[Lounge #405]

February 24th, 2013 by PZ Myers

This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. Fish face!

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread

Posted in Open Thread | 873 comments

Previous post: A Canadian poll on abortion
Next post: Oh, no, I’ve been doing it wrong!

873 comments on this post.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 24th, 2013 at 3:17 pm

Jakehamby last thread
The biggest problem with Esperanto as a universal language to my eyes is basically its ethnocentrism. To those whose native language isn’t Indo-European, it’s no easier to learn or use than a dozen-odd natural pidgins and creoles, and there aren’t enough speakers of it to make it worth the bother for anyone trying to learn a useful second language. English isn’t notably easy to learn, but has the advantage that a lot of people with money speak it, so if you want to get money from them by whatever means, it pays to speak it. It’ll remain a common lingua Franca for as long as that’s the case, pretty much. Lojban and similar languages will never be more than hobbies by their very nature. Basically, there are reasons why human languages aren’t like programming languages, and those reasons relate to all the ways that our brains don’t work at all the way computers do. Basically, Lojban is the Straw Vulcan fallacy given metaphorical flesh: no one actually does or can think in formal logic at all times for all decisions and communications, and will therefore not really find a language premised on that very useful.

Crudely Wrott:

February 24th, 2013 at 3:30 pm

From the previous thread.
Portia admonished me:

It’d be helpful it you would reflect upon the substance of the objection to the terminology.

It was helpful, for that is just what I did. It only took a moment to feel justly convicted.

I’m really not clumsy, it’s just that my feet are so big.

I’m teachable, though.

carlie:

February 24th, 2013 at 3:37 pm

Interesting little observation: Your feet on Asperger’s

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 24th, 2013 at 3:41 pm

Dalillama

English isn’t notably easy to learn, but has the advantage that a lot of people with money speak it, so if you want to get money from them by whatever means, it pays to speak it.

I disagree.
English is much easier to learn at a beginners stage and very error-tolerant. No stupid gendered nouns, no (almost) subjunctive, conjugation is mostly out of the window, too, and you’re still understood when you say “he go to work”

+++
OK, tried to bed the little one into a position that resembles “lying on mummy’s belly”.
Hope she can sleep now.
If things don’t get better tomorrow I’ll take her to the doc again on Tuesday.

MikeG:

February 24th, 2013 at 3:44 pm

Heh. I often sit like that. It is comfortable. No diagnosis here, I function fine in most situations, but hmmm…

chigau (違う):

February 24th, 2013 at 3:51 pm

When You™ reform English spelling, which regional dialect pronunciation is going to be used to decide said spelling?

Crudely Wrott:

February 24th, 2013 at 4:14 pm

Carlie, my youngest brother’s younger son has Asperger’s Syndrome. Lately he has joined a theater group and acting has been not only a pleasure for him but has proved therapeutic. He’s relating better to family and friends in general. Possibly because he has realized that he can role play. I’m not sure how that works but I’m glad that it’s making his relationships easier to maintain. He is glad too, as are his parents. And I. I hope that the next time I visit I can have a conversation with him. The last several attempts failed miserably. He didn’t have an understanding of metaphor and figures of speech. He took every word so literally. I was not wise enough to speak in definitive terms and he would walk off. It’s only lately that I’ve learned how I was wrong in speaking with him.

I have just recently been made aware that my youngest grandson may be similarly afflicted. Final diagnosis is not yet official. He’s eleven years old. I’ll remember what I learned from my nephew and just hope that grandson’s affliction is less severe than nephew’s.

Makes me wonder about myself and the genetics that may be present in my family.
__________________________
I have adopted sitting with my legs curled under me, yoga style. It seems to lessen my pain and makes it easier to sit with my spine straight.

unclefrogy:

February 24th, 2013 at 4:51 pm

My son came over and while we were talking the conservation came up “what is with some people on the internet?”
he clicked this link which explains it and if you start off as a dim jerk that would be increased by some factor.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19

uncle frogy

cicely:

February 24th, 2013 at 5:19 pm

moar hugs for Giliell. Warm, plushy ones.
-
Extra servings of support for mildlymagnificent, and hopes for the best possible outcome for mrmagnificient.
-
hugs for Ogvorbis. With extra tentacles.
-
-
That fissssssh looks very Golem-like, to me.
-

mildlymagnificent:

February 24th, 2013 at 5:26 pm

Just a by the way on numbers of English speakers. Don’t overlook the single largest group of English speakers in just one country – India.

And for those who fret about English spelling. Remember it has the largest number of words of any language, the verbs are dead easy to learn … with the great advantage of no changes for sex or age or status of listener or speaker ….. and the whole thing is written with a simple 26 word alphabet using not a single umlaut, cedilla or other diacritical mark.

The other thing about spelling is that many rules take into account both the sound/ emphasis and the writing of particular words – the doubling/not doubling rules for words like mopped, referral, reference are a classic example.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 5:29 pm

chigau @6:
Ebonics?

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 5:31 pm

mildlymagnificent:
You appear to know quite a bit about this subject.
I did not completely follow that last paragraph.
Can you translate that to English for me?
:)

chigau (違う):

February 24th, 2013 at 5:36 pm

hugs
yes
hugs for all

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 5:59 pm

carlie:
You are cracking me up in the abortion thread (did not want to put this there to overshadow/detract from the point you are making over there).

Maybe PZ can crop a picture of a Hedgehog onto one of a TCBY for the next Lounge…

carlie:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:06 pm

Crudely – my son with Asperger’s is also in theater in school, and very good at it. It suits him so well – there’s a script to follow, there are rules and he’s told exactly where to stand, what to do, how to act. I think that’s very comforting. And he’s good at imitation, and fantastic at memorization, and he loves the attention. Plus, the people who do theater tend to be caring on the whole, and they treat him well. He was so depressed after the last play ended because it was hours and hours every day of feeling like he belonged, of having friends. He can’t wait for the next one. I tried to get him doing stage crew for this year’s (they alternate which school does them which year) and that didn’t work out, but it might in the next round.

Tony – I’m trying. What just got me rolling was how it sailed right over travis’ head and then some.

Alethea H. "Crocoduck" Kuiper-Belt:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:12 pm

So glad to hear MrMagnificent is improving!

I had a crap weekend for fatigue, and I’m contemplating taking today off work just so I can actually do the laundry and shopping and exercise that I missed out doing.

mildlymagnificent:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:28 pm

Doubling? We double the last letter of one syllable words when a short vowel written with a single letter is followed by a final sound written as a single consonant spoken as a single sound. So we double for robbed, but not for mixed – because the single letter ‘x’ is spoken as ‘ks’, and not for washed, because the single sound ‘sh’ requires two letters when written. We don’t double the final letter for looked or headed because the short vowel sound in those words is written with two letters.

For multisyllabic words, you apply all those rules to the last syllable, with the added requirement that we only double the final letter when that last syllable is emphasised. (overlooking final ‘l’ which is never doubled in USA English, but always doubled in Brit English – so we write levelled when you write leveled) Gardening, opening, gossiping are all straightforward. The best examples of the difference arise with -er endings. Offering, bothered, gathering versus referring, conferring, preferred versus reference, conference, preference.

I often wonder how Indians cope with spelling. If you listen carefully you can hear that any difficulty you have in understanding their quite clear English speech arises from emphasis rather than diction or vowel pronunciation. The rhythm of their speech mimics Hindi word emphasis rather than standard Brit or USAnian emphasis on syllables. I was listening to a business discussion on the car radio and I found it hard to follow until I realised that delivery was pronounced as de-livery with strong emphasis on the first and the following three syllables almost run into one.

It can be quite fun, but pretty hard at first, to practise sounding out words with the emphasis in a different place.

Crudely Wrott:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:40 pm

Carlie, I am so glad to hear about your son and his experience in theater. It makes me so much more confident about my nephew’s future as well as Nathan, my grandson.

I suppose that the cooperation and mutual dependency that is demanded in pulling off a performance must be a supportive and empowering environment for those like your son and my nephew and grandson.

Thank you for providing such encouraging news. It reduces my worry and increases my hope.

Mildlymagnificent wrote:

And for those who fret about English spelling. Remember it has the largest number of words of any language, the verbs are dead easy to learn … with the great advantage of no changes for sex or age or status of listener or speaker ….. and the whole thing is written with a simple 26 word alphabet using not a single umlaut, cedilla or other diacritical mark.

This. ^

Now all I’ve got to do is learn some more of those words. Last time I checked there were in excess of 600,000 of them, not including technical and scientific terms.

How many do I use? Probably less than one percent. Room for improvement? Or am I just not counting all of them?

Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:43 pm

Got the Redhead watching the Oscar’s red carpet fashions, so I was able to get this weeks big cooking into the oven. A chicken/rice/veg (if desired) mixture for several days worth of eats. A knock-off of the old cream of X soup dishes. Even I found it easy.

Crudely Wrott:

February 24th, 2013 at 6:49 pm

Here is a sequence of English words that you might go through your whole life without hearing.

“Sauropod heads are essentially all mouth. The jaw joint is at the very back of the skull, and they didn’t have cheeks, so they came pretty close to having Pac Man-Cookie Monster flip-top heads,” researcher Mathew Wedel at the Western University of Health Sciences in Pomona, Calif., told LiveScience.

I love my language.

Link: http://science.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/24/17076293-how-dinosaurs-grew-the-worlds-longest-necks?lite

dontpanic:

February 24th, 2013 at 7:00 pm

Ogvorbis,
Yeah, I work for an organization that while not directly a branch of the govt, is run by a consortium for the govt, and so subject to these kinds of budgetary whiplash. And this time around I just not hearing any plans for contingency — its a bit frustrating, like fingers in our collective ears going “la, la, la”.

A few years ago when there was the whole govt shutdown thing, what happened was everyone was told that we had to take 1 unpaid full week off out of every 5 (or was it 4), i.e. a 20% pay cut right off the top. We got some leeway in which week, but with overlapping schedules and needs from various colleagues it was a mess. And we were given strict orders not to do any work during that week — these are scientists has have an overdeveloped sense of devotion to work (we generally like what we do) — because legally if we did anything they’d have to pay us and it would cause trouble. Having gone several years now without a cost-of-living increase I’d like to avoid the whole “take a 20% hit for an indeterminate period” thing as well.

—

Acting. Yes, tried to get son into that at school, but we could never convince him to do it. He always been a mimic, and has the most convincing “I’m Batman” (an amazing gravelly deep voice coming out of 15yr old). I think he’d be great at voice work at least.

—

Took the dog out in the mushy snow for a run around. I’m huffing-and-puffing way too much for such a simple walk. I’ve got to start getting into condition for an event I signed up for in the first week of April.

—

Spouse is calling me in to the Dr. Who special….

Pteryxx:

February 24th, 2013 at 7:24 pm

…Dr Who special? dashes off

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 7:26 pm

Hello everyone!
hugs&chocolate&whiskey to all that need it.

Quick DarkInfant update: She’s got her first tooth in and another two are threatening to pop out any minute now. She’s only 4 months old. O.o

In other news, I will be getting a new laptop on Wednesday, so hopefully I’ll be able to lurk less and participate around here more. Yay!

chigau (違う):

February 24th, 2013 at 7:32 pm

Audley!!!

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 7:46 pm

Chigau!!!!

chigau (違う):

February 24th, 2013 at 7:56 pm

Toothed babby, forsooth.
How goes the nursing?

ck:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:00 pm

…Dr Who special? dashes off
Whatever it is, it doesn’t seem to be shown in Canada. Next air date for any Who episodes is still set for March 30, here. :-(

johnmarley:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:04 pm

Is anyone else having the issue that the blog template doesn’t always load correctly in Google Chrome?

ck:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:04 pm

I apparently failed in my attempt to blockquote that first line.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 8:12 pm

Audley!!!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 8:13 pm

I still cannot get over the fact that Torchwood is an anagram of Doctor Who.

Pteryxx:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:14 pm

Yeah, the Doctor Who thing is BBCA running retrospectives of the first few Doctors, along with sample full episodes from back in the day.

—-

Random news:

White House promises open access to all federally funded research

John Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, issued a directive on Friday to all research funding agencies to develop plans to make the results of federally-funded research publically available free of charge within 12 months of publication. It also requires that scientists receiving taxpayer dollars to improve upon the management and sharing of scientific data.

This comes as a petition response here:

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/response/increasing-public-access-results-scientific-research

—

http://www.salon.com/2013/02/24/the_myth_of_persecution_early_christians_werent_persecuted/

Moss, professor of New Testament and early Christianity at the University of Notre Dame, challenges some of the most hallowed legends of the religion when she questions what she calls “the Sunday school narrative of a church of martyrs, of Christians huddled in catacombs out of fear, meeting in secret to avoid arrest and mercilessly thrown to lions merely for their religious beliefs.” None of that, she maintains, is true. In the 300 years between the death of Jesus and the conversion of the Emperor Constantine, there were maybe 10 or 12 scattered years during which Christians were singled out for supression by Rome’s imperial authorities, and even then the enforcement of such initiatives was haphazard — lackadaisical in many regions, although harsh in others. “Christians were never,” Moss writes, “the victims of sustained, targeted persecution.”

dontpanic:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:18 pm

It was a Dr Who special on the 2nd Doctor (they’re working their way through all of them in celebration of the 50th anniversary; the new sequence doesn’t start until the end of March) was on BBC America, 7pm Central. I’m a bit confused about the timing of these specials; they seem to be once a month.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 8:34 pm

Chigau:
My nipples are still attached, if that’s what you’re asking. :D

Tony!!!!

Old Mr Bear:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:35 pm

johnmarley:

I’m using Firefox, and quite often FtB will be displayed in a reduced mobile browser mode instead of the full site mode.

kayden:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:40 pm

Dang is that fish cute!

johnmarley:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:43 pm

@Old Mister Bear.
Yeah, that’s what it does for me in Chrome, too. Anyone know why? And is there a way of stopping it?

cicely:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:48 pm

Audley!
pouncehug
-

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 8:57 pm

Cicely!
tackle!

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 24th, 2013 at 8:59 pm

Audley!

Pteryxx:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:03 pm

…guess Audley’s been away for a while? belated ankle pounce

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:05 pm

Hey Joe and Pteryxx! How’s things?

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:16 pm

Carlie:

O.o

I’ve been trying to train myself NOT to sit that way because I suspected it was contributing to uneven sole wear and long-axial torsional wear of my shoes, and possibly to gait or ankle abnormalities that were complicating my efforts to actively exercise via walking or running.

I never noticed it was actively uncommon.

(Crosspostedish from the linked blog).

Owlmirror:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:18 pm

Yeah, that’s what [reduced mobile stylesheet] does for me in Chrome, too. Anyone know why? And is there a way of stopping it?

It appears to be a server-side issue. If there is a way to stop it, it is not on the client side.

Owlmirror:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:22 pm

I tried loading the previous two iterations of the thread, but I kept getting “Forbidden” and “Page not found”.

</nerdjoke>

Pteryxx:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:27 pm

Heya Audley, glad to see you’re throwing in. I’m sorta managing I guess, not as active online due to saving my spoons for other things. (Not that I can always manage to resist jumping in when it’s not good for me, but y’know. Like that’s rare around here. <_< )

mythbri:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:29 pm

@Audley

Glad to hear that DarkInfant is doing well, and teefs at four months! She’s a dental prodigy. I hope she goes easy on you.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:32 pm

ok, I’ve heard this a few times, and my currently buzzed brain isn’t able to translate…spoons?

dontpanic:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:35 pm

Tony,
spoons

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:37 pm

Giliell

English is much easier to learn at a beginners stage and very error-tolerant. No stupid gendered nouns, no (almost) subjunctive, conjugation is mostly out of the window, too, and you’re still understood when you say “he go to work”

You have a point about the error-tolerance. I may also be confusing the ease of learning spoken English vs written English, where the seemingly random spelling adds significant difficulty. I would also venture to suggest that the extremely simplified conjugations and ease of creating impromtu pidgins stems from modern English itself being arguably a creole language.
mildlymagnificent
Best wishes for hubby form me as well.

I often wonder how Indians cope with spelling. If you listen carefully you can hear that any difficulty you have in understanding their quite clear English speech arises from emphasis rather than diction or vowel pronunciation.

This is not entirely true; how different the vowels will be is a heavily regional thing. That is to say that different regions of India often have moderate vowel shifts in their English, relative to one another, as do different English-speaking regions outside of India. Basically, vowels can be a complete crapshoot, IME.

Audley
You’ve been gone? My time sense is shit, I thought I’d seen you just a couple days ago. Welcome back.
Tony
dontpanic beat me to it.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:41 pm

Mythbri:
Someone (Louis?) mentioned that Napoleon was born with teeth, so this means that DarkBabe is destined to be oour overlord… or something.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:51 pm

dontpanic:
Thanks.
I’m nearly in tears at a bar after reading that, but I think I understand better.
If I read that correctly (again, I have a slight buzz right now), spoons are something of a metaphor for a particular physical or mental condition that has an effect on the everyday activities of an individual that others-who lack the particular condition-take for granted.
Getting dressed.
Driving.
Eating.
Taking a shower.
Making breakfast.
Getting out of bed.
Washing clothes.

Damn. I feel ashamed that my privilege is showing. I had no idea how difficult things can be for others.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 24th, 2013 at 9:53 pm

Dalillama:
Trust me, time has flown for me too!

thunk, acolyte of metatextuality:

February 24th, 2013 at 9:54 pm

Hello everyone. Audley, hi, welcome back.

And hi to other horders who may or may not be here now.

Owlmirror:

February 24th, 2013 at 10:01 pm

@Lynna, and anyone else who is interested in Mormonism,

This is the first I had seen of an analysis on, and potential contemporary sources of, the Book of Mormon. It appears to be a thing, in the corner of the academic world that does literary analysis.

Mormon prophet Joseph Smith (1805–44) claimed that more than two-dozen ancient individuals (Nephi, Mormon, Alma, etc.) living from around 2200 BC to 421 AD authored the Book of Mormon (1830), and that he translated their inscriptions into English. Later researchers who analyzed selections from the Book of Mormon concluded that differences between selections supported Smith’s claim of multiple authorship and ancient origins. We offer a new approach that employs two classification techniques: ‘delta’ commonly used to determine probable authorship and ‘nearest shrunken centroid’ (NSC), a more generally applicable classifier. We use both methods to determine, on a chapter-by-chapter basis, the probability that each of seven potential authors wrote or contributed to the Book of Mormon. Five of the seven have known or alleged connections to the Book of Mormon, two do not, and were added as controls based on their thematic, linguistic, and historical similarity to the Book of Mormon. Our results indicate that likely nineteenth century contributors were Solomon Spalding, a writer of historical fantasies; Sidney Rigdon, an eloquent but perhaps unstable preacher; and Oliver Cowdery, a schoolteacher with editing experience. Our findings support the hypothesis that Rigdon was the main architect of the Book of Mormon and are consistent with historical evidence suggesting that he fabricated the book by adding theology to the unpublished writings of Spalding (then deceased).

http://llc.oxfordjournals.org/content/23/4/465.abstract

PDFs:

http://www.stanford.edu/~mjockers/pubs/LLCPreprintReassess.pdf

http://www.matthewjockers.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/SmithAnalysisRevised-9-12.pdf

Pteryxx:

February 24th, 2013 at 10:16 pm

Tony: exactly. In my case it’s mostly just PTSD, so I’m learning I have to carefully weigh whether to get involved in (or even read) a given thread fight or not.

Thanks for the fast linking, dontpanic.

dontpanic:

February 24th, 2013 at 10:23 pm

Tony,
I’m not completely enamored with the use of “spoons” as the unit of currency because I think it causes some confusion. In this analogy, “spoons” are the cost of doing everyday activities. At the start of each day the individual (especially those who “don’t look sick”) starts with some limited number of spoons and they spend them doing activities. It’s just that many people don’t recognize how many spoons they start with, while others are intimately aware of the limitations of their reserve.

If you think of it in terms of actual money in the cost of such activities, and some people start with just a fist full of dollars or even a few coins in their pocket, while most have a fat wallet or a platinum credit card. Every activity costs something (a few cents, to dollars, to $20′s on up). That would make the initial reading a bit more straightfoward. On the other hand, using money as an analogy would have left it harder to reference in such shorthand in other contexts.

broboxley OT:

February 24th, 2013 at 10:43 pm

looking at the extended family children splashed across the fireplace mantle, one gone forever, one in jail because of a mental disorder the courts don’t recognize one lost to stupidity with prescribed narcotics, the rest. I has a real bad sad because I’m getting old, but I have finally realized that I can only affect those who want change.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 24th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

I think I may call it a night on the abortion thread. I’ve said nearly all I can to travis, and find no energy (spoons?) left to fight “girls are there for their daddy no matter what”.

chigau (違う):

February 24th, 2013 at 10:59 pm

broboxley
All I have is some cheap white wine.
Hold out your glass.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 24th, 2013 at 11:41 pm

Hey, it’s Audley! waves
====
The “spoons” thing makes so. much. sense. Bookmarked for the times I have to explain that I only have so much energy, and need to “budget” it to get through my day.
====
Partner’s train should be arriving in Seattle in the next half-hour or so — staying up until he messages me that he got home okay.

Crudely Wrott:

February 24th, 2013 at 11:44 pm

Broboxley, you have my deepest sympathy, small comfort as that may be. Take what comfort you can. You still have your own life.

glodson:

February 24th, 2013 at 11:51 pm

Ever have a day where you feel like everything you’ve done is wrong? It has been one of those days. Fuck. It might explain why I’m trying to get drunk now despite knowing I’ve got an early day tomorrow.

chigau (違う):

February 25th, 2013 at 12:14 am

I have to go to bed.
I’m afraid I’m going to miss some interesting stuff.

glodson:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:17 am

Wow. I give up in the abortion thread on reading one person’s stupid comments, and then I find another stupid guy saying really stupid things. Fuck.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 25th, 2013 at 12:19 am

JAL:
To be honest, I have no commented on crayzz’s nym. To the best of my knowledge no one else has either.
As I said in the abortion thread, I see your position. I think I’ve been willing to give hir the benefit of the doubt based on the quality of hir posts.

Jacob Schmidt:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:31 am

I already commented about this in the other thread.

I personally see no problem with my old nym. It’s not a play on “crazy”, but nonetheless, I see JAL’s point. It’s dissimilar enough for my tastes. I’d rather keep it, as I am quite attached to it. But, well, whatever. If it makes others more comfortable, I’ll change it, at least around here.

Typing out c r a y ALT-122 ALT-122 can be annoying anyways.

theophontes (坏蛋):

February 25th, 2013 at 1:03 am

@ Owlmirror

Speaking of when religions were made up, I see in today’s newspaper (The Standard -Hong Kong) a full page advert for what looks like a new religion. The title reads: “The Utterance of the Returned Jesus”. The long spiel that follows is all written in the first person by something that reads like a cross between jeebus and sky-daddy but is perhaps merely a bad translation from the original Chinese (a bit of a giveaway that, being “omnipotent” and all). Apparently it has been alive for the past thousands of years preparing some Grand Plan.

There is a website given (link) but, quelle surprise, I cannot open it from China.

{relurks}

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:41 am

urggh
So, I survived the night. Poor kid has been coughing and crying most of it.
And I just HATE the infestation of German healthcare with woo. Called my pediatrician to ask what I could give her to ease the throat pain, got told the name of some medication. Bought it, took it home, looked at it, “homeopathic remedy”. Brought it back to the pharmacy, had a short discussion about this being “a good medication”, exchanged it for some throat pastilles and paid a whomping 21€ less…

When You™ reform English spelling, which regional dialect pronunciation is going to be used to decide said spelling?

In Spanish there’s something called “International Spanish” to make translation easier. And right now spelling doesn’t account for regional variation either. You could say there’s justice in it being fucked up for everybody….

mildlymagnificent

and the whole thing is written with a simple 26 word alphabet using not a single umlaut, cedilla or other diacritical mark.

And that is an advantage exactly how? Because those signs carry information and are easy and simple to use, usually they follow rules and they mean that you actually can tell the pronounciation from the spelling. If we just stopped using umlaute in German, it would make life more complicated because those sounds don’t only exist, they also form minimal pairs.

+++
Oh, and if folks want something hard to understand, try Singalese…
++++
Audley
Yay for dark infant. #1 got her teeth early as well and pretty painlessly.
(((hugs))))

+++
NOw back to bed…

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:41 am

Uhm, that should read “Singlish”, not Singalese….

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 25th, 2013 at 3:56 am

Is Kylie Sturgess leaving FtB?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:59 am

What’s “Singlish”?

Alethea H. "Crocoduck" Kuiper-Belt:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:43 am

Singlish=Singapore English la. Mostly English with some Chinese. Contrast to Hinglish, Hindi-English, which has a relatively high Hindi content.

Spoons are a fantastic metaphor, but I do feel a bit uncomfortable when people just use it to mean “out of energy”. Routinely being too tired to stand up for long enough to take a shower isn’t the same thing as just being a bit tired.

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 25th, 2013 at 5:03 am

theophontes@68,

According to the website, God has been incarnated as a woman from north China, and this has happened because the Chinese are the lowest and most disobedient (to God) people in the world. Looks like the sect has grown out of one of the Chinese “house churches”.

Alethea H. "Crocoduck" Kuiper-Belt:

February 25th, 2013 at 5:18 am

LOL, pickup artists! http://xkcd.com/1178/

theophontes (坏蛋):

February 25th, 2013 at 5:51 am

Thanks Nick Gotts.

I’m in Hong Kong this evening and will look into it a bit more.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:04 am

I understood the “spoon” metaphor as the spoon being a unit of energy or activity, where a normal person has a near-unlimited supply of spoons, others have a smaller, limited supply and must be careful how they are used.

As for my own spoon reserves, they’re perpetually low. Why? Dunno. Doc can’t find anything specific that would cause this lack-of-energy. (I’m pretty sure I’ve been tested for everything under the sun, and everything came back normal.)

I’m wondering if this hasn’t been an ongoing symptom of Hep C. (Blood transfusion pre-1990.) My infection (chronic) is stable, has been life-long, and hasn’t been otherwise symptomatic. I’m now thinking maybe I should bounce this off the doc next time I’m in.

Another factor is the meds I’m on, at least two of which have a warning label telling me that it “might make [me] drowsy.” These are not medications I can stop taking, they’re pretty much what’s keeping out of hospital and/or the ground. But I’m almost positive it’s not the meds, because I’ve been dragging ass since early childhood — long before I was on the more, ah, interesting medications, and while I was on freakin’ Ritalin, which is pretty much prescription meth, and… yeah. Nope. No energy. Lots and lots of jitters and anxiety and upset tummies and temper tantrums, though.

Throw in depression, ADD, chronic pain, Cerebral Palsy, and insomnia, and the fact that I have to consciously focus in order to block out the sensory input that most people just… ignore without effort (like the fact that your shirt is touching your skin) — and that last one takes a lot of fucking effort and concentration.

At this point, I’m not sure I even care* what the cause is — I’m just so damn tired of being tired.

The temper tantrums/meltdowns were — and still are — caused by exhaustion and over-stimulation. I am utterly unable to engage my rational mind when I’m in that state. I’ve gotten better at communicating my need for space/quiet, but there are still times when I just kinda… go boom. I don’t like it, because it makes everyone* unhappy.

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:22 am

Toc has been doing better it seems. Less skittish and actually trying to get into my bed at night (Snip is playing gatekeeper, though, punting him from the bed when he jumps up on it.)

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:23 am

These are for carlie. This is your present, from me, and to everyone else on the abortion thread (yes, Tony @366 on that thread, you can put it on a t-shirt).
Art critics, I admit, I haven’t done a drawing in years but the image induced by carlie was just too good. Thank you, for that.

Giliell
I hope you get better fastfastfast! warmteaandlozenges

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:42 am

Katherine
That sounds like good news!

WMDKitty
I wish I could lend you some of the spoons I seem to have recovered today.

+++

Some cute links (in my opinion):
Have these manatees been here before?
A scientific proposal…

carlie:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:45 am

rq, those are magnificent! :)

Hi Audley!!!!!

Nick, congrats on the research!

Giliell, hope things get better soon.

Good news, Katherine. Is Toc taking his medicine well?

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:48 am

@Carlie:

He actually ate the pill without my hiding it in his food this morning. I have to still figure out how to keep Snip away from it when I give it to him. Of course, he was upset cause he thought Toc was getting a treat XD Poor baby probably thinks he’s being replaced. Completely silly, given the fact Snip is usually asleep on my bed, and I’ll let him curl up on my lap while I’m playing games on the computer. Snip’s mah baybee. Toc’s Snip’s brother.

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 6:49 am

carlie
I can mail you the original, if you like. Or something. ;)

theophontes (坏蛋):

February 25th, 2013 at 7:25 am

[new cult]

Actually many of you will have heard of this group before…

The strange advert I found is here: The Standard (page 15)

The site I linked to before is run by huwenshia of
Guishan, Taoyuan County, in North East Taiwan

Also runs kingdomsalvation.org

On the same address has “dongli” running hidden-advent.org (going back to 2005).

Also check out:

Quasi-Christian religious group the Church of the Almighty God accused of spreading rumours that world will end on Friday [Ed: 21Dec 2012]

Link

Or Chinese report:

China’s “Almighty God” Rises with Threat of Apocalypse

Link in English.

They are also known as “Eastern Lightning”. Link to xtian report (interesting how clearly xtians see the the bullshit of other sects)

…

For many years we have had Falun Gng advertising with gruesome signage in Hong Kong, particularly around the Kowloon ferry terminal. Nowadays I have seen everything replaced with endless signage denouncing the same group. (image) There is no shortage of cults here.

theophontes (坏蛋):

February 25th, 2013 at 7:39 am

North East North West

Ibis3, Let's burn some bridges:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:44 am

Just dropped by to see rq’s gift for carlie and read the whole thread (backwards)–at 85 posts it was kinda manageable.

@rq did you ever have a chance to try any of the bread recipes? If you did, hope they turned out okay.

@Crudely Wrott There was a story on Hockey Day in Canada a couple of weeks ago that might be of interest to you. It’s about a boy with autism on a peewee hockey team in Vancouver. http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/video/#id=2333486292 (Hope the video is accessible to non-Canadians.)

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:54 am

Ibis3
No, moving + flu (whole family) = not much time for recipes. :/ I do have them saved, however, and seeing as how the whole family’s feeling a bit more alive this week, I hope to give at least one a try in a couple of days! I will, of course, let you know how it all turns out (by that I mean I’ll leave a note here in the Lounge ;) ).

Ogvorbis:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:35 am

Good morning, all.

Depressed. Tired. Feeling like shit. Feeling selfish. Not good. Bad nightmares. I hope that y’all are having a better day.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 25th, 2013 at 9:41 am

Good morning, everyone!

Hugs to Ogs.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:56 am

Good afternoon all
I have no idea what rq’s drawing refers to, so I better look what I’ve missed since yesterday.

Ogvorbis, hugs

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:08 am

…falls over laughing

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 25th, 2013 at 10:13 am

Beatrice:
Depending on your mood, you may want to avoid the Canadian abortion poll thread.

Ogvorbis:
Awww, that sucks my friend. Much sympathy and well wishes and hugs from me.

Ibis3, Let's burn some bridges:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:18 am

No pressure, rq. Please don’t feel obliged to try the recipes at all if you don’t feel inclined or don’t have the opportunity or whatever. (Ever notice that no matter how sincere one is about saying such things, it always comes off as some kind of passive aggressive snark? Sigh.) I only occasionally check in on the Lounge thread so I wasn’t sure if you’d already left me a note here.

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:19 am

But Tony, then she won’t understand the hedgehog! :)

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:20 am

Ibis3
It’s ok, I won’t feel bad if I only get a chance to try them 20 years from now. ;)

+++

By the way, has anyone heard from FossilFishy lately regarding the house and/or bushfire?

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:21 am

HUGS for Oggie. So sorry you had a terrible night.

-`-`-`-`-`

This Monday is being Mondayish. But, I stopped for coffee at my favorite spot. Their flavored brew of the day is “Highlander Grog.” :D I wasn’t sure what to expect but it is pretty tasty.

`-`-`-`-`

Much love to all, I have a mountain of stressors today and have to get back to it.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:24 am

Tony,

I’m good for now. All of you were doing a great job there, and ..well.. I’m skipping travis’ comments and just reading the replies. It makes me less ragey.

glodson:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:34 am

I’m re-reading the mess left in the Canadian Abortion thread. Those comments that looked stupid when I was drunk look even stupider now that I’m sober.

Let’s invent hypothetical situations so that I can make an argument as to a specific time when I can rob a woman of her autonomy over her own body! That always sounds like a really good idea.

Shit, I better leave a note that I was being sarcastic, as that seems to be a rather decent summary for the point a few people were trying to make in that thread.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:35 am

I got to the “if I had had children I wish the first one would have been a daughter because a daughter is always there for her dad” bit by brubakerknows.

barf

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:39 am

Beatrice
That one made me barf, too – especially since it was said as a matter of fact, without a trace of irony or sarcasm or self-awareness. And as a daughter, I resent the implication that I should be, by default, stuck caring for the elderly parents (although it does happen, mostly because I have children so that automatically makes me more likely to care, right), and that my brothers shouldn’t even be considered candidates.

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:40 am

Oh and later he also casually mentions that he got to do all the easy jobs – like mowing the lawn and stuff – for his parents, while his sisters did the difficult stuff, and never once mentions that he even tried to help them.

glodson:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:40 am

It is good to know that brubakerknows wants a daughter because it will be a greater benefit to him later on down the road.

I know I am devoted to my daughter in the hopes that she’ll grow up and be there for me.

…

Wait, no. I’m devoted to my daughter because she is my child and I want to do the best I can for her, and hope she grows up as an independent woman who is able to talk to her father about anything, and will always know that her father will do his best to help her through life which is why I feel it is my duty to understand gender issues now so that I can be a decent guide for her later as she grows into adulthood, and even beyond.

Lynna, OM:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:55 am

No doubt you have been hearing the new Republican meme on news programs, namely that the sequester was all Obama’s idea, and that Republicans gave him the tax revenue he wanted, so to hell with Obama — he is at fault, he is to blame, and he will not compromise, etc.

Even veteran journalist Bob Woodward has jumped on this rickety bandwagon. Woodward is wrong.

…Tim Noah argued that the White House came up with the sequestration policy “in roughly the same sense that it was Charles Lindbergh’s bad idea eight decades ago to fork over the equivalent in today’s dollars of $840,000 to a German-born carpenter named Bruno Hauptmann…. The sequester was a ransom payment.” Noam Scheiber added that saying the sequester was Obama’s idea is “like saying it was your idea to give wallet to mugger when he said, ‘Your money or your life.’”

Republicans were threatening to crash the economy on purpose and Obama was scrambling to satisfy their demands before GOP lawmakers pulled the trigger and shot the hostage (which is to say, shot us). The sequester then became part of the plan that Republicans proceeded to vote for and brag about, before they came up with the “this is all Obama’s fault” talking point in the hopes of winning a bizarre public-relations fight.

After Republicans created a crisis, both sides created the sequester, and both sides now consider it dangerous. The point that matters, even if Very Serious People in Washington are reluctant to acknowledge it, is that only one side is prepared to compromise to resolve the problem.

Which leads us to Woodward’s second, and more dramatic, error.

For the Washington Post legend, Obama is “moving the goal posts,” since everyone realized in the summer of 2011 that the sequestration cuts were supposed to be replaced with a different set of cuts — and no new revenue. It’s unfair, Woodward argues, for the White House to suddenly expect a balanced compromise when that was never part of the original plan.

Woodward is plainly, demonstrably wrong. It’s not a matter of opinion and it’s not an answer found in a fuzzy gray area in which both sides have a credible claim.

When the Budget Control Act became law to end the Republicans’ debt-ceiling crisis in 2011, a “super-committee” was created to find an alternative to the sequester. Was the committee’s mandate to find a cuts-only policy? Of course not — even Republicans accepted the fact that some revenue would be part of a solution. President Obama, when signing the BCA, explicitly said, “You can’t close the deficit with just spending cuts…. It also means reforming our tax code so that the wealthiest Americans and biggest corporations pay their fair share.’”

Brian Beutler added that Woodward “is just dead wrong.”…

Lynna, OM:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:57 am

Does Bob Woodward have early alzheimer’s disease?

…after learning of the criticism, Woodward emailed Politico’s Mike Allen with a defense that made matters worse, flubbing several key, basic details, suggesting he’s even more confused about the debate than was evident from his mistaken op-ed.

cicely:

February 25th, 2013 at 11:28 am

hugs and sympathy for broboxley.
-
Katherine Lorraine: Glad to hear that Toc is doing better…and may you awaken one night to two kittehs on your bed, curled up together.
:)
-
hugs for Ogvorbis. And bacon (which somehow, first try, came out ibacon. Cyberbacon vs. imaginary bacon: which one is crispier?).
-

By the way, has anyone heard from FossilFishy lately regarding the house and/or bushfire?

An excellent question.
begins worrying
-

And as a daughter, I resent the implication that I should be, by default, stuck caring for the elderly parents (although it does happen, mostly because I have children so that automatically makes me more likely to care, right), and that my brothers shouldn’t even be considered candidates.

Waitwaitwait. I thought that the rationale behind selectively aborting female fetuses was that a son would stay with the family and support his aging parents (with his wife doing the icky, physical parts, natch!), while a daughter requires a hefty bribe for some man to take her off your hands a dowry, and any resources you put into her upbringing (education, for instance) are wasted.

Which is it?
-

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 11:36 am

cicely, it’s this.
As for daughers-in-law, well, common knowledge rumour has it that, should the daughter-in-law, whose Husband is the only Child With Offspring, not fit into the general family dynamic (that is, she disobeys the patriarchal Matriarch), the actual daughter will care for ailing parents, even though all will make more demands of travel and aid of the (only) Childful Couple in the family, because Children Make You Care More and Better.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 11:38 am

rq
I’m not to the relevant comment in that thread yet, but I love the drawing :)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 25th, 2013 at 11:39 am

I’m too sick to participate today… but yay for Toc feeling better, and I’m worried about FossilFishy too.

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 25th, 2013 at 11:59 am

(Incidentally, fuck Mondays.)
-
hugs for iJoe, with plenty over to share with BossNurse, if needed. If not, save the excess against future need.
-

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:30 pm

Blearg.

Went to bed last night feeling mostly human.

Woke up today with a head full of fog. Ate something. Quickly concluded this was a bad idea.

Went to work anyway. Got Work Done.™

Am now back home, sipping tea.

Today can be summarized as me saying that I’m grateful that I managed to not pass out either at work, or while driving.

—
hugs for Oggie.

—
Crudely Wrott, plz to be checkin ur emailz.

UnknownEric is just a spudboy, looking for a quantum tomato.:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:35 pm

But Tony, then she won’t understand the hedgehog! :)

Well, you were the one who understood the tennis ball…

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 25th, 2013 at 12:38 pm

Yes, my white-port-and-stilton mac and cheese is better with more of the alcohol evaporated out of it. Somewhat surprisingly. O.o

michaelbusch:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:43 pm

At the risk that providing you all with a new chew toy would be better posted in Thunderdome:

I’ve been working a bit with the organizers of an astrobiology-themed social network called S.A.G.A.N ( http://saganet.org/ ). They are basically trying to use Facebook to organize various science outreach programs.

On March 5, S.A.G.A.N. will be hosting a webcast Q&A with Paul Davies, who has done important work in cosmology and theoretical physics but has also been associated with some dubious ideas. In increasing order of wooishness: panspermia in the form of life coming to the early Earth from Mars via meteorites, the arsenic-based life debacle, and the suggestion that origin of life would be understood through information theory rather than chemistry.

Davies has also made some rather outrageous statements with a theological bent. In particular, he asserted “the faith scientists have in the immutability of physical laws has origins in Christian theology” and “the claim that science is free of faith is manifestly bogus”. For that Jerry Coyne, Sean Carroll, and PZ all jumped on him; while the Templeton Foundation praised him.

In the interest of increasing S.A.G.A.N.’s traffic, I invite the Horde to ask Davies annoying questions.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:48 pm

I saw bits and pieces about the Oscars. Mostly sexist bits and pieces, like the opening number called “We saw your boobs”. There’s a close-up of Charlize Theron looking like she wants to kill someone Seth MacFarlane, and Naomi Watts looking frozen horrified, while their names were listed.

Wtf?

Lynna, OM:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:49 pm

Owlmirror @55: thanks for posting that summary. I saw the research earlier, but have never posted about it.

One more proof that Joseph Smith was a scam artist. It certainly puts a large hole in the mormon argument that there was no way the relatively uneducated Smith could have written such a marvelous work of literary excellence. (Quite apart from the fact that a majority mormons also prove with that argument that they know fuck all about literary excellence.)

On another subject, Rand Paul has failed at reading comprehension and at science … again.

Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) offers another fun example.

On Fox News on Thursday night, Paul said the military has spent $5.2 million studying goldfish and advocated yanking funding for such programs to cut the budget.

“In the military they have $5.2 million they spent on goldfish — studying goldfish to see how democratic they were and if we could learn about democracy from goldfish,” Paul said on Fox. “I would give the president the authority to go ahead and cut all $5 million in goldfish studies.”

At first blush, Paul sounds like he has a point, right? If policymakers are looking for funding to cut, $5.2 million to “learn about democracy from goldfish” seems excessive, at least at first blush.

But Princeton science professor Iain Couzin filled in some of the gaps to Poltico: “[Paul] got the funding wrong and the species wrong, and he misrepresents the work we’ve done.”

Apparently, the research has nothing to do with learning about “democracy” from goldfish — they’re not even goldfish — but rather, is intended to “lead to advances in technology for robots that work on deep sea oil spills and radioactive leaks.”

Couzin said the research has “direct applications to human security,” adding, “Perhaps Sen. Paul should read our papers before he comments on them and perhaps he should consider more broadly how science can help society.”…

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2013/02/25/17088176-rand-pauls-failed-fish-tale

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/02/scientist-guts-rand-paul-on-fish-study-87964.html?hp=r5

michaelbusch:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:51 pm

@Giliell @70:

I was wondering, since Singalese isn’t a usual English name for any language – although that it is used in a few other languages to refer to Sinhala (spoken by 16 million people, mostly in Sri Lanka). My Tamil-speaking friends tell me that Sinhala is hard for them, since while it has a lot of Tamil loanwords and a similar grammar, it is loaded with material lifted from three or four other languages.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 25th, 2013 at 12:53 pm

What makes them think that Senator Paul can read?

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 25th, 2013 at 12:54 pm

Couzin said the research has “direct applications to human security,” adding, “Perhaps Sen. Paul should read our papers before he comments on them and perhaps he should consider more broadly how science can help society.”…

And perhaps the moon is made of delicious toffee.
(In tones of Disgruntlement With It All.)
-

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 12:58 pm

http://www.buzzfeed.com/hillaryreinsberg/sexist-things-at-the-oscars
Wow, what a fun show.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:08 pm

…I learned a bit of trivia today.

The common name for thiamine deficiency, beriberi, is derived from the Sinhalese word beri “I can’t!”

That is, people suffering from beriberi would be asked to stand, they’d attempt to, fail, and say this. And thus the origin of the term.

Pardon me, I’m going to go cry.

broboxley OT:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:09 pm

I would settle for lawmakers to just read the crap they pass BEFORE they vote on it. Bad enuff they let the corporations write the bills

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

@Beatrice:

Color me surprised! Seth McFarlane was the host of the Oscars and was a complete asshole?!

Don’t you know, though, he was the Humanist of the Year a few years ago. We should all learn to be more like he is, we should aspire to be a humanist like him.

Ibis3, Let's burn some bridges:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:20 pm

@Beatrice YES! I watched the Oscars and it seemed like it was 90% sexist jokes with about 10% racist jokes thrown in for good measure. The bit about the Boobs song (ugh, I say as I type that) –there was a framing set up that you might have missed. They had Bill Shatner as Captain Kirk come from the future and tell Seth McFarlane how horribly received he would be (worst Oscars ever) for all his tasteless (i.e. sexist) jokes. He says, like what, and then “Kirk” runs the clip of the song, along with the reactions from Theron etc. In other words, they knew how awful and sexist it was, but put it out anyway with a big sign saying “this is just a joke, so you can’t get mad at us for real”.

In addition to the examples in your BuzzFeed link, there was also a skit with Sally Field where Seth McFarlane meets her in the Green Room and sexually harasses her (going on and on about how hot she was as the Flying Nun even after she tells him that he’s making her uncomfortable), which eventually succeeds in “seducing her” and they leave together after a passionate kiss (also after a dig at Adele who is supposedly busy “shouting” (I think that’s the word he uses, but I don’t recall) so no one will notice them leaving).

As far as sexist crap, I really do think it was the worst Oscars I’ve ever watched.

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:21 pm

Beatrice
I’m glad I did not watch them (Oscars). They should get a decent host, for once.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:29 pm

Ibis3,
You’re right, I didn’t know about the part with Shatner. His participation makes me sad.

Ibis3, Let's burn some bridges:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:32 pm

Can I also say how much the comments on the BuzzFeed article make it even worse? All those people condoning it because it’s oh so funny and he made fun of men too and the women were in on it so take out your tampon and get a sense of humour or think of poor Dear Muslima. It makes me feel like we’re never going to make any progress and women will be ground down forever.

jackiepaper:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:33 pm

Glad I missed it. We watched a few episodes of community instead.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

hugs for Ogvorbis and other who need them

@Oscars:
Makes me glad I avoided them like usual. I generally hate watching ceremonies like that anyway, even when they’re well done.

carlie:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:39 pm

We watched a few episodes of community instead.

Oh sure, go and make me depressed. pout It’s just not right any more, is what it is. It’s just not right.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:39 pm

Wow. I am also glad I skipped the Oscars. I was invited to watch them with a friend who likes to make sexist jokes and is totally unreceptive to my perspective on those things, so I’m glad I saved myself the stress.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:42 pm

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/closeread/2013/02/seth-macfarlane-and-the-oscars-hostile-ugly-sexist-night.html

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

I didn’t know about Sally Field either.
I’m sure the problem was her lack of humor.
/sarcasm

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

Form Portia’s link:

Getting Charlize Theron and Naomi Watts to pre-record looks of mortification didn’t help, either. (It was hard to tell watching at home, unless you were keeping track of what each woman was wearing, that these weren’t live shots.) It just seemed like a way for MacFarlane to make fun of viewers for being prudish and not “getting it.” (See, the cool girls think that it’s funny!)

Oh.

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

carlie:

Is something going on with the ongoing saga that is Community again?

Ogvorbis:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:49 pm

Thanks to all for hugs.

TRIGGER WARNING

I’m kicking myself because of a comment made on another thread. About the other boys knowing what a particular boy scout leader was doing. So now I am wondering — did they know? were they thankful it wasn’t them? did they not know? and, most important, why did I not even think about the boys who were not chosen? Shit. I’m depressed (again). I’m feeling guilty about my selfishness (which is new). How the fuck can ~2 years fuck up an entire life?

Sorry about dumping here.

Rip Steakface:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

Went on a trip this weekend for jazz band. While on the bus out to the place (long ride, ~8 hours), someone took out some speakers and played this song. It’s a calm, understated hip-hop song with lyrics passionately promoting gay rights… and it’s beautiful. Even if you think hip-hop is the worst thing to happen to music since the last terrible thing you think happened, listen to that damn song.

carlie:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

Parrowing – new season turning out to be not quite right, as predicted. Hopefully it will get better.

The Oscars – I let my 13 year old watch it for the first time – he was really excited about the animation awards. I wasn’t in the room. Now I”ve seen the video of the opening number, and I feel sick. This is what he saw as the paragon of movies?

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:57 pm

Ogvorbis,

more hugs

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 25th, 2013 at 1:58 pm

That’s pretty much the response I got from any time I questioned Seth McFarlane’s sexism, racism, homophobia, and transphobia – “it’s just a joke.”

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:07 pm

Thanks, carlie. I thought maybe it had been stopped abruptly again. I’ve been feeling that way about this season so far, too. :-/

*

Thanks for the book rec, Giliell. It’s going on my list.

*

Hugs for Ogvorbis

*

I can’t count how many times people have tried to convince me that if I just sit down and watch a season of Family Guy, I’ll enjoy it. I’ve probably seen about a season’s worth just in passing (and I’ve sat through the occasional episode to appease whoever was trying to convince me), and I have never ever regretted my decision to not seek it out. Also happy I didn’t watch the Oscars last night.

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

@Parrowing:

There are very few funny jokes in Family Guy. Most of it is overused nonsequitur references to pop culture (the main arc of the show probably fills five minutes of the show,) and the aforementioned sexism, racism, homophobia, and transphobia.

Beatrice:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:14 pm

I have never seen an episode of Family Guy. No loss, I see.

rq:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:24 pm

Nope, Beatrice, no loss.

glodson:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:33 pm

At one point, very early on, Family Guy seemed to make jokes at the expense of sexism and homophobic remarks. But then they realized that the asshole market was quite large and making sexist and homophobic jokes were just easier, so that happened.

I’ve stopped watching altogether. I’ve come to realize that Macfarlene is a hack, and I shocked that his Nazi joke at the Oscar announcements didn’t raise more eyebrows.

glodson:

February 25th, 2013 at 2:47 pm

I just read the articles linked about the Oscars. I am so happy that I didn’t watch. What a bunch of crap. I was being kind when I called Macfarlene a hack.

Sexist and racist, what an entitled douchebag.

broboxley OT:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:17 pm

missed the oscars, dont watch them, rarely if ever do I watch the movies associated with them. Sounds like I didn’t miss a thing. However from the comments, maybe lenny bruce isn’t as funny as I thought he was

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:23 pm

AAARGH AAARGH AAARGH!!! I procrastinate for a weekend, then decide to pop in here to dump a few links so I can close the tabs this computer can’t deal with in the long run, so I can work better – and I find that there are several highly interesting discussions going on!!!

So:

Opinion 20: Esperanto is rubbish – for rather technical reasons! A long, very interesting, and very entertaining read; when you’re done, read or at least skim the Wikipedia article on Esperanto phonology.

Opinion 16: English spelling doesn’t need a reform – it needs a bloody revolution! A much shorter article about real and imagined problems with reforming the English spelling system, which follows rules over 85 % of the time !!

Also:

The Bad Men Project

And sterile Internet hugs to Giliell and family.

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:33 pm

Link dump, all from Jadehawk on Twitter:

in Soviet Russia, steam punks YOU!

Someone climbed up a chimney and stayed there for a few days. And now Electricité de France sues them for millions. o_O Petition.

itteh bitteh diversiteh committeh ^_^ squee

Kickstarter project: Grieving for the Living: Effects of Disownment in Adulthood – going to be a book.

michaelbusch:

February 25th, 2013 at 3:56 pm

Another matter:

The news informs me that only ~50% of Russians polled by the Moscow-based Novye Izvestia paper “believe that the Chelyabinsk bolide was caused by a meteor”. The remainder make claims that span all manners of nonsense: US weapons test, Russian weapons test, message from God (echoing a Chelyabinsk-based Orthodox cleric), a UFO, and a deadly space virus. Other outlets have polled different samples of the population, but find either a slight majority or a large minority of denialists.

And all this when the thing was recorded from dozens of different cameras, so that you can track its trajectory by watching the fraction of them that were uploaded to Youtube, and when anyone can go over to Lake Chebarkul and search likely spots for pieces.

triskelethecat:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:23 pm

Haven’t been here for a while, but this is just a dump and run. I’ll try to be back later!

Don’t know if this will fit anyone but if you’re jobhunting and want to be in Ohio…. there are worse states.

http://tinyurl.com/b8t4vzm

Menyambal --- son of a son of a bachelor:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:24 pm

Rip Steakface, thanks for the song link.

Family Guy is only watched by the snarly-jerk teen of this extended family, the fan of messed-up people and folks getting hurt. I do find some few bits amusing, but those parts seem to be followed by a minute of inaction, as if they are waiting for the audience to get the joke, or maybe to laugh at the uncomfortable pause (or maybe just padding-out the show).

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:42 pm

“Sauropod heads are essentially all mouth. The jaw joint is at the very back of the skull, and they didn’t have cheeks, so they came pretty close to having Pac Man-Cookie Monster flip-top heads,” researcher Mathew Wedel at the Western University of Health Sciences in Pomona, Calif., told LiveScience.

And it’s not just Matt Wedel. This is how people who work on sauropods talk. Because sauropods are so awesome!

More petitions and fundraisers:

NRA members mostly support the ban on assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, but the leadership doesn’t, and therefore Sen. McConnell (R-KY) doesn’t either. There’s a petition to him to reconsider, and there’s an ad with a hunter saying he’d be a bad hunter if he needed that kind of weaponry that will be aired in KY if enough people donate.

A pipeline is planned through British Columbia to bring natural gas from fracking to the sea. It seems like the people who live there weren’t really informed much, let alone asked what they think about it. They’ve been protesting on site for a long time now and would like to keep that up.

Michele Fucking Bachmann is on the House Intelligence Committee. Off with her!

Petition to “[s]upport Support the Private Student Loan Bankruptcy Fairness Act, which is common sense legislation that would treat privately issued student loans the same as other types of private debt in bankruptcy, providing much needed relief and consumer protections to college students and recent graduates who are struggling with excessive debt.” Requires a 5-digit ZIP code. Go, Chris Gibson!

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:46 pm

And all this when the thing was recorded from dozens of different cameras, so that you can track its trajectory by watching the fraction of them that were uploaded to Youtube, and when anyone can go over to Lake Chebarkul and search likely spots for pieces.

Well, that happens when people aren’t used to the fact that lumps of steel fall from the sky, but are used to the government not telling them the whole truth about pretty much anything.

(…Yeah, it’s not really steel, but…)

Lynna, OM:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:54 pm

Hi, David M. [waves] Are you still living in Paris?

michaelbusch:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:54 pm

@David:

I get some of the motivations, but this isn’t just a question of mistrusting the Russian government – it’s a question of mistrusting everyone who was injured by the shockwave, who had a dash cam attached to their car that happened to be looking in the right direction, or who has picked up the pieces. Plus everyone with an infrasound microphone array and the weather satellites that all saw the bolide go down.

Like with the moon landing denialists or the UFO enthusiasts, I must conclude that at for a significant fraction of the population evidence has ceased to be relevant.

But perhaps I speak from a privileged position. I am quite aware of what falls from the sky and how often it falls.

Lynna, OM:

February 25th, 2013 at 4:58 pm

David M. @148

Kickstarter project: Grieving for the Living: Effects of Disownment in Adulthood – going to be a book.

I should point some ex-mormons to that kickstarter project. The fit is almost uncanny.

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 5:05 pm

From last subthread:

One of the problems people discovered when trying to speak Esperanto early on was the lack of swear words. How do you import obscenities into a brand-new language?

Interesting. Esperanto does have a prefix and a suffix that both express contempt…

Anyway, we’re stuck with English at least for the next couple of generations, but it’s interesting to imagine what language people would really be speaking on the Starship Enterprise in the 24th century, I think.

Two things are for sure:

1) English won’t stand still;

2) I’d expect there to be lots of Vulcan loanwords related to spacefaring. In Star Trek, there’s one, and that’s only in Enterprise where they retconned the “M-class planets” as “Minshara-class”.

michaelbusch:

February 25th, 2013 at 5:19 pm

@David:

I always assumed there was a Translation Convention in force for Star Trek. We don’t often hear aliens speaking in whatever language they’re actually using (except for occasional Klingon and Vulcan), but get everything in English / whatever dubbing has been done. Likewise, Federation Vernacular English (or whatever it is that Starfleet uses) was being translated into late-20th-century American English.

I may be starting to apply Fixer Fic to Star Trek, which the more serious trekkies I know say I am not allowed to do anymore. I once re-wrote the whole setting and came up with something like Schlock Mercenary instead.

vaiyt:

February 25th, 2013 at 5:36 pm

More dealing with the diploma business.

I’m trying to keep the negativity under control with help of my online friends and gaming… which brings out guilt for spending too much time in front of the computer -_-;

Thanks for all that offered hugs in the meantime. I’ll work on proper thanks when and if I get out of this.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 25th, 2013 at 5:39 pm

Food stamps for pets?
“When man falls on hard times, what’s his best friend to do?
A new donation-based program called Pet Food Stamps aims to provide food stamps for pets of low-income families and for food stamp recipients who otherwise could not afford to feed their pets, reported ABC affiliate KVIA in Las Cruces, N.M.
Based in New York, the program is open to anyone in the United States. More than 45,000 pets have already been signed up in the past two weeks, according to the program’s founder and executive director Marc Okon. Once need and income is verified, the families will receive pet food each month from pet food retailer Pet Food Direct for a six-month period.
“We’re not looking for government funding at this point,” Okon told ABCNews.com. “Should the government be willing to provide assistance further down the line, we will look into it.”
The only way to apply for the program is through an online application, but Okon said applications would be accepted through mail once the program moved to its new office.

ck:

February 25th, 2013 at 7:20 pm

David Marjanović wrote:

Petition to “[s]upport Support the Private Student Loan Bankruptcy Fairness Act, which is common sense legislation that would treat privately issued student loans the same as other types of private debt in bankruptcy

Wasn’t it just a few years ago that the law was changed to specifically exclude private student loans from bankruptcy forgiveness? The excuse was that it had to be excluded because of massive fraud by those who would take them, and then declare bankruptcy immediately after college was complete to avoid paying back their loans. I’m increasingly suspect of those who claim massive fraud these days, though.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion) wrote:

A new donation-based program called Pet Food Stamps aims to provide food stamps for pets of low-income families

Uhg.. Frankly, food stamps is a bad idea for humans, let alone pets. Let the charity recipients spend their ‘gift’ on whatever they please without someone else acting as a paternalistic gatekeeper for the money.

broboxley OT:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:06 pm

ck #161 even worse, if you have a drug conviction, no food for you, go steal if you are broke and hungry

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:14 pm

Hi, David M. [waves] Are you still living in Paris?

wave :-) No, I started my second year here in Berlin a few weeks ago. My first postdoc! Before that, I spent a year at home in Vienna.

I get some of the motivations, but this isn’t just a question of mistrusting the Russian government – it’s a question of mistrusting everyone who was injured by the shockwave, who had a dash cam attached to their car that happened to be looking in the right direction, or who has picked up the pieces. Plus everyone with an infrasound microphone array and the weather satellites that all saw the bolide go down.

Of course. That’s part “they’re probably in on it”, part not thinking it through.

Likewise, Federation Vernacular English (or whatever it is that Starfleet uses) was being translated into late-20th-century American English.

lightbulb moment Makes sense… though we do get exposed to plenty of new words for new concepts, like “tricorder” and “phaser”.

Wasn’t it just a few years ago that the law was changed to specifically exclude private student loans from bankruptcy forgiveness?

Yes, and that’s what the petition is against.

Accusations of massive fraud always make think they’re launched by people who’re trying to say “I’m an asshole, so everyone else must be, too”; but then, I think university should be financed by taxes in the first place… it’s an investment by Us the People.

Frankly, food stamps is a bad idea for humans

Quite. Over here, they were abolished for everyone as soon as the aftermath of WWII (die Nachkriegszeit, “the after-war time”) was largely over.

even worse, if you have a drug conviction, no food for you

Hooraaaaaaaaaay.

broboxley OT:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:18 pm

oh cheeze we are paying the uk back for benny hill
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2284237/Honey-Boo-Boo-goes-world-domination-reality-set-hit-Eastern-Europe.html
at least the gay uncle helps

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:49 pm

Peezus H Christ. I posted on fb about the Boobs song at the Oscars, and got this from a middle-aged white dude:

I just listened to the song…..and watched the reaction of some of the individuals…..one comment of reflection….don’t want someone commenting about that reality…..don’t consent to do that in a movie…..now for gender balance it might have been fitting to do a two part song….the second part dealing with male asses seen in the movies…..[it would be better to have him sing about penises...but can't do that as that changes the picture rating]….finally, I understand he is offensive and to anticipate less during the show is naive…..

…wut. This is from a gay man who posts about gay rights. I would never think of calling him naive for calling out homophobic crap. I don’t even…

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 25th, 2013 at 8:51 pm

itteh bitteh diversiteh committeh ^_^ squee

sqeee!
-

[...]and a deadly space virus.

I dunno; that strikes me as a bit big for a virus…ST:TOS giant space amoebae aside.
-
triskelethecat!
pouncehug
-
Good news! Nephew-in-Law’s diagnosis: chemically-induced psychosis. Apparently he’d simply been on the muscle relaxant far too long (and this was among those options listed in the fine print under WARNINGS, and Side Effects).
-

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 25th, 2013 at 8:52 pm

hooray! for good news, cicely!!

Nutmeg:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:06 pm

confetti and sparklers for cicely’s good news!

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:07 pm

More catching-up…

English is not only the most commonly spoken language on the planet (someone correct me if I’m wrong), it is the lingua franca of science,

100 years ago, there were German, English, and French, more or less in that order, with the proportion of German apparently increasing. The motto of Stanford University, which was founded around that time, is in German.

Two world wars later, science was a US thing, because everyone else was too dead or too poor to invest serious money in science. (Oh, sure, there was the Soviet Union, but they were stewing in their own juices… and still are, because they got poorer and poorer.) So, practically all science was in English. Nowadays, the Chinese are beginning to flood the “market”, and there’s plenty of science published in Chinese – but because learning to read (let alone write) Chinese is so much harder than English unless maybe if you’re Japanese, and because English is so global already while Chinese is only of use in China, most Chinese scientists speak understandable English now.

the official language of aerial transport and flight control

US and UK out-investing everyone after WWII.

and it has more words than any other language.

1) Spoken by many people; 2) used right now in contexts where words are created (you mentioned science); 3) plenty of synonyms (often doublets where one synonym is of native origin and the other is from medieval Norman French); 4) quite some dialectal diversity, with words originally limited to one or a few dialects occasionally cropping up in the standard language.

Also, there’s the Oxford English Dictionary, which allows you to count the words fairly easily. Comparable historical dictionaries don’t exist for many languages. For German, one was made (by Jacob Grimm) in the late 19th century, but it’s only being updated now, a process that is taking decades.

It has, therefore, at least the potential of being more expressive and more precise than other languages.

In some fields, particularly science right now, yes. 200 years ago, English was seemingly hopeless in that regard, and French was more or less in that position.

sexy-times and snuggles — aaah. ^_^

:-) :-) :-)

Because I don’t know any other language that is that fucked up. I mean, Irish has a weird spelling system, but at least it’s regular.

Yep, the English spelling system is worse than French, worse than Tibetan, worse than Mongolian-in-the-Mongolian-alphabet… Irish does lots of weird things****, but yes, it is mostly regular.

* If you only know how to pronounce a French word, good luck guessing the spelling. But if you know the spelling, you can figure out the pronunciation with precision. The only exceptions are proper names and a few short common words.
Silent letters on both ends of words! Like… Double French!
* Spelled the way Genghis Khan pronounced it. Like English, Mongolian has changed a lot in the meantime; for instance there’s something very similar to the English silent gh. – Mongolian in the Cyrillic alphabet is a wonder of clarity, almost as clear as a Soviet alphabet can get.
**** How is “four men” spelled again? Ceathar fhear or something? I’m told it’s pronounced [kʲʰaraːr]. Like English silent gh on steroids.

If left to their own devices, they say it ‘theh’, with the ‘-eh’ kind of like the ‘ai-’ sound in ‘air’.

Yep. Turns out English words never end in /ɛ/, unless you count meh and feh – that’s quite unusual from a Standard Average European perspective.

My favorite bit of English-is-weird is the letter cluster ough.

Isn’t that part of an off the wall spelling of “fish” using some of the quirks of English?

The mentioned ghoti has occasionally been extended to ghotiugh, with ugh as in though.

Marc Okrand being the joking type, the Klingon word for “fish” is of course ghotI’, with all five letters of that word pronounced regularly: [ʁotʰɪʔ].

Often, English gh makes etymological sense; th-ou-gh corresponds 1 : 1 to German d-o-ch. But sometimes, as in ghost or ghastly, the h is completely spurious.

Endless thanks, Joe. Esteleth is an angel (I’ve said so before) and you are too. The Horde is made of loving concern. I’m gobsmacked and not sure how to handle it. Folks I only know through their written words are literally providing for my survival. My astonishment continues unabated.

dumps heap of hugs on the floor
goes to bed

David Marjanović:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:15 pm

quite some dialectal diversity, with words originally limited to one or a few dialects occasionally cropping up in the standard language

I mention this because any large German dictionary contains a few words that I, a fairly well-read holder of a doctorate, have never encountered before and that I can’t even guess the meaning of.

pharm scigrad:

February 25th, 2013 at 9:44 pm

Arrrrggghhh… I need someone to tell me this is as ridiculous as I think it is:

A change in our ‘perception’ will change our ‘reflection’. Light does not travel, it reflects itself giving the illusion of travel. — deep thought to ponder.

I swear, the stuff about how cancer was because your cell receptors felt your anger and your cancer DNA is exposed and blah blah was… whatever, I KNEW that was bogus, (and said as much in a PM to my friend) but this is just so, so… it makes me stutter. I don’t want to cause a flamewar on my friend’s wall, but she was the one who asked me to comment on her question in the first place and now I’ve got Mr. DeepThinker on there spouting off all this mess – it is taking a lot inner strength not to push caps lock and go Horde on him. Especially when there is someone else on there commenting that there is a lot of truth to what he is saying. ><

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:10 pm

Oh my Dog…

I have the flu AND the shits. I feel HORRIBLE. I could DIE!

On the other hand, do you know what happens when you actually bell a cat? The cat hears the bell, hates the bell, desperately wants to get away from the bell, and completely can’t get away from the bell. So the cat runs from room to room, under and over and around everything, before giving up and sitting perfectly, completely still.

ck:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:23 pm

pharm scigrad,

You could just try to out deepity him, by getting ridiculous fake quotes from a Deepak Chopra generator and posting them. And always remember, “Our consciousness is the continuity of ephemeral acceptance”, whatever that means.

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:25 pm

vaiyt-

Ugh, that’s completely horseshit and it sucks how universities always wait until the last minute to let you know about stuff like that. Hope you can work it out with the minimal amount of bullshit and life disruption! Hugs

cicely-

At least you now know what’s causing it, so the nephew-in-law can get back to feeling all right.

On Oscars-

Yeah, there seems to be a distinct strain of man who seems to be wanting to defend Seth MacFarlane’s hackneyed rote privileged old men’s club routine as some sort of great comedy that one could only complain about if one was a humorless feminist.

The problem about the defenses though is that they in no way resemble other defenses of legitimately challenging and daring comedy. No specific citing of which jokes in particular struck them as funniest or why those particular jokes were high comedy, but rather a bunch of “he was hilarious” and “I laughed at everything” with no real information other than defensiveness.

It’s almost enough to make you suspicious that they’re defending the sexism in general and are unwilling to stand up and admit that in public.

Impending Unemployment Update-

Just heard back from the summer job I applied for (and which I thought I interviewed pretty well for (I made the interviewer laugh a lot and was directly complimented several times by the interviewer)). I didn’t get the position and the rejection letter was a bit oddly phrased. Trying to not read anything into that as it was probably just a form rejection letter and an honest hiring decision on their part, but I’m starting to get a little bit worried about my employment chances with my not-passing body type and starting to wonder if I need to go back in the closet for the short-to-medium term just to become financially stable.

Fucking oppression, man. I really miss Denmark and its not giving a damn about my gender presentation awesomeness. And I miss not feeling paranoid all the damn time.

JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:25 pm

Jacob Schmidt,

Thank you for changing your nym and not making a thing about. While you may not have meant it to mean crazy, and I may have been the only one to bring it up here but there’s plenty of people who do use crayzz that way and there’s slang “cray-cray” for crazy as well. I really appreciate the change but I was just so uncomfortable I didn’t like using your username, which would have just been rude when talking to you.

Sorry I didn’t respond sooner. I ran away from that threat right after that because that douche’s “daughters are always there for their fathers” just pushed me too far. It brought up a lot of issues I had growing up.

Often I comment only because something compels me to yet I can’t follow through for long because those same things repulse me away. (You guys don’t repulse me, the douchenozzels spewing toxic shit do.) I hope that makes sense.

—

In awesome news today, I got a lot of great books from Pteryxx who kindly included a plastic Easter egg filled with jelly beans that Little One has named Nemo (because it was colored like Nemo). It totally made our day. =)

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:29 pm

pharm scigrad @171

But light does travel. It is both a particle and a wave, both of which have direction and temporal positions that we can actually track and visualize with nifty experiments (like using a surface of water to view how sound waves travel in a medium).

I mean, before we can get to the bizarre linguistics/physics bait and switch and everything else wrong with it, that’s the part that’s just jumping out at me from the get-go.

JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness:

February 25th, 2013 at 10:34 pm

Randomly from the bottom of the Thread since there’ no way to really catch up:

Endless thanks, Joe. Esteleth is an angel (I’ve said so before) and you are too. The Horde is made of loving concern. I’m gobsmacked and not sure how to handle it. Folks I only know through their written words are literally providing for my survival. My astonishment continues unabated.

QFMFT
Seriously, felt the same way when y’all saved me. Twice.

===========
==========
o.O
Thank god I didn’t watch the Oscars. I don’t like that kind of crap when it’s done well, this year just sounds like the worst ever and done on purpose. Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
=============
============
Cerberus from Time Forgot

Impending Unemployment Update-

Just heard back from the summer job I applied for (and which I thought I interviewed pretty well for (I made the interviewer laugh a lot and was directly complimented several times by the interviewer)). I didn’t get the position and the rejection letter was a bit oddly phrased. Trying to not read anything into that as it was probably just a form rejection letter and an honest hiring decision on their part, but I’m starting to get a little bit worried about my employment chances with my not-passing body type and starting to wonder if I need to go back in the closet for the short-to-medium term just to become financially stable.

Fucking oppression, man. I really miss Denmark and its not giving a damn about my gender presentation awesomeness. And I miss not feeling paranoid all the damn time.

Holy fuck, that sucks! I’m so sorry. =( hugs

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 25th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

Wait…light doesn’t travel?
Uhhh…light year?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 25th, 2013 at 11:57 pm

Monty Python meets J.R.R. Tolkien.

Fellowship of the Ring
The Two Towers
Return of the King

Illustrated with screencaps from the films, even!

Hekuni Cat, MQG:

February 26th, 2013 at 12:36 am

cicely – Yay! Good news for nephew-in-law.

Ogvorbis – hugs and chocolate

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:02 am

Good morning!
What’s the opposite of a Godwin…?

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:02 am

Uhg.. Frankly, food stamps is a bad idea for humans, let alone pets. Let the charity recipients spend their ‘gift’ on whatever they please without someone else acting as a paternalistic gatekeeper for the money.

As you noted, this is a charity. A charity with a gimmicky name. Unlike actual food stamps, it’s not tax money, so there’s no requirement for anyone to give. People donate to what moves them, and those who want to give money directly to people in poverty already have ways of doing so. The set of people who would give though a charity like this is not a subset of the people who would give directly. Therefore, these donations can either 1) satisfy your criteria for non-paternalism, or 2) occur at all. But not both.

pharm scigrad:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:01 am

ck – That is a rather brilliant idea, which made me laugh (a sorely needed laugh, I might add). Some random Chopra quote would probably be just the thing he was looking for out of me. Apparently my suggestion that we keep our modern, evidence-based approach to medical care while making changes to fix how it is delivered to patients and reimbursed by payors was much too myopic. He called me out directly, more on topic this time (regarding my comments on health care and pharmaceuticals versus natural/holistic alternatives) with a very long winded comment that began:

I agree with much of what you’ve said but encourage you to zoom out… make a paradigm shift and look at the entire picture from a birds eye.

><
*****
Cerberus from Time Forgot – I did take physics, but I can't say I particularly enjoyed it. I know light is both a particle and a wave – pretty damn sure it travels, sun being where it is and all, but it is always nice to have confirmation of that from people more sure of these things than I. Never took philosophy, even though I technically have a degree in it (pretty strange thing, come to think about it), so I've picked all that sort of unraveling of horrible argument from the internets. I'm very glad to know that my bullshit detector is functioning correctly. Thanks.
*
Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion) – LOL – Game. Set. Match. I think you win an internet for that. I don't know if I can give out internets, but if so, you get mine. :)

opposablethumbs:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:02 am

Cerberus, that is so shite :-( chocolate and wishes for a better outcome. .

Hugs to Ogvorbis – hope you’re feeling better????

It feels a little odd to say good news, cicely, but it really is, isn’t it. Hope the change of drug regime works well and soon.

John Morales:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:18 am

David,

Opinion 20: Esperanto is rubbish – for rather technical reasons! A long, very interesting, and very entertaining read; when you’re done, read or at least skim the Wikipedia article on Esperanto phonology.

Cripes!

A long, very interesting, and very entertaining read, indeed — but I wish I truly understood more than a small part of the technical stuff.

(I’m taking a break now, but I’m up to “F”)

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:04 am

INCOMING!

ducks out the way of an avalanche of assorted hugs, headbonks, shoulder-pats, and other gestures of comfort

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:09 am

Morning
Kid is slowly getting better, at least she got a good night of sleep, has eaten breakfast and is already fit enough to throw a tantrum when things don’t go her way.
Me, not so much.

iJoe
You can sit right next to me in the “feeling bad and being contagious” corner.

David

**** How is “four men” spelled again? Ceathar fhear or something? I’m told it’s pronounced [kʲʰaraːr]. Like English silent gh on steroids.

H mostly eclipses the sound before it, as in “Baile atha Cliath” (Dublin), except in the combination with bh and mh when it becomes “f” (dubh (black), Niamh).
What makes it really weird to learners is the way in which prepositions and stuff add letters which then eclipse other letters and stuff. So, “in Dublin” becomes “i mBaile atha Cliath” with the m eclipsing the B (maille). But that shit is regular and you can go from spelling to pronounciation (though vice versa is hard)

++++
Ahhh, capitalist economy. World’s largest chemical company makes record profit, stock dumps.

tbtabby:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:34 am

A challenge to all biologists: watch the Atop the Fourth Wall Review of Marville #4 and see how long it takes you to punch holes in drywall.

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:28 am

The doughty-faced ploughman from Scarbourough fell into a slough and coughed and hiccoughed. – Esteleth

Hmm, that repeats the “ow” sound three times, and misses some!

The rough-coated, dough-faced ploughman strode coughing and hiccoughing through Scarborough.

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:31 am

To those whose native language isn’t Indo-European, it’s no easier to learn or use than a dozen-odd natural pidgins and creoles, and there aren’t enough speakers of it to make it worth the bother for anyone trying to learn a useful second language. – Dalillama

I’m not sure that’s true, because there’s an international Esperanto community, mostly well-educated progressives, and I’m told many of them are ready to offer hospitality to fellow-Esperantists.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 4:59 am

Not only does light travel, it can be slowed down and stopped

rorschach:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:48 am

Hai! It’s not that I don’t love you anymore, I’m just busy. SO is here for a week, I have night shifts, and am generally enjoying myself…Talk soon.

Ogvorbis:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:46 am

Hugs to Ogvorbis – hope you’re feeling better????

Not really. Another shitty night. I thought I had achieved equilibrium, but I guess not.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 7:04 am

hugs for Ogvorbis.

richardh:

February 26th, 2013 at 7:40 am

pharm scigrad

A change in our ‘perception’ will change our ‘reflection’. Light does not travel, it reflects itself giving the illusion of travel. — deep thought to ponder.

Never mind the physics, you could start by pointing out the fallacy of equivocation. The “perception” and “reflection” in the first sentence are being used in some psychological sense. The “perception”of light is biological, its “reflection” is physics. Any connection between these meanings is coincidental. This “argument” is essentially isomorphic to the as-above-so-below woo-meme.

Oh, and the physics is nonsense too (trust me, I’m a physicist!). In classical physics, Maxwell’s equations combine to produce a wave equation; the uniqueness theorem allows us to construct Green’s functions which advance the solution in time; informally this can be represented as Huygens wavelets spreading from at every point on the wavefront. (The quantum explanation is left as an exercise for the reader…)
If you want deepity word-salad, you could say that the light propagates itself. There’s probably a bad agricultural metaphor lurking somewhere in there.

broboxley OT:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:07 am

A change in our ‘perception’ will change our ‘reflection’. Light does not travel, it reflects itself giving the illusion of travel. — deep thought to ponder.

if one does not have a reflection, does light cease to exist?

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:36 am

“Foudre makes the excellent point/sums it up with, “why hire a black model when you could just paint a white one!”"
http://jezebel.com/5986608/16+year+old-white-girl-poses-in-african-queen-editorial

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:37 am

Cerberus

Trying to not read anything into that as it was probably just a form rejection letter and an honest hiring decision on their part, but I’m starting to get a little bit worried about my employment chances with my not-passing body type and starting to wonder if I need to go back in the closet for the short-to-medium term just to become financially stable.
Fucking oppression, man. I really miss Denmark and its not giving a damn about my gender presentation awesomeness. And I miss not feeling paranoid all the damn time.

Damn, I can’t even say how much that sucks. I’m really sorry you have to deal with it.

JAL

In awesome news today, I got a lot of great books from Pteryxx who kindly included a plastic Easter egg filled with jelly beans that Little One has named Nemo (because it was colored like Nemo). It totally made our day. =)

:D :D :D

get well teddy bears and chocolate for Giliell and Joe

opposablethumbs:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:50 am

Not really. Another shitty night. I thought I had achieved equilibrium, but I guess not.

:-((((((
I’m really sorry to hear that. Two steps forward, one back? I can just barely, faintly imagine how hard this must be. I hope you get to another forward step really soon.

chigau (違う):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:58 am

I hafta go to work.
leaves a pile of hugs

Ogvorbis:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:59 am

I’m really sorry to hear that.

Thanks.

Two steps forward, one back?

Sometimes it feels like one step forward, three steps back. Three years ago, all I knew was that I didn’t like being in cub scouts. That was easier.

I can just barely, faintly imagine how hard this must be. I hope you get to another forward step really soon.

I swear my brain is spending all my waking and sleeping hours coming up with ways to tell me this is my fault. I joined scouts. I never said no. I never told. I abused others. I recruited others. And, most recently, I never even thought about whether or not the other scouts knew what was going on. Which makes no sense.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:00 am

It’s almost enough to make you suspicious that they’re defending the sexism in general and are unwilling to stand up and admit that in public.

Well put. Have a cuppa tea* for hitting the nail on the head like that.

Or treat of your preference.

dianne:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:00 am

Dropping in for a random rant. On the Catholic hospital thread, people mentioned doctors doing work arounds to get patients needed care in Catholic hospitals. I considered responding there, but decided that my rant was more general and so moved it to here. I hope you don’t mind. Anyway, here goes.

Work arounds are depressing as crap. No matter why they’re needed. Every single employee in a hospital should have the patients’ well being as their top priority. Not ideology, not making the biggest bonus, not providing the prettiest rooms and the yummiest food, not even complying with the law. The patients’ best interests should ALWAYS be the first priority. It’s nice if that matches your ideology, provides a big bonus, allows you time to worry about the tastiness of the food, and complies with all laws, but those are secondary issues. If we’re not here for the patients’ health, why are we here? So I find having to do things like appear to be trying to cut costs so that the dean can get a big bonus annoying and would find having to make complicated excuses to save a pregnant woman’s life soul destroying.

Why do we put up with this crap? When a high level hospital employee says, “You can’t keep taking uninsured patients, we won’t be able to make our bonuses” why isn’t that a career destroying statement? It should be. Why do we even consider allowing organizations that have as doctrine that certain people should be allowed to die when we could save them (gays with HIV, pregnant women in trouble) to have anything to do with hospitals? What’s wrong with people?

dianne:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:07 am

100 years ago, there were German, English, and French, more or less in that order, with the proportion of German apparently increasing.*

And then Germany let its anti-feminist right wing nuts into power. See what happens when you do that?

Matt Penfold:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:17 am

Dianne,

It is not even in for-profit healthcare systems that there are such problems.

A NHS trust (basically a part of the NHS that runs hospitals in a geographical area) was found to have so neglected patient care that the number of excess deaths may well have run into the hundreds. The reason for this neglect was that the trust managers put too much emphasis on meeting Government targets (on waiting times, cost savings etc) and too little on actually providing good care. Several other NHS trusts are now under investigation for similar occurrences.

(For those wanting to know more, google North Staffordshire NHS Trust).

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:26 am

Would it be more correct to say, “Her Majesty, the Queen of Sweden, Silvia” or “Her Majesty, Silvia, the Queen of Sweden”?
Is there a website for such protocol?
(Translating.)

glodson:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:33 am

A change in our ‘perception’ will change our ‘reflection’. Light does not travel, it reflects itself giving the illusion of travel. — deep thought to ponder.

Cubert J. Farnsworth: I understand how the engines work now. It came to me in a dream. The engines don’t move the ship at all. The ship stays where it is, and the engines move the universe around it.
Bender: That’s a complete load!
Cubert J. Farnsworth: Nothing’s a complete load! Not if you can imagine it. That’s what being a scientist is all about.

I think Chopra learned science from Professor Farnsworth and Cubert.

Matt Penfold:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:37 am

Would it be more correct to say, “Her Majesty, the Queen of Sweden, Silvia” or “Her Majesty, Silvia, the Queen of Sweden”?
Is there a website for such protocol?

I would go for the latter, but are you asking specifically about the Swedish royal family, or more generally ?

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:43 am

Matt
Specifically for her. Wikipedia says she’s styled Her Majesty The Queen, but I have to have the ‘of Sweden’ in there, plus her name.

Matt Penfold:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:47 am

RQ,

There is the official Swedish Royal Family site (link below) which calls her HM Queen Silvia. I might be inclined to go with HM Queen Silvia, the Queen of Sweden.

http://www.kungahuset.se/royalcourt/royalfamily/hmqueensilvia.4.396160511584257f2180001483.html

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:50 am

Thank you, Matt!

richardh:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:53 am

myself I’d drop the definite article, as the name makes it clear which one you mean, thus:

Her Majesty Queen Silvia of Sweden

but what do I know?

Lynna, OM:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:54 am

David M. @163

wave :-) No, I started my second year here in Berlin a few weeks ago. My first postdoc! Before that, I spent a year at home in Vienna.

Now I feel rude and stupid for not keeping up with you and your activities. [sad face] I’m only a little more than two years behind in the Pharyngula universe.

Happy smiles for the postdoc position!

I guess I could introduce you to my daughter, who admires your brilliance, the next time you travel to NYC. (She is married, so no sexual or romantic innuendo is intended.)

Matt Penfold:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:56 am

myself I’d drop the definite article, as the name makes it clear which one you mean, thus:

Her Majesty Queen Silvia of Sweden

but what do I know?

You could do that, but then you risk loosing making it clear what her official title is (HM Queen Silvia) as opposed to the qualification, which it makes it clear where she is queen of.

opposablethumbs:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:30 am

I swear my brain is spending all my waking and sleeping hours coming up with ways to tell me this is my fault.

I can see how that would happen. There must be a massive entanglement of guilt and denial-of-powerlessness and rage and fear and fsm-knows-what-all else going on at any number of different conscious and not-conscious levels. I know you’ve said that all this is staying on-line only for the present, but I’m glad to remember that you’ve also said you have rl options available should you decide at any point that you want ‘em. Keep remembering what people have said around here: you were a child and the abuser was a powerful adult; you’d never think of blaming that child if it were anyone else; he undoubtedly deliberately forced victims to feel complicit (feel, not be – it was an illusion, part of his manipulation) precisely so they could not report and would feel more tied to him, and his doing so was just another aspect of his abuse, his power-play. A ten-year-old child on the one hand – and on the other a “pillar of the community”, physically and psychologically powerful in that context at that time, an experienced abuser and manipulator, actively helped by another adult, backed up by a massive, respected organisation – I’m not seeing any choice for any of his child victims there, and no-one would. If that were any other ten-year-old you would know through and through that they were not to blame; now you just have to let yourself know it for this particular ten-year-old.
You’ve shown us in everything your online self does and says that you are a good person, Ogvorbis. He failed, remember. He failed to make you the least bit like him.
Dammit. I hate so much that this happened. Imma send you another e-hug anyway.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:31 am

Ah, royal protocol. I’m a peasant by descent, so I don’t even have a genetic gut feeling about how to say these things. ;)
I’m going to go with Matt‘s suggestion about Her Majesty Queen Silvia, with the ‘of Sweden’ qualifier following, even though it sounds clumsy (but official title…), but thank you for your much-nicer-sounding suggestion, richardh.

Nutmeg:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:54 am

Horde-sourcing some research, because I can’t for the life of me figure out search terms that give useful results:

I’m looking for examples of studies where an organism has to reach a certain size, weight, body condition, etc., before it can undergo another developmental process.

Is there a name for this that I don’t know, or particular magic search terms? Or does anyone have examples offhand? Vertebrate examples would be most useful but I’d be grateful for anything.

Thanks! Here is a pile of hugs and chocolate, and I will catch up with all of you later.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:56 am

Uhhh…light year? Yuck, those might have half the calories but the taste terrible. ::eye roll::

Light can be slowed, that is what makes lenses work (index of refraction in glass ≠ 1) and give us mirages (not miracles, stupid autocorrect) by bending light due to differential slowing. But I disagree that it can be stopped. I sort of remember when that result was being hyped, and while I can’t be arsed to look up my objections again, I do remember feeling that it was pretty bogus and a twisting of what was really going on to “wow” the layperson.

On the other hand, a semi-sensible deepity is that light in a vacuum experiences no time. This can be justified as a limit of the equations of special relativity. But, yes, light travels; no two ways about it. Trust me, I have a masters degree IN SCIENCE!

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:03 am

Ogvorbis-

I swear my brain is spending all my waking and sleeping hours coming up with ways to tell me this is my fault.

The worst thing about surviving things like that is the way the brain shifts and twists to stab again and again at our weakest points, coming up with horrifying fictions to lay us low, and make the scars fresh and bleeding again.

But it is always just that. Fictions. That voice is trying to create for you the illusion of control by crafting an unthinkable nightmare and there’s a dark comfort in that. If you just did X wrong or could have done Y better (and certainly, your brain argues, doesn’t everything have a Y that could have been done differently in the clarity of hindsight), then somehow this is a story that couldn’t happen again.

But there’s no X or Y that you could have changed with who you were walking in and who you were when you were trying to figure it out and survive it. The agency on your part was robbed from you by a cruel evil villain and all the blame is his and his alone. Did you do weird things around it? Only in the light of hindsight. I shook my rapists hands after he had done the deed. My brain still screeches to me about that and tries to wield it like a cudgel to rewrite and blame, but it does not change what did happen. Those scars, those flashbacks, those attempts at processing it in the direct chaos of unthinkable event, are all on the abuser who raped you, never you.

And I’m not telling you that because you don’t already know it, but because speaking as someone who has been going through something a hundredth as powerful in uncovering the seriousness of my own assault, I know it helps to hear it from someone who isn’t yourself.

You’re not Him. You’re not responsible for what He did to you. You were not personally responsible for stopping Him from continuing. You are not personally responsible for His existence.

He is. He will always be.

Good luck Ogvorbis, you will get through this. And if you ever need us as a sounding board to confirm that things your head says are the bullshit you suspect them of being, you can always do so and we can always be there for you.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:05 am

Actually, I think I misspoke. I’m pretty sure I met the requirements for a masters degree along the way to being a fully certified quantum mechanic, but you know, I don’t think I ever got a pretty piece of paper that would “prove” it. Hmmm.

Okay, I’m in deep avoidance mode from two work tasks that just make my brain want to squirm….

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:06 am

Okay, I’m in deep avoidance mode from two work tasks that just make my brain want to squirm….

Ooh, ooh, me too! I’ve started a corner of the Lounge for that. Have some tea.

thumper1990:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:07 am

@don’tpanic

Light can be slowed, that is what makes lenses work (index of refraction in glass ≠ 1) and give us mirages (not miracles, stupid autocorrect) by bending light due to differential slowing.

I’d be willing to bet at least some “miracles” have been caused by that phenomenom.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:23 am

I agree with much of what you’ve said but encourage you to zoom out… make a paradigm shift and look at the entire picture from a birds eye.

“…but I can’t see into the ultraviolet.”

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:28 am

thumper1990 @222

Yup. Probably many, but at least the myth of Brigadoon is created by a mirage effect called Fata Morgana where that bending light causes parts of land or castles out on the ends of peninsulas (where they were well guarded) could look, from far away, like castles floating in the sky.

Same with the Flying Dutchman and ships on the horizon. It’s the same principle that causes the mirage illusion of oases in the distance.

Nepenthe:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:43 am

Howdy.

Thanks to Portia, ck, JAL, Giliell, and anyone I may have forgotten for musing on my non-questions about dating.

I have no idea what’s going on in this thread, as I’ve been busy becoming smitten and reuniting with my kitteh, who is now out of both the woods and the bathroom.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:51 am

Azkyroth, I think I’d be more likely to try to view the material that started this sub-thread in the infrared.

For the non-physics nerds: moving away from things at high rate of speed shifts visible light from that object to the lower frequencies (red, infra-red, on out to radio waves), while moving towards them shifts to the blue (then ultraviolet and on up to gamma rays). All this as in: universe expanding, everything moving away from everything (as space itself expands, ala raisins on a balloon in the 2-D analog) means distant galaxies are “red shifted” (the further away, the more faster they’re moving away from us so the more shifted into the red do their spectra appear). /science-nerd

Portia, yes, thank you, tea would be lovely.

Ogvorbis:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:55 am

TRIGGER WARNING

Keep remembering what people have said around here: you were a child and the abuser was a powerful adult; you’d never think of blaming that child if it were anyone else; he undoubtedly deliberately forced victims to feel complicit (feel, not be – it was an illusion, part of his manipulation) precisely so they could not report and would feel more tied to him, and his doing so was just another aspect of his abuse, his power-play.

I do remember. And my mind is filled with what I did, not what he did. What I did to others, not what he did to me. When I treated others as objects (or forgot them, or set them up), not when he did the same to me.

You’ve shown us in everything your online self does and says that you are a good person, Ogvorbis.

Thanks. I appreciate that. Of course, I read it and the back of my mind says to me, ‘Damn. You really fooled them!’ Which I know is not true but there is a part of me that believes it.

If you just did X wrong or could have done Y better (and certainly, your brain argues, doesn’t everything have a Y that could have been done differently in the clarity of hindsight), then somehow this is a story that couldn’t happen again.

I think far less on what I could have done to protect me, or prevent me being hurt, as I do kicking myself that I didn’t do anything to protect them (them being fellow scouts who were abused, fellow scouts who were not abused (and no, I have no idea how that one makes any sense at all), the girl I hurt, and future victims of the same asshole).

You’re not Him.

At the very least, I have pretended not to be him for long enough that who I pretend to be is who I am.

You’re not responsible for what He did to you.

That one I agree with and it has stabilized there.

You were not personally responsible for stopping Him from continuing.

That is the place it breaks down. I feel like my actions and inactions exposed others to abuse.

You are not personally responsible for His existence.

And that’s one I never even thought about. I don’t think I ever thought I was.

And if you ever need us as a sounding board to confirm that things your head says are the bullshit you suspect them of being, you can always do so and we can always be there for you.

Thank you, all of you, for being that sounding board. Sometimes the act of typing it out is cathartic. Sometimes your good thoughts, your advice, your honesty, helps beat back the bullshit.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:59 am

Since people keep bringing this show up…

Weed Monkey:

February 26th, 2013 at 12:24 pm

Since you people keep bringing this show up… part 2

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 12:33 pm

coHowdy folks…

Hugs and chocolate and booze as needed.

Ogvorbis I know you’re going to find your way to a better place. The trail is long, and dips back into the dark part of the woods more than it should, but I honestly think you’re going to find more and more time is spent in the bright daylight as time goes on.

Nepenthe glad to hear about your cat.

I’m going to go back to huffing adhesive fumes now.

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 26th, 2013 at 12:44 pm

Ogvorbis @227

You were not personally responsible for stopping Him from continuing.

That is the place it breaks down. I feel like my actions and inactions exposed others to abuse.

It’s the “victims of oppression are not personally responsible for undoing oppression” problem.

We understand culturally that undoing systems of oppression whether they be molestation networks or systematic discrimination is mostly going to be undertaken by those most affected by it (survivors and the like). And we understand that a lot of the cultural momentum is going to come from those communities standing together and that is better for all to stand together as one and help push away those oppressions rather than turning a blind eye.

But here’s the problem.

So often that cultural understanding is wielded as a cudgel both by outsiders and by one’s self. Suddenly it’s not a “good thing” to have done that, but rather it’s treated as mandatory, as something expected of discriminated groups. If they don’t have the emotional resources or have processed through the oppression enough to fight back, they are often treated like shit by others and themselves for not magically fixing the problem on their own.

And it happens especially hard to rape victims because so often the processing of trauma occurs long after it makes sense to fight back against the specific rapist. So instead of coming together in solidarity and helping each other through difficult times, we’re often at home kicking ourselves because we didn’t have the resources at the time to make sure that bastard was taken off the streets and could never victimize another person again.

I shook the hands of my rapist and let him go on to molest others. My partner spoke praises of her rapist to people he probably has gone on to rape, because he got in her head and make her feel guilty for “disrupting his life”. But we are not personally responsible for stopping Them. We are not culpable for Their crimes because we didn’t have the resources to fight back then and stop it. No matter what our brains tell us. No matter what your brain tells you.

As opposablethumbs noted, experienced rapists are great at getting into people’s heads, encouraging their victims to blame themselves and help protect them, to dismiss the pain and tragedy and even help them acquire new victims. And they are strongly supported by a very active rape culture that enshrines them, that encourages victims to self-deny to avoid the terror of the “false rape accusation” or even to lack the resources to process what happened to them until it is much too late to do much.

And that’s never their fault. You didn’t have the resources then, as you do now, to process what happened and be ready to help others end the oppression.

And that’s what you can do for those victims now. That’s how you can fight against that oppression today here and now. Simply telling your story and being there when a current victim of someone lets you know what is happening to them. Providing that counter to the narratives in their heads and in society so that generation can process faster, so that generation can have more support. And brick by brick, step by step, this is how the Hims out there will be stopped and rooted out.

You’re not responsible for stopping Him then. You’re not responsible for stopping Him now. You may even have done things you’re not at all proud of. But it’s the price of healing and nothing else. No matter what your lying-ass mind says.

Ogvorbis:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:10 pm

The trail is long, and dips back into the dark part of the woods more than it should, but I honestly think you’re going to find more and more time is spent in the bright daylight as time goes on.

I feel like I’ve almost gotten out of Mirkwood and then, bam, right back in. I hope I find sunshine.

You’re not responsible for stopping Him then. You’re not responsible for stopping Him now. You may even have done things you’re not at all proud of. But it’s the price of healing and nothing else. No matter what your lying-ass mind says.

Thanks. I still feel like I have done something wrong that I didn’t stop him back then and have no real way of stopping him, or others like him, now. I sure hope this is part of the price of healing.

Hugs to you, iJoe and Cerberus.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

Hugs to Og.

Yay for Nepenthe’s kitty.

Tea all around.

It’s quite snowy out there. This system looks like it’s stretched all the way across two states.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

Azkyroth and WMDKitty, thanks for the snickers :)

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:16 pm

Finally, a female Doctor.

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:19 pm

Ogvorbis-

It is.

Appropriate physical gesture of support right back!

And good luck.

vaiyt:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:21 pm

If they don’t have the emotional resources or have processed through the oppression enough to fight back, they are often treated like shit by others and themselves for not magically fixing the problem on their own.

And whenever they do fight back enough to get others to recognize their situation and stop treating them like shit, it gets turned around and interpreted as a gift from the oppressors. With time, history lessons erase the fights and keep only the turning point. Like: “oh, so and so signed an emancipation document out of the magnanimousness of their heart, and suddenly the slaves were free! Yay!”

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

<sad-whinge> Snow? If I only had an office on the outside (rather than atrium) side of the corridor I could see the weather as it happened.

I wonder if the college where my wife teaches is going to cancel night classes so she doesn’t have to go out tonight — I can’t imagine that the roads are going to be in good shape when she’s done at 11pm.

Portia, could I have a spot more of tea please, thanks.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:27 pm

dontpanic, I’m currently brewing a lovely vanilla chai. Hold out your mug.

Are you in Winter Storm Rocky as well? I hope the college cancels. The winds are going to make it drifty and the warm temps will make the snow heavy. Hope you and your wife stay safe!

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

Chai? I heard of it, but never actually tried it. Thanks.

No, the (overly flat) midwest. [Figures out that "Rocky" isn't a reference to the Rocky Moutains, but that winter storms are named ... when did that start to happen?] Yes, I guess so. Just started to hit us in the last few hours. [Wanders across the hall and back] Hmmm. Pretty white out there and blowing hard. At least I will make it home tonight; can’t say that for all my colleagues, some of whom were going to fly out (homeward bound) or start a 4hr drive after the end of the work day. Neither of which I think is going to happen for them until at least tomorrow.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

Yeah, the Weather Channel started naming winter storms this year for the first time. They were super creative with the preceding one, which was called “Q”. It’s supposed to last til tonight at midnight, I hear. Well, for around here, anyway. I don’t think anyone’s flying anywhere for a bit.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:44 pm

Oh, and my chai isn’t like the sugary mess Starbucks, et al, calls a chai. : )

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:46 pm

Ha, I hadn’t look at the full list of names before. http://www.weather.com/news/why-we-name-winter-storms-20121001

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

Ah, but I like sugary messes … coffee, to me, serves as a cream and sugar delivery device. (Just as bread acts as a butter delivery device to my son.) Though having never had one, I can’t tell whether I prefer your non-mess to Starbucks “chai”.

Oh, so this is the first year for winter storm names. And the weather channel has taken it upon itself to be the designated designator. Hmmm. And … we’re already up to “R”. Whoa, think they’ll run out of letters?

Ooops, off to a seminar about the russian meteor strike….

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:08 pm

I admit to being a tea snob :) I’m in the camp with your son as far as bread’s purpose in life, so…to each their own.

I hope they do run out of letters…I’d like to see more creative than Iago and Gandolf and Xerxes…

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

Hugs or other desired gestures of support to Ogvorbis, Cerberus and others who need them.

Oggie, reiterating what the others have said; there is no way that you could reasonably be considered culpable for actions taken under such levels of duress. Even adults are not held responsible for things done with a gun to their head, much less children. I use that metaphor advisedly; you were under a compulsion as real as a gun to the head, and arguably a worse and more compelling one. As I said earlier, you had literally no options that would have changed anything; In that time, at that place, no one would have believed you or tried to help you even if you had told them, and almost certainly would have made your life even worse because of < insert victim-blaming bullshit here >. You can’t be blamed for not having magic superpowers, and that’s what it would have taken for you to be able to change the situation. There certainly are people who could have changed it, starting with the abuser, who could have stopped/not started, but none of those people were you, or his other victims.

dontpanic
It’s more that the Weather Channel has decided that they should name winter storms, and started doing it. AFAICT no other weather service does it or pays attention.

Stuff about my home life

Poor D is in a hell of a situation. Her ex-gf has their daughter, and has moved to California with her (We’re in Oregon). Last night she told D that she’s not going to let her be in touch with the girl anymore. D has no legal or practical recourse, as they weren’t legally married and she’s not the biological mother. She’s also not in a situation where she can raise a child even if she could try to get custody.

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:22 pm

Poor D is in a hell of a situation. Her ex-gf has their daughter, and has moved to California with her (We’re in Oregon). Last night she told D that she’s not going to let her be in touch with the girl anymore. D has no legal or practical recourse, as they weren’t legally married and she’s not the biological mother. She’s also not in a situation where she can raise a child even if she could try to get custody.

Fuck DOMA. : ( That’s awful.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:29 pm

hugs for Ogvorbis (it was not your fault and you are not responsible), the ever-eloquent Cerberus (I know you weren’t talking to me, but what you said resonates a lot with other guilt-inducing aspects of my life, so I take your words to heart…), Dalillama (and D by proxy, because that just sucks more than words can say), anyone else still under the weather (health-wise)…
moreteawithcreamandsugar for dontpanic (I’m with you re: coffee as vehicle, and your son re: bread-and-butter – today, when buttering some bread for lunch, I decided to weigh how much butter I put on it, mostly because I’d just unpacked the kitchen scale; 6 grams – and that’s not even a lot, for a 30 gram slice of bread.), also a warmblanket for Portia. (You and dontpanic and whoever else under-the-weather joins you can share the tea and blankets out in that little cozy corner of yours. :) )

Today is one of those days. Just… those days. Today I don’t belong anywhere and getting (some) laundry done just doesn’t cut it for productivity. Today I say, I have had enough and I want out and Fuck this shit and me-me-me-me-me!!!.
Tomorrow will be different. Right? Right. I’m off to make that happen that much faster.
(Good night.)

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:31 pm

hugs rq. Tomorrow will be better. So much better.

——

Incidentally, I just made a hair appointment for a drastic haircut tomorrow. Maybe I have enough to donate….anyone know which organizations are reputable? I know Locks of Love has been criticized.

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:34 pm

I’m sorry everyone is having such a shitty day/days. hugs all around

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:42 pm

PS Portia – you, too? You need 8 inches as a minimum and I’d had the website all bookmarked (there’s more or less one organization that I found to which I would send it for free), but I’ve since lost the link. But I’ll be looking it up soon, too. Just need an extra inch so I don’t end up shaving my head just for donating the rest. ;) I hope the haircut is spectacular!

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:44 pm

Thanks rq! I’m a bit nervous. I haven’t found one for less than 12 inches, which I don’t have to spare. But good to know there’s at least one out there, I’ll keep looking :) I’ll ask the salon too, come to think of it.

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:49 pm

Anyone in the mood to deal with a… person on the Dan Savage thread? I’m currently nearly speechless and I’m sure someone else could handle this can of worms better than I could.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:49 pm

Portia
This is the site I’d found, it still looks like my best bet (since I don’t have anything local and they accept mail-ins). And I messed up, they want 10 inches. :)

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:53 pm

I’ll look Beatrice..

Thanks rq!

Ogvorbis:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:56 pm

You need 8 inches as a minimum

Pulls open front of underwear. Looks.

I’m a bit nervous. I haven’t found one for less than 12 inches,

Looks again.

And I messed up, they want 10 inches

Gives up and feels inadequate.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 2:59 pm

Beatrice
You made me look. Now I won’t be going to bed immediately. (It’s ok. I’ll go to bed later.)

Portia, who will be okay.:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:00 pm

Beatrice, what the what is going on in there, I agree. Jebus. Makes me a little sad that the Peez (I used it Joe!) is so on board with Dan Savage as the Humanist of the Year. : / He’s up there with Ryan Murphy in my estimation.

Og: I laughed aloud.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:02 pm

Ogvorbis
I’m not sure you want to cut that bit off, there… Even for a good cause.

Lynna, OM:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:02 pm

We’ve enjoyed quite a bit of Oscar-related conversation in the [Lounge], but I don’t think anyone mentioned that one of the most amusing categories of post-Oscar news is always the coverage from Iran. They blithely alter the speeches of recipients, etc.. This year they altered Michelle Obama’s couture. Now that’s some coverage.

Rachel Maddow presented great coverage of Iran’s coverage.

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:04 pm

Thank you, thank you, thank you to rq, Beatrice, and Portia for saying what I needed to say in the Dan Savage thread but couldn’t because I’m still too anxious. ♥

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:05 pm

Thanks, I was just imitating a goldfish, and writing and deleting comments over there.

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:07 pm

Parrowing,
I didn’t even say anything, I was completely dumbstruck by that comment and =8)-DX approval! I’m still all “!!1eleven!”

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:10 pm

Beatrice @253

Yeaaaaaahhh. (Exasperated sigh)

This is why I don’t like Dan Savage as much as I should for things like It Gets Better. His position as “the one big sex show advice person” means that his various internalized garbages often filter down to the disciples and make them worse people instead of better.

Dalillama @246

That is fucked up beyond relief, both on the part of her ex-partner and a fucked up system that doesn’t provide the same protections to all families.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:29 pm

THE PEEZ!!!

Thanks Portia! We’ll make it stick!

Dan Savage is… hit and miss? It is hard to drum up huge enthusiasm for him either way I guess? I certainly can see why people would want to give him an award, and I can see why other people would object, and I can’t respect anyone who would simply dismiss the criticism because he does some good. I just wish- and I find myself saying this in a lot of venues- I wish that people who suffer one form of discrimination would stop and think just a little bit harder when talking about people who suffer from a different form. Black TV shows talking shit about atheists, anti-trans* feminists and their shit, atheists attacking feminists, and on and on. We mostly seem to get it when we’re the target, so why do we ignore it when other people are the target?

dianne:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:33 pm

They were super creative with the preceding one, which was called “Q”.

I still want to hope that somewhere TWC employs a ST:TNG fan who suggested the name. Or even a James Bond fan.

Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:34 pm

Ugh, Winter Storm Rocky is moving though Chiwaukee (ironically from the south). I came home to commode and feed lunch to the Redhead. Don’t think I’ll go back to work, as the roads are covered with thick, slippery slush, the unsafe drivers out in force, and I really don’t have anything that pressing. Fortunately, I voted in the local primary election this morning before the storm hit.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:40 pm

Parrowing
I mostly did like Beatrice – goldfish.
But you’re welcome. :)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:44 pm

WTF is a “Winter Storm Rocky”?

… oh, it is the thing HOLDING UP DELIVERY OF MY MOTHERFUCKING AMPLIFIER CORNERS?!?! Goddammit. How the fuck can this be happening to me? Why is some storm specifically targeting me and fucking with my shit? How? Why? WORST THING TO EVER HAPPEN TO ANYONE, EVER!

… I imagine that’s what it is like inside the head of Stephen Colbert(the character, not the actor) pretty much all the time.

Lynna, OM:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:46 pm

Hmmm. This Senate bill does not sound like a good idea. Business-first, anti-big government forces are once again voting to restrict individual freedom by way of bigger government.

To some, the undercover videos purporting to show mistreated animals or inhumane working conditions are the only way to expose practices that the public needs to know about.

To some farms and businesses, though, those videos are misleading threats to good companies that ought to be made illegal.

Tuesday, a Senate committee sided with those businesses, voting 7-2 for a measure that would make it illegal to photograph or videotape a farm or industry with the intent to embarrass, annoy or harm the business.

In its current form, whistleblowers — including journalists documenting stories or members of the public who post such videos on YouTube — would face legal sanctions. …

Link.

rq:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:50 pm

Anyway, this time I am going to bed. Good night!

Lynna, OM:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:50 pm

Another bill from the state Senate of Indiana would remove one of two mandatory, medically unnecessary, vaginal ultrasounds for those sinful females seeking an abortion. So, they now plan to fuck you over just once, (and make you pay for the privilege), instead of fucking you over twice.

The Indiana Senate today eliminated a requirement that women undergo an ultrasound after obtaining a drug-induced abortion, but kept the mandate that she have one before taking the drug….

Link.

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 26th, 2013 at 3:55 pm

I think that’s a pretty accurate description of what goes on inside my father’s head, iJoe. Last time I went on vacation with my parents, he dropped and couldn’t find his hotel key card (it was on the hotel room floor about two feet from where he was when he had noticed it was missing). Instead of looking in the obvious places and then giving up after a minute or two to ask the lobby for a new one, he raged and stormed about the hotel room, cursing everything he could think of. I kid you not, these words came out of his mouth (and not in a joking way, but in a way that made me wonder how quickly I could reach my phone to call the cops if I needed to): “Thanks a lot, God. Is this what I deserve? Is this how you’re testing me now?” He is a strong believer with a severe Job complex. He has certainly interpreted dangerous storms that have killed others to be actually all about him.

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:02 pm

hands iJoe a bucket

make that two buckets

I’m sorry you’ve become ill-er. This, too, shall pass.

The cat will (almost certainly) soon get used to the bell. In fact, my late Midnight-cat got so used to the bell as to be unnerved if he temporarily misplaced his collar, and would slink around as if he expected something dreadful was about to happen to him—probably a bath. After all, collar removal is what happens just before a cat is subjected to the Flea Banning Water Torture.

Your description of your cat’s panic at being belled reminds me of the time Midnight walked through the hand-loops of a plastic WalMart bag in such a way that it got stuck. Said bag was being used for Halloween Candy Overflow Storage, which gave it weight, and the plasticiness gave it crinkle, and he ran and ran and ran, and it kept chasing him…. Eventually we were able to tackle and un-bag the cat. He needed a lot of cuddles after that.
-
Cerberus-
Indeed! And recognise his wife and son again! And maybe get to keep his shitty job!

Also, hugs against the forces of oppression, and against the general sense of paranoia.
-

Monty Python meets J.R.R. Tolkien.

Awesomeness!
-
Hai, rorschach!
-
hugs and encouragement for Ogvorbis. Just because it was a plateau rather than an equilibrium doesn’t mean that it wasn’t worth having! Or that equilibrium will never come.
-

“Foudre makes the excellent point/sums it up with, “why hire a black model when you could just paint a white one!””

:( :( :(
-

Why do we put up with this crap? When a high level hospital employee says, “You can’t keep taking uninsured patients, we won’t be able to make our bonuses” why isn’t that a career destroying statement? It should be. Why do we even consider allowing organizations that have as doctrine that certain people should be allowed to die when we could save them (gays with HIV, pregnant women in trouble) to have anything to do with hospitals? What’s wrong with people?

Selfishness, and greed, and a desire to be on the winning (PR) side. Possibly in reverse order.
-

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:09 pm

I swear my brain is spending all my waking and sleeping hours coming up with ways to tell me this is my fault. I joined scouts. I never said no. I never told. I abused others. I recruited others. And, most recently, I never even thought about whether or not the other scouts knew what was going on. Which makes no sense.

You said it yourself, the other day: control of self, at all costs! Your brain is just trying to back-date it to your childhood, before being under your own control was even possible. To retroactively control your ability to control, if you will.

Give your brain a right ding around the ear-hole.
-

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:22 pm

Uhhh…light year? Yuck, those might have half the calories but the taste terrible. ::eye roll::

And they have this really odd mouth-feel, like maybe they used too much ground up sea weed to add bulk. Blech!

No amount of “chocolate” coating can make those things edible!
-
Nepenthe: Yay for recovered kitteh! At last, your bathroom can breathe free!
-

I think far less on what I could have done to protect me, or prevent me being hurt, as I do kicking myself that I didn’t do anything to protect them (them being fellow scouts who were abused, fellow scouts who were not abused (and no, I have no idea how that one makes any sense at all), the girl I hurt, and future victims of the same asshole).

Survivor’s guilt.
As adapted to the trauma-at-head.
-

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 4:24 pm

Thanks cicely… been a rough couple of days. At least my wife is well, but she’s got work garbage to deal with tonight and I think she’d rather trade places with me.

cicely (a Bearer of Very Little Braaaiiinzzz):

February 26th, 2013 at 4:39 pm

Dalillama: Sorry to hear about D’s situation. That is a major mass of suckage, right there.
-
Ogvorbis: I lol’d.
:)
-

We mostly seem to get it when we’re the target, so why do we ignore it when other people are the target?

‘Cause we’re all special, special snowflakes?
Empathy failure. Redo From Start.
-

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 4:53 pm

Stigma as Ego Depletion: How Being the Target of Prejudice Affects Self-Control

doi 10.1111/j.1467-9280.2006.01695.x

This research examined whether stigma diminishes people’s ability to control their behaviors. Because coping with stigma requires self-regulation, and self-regulation is a limited-capacity resource, we predicted that individuals belonging to stigmatized groups are less able to regulate their own behavior when they become conscious of their stigmatizing status or enter threatening environments. Study 1 uncovered a correlation between stigma sensitivity and self-regulation; the more Black college students were sensitive to prejudice, the less self-control they reported having. By experimentally activating stigma, Studies 2 and 3 provided causal evidence for stigma’s ego-depleting qualities: When their stigma was activated, stigmatized participants (Black students and females) showed impaired self-control in two very different domains (attentional and physical self-regulation). These results suggest that (a) stigma is ego depleting and (b) coping with it can weaken the ability to control and regulate one’s behaviors in domains unrelated to the stigma.

https://cdn.anonfiles.com/1361919148959.pdf

David Marjanović:

February 26th, 2013 at 4:56 pm

Aaaaaaaarrrrrgh! A thread on science theory! And stuff! And everything! And I just spent all afternoon & evening working nonstop on the page proofs of my next paper, and it’s almost midnight, so again I have to go home and to bed without switching the computer on!

Accepted 29 November 2011. Published 29 March 2013. epic facepalm Sure, there aren’t many journals that publish papers of this length, but if I’d known in advance that this journal would take so long…

cicely! What did you do to earn your new epithet? ~:-(

Link dump:
Petition to stop predatory payday lending in the US.
Petition to all EU finance ministers to do what the EU Parliament wants and stop big banks hiding billions in tax havens.
Artist makes large pictures from banknotes. Very pretty. In German, but I didn’t listen anyway, because I don’t have sound here…
The name Tetrapoda was coined by H. Credner sometime before 1911, says the 1911 Encyclopædia Britannica! The plot thickens!!!

David Marjanović:

February 26th, 2013 at 4:58 pm

Working nonstop is fun. :-)

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:00 pm

Fuckfuckfuck. My brain isn’t working very well. Just went on a med call that was a fatality. I rolled my ankle walking through the snow to the station. it hurts.

John Morales:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:04 pm

On perceptions, via PET: We Aren’t the World.

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:05 pm

I’m sorry, Portia.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:06 pm

Thanks, Beatrice.

…I’m now with you on the “eleventy” type reaction to the stuff in the DS thread.

Strange gods:

Does that explain why I often lose my composure when people say nasty sexist crap to me? Or am I misreading the excerpt you’ve posted.

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:09 pm

Fuckity fuck. I’m totally pissed off right now.

Smith was the only audience member who stepped out of the courtroom.

“…our most gracious Heavenly Father, we come to you today with sad hearts,” Sammons said. “We’re so sad that we as a nation have let such a small minority group tell us what to do. Lord, I ask forgiveness for myself, but I’m of the old school where we don’t run, we fight. So, forgive me for that.”

“Lord, we ask You to be with us always today…we just ask Your special blessing for this court, this good Christian bunch of people that are always trying to do the right thing for the county. We ask all this in Your Son’s precious name. Amen.”

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:11 pm

Portia,

Yeah, I responded this time, righteous anger and all. And just as I was preparing to finally go to bed :/

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:11 pm

I’m glad you did. It was perfect.

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:15 pm

I do think Smith messed up by stepping outside, though. The statement of Caywood’s that “Anybody who’s uncomfortable with this, we’ll give you a moment to step outside” was non-binding, and could actually hurt any challenges in court. Couldn’t it?

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:16 pm

Couldn’t it?

No. Unconstitutional is unconstitutional regardless of who’s present. (If I understand the issue correctly, that is. Apologies for my addled brain if i have not).

opposablethumbs:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:16 pm

Portia, I’m sorry. And dianne #203 – this, many times this. I forgot to say earlier that I only wish more people thought the same way that you do.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:27 pm

Thanks, opposablethumbs. I’m gonna have some tea and prop my foot up. : /

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:27 pm

No. Unconstitutional is unconstitutional regardless of who’s present. (If I understand the issue correctly, that is. Apologies for my addled brain if i have not).

OK, that makes sense to me. I’m sorry for barging in with my own issue. I may make a showing since it’s in KY in support of the challenge if one ever arrives. Christians really are running roughshod over the Constitution and the First Amendment. SMFH.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:29 pm

No apology necessary. Open thread :)
Glad I could help.

Beatrice:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:34 pm

After this lovely “What is this? I don’t even…” interlude in the Dan Savage thread, I’m really off to bed.
Good night. Have fun polishing those fangs.

notices Cerberus’ comment
That was really good.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:34 pm

Does that explain why I often lose my composure when people say nasty sexist crap to me?

It might have something to do with it, but this paper was studying effects of subtly activated stereotype threat, while you’re talking about overt attacks on your identity, the effects of which probably eclipse what was studied here.

triskelethecat:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:34 pm

@Cicely: (returns pouncehug) HI! I’ve missed you guys. But this WordPress login has been driving me buggy…

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:35 pm

Night Beatrice!

Strange gods:
I’m gonna reread that sentence a few more times and maybe I’ll form a coherent thought about it.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:35 pm

Hi all. Hugs or chocolate all around, whoever needs what. I’d chime in on the Savage thread, but I’ve spent the day on office politics and still have quite a bit more on it to do tonight in addition to all the lecture prep for tomorrow I didn’t get done today b/c politics and I’m totally wound up and need to work out but I don’t know if my lungs will let me, so maybe I’ll try and then collapse and then not be able to get anything done at all. :) But yeah, thanks to those who are pointing out the number of ways in which he is not exactly stellar in all more than a couple of areas.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:40 pm

Portia, it might help to know that “stereotype threat” is a term of art.

triskelethecat:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:58 pm

@Portia: so sorry about the snowbound. I’ll send you some more tea. My BFF who has an evil twin inside introduced me to Teavana. While overpriced, their chais are really delicious. But I’m really glad I haven’t found one nearby (nor have I looked). (pours Portia a fresh cup so she doesn’t have to walk on the ankle)

Oggie: Just keep telling yourself that YOU ARE NOT AT FAULT. It’s not easy. I understand that. I feel guilty about not confronting my rapist – and VERY guilty about his suicide a few years later. I keep wondering if my silence contributed to it (long story as to why). But the sunshine does come out. You will probably always have triggers. Keep working on it. We are all here for you (and smack the little demon in your head who says how fooled we are).

Lynna: so nice to “see” you again!

I’ve been hanging out on PET much more than here. Since I use multiple computers, WordPress has decided I’m evil and causes a lot of problems if I try to log on from other areas. And, since I’ve changed jobs (yes, again, now almost a year in the new position) and my employer has decided that while I can read Pharyngula I can’t comment on Pharyngula…I don’t stay current with the Lounge. But I do think of you all. And I’m going to try to come around more often.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 5:59 pm

Oh, triskelethecat!! :) hugshugshugs

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:01 pm

Good news!

BossNurse had a visit from her company’s executive team to do a “mock” inspection of the facility in anticipation of the annual state visit. Since A) this is the first time she’s done one for this company and B) this is the issue that got her fired from the job in The Place That Shall Not Be Named, it has been a pretty stressful day for her… and for me too!

Well, I just got a text, all went well and she’s on her way home only a few minutes later than normal. My wife has had a pretty rough 18 months, professionally. This is hopefully going to be a big huge confidence booster for her, and a sign of good things to come.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:03 pm

Thank you very much, triskelthecat. That’s just what I needed.

I went to a Teavana once. It was surprisingly high-pressure sales. It was an hour away. S and I made good our escape because we felt intimidated, ha. (Bad tea snob…). Maybe I’ll order some chai from them though.

Being snowbound isn’t so bad, per se. I don’t have to drive anywhere til tomorrow, at which time most of the deep stuff should be cleared. I’m cozied up in my recliner with a lap blanket and an ice pack on my ankle. If only my knitting weren’t too over there right now…

…goodness I sound delightfully geriatric.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:03 pm

Glad to hear it, Joe.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:05 pm

Rephrasing: Saying sexist crap to you is an open insult to you, even if indirectly. This study was about what happens when race or gender is merely brought to attention in a context associated with stereotype, such as young women taking a math exam; the study found that ego depletion results. Ego depletion because of gender salience might be one relatively small effect of saying sexist crap to you, but the bulk of the reason why you lose your composure was probably not studied in this case. That larger reason might also be ego depletion, but probably not ego depletion due to mere salience of gender in a context associated with stereotype.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:16 pm

Portia, sorry about your ankle. I’ve been there a few hundred times or so. :)

You should get one of those grippy reach extention thingies like this.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 26th, 2013 at 6:17 pm

New laptop post!

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Thanks for the further explanation, strange gods. So, if I’m a young woman taking a math exam (or…the LSAT), my mental struggle with the idea that I am inherently less able at that activity is lessening my ability to actually be good at that activity?

Thanks Joe : ) You’re right, that’s a great idea!

Audley:

Hoooooray new laptop! hooooray for Audley Lounging with us!

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:20 pm

I’m lucky to have a local tea shop that sells a number of interesting blends. The one I’m going through right now is a black tea with rose petals. They even have one that has popcorn in it – I haven’t dared try that one. I’m tempted to try a “mulled wine” flavor tea they have, but I worry it will be too tart and I haven’t got up the nerve to ask them to brew me a cup (they totally would, but I’d feel like a high-maintenance customer).

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:20 pm

Yay Audley!

glodson:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:21 pm

Must stop eating the cookies that I made with the little one.

birgerjohansson:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:24 pm

Threadrupt.
Got sick Sunday, too brief to be stomach flu, but those 12 hours felt like an eternity. I only got enough strength to go buy new food this Tuesday evening. Cicero (feline monster) has been great company.
Summary of Italian news: Nobody wins election. Berlusconi will not go away unless someone hammers a stake through his heart or dumps a ton of garlic on him from a great hight.
Summary of Swedish news. People were born. People died. Politicians bickered. Springtime seems to be a month early.
— — — — — — — —
Swedish documentary about ´Merican bloke who becomes an underground musical icon in apartheid South Africa without knowing about it for thirty years (“Searching for Sugarman”) gets Oscar. Convoluted fate but fascinating.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:32 pm

terrorist fist jab for birgerjohansson and everyone else who is sick or injured tonight.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:38 pm

So, if I’m a young woman taking a math exam (or…the LSAT), my mental struggle with the idea that I am inherently less able at that activity is lessening my ability to actually be good at that activity?

Yes; and that is a description of stereotype threat. (These effects can be reduced or eliminated in various ways.)

The study linked in 279 found that stereotype threat also causes ego depletion, thereby indirectly affecting performance at other activities unrelated to stereotype contexts (in this study, the Stroop task used in various areas of research, and the handgrip task which has been common to ego depletion research).

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:39 pm

Thanks for humoring me as I put the pieces together, strange gods. That’s really interesting.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:40 pm

Oh, Audley!!!! :)

birgerjohansson:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:41 pm

Improbable Joe, you have my sympathy.
— — — — —
I live in bloody Sweden, and I don’t care how the nobs structure their titles. A least being big honcho of some minicountry like San Marino would have a coolness factor. Big countries and their ruling families come with a historical luggage that is bloody and repugnant. Except possibly Iceland, if it counts as “big” (but it is blissfully free of nobs).
— — —
Soon two hours past local midnight, no wonder I am rambling.

glodson:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:44 pm

Remember the blog about how deer can’t read?

She’s back with a new post just as bad. And a deer proved her wrong.

birgerjohansson:

February 26th, 2013 at 6:51 pm

I hope stereotype threat can account for the statistical blip that created books like “The Bell Curve”. Not that facts wil stop a bad meme, racial inferiority will live on in memespace alongside The Elders of Zion.
— — — — — —
Hang in there, Joe!
— — — — —
Regarding Iceland, do Ice Giants count as nobs? I forgot to check.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 7:01 pm

broboxley:

if one does not have a reflection, does light cease to exist?

If one does not have a reflection, one is fond of blood.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 7:09 pm

dontpanic:
(I find that my fingers instinctively want to put in an apostrophe)

Chai? I heard of it, but never actually tried it. Thanks.

Watch out.
She’s trying to teach you how to chai one on…

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 7:17 pm

Joe:
Hope you get to feeling better soon. Glad BossNurse is coming home to keep you company.
****

Portia:
Snowbound?
Pensacola is chilly right now, but earlier today was quite lovely. Jealous?
:)

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 7:19 pm

Tony
I am indeed jealous. You better make ready your couch if you plan to keep taunting me :)
I’m mostly just upset about the snow because it cost me one pain free ankle!
And you are very punny, my friend, you make me smile.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 7:27 pm

I’m gonna pick a fight –

I love chai tea, but I drink it straight.

Because milk in any sort of tea is an abomination.

ducks

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 7:27 pm

I’m on board, carlie : ) No fight here.

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 26th, 2013 at 7:57 pm

Hello again, everyone!
Carlie:

I’m lucky to have a local tea shop that sells a number of interesting blends. The one I’m going through right now is a black tea with rose petals

Ooooo, jealous! I’ve had Twinings Rose Garden tea, which is delightful, and I can only imagine how good a hand-blended loose black/rose tea is!

(Please bear with some intense typos– still getting used to this keyboard.)

ck:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:03 pm

Business-first, anti-big government forces are once again voting to restrict individual freedom by way of bigger government.

Given the crap the government already does (Bradley Manning, the source of much of the WikiLeaks data, has been in prison waiting for trial for over 1000 days now) to prohibit its own embarrassing secrets from getting out, it’s only fair that big business be allowed the same benefit. At least this law won’t have a maximum penalty of 30 years imprisonment or execution, unlike those targeted by the espionage act. I’ll bet the anti-big government forces have little to no problem with those laws either (except that many may think they’re not being used enough). Let’s just re-brand it “economic terrorism”, then we can do anything we want to those who get in the way.

broboxley OT:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:05 pm

#321 Gunpowder Chai like my nan made
boil 1.5 cups of water. Add 3 heaping teaspoons of loose black tea. Steep 5 minutes, strain into cup, add two spoons of sugar and some evaporated tinned milk. Guaranty the energy boost .

Tony, I was thinking of black holes :-)

triskelethecat:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:09 pm

Hey…YAY! I got my program to work and log me in on the laptop!

@Carlie: HI! I miss you!

@Carlie and Portis: definitely no milk in tea, usually, even chai. However, sometimes on VERY rare occasions, I will hit Dunkin Donuts for a Chai Latte – usually when I really need a sugar fix. And yeah, Teavana IS high pressure – I had a $25 gift card and the first thing they did was show me tea pots that cost over $100.

I did buy 2 kinds of chai, and 2 of their airtight tea containers, because I could use them – I have several kinds of loose tea that dear Walton sent me and I haven’t dared open because I have nothing to keep it in. And, I may buy more of the chai once in a rare while. It’s very good.

triskelethecat:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:11 pm

Oh, and..Hi Audley! Hooray for new laptop postings!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:16 pm

carlie:

I’m gonna pick a fight –

I love chai tea, but I drink it straight.

Because milk in any sort of tea is an abomination.

ducks

Does milk make the turn it into gay tea?

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:18 pm

Do you people not know how to drink real tea?
The Long Island or Long Beach variety…? Lightweights.
(vodka, gin, rum, tequila, triple sec, sweet n sour for both; splash of coke for the first and splash of cranberry for the second)

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:19 pm

Yeah, Tony, Leviticus 72:345 “Thou shalt not combine the milk of a cloven-footed beast with the leaf of ebony. Those that breaketh mine commandment shall have their teapots shattered and their tea balls crushed, for it is an abomination.”

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:19 pm

:sigh:
Does milk make the TEA turn into gay tea?

triskelethecat:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:26 pm

@Tony: I will happily join you in a pitcher of LI Iced Tea. Make mine double shots, as long as I’m not driving… Haven’t had the Long Beach version but I’m willing to try.

Nah, milk just generally makes tea nasty.

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:28 pm

David: Let’s just say that Monday was a Very Bad and Stupid Day. I couldn’t brain to save my life, and my hands and feet were, as the book says, deft as crowbars…not an advantage when trying to cut and mount fiddly little bits of silver doily onto a plastic easter egg, or when not trying to Zombie Walk.

But that reminds me that I should go ahead and change it.
-
hugs and soothing liniments for Portia and her ankle.
-

On perceptions, via PET: We Aren’t the World.

Interesting!
-
iJoe: Glad to hear that BossNurse’s “mock inspection” went well.
:)
-

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:30 pm

Portia:
LOL!!!

Gosh, did someone start a War on Women in the United States? Nah. Couldn’t be. /snaaaaaark

The Indiana Senate on Tuesday approved new restrictions aimed at clinics that offer the abortion pill, requiring them to perform ultrasounds on women seeking the drugs.
http://news.yahoo.com/ind-senate-approves-tougher-abortion-pill-rules-235406025.html

::blinks::
Cardinal Keith O’Brien is resigning???!!!

Pardon me while I go back and recover my gobsmacked so hard it is lying on the ground 5 feet behind me jaw.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:31 pm

Thank you, cicely. Hugs to you.

Tony:
:D

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:39 pm

Cerberus
I applaud you again for your most recent comment on the Savage thread. I wanted to particularly call bullshit on the “response” to Beatrice but couldn’t form the thoughts.

…and what’s NRE?

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:39 pm

All right class. School is in session.

Your hint: liquid.

carlie:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:43 pm

And remember, we keep our supraesophogeal ganglion to ourselves. That means you, Jimmy.

Rev. BigDumbChimp:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:45 pm

Anyone in the Austin, TX vicinity I will be your forever admirer and doter upon type uncreepy Internet person if you send me Jester King beer.

We just had them here at a beer festival and there was some limited supply and promises of more to come but I must have more.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 8:52 pm

Rev:
Uhhhh…Rev?
Which Jester King beer?

http://jesterkingbrewery.com/beers/

I see a few.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:54 pm

Allo!

A few of the things that are making Esteleth grumpy:

(1) It is sleeting.

(2) It is supposed to keep sleeting all day tomorrow.

(3) My iMac is in the shop, for the LCDs suddenly exhibiting mass death. So I type this from my MBP. The good news is is that not only do I have AppleCare, the iMac is still under warranty. The bad news is that the iMac is eighteen months old.

(4) The sick that I had this weekend cleared up today, making me feel human again. Until around 6 pm, when it returned with a vengeance of “lol, you didn’t need your lower GI to work, right?”

(5) Co-worker is a sanctimonous shit. He emailed me a paper he found in Cell Stem Cell on Friday morning (observant Horde members will remember that Friday was when the sick started). Today, he asked my opinion. I honestly said that given that I was struggling with a fever all weekend, and playing work catch-up when not, I hadn’t had the chance to give the paper the close reading it deserved. Said I’d give him said opinion tomorrow. Got snotty, said that when he’s laid up, he reads in bed.

(6) Have since read this paper. It is okay. Not stellar, but okay. Worthy of Cell Stem Cell, but not glorious. And not a huge game-changer for my research, like he implied when he emailed it to me.

(7) IT IS FUCKING SLEETING. Because emphasis.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 8:54 pm

Maybe I’ll work from home tomorrow. I feel a sore throat coming on — thought I’d missed out on the fun the rest of the family had … but perhaps not. ‘sides my stress levels are high.

E-mail exchange w/ grad student: Me: Get a copy of software package X. Him: Couldn’t. Me: it’s just like package Y which you have in hand, so use cmd. Him: tried cmd, didn’t work; should I do cmd –proper-flags. Me: yeaaah, that’s how you got Y isn’t it? try it. Him: oh, that worked. Me: [facepalm]

person-to-person exchange w/ post-doc: Me: okay, you have two programs (A and B) each of which does 1/3 of what you want done, so combine them and add the remaining 1/3 to tie it all together. Him: [shows me C++ source for A with run B.exe dropped in the middle of a routine]. Why didn’t this compile. Me: [headdesk hard] Try scooping out the guts of B from the source code and putting it in A…

Left work at 5 (a little earlier than usual for me) in anticipation of the effects of snow (and as a result of the aforementioned incidences + others). Roads are generally clear, and conditions aren’t too bad. Until I get to my street (a closed court at the with our house at the end on top of a hill) — city hasn’t been by yet (the big trucks only use us to turn around, a small truck to actually plows the street).. Turn the corner, start slip-sliding a bit but manageable. Until I see a pickup plowing one of the driveways backing out quickly right at me. Honk, stop. He quickly pulls forward. Self: “Oh, hell, I’m on a slope with no forward momentum. This will be fun.” Actually it wasn’t so bad; a bit of spinning tires and then it caught.

Wife’s evening class was cancelled, so I took the opportunity to replace her windshield wipers while there was still light. Then shovelled too much snow (back hurts) so we have some chance of getting out in the morning. And now I’m still avoiding the work I’m supposed to be doing.

Tea. Yeah, maybe I should go make myself some tea. Wonder if we have any “Good Earth”. That’s nice and strong and soothing.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:04 pm

Esteleth:
But…but…but…doesn’t everyone love a little sleet? It is so frosty and slick.
/snark (I swear, I must have made a second one at some point, cuz I have one currently and so does Portia)

Seriously though, ugh. Sleet sucks!

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:09 pm

Esteleth:
Ugh. Sleet. I just checked and we’re only getting snow, so yay for me, I guess.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:17 pm

Damn.

Another shooting.A shooting took place at a university residence hall in South Carolina on Tuesday and students and faculty were urged to stay indoors, the university said on its website.
http://news.yahoo.com/shooting-reported-south-carolina-university-college-website-023723332.html

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:27 pm

Esteleth:
Sleet sucks. So do relapses and snotty co-workers. hugs

dontpanic:
Glad you and your wife are both safe.

Tony:
Damn, indeed : ( My alma mater here in town ran an “active shooter scenario” drill last week. Hope they never have to know the real thing.

=====

I might have to go out in the snow tonight. The joys of being a small town lawyer.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:40 pm

Oh, joy. PTSD flare, feeling numb, can’t sleep, no appetite, and just wanting to curl up and hide until it goes away. (Which I know from experience does. not. work.)

On top of that, one of my very important meds is out of refills and the pharm needs to call my doc — until I get the refill, I’m rationing the last few tablets, and horribly undermedicated. (Not. Helping.)

I am really fucked up. Dunno how Partner can find me lovable at all. Don’t deserve love.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:42 pm

You DO deserve love, WMDKitty. You do.
I hope your meds come through quickly. headbonks?

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:44 pm

For everyone who needs it… and really, who doesn’t need it?… here’s a picture of my dog in her new sweater.

Yes, another new sweater. My MIL is learning to knit. :)

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:45 pm

Awww. It is so nice when people compliment you.

I’m sitting at Emerald City, having a few drinks and socializing with a few people I’ve never met (some very friendly ones). This gentleman just walked up to me, noting that I was on my laptop and asked if this was my office. Apparently he’s noticed me here before. As a bartender, I have some awareness of the people at my bar and that often translates over even when I’m on the other side of a bar–so I noticed him as well. Not in a I think he’s an attractive guy way, but in a this is a fellow bar patron. He just told me that I’m the most handsome guy in the bar every time he has come in. Awwww. If mocha skin could blush.
(he has a lovely British accent)
****
And I just had a lovely conversation with a heterosexual couple about how gay people should not exclude non gays from the bar scene. This was a couple that attended a local pageant called the Zeus Ball (related to Mardi Gras), and they were criticized by a few gay people for being there. I get the idea that there are not as many gay areas as there are heterosexual areas, and gay people need these spots to be themselves…but DAMMIT, when you have people who are accepting and friendly and actively want to show others their support, why the fuck do you want to drive them off?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:46 pm

Portia

Crying now.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:47 pm

Portia:

http://news.yahoo.com/photos/midwest-braces-for-massive-winter-storm-slideshow/pedestrian-passes-snow-covers-cars-trees-tuesday-feb-photo-172540082.html

is this related to the lovely weather you’re having?

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:48 pm

Awww, love the dog pic Joe!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:51 pm

WMDKitty:
You do deserve love.
Don’t doubt that.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:55 pm

WMDKitty
offers hanky, shoulder
I’m sorry. Is there anything you can usually do to get through such a tough time more quickly? Sorry if that’s a stressful question. : /

Tony
You are handsome. And yes, that’d be the weather. It was mostly bad because the warm temps made the snow so heavy along with being deep. It’s slushy and that’s just going to freeze and get more snow on top of it overnight. Thank goodness for my little carport so I have minimal clearing to do in the morning. I may cancel my hair appointment after all.

…I really hope I don’t get the call from a jail that I expect to get tonight.

Joe
Puppeeee cutteennnnesss :D

====

My ankle was feeling ok after elevation and ice so I moved around the house doing this and that and it quickly started hurting again, pain radiating up my calf. Whiiiine.

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:57 pm

scritches for WMDKitty. A catnip mousie is also available.
-

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 26th, 2013 at 9:58 pm

And also, kittens cuddling teddy bears.
-

Alethea H. "Crocoduck" Kuiper-Belt:

February 26th, 2013 at 9:59 pm

OMG U GAIZ ITS ON SALE: https://www.thinkgeek.com/product/e991/?srp=3

And several other tentacle themed products. I bought, umm, some. Just a few.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:00 pm

Tony:

Not being gay, I don’t have any weight in the conversation, but …if there were straight people who were gonna whine and not understand why anyone would be annoyed at their presence in non-straight space….those might be the exact people who should be run off? I dunno.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:00 pm

Joe:
Do you still think of your dog as a puppy?
Krystal has been with me for 3 or 4 years and I still call her a puppy.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:05 pm

Portia:
Actually they weren’t really complaining. They were stating it in response to a comment I made about heterosexuals being welcome here.
I can see the other side of the point, but I just cannot get past the idea that on the whole gay people want to be accepted into society and not marginalized or discriminated against for being different, so to hear of gay people that will treat others in that manner annoys me. Also, while gay rights have been advanced significantly by people in the queer community, we have also benefitted by those individuals who are heterosexual and love us. I think alienating them is ultimately harmful. I do want to retain those spheres that we queers can enjoy as places that we can be ourselves and be comfortable, but does that have to be at the expense of our allies?

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:09 pm

It’s totally up to you to conduct your activism, or what-have-you, however you like. I can only frame the ideas as how I would feel if the same thoughts were applied to women/men dichotomies. shrug No one is saying I have to take care not to alienate sympathetic men, though, so I’m gonna shut up about it because I think Rule Number One of being an advocate for a marginalized group you don’t belong to is to not tell them how to feel about issues that affect them and not you. So, run on sentence. :)

Portia’s shutting it now :)

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:09 pm

Alethea:
Nice site!
I think it was Katherine who likes Steampunk.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:12 pm

Actually, Portia, no need to shut up. I am intrigued by your perspective on the issue. I’d be curious to hear more of what you mean (though if you’re not comfortable doing so in the Lounge, feel free to email me).

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:14 pm

All I can do for now is put the sharp objects out of reach and ride it out.

Fuck, I don’t even know what triggered me this time, and that bothers me more than the PTSD itself. If I can figure out what pushed my buttons, I can usually find a way to cope with it or convince myself that I’m okay (or will be okay). The unknown… yeah. I know I’m going to sit and obsess and work myself into a knot trying to figure it out, and that can be dangerous because that “dark” part of me always tries to talk me into doing stupid self-harm-y things. This leads to me trying desperately to distract myself with anything — books, video games, fanfic — and staying up for days on end until I just crash.

I really need professional help. And possibly a medication adjustment, because the stuff I’m on, it keeps me functional and mostly-stable, but it’s not, you know, 100% effective.

But then again… what if this is as good as it gets?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:17 pm

Tony

Re: straights in gay bars

One of the reasons I love my local gay bar is precisely because nobody there is going to judge me for being disabled. And the loo is 100% wheelchair friendly.

broboxley OT:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:19 pm

important point

CALVARY CHAPEL, in retrospect, seems addictive to certain personalities the way alcohol is addictive to others,” says Larry Fike. “If you have certain kinds of hang-ups or problems, Calvary can act as an addictive kind of salve.”

being a complete dennis around any religious discussion makes me very annoying, on retrospect on this board it may be annoying here as well
http://www.metroactive.com/papers/sonoma/04.02.98/calvary-9813.html

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:26 pm

One of the stories I shared with the couple:
Back when M was alive, he and I went to Atlanta, GA for Gay Pride. While we were there, we met a bunch of really fun people, all of whom were gay men, except one heterosexual woman, A (probably 9 or 10 of us in total). A loved her gay men. In fact, IIRC, she said she spent more time with gay men than any other group of people. We all went to a gay sports bar called WOOFS. While there, some of us played pool and A was watching us. At some point, a couple of gay men at a table next to ours made some comments I overheard. Something about “What is she doing here. There’s a bar down the road for her kind.”
I was not happy, and I said so.
I went off on them, much to the surprise of the rest of the people in our group.
I’m the kind of person who wants to include others, not exclude them (obviously if you hold moral views I find reprehensible, I have absolutely nooooooo problem excluding you Hello Slymepitters)

Rev. BigDumbChimp:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:28 pm

Which Jester King beer?

Any of the barrel aged sours and saison. I has luv for them

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:32 pm

Alethea:
That site…
Oh it hurts…
I need money, because I need many of those shirts.

Rev. BigDumbChimp:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:34 pm

Um

Michael Franti (@Michaelfranti) is now following you on Twitter!

Alright then

Tigger_the_Wing, Ranged Throngs Termed A Nerd With Boltcutters:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:36 pm

Hi Hordely people, I’m so sorry that I haven’t been participating much recently, here or on PET. Not enough spoons. It’s taking me far too long to recover from the virus infection. Even reading, let alone commenting, leaves me drained and I currently have a three-second attention span. :-/

But I would really, really appreciate some advice, so I’ve spent the afternoon composing this. I hope it isn’t too much of a teal deer. Please feel free to ignore this! (Cross-posted to PET)

~~

I saw my GP on Monday and we did the usual four-weekly summary of my pain levels and form-signing necessary for me to get another four weeks’ worth of Norspan patches.

We discussed my other medications and which ones were actually useful in controlling more than one of my many and varied symptoms/disorders. I made my usual apologies for being ‘complicated’, she made her usual comment about how it was ‘interesting’ and then I joked that I couldn’t possibly be the only one in the world with my suite of disorders – no-one could be that unlucky! – and there’s probably a rare syndrome out there somewhere that fits me, but no-one has thought of applying it to me yet. And then I showed her how I had confused the pain specialist by being able to bend down, legs straight and knees together, and put my hands flat on the floor, despite over thirty years of Ankylosing Spondylitis in my spine.

She reacted as if a lightbulb had gone off in her head.

“I think I know what you’ve got, and it IS a rare syndrome!”

She sat back at her desk, got onto the computer and went to the NCBI bookshelf and showed me:

“Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, Hypermobility Type”

We went through the article (she printed it off for me, so I could read it later) and it covered all my previously-assumed-to-be-unrelated symptoms. Seriously. Cardiovascular, GI, musculoskeletal, CNS; even things I hadn’t considered personal health problems at all, like my pregnancies ending in premature rupture of membranes and very fast labours, and nearly dying from blood loss after having my daughter.

So, my dear Horde friends and acquaintances and adopted grandchildren, what do I do next? Does anyone in Australia know of someone who specialises in EDS? I’ve tried looking (online) myself, with no joy yet. My GP (who is Canadian, btw) says that the few EDS patients she has seen over the years, have had to travel to London for specialist help! Can I manage this myself? Sorry, I have a zillion questions!

P.S. My sons all have hyper-mobile joints to some degree or other. I recall my mother being able to put her hands flat on the floor when she was younger too. Partly why I never considered it seriously abnormal. Like being on the Autism spectrum, when it is your family’s ‘normal’ you don’t think about it. Oh, and while reading the 20 pages of printout the GP assigned as homework, I recalled an incident that took place about fifteen years ago; when a young man with Marfan Syndrome asked me if my eldest son (the concert pianist) had been diagnosed with it.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:41 pm

Sharing dog pics? Dog was out in the snow while I shoveled. Usually has this serious look, but he was a bit puppy-like in the snow. Jumping for tossed snowballs, burrowing his nose in the snow.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:45 pm

Tony

I do want to retain those spheres that we queers can enjoy as places that we can be ourselves and be comfortable, but does that have to be at the expense of our allies?

Yes and no. Basically, a lot of gay people have taken a sufficient degree of shit regarding it that they basically can’t relax and let their hair down among groups of straight people, especially those they don’t know well. Combine this with the fact that straight people, like other privileged groups, tend to dominate the spaces they’re in, intentionally or not, and you have a significant proportion of the gay community who would rather that they stay away entirely. This is aggravated by the fact that as straight people start to dominate the environment, it changes to be more enticing to straight people, ans soon you find that they’re making up more of the crowd, and you’ve lost all the reasons you had a gay space to begin with. There is another dynamic too, which I think may be in play in the story you told in #372: A lot of ‘gay spaces’ are really ‘gay men’s spaces, and there’s a large current of misogyny running through many parts of gay male culture. Simultaneously, the existence of bars where they can go with a low likelihood of being sexually harassed, propositioned, or assaulted it often a draw to straight women. Some gay men have a problem with this, but it’s a largely separate thing from straight couples/straight people looking to pair up start coming into things.

chigau (違う):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:47 pm

So, I’m catching-up, bottom-up on several threads, in the wrong order.
but
I am having a bath to get clean and wash my hair
whilst preventing my left knee’s wound-dressing from becoming wet
and balancing the net-book on the edge of the tub
and I need a drink.
hugs for everyone

Akira MacKenzie:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:48 pm

A couple of weeks ago I posted about my friend Jim’s Burzelic’s efforts to crowd-fund distribution of Misfit Heights, the zombie/puppet/musical film he co-created. Well, with 14 days left, they just met their $5000 goal! I don’t know if any Pharynguloids contributed, but if so, thanks so much. Jim has worked really hard on this project, and it’s great to know that it will finally get out to general audiences via the net.

There is still time left to donate, so if you’re interested, stop on by: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/unfetteredent/misfit-heights

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 10:56 pm

dontpanic:
Awwww (I seem to be saying this a lot tonight)
Cuuuuuuute dog pic!

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

Sorry, Tony, was composing a reply and got a collect call. Well, first I got a call from my brother (he never calls, I still feel like a giddy eight year old when my big brother gives me attention :D) and then got the other one. I was composing a reply which is half finished. I shall abbreviate as follows and expand maybe in an email to you later:

I just don’t want anyone to feel like I’m straightsplaining, so anyone else feel free to correct me.

That refrain of “Don’t be mean, they’re on our side” grates on my nerves a little bit when I hear it wrt feminist issues because it’s a unique type of silencing. I particularly hear it, though, from men who think I’m just a touch too aggressive or abrasive or unapologetic about calling out their perpetuation of insidious sexist tropes.

The most recent example I can think of was that fateful Valentine’s night with Jerk. We were talking about how I approach a sexist remark and its maker. I said it’s really not about the remark after a while, it’s the response. When I get a thoughtful and/or contrite response, I smooth out my ruffled feathers and have a conversation. When I get a defensive response, I go in guns blaring. Jerk suggested that this was the problem with the discussion, me being too mean. We all know how he turned out.

So it’s a button for me, and it may not be for everyone. I’ve seen it before cough JT Eberhardcough with other men, too. They say that if only we were nicer, and held their hands, and didn’t deny them access to our spaces, then we’d all be on the same happy side and they would be the best allies they could be! But what they fail to acknowledge is that by barging in and acting entitled to entrance or explanation or education, they are not fighting unearned social privilege, they are exercising it.

Dalillama’s point about attitudes towards women in the gay community are well-taken. Especially in light of the Dan Savage conversation…

Ok so that was less abbreviated than I planned.

WMDKitty – scritches

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:03 pm

WMDKitty

Sorry you’re having such a rough time of things. Maybe more medication, maybe less… I hope you can get hooked up with a professional to help you work through things. In the meanwhile, know that you ARE worthy of love, even if it doesn’t feel like it today. And stay busy!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:03 pm

Dalillama:
I didn’t think of the sexist element of it. The couple I’ve been talking to have given me a bit of information, but really, I wasn’t there, so I don’t know the full context of their treatment. I can only speculate.
My situation is one I can talk about. I don’t know the motivation of the guys in question, but they made A feel very unwelcome, and me, quite mad. Actually, IIRC, I was at the point of being so mad I was shaking.
I completely see where you’re coming from, and considered that as one reason some gay people are resistant to heterosexuals intruding in one of the few spaces for us. In fact, the bar I come to has a Drink N Drown night twice a week, and many heterosexuals come out for it (pay $10 and drink all you want from 9-1). There have been nights when I’ve seen many attractive men, only to realize they’re hetero (I keep wanting to use the word straight, but after someone commented here a few weeks ago about that word, I’ve been avoiding it), and I’ve been frustrated. But I usually remember that I want heterosexuals to be comfortable around queers. I want them to think of us as no different than anyone else. So for me, I weight the ultimate benefits of acceptance against the costs of them “intruding” on “my” territory.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:07 pm

Portia:
ok, I can grok that completely.
I think this couple was different, since it didn’t seem that they were complaining about the way they were treated, more stating it as something that occured. They mentioned nothing about creating a fuss. I’m of two minds on the subject. I can completely understand the frustration of having heteros (is it ok to abbreviate the word this way) “intrude” in queer spaces. I just try to look at the long term benefits. Perhaps I’m being overly optimistic, but I think the day will come when being gay is such a non issue that only a smalllllll minority will take note of (for instance) two men holding hands walking down the street.

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:11 pm

Anybody have a spare hug to toss my way? Stressful work situation. Court in the morning. Personal element. Need to sleep but too nervous.

Only speak in sentence fragments.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:13 pm

Well golly, I’m reminded of some of the frustration I’ve felt dealing with joey in the Thunderdome. His absolutist position doesn’t allow for the nuances of human interactions. Seeing Portia and Dalillama’s comments on this subject has been a reminder of the nuances of so much of how we interact. My experience…Dalillama’s…Portia’s…none of them are “right” or “wrong”. They reflect the complexity of our interactions with others.

chigau (違う):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:16 pm

Portia
have a hug
and as a bonus
a kitteh on your lap

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:17 pm

Oooooh kitteh! :D

Portia, snowbound:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:23 pm

I’m gonna snuggle this virtual kitty and try to wind down so I can be something like functional in court tomorrow. I ♥ you all, good night!

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:24 pm

Portia

Moar kittehs

Crazy how they can’t hear their own names, but if you run a can opener, they’ll hear it from a mile away, innit?

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:24 pm

Portia, HUGS. Home things work out for the best.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:27 pm

WMDKitty:
Are you talking about your kitties? All of mine hear and recognize their names.

dontpanic:

February 26th, 2013 at 11:32 pm

HomeHope Ahhhk. I’m the king of typos! And a I’d make a terrible copy editor.

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:38 pm

dontpanic:
I might challenge you for the king of typos crown.
I’m pretty good HERE.
On my phone, however…

chigau (違う):

February 26th, 2013 at 11:44 pm

I just read this comment on another blog

So what if they had to choose between garlic and Nutella?

I refuse to give context because the question is so Important® by itself.

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:01 am

WMDKitty

Crazy how they can’t hear their own names, but if you run a can opener, they’ll hear it from a mile away, innit?

So that’s why you name them WHRRRZZZSHHHH-GNK-TING

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:03 am

Ugh

Morning.

Scritches for WMDKitty, hugs for everyone

Cute dog photos, Joe and dontpanic.

I skimmed the fathate thread, and saw the werewolf bit, but can’t respond now. Cerberus probably did a great job anyway. I’ll read later.

Have to go to work soon.
Ugh

Cerberus from Time Forgot:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:13 am

WMDKitty @351

You are plenty lovable. And those of us who love people with a lot of scars (whether internal or external) stay because we want to. Because that person is beautiful, lovable, and so very worth it. Because they bring so much more joy to our lives than they bring frustration or rejection. And because we understand that what is going on isn’t either their fault or our fault, but the trauma and the healing thereof.

You will get through this and all through it, your partner will still love you just the same and ze’ll tell you much better than I could. Appropriate Physical Gesture of Affection

Portia @386

Strong Hugz

Portia @340

NRE means New Relationship Energy.

Basically, it’s the term for that heady rush of novelty, excitement, connection, possible intense sexual chemistry, overromanticization, and overall endless good feeling people often have at the beginning of new relationships. You know, the whole “we get along amazing, the sex is godly, we laugh together all night, and I don’t think it’s a bad idea to move across country and get a new job for this person” kind of near-drunken blindness that can strike us when we’re exploring a hot new relationship.

It’s a period that lasts anywhere from a day or two to a year (though usually around 3 months) and is largely responsible for relationship structures like “serial monogamy”, dating new partners briefly, rapidly in succession so as to always be experiencing NRE.

Pretty much most cultural depictions of love show NRE as “true love”, which is why the “happily ever after”s always seem to come so quickly after they first meet and “everything is wonderful with this person”.

It can also be dangerous, because NRE can especially blind us to red flags and many abusers exploit this to disconnect potential victims from their support networks in this period so they’re already stuck by the time things are starting to go sour.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:23 am

Tony

Most cats do know their name, yes… but they have very selective hearing!

Cerberus

It can also be dangerous, because NRE can especially blind us to red flags and many abusers exploit this to disconnect potential victims from their support networks in this period so they’re already stuck by the time things are starting to go sour.

Ayup. That’s how I ended up stuck with the Jackass. By the time I twigged to his games, he had me ground down to nothing.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 12:58 am

WHY

DOESN’T

ANYTHING

FUCKING

WORK?!

chigau (違う):

February 27th, 2013 at 1:04 am

Azkyroth #401
speaking for myself
because the IT crew came in on the so-called weekend and re-configured the whole shebang.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:05 am

Gracie has decided to hang out with me tonight, which is awesome.

What’s not so awesome is that she just claimed the bed…

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 1:09 am

They say that if only we were nicer, and held their hands, and didn’t deny them access to our spaces, then we’d all be on the same happy side and they would be the best allies they could be! But what they fail to acknowledge is that by barging in and acting entitled to entrance or explanation or education, they are not fighting unearned social privilege, they are exercising it.

I don’t know. Speaking as someone who predominantly experiences privilege from the other side as the (lived-experience, I’m sure this isn’t “intentional”) calculated withholding of explanations of things that my failure to “just get” is treated as a deep, devastating character flaw* I find this sort of phrasin g really difficult to get behind.

I’ll try to think about it more.

we HAVE collectively grown the fuck up and admitted that people not on the autism spectrum have nontrivial privilege, right?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:27 am

Azkyroth

I’d say it’s a specific form of able-bodied privilege.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 1:35 am

My experience suggests it’s qualitatively different but that there are insturctive parallels that ight be drawn. I just remember whether it “really counted” as privlege being an issue the last time I didn’t/couldn’t hold back my feelings on the m,atter, thought I suppuse someone will be along to “coprrect” my experiences shortly.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:57 am

Hugs* for those that need them. I keep meaning to post some of L’s cute dog pics, but I never get around to making an account on one of the photosharing sites.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:57 am

Azkyroth

Point is, we all end up getting the short end because the “normal” folks just don’t grok our experiences. They have the privilege of having working bodies and properly wired brains.

In high school — I don’t recall the precise circumstances that brought it about — some able-bodied students spent the day (or was it the week?) in wheelchairs. I had people come up to me after that, saying they really had no clue how hard it is to do everything from a seated position. I don’t know how much reach that had, but I like to think a few minds were opened by that.

It’s too bad you can’t temporarily tweak their brains so they can have a taste of what life on the spectrum is like.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:59 am

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2013/02/22/thunderdome-21/comment-page-1/#comment-570731

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:05 am

Azkyroth,

Please, understand that when people make comments such as the one you quote in your #404, it is referring to the vast majority of people who deliberately don’t understand, not because of being on the spectrum, but because of being assholes.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:07 am

Ok, not necessarily assholes all of them, but not on the spectrum either, but being privileged.

Cerberus: Fucking Oppression, Man:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:22 am

Azkyroth @401

Because of the space elves, obviously!

opposablethumbs:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:32 am

tigger_the_wing, there’s someone I know of in another part of the internet (livejournal) who has Ehler-Danloss and quite often mentions things going on in relation to it on her LJ. She’s in the US, so I assume she probably won’t know particularly about people or resources in Australia, but she seems knowledgeable about the condition itself and about managing it, and into passing on info. I don’t “know” her particularly well but would you like me to ask her permission to link you to her LJ so you could contact her? Just a thought.

rq:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:02 am

hugs to those who want/need, substitute for scritches or shoulder-pat as desired.

No FossilFishy anywhere? Anyone have email connections? Starting to worry…

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:31 am

Morning
So, the kid is coming to life again, she even picks fights with her sister again AND she slept in her own bed all night (sick kids are allowed in the parental bed). And I’m beginning to feel mostly human again, too. Still, my throat hurts like I tried to drink some troll cocktail in Ankh Morpork.

Assorted hugs all around
tea
Don’t hit me, don’t hit me. I usually drink mine cold, but not real tea-tea but the herbal, fruit and Roiboos varieties. Tastes better than water, especially if you carry it half a day in a bottle. My sister does the sugar delivery with coffee. I think she’s at cubes per cup now.

Dalillama
Oh shit that sucks. Being denied access to my children is about the worst thing I can imagine and I don’t pretend that this is due to blood and genes. (hugs)

Joe
Yay for Bossnurse

birgerjohanson

I hope stereotype threat can account for the statistical blip that created books like “The Bell Curve”. Not that facts wil stop a bad meme, racial inferiority will live on in memespace alongside The Elders of Zion.

I’d first like to see some reliable tests for a “general intelligence” first. Because so far I don’t see them. And I’d like to see somebody control for factors like prenatal care, maternal health, healthcare, infant and childhood nutririon and education…

Tony

And I just had a lovely conversation with a heterosexual couple about how gay people should not exclude non gays from the bar scene.

I can understand their frustration. It drove me nuts to be the first to arrive to a night out and then being subsequently ignored by the waiters until our gay friends showed up, but I can understand that gay people aren’t too happy to have their spaces overrun by hipsters, which was an issue at that place and time. It felt for the gay community like they were driven out of their spaces, being reduced, again, to some cliché that was part of the “flair”.
In my experience, and I know this sounds snobby, you had to be the right kind of straight person. Somebody who didn’t go to a gay bar or disco because of the “exotic flair” but because I wanted to spend time with my friends who happened to be gay.

Alethea
Not much help here, but yay?
I mean, there must be somebody in this world who knows this stuff.

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:59 am

I suppose I should introduce myself. Long time lurker, first time poster. I’m an atheist. The religion I don’t believe in is the Anglican flavour of Christianity. My hobbies are Opera, roleplaying, HP Lovecraft and trolling the catholic church.

Sorry if this makes me appear egotistic and intrusive, I’m like that a lot of the time.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:09 am

Hello and welcome to the Lounge, dongiovanni.

carlie:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:37 am

Tigger – I know nothing about it, but congrats on getting a diagnosis at last. It must feel good to at least be able to put a name to it and wrap everything up under it.

Welcome, dongiovanni!

richardh:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:26 am

On Fata Morgana, mirages and the like, read Minnaert’s classic The Nature of Light and Colour in the Open Air , one of my all-time favourite non-fiction books. It explains all kinds of interesting atmospheric phenomena in a mostly non-technical way, and I’d recommend it to anyone who ever goes outdoors and notices things. Bonus points for anyone who manages to see Haidinger’s Brush after reading it!

(I don’t have the time to be a regular here and really get to know people, but if it’s not too presumptuous, please consider this a kind of abstract hug for anyone who’s feeling in need of one!)

rq:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:04 am

What the Story should have been: Djesus Uncrossed.

roundofhugs

carlie:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:21 am

Hello, richardh!

Snow day.
Child 2′s reaction: Yay! I’m going to make myself eggs and watch tv!
Child 1′s reaction: Yay! I’m going back to bed.

Alethea H. "Crocoduck" Kuiper-Belt:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:48 am

Hi, Dongiovanni & richardh!

I’ve just been out singing, so I am very happy! Bach Magnificat, just glorious. I’m thrilled to be back in choir after so long. Even though an evening rehearsal is still quite hard for me, and I seem to have lost an octave and a half that I hope will come back with practice. My bottom notes just disappear, very odd. I managed to get the odd E&F above middle C when in context, and my top A seems to be back so that’s already better than last week where I had only one octave G-G.

Anyway, I feel I’m very slowly getting my life back. Weekly choir and yoga this year, and gentle relaxing holidays with my friend. I’m pissed off that I couldn’t go to Vietnam with my bloke and ride Urals down the Ho Chi Minh trail, but there will be other adventures one day.

Giliell, were you confusing me with Tigger just now? We do both have health problems and live in Canberra, but other than that we’re not the same!

Ogvorbis:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:55 am

Happy Thursday.

Wife has a two hour delay. She will be working her street corner in rain and wind. Bleah.

triskelethecat:

Thanks for the support. And hugs to you.

WMDKitty:

Safe hugs.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:03 am

Quick question before I turn in for the night… morning… whatever.

Am I the only one who has somehow managed to self-trigger?

Katherine Lorraine, Tortue du Désert avec un Coupe-Boulon:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:18 am

@WMD:

Nope. I’ve self-triggered myself a few times at work. Worst part is I don’t know what the trigger was, all I know is that immediately afterwards I started going into major panick attack mode.

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:22 am

No, you’re not, WMDKitty. I do that sometimes.

Ogvorbis:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:48 am

WMDKittty:

I trigger myself all the time.

TRIGGER WARNING:

As I lay awake last night trying to sleep, I kept going around and around and around with the idea that future abuse was my fault, that I should have told.

But I did tell. I did tell. I told the den leader of (I think?) the Webelos. I didn’t go into any real details, but I told him that Abuser had been doing things to some of the boys. And I was told that I was a liar. How dare I accuse him, a good family man, of doing anything? And was told that if I said anything, how would he support his wife and children? So I was made to apologize to him. In person. Just the two of us. Alone. And he punished me for lying about the way that he taught us. And he punished me by doing the exact same thing that he was punishing me for accusing him of doing.

So fuck this shit. It was not my fucking fault. I told and wasn’t believed. I told and was informed that I was lying. I told and was raped again to punish me for lying about him raping me. I told and it got me nowhere.

A year later, he left and moved down to west central Arizona and scouting kinda collapsed. I wonder if someone else told the right person? A kid who was not known for telling tales told and was believed?

And I wish to hell that my mind would let these memories out without all the angst. Damnit, this memory is good news for me, this memory is a positive, why do I have to go through so much shit and guilt to get there?

And when I think back on this, I sound like a fucking textbook case of child abuse. I volunteered to join the scouts which put me in a position to be abused (guilt!). I was manipulated into drinking too much soda to put me in a position that was so embarrassing that I would be afraid to expose the rape in fear of my wetting my pants would become public knowledge. He took photos of me with other boys which shamed me. I was manipulated into abusing others, into bringing others into the abuse which meant that I was not only complicit, but saw myself as an abuser. Strangers, a couple with two children. walked into a campsite while I was being abused and the apologized and kept going! And when I told, no one believed me. And I have spent most of my life blaming myself. I sound like a fucking cliche.

And now, rather than feeling depressed, I feel fucking angry. Mad. Where the fuck were the adults who were supposed to be adults? Why didn’t the parents say something? I did what I was supposed to do and got punished again. FUCKING ASSHOLES!!!!

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:05 am

Alethea and Tigger
Yes, sorry, mixed you up

Ogvorbis
Big, big, hugs
I’m glad that memory finally made it through to you.

So, I’m feeling well enough to go to work tonight

rq:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:36 am

somanyhugs, Ogvorbis.

+++

In other news, I think I just came this close to burning the house down. O ooo…

Pteryxx:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:46 am

all the hugs for Ogvorbis

—trigger warning—-

Not only was none of it your fault, you DID try to stop it. You did try. You DID try.

You’re not a mere cliche – the textbook example is the abuser’s, by cultivating a family-man, nice-guy image as a pre-emptive defense against any victim that might come forward. It’s ‘How Predators Get Away With It 101′.

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:02 am

Moments of Mormon Madness: BYU professors of very little brain are digging around in Egypt, looking for proof that the mormon Book of Abraham (one of Joseph Smith’s many scams) is historically accurate.

Legitimate professors, real Egyptologists, view BYU professor Kerry Muhlestein with scorn [emphasis mine]:

“I watched the three videos, and I don’t agree with any of it. The ancient Egyptians had no concept of Abraham, so I don’t know where he gets these comparisons… And No, most Egyptologists do not agree, despite what Kerry says. I know Kerry, but I do not have much respect for his work. Now I have even less. The fact that he is digging in Egypt is even more worrisome… This PhD was awarded before I arrived at UCLA, although I know that Kerry finished his text based dissertation after only two years of Egyptian language training, which is rather laughable.

Have you read Robert Ritner’s work about this in Journal of Near Eastern Studies? It’s the best out there… Kerry is just spinning out the same Mormon rhetoric. What is different is: Mormons are funding PhDs in Egyptology and Biblical Studies and then funding positions at BYU and elsewhere and passing these people off as experts, when they are only ideologically driven researchers, not experts interested in actual evidence.

Excerpt is from an ex-mormon discussion going on here:
http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,808394

Audley Z. Darkheart (liar and scoundrel):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:05 am

OMG JOE YOUR DOGGEH IS KEY-YOOT!

dies

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:11 am

A Moment of Mormon Madness that neatly illustrates the fuck-the-victim attitude toward suffering:

When I see the physical and emotional pain Ashtyn is going through, I feel sad and have shed tears with and for her. However, if I had the ability to take this cancer away from her, I wouldn’t. You heard me right. I would not take this cancer from her. Why would I rob her of this life changing experience?

Ashtyn chose this before coming to earth. She knew the pain she would experience. She also knew the blessings that would be hers from going through it. Lives would be changed. Her life would be changed. Every moment of her trial will be worth it. She will never want to give back what she gains and what she learns. It will be precious to her. So as a mother, why would I ever take that away from her? I am happy for her that she is the kind of girl that God has trusted to go through this with faith, strength, and dignity. God has every confidence in her. I do too.

From this mormon mommy blog: http://ashtynsarmy.com/she-chose-this/

jose:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:11 am

Gotta love Ed Clint. Oh, you criticize evo psych? Here’s some new research that improves on the aspects that have received criticism. That proves your criticisms are wrong. No, Ed, all that proves the criticisms were effective! :D

His post is giving me some serious giggles. He so thinks he has shown critics! You show ‘em, Ed! ^__^

ChasCPeterson:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:19 am

link it

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:24 am

[rant]
This college wants to drive me crazy.
So, you may remember that some weeks ago I despaired about not being able to find the central exams secretary which I was told to hand in some applications by the central exams comitee, only to find out that those things are actually the same and went there and handed stuff in.
So, now I get a mail from a third secretary (exams secretary of the faculty) which asks me to hand in that application plus my high school diploma.
I write back: Well, I handed in the application, but I didn’t know I had to hand in the highschool diploma again because I didn’t start college now, I only changed to a different mode.
I get a mail back (in a tone that says “don’t waste my time, silly girl”) saying that I only changed with the Central Students Secretary (another institution…) but I need to hand in that application.
So, I worte back that I handed in the very application she sent me at the central exams secretary as required by the central exams comitee, but I’m happy to send it in again if she’d like me to.
I haven’t heard from her since, I hope that’s because she gets her stuff in order…

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:25 am

Expect to see Fox News, Rush Dimbulb, and all right-wing bloggers repeating on an every-five-minutes cycle the “fact” that Obama Care will increase the deficit. Alabama Republican Jeff Sessions is the perp. You can view a video of his presentation to the Budget Committee, and read analysis here.

… [Sessions speaking]“According to the GAO under a realistic set of assumptions the health care law will increase the deficit by 7/10th percent of GDP or roughly $6.2 trillion over the next 75 years. $6.2 trillion unfunded liability of the United States. In other words, the GAO reveals that the big tax increases in the bill come nowhere close to covering the massive spending.”

That seems like a pretty big deal, doesn’t it? For several years, literally every independent study of “Obamacare” has shown that the law will save the nation hundreds of billions of dollars. And yet, there was Sessions pointing to a GAO study that suggested the exact opposite. Indeed, the far-right senator boasted, “The results of this report confirm everything critics and Republicans have been saying about the health care bill and reveal the dramatic falsehoods that were used to push it to passage.”

How’s that possible? As Igor Volsky explained, “The Alabama senator asked the office to estimate what would happen if the cost containment provisions in the law — the Independent Payment Advisory Board, excise tax on high-cost plans, and reductions in Medicare payments to providers — are ‘phased out over time’ while the coverage provisions remain.”

This is roughly the equivalent of the Boston Celtics’ coach asking someone on his staff, “Figure out what our record would be if our opponents’ points didn’t count.” Then, soon after, the coach called a press conference to declare, “Good news everyone! We’re undefeated! We’ve won every game in a shutout!”…

By the same logic, Jeff Sessions can prove that my car is an ineffective method of transportation if he takes away its engine and wheels….

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:27 am

In reference to my post @437: A summary of conservative media echoing Jeff Session’s misleading claims is presented here.

Excerpt:

Limbaugh: GAO Said That “Obamacare Will Increase The Long Term National Deficit By 6.2 Trillion.” Rush Limbaugh also discussed the GAO report, saying it showed that “Obamacare will increase the long term national deficit by 6.2 trillion.” He added: “It’s not saving anybody any money. It’s not reducing your premiums by $2500. It’s not balancing the budget. It’s not reducing the deficit. Obamacare — another way to put this — Obamacare will result in this country spending $6.2 trillion it otherwise would not spend. It’s the only way to look at this. If we had not made any changes in our health care system, we wouldn’t be spending this 6.2 trillion.” [Premiere Radio Networks, The Rush Limbaugh Show, 2/26/13]

Ogvorbis:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:03 am

So if the revenue and cost containment measures are removed, the health care reform act will cost more? Shocking.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:21 am

What kind of a fucking idiot asks a person working nearly for free how come they aren’t working somewhere better!?

And how come there are so many such idiots at a single place of work!? I’m starting to realize why are country is fucked. The people here are obviously absolute morons.

One of these days I’m going to answer one of them with “Well, it was a tough decision, but in the end, the amazing salary decided it”. Maybe they won’t even get the sarcasm.

And now I almost cried in the tram because I didn’t get the ticket to a movie today, a movie I could only see today and for which you could only get the free ticket today.

Yep, I’m perfectly right in the head. Sure.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:28 am

And my father never ever greets me when I come home. I mean, I know being a nice person is not his thing (this is the person who, when you tell him you are going out, often answers with “what do I care? go”), but he could at least mutter a fucking acknowledgement to a member of his family .

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:32 am

Morning folks.

Beatrice, sorry you missed your movie. Especially since it was free. :(

Azkyroth, the assholes can get bent. Your experiences are real and valid, and no asshat can come around and “correct” them for you after the fact. And it is of course a matter of privilege when people tell you to “just deal” or complain when you don’t “get it”.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:33 am

Um, sorry for excessive venting about all kinds of stupid things.

I forgot what I want to comment on, so I’ll just leave some hugs here, extra for Ogvorbis. I’m glad you made another breakthrough.

Matt Penfold:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:33 am

Why, when calculating the cost of healthcare, do those opposed to universal healthcare never take into consideration the cost of not providing healthcare ? I know they are bit harder to calculate, and require a bit more work, but they are doable.

glodson:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:41 am

Why, when calculating the cost of healthcare, do those opposed to universal healthcare never take into consideration the cost of not providing healthcare ?

I would guess they already know how that would roughly work out. Or worse, they already have done the estimations and want to ignore that little problem.

JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:44 am

Ogborbis,
more hugs

———–Trigger Warning!——————-

Pteryxx,
all the hugs for Ogvorbis*

—trigger warning—-

Not only was none of it your fault, you DID try to stop it. You did try. You DID try.

You’re not a mere cliche – the textbook example is the abuser’s, by cultivating a family-man, nice-guy image as a pre-emptive defense against any victim that might come forward. It’s ‘How Predators Get Away With It 101′.

Hell, even if the abuse isn’t the textbook family-man, nice-guy image the people around them will lie, pretend and deny to themselves and others in order to create that image for the abuser.

My father was not a nice-guy, family-man. He was an alcoholic, partied, left me alone for weeks to go hunting (best weeks of my life), and worked two jobs to support his habit. Yet we still needed friends to keep the power on and the friend of the family landlord kept giving us breaks on rent.

He was the golden boy football player, son of a firefighter and a teacher who joined the Army to serve his country. Hard to get more “down home American boy” than that. But he wasn’t the good guy anymore and every one knew that – they just couldn’t admit it. So they looked the other way and I often found myself lying to cover my father (to make him look better). Family, and his friends would scold me for lying IF the lie didn’t work, make sense or didn’t make him look good. They needed the Golden Boy. They kept the Golden Boy going and I was sacrificed to make it happen. He’s still there, still going and now I’m just the ungrateful bitch who my mother turned against him and his family. snort
He’s still using me.

rq:

February 27th, 2013 at 10:49 am

Beatrice
hugs and a hot chocolate! Or something… :(
Can I ask what movie it was?
And morehugs about just having (another?) crappy day.

Giliell
I had a similar situation with work when I went back after #2, I had to get a new photo ID, which means hand in some salon photos and all that crap. So I handed in a set, my boss handed them up the chain, and a week later… I get a note on my desk saying Hand in those photos! from someone in bookkeeping. After a few phone calls, I ended up handing in a second set the next day. A week later, I got another note with strong words about my attitude towards the job and a phone call from bookkeeping about not having handed in any photos. So I called the lady who was supposed to receive the photos directly, and told her I’d handed in photos twice (my boss backed me up). She spent about a minute looking through a filing cabinet, at the end of which I heard a mumbled “I guess the new girl put them away abitdifferentlythankyoubye…” Had similar issues when I tried to correct my address, which they’d written wrong even when I’d submitted it correctly, twice.

tl;dr: I hate official institutions like that, because nobody ever seems to know what someone else is doing, and if something goes missing or doesn’t appear, it’s obviously because the person submitting did not submit. I ♥ NOT bureaucracy.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 11:05 am

rq,

People are idiots and I’m frustrated with everything in my life.

Thanks for the hugs and chocolate.

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 27th, 2013 at 11:40 am

Plenty of spare hugs for Portia.
-
Tigger: Surely, if at last you know it’s True Name, you are in an improved position to correctly treat it?
-

So what if they had to choose between garlic and Nutella?

I refuse to give context because the question is so Important® by itself.

:) :) :)
-
dongiovanni, Welcome In! Opera doesn’t do anything for me, and while I don’t troll the RCC, I do derive considerable pleasure from their current cockroaches-scuttling-for-the-baseboards reaction to the exposure of their personal and institutional misdeeds. Roleplaying games (tabletop!) and HPL, on the other tentacles, touch me where I live.

So…dangling bait…what are your views on Horses and peas?
-
Howdy, richardh! returning abstract hug
-
Ogvorbis: hugs. It was indeed not your fucking shit. The adults you told were derelect in their duties/resposibilities. They preferred (like the Catholic Church) to take the easy way out, refuse to listen to the victim, and cover it all up. Fuck ‘em sideways!
-
Giliell: Glad to hear that you and the offspring are feeling better.
-

In other news, I think I just came this close to burning the house down. O ooo…

Deliberately, or by accident? And in either case, where were the Horses, when this was going down? ‘Cause if you can’t see ‘em, there’s no telling what They were getting up to.
-
chocolate-covered hugs for Beatrice.
-

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 27th, 2013 at 12:18 pm

I Don’t Always Run Around The House
-

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:35 pm

This is a follow up to my post @431. Dr. Kara Cooney, who was the star of her own TV show Out of Egypt on the Discovery channel, is the professor quoted in the scathing opinion of mormon “Egyptologist” BYU professor Kerry Muhlestein.

Janine: Hallucinating Liar:

February 27th, 2013 at 12:55 pm

Lynna, what you have linked to at #433 is truly one of the most ethically reprehensible things I have read.

She choose to have cancer? She fucking choose to have cancer?

This is the flip side of The Secret. (Ask me again why I have New Age as much as any other religion.)

I think it is already time to reread Bright-sided: How the Relentless Promotion of Positive Thinking Has Undermined America by Barbara Ehrenreich.

Crip Dyke, MQ, Right Reverend Feminist FuckToy of Death & Her Handmaiden:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:34 pm

Og –

You deserved different. You deserved to have your autonomy and body respected. You deserved to be taken seriously when you told others that they hadn’t been respected. You deserved so much.

And your reaction is completely understandable, even the part when you were upset with yourself. But I’m glad you’re at the anger stage because it’s now when it’s a bit easier to here something with less risk of it sounding as if you are being blamed again: You deserve to be treated better by yourself.

I hope the anger doesn’t turn inappropriately inward. THose patterns can be hard to change, and I hope to goodness gracious that this shift for you augures a shift both profound and important. You deserved better. You still deserve better than this aftermath, even from yourself. I hope you get it, and soon.

My absolute best,

CD

opposablethumbs:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

Drive-by hugschocolatebaconandwhisky to all who would care for some, and holy shit Ogvorbis that sounds pretty major. You did report, in spite of everything, and the bastards let you down wholesale. I don’t know whether to be furious again or glad that this particular memory has come forward.
.
Janine, yes to spitting tacks at this aspect of New Age crap as much as any other – victim-blaming by any other name is just as fucking vile. Even if it’s the parent desperate beyond reason to find a way of bearing their own pain by denying reality, it’s just as vile in what it says about the child.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:44 pm

So, back from work, so I should be physically and financially able to go grocery shopping tomorrow*

rq
Yeah, blame it on the new girl…
I have no problem sending them the fucking stuff again, but
A) how am I supposed to know?
B) I feel like Asterix in the movie when he needs to get a certain certificate…

beatrice
Yep, people are idiots.
Have you tried excessive politeness with your dad? Like saying “Yes, dad, I’m also very glad to be home and to see you” It works with mine….
No, we’re not in dire straits. It’s just that I usually time the week’s expenses so that I try to get along with a certain amount each week. But I was a hog on Saturday… And actually, since the only healthy person ate in kindergarten anyway, there wasn’t really a need for it so far

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 27th, 2013 at 1:48 pm

hugs* to Ogvorbis , Beatrice, Portia et al.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 2:05 pm

Please, understand that when people make comments such as the one you quote in your #404, it is referring to the vast majority of people who deliberately don’t understand, not because of being on the spectrum, but because of being assholes.

I try. I, at minimum, have a backlog of feeling trivialized and erased, and I have had the experience of having that distinction explicitly denied and the suggestion of its existence belittled before, and I was in a really bad emotional place last night. Sorry. :/

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:05 pm

Janine @452

Lynna, what you have linked to at #433 is truly one of the most ethically reprehensible things I have read.

Yes, and that attitude is pervasive in the morridor. I suppose that mormon women and girls who are raped also signed up for that in the pre-existence.

I ran into a lesser version of this mormon viewpoint when my mother was dying. All the hospice personnel were mormons. They never tired of telling me what a blessing I was receiving by having to act as caretaker for my mother. Those ladies would even call me on the phone to preach that shit. One of them insisted that I stop trying to earn a living while I was taking care of my mother because, “Now is the time. This is your opportunity to give. Your mother should be your priority.” Normal social boundaries are alien to them.

Krasnaya Koshka:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

Lynna @433 — That is one of the most horrific things I’ve ever read. I’m stunned.

Beatrice — Your comments on the Dan Savage post were wonderful. When I think Dan Savage, I think of his horrible advice to lesbians when I first read him years ago. I was disgusted by him and cannot help but be disgusted by him now. I never read anything by him fat-shaming so I can’t comment on that but I wanted to say:

You’re absolutely right in what you wrote. And what rq and Parrowing and Portia and Illuminata backed up.

I have no contract with my gf about how much weight she may gain or lose. That seems freakin’ creepy. I fell in love with my gf because of her thoughts and her voice and her laugh and the way she moves and the way she treats others. She’s an amazing woman and if she changes her physicality it makes no difference to me. I find her sexually appealing because I love her.

My gf is a big woman. She was a Soviet champion rower in her youth (10 hours a day every day for ten years) so, while she is larger than most she’s also fitter than most and can run circles around nearly anyone. I call her a machine because she needs little sleep and never gets sick.

She also has some sort of epilepsy that is degenerative. I don’t know if I believe this because her doctors also said she’d die by 40 and she’s now 45 (as is her twin). She definitely does have epilepsy and has seizures. I’m used to this. BUT even if she at some point was incapacitated it would not lessen my love for her. It would not lessen my attraction. (Of course it would lessen the sex, but who cares?)

So I wanted to assure you, Beatrice, that your interpretation of a loving relationship is correct. You did the right thing and you made great arguments. I applaud you.

TRIGGER WARNING~

Ogvorbis — Your thoughts often echo mine. I’ve thought the same things over and over but we really were just children and we hold none of the responsibility. It was not our fault. I promise you, it wasn’t.

I was sort of blissfully not thinking about any of my past until it all hit me when I was 27 and then it kept hitting me at odd times afterwards. “If only I’d…” “But what if…” You have to stop that. I know it’s hard. None of it was your idea. And you fucking tried, man. Like I did. You told adults, like I did.

Please, I don’t mean for you to stop expressing. I think it’s very good for you to do so. But it wasn’t your fault. You were a KID!!!

Also, WMDKitty: Yes, it’s super easy for me to set off my PTSD though I never think I’m having a panic attack. I usually think I’m having a heart attack or something else fatal though I’ve been very fortunately extremely healthy in my lifetime. Not knowing what sets it off is the worst, I agree. I am accustomed to thinking I’m a loser or just stupid.

Janine: Hallucinating Liar:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

And who is supposed to take care of you while you are jobless and having the blessing of caring for your dying mother?

Oh, wait. You should not have a job. You should be married, have the blessings of taking care of a household and be supported by your husband.

broboxley OT:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:17 pm

looks like my new gig is in fargo nd start in two weeks….2 WEEKS HOLY FUCK! I NEED TO GET GOING

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:28 pm

And who is supposed to take care of you while you are jobless and having the blessing of caring for your dying mother?

Oh, wait. You should not have a job. You should be married, have the blessings of taking care of a household and be supported by your husband.

Exactly, Janine.

Any decent woman would have a husband and would be more than happy to kill herself with 24/7 care of an Alzheimer’s patient with cancer. I am not decent. I am fucking Satan. (Wait. That could be interpreted in more than one way.) I am Satan on wheels. Watch me roll.

I did a damn good job of taking care of my mother. And years later I still suffer from PTSD as a result, though the negative effects, and the frequency of the flashbacks has diminished over time.

rq the kutalikleptomanic:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:30 pm

cicely
re: burning down the house
I believe no Horses were involved. Rather, I was a victim of Insufficient Information, brought on by Casual (or at least, Unconscious) Sexism, by being uninformed about the Imperativeness of the Plugged-in White Plug that Should Never Be Unplugged (and which also should be Checked First in case furnace heat and pressure are over the red line). thinks for a bit I take it back. I wasn’t this close to burning the house down; but this close to blowing (parts of) it up.
Meh. Next time Husband gives me a furnace heating tutorial, I’m going to make him explain more than the one dial. (We’re currently on a manually-fed wood/coal heating system, with which I happen to spend the majority of hours, and yet I am kept in the dark about most of the functions of all the cute little dials. In my offense, I never asked, either…)

Krasnaya Koshka
I hope your gf is as fine as possible for as long as possible!
And the fat-shaming conversations always make me think of my sister, who goes from overweight to fit back and forth quite (ir)regularly, through no fault of her own. It all depends on the state of her mind, her job, time, season, etc. And I hate anyone suggesting that she is 100% responsible for maintaining some sort of physical ideal because it’s in a relationship contract.

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:48 pm

Link dump:
The origin of ovoviviparity in coelacanths some 245 million years ago. With a link to the free paper.
Discovery of what is claimed to be the hat of the Korean king who developed the Korean alphabet in the early 15th century. Contains what would be the earliest known specimen of writing in the Korean alphabet. I hope it’s genuine; would a king have “king” (the Chinese character 王) written on his hat, and that 3 times?

chocolate-covered hugs for Beatrice.

:-D

And my father never ever greets me when I come home. I mean, I know being a nice person is not his thing (this is the person who, when you tell him you are going out, often answers with “what do I care? go”), but he could at least mutter a fucking acknowledgement to a member of his family .

In isolation, that’d just mean he’s against useless rituals. He can see you, and he knows you know he can see you – so why say it out loud? For me, greeting is a chore. I sometimes avoid being seen by people who’d recognize me so I don’t need to greet them when I know full well we’re not gonna have a conversation anyway.

“What do I care? Go” is an expression of trust: he feels he doesn’t need to know all the time where exactly you are, because you can handle yourself.

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 2:58 pm

scrolling up instead of going home

BTW, the paper I just finished correcting the page proofs of will be open-access! :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

Now I feel rude and stupid for not keeping up with you and your activities. [sad face] I’m only a little more than two years behind in the Pharyngula universe.

But you have very good reasons for that! shudder

Happy smiles for the postdoc position!

^_^

I guess I could introduce you to my daughter, who admires your brilliance, the next time you travel to NYC. (She is married, so no sexual or romantic innuendo is intended.)

I’m sure that would be interesting! I suggest the American Museum of Natural History as a venue ^_^

Cerberus: Fucking Oppression, Man:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:00 pm

Ogvorbis-

I’m glad you were able to recover that moment and use it to help fight the fiction of blame your mind is trying to create.

TRIGGER WARNING. If it’s any help I can tell you that my partner did the same sorts of things after her rape. It was all her fault. She was asking for it. She did nothing to protect herself. She came on to him. Blah blah blah. Working through it step by step, it turned out she had done a lot of things quote-unquote “right”, removing herself from the situation, telling him no, struggling to push him off, etc… that she had simply erased in order to support this narrative that she was a terrible person who deserved it.

It’s a sucky fight, but we’ve got your back and most importantly, we can remember what you say so when your mind tries to fight back, we can help you remember that you did what you could and it’s no one’s fault but your rapist (except maybe the douchebag who dragged you back to him).

JAL-

My partner’s from the same sort of family. Everyone is supposed to keep everything a secret in order to “protect” the family. It’s one of the big things that has made coming out and being an award-winning poet difficult for her.

WMDKitty-

All the damn time.

TRIGGER WARNING. Ever since that thread where I actually acknowledged that what happened to me was rape, I’ve been setting myself off like a poorly-put-away machine gun. Usually it happens when I’m dreaming or have closed my eyes for a second. Nothing really happened to trigger it, but bam, there I am being raped again or feeling the feel of his rubbing on my thigh. In fact, random thigh triggers happen all the time. I’ll just be sitting and then I need to move to lying on my side, because in the open air, I can feel him pressing against me.

In short, yeah, that sort of thing just happens. And it sucks.

Ogvorbis:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:15 pm

Ever since that thread where I actually acknowledged that what happened to me was rape, I’ve been setting myself off like a poorly-put-away machine gun. Usually it happens when I’m dreaming or have closed my eyes for a second. Nothing really happened to trigger it, but bam, there I am being raped again or feeling the feel of his rubbing on my thigh. In fact, random thigh triggers happen all the time. I’ll just be sitting and then I need to move to lying on my side, because in the open air, I can feel him pressing against me.

Quoted, in full, for truth.

TRIGGER WARNING

Since I began remembering why I never liked cub scouts, the triggers have come fast and furious, some of them out of nowhere. The body memories are, for me, bad, but not the worst — the worst for me is listening to me tell me why this, that, and the other thing, are all my fault. And it seems like every fucking time I beat it down it jumps right back up with a new tactic. The strategy never changes, but the tactics my mind uses to beat me up mentally evolve rapidly. Now that I remember telling, and not being believed, my culpability is even less believable. I did try to stop him. I did. I really tried. I failed to stop him, but at least I tried.

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 27th, 2013 at 3:19 pm

The origin of ovoviviparity in coelacanths some 245 million years ago.

Shiny!

And, David, you can have your hugs either covered in chocolate or wrapped in bacon, whichever you’d prefer.
:)
-

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:22 pm

David,

In isolation, that’d just mean he’s against useless rituals. He can see you, and he knows you know he can see you – so why say it out loud? For me, greeting is a chore. I sometimes avoid being seen by people who’d recognize me so I don’t need to greet them when I know full well we’re not gonna have a conversation anyway.

Well yeah, except that I’m talking about my father not someone who I might pass by on the street.

If it’s supposed to be a random observation only tangentially related to my comment, fine. But since you continue to comment on my individual situation, that last sentence makes me feel really great about the whole not being treated like a totally random person by my own family.

“What do I care? Go” is an expression of trust: he feels he doesn’t need to know all the time where exactly you are, because you can handle yourself.

Oh fuck off. You serious?

You’re welcome to interpret that “fuck off” as meaning “Thank you for that lovely comment, David. That is a perspective that hasn’t crossed my mind, but sounds really plausible. You are so smart and amazing” … but it actually just means “fuck off”. Well, you can add … “with this bullshit” in the end.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:26 pm

David is autistic. That means you’re oppressing him by telling him to fuck off.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:28 pm

Before you say anything… my comment belongs to the thunderdome, I didn’t think of the Lounge rules when I posted.
I’ll be off to bed anyway.

Krasnaya Koshka:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:29 pm

rq — Thank you! I do believe my gf’s stubbornness will carry her through. Well, hopefully.

Also, I meant to say this quite a while ago: I’m happy to see you, Cerberus, commenting again.

Beatrice:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:35 pm

Krasnaya Koshka,

Thank you for those nice words about me. Sorry for not answering, I wanted to go to bed so I didn’t want to comment any more tonight and keep myself awake longer. Now that I’ve answered David, I certainly don’t want to ignore you.
I hope your girlfriend keeps proving the doctors wrong for many more years.

dontpanic:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:58 pm

you can have your hugs either covered in chocolate or wrapped in bacon, whichever you’d prefer.

Is that an exclusive or an inclusive one? Chocolate, bacon covered hugs for those who want them?

—

One of them insisted that I stop trying to earn a living while I was taking care of my mother [...]

Not that I would have thought of it at the moment if I were in the situation, but I wonder if a good comeback might be to ask them to get out their checkbook.

birgerjohansson:

February 27th, 2013 at 3:58 pm

Random link bombing:

Bono ignites TED 2013 urging audience to become ‘factivists’ in war on extreme poverty and corruption http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/02/27/bono-ignites-ted-2013-urging-audience-to-become-factivists-in-war-on-extreme-poverty-and-corruption/

—- —- —- —- — —
Sexist photo makes Facebook joke 200 times more popular, and prompts rape comments http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/02/24/sexist-photo-makes-facebook-joke-200-times-more-popular/

feministdalek:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:15 pm

Hullo Horde. Long-time reader, first time commenter (I think?…unless I’ve commented before and forgotten).

I don’t have anything to particularly exciting or interesting to contribute, but I was wondering if someone would give me some tips/pointers on my new rat furbabies. I know there’s someone in the Horde (…Caine, maybe?) with a metric shit-load of rats, and as a first time owner I want to KNOW ALL THE THINGS!

I just like the Horde/Pharyngula more than most other online communities, so I’d rather post here than anywhere else.

Cerberus: Fucking Oppression, Man:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:33 pm

Obvorbis @467

Safe Physical Contact Which May Very Well be a Hug

Damn right you did!

Ugh, fucking minds, man, so bloody good at fucking us up after a trauma.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:35 pm

Hey feministdalek, and welcome!

Caine is the rat expert. I’ve had rats before, but I don’t know much besides “awwww… so cute!” and “Ouch, don’t bite!”

glodson:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:37 pm

Ever lurk a thread and watch someone run headfirst right into the brick wall that is the Dunning-Kruger effect? I think that’s unfolding right now in the Krauss and philosophy thread. I want to reply, but I don’t even know where to start with the idea that the theory of gravity aren’t falsifiable, that natural selection is not falsifiable, or may even be indistinguishable from intelligent design.

I really don’t even know what to make of all this.

ChasCPeterson:

February 27th, 2013 at 4:50 pm

Rats enjoy nothing more than a large bowl of chocolate pudding on the floor in your bedroom. They may be raised efficiently and healthfully on a diet of pencil shavings, mandolin strings, Nutella, and common everyday dirt. Leaving your toilet seat open is the best way to make sure they have plenty of refreshing water to drink. Rats are delightful companions whose droppings (if fed as suggested) are inconspicuous and smell very faintly of cedar. Any normal household’s populations of dustmites, silverfish, cockroaches, centipedes, and hairy spiders will dispatch them before you can even notice! Playful creatures, rats really seem to enjoy chewing on polystyrene-foam food containers and climbing up khaki pants-legs, so give them the run of the whole neighborhood!

hth.

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:00 pm

I suggest the American Museum of Natural History as a venue ^_^

Excellent choice of venue!

Cerberus: Fucking Oppression, Man:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:11 pm

Ugh… the Dan Savage thread…

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:11 pm

the idea that the theory of gravity aren’t falsifiable, that natural selection is not falsifiable, or may even be indistinguishable from intelligent design

headdesk Well, I wanted to read that thread tonight anyway, and I just made a good-sized amount of (very weak) tea – drinking that will take a while (caffeine doesn’t seem to have any effect on me), so I might catch up with it before keeling over and falling asleep.

Excellent choice of venue!

:-)

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:14 pm

…Oh yeah. I forgot: Darren Naish @TetZoo tweeted 54 minutes ago:

It’s late February 2013. You might not believe it, but 102 #rhinos have been poached so far >>THIS YEAR<<. One rhino per 11 hrs. HELP!!!

glodson:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:14 pm

headdesk Well, I wanted to read that thread tonight anyway, and I just made a good-sized amount of (very weak) tea – drinking that will take a while (caffeine doesn’t seem to have any effect on me), so I might catch up with it before keeling over and falling asleep.

In fairness, he’s made the idea a bit more clear in that both Intelligent Design and Natural Selection are in the same boat scientifically, but philosophically Natural Selection wins.

Don’t look at me like that. It is an improvement.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 5:21 pm

In isolation, that’d just mean he’s against useless rituals. He can see you, and he knows you know he can see you – so why say it out loud? For me, greeting is a chore. I sometimes avoid being seen by people who’d recognize me so I don’t need to greet them when I know full well we’re not gonna have a conversation anyway.

“What do I care? Go” is an expression of trust: he feels he doesn’t need to know all the time where exactly you are, because you can handle yourself.

David, I suppose that’s a possible explanation but it’s unlikely to be accurate given that Beatrice has never indicated that her father is on the spectrum and there are other, more common and simpler explanations. Based on her comments, he also isn’t interested in attempting to understand why this behavior causes distress to her or meet her partway with it, either, so the internal reasoning behind it only carries so much weight even if you’re correct.

Crip Dyke, MQ, Right Reverend Feminist FuckToy of Death & Her Handmaiden:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:23 pm

David!! Just the help I need: How are you on Arabic?

Need something transliterated:
النذل

I’m pretty sure that I know the meaning, but not at all sure of pronunciation.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:24 pm

Great explanation. Now here’s a potentially illuminating question. Should it have been Beatrice’s responsibility to explain all that to David?

Crip Dyke, MQ, Right Reverend Feminist FuckToy of Death & Her Handmaiden:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:27 pm

Welcome feministdalek!

So god to see you here. I’m not a ratite, but yes, there are a number here and Caine is perhaps the rat-parent who is most often online and checking the Lounge. She’ll show up before too long, unless something is particularly off…

============
BTW: for Gilliel – how’s the knitting?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:34 pm

Feeling a bit more stable and “with it” today. That’s of the good, right?

Crip Dyke, MQ, Right Reverend Feminist FuckToy of Death & Her Handmaiden:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:37 pm

Definitely of the good, WMDKitty. Wishin’ ya well.

glodson:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:44 pm

It is good, and here’s hoping you are feeling great soon.

Now I have to go because a little three year old girl wants to play some rock-n-roll.

I swear, I always thought my parents were in charge when I was kid. And now that I’m a daddy, I find my daughter is in charge.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 5:56 pm

Great explanation. Now here’s a potentially illuminating question. Should it have been Beatrice’s responsibility to explain all that to David?

“Responsibility” is probably not the right word. It would certainly have cost little and been helpful and compassionate – especially if Beatrice were aware of David’s disability, which I would assume she isn’t based on the response. Without having identified himself as autistic, that comment would, I suppose, fall under the same “other, more prevalent explanations” issue I cited – but if he’d made a follow-up post to the effect of “I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to cause you distress. I have an ASD and the behavior you describe seemed familiar, so I thought I might be able to provide some insight into it. Can you explain what I did wrong?” I think the proper response would be an explanation like the one I gave rather than the “SHUT UP YOU’RE JUST MAKING EXCUSES ASSHOLE” responses that I usually observe in that kind of exchange.

Whose responsibility should it be?

Lynna, OM:

February 27th, 2013 at 5:56 pm

You probably already look at Bankers with some skepticism, that lot having earned more punishment than they’ve received, but how do you feel about mixing banking and religion? Are Bankers worse when the head of their bank is the Pope?

In an article that is not very well written, but which contains solid information, Betty Clermont of Daily Kos provides a summary of Catholic financial shenanigans and an overview of the Vatican Bank or “Institute for Religious Works” as the criminals who run the place prefer.

Excerpt:

Vaticano S.p.A. (Vatican Inc.) by Gianluigi Nuzzi was published January 1, 2009. Documents obtained by a Vatican employee who didn’t want them published until after his death show the IOR functions as an “off-shore” financial institution for rightwing politicians, the Mafia, Italian tax-evaders and other disreputable characters. “The IOR…ensures privileges to be granted in exchange for political backing, legal provisions and business support.” …

On September 21, 2010, the Bank of Italy’s Financial Intelligence Unit (the Bank of Italy is the country’s central bank and therefore has regulatory functions) informed the IOR that it was under investigation for possible money laundering using two Italian banks and issued notices against Ettore Gotti Tedeschi and Roberto Cipriani, director general of the IOR, for omission of procedures against money laundering. Prosecutor Nello Rossi said €23 million (about $31 million) in IOR transactions were seized from the Italian bank accounts. According to court documents, prosecutors stated the IOR deliberately flouted anti-money-laundering laws “with the aim of hiding the ownership, destination and origin of the capital.” Court documents also revealed suspicions transactions totaling €900,000 involved clergy acting as fronts for corrupt businessmen and the Mafia. …

And there’s this: JP Morgan was convinced that the Vatican Bank was so unethical that Morgan cut ties with IOR. If, Credit really goes to the U.S. Treasury Department, and not to JP Morgan for this attack of conscience.

Under pressure from the U.S. Treasury Department, JP Morgan Chase notified the Vatican on March 16, 2012, that it closed the IOR account in its Milan branch because the IOR was “unable to respond” to requests for information about the provenance of the deposits. JP Morgan had been requesting the information since 2010. Furthermore, JP Morgan reported €1.8 billion ($2,200,000,000) had been deposited in the last 18 months in that account. (And this is one account out of how many throughout the world?) At the end of each day, the balance was reduced to zero and the contents moved to an IOR account in Frankfurt. According to Spiegel, investigators suspected the account was used to launder funds from “dubious sources.”

feministdalek:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:05 pm

Thanks for the reception! Here is a list of What I Have Learned About Rats:

1. They reallyreallyreally like edamame and cheerios. And now I have cheerio bits crunching underfoot juuust about everywheres.

2. Running up pant legs will happen when you least expect that they will suddenly find your giant human body a nice habitat.

3. They can make holes a foot wide in nice, long, flowy white curtains overnight. And then you will scoot the cage out from the wall a bit.

I didn’t know you could give them Nutella! I thought that chocolate wasn’t good for them and would cause some pretty serious weight gain; so far, they seem to love gettin’ all messy with a teensy dish of pb or greek yogurt.

Cerberus: yes, ugh indeed. I couldn’t finish it, but I just can’t grok the “I am responsible for being the living reality of my partners fantasy/ideal”. Yes, of course we have responsibilities to each other, and yes, physical attraction is a PART of the equation…but if that’s the most important thing in your relationship and a be-all, end-all, that’s pretty sad. If I just wanted someone to satisfy my desire for a fantasy-lover, why not save everyone living in the real world and just get a love doll?

P.S. I love watching this community work. I read threads with as much interest as I do the actual articles; nothing negative about PZ, but the organic conversations that spring up in the comments are about as fun as the posts, and often as insightful and intriguing.

If you’ll excuse me. I’m off to do some spermburgling and General Misandry.

broboxley OT:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:09 pm

#495 Lynna, dont forget the history of Bank of America as well
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_of_America#History

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Hey everyone, today was a rollercoaster. Made my first pro hac vice appearance totally unexpectedly. Now I have to do some drafting because the first half of my day was eaten by court.

WMDKitty:
So glad you’re doing better.

feministdalek:
Welcome!

Azkyroth:
It was definitely not Beatrice’s responsibility.
———————————–
waves at everyone
I know there’s stuff I’ve missed today. Pile o’ hugs here for the taking. And thanks to everyone who dished one out for me. They are appreciated : )

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 6:31 pm

Azkyroth:
It was definitely not Beatrice’s responsibility.

How would this be reconciled with the way any other disability is treated, or at least the treatment that’s advocated for?

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:38 pm

It looks to me like David’s responsive comment would be applicable in the context in which Beatrice indicated her father was on the spectrum, yes? A preliminary inquiry to that effect might have saved him exacerbating her frustration.

Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls:

February 27th, 2013 at 6:45 pm

Question for the medical experts. The Redhead suffered a hemorrhagic stroke. Is she more likely to suffer another hemorrhagic stroke, or an embolism stroke?

The reason I ask is that her doctor wants to put her on cholesterol-lowering drug since her LDL is above 100, but from what I’ve seen with Google, that does increase the risk of another hemorrhagic stroke if her LDL levels get too low, like below 100…

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 6:49 pm

It looks to me like David’s responsive comment would be applicable in the context in which Beatrice indicated her father was on the spectrum, yes? A preliminary inquiry to that effect might have saved him exacerbating her frustration.

Okay, now I follow. In that regard, I agree.

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:02 pm

I put my hair in a ponytail, bent my neck weird, looked in the mirror, and held up a tape measure. I think I have enough hair to donate. :D

Missed my hair appointment today though. sniffle

vaiyt:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:18 pm

Wolverine and Hercules kiss in a comic (X-Treme X-Men) where they were gay since the beginning. American comics news sources don’t care, but the local fans here are going batshit. Meanwhile, I point and laugh.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:27 pm

vaiyt:

Them there’s be a couple of passionate men in any universe, but I’m not sure how much sense a Wolverine/Hercules hook-up makes. I haven’t read any Marvel books in probably 5-6 years though, so… shrugs

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:29 pm

Why do my mom’s perfectly normal, non-intrusive questions about my life make me want to hide under the table? I can’t figure out why I feel this way.

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:42 pm

Hey guys, bit of freedom from religion activism to pass on to you to act on if you feel so inclined. So yesterday, this happened. Relevant excerpt:

“Let me have everybody’s attention, please,” said Magistrate John Caywood just before the meeting. “…at this time, I’d like to ask Magistrate Sammons to please lead us in prayer. Anybody who’s uncomfortable with this, we’ll give you a moment to step outside.”

Smith was the only audience member who stepped out of the courtroom.

“…our most gracious Heavenly Father, we come to you today with sad hearts,” Sammons said. “We’re so sad that we as a nation have let such a small minority group tell us what to do. Lord, I ask forgiveness for myself, but I’m of the old school where we don’t run, we fight. So, forgive me for that.”

“Lord, we ask You to be with us always today…we just ask Your special blessing for this court, this good Christian bunch of people that are always trying to do the right thing for the county. We ask all this in Your Son’s precious name. Amen.”

So the ACLU was there and they may or may not pick up this case, hopefully they do see the merit in it as it very clearly violates the First Amendment. What we can do in the meantime though is to contact the Boyle Co. Fiscal Court, the ACLU, Americans United, FFRF, and American Atheists about it.

This is the contact information for Boyle County Fiscal Court j.e. Harold McKinney

Judge/Executive

Harold McKinney
321 West Main Street, Room 111
Danville, Kentucky 40422
phone:(859) 238-1100
fax: (859) 238-1108
[email protected]

Office Hours:
8:30 a.m. – 4:00 p.m., weekdays
Regular Fiscal Court Meetings:
Second Tuesday of each month, 10 AM and
Fourth Tuesday, 10 AM

This is for ACLU, urge them that you’d like them to take up this case:

General Feedback Form
Write:
125 Broad Street, 18th Floor, New York NY 10004.
Or call: 212-549-2500

AU:

Email: [email protected]
Phone: (202) 466-3234
Fax: (202) 466-2587
Address: 1301 K Street NW, Suite 850E, Washington, DC 20005

FFRF:

EMAIL: contact form

Freedom From Religion Foundation
PO Box 750
Madison WI 53701
608/256-8900
FAX 608/204-0422

American Atheists:

Contact form

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:43 pm

Portia,

Parents have the (black!) magical ability to say words that, if simply printed out and read by a random person to another random person, would seem innocent and possibly even positive. When said by a parent to their child, even an adult child, it takes on all sorts of hidden dimensions based on past experiences and can leave you feelings 11 kinds of discombobulated. You can train your parents out of a large part of it, but never all of it.

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:46 pm

Joe:

You’re exactly right. Plus, I end up feeling guilty for feeling annoyed (or something like annoyed) because she only means well, I really know that. I can (and have) told her that I’m not up for questions or discussion on a certain topic, and she’s 100% ok with that and respects it. So it’s just me, being irrationally irritated (is the story my brain tells me). But thanks to you, now I realize that there’s some underlying reason or trigger button buried down there that I don’t know or really even need to know in order to just take a breath and let go of the irritation.

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:51 pm

I can told people things! Sorry if my grammar broke anyone’s brain. : p

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 27th, 2013 at 7:52 pm

Is that an exclusive or an inclusive one? Chocolate, bacon covered hugs for those who want them?

I save those for special occasions!
:D
-
Hi, feministdalek; welcome in! And yes, it is Caine who owns an entirely-improbable number of rats.
:)

I just like the Horde/Pharyngula more than most other online communities, so I’d rather post here than anywhere else.

Hey, me too!
:) :)
-

t’s late February 2013. You might not believe it, but 102 #rhinos have been poached so far >>THIS YEAR<<. One rhino per 11 hrs. HELP!!!

:( :( :(
-
WMDKitty: Hurrah for increased stability!
-
“Spermburgling”. Now there’s a word you don’t see every day! It conjures up images of roving black-clad, ski-masked women stealthing through the night with crowbars and buckets (and, where applicable, ladders—for the second-story work).
-

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 7:54 pm

cicely:

It conjures up images of roving black-clad, ski-masked women stealthing through the night with crowbars and buckets (and, where applicable, ladders—for the second-story work).

And they call themselves….

Lillith’s Angels

cicely (Hell, YES, I'm ready for a Real Change):

February 27th, 2013 at 8:25 pm

Portia:
:)
-

throwaway, promised freezed peach, all we got was the pit:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:38 pm

Currently have a post in mod which had more than 3 links. Here’s an alternative in case it never gets through: http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?p=7404376#post7404376

Also, I made cookies! For each letter you send I’ll imagine I gave one to you… ;) Some of you already deserve some noms… Form a line! (cicely, portia, joe, azkyroth, vaiyt and everyone whose name is on the first page…)

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:39 pm

Cookies! Yes please!

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:46 pm

Ever lurk a thread and watch someone run headfirst right into the brick wall that is the Dunning-Kruger effect? I think that’s unfolding right now in the Krauss and philosophy thread. I want to reply, but I don’t even know where to start with the idea that the theory of gravity aren’t falsifiable, that natural selection is not falsifiable, or may even be indistinguishable from intelligent design.

Done.

David!! Just the help I need: How are you on Arabic?

Bad. Never tried to learn it.

Need something transliterated:
النذل

I’m pretty sure that I know the meaning, but not at all sure of pronunciation.

From looking it up, and from experimenting with the Windows Character Map (♥!), the first is a ‘alif, and the second is a lām, giving the definite article al-. That makes further sense because the rest is 3 letters, by far the most common number for an Arabic word to have in its basic form. Then comes a nūn, then a dhāl, and then another lām – “n”, then “th” as in “this” (not as in “thick”, that’s another letter), then “l”. To know what vowels to fill in, I’d need to know the language, the spelling alone doesn’t tell.

Great explanation. Now here’s a potentially illuminating question. Should it have been Beatrice’s responsibility to explain all that to David?

No, why? It’s my responsibility to read the thread so I know the context. I remember that Beatrice has complained about her dad before, about quite different things he also does and that I can’t explain this way. That’s exactly why I started with “in isolation”, put that in boldface, and then went on with “would” instead of just stating it as a fact.

But now I won’t catch up (even though I gather Beatrice has weighed in), I’ll just go to bed. It’s… crap, it’s a quarter to four in the morning. FML!

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 8:47 pm

Coooooooooookies!
nomnomnomnomnom
-

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:47 pm

cicely – I like horses and peas insofar as they refer to the commonly accepted meaning of the term… if this is not what you meant than I apologise for the confusion that shall inevitably ensue.

Lynna – What is wrong with Limbaugh and related right wing commentators? Do they really think that a deficit is more important than 40 million odd people not having adequate healthcare? Sorry about this, I just can’t understand the mindset that would prompt that kind of behaviour.

throwaway – Cake is better than cookies. Always. Et in saecula saeculorum. Amen. Not saying that cookies are bad in any way, but cake is just better.

David Marjanović:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:52 pm

…uh, except that the vowels have to be short, because long ones would be spelled out (as ‘alif, yā’ or wāw) AFAIK.

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:54 pm

Welcome, dongiovanni!

…confusion is the least of your worries at this point. Here, take this suit of armor. Or just run.

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 8:57 pm

Oh Gods, what have I done?

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:02 pm

We, in the Give Peas a Chance faction of the Lounge, have forged a small but scrappy resistance movement to the Tyranny of the Pea-haters. There is also a smaller subfaction of Horse Defenders, but we mostly seem to sympathize with abject terror as a reasonable reaction in the face of the Awesomeness that is Equinity.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:02 pm

dongiovanni: Much as I hate to consign newcomers to Outer Darkness on such short acquaintance, I’ve just gotta say

Blasphemer! Heretic! Hater-of-Kittens!

and watch sternly as you are flung into the Equine-infested Pea-gardens of Hell.

No, I’m sorry. You brought this on yourself.
-

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:05 pm

Cake is better than cookies.

now THAT is blasphemy.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:08 pm

As the old saying goes, “A day without Horses is like a day without showers of flaming bile”.

And also, “A pea in the hand is an Abomination Unto Nuggan. Put that thing down—you don’t know where it’s been!”
-

Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:12 pm

Oh-oh, deep rifts forming. Lays out a spread of bungied grog and swill to keep things together

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:13 pm

What do the kittens have to do with it? My kitten – loving credentials are impeccable. I even post on whyevolutionistrue occasionally.

Also, I’m half convinced that horses are a manifestation of the Tatterdemalion King of Carcosa. Just the way they look at you.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:15 pm

They lurk beneath the pie-crusts of the unsuspecting, you know.

The peas, that is. Not the Horses.

You’ll find Them lurking in darkened out-buildings, poised to spring out upon the innocent and the unwary.
-

Portia, snowbound:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:18 pm

Well….Horses have been lurking in unsuspecting folks’ foodstuffs as of late…

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:20 pm

Flaming bile? Is that even possible? Am I going to have to buy bile and try to set fire to it? Or are you referring to the Pope’s valedictory address?

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:22 pm

Indeed. That said, horse salami isn’t actually that bad.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:22 pm

Well….Horses have been lurking in unsuspecting folks’ foodstuffs as of late…

…springing out upon (and into) the innocent and the unwary.

Who complained. And rightly so!
-
I’m entirely willing to believe in a Carcosa Connection for the Hellbeasts.
-

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:25 pm

Flaming bile? Is that even possible?

It’s Supernaturally Malefic!
-

dongiovanni:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:26 pm

True that.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 27th, 2013 at 9:26 pm

That said, horse salami isn’t actually that bad.

I wouldn’t know. I do not partake of the Unholy Communion.
-

Crudely Wrott:

February 27th, 2013 at 9:49 pm

Just to let Esteleth and the rest of you wonderful people know that a big chunk of care arrived today in my bank account. The event was most welcome! Many, many thanks.

The first thing I did was go to the grocery store. Second, made rent up to date though another weeks worth comes due tomorrow. Also tomorrow Sprint gets enough dollars to make my phone work again and the folks who rent me storage get paid for February’s rent.

I’ve been absent from the Lounge for the last couple of days since my InnerTubes keep going flat. Several outages per day, some lasting all night. Just when I most wanted to be in touch, doncha know.

Right now I’m going to have another quick bite to eat and then hit the hay or, as my father used to say, “hit the goose hair”. (no such luck to have feather pillows and down comforters just now)

I’m very tired and have slept but little for three days. Just short naps. Lots of worries and anticipation concerning the days ahead.

Just know that your generosity is making a huge difference and I have some breathing room. Next on the list is visiting health care providers and relief agencies. Neither one of which I’m fond of doing.

Dear Horde, may the blessings of Cthulhu be upon you and may the Flying Spaghetti Monster’s appendage touch you gently. May you always make up such a sweet and laudable assemblage of humanity and never forget that you really do make a difference that extends far beyond yourselves.

Now, to belly and then to bed.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 10:25 pm

What is wrong with Limbaugh and related right wing commentators? Do they really think that a deficit is more important than 40 million odd people not having adequate healthcare? Sorry about this, I just can’t understand the mindset that would prompt that kind of behaviour.

I’m quite certain they regard the 40 million people not having adequate healthcare as a feature, not a bug.

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 27th, 2013 at 10:44 pm

…so, I knew a guy who made some speculative investments. Like, when he and his friends invested in this Italian restaurant. I was pretty skeptical, but it wound up being a success. His profit margin wasn’t great, but it was there, and it’s growing.

He wasn’t a fool, though. He tried to draw the line when his friends’ next idea was to open an animal shelter. But, you know what they say: “In for the penne, in for a pound.”

^.^

rowanvt:

February 27th, 2013 at 11:29 pm

I just had my first lock up of the year with my snakes, and it was the matriarch and demi-patriarch of my Sweet Corn temperament line! If none other mate, I will still be happy to have super docile baby snakes to play with again.

Not like this nasty little piece of work. Also pairing her parents together again. Evilest corn snake hatchling there ever was.

http://imageshack.us/a/img100/1016/evilbaby.jpg

chigau (違う):

February 27th, 2013 at 11:50 pm

‘rupt
hugs

Beatrice:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:14 am

Azkyroth,

I have to admit that I know that David is on the spectrum. His response was hurtful because it took a ridiculously charitable view on something that is only a very small part of my father being an unpleasant person, some of which I occasionally write here. David doesn’t read regularly, and even if he were, I wouldn’t expect him to know everything I have ever written, but I think his response was going out of his way to give the most charitable reading to something for which the easiest explanation is… less nice anyway. Even with not knowing any of the context. I was also in a really bad way last night, so reading that comment didn’t exactly help.

Does telling him to fuck off even though I know he’s autistic make me an asshole? Even if it does, in this particular instance, I don’t regret my response. A nicer thing to do would have been to write what you have written (and thank you for that explanation), but I was in no state to stay somewhat polite in more than one paragraph.

I do understand that people on the spectrum would benefit from explanations of some situations, so that they would know how to respond without looking inconsiderate or hurtful, or getting hurt themselves. But there are situations, like this one, where the other party is already hurt and angry. In that moment it is easy to start doubting whether someone said something because they didn’t know any better or because they just didn’t care to stop and think for a moment before hitting Submit.

Beatrice:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:24 am

Ah, I read this page now. Well. Apparently, I completely misunderstood David’s nuanced comment, which was clearly about some different theoretical situation I should have taken no notice of.

That was sarcasm, btw.

Whatever. I’m not going to argue and show off as a greater asshole than I already appear to be/am. I already clarified.

grumpy hugs to those who need them, ignore the grumpiness

Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:26 am

Okay.

chigau (違う):

February 28th, 2013 at 1:12 am

the pods got ‘em all

dongiovanni:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:41 am

Hmm… could I please have your thoughts on Chocolate Mousse recipes?

And that is just the most adorable glabrous little corn snake baby from the pits of the outer dark. So cute.

rq the kutalikleptomanic:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:51 am

Good morning. I see there are cookies to be had.

hugs, Beatrice. And for Portia, too. I know that parentally-induced feeling you speak of. My dad says “Hello, how are you doing?” and I panic at the thought of giving a wrong answer. And here I am, all grown up and with me own house now. sigh

+++

In other news, I have no other news, except that I realized my faux pas with the Furnace yesterday was because, for a few days there, I forgot to mention how Awesome the Good Horse really is, and I was punished for my omissions. I shall henceforth strive to better remember the Greatness that is the Equine Nature and Spirit. With many sacrifices of peas.

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 28th, 2013 at 2:56 am

Wife and I went to see Cloud Atlas yesterday. Highly recommended, despite rather excessive amounts of bang-bang action and an unnecessary “Happy Ending” not in the book. Gripping stories, amazing sets and special effects, and very clever use of a small number of excellent actors to play parts in all six interwoven stories – at the end, they showed who each of these few had played, and in many cases, particularly those involving cross-dressing, I hadn’t had a clue at the time.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:24 am

Good morning
Talking about films, I think I need to get Beasts of the Southern Wild when it’s released on DVD here. Thank you haters, you made me realize that a film I might really like is out there.
Oh, and it was not my idea to make Mac and Cheese tomorrow. OK, I didn’t argue against it, either…

Crip Dyke
I think you must mix me up with somebody. There are several knitters here, but my only use for knitting needles is making pinchos.

beatrice
(((hugs)))

David
Women are quite used to having their existence only acknowledged in terms of work not done. Because servants are not greeted. Servants also don’t have plans of their own. The behaviour beatrice has described of her dad reminds me often of my own “I’m not a sexist therefore I don’t have to change my behaviour, it is automatically not sexist” dad, only worse.
And it grinds you down.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:36 am

dongiovanni
My thoughts on chocolate mousse recipes?
I like them!
;)
But maybe you’d rather like an actual recipe…

OK, classical French Mousse au Chocolat
Easy as pie
Beat 6 eggyolks with 100g confectioner’s sugar, add some drops cognac
Melt 200g of chocolate. Attention: white chocolate doesn’t work!
Carefully add the chocolate to the eggyolks
Beat the whites with a pinch of salt.
Add 1/4 of the whites to the chocolate mixture without taking much care.
Add the rest in several portions and carefully incorporate them with a wooden (or silicone) spoon.
When all is mixed, put into bowl or glasses, put some cling film on top and put into the fridge for 24 hours.
Yes, that’s right, a full day.
This means it’s not much of a spontaneous treat but very well to prepare in advance for a dinner party.

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 28th, 2013 at 4:19 am

Because milk in any sort of tea is an abomination. – carlie

On the contrary tea mixed with cows’ milk is an unrivalled source of moral fibre!

rq the kutalikleptomanic:

February 28th, 2013 at 4:24 am

Giliell
Waiting a full day for chocolate mousse is torture. It’s one of the reasons I don’t make it, because the waiting period is soooo loooonnnng… (But thanks for the recipe. ;) )

carlie:

February 28th, 2013 at 5:17 am

I recently saw this recipe for chocolate mousse:

Chocolate, water, whip.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 5:48 am

carlie
That’s interesting, I’ll have to try it, because every other recipe that requires melted chocolate I’ve ever made makes a big deal about not splashing any water into the melting chocolate, because it separates it. Maybe it’s the difference between a little and a lot, though.

Matt Penfold:

February 28th, 2013 at 5:56 am

I’m not sure how stable that mousse make with just chocolate and water would be. I suspect if you kept it for any length of time it would be begin to seperate, as fat and water do not like to mix unless you use an emulsifier, which in standard mousse is where the eggs yolks come in.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:03 am

I am, as of this moment, revoking all of FuckingCat’s balcony privileges. When he returns (again), he will never go out there again, and will simply have to learn to go in and out via the front door, like any normal pet, instead of jumping off the balcony railing. Bloody hell.
I hope he’s not hurt, there’s a lot less soft snow on the ground this time around…

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:12 am

ahem
Looks like I owe FuckingCat an apology, seeing as how this time his absence on the balcony meant that he’d gone up the roof, not down. He is now back inside, but I will force him to use the front door for going outside from now on. /catstress

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:34 am

Found a little bit of backbone (and thrashy goodness) in Broken, Beat, And Scarred

http://youtu.be/WDaPjyseJJo

Rocked out. Feeling… I don’t know what, but it feels good!

I want more of this and less of the angry!kitty, man!

Ogvorbis:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:16 am

Good morning. Happy Friday!

DREAM WARNING

Had multiple remembered dreams last night.

One of them involved a small herd of dwarfs, a box of donuts, and a giant bottle of creme de menthe. I was trying to get the donuts and alcohol from western Minnesota (for some reason (hell, it’s a dream, it ain’t supposed to make sense) the donuts and creme de menthe were in storage at the Spam plant (which I think is in southern Minnesota, not western . . . )) to Florida. But the donuts and the green liquor were considered holy by the dwarfs and they were chasing me. Picture the chase scene from The Blues Brothers but insert dwarfs driving Mini Coopers for the police and police cars. Yes, it was strange.

TRIGGER WARNING

I also dreamt of scouts. Normally, when I dream, I am always me. I am almost always in my own body in dreams, never outside looking at me, except for the cub scout dreams. Those dreams I have always been outside of myself but still feeling the pain (and, yes, pleasure (shudder)) of the abuse. This time I was in me, I was in my body, and a man, a man with a beard, a tall and heavy man, showed up while I was being abused. And in a detached part of my mind, I wondered, oh, shit, is this yet another rapist I didn’t remember?

He took me by the hand, and took T and S and S by the hand, and led us out of the trailer, out of the tent, out of the campsite, out of the community center, out of all the different places I was raped, and walked us away from our abuser. I woke in a cold sweat with my mind running away on twelve different what-if paths. I didn’t remember ever seeing this man before. Ever.

Eventually, I went back to sleep. I woke up, headed for the bathroom, and dropped my toothbrush into the sink. There, in the mirror, was the stranger who helped us walk away. (It really did shock me even though this sounds like a plot twist in a b-movie.)

So my today self showed up in a dream about my past self as a non-me character to lead me away from my past. What the fuck? This is like the dreams where I, as a child, took the hands of others and walked them away.

I wish I knew what my mind was trying to tell me. Or that my mind would stop sending me messages that are so damn allegorical.

Anyway, feeling better today.

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:46 am

Og:
Glad you’re feeling better. hugs

Giliell:
Mmmmm Mousse. I may have to try your recipe.
And mac n cheese.
You’ve planted a lot of food cravings, ha.

————–

The Onion made me snicker this morning: Gay Teen Worried He Might Be Christian

“The other week, I was this close to picketing in front of an abortion clinic,” the mortified teenager said, his eyes welling up with tears. “I know it’s wrong, but I wanted so badly to do it anyway. I even made one of those signs with photos of dead fetuses and hid it in my closet. I felt so ashamed, yet, at the same time, it was all strangely titillating.”

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:49 am

hugs for Ogvorbis, I’m glad there seems to be progress that’s making you feel better. drinkofchoice

+++

Not sure what it is that needs to be set straight…

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:51 am

rq
Yeah, it’s so weird the way parents can affect you. I feel better knowing I’m not alone (and thus not an Ungrateful Wretch of a Daughter).

…I think one of my issues is that whenever I’m annoyed with her I immediately think “You’ll be sorry when she’s gone.” It’s been that way ever since her mother died four years ago. I’m a little neurotic, yes.

chigau (違う):

February 28th, 2013 at 8:51 am

Oggie
hugs
It sounds like the “adult you” and the “child you” are agreeing.
Probably a good thing.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:53 am

Ooooh, cicelyyyy, horses are everywhere!!!

broboxley OT:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:53 am

okay, will comment on dads with adult children
responses may sound the same but the meanings vary
“hmm okay” may mean any one of the following
what the fuck does he/she want now?
how much is this gonna cost?
lalalalala I dont want to hear you
I love you but I don’t want to know(common)
I’m glad you are alive and apparently well (also common)

parental discussions are rarely straight forward because of years of history as an authority figure who has to learn to let that go.

I don’t have much practice or history as my father died when I was very young and my mother has been quite insane her entire adult life but functional enough to not be institutionalized so I wing it.

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:54 am

rq
I would guess they think that this:

“The Bible is the foundation of this nation, of our laws, of our society,” Burnett said.

constitutes setting the record straight. : P Because us godless heathens have been actually setting the record straight wrt the foundation of U.S. democracy spreading our secular hellbound lies about the Founders.

Because Pilgrims!

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:55 am

Portia
Considering my dad has cancer and his time is running (extremely) short, I also get a huge guilt-trip out of not being happy? grateful? enough when he asks about my life. But when I was little, there was just too much nit-picking and putting down for not being good enough (that is, using my reasons, not his reasons to come to a (polarly opposite) decisio), that I just panic at even simple questions… Eh. shrug What’s a girl to do? We can start an Ungrateful Daughter-Wretch Corner, if you like. :)

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:58 am

Well, with such good company, I’ll be quite happy in that corner, rq.
Many many hugs for your dad-situation.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:09 am

Portia
Ah, right, the pilgrims. The ones who brought turkey to the Americas to share with the heathen Injuns, and thus convince them of the Truth of the Bible and the Love of Jeezus Ker-rist. Or something. Well, if the special effects don’t suck, it’ll be worth watching a piece of Bible-ugliness-omitting crap.
Now, what drinks shall we serve in this awesome corner of ours?

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:10 am

Haha Definitely “worth watching.”

…hmm…I’m having some hazelnut coffee to start my day but you are probably ready for a cocktail by this point in yours! Especially with the FuckingCat giving you grief!

Crip Dyke, MQ, Right Reverend Feminist FuckToy of Death & Her Handmaiden:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:12 am

Well, accept my apologies, Gilliel.

I haven’t had much use for knitting needles lately either. I haven’t even painted anything since law school started – not one darn thing. To the extent I’ve had any down time, I’m just treading water stress-wise.

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:14 am

@rq #562

I read the list (Yep, I’m that bored!) and of all of them I’m actually quite excited about this guy:

Cardinal Gianfranco Ravasi – 12/1

Age: 71

Nationality: Italy

Pros: Thinks Darwin can be reconciled with the Bible, quotes Amy Winehouse on Twitter and says Church is boring.

Cons: Sounds like he’s in the wrong job.

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:15 am

Crip Dyke,

Now I’m going to have go back and look for what knitting thing you posted.
I didn’t paint for long periods of time during law school, either. Sorry you’re bogged down right now.

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:16 am

Nevermind, thought it was a pattern or something. Don’t mind me…gonna go confuse myself elsewhere for a minute :)

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:37 am

Portia
Hazelnut coffee sounds delicious. With Bailey’s instead of milk, in my case. ;)
Actually, I have to drive to choir tonight, so I guess that will have to wait, too.

theophontes (坏蛋):

February 28th, 2013 at 9:41 am

@ Ogvorbis

That dream sounds really good!

{proffers hugs}

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:43 am

For those brave enough to try yet another weight-loss program, I present the Moose Cleanse. As the tagline indicates, any weight-loss is incidental.
(I’m going to post this on my friends’ Facebooks every time they put up another post about how cupcakes make girls big or how exercise is the single thing missing for a healthy life-style.)

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:08 am

I am CRANKY.
Real estate agent schedules closing at exactly the time I told him I was scheduled to be in court.
Dry cleaner isn’t going to have my stuff ready til next Tuesday. Stupid storm.
Had I been told earlier (that is, on Tuesday when the problem occurred) I could have made other arrangements.
Rarg.
I’m gonna come up for air from organizing my desk and have something to eat and try to banish the crankies.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 11:16 am

Tree Lobsters!
-

Hmm… could I please have your thoughts on Chocolate Mousse recipes?

I approve of them.
-

“In for the penne, in for a pound.”

groooooan!
-
chigau!
hug
-

In other news, I have no other news, except that I realized my faux pas with the Furnace yesterday was because, for a few days there, I forgot to mention how Awesome the Good Horse really is, and I was punished for my omissions. I shall henceforth strive to better remember the Greatness that is the Equine Nature and Spirit. With many sacrifices of peas.

If this were so, then the Horses would be revealed as a collection of blackmailers/extortionists. Just like the Xian god.

Happily, we can know that the Horses had nothing to do with the Furnace, by the fact that the house did not explode, then burn to the ground (because they are bottomless well-springs of Maleficence, that’s why!); and also by the fact that no catastrophic weather phenomena bedevilled Usaia (because other places Do Not Matter (and possibly Do Not Exist) for purposes of Super-and/or-Un-natural Signs & Portents) in connection with the misFurnacement.
-
Ogvorbis: Nicely surreal dwarf dream; I approve.
The other dream sounds…promising.
-
rq: You know, if the Horses have been filling the top spots in the RCC (using the same image-distortion technology that made it possible for space fish to masquerade as perfectly ordinary Venician vampires) since at least the Renaissance, it would explain a lot!
-

chip:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:22 am

I don’t know if y’all have seen this, but it’s been making me sigh heavily (or, y’know, jump up and down stiff-kneed).

http://lifeinc.today.com/_news/2013/02/21/17034058-nerf-for-girls-hasbro-planning-pink-heartbreaker-bow

I think it’s the “collectible arrows” part that really makes this.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:25 am

Dearest Horde, I have discovered a glorious lunchtime thing.

(this contains both meat and cheese, so those who abstain from either/or are thusly cautioned)

To wit:

Honey wheat bread.

Generously slathered with:
(1) cranberry sauce
(2) honey mustard
(3) chopped walnuts

Topped with:
(1) roasted turkey
(2) brie.

Pardon me, my mouth just had an orgasm. :D

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:27 am

Frascotti hinted that Hasbro may have more of these gender-crossover products in the works.“There are lots of opportunities to broaden play opportunities that historically have been more gender-specific.”

This made me a bit dizzy. I get what they are going for (more money by expanding their marketing to both genders), but…. yea.

opposablethumbs:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:29 am

Wow Ogvorbis. Sounds like a shock to have experienced such a dream – but this has to be another positive step, surely? Your adult self taking control of the memories, perhaps (which is kind of what seems to have very gradually been happening since this all started coming through)????

Do you always remember your dreams in such lucid detail, or do these ones behave differently for you do you think?

Argh, RL is being a bit too frantic for my liking. And I’m not concentrating, and this work is due next week … Concentrate! Dammit.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:32 am

Oggie, if I could speculate, I’d say that the dream featuring now-you coming to tend to then-you is a good thing. Best of luck. hugs

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:34 am

hugs for Crudely Wrott

Women are quite used to having their existence only acknowledged in terms of work not done.

facepalm Now I remember that Beatrice posted just the other day that her dad pointed out the kitchen floor was wet and expected her to wipe it all up because she was the woman in the house. Yeah, he’s an asshole.

Keeping track of so many people’s backstories is difficult, especially when I only know them as names and avatar pictures. The Reset Rule comes naturally to me, and it goes both ways. :-(

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 11:34 am

dongiovanni:
(A trifle late with this…)
Welcome to the Lounge. Glad to have you.

Yes, cake is always better than cookies. You are off to a great start here.
Next up, the real challenge: to PEA or NOT TO PEA, and its sequel Horses: Friend or Foe?

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 11:37 am

Oops, I see you have met cicely and answered round 1 of the Q&A….

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:40 am

TRIGGER WARNING

[...]

I wish I knew what my mind was trying to tell me. Or that my mind would stop sending me messages that are so damn allegorical.

There isn’t always a message. Dreams are often confused, incoherent, chaotic even.

And if there’s one, you’ll find out. Don’t try to do all the work at once. long hug

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:40 am

Hmmmm… I thought I had posted a comment.

No biggie. MORE hugs for Oggie… I think the current dream is you hopefully internalizing positive messages about yourself. Because the adult you is an awesome person who would protect anyone who needed it.

See, when I have dreams, it is about being a drone on an assembly line where the parts come to fast to finish, and there’s a never-ending stream of them.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:48 am

Congress has passed the inclusive VAWA! :D :D

The GOP nonsense failed to get enough votes. So the Senate version – which includes expanded protection for Native American women, queer women, and noncitizen women – is on its way to Obama.

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:49 am

Hooray!!!!!!!
VAWA!!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 11:51 am

Y’know, there was this person here that I used to think was awesome. When she revealed that she is Pro-Pea, I struggled with how to cope with the devaststing news. It took time but I came to accept that she has to have one failing. But now I see that she disagrees about Cake>Cookies??!! Thats just too far. Now she never gets to come to Pensacola and enjoy sunny, non-snowbound weather. If only I could remember her name. Starts with a ‘P’, ends in an ‘-ortia’… :)

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:53 am

Do we need to head back to the Thunderdome and continue the Epic Fight That Wasn’t?
Cooooookies for Life!

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 11:55 am

::blinks::
They did??!
Way to go Congress!
Been a loooooong time coming!

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:55 am

The GOP nonsense failed to get enough votes. So the Senate version – which includes expanded protection for Native American women, queer women, and noncitizen women – is on its way to Obama.

Good. I am glad it got passed, and still rather disgusted that it took this long.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:59 am

Observation:

The vote on VAWA was mostly along party lines. However, some Republicans voted “aye.”

Most of said Republicans are women.

Funny that.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:01 pm

Esteleth, that sandwich does, indeed, sound glorious.
-

Congress has passed the inclusive VAWA! :D :D
The GOP nonsense failed to get enough votes. So the Senate version – which includes expanded protection for Native American women, queer women, and noncitizen women – is on its way to Obama.

Yesssssss!!!
punches air
-

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:02 pm

Portia:
Oh it is on.
We shall battle in the manner befitting people of our stature: Boardgame Wars.
I shall be gracious (retroactively added to the list of my divine qualities, alongside prim, pure, and proper) and allow you to pick the game that shall bring victory to The Mighty Shoop.
Pictionary
Scrabble
Monopoly
Trivial Pursuit
Candyland
Choose wisely…

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:03 pm

And hurrah for glue that can actually…you know…make things stick to other things.
-

Portia, snowbound:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:04 pm

Pictionary or Trivial Pursuit. Prepare yourself for defeat! Or save yourself the humiliation and surrender now.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:07 pm

Tony: You know…Portia was propagandising for the Horses, just last night. I fear the worst. I fear that Portia is…

…nag-ridden.
-

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:09 pm

cicely

I just imagined that you put on a pair of sunglasses as you said the last bit. I really hope you did as you typed out your post at 599.

Ogvorbis:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:13 pm

Nicely surreal dwarf dream; I approve.
The other dream sounds…promising.

Yeah. The dwarf dream was both surreal and strange.

The other dream, I have no idea what to make of it. It wasn’t frightening. But at the same time it was scary.

Your adult self taking control of the memories, perhaps (which is kind of what seems to have very gradually been happening since this all started coming through)????

Do you always remember your dreams in such lucid detail, or do these ones behave differently for you do you think?

Yeah, I do seem to be taking control, or at least taking others by the hand (which includes me?). And no, most of my dreams are not this lucid, nor do I remember them. The nightmares (9/11 or scouts) I tend to remember. Nonsense ones are usually forgotten upon waking (other than a memory that I had a dream).

There isn’t always a message. Dreams are often confused, incoherent, chaotic even.

And if there’s one, you’ll find out. Don’t try to do all the work at once. long hug

The dreams about being a scout, about my abuse, tend to lead somewhere, tend to open up something that I had forgotten about (usually for self-protection). So I have kinda trained myself to look for meaning, or to poke around in the memory gaps, when it I have these.

I think the current dream is you hopefully internalizing positive messages about yourself. Because the adult you is an awesome person who would protect anyone who needed it.

Well, the adult I am appears to be who I thought I was pretending to be, so it sounds right.

See, when I have dreams, it is about being a drone on an assembly line where the parts come to fast to finish, and there’s a never-ending stream of them.

Oh. That’s life. Normality.

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

@Cicely #577

Thankyousomuchforintroducingmetothatit’sfuckingawesome!!!!

Seriously though, there’s one (cited below because I’m not clever enough with the HTML to make the link into another word like you do) which every single evo-psych advocate should be forced to read.

http://www.treelobsters.com/2012/12/435-noisy-data.html

Portia, Consequential Pursuit Warrior:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:23 pm

thumper:
it’s

<a href=”www.example.com” rel=”nofollow”>What I want to Title This Link</a>

Becomes:
What I want to Title This Link

(It will not look right in preview).

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:26 pm

cicely:
NEIGH! say it isnt so! Quickly, my entourage, bring me the fainting couch! And some Red Velvet cake.
**
I do believe you have spoken too soon Portia. My skills are known throughout the world. I am unparalled.
Plus I’m really good at board games.
Pictionary it is.
Alert! Alert!
Please stand at attention!
Incoming!
PENIS FACTS
” 1. Spiny Norman no more.

Evolution has discarded many parts of the human penis, including … its spines?

Penile spines are little tiny ridges made of a hard tissue called keratin, and line the outside of the penis. They look (I think) a bit like those punk-inspired accessories that are so popular these days. Lots of animals, including the chimpanzees, still have penis spikes. Christine Dell-Amore of National Geographic News writes that the human genome project gave us the information that the ancestor we share with the chimps also had the spines.

But that was so six million years ago. The code for the “penile spine enhancer” was deleted from the human androgen receptor gene, says Nature (androgens are male sex hormones) and Dell-Amore reports that it happened “before our common ancestor split into modern humans and Neanderthals about 700,000 years ago.” Quite a few deletions were discovered — 510, if you please — and gave us other spiffy changes like having bigger brains and not having whiskers.

It’s not yet certain just what the spines are for, though there are theories, Jen Quaraishi reports in Mother Jones like a correlation between spines and greater promiscuity, also that they make for faster copulation time. If you want to see what they look like, here’s a picture of a cat penis on a blog called Sand Walk.

http://www.alternet.org/9-fascinating-things-you-may-not-know-about-penis?page=0%2C0”

Number nine is definitely odd…

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:29 pm

Cookies are better than fruitcake. Tis the only concession I shall make.

Portia, Consequential Pursuit Warrior:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:34 pm

You are free to be wrong about cookies. Just know that you are wrongwrongwrong.

Cheesecake is better than cookies. Tis the only concession I shall make.

You’ve done it now.
You’ve really done it.
I gave you two choices, you fell right into my trap.
Rule number one: Never get involved in a land war in Asia.
Rule number two: Don’t go up against a Sicilian in a battle of wits when death* is on the line.
Rule number three: Don’t challenge Portia to Pictionary.

Muahahhahaha

Portia, Consequential Pursuit Warrior:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:35 pm

Oh, and tree lobsters….

teehehehehe
love that

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:39 pm

All Evo-Psych advocates should watch this

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:41 pm

Dammit!

All Evo-Psych advocates should watch this

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:44 pm

fuckshitwankbollocks.

All Evo-Psych advocates should watch this

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:48 pm

Jesus hopping Christ on a motherfuckin pogostick!

All Evopsych advocates should see this comic

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 12:50 pm

Well, I give up. #610 went to the right site but the comic didn’t display. I took the “http:\\” out, and now #611 is trying to take you elsewhere on Pharyngula.

There is a reason I’m not in IT.

Thanks anyway, Portia! I’ll try some other time, on a different thread…

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 12:52 pm

I just imagined that you put on a pair of sunglasses as you said the last bit. I really hope you did as you typed out your post at 599.

Sadly, no, for I do not own a pair of sunglasses.

I do, however, own a pair of eyebrows, which I wiggled ferociously as I typed it.
:D
-
thumper: Especially the “secret message”:
“Some days, it seems like there are more statistical outliers than there are valid data points. How am I supposed to justify my conclusions with that sort of data?”
-
Tony: I will not say you “neigh”. (Even though you clearly did. I am trusting that this aberration will not be repeated, else it’s to the Horsepond with you.)
-

Tony the Queer Shoop (supporter of unrestricted access to abortion):

February 28th, 2013 at 1:04 pm

Well look who went out and got herself a shiny new nym.

Neverthesless, it shall do you no good.

None who have entered the octagon have bested me. I shall continue my generosity and allow you to pick some allies to have on your team. There plenty of Pea lovers in here that might come to your aid.

I shall need no help, as I have been besting ‘Consequential Pursuit Warriors’ since my infancy…

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:10 pm

(Cheesecake-yuck)

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:11 pm

Hmf, you picked the wrong game, then I forgot to change it.

Nonetheless, you shall still hang your head in defeat.

~CALLING ALL PEA-LOVERS~

Those with pea-ambivalence are also welcome to the cause. These tyrants are trying to establish a cake-igarchy and banish your freedom to eat peas. Do you want that? I don’t think you do.

thumper1990:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:13 pm

@Cicely

Aw, the alt-text! Why do I always forget to check for alt-text? grumble

Nick Gotts (formerly KG):

February 28th, 2013 at 1:14 pm

Gah!

One of the current news stories in the UK is a series of complaints of sexual harassment of women against a former leader of the Liberal Democrats in the House of Lords. Today on The World at One, the BBC’s lunchtime radio news programme, they interviewed an EP-ist “scientific” apologist for harassment, who explained that men often touch women without consent because they “misinterpret signals”, women are more likely to complain about this if the man is married andor unattractive, and “by their own admission” “women” (all of them apparently) use flirtation to get things other than sex (or, by implication, the pleasures of flirting itself). Below is my comment to the BBC.

The BBC apparently feels apologists for groping should have their say. On World at One today, we were treated to a five-minute farrago of sexist victim-blaming with a pseudo-scientific veneer, courtesy of a Professor Glen Something-or-other.

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:17 pm

My daughter loves peas, for what that is worth.

And she’s like weapon grade adorable.

dianne:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

Threadrupt nonsequitor:

I just finished submitting an abstract for the EHA. The first piece of demographic information they wanted about me before I could submit it? Gender.

Problem #1: They provided a binary drop down menu forcing one to choose male or female.

Problem #2: Why is it any of their damn business what gender I am?

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

Excellent! Cuteness is one of my primary criteria for an effective Pea-ally.

Beatrice:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:20 pm

I like cake.

I like peas.

:|

Ogvorbis:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

I am a pea eater. We are LEGUMES!

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

Hmmmm…not sure how I feel about those with _divided loyalties_

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

She’ll make a better ally than me. She’s both cuter and smarter than her daddy. But she did tell me that I was lovable. Then she had us all do our cheer in the car.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:30 pm

Portia:
Let this image sink in as a reminder of how crushing your loss at Pictionary shall be at my hand:
The fate of all who have challenged me.

dianne:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:31 pm

Read some of the thread. I now have a craving for really good peas. Plus a horror of bad peas. Simultaneously.

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:33 pm

@626

You monster! That image was more suitable for the Thunderdome!

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

…

Oh god, I’m stupid.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:33 pm

Tony:
I laughed really loudly at that link Your feeble attempts at intimidation fall as flatly as your boasting will when I crush you like a two-year-old with a birthday cake.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:40 pm

COOKIES!!!
And I love the Horse.
Cheesecake is the only cake better than…
Ooooh, wait, Portia, I think I have to go with cake on this one. I just pictured that devilish chocolate cake I sometimes make with cream-cheese/whipped cream icing with a dash of maple syrup… And while I make amazing cookies, too, Tony wins me with cake. So so so sorry.
Can we still have our corner?

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

Nooooooo, rq! Not you too!

…I guess we can still have our corner. But only if you bring cookies.

I might also pout for a bit. Don’t mind me.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:46 pm

I love it when you’Re silly, all of you
Have a brownie

+++
Shameless bragging
I needed some razzle-dazzle
(and yes, I am that pale…)

++++
And since we’re bashing evo-psych: I was watching a program last night about beliefs in magic all over the world. Well, I watched it for like 5 minutes until the evo-psch guy showed up to tell us: “basically we’Re still mammoth-hunters”. Yep. Because all humans hunted mammoths. Especially in Africa. And nothing ever changed since…

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

I see that was as effective as your attempts to psychologically demoralize me by changing your post nym…
(I suddenly have this image of a bunch of us meeting one weekend for Teh Great Pictionary Wars of 2013–at IJoe’s home, where he will dazzle us with his culinary skills, while rq is the referee/scorekeeper, and everyone else chanting:
“Shoopy, Shoopy, he’s our man. If he can’t do it, no one can!”)

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:49 pm

everyone else Tony by himself chanting:

FIFY.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:50 pm

Mmmmm brownie.

…is it cookie.
…or is it cake.

WHAT HAVE I DONE.

Pretty sparkle, Giliell :)

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

A brownie is a brownie!

DEEP RIFTS!

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

Snicker, snicker…all out ROTFLOL!
****
Giliell:
Oooh, pretty.
Rhinestone Cowgirl? (And why does cowMAN or cowWOMAN not sound right?)

And despite the fact that I do not enjoy besting _another_ friend in battle, I am having a blast being silly.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

I’m dying over here because I can’t stop picturing you muttering chanty encouragement to yourself as you scribble and everyone looks on in puzzlement.

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

And why does cowMAN or cowWOMAN not sound right?

Because you imagine a half cow human that flies?

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:56 pm

Ooooh, time out Portia…brownies…NOM NOM NOM. May I have one with no nuts?

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 1:59 pm

glodson:
That brought the oddest image to mind :)

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 1:59 pm

Giliell: I see the blingies, but can’t make out what they’re attached to. Can has stand-alone pic, plz?
-
Portia: I will be chanting for Tony, though it breaks my heart that I must choose; for you are a lover of peas, and a lately-revealed Horse sympathiser.
-

DEEP RIFTS!

As long as they come with chocolate frosting….
-

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:00 pm

Oh, sure, no problem, have a “time out.” I’ll totally “observe” a “truce.”

How’d those quotation marks get in there?

scarfs another brownie

You have asserted your undefeatableness without evidence, I therefore dismiss the assertion without evidence.

Boom. Hitchen’d.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:01 pm

That’s okay, cicely, friendships are casualties of WAR.

Plus, I have GlodsonDaughter on my side. How can I lose? Weapons-grade cute…key word…weapons.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:02 pm

(Thats not me chanting to myself. I am praying to our dear FSM that he spares your soul after you discover what millions across the world have learnt:
I am Da Bomb Diggidy)

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:02 pm

mightily resists making a joke about nuts

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:06 pm

I was on the fence, as I am approximately pea-neutral and like both cake and cookies, but…

Ooooh, time out Portia…brownies…NOM NOM NOM. May I have one with no nuts?

A brownie with no nuts? Portia, please pass me a cookie. (Unless you have an allergy, Tony, in which case, is it okay if I for now remain somewhere in the middle where I don’t have to make any big decisions, pretty please with a cherry on top? (which reminds me… ice cream is better than cake and cookies!))

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:08 pm

I’m a gay man in Florida. I cannot get hitched.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:09 pm

Brownies are awesome, too. I make the best. here are some but I ate most of them, sorry… But not really.
Why do I have to referee?
And Tony can be his own cheerleading squad. I’ll eat both cake and cookies AND all the brownies. I hoard them, just so you know. Grab ‘em while you can.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 2:09 pm

Because you imagine a half cow human that flies?

Got that for you right here. (This is obviously the male of the species.)
-

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

Brownies with no nuts? I am aghast… Although I did make some once, Triple-chocolate, they were called… But they needed the nuts, it was just too much chocolate, otherwise. <– I hate admitting that.

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

It’s link dump time.

Petition to the “green” President Rafael Correa Delgado of Ecuador, who wants to hand over lots of rainforest for oil drilling – against the wishes of the inhabitants.
Candidate for Germany’s Next Topmodel has no problem coming out as lesbian (“article” in German). Progress, I guess. :-)
Injustice Antonin Scalia has no problem coming out as flat-out racist. Petition to Chief Justice John Roberts not to vote for overturning the Voting Rights Act with Scalia.
Vertebrate eyes, or at least lab frog eyes, still work when they’re not in the head.
High humidity leads to loss of infectious influenza virus from simulated coughs – open-access paper!

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:12 pm

A brownie with no nuts?

No such thing anymore. I’ve eaten them all.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:12 pm

cicely @650
There’s nothing obviously male about that one. I demand more evidence!

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:12 pm

Parrowing
Welcome aboard! Have a cookie : ) Thin Mints are today’s special.

rq
I wouldn’t make you referee. Just mean ol’ Tony. He’s mean like that.

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:12 pm

I has a sad.

I went down to the coffee cart in the lobby and ordered this drink I’ve enjoyed for some time there.

The barista gave me a sadface and said that this was a special and they don’t carry it anymore.

weeps

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:14 pm

Oh, she had said HITCHEN’D.
Well if that were an original retort rather than one borrowed from our resident grog provider, Nerd, ‘twould have been thread-winningly funny. As it was, I merely gave a half smile.

Parrowing:
Nope no allergies.
I see you side with Portia.
The Rifts are growing indeed (another brownie please). Oh and vanilla ice cream with a warm brownie or chocolate cake is heaven.

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:14 pm

I needed some razzle-dazzle

That is beautiful!

Beatrice:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:15 pm

I’m dying for some chocolate after all this talk about sweets.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:19 pm

rq:
I dont eat the nuts so as not to deprive you of them. I do so try to think of your needs. I am a compassionate Shoop, unlike that wannabe Pictionary Champ.

cicely:
thats more like 3/4 cow 1/4 human…

opposablethumbs:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:20 pm

I am (ha!) attempting to work this evening. But whenever I can I shall keep an eye on the Terrifying! Horse-and-Pea-Defying! PICTIONARY PURSUIT CAGE MATCCCCCHHHHHH!!!!elebenty! from my ringside seat.
.
May I say I’m enjoying the pre-fight warm-up immensely. Though I’m just a little concerned for the structural integrity of the Lounge …

dianne:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:21 pm

Chocolate ice cream cake with chocolate chocolate chip ice cream and a chocolate buttercream frosting. This is what I will likely be attempting to make for my daughter’s next birthday.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:22 pm

And really, what kinda joke could anyone tell about me not liking nuts?
(i’m sure that would be unoriginal too…)

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:24 pm

dianne:
Someone is hogging the chocolate!

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:24 pm

I feel my loyalties are torn, torn, I say!
I’m just going to have myself a pile of cheesecake, brownies, icing, cookies and roasted garlic (this is magic) over here.
And yes, I want a real brownie now. pout I’ll take Esteleth’s orgasmic sandwich, too, but a warm cheesecake brownie would be better. With ice cream. Vanilla.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:26 pm

Tony
I refuse to make any jokes about you and nuts. Not even peanuts.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 2:28 pm

rq: I’d suggest that you reach under and check for yourself…but I thought we all were against non-consensual groping? The appearance of a penis-tip barely revealed peeking from behind that rear-right leg is enough to convince me, however.
-
comforting hugs for Esteleth. I grieve for your loss. “Object desired no longer available.” Story of my life.
-
Tony: I think we’re going to have to suspend judgement pending a proper DNA assay—however, given the speed with which DNA is processed for current-events rape cases, I also think we’ve got a bit of a wait ahead of us.
-

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:28 pm

opposablethumbs:
Hmmm the Lounge may not be able to handle all the stress Portia is creating. I of course have merely been sitting innocently (angelic, even) on my bean bag watching Buffy.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:32 pm

cicely
It might be a penis-tip. It might be something stuck in the fur of the underbelly, like a giant pea. How’s am I to know without copping a feel? With permission, of course.
Alternatively, those sculptors could have gone for a more spread-eagled pose. Appropriate, no?

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:32 pm

I love cake and cookies and ice cream and brownies and garlic sooooo much that I won’t even mix mine. No ice cream cake, no brownie à la mode, and not even garlic cookies for me.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:32 pm

I was really confused why you were saying you couldn’t get hitched. Now I follow.

…no wait, I lead. I lead my valiant forces into noble battle!

I made chocolate dipped pretzels earlier in anticipation of a craving.
I’ll share, Beatrice….
(almost left out the comma, which would have been awkward)

Tony
As a penalty for your impudence, you can’t make snowmen with me. And the snow is perfect. So there.

You only add Wannabe because you have not yet experienced the mighty power and amazing prowess I wield in this game called Pictionary. The game-playing relatives, they clamor for my favor, that I will grace their team with my participation. Verily.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:33 pm

Tony
Sorry, no nuts (I haz allergies)

cicely
Bling
Still moar bling
It’s a lace headpiece.
Now I only need some occasion to wear it

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:34 pm

Tony? An angel? I’m sorry, do you have wings to prove it? As far as I know, Esteleth is the only semi-proven angel around here.
opposablethumbs, I’m pretty sure PZ knows his audience and the Lounge will take it. But you never know, A woman’s anger and all that jazz… (Portia, I’ll being lots of cookies!)

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:36 pm

Hmmm the Lounge may not be able to handle all the stress~~ amazing artwork Portia is going to be creating. I of course have merely been sitting innocently inculpatorily (angelicdiabolic, even) on my bean bag watching Buffy, and taking notes on how to be evil from the various villains.

}:)

rq, don’t listen to Tony. Those who are not allergic but don’t eat (tree) nuts are not to be trusted.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 2:36 pm

I guess we could ask it how it self-identifies…if we had Niven’s side-slipping time machine.
-

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:37 pm

By the way, I bake pot brownies for all to enjoy after I win in battle…(yes, even Portia may have one)

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:37 pm

beepbeepbeep
Backs up the truck full of cookies for rq

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:37 pm

Giliell
That should be the Bling-Crown of Victory for this Pictionary-Death-Match. To be worn by the referee during competition, of course, and kept in a glass case afterward and awarded to the winner to be dusted and kept in pristine condition for life.

Parrowing
I’ve had a garlic parfait. Delicious.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:38 pm

Portia doesn’t go in for herbal additives to brownies :)
Just nuts. Or peanut butter.
Or candy.
Now i may to make brownies.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:39 pm

Tony
I’m allergic to pot. Also pots (not really, bad pun opportunity), but that’s a whole other story.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:40 pm

DISCLAIMER:
I have in no way implicitly conceded the point that Tony will win. What do you bake when you lose, Shoop? May want to collect ingredients for that.

UnknownEric is just a spudboy, looking for a quantum tomato.:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:41 pm

Rhinestone Cowgirl?

I can never remember the words to Rhinestone Cowboy, but I insist on singing along.

“Like a Rhinestone Cowboy (bum-bummmmm)
umm… like a two-fisted dog in a Calgary rodeo (???)”

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:41 pm

rq:
I drank a Red Bull. I hear that gives you wings.

****
::returns to watching Buffy, studiously taking notes on the villains to better understand his Pictionary opponent::

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:43 pm

Trust me when I say my Pictionary skills are better than my html skills.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 2:43 pm

Alternatively, those sculptors could have gone for a more spread-eagled pose. Appropriate, no?

snortle
-
Giliell: Pretty-shiny! Like!
-

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:47 pm

:::
Pauses Buffy long enough to notice that he will need to explain the meaning of ‘undefeatable’:::

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:49 pm

rq:

Garlic parfait?! I want one!

*

My husband calculated that he saved 120:- (approx. $18.50) in tax this month because he officially withdrew from the Swedish Church last year. Not a huge amount, but it adds up. Unfortunately, there is another church tax that no one can get out of, not even people who are not members, never have been, and never will be.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:50 pm

Everyone is undefeated…until they’re not.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:51 pm

To be clear, there are many nuts that my mouth has found pleasing…
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Peanuts
Cashews
Pistachios
To name a few.
I just do not want crunchy in my brownies.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:55 pm

Those first two aren’t nuts.

FRAUD

ednaz:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:57 pm

rq

I feel my loyalties are torn, torn, I say!
I’m just going to have myself a pile of cheesecake, brownies, icing, cookies and roasted garlic (this is magic) over here.
And yes, I want a real brownie now. pout I’ll take Esteleth’s orgasmic sandwich, too, but a warm cheesecake brownie would be better. With ice cream. Vanilla.

May I have one of each, please?

holds up plate, looking sweet

glodson:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:57 pm

I’m trying to get caught up in this thread, but I keep thinking of a human-cow hybrid that is weapons grade cute and made of brownies. With nuts.

I am utterly confused.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:57 pm

Parrowing
Mr. left the Lutheran church after, in a month with several big boni he paid 100 German Marks in church tax. But nobody is allowed to tell his grandma. He gets to use me as an excuse why we were never married in a church and why the kids aren’t baptized.

+++
Uhm, sorry, the chocolate is all in the brownies…

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:58 pm

Oh, and ‘Pictonarian’ is SO not a word. Your English teachers would be chastising you right now if they knew…

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:58 pm

Further:

Pistachio nuts are the single-seeded stone fruit of the pistachio tree (sumach family, Anacardiaceae), which is native to the Mediterranean area.

Emphasis mine. Source.

Portia – 1
Tony – 0

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 2:59 pm

Luckily for me, “Pictonarian” is not in my post-nym :)

(I’m worried we’re gonna devolve into pedantry…but then I’m great at pedantry).

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:01 pm

Bet she found that on Conservapedia…
(Did not know that. Unlike some, I humbly submit to correction and my vast humility enables me to accept that it is ok to be wrong)

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:03 pm

Oooh, I was going to be pedantic, but Portia beat me to it!

ednaz, would you like your roasted garlic on the cheesecake, or beside it?

Anyway, good luck with the fight. I’ll be checking in tomorrow to make sure you two (all?) have behaved. That’s how I referee, and if you don’t like it, bite me (warning: I am not crunchy except in the bony bits). I’m taking my pile-of-goodies and whistle with me, and no, nobody can stand in for me, because nobody referees like I do. Not even shiny rhinestone half-cow-girls (or men).

I’m confused, too. Ek. Time for bed!

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:03 pm

Had your correction been correct, I might have corrected myself! Neener.
It’s only hubris if you’re wrong, as a friend of mine used to say…

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:04 pm

Night, rq.
I’ll try to make Tony behave in your absence, but he’s just so unruly.

Sweet dreams : )

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:04 pm

:(
You shall have devolve into pedantry on your own. I have to get ready for work. I shall return soon to give you the gift of my triumph.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:05 pm

whisper
Psssst Tony, look over here! Nuts are fruit, but peanuts aren’t nuts (they’re legumes). So Portia is only half-right. ;)
/whisper

ednaz:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:05 pm

Giliell, You are lovely!
Your bling suits you. thumbsup

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:06 pm

Catching up.

very careful hugs for Cerberus

chocolate for Beatrice

Nutella is, as the name says, a hazelnut product. It’s not chocolate.

Cheesecake contains cheese. That’s bad.

David is autistic. That means you’re oppressing him by telling him to fuck off.

Well, I’m autistic enough that I can’t tell if you’re actually mocking me here… but I don’t think you are. So, I’ll just take this at face value:

No. I don’t feel oppressed at all, and I don’t think any such effects are happening on me or will happen later. All that’s going on is that the interpretation of greeting set me off, so I undertook some projection. Beatrice has nothing to apologize for.

Again, it’s my responsibility to read enough of the thread so I understand the context.

And while I’m clearly somewhere on the autism spectrum, I’m clearly not outright autistic. I’m not even diagnosed with anything; the one psychologist that I told about Asperger’s (because she… may not even have known about it) didn’t want to diagnose me with it, for fear I might hide behind the diagnosis…

Cake is better than cookies.

Depends on the cake and the cookies, obviously.

Congress has passed the inclusive VAWA! :D :D

Jadehawk’s® Totally Biodegradable Confetti®

Lots of animals, including the chimpanzees, still have penis spikes. Christine Dell-Amore of National Geographic News writes that the human genome project gave us the information that the ancestor we share with the chimps also had the spines.

o_O I had no idea!

Well, I give up. #610 went to the right site but the comic didn’t display. I took the “http:\\” out, and now #611 is trying to take you elsewhere on Pharyngula.

In comment 610, the URL ends in a formatted quotation mark that clearly doesn’t belong there. Did you use a word processor to write the comment?

I just finished submitting an abstract for the EHA.

What’s that? (Google doesn’t help.)

comforting hugs for Esteleth. I grieve for your loss.

All seconded.

Those first two aren’t nuts.

FRAUD

Still, bizarrely, the smell of peanuts triggers my nut allergy, as do both walnuts and hazelnuts. It’s not the classic peanut allergy where people get anaphylactic shock when someone opens a bag on the other side of the room.

Luckily for me, “Pictonarian” is not in my post-nym :)

From memory, the Bierce-Hartman-McKean-Skitt Law of Prescriptivist Retaliation states that any statement about correct spelling, punctuation(,) or grammar is bound to contain at least one eror.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:07 pm

I’d call you a traitor, rq, but I clearly distinguished the first two in his group as not nuts, and the third as a fruit!

…wait. I might be lost.

Anyhow, I should get to work too. Have a good night, Tony! :)

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:07 pm

As referee, I must drop this information about nuts that are fruits and those that are seeds for both Tony and Portia and step back to observe the results.
Unruly is fine. It’s when it gets violent in the Lounge that things go awry… And remember, children, Be civil! and use long words. It’s just so much more epic that way.

rq:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:10 pm

Portia, it’s ok, I lost the original list too (read: I’m too lazy to scroll up) so I’ll go hide in bed, this time for real! (Cashews are nuts – they also happen to be fruits.)
Have fun at work, Tony! :)
Good night, all.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:11 pm

Wikipedia is the source of all truth in the universe.

Verily. (That wasn’t a long word but it was a fancy word. I’ll work on being more voluminous and vociferous in the future. Not to mention alliterative.)

ednaz:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:11 pm

rq, Roasted garlic on the side, please. : )

-

Go Tony!

Go Portia!

Wait, I want both teams to win! : p

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:17 pm

S canceled on taking a weekend trip to judge a moot court competition with me. Whiiiiiine. Now I don’t wanna go either. : /

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:21 pm

Sorry that he canceled, Portia. But, if I may do the annoying “But maybe there’s a bright side!!!!” thing- maybe if you still go but alone, you’ll have a greater chance of meeting other lawyerly people that you get along with? I’m sorry if that’s a silly thing to say or it doesn’t make you feel better/makes you feel worse. hugs

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:27 pm

Thanks, Parrowing. That’s actually helpful. Not only will I see old classmates, but I can also make new acquaintances. I mean, I could do that with him. But I’m going to tell myself that if I’m not concerned with hanging out with him I willl be forced to get outta my shell. hugs back, thank you.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:31 pm

I need to be supportive of his efforts to bolster his own mental health, even when they inconvenience or upset me. I need to be supportive.

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:37 pm

rq @706:
Does this weaponless Shoop look like a hammer wielding camel?

David Marjanović:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:49 pm

Keith Ellison appears to have pwned Sean Hannity! (Haven’t watched it yet, no sound here.)

The ivory trade, complete with poaching, is getting worse, but Thailand is considering stopping the trade in the country; petition to make it so.

Giliell, professional cynic:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:57 pm

OK, my bed is calling and I’m afraid it might wake the kids.
Thanks youse all for the compliments about the Bling.
Assorted hugs

Tony

Does this weaponless Shoop look like a hammer wielding camel?

My 11pm brain made that a “shirtless weapon”…

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 3:57 pm

Night, Giliell, sleep well.

dongiovanni:

February 28th, 2013 at 4:15 pm

Giliell – Thank you so much for the recipe. I shall try it immediately.

As for fruitcake, it is most definitely aberrant.

Hugs to those who need them :)

Now I must go to produce cake and mousse.

dontpanic:

February 28th, 2013 at 4:50 pm

you can’t make snowmen with me

My spouse called me on her way to work because she’d passed a snow-Dalek complete with plunger and eggbeater. WANT!

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 4:56 pm

I take a few hours to go outside, and Deep Rifts form. I don’t care which camp I wind up in, as long as there’s beer. I’m easy to please that way.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 4:56 pm

Let me be the first to offer you a malted beverage, Joe : )

dontpanic: Snow-dalek…now I have ideas :D

Esteleth, Ficus Putsch Knits:

February 28th, 2013 at 5:32 pm

At seminar today, the speaker started with a cartoon.

Two snowpeople, outside. It is snowing.

One snowperson is pointing up with its stick branch, and saying, “Look! Stem cells!”

(I laughed)

birgerjohansson:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:11 pm

Although I am mostly recovered since Sunday, I am not quite well yet: http://soundcloud.com/educated_monkey/dave-chappelle-diarrhea-choir
— — — —
More out of season springtime weather. My town has travelled at least 200 miles southward since the eighties.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:11 pm

Portia, thanks for the beer… I guess your side of the Rift will do. :)

opposablethumbs:

February 28th, 2013 at 6:19 pm

Two snowpeople, outside. It is snowing.

One snowperson is pointing up with its stick branch, and saying, “Look! Stem cells!”

I love it. The whole family loves it. Passed on the description to SonSpawn, who laughed out loud and agrees that it’s adorable and has instructed me to tell his sister first thing tomorrow (only ’cause it’s kind of late tonight).
Good night Horde.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 7:10 pm

I laughed, too, Esteleth. :)
My dad will love that joke.

Joe, welcome to the winning team.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 7:16 pm

Beer, and chrome amplifier corners, and an amplifier carrying handle, and guitar straps, and shoulder pads for guitar straps, oh my!

I blogged about it, and I’ll mention it here… my amp sounds AWESOME! It is going to look so good when I’m done putting it back together, and it is worth the effort because it sounds so good.

Portia, Pictionarian Extraordinaire:

February 28th, 2013 at 7:47 pm

clink my wine glass against your beer, Joe, that’s really cool : )

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 7:57 pm

Jessica Williams is a gem. I am so glad she started getting better stuff.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:02 pm

Portia:

Wanna guess what my next project is? I’m going to buy a DIY guitar effects pedal kit, where they send you a housing and the components and you solder all the bits together. And then maybe an Arduino, but no promises. And the ultimate goal is to build an amplifier entirely from parts. Because I’m a huge Pink Floyd fan, probably an amplifier based on David Gilmour’s Hiwatt amps.

Not that I have any idea what I’m doing, but I can learn… grins

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:03 pm

That’s the spirit, Joe! Sounds like a neat way to learn. Great feeling of accomplishment awaitng you on the other side of those projects :)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:18 pm

Thanks Portia… accomplishment AND serious cash-savings! The Hiwatt company is currently shut down (I’m sure someone else will buy the name… Jimmy Page and Pete Townshend used these amps too!) and the closest clone models run between $1900-2200. I can build a hand-wired clone with similar specs for around $650, and upgrade to closer to original specs for only a couple of hundred more.

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:48 pm

Win-win!

…I’m getting a little tipsy

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:50 pm

I just took a survey for a sociology major or something,and this question is an “agree or disagree” one
and I’m not sure what it means.
“When I am with a sexual partner, I feel that I can always be responsible for what happens sexually with him”

I don’t get what that means. There were others about whether the respondent could “say no and mean it” in the midst of a progressing sexual encounter, and I know they ask questions slightly rephrased, but I’m still confused.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:55 pm

Portia,
I read that as a way of saying “Everything that occurs is something I choose,” but it is a poorly phrased question, IMO.

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 8:58 pm

Dalillama,
That makes a little more sense to me. Maybe they ran out of different ways to ask the “Are you regularly raped?” question. : p I answer “neutral” because I didn’t understand it and my first and second readings almost sounded…victim blamey.

Dalillama, Schmott Guy:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:02 pm

That’s actually a chronic problem I have with those surveys. There’s almost always at least one or two questions that I can’t parse in a way that makes sense, or make sense but don’t appear to have any meaningful answers.

bluentx:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:07 pm

You relurk for a while and what happens:
DEEP RIFTS!
I must take better notes and start a Lounge Lizards* Preference Chart. Items to track: peas, horses, cilantro, cake vs. cookies, brownies nutted or nyet, game prowess.. This could turn into a never ending/ constantly being upgraded project! Such anarchy… such animosity… such silliness : )
-
Lounge Lizard is NOT a pejorative. Why they’re one of my favorite bands! http://youtu.be/xbvrRct-TXc

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:09 pm

bluentx Welcome back! I’ve used Lounge Lizard before, with no dire consequences. Lizards aren’t horses, so no controversy there. :)

Portia, I’m a little tipsy too. This is the first time I’ve felt well enough to drink in almost a week, I’m on beer #4 and it is hitting me pretty hard.

cicely (If the glue's fit, I'll wear it.):

February 28th, 2013 at 9:10 pm

Just remember, bluentx, that Horses is always* capitalised, in keeping with the associated unnatural threat level—after all, who spells ‘Cthulhu’ other than with a capital ‘Cth’?
-

Portia, has had better days:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:11 pm

Joe:
Yeah it’s two glasses of sparkling wine for me.
I wish S hadn’t waited til I was half tipsy and 9pm before implying he wants me to come over.
Sigh.

bluentx:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:28 pm

And:
@ # 588:
Yea! Passage (finally) of the VAWA!
@ #604:
Why did my brain insist on reading that article in a Dr. Ruth voice?
[Can't find the comment number now]:
That clip of Keith Ellison doing the Hannity Stomp was a thing of beauty, but of course the Fox-watchers will dismiss him with: “Oh, what do you expect. He’s a Mooslum! He hates Amurika!”

bluentx:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:39 pm

Horses is always capitalised, in keeping with the associated unnatural threat level

You mean it’s part of the Homeland Securtity Advisory System?
Red
Orange
Yellow
Blue
Green
Horses
—-
Who knew!? The Lounge is so educational!

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 9:41 pm

Portia:

STAY HOME!

dontpanic:

February 28th, 2013 at 10:26 pm

Did the overflowing sink full of dishes; quaffed a glass of Port; continue to avoid the work task that I’ve been avoiding all week…

peas — fresh snap, sugar or shelled: good. cooked in any way: bad
Horses — eptimone of evil
cilantro — glorious, especially in my albondigas soup with a half cup of garlic
cake vs. cookies — good cake better than bad cookies, and vice versa (i.e. depends)
brownies nutted or nyet — either w/ a slight preference for nyet
game prowess — I can sometimes beat my wife (mostly luck on my part) and two learning disabled 11 year olds at Scrabble (last time I played that particular one); monopoly usually ends in a draw w/ my 15yr old (wife hates to play); son can whoop me at any video game and has been able to since he was 10 (Star Wars: Battlefront, in the space fighter scenarios I would almost never make it out the hanger before he shot me up — he’d alway be cackling evilly)

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 28th, 2013 at 10:50 pm

Whoa. Threadrupt. (Apologies!)

On Peas, Horses, and the Matter of Cakes or Cookies

Peas. I will eat them if I have to, but I really don’t like the way they feel when chewing. They kinda squish, it’s ick.

Horses. I’m neutral on the matter. While I’m not particularly fond of the beasts, I must admit they have their uses. (I’m thinking animal therapy, yeah?)

Cakes vs. Cookies. I like both. Some days I want cake. Some days I want cookies. Sometimes I want pie. Sometimes I go out to the Food Co-op and get something weird and dessert-y because, what the hell, I can. As long as I’m getting sugary goodness, I’m happy.

Dreams

Been having strange ones. Okay, even stranger than usual. I think these ones are trying to tell me something. I’m searching through a castle or dungeon, sometimes a modern estate-type area. I’m searching for gems or treasures or parts of a whole, I’m not sure exactly what, but I know it’s important and I need to find all the parts. I don’t know why. I don’t know what the things are, or what they make, or what they are part of, or what the point is. I just know I need to find them, and a lot of them are hidden in wall panels and shit like that. It’s… like a wacky nightmare version of No Stone Unturned, but without a clearly defined number of objects (or even a clue what the objects are), or a clear objective in place, just an urgent sense of “find these things”.

I feel like this is important, somehow, but what does it mean?

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

February 28th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

And the dreams are recurring on a nightly basis.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

WMDKitty, I have those same sorts of dreams, but they are more in the context of video games. I don’t know if you play video games, or if you do what sorts of games you play, but most games I play involve someone saying “we need the pieces of the A in order to open the B gate, so that we can access the plains of C where you’ll need to collect the seals of D so that we can breach the E wall, beyond which the F fragments lie… and on and on and on. And I have nightmares of chasing down piece after piece after piece and never finishing.

I don’t know what it means either, besides a restless night and a crabby morning.

strange gods before me ॐ:

February 28th, 2013 at 10:59 pm

Dreams do not have complex meanings. They all mean one of the following:

you have been feeling stressed lately; or
you have been feeling powerful lately; or
you have been thinking about the subject of the dream lately; or
nothing.

Usually nothing.

bluentx:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:02 pm

My board game prowess was stunted as a child. My Southern Baptist mother wouldn’t let her kids play certain games. She read my cousin the riot act when he taught me how to play Monopoly because … !!eleventy-eleven!! IT HAS DICE! DICE ARE FOR GAMBLING!!!! My cousin was stunned. “Board games? She won’t let you play board games!?”
Mom was quite upset with me when I reasoned: “Mom, if someone wanted to gamble, they could devise a way to use Old Maid cards to do it.” Mom hated it when I used logic. Looking back I don’t know why it took me so long to use the same logic on religion. Zombie Jesus, men surviving in the belly of a whale, miracle this, miracle that…sheesh!

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:06 pm

bluentx, I’m lucky in that I’ve always been an atheist, since I was old enough to understand the difference between fairy tales and reality. So I don’t and can’t know how you feel on that level. On the other hand, my parents taught me to be an atheist completely accidentally, and none of us realized the Deep Rift until I was a teenager, so I DO understand the “mom being mad” part.

bluentx:

February 28th, 2013 at 11:32 pm

I don’t particularly think that dreams “mean” anything but they can be interesting and maybe help you work out a problem. Kinda like: prayer doesn’t ‘work’ but it might calm you down enough to work out what your next step should be.
Many of my dreams are “you have been thinking about the subject of the dream lately” and through the dream(s) I have worked out a way to handle the situation IRL. Sort of a role playing therapy thing.
Now, what I was supposed to get out of the strangest (but not scary) dream I ever had I do not know to this day:
I’m attending an outdoor concert (Auditorium Shores for those of you who know Austin). The topography was slightly off but it was recognizable. I listened to the music, people watched and eventually realized that I was dreaming, then woke up. Next night I have the same dream (same bands, same music) but this time I immediately say to myself “This is the same dream I had last night.” I look around and say, “In last nights dream I was standing under that tree over there. I wonder if…” I walk to the tree and there ‘I’ am! I said “Hello” to myself, myself said “Hello” back, second-dream-self thinks “This is weird.”
And I woke up and said, “That was weird.”

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 12:05 am

Damn.
I didn’t know Rainbow Mars was about Svetz.

The Mellow Monkey:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:07 am

My dreams are usually like bizarre art films with convoluted plots and tortured metaphors. At times, there’s some recognizable symbolism of whatever I’ve been thinking about during my waking hours. Usually it’s just the fact that I’ve trained my brain to think like that through reading and writing, so it goes into free form storytelling mode. There is no meaning. Just a hilarious story, free from the burden of having to make sense.

As a result, I’ve had a lot of dreams that I cherish the memories of them like “so bad it’s good” movies. The one involving the T-rex trying to ride the swing at the elementary school while Steven Spielberg was shouting out instructions from the jungle gym shall remain with me for the rest of my life.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:10 am

iJoe:
Religion-wise “Mom got mad” at me because I fought like hell (as a teenager) about having to get up early on Sunday to go to church : ) Then, it was just that church was so boring!

After leaving home I was just ambivalent about religion. For years I’d get on an occasional “where do I fit in” kick and study different denominations, religions, New Agey crap, etc.

For the longest I thought “What’s wrong with me?Why can’t I just accept/believe what my friends believe?” Growing up in Texas I was sometimes worried (literally) that someone would find out I’ve never been baptized. (Egads!) It would have been social suicide (not to mention an onslaught of unwanted witnessing/proselytizing coming my way) to admit it.[ Now I think it's a plus-- I don't have to get un-baptized ! Heh!]

Eventually I read more philosophy (yeah, I know how some people around here feel about that) and I read Susan Jacoby’s Freethinkers: A History of American Secularism, Jennifer Michael Hecht’s Doubt: A History, some Dawkins, some Hitchens, etc.
Now I consider religion just “an interesting psychological phenomenon”– (a favorite line from the movie The Gods Must Be Crazy)- that seems aprapos.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:16 am

The Mellow Monkey,

I’ve had those sorts of dreams too, and they are great and awesome. In the theme of my earlier video game-based dream post, I had a dream the other night based on the Dead Space game series. You’re in a powered armor suit, and one of your powers is “kinesis” which means limited telekinetic powers. So I had a dream the other night that included sentient gorillas throwing iron balls on chains at me, and me being able to catch them with “kinesis” and throw them right back at those damned dirty apes!

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:27 am

Good morning!
The reason I’m glad I no longer have religion?
I won’t be worrying about my dad ‘seeing’ me from Heaven after he dies. That means less guilty thoughts about doing his my way or his way.
This thought came to me once when we were visiting Husband’s mother’s grave, and I was randomly thinking about how he’s a bit shy about sex noises and generally doesn’t like to do it if he knows his siblings are in the next room (although asleep), and then the thought came to me that, Wait, he (his family) believes that his mom is in heaven and looking down on everything they do… And I just… Don’t really want his mom watching us. :/
Either way, I had a weird epiphany that day also about god, because, if she herself isn’t always looking down from heaven, supposedly god is, and he could always tell her about everything we do, since, you know, he’s god and everything. I decided I was glad I could look at all of that from the side.

In other news, I see last night’s conflict has not been satisfactorily resolved. Did everyone involved just flounce, or was Improbable Joe just being a distraction with his amps and beer?
(Portia, I hope you had the sense to tell S not to come over and not to go yourself!! And yes, I think you should go to the event yourself and network for yourself, if only to get used to going places without S. It’ll be fun!!)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:30 am

bluentx: yeah, ‘philosophy’ seems stupid to a lot of us because it fails to drum out its own stupid, and gets defended by people we respect and expect to know better. And when you add in the folks who claim to be philosophers who are former FtB bloggers and who turned out to be complete assholes? From a lay perspective, the entire discipline is suspect.

My mother didn’t get on me for religion until she found out I was an atheist. Before that she was generally not awesome. I want to be fair, she had to deal with me and my genius IQ and my older brother who is on the autism spectrum at the same time. I mean, come on! The first time I took the SAT I got almost 1000 out of 1600!!!

She still could have been nicer. I wasn’t great, but she would never have dared treat an adult that way, so she shouldn’t have gone after me that way either.

ednaz:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:30 am

IJoe, Congratulatory beer coming your way for your awesome amp adventures. Way to go!
-

Portia, Seconding Joe’s – Stay Home.
Perhaps let S miss you a little?
-

Esteleth, Loved the snowman joke. : ) Will tell it to The Hoodlum.
-

chigau (違う), How goes the govt. work?
May I offer you some rum?

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:32 am

rq, I’m not a distraction, I’m an enhancement. I’m expanding your worldview by talking about things you don’t have direct experience with. For free, even.

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 12:33 am

ॐ
re: dreams
yup
—-
I have just eaten some eda-mame (perilously close to peas).
They were frozen and a bit beyond their “best before”.
But slow simmer and lots of salt has made them yummy.
—
Kitteh does not approve of skim milk.
—
rum hugs for all

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:35 am

ednaz,

Thanks, and you’re totally welcome in my house. We’ll have a bed and heat and eggs and… electricity? I don’t want to promise too much, you know? But you’ve always been awesome to me and BossNurse, and we both appreciate it.

ednaz:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:40 am

bluentx,

Now I consider religion just “an interesting psychological phenomenon”– (a favorite line from the movie The Gods Must Be Crazy)- that seems aprapos.

I like this. : )

ednaz:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:43 am

IJoe, Hee! Very cool. : )

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:49 am

Hey ednaz I have a fireplace and wood, so heat is covered. :) There’s a really nice Sealy mattress in the spare bedroom. We’ve got DirecTV and decent Internet. We have a Keurig and plenty of K-cups. You can touch ONE of my guitars. So my house is better than a hotel, and we also have cats if you like that sort of thing. :)

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:01 am

sgbm
Of course not, no, it’s not at all possible that dreams are the brain’s way of sorting out conscious and subconscious issues while you sleep…

iJoe
Yeah, I’m a gamer. I’ve been back and forth between Fallout 3, Fallout New Vegas, and Skyrim lately. It makes sense that my brain might use that kind of framework to work out… whatever it is. It’s a pattern I’ve seen before with my dreams, where it’s the same thing (with minor changes) every time, until there’s a breakthrough of some kind. Once it’s worked out, the dreams change, or move on to (repeated) dreaming about the next “objective” in my brain’s nocturnal agenda.

Right now they’re leaving me with a feeling like there’s… something just out of reach, something important, something vital, like maybe it’s the key to finally taking the next step forward in coping with the shit I’m coping with. Heh. Like screwing up the courage to seek out a therapist.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:06 am

Improbable Joe
I have had direct experience with amps. Just not green ones with fancy corners with all their insides plucked out. ;) Always a new perspective on the horizon. Thanks, Joe!

strange gods before me ॐ:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:11 am

The something-important-just-out-reach feeling in a dream is just as meaningful as when the same feeling occurs during an LSD trip. It’s your waking narrative self that is saying “seek out a therapist”. Doesn’t mean it’s not good advice.

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 1:12 am

ednaz #759

How goes the govt. work?

Redundancy on top of repetition inside of reiteration overlapping with ‘covering all the bases’.
cubed
rum is always welcome

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:15 am

iJoe:
If I didn’t make it clear (and apparently I didn’t) the philosophy study was a stepping stone for me and mostly just of historical interest– what’s already been argued, been debunked, reworked, etc. I didn’t go to college so I was a late bloomer in reading many things– just catchin’ up : )

Good morning, rq:
No, the Rift is not settled and yes, it just seems to have faded (for now). Always happens: about the time I get caught up on the thread the virtual crickets start ‘singing’, The Lounge clears out and the night crew gets stuck with the push broom and cleaning ashtrays : )

And yes, I think the “God and Grandma are always watching” thing is kinda creepy, too.Religious Voyeurism- yech! I thought “good Christians, et. al.” were supposed to be against peepshows. Holy Hypocrites, Batman!

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:25 am

WMDKitty I would love, and be honored, and even would be willing to spend my own money, to play games with you online. Some variation of “Improbable Joe” is my ID across all gaming platforms.

rq Few people have direct experience with an amp as awesome as mine. grins The guy at the store was amazed, and we’d already spent half the morning playing the same guitar through most of the good amps in the shop. When you add in the vinyl covering and the adhesive… it certainly makes for a unique experience.

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 1:28 am

bed then, me

John Morales:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:33 am

ॐ,

Dreams do not have complex meanings.

Not intrinsically, anyway. :)

–

Tony,

I’m a gay man in Florida. I cannot get hitched.

Well, you can get a beard…

(Bad joke?)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:34 am

bluentx

I 200% endorse the study of philosophy as a branch of history. I think that philosophy has covered immense areas of human experience, especially before we had competent science to do the work in the world beyond the conceptual.

I’m a person who exists in both worlds. I’m intellectual enough, I think… I’ve got a fair grounding in literature, mathematics, and physics. I’ve also spent plenty of years in the world of DOING. I’m a former Marine, I’ve worked on assembly lines, I’ve dug ditches and shoveled chicken shit. I don’t value one world over another, but I’m more aware than most when one world crosses the line into places they can’t understand.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:40 am

bluentx
It just made me wonder why people think it’s so awesome when their dead relatives ‘look down on them from heaven’ – honestly, would you want a whole collection of blood relations from several generations (right back to the last pagan one) checking out everything you do?? /rhetorical
I certainly don’t. I know it’s supposed to work as a way of keeping people good (because people are only good when other people watch and make sure they’re good).
I’ll help you clean up.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:51 am

rq

I’ll help you clean up.

Me too. I was about to launch into an ugly thing about how I’d love Internet bullies to come at me in real life because I’m a former Marine with lots of extra instructor training and I could hurt lots of people, and my sparing partner was a guy who was 8-inches taller than me and outweighed me by 60 pounds… but you know what? The OTHER thing I was good at was cleaning. I can scrub good and I’m great with a floor buffer. :)

ednaz:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:51 am

So God’s a peeping tom! : D

strange gods before me ॐ:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:55 am

Ethics is philosophy.

If you’ve ever been unsure what’s the right thing to do, you needed philosophy.

If you thought about it and then made a deliberate decision, you used philosophy.

ednaz:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:58 am

IJoe, I will trade being allowed to touch one guitar for being allowed to hear you PLAY one guitar!! : D thumbsup
-
Beverage of choice for the clean-up crew. : )
-

Good night All. Pleasant weird dreams.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:04 am

ednaz The price of staying with me is being forced to hear me play guitar… more of a punishment than a blessing?

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:08 am

I want to punch some bullying assclowns in their fucking faces, and/or polish some brass or leather… [/Marine curse]

John Morales:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:10 am

The future is becoming: Drones set for large-scale commercial take-off

Hundreds of small commercially operated drones could soon take to Australian skies under a radical new set of rules proposed by the Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA) in Melbourne this week.

Under a new weight class system, prospective drone entrepreneurs with craft weighing 2 kilograms or less could take off after completing nothing more than an online application form.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:11 am

Once the game(s) is/are back on, rq, I put my name in the hat in case you need a break as ref. Not being much of a gamer (board or video- tho I do enjoy some word games) I volunteer as your second.*

Not intended to imply that you are not up to the task.

-

So God’s a peeping tom!

Apparently, yep. A Celestial Peeping Diety.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:19 am

Improbable Joe
You can polish some brass taps. They’re around here somewhere. I’m better at cleaning windows… Wait, does* the Lounge have windows? Or is it one of those dark, sub-terranean dens that make you lose track of all time?
What brought your rage this time? Or is it a general thing?

ednaz
Of course god’s a peeping tom – otherwise, how’s he to know who gets the coal and who gets the… oh, wait. Well, he’s still a peeping tom! ;)

bluentx
I suspect our time-zones are similar enough that we’d be on the field at the same time (or at least, when no one else is on it :P). :) But first, we must invent the Referee Dessert. Just so nobody thinks we’re taking sides (cakecakecakecakecake…). ;)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:28 am

rq

What brought your rage this time? Or is it a general thing?

I don’t know about you, but any time I step beyond the safety of the Lounge, I see things worthy of some righteous rage. Lots of bullies, lots of harassment, some number of people dead by suicide or murder because of ideas that should have been rejected decades or centuries ago.

And there’s a part of me that says “I can make a change” by hitting people really really hard… and I know it is unreasonable and illegal and impossible. But by putting the solution on that scale, it puts the problem on that scale, and makes it something I feel can someday be corrected.

It is wrong. It is a ridiculous fantasy. I can’t help but wish I could do something.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:41 am

… and I’m sure someone from the Slymepit will take what I posted and try to claim that I’m making a threat, because that’s how the Slymepit rolls. And fuck them too, because if anyone sees what I said as a threat against them, it only means that they are a bully who is afraid of people calling them out. Let’s not coddle the sexist bullying cretins, OK?

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:45 am

Time zones and match schedules:
I guess it all depends on how many rivalries or teams end up surfacing. We may have to have some “away games” and travel may become a large factor.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:51 am

because if anyone sees what I said as a threat against them, it only means that they are a bully who is afraid of people calling them out.

That or they’re channeling Bob Woodward and their reading comprehension is just as bad as his.
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/02/exclusive-the-woodward-sperling-emails-revealed-88226.html

Giliell, professional cynic:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:56 am

Good morning
Can you hear that?
It’s the sound of silence!
Both kids in kindergarten (and it is about time the little one settles back into “world with rules mode”).
I have big plans for today, like taking a shower in peace without worrying about the rest of the flat.

dreams: Last night one’s involved tree houses. And somebody who wanted to play one-upmanship and tried to build one where you boarded a spaceship to get there. Actually a funny one.

games: I’m from a family of gamers and I married into a family of gamers. I’m also from a family of cheaters. My grandpa would even cheat at chess. Not because he wanted to badly win against a little kid, but because he wanted us to catch him.
What was funny was when my grandma was Worried™ during the time I played trading card games. Because she was afraid of gambling and she was totally shocked when she heard that there was Money involved. It took some time to explain to her that yes, we played for money, but you couldn’t win any. If you lost a game, you had to pay 10 ct, if you won you still had to pay 5ct and when there was enough money we’d go for dinner together.

atheism: 4th generation (at least on my maternal side) here. Although I guess my mum is the perfect example how being raised a liberal atheist without critical thinking turns you into somebody who isn’t actually liberal, but who simply has the right position on a couple of issues. Fooled me for a long time. So she has, for example, some feminist ideas, somewhere between 2nd and 3rd wave but no background in those ideas so she is totally not able to examine new ideas or change hers. She would be totally pro-choice and of course pro women in the workforce and stuff, but also absolutely victim-blaming and teaching me how to prevent rape and shocked, I tell you, shocked when I made a pin-up of myself for Mr. (I’m still quite proud of that picture. It was funny because out of like 50 pictures the one is the best where the setting crashed around me…)

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:02 am

bluentx

I read that about Bob Woodward. I understand that he’s a whole lot pathetic, but he’s also a legendary journalist who has always targeted hugely important figures including several presidents.

Imagine people who are engaged in similar behavior, except instead of targeting a president or two, they’ve picked some random guy on the Internet like me to follow around in order to harass. Bob Woodward isn’t even 1/100th as important as the presidents he’s targeted. Can you begin to imagine how sad and pathetic someone would have to be to target me? Because I can’t even start to formulate that… they would be below me, but also below my pets, and also below the poop and pee I scoop out of the litter boxes… but they are following me more than I follow the poop and pee I scoop up, so how low does that put them?

It is entirely too sad to even consider, so for their sake I hope they stop following/bothering me, because they’d be better served in their own lives by doing ANYTHING else… scratching their butts, picking their noses, clipping their toenails. Some dude made a video about me? Really? I don’t have a whole lot going on, and I still found something better to do than watch the video.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:17 am

Also? I want to say two things:

1) “I know who you are. I know where you live. I’m going to give you exactly what you have coming to you with my bare hands. It is going to hurt me more than it hurts you… no, that’s a lie. It is going to hurt you a bunch, and I might have a few bruises for my pleasure.”

2) “Carly Simon. 1972.”

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:19 am

grins

Jeez, that was just… obscure? I wish I’d quoted Liam Neeson from Taken though… Would have been funnier. :)

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:01 am

Improbable Joe
I wouldn’t have gotten the reference, anyway. :)
And with regard to the stuff outside of the Lounge, yeah, it makes me ridiculously angry sometimes… But also at those propagating those ideas. Like, can they really be that stupid to believe it and to teach it? I find it extremely difficult to wrap my mind around the kind of world view that can see telling your gay child he is an abomination as a Good Thing. I just… I can’t understand it. And while I do get angry, I get a horrible sense of sadness for the victims of such world-views, to the point where it just makes me cry. To be that trapped, and to grow up (or have grown up) believing [x], which is harmful… Bleh. I just hope I can do better for my own kids, you know?
(Punching things just isn’t my style, really. But I can understand the feelings behind it – mostly frustration at the immensity of it all, I suppose. And the pure, unadulterated asshole-ishness. Beer?)

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:05 am

I used to like that Joe guy. Til he sided with Portia of the Dark Side, aka She Who Shall Lose.

Gosh, what a long day. ::Jar Jar Binks voice:: “Meesa going to bed::

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:22 am

Tony
Good night! Here, have some cake! (I’ll admit it’s not red velvet, I have yet to attempt that recipe, but when I do, I will save a piece for you.) In the mean-time, you’ll have to make do with these:
Irish Car Bomb Cupcakes
Yield: 24 cupcakes
Prep Time: 40 minutes | Bake Time: 17 minutes

For the Cupcakes:
1 cup Guinness stout
1 cup unsalted butter, at room temperature
¾ cup Dutch-process cocoa powder
2 cups all-purpose flour
2 cups granulated sugar
1½ teaspoons baking soda
¾ teaspoons salt
2 eggs
2/3 cup sour cream

For the Whiskey Ganache Filling:
8 ounces bittersweet chocolate
2/3 cup heavy cream
2 tablespoons butter, at room temperature
2 teaspoons Irish whiskey

For the Baileys Frosting:
2 cups unsalted butter, at room temperature
5 cups powdered sugar
6 tablespoons Baileys Irish Cream
1. To Make the Cupcakes: Preheat oven to 350 degrees F. Line 24 cupcake cups with liners. Bring the Guinness and butter to a simmer in a heavy, medium saucepan over medium heat. Add the cocoa powder and whisk until the mixture is smooth. Cool slightly.
2. Whisk the flour, sugar, baking soda and salt in a large bowl to combine. Using an electric mixer, beat the eggs and sour cream on medium speed until combined. Add the Guinness-chocolate mixture to the egg mixture and beat just to combine. Reduce the speed to low, add the flour mixture and beat briefly. Using a rubber spatula, fold the batter until completely combined. Divide the batter among the cupcake liners. Bake until a thin knife inserted into the center comes out clean, about 17 minutes. Cool the cupcakes on a rack.
3. To Make the Whiskey Ganache Filling: Finely chop the chocolate and transfer it to a heatproof bowl. Heat the cream until simmering and pour it over the chocolate. Let it sit for one minute and then, using a rubber spatula, stir it from the center outward until smooth. Add the butter and whiskey and stir until combined. Let the ganache cool until thick but still soft enough to be piped.
4. To Fill the Cupcakes: Using a 1-inch round cookie cutter (or the bottom of a large decorating tip), cut the centers out of the cooled cupcakes, going about two-thirds of the way down. Transfer the ganache to a piping back with a wide tip and fill the holes in each cupcake to the top.
5. To Make the Baileys Frosting: Using the whisk attachment of a stand mixer, whip the butter on medium-high speed for 5 minutes, scraping the sides of the bowl occasionally. Reduce the speed to medium-low and gradually add the powdered sugar until all of it is incorporated. Add the Baileys, increase the speed to medium-high and whip for another 2 to 3 minutes, until it is light and fluffy.
6. Using your favorite decorating tip, or an offset spatula, frost the cupcakes and decorate with sprinkles, if desired. Store the cupcakes in an airtight container.
(Recipe from the Brown-Eyed Baker.)

Yes, it has a lot of ingredients, but honestly, do you want all your cooking and baking to be easy??

Parrowing buıʍoɹɹɐd:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:25 am

Good night, Tony.

In the light of day and in the absence of wine haze, this rift seems to be filled with chocolate sauce. I think we’re allowed to swim or raft to the other side of this one when we want to.

For some reason, I always enjoyed being scorekeeper much more than actually playing games. No one ever believed me when I said I’d rather sit out of playing because I’d have more fun that way. They would always pressure me and accuse me of not wanting to enjoy myself… that was really annoying.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:31 am

Parrowing
I think filling the rift with chocolate sauce is the best idea ever… Until someone who hates chocolate sauce comes along, and puts up a High Peninsula between the chocolate sauce and the vanilla creme.
Looks like we have a team of referees and score-keepers developing. Heh. By the time the match is done, all the goodies will be eaten and gone!

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:43 am

That recipe sounds totes awesome, though a wee bit beyond my skill set rq. How about you and Joe fix the grub and Parrowing will be the referee/scorekeeper.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:47 am

do you want all your cooking and baking to be easy??

” Neigh!” Oh..uh.. I mean, “Nay! ”
looks around to see if Cecily heard that
I hate, hate, hate seeing a luscious picture of a cake, cupcakes, brownies, etc. and then reading the ingredients that start with “1 box of cakemix”or “brownie mix”! Rarely is a mix “appropriate” in my opinion.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:57 am

bluentx
Iadmit, in a pinch, sometimes I cheat (like making a Jello cake for Middle Child’s 3rd last week because sick and no ingredients (because sick)). But. When I have the time and energy, there’s a special magic to making something complicated from scratch.
That being said, Tony, I will not be relegated to the kitchen just because I can do it. It’s a bit of a sore spot for me, and while I honestly enjoy doing stuff for fun in the kitchen, once I’m put there just because I can (and don’t place myself there by choice), it’s no longer amusing. I’ll referee; if Joe needs help, I’ll lend a hand, but please don’t stick me in the kitchen for posting a recipe with lots of ingredients. I do it for fun, not because I’m assigned. ;)

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:59 am

Until someone who hates chocolate sauce comes along, and puts up a High Peninsula between the chocolate sauce and the vanilla creme

I would fight to the death for chocolate and caramel! Ummm…caramel….nomnomnom…

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 5:19 am

in a pinch, sometimes I cheat

Understood. I did say ‘rarely’ ; )

Growing up Mom (the housewife) sometimes supplemented Dad’s income by catering parties, baking wedding cakes and always baking the birthday cake of our choice.
My mom died in 1997 and long time friends still comment on her German Chocolate Cake or Carrot Cake or (this one’s for you Tony) Red Velvet Cake or her Christmas cookies or…

I got her to write down many of her recipes before the Altzheimer’s kicked in too badly but I have to be careful when passing recipes on. Some of the ones she hand-copied more recently are missing an ingredient or two, a crucial step or instruction.

It’s amazing just how many memories are triggered by the taste or smell of just the right recipe or ingredient.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 5:36 am

bluentx
That sounds like a delicious childhood, and too bad about the missing ingredients/instructions. If you know some of the ingredients/instructions, maybe you should consider putting together a cookbook of her best? In case you have too much time on your hands and all that, apologies if the suggestion is inappropriate. ;)
My mum also did the cake-of-choice for birthdays, within limits, though (by that I mean she wasn’t a cake artist, but it doesn’t lessen the gesture or the deliciousness of the cakes). I can’t remember a single cake that I didn’t like, either mine or my siblings’. But I know which recipe books she used, which makes the best ones easy to reproduce. ;)

Ogvorbis: We Are LEGUMES!:

March 1st, 2013 at 5:49 am

Damn.

PZed must have forgotten to lube up the portcullis again.

And it is Saturday. Mmmm.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:07 am

I’m working on the reproduction of recipes and have been ‘thinking about’ the Family Cookbook for years. One of these days… I’ve already got one box of recipes labeled “Mom’s Best”… you must be psychic!

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:12 am

bluentx
I must be. And I think your tinfoil cap has slipped a bit. ;)

Giliell, professional cynic:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:14 am

buentx

I’m working on the reproduction of recipes and have been ‘thinking about’ the Family Cookbook for years.

One of the best things I ever got was a ring-binder cooking-book where you can just write in the recipes yourself.
So, whenever I try a recipe that works really well and that isn’t in a cooking book but in a magazine or on the internet, I write it down. Also grandma’s recipes for my two favourite christmas cookies. Funny enough, there’s only sweet stuff in there. For dinner recipes I usually just remember the general guidelines and then do them from scratch.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:16 am

Slipped? No, that’s just a jaunty angle, don’t cha know.

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:22 am

Giliell:
I’ve got a binder something like that. Somehow it seems to keep overflowing and never gets scanned, copied or properly organized. Go figure!

bluentx:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:33 am

I’ll say goodnight/good morning now.
It’s only Friday?! My Friday doesn’t happen until Monday morning, so I’ve got three more days of “workin’ for tha man” torture?!*
-
* There ya go Ogvorbis. Competition on warping calendars. Ha-ha!

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:59 am

bluentx
Good night!

Beatrice:

March 1st, 2013 at 7:25 am

Hello!
Good night, bluentx!

Ah, Friday. And a nice sunny one. Super.

marko:

March 1st, 2013 at 7:34 am

Hi folks,

I don’t often post in the lounge, but I was wondering if I could get a bit of advice from anyone who has their noses a bit more finely tuned for sniffing out quackery than me.

I was one of a reasonably large distribution group for an email forwarded on by the head at my daughter’s school (I’m on the parent council, so find myself on these distribution lists fairly regularly). I was immediately quite concerned about the contents and thought it didn’t all quite ring true. The email was from a group called the “Emergent Disease Foundation” and was warning about the potential risks to public health from exotic animals. They linked to their website and a couple of journal publications, I was suspicious that the papers all seemed to be written by the trustees of Emergent Diseases Foundation, and seemed to be quite fond of citing from their own publications. A Google search for them showed enough evidence that my gut feeling was right and I sent off a quick reply all urging caution before we sent this out to a wider audience than it had already found.

Has anyone came across this group, or know anything about them? I would appreciate any opinions as to whether my initial diagnosis of quackery was in the ballpark?

You can find them here:
http://www.emergentdisease.org/

And a link to the paper they cite in the email:
http://emergentdisease.org/assets/documents/A_review_of_captive_exotic_animal-linked_zoonoses.pdf

Cheers,
Marko.

Pteryxx:

March 1st, 2013 at 7:51 am

bluentx re boardgames:

Mom was quite upset with me when I reasoned: “Mom, if someone wanted to gamble, they could devise a way to use Old Maid cards to do it.” Mom hated it when I used logic.

Ooh, I got that line too! Nothing involving dice or ‘bad’ playing cards (the standard ones with hearts, spades etc). I was told that’s why permissible games were ones like Life (which used a spinner instead of evil dice) and Uno (which used its own cards instead of the evil ones).

I used to roll wooden pencils. They have six sides, right? <_<

theophontes (坏蛋):

March 1st, 2013 at 7:54 am

{distracted by the EP comments, The Horde fail to notice a tiny electrically powered octocopter, piloted by an eight legged invertebrate, deposit a linky marked: “For Emergency Use Only” on Portia‘s lap.}

@ John Morales

drones

Response in thunderdome. Link.

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 8:23 am

Several members of the Forum for Young Canadians http://www.forum.ca/forum2/index.php have become ill with a ‘stomach bug’ while on a trip to Ottawa.
On the News, a spokesperson was quoted as saying that one of their trips was cancelled because they didn’t want to spread the infection on Parliament Hill.
Am I a bad person because I thought, “Well, I would.”?

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 8:27 am

theophontes
srsly?
pea-flavoured pop-sicle?

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 8:32 am

chigau
The first place I would go would be the PMO, to shake hands with Mr. Harper.

chigau (違う):

March 1st, 2013 at 8:37 am

rq
Yup. Then with every politician in the place and on to the Senate!

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 8:44 am

chigau
I would make it a Grand Event.

theophontes (坏蛋):

March 1st, 2013 at 10:44 am

@ chigau

pea-flavoured pop-sicle?

Rather nyummy actually. (Red bean popsicles are also very popular.)

edamame

or mao dou in Chinese. Literally “hairy beans”. Sadly none on the market right now. I buy them fresh and then boil them in water with some added sechuan peppers, soy sauce, vinegar. Beats even popcorn as a tasty snack.

cicely (No further comment.):

March 1st, 2013 at 10:54 am

Why We Have Sinuses: a series of untested hypotheses (in varying degrees of facetiousness)

1) To lighten up the skull, since empty space (quiet down, you hecklers in the back!) weighs less than bone—or squishy water-filled tissue.
2) As a sloppy, inefficient barometer, advising you that:
a) a front is coming through; bring in the patio furniture and tie down the cats;
b) you have abruptly changed altitude; you have driven up a mountain, or your plane is going down in flames.
3) Mucus Overflow Containment. Need I say more?
4) The ragweed is ripe. What you do with this information is entirely up to you.
5) A large feline has you in its sights. Teleport Without Error!
6) Air-borne Particulates Advisory; grab a fire extinguisher, there may be a burning plane somewhere in your vicinity.
-
Cilantro: What good is soap that won’t get the dishes clean???
Cake or Cookies: How much chocolate are we talking, here?
Nuts in Brownies: Yes please, with extra nuts; pecans for preference, but walnuts are also acceptible.

And I think that I’ve made my view clear on Certain Other Matters.
-

While I’m not particularly fond of the beasts, I must admit they have their uses. (I’m thinking animal therapy, yeah?)

But nowadays, it is possible to get perfectly good glue from other sources. Less infernal ones.

WMDKitty, I have dreams like those all the time! What they generally mean, in my experience, is:
1) I haven’t been playing enough D&D.
2) I’ve been playing too much D&D (difficult, but possible).
3) I’m the DM, and teh brainz is set on Autoplot.
4) I need to DM. Plan coup.

Your mileage will almost certainly vary.
:D

I also sometimes do D&D/movie-and/or-TV fusions…or D&D/book fusions…or D&D/Civ III fusions (those are odd!)…or D&D/Real Life fusions…or D&D/Superheroes fusions…or D&D/SCA fusions….
I’m sure that this crowd will have easily picked out the common denomiator.
:)
-

I didn’t know Rainbow Mars was about Svetz.

Neither did I, I was just wikiing for a linkable explanation for the malfunctioning “time machine”. It looks like it collects all the short stories, but I don’t know how firmly that additional material is tied to them. Is the Secretary General an inheritable office? And does the current holder of that office have the cognitive development of a 6 year old? Inquiring minds have no clue.
-

carlie:

March 1st, 2013 at 11:02 am

pea-flavoured pop-sicle?

Rather nyummy actually. (Red bean popsicles are also very popular.)

I have had a durian popsicle!* I even had an entire photo essay of feeding them to my children on facebook, back when I had such a thing.

which I first spelled as “duran”, then giggled at the thought of 80s pop band branded treats

cicely (No further comment.):

March 1st, 2013 at 11:16 am

Peeping Toms are “created in God’s image”.
-
“Conscience is that calm, still voice telling you that someone is watching.”
-

Both kids in kindergarten

Hurray!
-

” Neigh!” Oh..uh.. I mean, “Nay! ”
looks around to see if Cecily heard that*

Oh, cicely heard it, all right!
racking up a demerit in bluentx’s column

And cake from a mix is about my speed.

My mother always asked what kind of cake we wanted for our birthdays—then made the kind of cake she wanted for our birthdays. Why did she even bother with asking?
-

{distracted by the EP comments, The Horde fail to notice a tiny electrically powered octocopter, piloted by an eight legged invertebrate, deposit a linky marked: “For Emergency Use Only” on Portia‘s lap.}

eyes wide with horror
Is that…a pea-flavored popsicle???
gulps hastily, while reaching for the barf bucket
-

Lynna, OM:

March 1st, 2013 at 11:29 am

More evidence that something has gone seriously wrong in Bob Woodward’s mind. This journalistic giant, famous for the role he played in exposing the Watergate scandal and in bringing Nixon down, has slid off the rails. His reality train is so drastically derailed that he is now appearing with Ann Coulter on Faux News to blather away, in ways that only confirm that he has lost his grip on journalistic integrity.

This latest edition of wayward Woodward began when he misunderstood/forgot/lied about the origins of the sequester. He got so much of that story wrong that his friends tried to put him back on track, and they did it kindly, with respect. Which drove Woodward wild. He came down especially hard on Gene Sperling.
Video and longer article here.

… Look, this really isn’t complicated. As we’ve discussed, last week, after their phone conversation got a little heated, Sperling emailed Woodward directly and said, “I apologize for raising my voice in our conversation today…. But I do truly believe you should rethink your comment about saying that Potus asking for revenues is moving the goal post. I know you may not believe this, but as a friend, I think you will regret staking out that claim.”

Sperling added in his email, “I agree there are more than one side to our first disagreement, but again think this latter issue is diffferent. Not out to argue and argue on this latter point. Just my sincere advice. Your call obviously. My apologies again for raising my voice on the call with you. Feel bad about that and truly apologize.”

Even now, after having a week to think about this and reflect on the exchange, Woodward is still convinced Sterling was speaking in “code,” trying send a subtle “you better watch out” message.

And this is why it seems something has gone very wrong with Bob Woodward.

There is no code. There is no secret message. There was no between-the-lines threat. Woodward was advancing an argument with factual inaccuracies and Sperling told him “as a friend” that he will “regret” the embarrassment that comes with getting a big story wrong.

That Woodward feels the need to run to Fox News, of all places, to argue once again that a White House staffer sent him a “coded” threat is just sad, and unbecoming of a journalistic giant.

Lynna, OM:

March 1st, 2013 at 11:34 am

Mansplaining coupled with evasion and an irony deficit:

Politicians who try to be funny often struggle. Politicians who try to be funny about state-mandated, medically-unnecessary, trans-vaginal ultrasounds invariably fail.

Just ask Sean Duffy, a Republican congressman from Wisconsin, who made some curious comments on the subject last week.

Rep. Sean Duffy (R-WI) declined to take a position last week during a town hall meeting on whether transvaginal ultrasounds should be mandatory for women seeking abortions, saying he has never heard of the practice and couldn’t weigh in on it because “I haven’t had one.” [...]

Yeah, that’s funny. You are a man and you’ve never had a transvaginal ultrasound. [cough, spit]
This fine lawmaker went on to explain that he didn’t know what a transvaginal ultrasound was. Oh glorious ignorance.

Linky.

Lynna, OM:

March 1st, 2013 at 11:43 am

Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts is supremely wrong, WRONG. In arguing against the Voting Rights Act, he presented “facts” that have since been easily proven to be, well, not factual.

Up-thread @517 dongiovanni asked why people like Rush Limbaugh, that is conservatives, think like they do. Well here’s prove that even the Supreme Court Chief Justice can fail at thinking on the same level as Lush Dimbulb.

“Do you know which state has the worst ratio of white voter turnout to African-American voter turnout?” Roberts asked Solicitor General Don Verrilli. When Verrilli said he did not know, Roberts answered the question for him: “Massachusetts.” Moments later, the chief justice did it again, asking, “Which state has the greatest disparity in registration between white and
African American?” Again the solicitor general did not know, and again Roberts said, “Massachusetts.”

James Carter took a closer look at the latest information on voting and registration from the U.S. Census Bureau and found that Roberts appeared to be completely wrong. What’s more, the Boston Globe talked to Massachusetts Secretary of State William Galvin, who’s eager to explain just how mistaken the conservative justice is. “I’m calling him out,” Galvin said…..

More details about the wrongness of the Wronghere.

howard:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:06 pm

@827: of course, you’d think that the logical thing to do if the VRA doesn’t cover states with deeper divisions (assuming his asspulled data was correct) is expand the act. But you know he just wants to do away with it entirely.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:08 pm

I would like to smash something, please. Could somebody pass me the sledgehammer? I seem to have misplaced it in one of the corners of the Lounge.
The phrases I give up and I hate myself and Fuck this shit and I want out have been running through my brain since early afternoon. Does anyone have any suggestions to tempt them down to at least a walking pace, and soon?x
Many thanks.
The oven is calling (dinner, nothing more).

opposablethumbs:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:13 pm

Noooo rq, I’m sorry and angry for you at whatever/whoever has been messing up your RL. I have to run right now, but can I send you lemon and ginger tea before I go? And a hug, I have one here all ready to go?

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:15 pm

Hugs and sledgehammers for rq. I’m sorry you’re having a rough time of it, hope dinner helps settle down your brain a little bit.

Parrowing, Time For A Saucy Change:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:19 pm

passes sledgehammer to rq

I’m sorry you’re having such a bad time. I don’t think I have any suggestions, just a reminder that we’re always here to listen to you. Here is a garlic parfait for you but if that’s not to your liking currently, it will magically turn into something else.

cicely (No further comment.):

March 1st, 2013 at 12:22 pm

hugs for rq. And sledgehammers are all well and good for Life’s Little Viscitudes, but may I recommend the napalm!, instead?
-

cicely (No further comment.):

March 1st, 2013 at 12:24 pm

Or, even, as well?
-

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 12:38 pm

cicely, not that bad (yet). Perhaps later in the evening.
And a garlic parfait would be parfait, Parrowing (why is it called a parfait?). Although a garlic cheesecake (I dare you!) would go down well, too.
All I want is a little, tiny, little break. I’m tired of hearing myself yelling for no reason at all. It speaks of a lack of self-control that I simply do not possess at the moment, and yet there is no other out. Or at least, not one I can think of. Help?

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:08 pm

I do not know what is wrong with some people. I mean seriously, WHO…WHO would create a pea-popsicle or garlic parfait?

On a whim, I decided to do some Wiki-Fu (cicely, thou should avert thine eyes) on the dreaded PEA. I found some trivia (which will give me a leg up so I may win against Portia in Trivial Pursuit after I easily best her at Pictionary):

” There are many varieties (cultivars) of garden peas. Some of the most common varieties are listed here. PMR indicates some degree of powdery mildew resistance; afila types have clusters of tendrils instead of leaves.

Alaska, 55 days (smooth seeded)
Thomas Laxton/Laxton’s Progress/Progress #9, 60-65 days
Mr. Big, 60 days, 2000 AAS winner
Little Marvel, 63 days, 1934 AAS winner
Early Perfection, 65 days (This variety is the foundation of many improved varieties and crosses, including Dark-Seeded Early Perfection and Bolero, the latter being one of the most successful commercial varieties.) [8]

Kelvedon Wonder, 65 days, 1997 RHS AGM winner
Sabre, 65 days, PMR
Homesteader/Lincoln, 67 days (heirloom, known as Greenfeast in AU, NZ)
Serge, 68 days, PMR, afila
Wando, 68 days
Green Arrow, 70 days
Tall Telephone/Alderman, 75 days (heirloom, tall climber)
Other variations of P. sativum include:

Pisum sativum var. macrocarpon is commonly known as the snow pea. Pisum sativum var. macrocarpon ser. cv. is known as the sugar or snap pea. Both of these are eaten whole before the pod reaches maturity and are hence also known as mange-tout, French for “eat all”. The snow pea pod is eaten flat, while in sugar/snap peas, the pod becomes cylindrical, but is eaten while still crisp, before the seeds inside develop.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pea#section_9”

I hasten to add, I do not mind snow peas in a salad. Uncooked of course. I also love edamame. It’s the solo, squishy, starchy de-podded peas that are an abomination.

Beatrice:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:10 pm

hugs for you, rq

Tony the (Undefeatable) Queer Shoop:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:12 pm

rq:
I’m sorry things are frustrating. Why dont you and the ‘me from last week Monday’ and we shall sledgehammer away at an abandoned building?

dontpanic:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:40 pm

Although a garlic cheesecake (I dare you!) would go down well, too.

I’m trying to remember if that was one of the offerings at the Gilroy Garlic Festival when we attended a decade ago. There were so many different things available it wouldn’t surprise me at all.

Parrowing, Time For A Saucy Change:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:56 pm

rq:

garlic cheesecake (I dare you!)

Dare accepted. I’ll even taste it. Some of us live on the edge.

Portia, Plentiful Pleasant Pea Purveyor:

March 1st, 2013 at 1:59 pm

rq
So so so many hugs. And sledgehammers. And martinis.
Sorry you’re having a rough time.

theophontes
Operation Octocopter Advantage has been a success. I shall have ALL THE VICTORIES.

Tony
You just admitted an affection for peas.
CICELY!!!!! You have a defector!

I’ve had red bean ice cream at a sushi place, it’s rather good.

=======

I think I have enough hair chopped off to donate.
I can’t get used to how light my head feels.

Giliell, professional cynic:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:03 pm

Good evening

Just booked a week of easter holidays in the southwest of France
happydance

Hugs and some old furniture to smash for rq

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:22 pm

°Tony
Let’s do it. laces up steel-toed hiking boots I’ve got my sledgehammer, what’ll you bring?

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:24 pm

Yay for Giliell!!

I can’t keep track of which bits of what are on which sides of our Deep Rifts, so I’m going to be Team Joe and perch myself on one of those tall lifeguard chairs with a glass of iced tea and a floppy hat.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:25 pm

Giliell
jealous of your holiday.

Parrowing
When I come to Stockholm in August, you can make me two cheesecakes – one with garlic, and one without. I’ll even eat them both. ;)

Portia
Red bean desserts are generally good. I think because the beans themselves are sweet. My favourite after-sushi dessert so far, though, is green tea ice cream. Seems pretty tame, compared to some of the stuff floating around here.

Portia, Plentiful Pleasant Pea Purveyor:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:27 pm

Ooooh yes, green tea ice cream is a lovely light flavor.

mmm Now I want ice cream.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:31 pm

I want ice cream, too. Garlic-cheesecake-and-green-tea flavoured.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:37 pm

I’m switching my iced tea to iced GREEN tea. Yum!

Beatrice:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:37 pm

I want raspberry icecream. Like the one I ate in that gelateria in Florence.

I also want to eat it in that gelateria in Florence.

Beatrice:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:39 pm

But I would settle just for raspberry icecream without Florence.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:40 pm

Mmmm, raspberries! The best berries in the world.

Parrowing, Time For A Saucy Change:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:47 pm

I lurrve green tea ice cream! But most places make it too sweet to be perfect, in my opinion. I like it like I like my pea-colored horses, green and bitter.

*

Congrats on getting the haircut, Portia, and yay for being able to donate! My next haircut (less than two weeks from now!) will be straightening out last year’s asymmetrical bob. It will be waaaaay too short to donate.

*

Oh, it’s happening, rq. By the way, I’m trying (sort of) to look into logistics for Stockholm. Without having a price for the conference I can’t make too many decisions, but if you want to get in touch with me about it at all, let me know and I’ll leave my email address here.

Beatrice:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:49 pm

Technically, that raspberry icecream was actually sorbetto. That just means I can eat it more than the regular kind so that’s even better.

Portia, Plentiful Pleasant Pea Purveyor:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:51 pm

Raspberries are the best berried. I love them.

Parrowing:
Thanks! I’m pretty excited to have a whole new look. My motivation was mainly to look a little older and maybe get taken a little more seriously. We’ll see.
Good luck with your haircut :)

birgerjohansson:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:53 pm

More confirmation of “background” climate science. (The denialists are out in force in the comments section) “In prehistory, CO2 and warming went in lock-step” http://phys.org/news/2013-02-prehistory-co2-lock-step.html
— — — — — — — — — —
If I get a weapons-grade stomach bug, you can put me in a trebuchet and launch me into the Capitol building. Going out in a blaze of glory…or at least in a display of “guts” (splat). I think South Park made an episode of it.
— — — — — —
I got a set of glasses for my 85-year old mom that had different parts of the lenses adapted for different-distance vision. Sadly, my mom found it too complicated to learn to use them so today I ordered two different pairs, one for reading and one for watching TV. Fortunately the optical examination for the previous glasses is also good for the new ones, so the cost for the pair ended up less than half what the failed ones cost. Also, without a new examination they can get her the glasses in just a week.
— — — — — — —
Paid bills, worked first day since I got sick. Feels good.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:57 pm

Portia
Hair or no hair, they damn well should take you more seriously. Grr. Here, have some raspberries!

Parrowing
I’ll probably ask for your email as the dates get closer, and yes, prices become available. I’m still waiting for a reply from Minnie the Finn, I haven’t got one yet, and looking for accomodations on my own will be a bit more challenging. Oh, and have you seen my pea-green horse? :)

Beatrice
Whatever it was, it had raspberries in it. That’s good enough for me (also, Florence, where I’ve never been, which makes it sound that little bit more awesome).

+++

I’m going to be here a while tonight. Translating. Education crap. Ech.

birgerjohansson:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:59 pm

Stockholm in August? Potential for “ryssvärme” (Russian heat). Many days of 30+ (which you probably consider chilly).
.
Returning to disease and Canada -have you tried to give Harper a Central African bat as a pet? The critters have amazing innate immunity. Ebola gives them no problems.

Ogvorbis: We Are LEGUMES!:

March 1st, 2013 at 2:59 pm

Threadrupt

Making home-made pizza. Home-made crust with oregano, crushed chili, and herb-infused olive oil. It wil be topped with sweated onions, yellow sweet pepper, sliced fresh Roma tomatoes, pepperoni, hard Italians salami, and some cheap mozzarella cheese. And there was enough dough left over that I have a foccacia rising right now.

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:05 pm

birgerjohansson
Someone linked to a link about exotic pets and all… I think Harper has been warned. :o
(Glad to hear you’re feeling better!)
Why is it called Russian heat?

Lynna, OM:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:05 pm

Mormon Moments of Madness, and, surprisingly, mormon mommy moments of reason: mormons have been doing so much fighting over breastfeeding infants lately, (the when, the where, the how, the “porn”), that the issue made the Salt Lake Tribune … twice.
First link.

… Any change would come too late for Marie Le, who stopped attending LDS services after being scolded in 2006 for breast-feeding her baby.

Though Le says “nothing was showing,” the Idaho mother got a visit from her Relief Society president, who said that some women had complained about her nursing, that she was harming their husbands who had “porn problems” and that they didn’t want their teenage sons “exposed to anything.”

Le went to her Mormon bishop, who she says sided with the critics. The experience was “emotionally devastating,” Le recalls. “I felt that church was like a big family and now my safe religious haven had betrayed me.”

She started having panic attacks at the thought of a whispering campaign about her. Le no longer considers herself a Mormon….

That first article also makes the point that many mormon women have so many children that they can’t leave the meeting room to nurse a baby elsewhere without also leaving their toddlers and other children unsupervised.

Second link.

If you find the sight of nursing mothers distractingly scandalous in church, then perhaps it’s time to get over it. There’s every reason to believe God doesn’t care. And if he doesn’t, maybe we shouldn’t either.

More important, if you find the sight of a nursing mother sexually problematic, there’s probably a lot more wrong with you than church could ever fix.

And there’s this: http://latterdaylactivism.com

Lynna, OM:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:10 pm

Oh, dear, I left out the porn quote from my post @860. We can’t have that.

As a new mother in Provo about three years ago, Heather Moore-Farley got a call from her Relief Society president, asking her to use a blanket or go to the mothers’ lounge in the women’s bathroom to breast-feed to protect others’ sensitivities. Then her bishop suggested Moore-Farley and her husband pray about it. They did and got the same answer: She was doing nothing wrong.

Sometime later, another ward member confronted the couple as they were walking home from church and accused her of “contributing to the pornography problem” and “not keeping [her] covenants.”

Portia, Plentiful Pleasant Pea Purveyor:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:41 pm

Thanks, rq! They damn well should! Sad realities we live under. : /

Om nom nom raspberries!!

Ogvorbis: We Are LEGUMES!:

March 1st, 2013 at 3:49 pm

Hugs to rq and all who are in need of supportive hugs.

Dreams have not been too bad. Nothing really scary — just normal 9/11 scary. Which is a relief.

Nepenthe:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:16 pm

@Lynna

This fine lawmaker went on to explain that he didn’t know what a transvaginal ultrasound was. Oh glorious ignorance.

To be fair, there are lots of things that Sean Duffy doesn’t know about. He was elected because–excuse me while I get out a handkerchief–he was a reality television star. Yes. The good people of the Northwoods decided to elect a guy from The Real World. commences weeping

rq:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:17 pm

hugs back, Ogvorbis.

Parrowing, Time For A Saucy Change:

March 1st, 2013 at 4:48 pm

Ooh, nice horse, rq! (For those who are concerned, I didn’t just write that.)

Off to bed. Good night, everyone.

birgerjohansson:

March 1st, 2013 at 5:06 pm

rq,
Russian heat: Often, in summer, a stable high-pressure area moves from the Russian-Ukrainian region into Scandinavia and stays there for weeks.
But I should not complain, it is much worse for the Russians; most cannot afford AC, indeed many in rural areas still lack basic amenities. At work we had two consecutive co-workers originally from the Volgograd area, they told us how it is for their relatives in summer. A couple of years ago, the heat lasted well into fall and set off forest fires that made the sky above Moscov full of ashes.
.
I am told the Russian thunderstorms need no lessons from the ones in Amercan tornado territory. A Russian filmmaker who filmed King Lear made good cinematic use of the thunderstorms.
— — — — — — — — — —
The practices by the LDS and other churches have been flying under the radar until the internet era makes the stupidity visible to the world. It will get harder for them to get young converts, and their young people will increasingly compare the world beyond with the stunted existence the religious community offers, and find the latter wanting.
It’s not rock music that is diabolic, it is the internet.

Ogvorbis: We Are LEGUME!:

March 1st, 2013 at 5:14 pm

And I forgot to put salt in the dough for the pizza and foccacia. Damn. I could fuck up a one-horse parade.

WMDKitty -- feeling so very small:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:12 pm

Progress has been made!

I stopped in at DVSAS today.

I talked to someone about The Jackass.

And I stopped in an alleyway (on the way there) to vomit, because I was just. that. anxious.

My Wednesday evenings will be spent attending a support group for survivors.

I feel really, really good about finally taking this step.

Ogvorbis: We Are LEGUME!:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:22 pm

Safe hugs to WMDKitty.

Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:23 pm

WMDKitty

Yay for progress! terrorist fist jab

carlie:

March 1st, 2013 at 6:43 pm

This was on slactivist recently. Stop apologizing for what you like to read.

I really like it.

You should not apologize for what you like to read. The person you are apologizing to can only fit into one of three categories:

1. He or she shares your joy.
2. He or she doesn’t give a good goddamn.
3. He or she thinks less of you for what you read in which case don’t apologize to that person because he or she is clearly a douchebag who doesn’t deserve your obeisance.

PZ Myers:

March 1st, 2013 at 7:40 pm

NEW THREAD.