The Noah’s Ark/DNA guy is back


Earlier, I posted those emails from a creationist telling me that he had a “theory” that united human genomics and Noah’s ark. I told him I was uninterested in the conversation. Of course, he wouldn’t shut up and sent me another email today.

Hello,
Yesterday I sent you my theory on human genetics and Noah’s Ark. Today, I am sending you the theory again in hopes that you’ll read it. It only takes 10 minutes of your time and it’s finding may be life changing. If you will just suspend your disbelief and are willing to entertain the idea that everything we know is wrong, you may find this theory interesting. I am a college graduate in the field of Biology and a former atheist/evolutionist. I am well studied in the theory of evolution as well as new atheism, so I understand this idea might seem absurd at first. However, with an open mind this theory will be life changing.

I’ll give you his “evidence” now. First of all, there is no theory to read: he sent me a pdf titled Theory that is nothing more than a list of biblical patriarchs and the haplogroups he assigns to them. That’s it! A list is not a theory.

To make it even worse, he sent an assortment of images organized by each of the biblical patriarchs — photos of modern people of different races. This is also not a theory. (I’m not attaching that here — it’s pointless.)

Then he sent a map of “Noah’s World”, showing the imaginary migration routes of Noah’s descendent. It’s a map. Not a theory.

And finally, there’s a Y DNA haplogroup map. Not a theory.

My life has not changed, and I don’t find the “theory” very interesting. It is absurd. And stupid.

Comments

  1. nomdeplume says

    But but PZ he is “a college graduate in the field of Biology and a former atheist/evolutionist” and is “well studied in the theory of evolution as well as new atheism”, so, you know, he is well qualified to change your life…

    But seriously, how many Americans are “college graduates” in this sense? Not only is fake news running riot, but so is fake education.

  2. Tethys says

    This is like my clueless born again siblings theory of how the 12 tribes of Israel are the ancestors of all people.

    An example of the reasoning via flawed etymology- the tribe of Dan is given credit for both the Danube and the Danes. Pointing out that it is spelled Donau in Europe, and means great river in Latin did not seem to penetrate.

    Pointing out that sibling did a DNA test and it showed 0% Jewish ancestry was slightly more successful. At least I haven’t had to hear any more nonsense about 12 tribes.

  3. raven says

    There is absolutely nothing in the bible that wasn’t known by the Iron age and Roman occupation age people that wrote it.
    It even starts out with the Flat Earth, while the moon is a glow in the dark disk, the stars are just lights stuck on a dome, which has doors so the god can pour water on us when he gets annoyed.
    That is a fact that tells anyone a lot about who actually wrote it.

    The New World and what became the USA isn’t mentioned at all because they had never heard of it.

  4. larpar says

    Regarding the second map. Is he saying that Adam is from Cameroon?
    That’s way off. I have it on good authority that the Garden of Eden is a suburb of Atlantis. : )

  5. robro says

    That global map of haplogroupss actually has two notes: “Exposed land during Last Glaciation Maximum” and “Ice sheet during Last Glaciation Maximum.” As I remember that’s 40K–50K years ago at least. Does that suggest this person isn’t a Young Earth Creationist?

  6. ANB says

    Larpar, sorry to correct you but the Garden of Eden is a suburb of Atlanta. Perhaps you were tired when you were typing.

  7. unclefrogy says

    If you will just suspend your disbelief and are willing to entertain the idea that everything we know is wrong, you may find this theory interesting.

    that is what you do when you go to the theater or read a novel especially fantasy and science fiction genres, not what you do when you are trying to understand the nature of reality and the principles that underpin it, do science.
    uncle frogy

  8. PaulBC says

    The second map, I assume, shows all the places the Ark had to stop to drop off passengers. It seems like it would be pretty slow, but if Santa can do it, why not?

  9. anchor says

    “If you will just suspend your disbelief and are willing to entertain the idea that everything we know is wrong…”

    Like, say, 1+1=2, or the Pythagorean theorem or the inverse-square law or the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics or a zillion other trifles we think we know?

    All of them wrong?

    Now why in blazes would anyone be willing to entertain a colossally stupid idea like that?

    There’s something seriously wrong with that fellow.

  10. chrislawson says

    As unclefrogy points out, suspension of disbelief is something one does to enjoy a work of fiction, not something one does to appraise a scientific theory.

  11. chrislawson says

    I love that map with the hand-drawn MS-Painted Assyrian border. Reminds me of a certain hurricane map.

    I’m trying to figure out how anyone can look at that map and not see that it is filled with peoples marked on it whose very existence contradicts by the Noachian story. Persians, Egyptians, Ethiopians, Numidians, Lybians, Armenians, Thracians, Greeks, Cimmerians (hi, Conan!), Thebians (although what they’re doing in the city of Syrene, a few thousand km from their central Greek origin remains a mystery) — all marked on the map, but strange how none of these peoples are descended from a single Jewish family, which would be inescapably demonstrated by genetic studies and would already be well known to scientists if it were remotely true.

  12. KG says

    Pointing out that sibling did a DNA test and it showed 0% Jewish ancestry was slightly more successful. At least I haven’t had to hear any more nonsense about 12 tribes. – Tethys@3

    Your sibling gives up much too easily. DNA tests would only be looking for descent from the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, not from any of the ten lost tribes!

  13. llyris says

    Probably an insult to Pterry, but that map is reminding me of the quote “She’s just showing off. She doesn’t even know where Thespia is.”

  14. blf says

    @6 suggests “this person isn’t a Young Earth Creationist?”

    Nah. Just as bad at plagiarism (or copy-pasta?) as at thinking.

  15. anchor says

    @#17 – What theories? I saw unclefrogy’s post. That’s what motivated my post. It seems more like that fellow regards scientific theories as works of fiction. It might explain why he thinks its reasonable to entertain the idea that everything we know is wrong, but that’s only a tentative fiction. ;)

  16. Owlmirror says

    Your sibling gives up much too easily. DNA tests would only be looking for descent from the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, not from any of the ten lost tribes!

    Judah and Levi, not Benjamin. And since the tribes were purportedly descendants of siblings, it doesn’t matter; they would purportedly show shared Israelite heritage.

  17. Tethys says

    I just wanted sibling to stop with the raving about their very special theory about the 12 tribes, period.

    It was horribly embarrassing for other sibling, who happens to be married to a Jewish person.

  18. says

    WTF? The guy who sent me a death threat by e-mail at my workplace for showing that his “crystalline” material was actually amorphous sent me a more coherent rant.

  19. KG says

    Owlmirror@24,

    Judah and Levi, not Benjamin

    Well not according to Wikipedia. And some scholars deny that Levi was a tribal designation at all. As for the fact that the tribes were descended from brothers, since the whole treatment of human genetics by fundie bletherers assumes impossible rates of change and plenty of divine intervention, easy enough to invent a curse laid on the ten tribes (who had after all gone a-whoring after strange gods and so got stomped by the Assyrians) that fucked up their Y-chromosomes!

  20. Owlmirror says

    @Tethys:

    This is like my clueless born again siblings theory of how the 12 tribes of Israel are the ancestors of all people.

    Actually, if sibling brings this up again, you might try pointing out that this isn’t consistent with the bible.

    Here’s a bible timeline. It’s kinda bullshit, but your sibling, presumably, thinks it’s true.

    https://biblehub.com/timeline/

    The bible is pretty clear that all the nations arose after Noah’s sons went and magically had zillions of kids all over the place in a short amount of time; see Gen 10 (between ~2500BC-~2100BC). Then Abraham pops up, then Isaac, then Jacob/Israel, then Jacob’s kids go to Egypt, and a few hundred-odd years later leave Egypt and enter Israel, then between ~1399BC-722BC, the tribes are in Israel. And in all that time, they barely fill up this tiny little land, and they are few enough that Senncherib’s armies can herd all of them out.

    So how is that the ten tribes, so small in the land of milk and honey itself after several hundred years, can just magically grow enough to take over Assyria, Babylonia, Persia, Media, Greece, Rome, Egypt, and of course everywhere else, in much less time than they were in Israel? And how can they do this without the bible saying anything at all about it?

    You could also point out that if the ten tribes are the ancestors of all people, then “take over the world” means “genocide everyone else”. Are they sure they want to go with that?

    Your sibling has latched onto a fringe kook theory, so maybe even the bible itself can’t dislodge it. But maybe it’s worth at least a shot.

  21. Owlmirror says

    @KG: Gah, I’d forgotten that Benjamin was part of Judah. But technically, that’s another lost tribe; perhaps even lost inside of Judah. WP:Tribe_of_Benjamin: “When the southern kingdom was destroyed in the early sixth century BCE, Benjamin as an organized tribe faded from history.”

    And some scholars deny that Levi was a tribal designation at all.

    That’s a very modern minority opinion, though. I’m pretty sure that the traditional “ten lost tribes” idea implicitly considers Judah and Levi to be the non-lost tribes.

    Too much of a headache to parse it all out.

  22. Paul Cowan says

    I love the mental image of pairs of penguins waddling across the Sahara, gamely heading south.

  23. Tethys says

    Owlmirror

    Your sibling has latched onto a fringe kook theory, so maybe even the bible itself can’t dislodge it. But maybe it’s worth at least a shot.

    They’ve taken enough biology to know that Noah and family could not have been a founding population. Shoehorning in the 12 tribes gets around that bottleneck? I plan to give them a copy of David Reichs book on ancient human genomic studies, ‘Who We Are and How We Got Here’.
    As you said-

    Too much of a headache to parse it all out.

    . I hope that the recent crackdown of social media on the Christian white right groups and conspiracy nuts helps to stop the bizarre theories from circulating.

    Thanks to you and KG for the mini history lesson. The lost tribes seem to figure in quite a few people’s personal theories. It’s just as plausible as Jesus visiting the Americas before ascending.

  24. PaulBC says

    It’s just as plausible as Jesus visiting the Americas before ascending.

    And imagine his disappointment that Disneyland hadn’t even opened yet.

  25. Owlmirror says

    @Tethys:

    They’ve taken enough biology to know that Noah and family could not have been a founding population.

    If they’re willing to reject the biblical literalism of the post-Flood nation foundation via Noah’s sons because of the science of biology, why then are they not willing to simply accept the known science of history, archaeology, anthropology, and paleoanthropology?

    Oh, wait — is this because paleoanthropology eventually connects humanity to apes and monkeys via evolution? Well, they can just ignore the paleoanthro and pay attention to everything else.

    I plan to give them a copy of David Reichs book on ancient human genomic studies, ‘Who We Are and How We Got Here’.

    I hope it helps.

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