.
StevoR @ 29, I remember the right wing outrage machine making tons of belly noise about one establishment with a mandatory tip. Turned out, when the owner was interviewed, she pointed out signage that was prominent in the window and posted all around the business, including at tables and on the menus, the tip was optional, but was defraying the cost of health insurance that the owner was providing all of her employees.
Irritated me no end, can’t afford to dine out any longer and worse, the business was far from my state, so I couldn’t even send traffic her way.
erik333 @ 31, that’s easy if you learn to speak Trumpian. Heroes win, losers don’t win, saps die for their country and only heroes count (winners, ya know). It’s also why, when discussing bankruptcy, it’s a win for Trump, as he is psychologically incapable of losing.
No, it doesn’t have to make sense.
Kagehi @ 32, it’s RINO, not RHINO. Republican In Name Only.
The rest, fairly spot on. They’re all Loony Toons. Cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. 98 cents short of a buck and they keep sticking their two cents in. Salt of the earth, you know, morons.
feralboy12 @ 35, missed Gymkata, thankfully. Alas, caught plenty of Gun fu and Gun kata.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equilibrium_(film)#Gun_kata
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_fu
brightmoon @ 37, agreed. I saw my hospital bill for a week in the hospital, with pneumonia and partially collapsed lungs, with heart failure, CT scans, nuclear stress test, angiograms and more. All, due to my thyroid acting up. Could’ve bought a fine home with that kind of money! And that, at a UPMC hospital, a decidedly not for profit organization (which oddly managed to buy every hospital in town, those out of town going to Penn State and Geisinger).
I have a couple of observations about the Retton brouhaha. First of all, nobody’s business.
Second, from Wikipedia, Mary Lou dropped out of high school to pursue gymnastics. There is no mention of her continuing her education and she appears to not have had a business career after gymnastics. Such is common for professional athletes who have a short fame and fortune with no follow up or Plan B.
Finally, her house in Houston, the 9000 sq ft mansion, she only lived in for a year or so. It was built in 2002 and sold for about $1 million and is listed at $6 million today. That is typical for Houston houses and I can tell you the fixtures were from Lowe’s and Home Depot. It’s not a fancy place. House prices in Houston have doubled and tripled in the past 20 years, so Retton’s “mansion” is no big deal.
I guess the strange thing is no health insurance. I don’t get that, but it could be she has scant income and is basically skint, which is too bad.
Heh. The irony is strong within you, Doc Bill, what with your observation and all.
(Am I being too obscure for you? I mean, you are somebody, no?)
Well, maybe — but it could be she got given $459,324, which is not too bad, really. Is it? ;)