Obama At Notre Dame

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1. 1
   

   Isabel

   May 17, 2009 at 11:05 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   “I doubt that Obama even believes this God shit, and is just pandering to deranged God weirdos”

   People keep saying this, but I’m curious why you think so. Why did he go to church all those years -decades-then? It seems important to him. If it was all for his political career that’s pretty cynical. Ditto for his opinions on marriage.

   I guess time will reveal the real Obama.

   (or not)

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   Mitch Harden

   May 18, 2009 at 8:00 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   The reason people say that is because it is hard to understand how any rational human being can REALLY believe in God.

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   drugmonkey

   May 18, 2009 at 1:45 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   It is also the case that the population of US political officeholders, particularly from the left-leaning progressive side of politics, is bizarrely enriched in the God fearing. Especially relative to expected value in the basal population of similarly smart, educated, worldly and community minded people.

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   juniorprof

   May 18, 2009 at 11:26 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   If I wanted a political career my ass would start going to church. Its just how you play the game… And for the record, I agree with you CPP, I doubt he believes it. But you know what, he can say it all he wants, just keep the increased fuel efficiency standards, cap and trade, health care reform etc. etc., coming…

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   TomJoe

   May 19, 2009 at 8:08 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   And for the record, I agree with you CPP, I doubt he believes it.

   That’s like saying scientists who claim to be atheist are only doing so so they fit in with other scientists. You know, science being a profession dominated by atheists and all.

   It’s fucking stupid to say: Oh, I think he’s a because he’s a but we’ll never know.

   Take it at face value, fucking deal with it, and move on with your life.

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   TomJoe

   May 19, 2009 at 8:09 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   Next to last sentence was meant to read as:

   It’s fucking stupid to say: Oh, I think he’s a [whatever1] because he’s a [whatever2] but we’ll never know.

   In Obama’s case replace [whatever1] with Christian and [whatever2] with politician.

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   BB

   May 19, 2009 at 12:47 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   Obama has always maintained that he is a Christian.
   Remember the Reverend Wright brouhaha?

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   drugmonkey

   May 19, 2009 at 2:05 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   That’s like saying scientists who claim to be atheist are only doing so so they fit in with other scientists. You know, science being a profession dominated by atheists and all.

   Bullshit. Outside of paranoid right winger fantasy nobody in science gives a flying fuck about the religious practices of our peers. The fact that the beliefs of one Francis Collins are such a huge exception just spotlights the fact that we have no freaking idea what the religious beliefs of anyone else are…until they decide to make a big deal out of it for some reason. there is simply no reason for anyone to “fit in” by declaring atheism when in fact s/he is not. at worst, a person might be motivated simply not to talk about it.

   In contrast, from local city council elections on upward the politicians are asked about their religious beliefs. There is no such thing as religious privacy when it comes to the political career.

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   TomJoe

   May 19, 2009 at 3:21 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

   Outside of paranoid right winger fantasy nobody in science gives a flying fuck about the religious practices of our peers.

   Likewise, bullshit. I’ve read a multitude of blogs where people in the sciences claim that christians make piss poor scientists. I would hazard a guess that some of those individuals would have a hard time separating their personal bias from their professinal bias come review time (for manuscripts, grants, etc).

   Now, while I’ll readily admit the analogy was not perfect (what analogy ever is?) I’d say I’m damn closer to the mark than you may like to admit.

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    Isabel

    May 20, 2009 at 7:08 pm (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    “…there is simply no reason for anyone to “fit in” by declaring atheism when in fact s/he is not. at worst, a person might be motivated simply not to talk about it.”

    Just sit there silently while your scientific peers lob insults at religious people and your holier-than-thou ‘progressive’ friends mock Christians and Catholics day in and day out (oh yeah and blame all the world’s problems on them).

    Yes, just keep quiet about your religious preferences and you too can be a successful scientist (or science blogger!)

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    J

    May 23, 2009 at 10:58 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    It depends a bit on what kind of scientist you are, and there is a good deal of pressure to not believe in that “god stuff” in the sciences. Unlike a politician, though, scientists aren’t popularly elected. Sure, there’s a lot of popular pressure for various things and one’s peers have to evaluate you in various ways, but it’s still fundamentally different than the public life of a politician. To whit: it’s easy to imagine one *starting* to go to church to establish political bona fides; it’s (somewhat) less likely that someone will *stop* going to church to establish scientific ones. (I suppose in a small town, um, full of scientists? one might be afraid of church-going and being seen by Prof. Frink at the Big Bang Burger, but most scientists don’t like in the fictional town of Eureka.)

    It is absolutely true that a scientist might feel compelled to fake being a non-believer by social pressure, but since our lives are less public, I think that kind of pressure is quantitatively different than for a politician, if not qualitatively so.

    That being said, I do think O believes in the godstuff, among other reasons, if you look at what his mentors and friends have said, they all felt he and his family were very conservative in their *behavior* and social comportment, and indeed, one of his mentors said (on The Daily Show at least) that he always assumed O was a Republican from how he comported himself.

    While I sympathize with (and am one of) the ardent atheists, this confrontational “you’re either with me or you’re against me” wackaloonity is not good. I know plenty of very smart believers, and very dumb atheists and agnostics. And since the secularists for years have been arguing that one doesn’t have to have religion to be moral, I think it behooves us to admit the empirical evidence that one doesn’t have to be atheist to be smart or rigorous (even if we feel that the two are more likely to co-occur). There are enough exceptions that it simply makes us look hysterical.

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    Isis the Scientist

    May 24, 2009 at 9:02 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    I doubt that Obama even believes this God shit, and is just pandering to deranged God weirdos.

    The folks at Notre Dame also count as deranged God weirdos…

    Hm.

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    Silent Breeze

    May 31, 2009 at 6:24 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    I simply think If your in any state of Government God should always come first. But to each their own. He is doing a great job if ask me. Just look at the polls from last 4 years. Keep good faith!

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    Silent Breeze

    May 31, 2009 at 6:25 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    AMEN BROTHER ! hahahah!

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    Silent Breeze

    May 31, 2009 at 6:28 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    Church SHOULD be split from State Law, People use the God roll 2 much! Just to get a slap on the wrist.

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    Silent Breeze

    May 31, 2009 at 6:30 am (UTC -7) Link to this comment

    You said it for me, Thank you! Nice words