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Jan 14 2013

[Thunderdome]

uglyfish

This is Thunderdome, the unmoderated open thread on Pharyngula. Say what you want, how you want.

Status: UNMODERATED; Previous thread

777 comments

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  1. 501
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    If only PZ moderated threads so that douglas could have private conversations with one person.

    PZ, PZ, PZ. Shame on you.

    Oh wait. I thought douglas considered banning censorship. Since I don’t see how PZ could stop us from responding except by threatening banning us, douglas is now (by his own flawless logic) asking for censorship. Oh noes! He contradicted himself. What a surprise.

  2. 502
    athyco

    It’s not is not all about sniping back and forth about irrelevant crap. Your defensiveness is still there, leading you into broad, unsupportable statements.

    What did YOU provide that was relevant to the “Trumped!” thread? That was the primary idea underlying all the “sniping.”

  3. 503
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    You needn’t tell me this is an open thread, I’m fully aware. What made you think that I wasn’t?

  4. 504
    athyco

    My last comment didn’t go through. Crap.

  5. 505
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Frankly I’m already wishing PZ moderated more.

    After your performance over on the “Trumped!” thread, you wish for more moderation? Moderation against what? Derailments?

  6. 506
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Doug, Forward your idea. Define the problem. Define your terms. Show the problem really exists. Propose a solution. Then an intelligent discussion can be had. Until then, it can’t happen.

  7. 507
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    athyco,

    I would tell you to just click on the Next button above the reply window, but you won’t see the comment until you click the Next button :)

  8. 508
    athyco

    Oh, it did. We’re now on the second page of Thunderdome.

  9. 509
    athyco

    LOL, Beatrice. I’ve seen it happen to others before, but it still catches you by surprise when it happens to you.

  10. 510
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd

    I’m just trying to give Athyco my full attention because he seemed like he had a lot to discuss and it’s the polite thing to do.

    If you want to keep trying to bait me go right ahead but if Athyco wants to discuss at length then I’m going to ignore you.

    I’ll be happy to converse with you if you want that so badly… looks like Athyco wasn’t really interested anyway.

    So go ahead I guess…

  11. 511
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    douglas:

    What the hell is your goal, here? You drop into a thread about threats and make the claim that bullying back is the way to handle bullies. Multiple people disagreed (and you even disagreed (for part of one post) with one of the disagreements) and now you claim that we are baiting you? What the hell?

  12. 512
    athyco

    Your “polite” falls far short, douglas1102.

    What did YOU provide on topic for the Trumped! thread?

  13. 513
  14. 514
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    Your “polite” falls far short, douglas1102.

    What did YOU provide on topic for the Trumped! thread?

    Did I miss some of your comments? I’ve no idea what you mean.

  15. 515
    douglas1102

    Ahhh… forgot the e-mail notice thing.

  16. 516
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    I’m just trying to give Athyco my full attention because he seemed like he had a lot to discuss and it’s the polite thing to do.

    You have a funny idea of what is and isn’t polite.

    I’ll be happy to converse with you if you want that so badly…

    This isn’t a conversation. That is your misconception of what is happening. You are talking to everybody looking at the thread when you post. Everybody can respond. Respond to what will forward your argument. What several of us are trying to do is to get you to properly define your argument.

    What is your goal? What is your problem? What do you perceive is a problem? What is your solution? Notice it is all YOU defining things. No give/take involved. YOU.

  17. 517
    athyco

    PZ put up a content thread about Ophelia Benson. It was the thread we just left. You STILL have not typed her name. What did you provide ON TOPIC for that thread?

    I described a number of ways that you initially set off alarms, yet Ogvorbis answered you. If you had read his answer carefully, you would have found that–possible rough edges aside–you had already been doing on Matt’s video and Aron’s blog what we do here. You could have entered our conversation ABOUT OPHELIA.

  18. 518
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    imkindaok:
    The pervasive influence of religion provides tremendous support for many social justice issues. Homophobia, sexism, classcism, and more continue to hold sway in large part due to religion. That is why fighting against the pernicious effects of religion really does cover fighting for social justice.

    ****
    Your comments about religion and atheism read to me as someone who prefers an accomodationist approach. There are atheists who agree with you. I am not one of them. I rhink religion is detrimental to human progress on a social, political and economic level. There are many good people within the various religions and certainly when combatting certain societal ills, they will likely be allies. However, they also support the institutions that continue to hinder progress. There is only so much work one can do with a Catholic to stop the spread of AIDS in Africa because one of the root problems of that epidemic is the teachings of the Church. One could work with Mormons on an anti bullying campaign, but at some point the issue of Mormon opposition to homosexuality is likely to rear its head.
    Catch my drift?

  19. 519
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    I’m not buying that at all, I posted about these threats on-line and what to do about it…. then I got stupid endless comments accusing me of claiming that Pz censors even after I clarified, and even after I offered empirical freaking evidence that was not my view.

    And it’s STILL happening right on this thread.

    Obviously you’re not trying to be sincere with me. Clearly it was not me bringing it off topic, you know that.

  20. 520
    athyco

    Nerd of Redhead @516:

    Everybody can respond. Respond to what will forward your argument. What several of us are trying to do is to get you to properly define your argument.

    That’s why I reiterated that this would be open, douglas1102. A reminder, not a snark.

  21. 521
    athyco

    So? People comment without refreshing and you get 14 people saying the same thing. It happens. Respond to what will forward your argument.

  22. 522
    douglas1102

    And to elaborate more on 519 I also clearly said I wasn’t interested in talking about censorship but still the conversation had to be about that.

    The derailment a accusation is nonsense

  23. 523
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 521

    I’ve no idea what you’re reffing to.

  24. 524
    douglas1102

    Obviously we need to establish that I’ve made no censorship arguments whatsoever because I’m tired of seeing it get brought up.

    Not only do I reject the “derailment” accusation I’m demanding it should be directed at the ones who actually insisted on constantly bringing it up.

  25. 525
    athyco

    Douglas, if you don’t plan to acknowledge that I’ve already said that you misused “censor” and meant “moderate” or “banhammer” or “banish to Thunderdome,” you’re arguing defensively, not dealing honestly.

    Why the hell are you still harping on the “censorship” issue? If you’d not said you wished PZ moderated more, it wouldn’t be in this thread at all.

  26. 526
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    And to elaborate more on 519 I also clearly said I wasn’t interested in talking about censorship but still the conversation had to be about that.

    This is too cryptic to be interpreted. Elaborate.

    Actually, it would be good for you to start over, from scratch. Everybody is confused, including you.

  27. 527
    athyco

    I’m demanding it should be directed at the ones who actually insisted on constantly bringing it up.

    Sure, Cupcake. Demand away.

  28. 528
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 525

    Yes, I realize you clarified my position and that’s why I’m bothering to respond to you. But people still don’t seem to get it and you’re still claiming that I was “off-topic”. If by “off-topic” you mean responding to the off-topic comments directed at me then I’m guilty as charged but I expect to see someone admit it besides you.

    I should be demanding an apology, people are still accusing me of crying “censorship” right here and it’s verifiable nonsense. It’s downright nervy considering how much time I’ve spent arguing that PZ does not “censor” I bet even way more than all of you have.

  29. 529
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    But people still don’t seem to get it and you’re still claiming that I was “off-topic”.

    You were off topic. Show you were on topic…

    I should be demanding an apology, people are still accusing me of crying “censorship” right here and it’s verifiable nonsense.

    Where is this paranoia coming from? You talked censorship previously. We take true censorship seriously, but not the “freeze peach” definition of censorship, which means they must be listened to.

    This is why you should start over from the beginning.

  30. 530
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    douglas1102:

    You arrived in a thread about a woman blogger being threatened with an acid attack and observed that bullying back was the best solution. I disagreed with you. You agreed with my disagreement and then disagreed again. So am I the one who derailed that thread? I responded to a comment I wanted to respond to and now you argue that I should apologize to you and possibly be banned because I responded to you? I asked it before and I’ll ask it again: what the hell?

  31. 531
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    Being falsely accused is a perfectly reasonable time to demand so lose the “cupcake” BS

  32. 532
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd

    “You talked censorship previously”

    Not about PZ and not endlessly. It was a small part of my comment that seemed perfectly OP to me.

    This is what I mean… if Athyco gets it then why the hell can’t you?

  33. 533
    athyco

    I bet even way more than all of you have.

    You better than us, douglas1102?

  34. 534
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    douglas1102:

    You are the one who brought up censoring:

    Of course they can be salvaged, why not? It sure sounds like you’re saying “ignore them” banning is a great way to ignore someone.

    Hate speech is best countered with better speech, when better speech fails censoring begins.

    How is pointing out that you brought censorship into the thread a false accusation?

  35. 535
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    It was a small part of my comment that seemed perfectly OP to me.

    How? NON SEQUITOR TO MOST OF US.

    This is why you need to start over. Too many misconceptions on both sides. And you must remember we look at all your posts, not just your last one.

  36. 536
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I’m just a soul whose intentions are good, oh Lord, please don’t let me be misunderstood.

  37. 537
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 533

    “You better than us Douglas?” huh? Are you better than me Athyco???

    I said I bet I spent more time than all of you arguing that PZ does not censor and that it’s nervy to accuse me of such. If you interpret that as claiming to be “better than you” then that’s you problem.

    @ Nerd

    “Too many misconceptions on both sides”

    Wow did you actually show some humility to me? Thanks, even though it was hidden in snark I’ll take it anyway =)

  38. 538
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    I said I bet I spent more time than all of you arguing that PZ does not censor

    This is a misconcept, and shows your ignorance. PZ can’t censor. He isn’t the government, or a representative of it on this blog. Since this is private property, so to speak, he can throw out those who are obnoxious. Which he does. But that isn’t censorship. They are free to keep speaking/posting their bullshit elsewhere. Since you are confused about this, I suspect you are confused about other issues.

  39. 539
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis 534

    I’m going to give you the benifit of a doubt and assume you didn’t see the comment where I said, “I brought up censorship but it was a small part of a comment that was OP” and you’ve posted that comment.

    I said, “I never claimed PZ censors and I can prove I’ve never felt that was the case” and yet the conversation still keeps going back to that, that is derailing and if me responding to that derailment is also derailment so be it but I want acknowledgment I didn’t start that derail and I specifically said I wasn’t interested in talking about it.

    This is why I’m demanding apology otherwise this same crap is going to constantly be brought up, this is friggin’ ridiculous.

    STILL… that stupid accusation is getting hung on me. How many freakin’ times more???? This is why you need more moderation.

  40. 540
    athyco

    douglas1102, on a few occasions when I’ve made comments on these intertubes, I’ve used the exact words in another’s comment as evidence against their assertion. It may or may not have been the first thing I typed, but when it became obvious that they couldn’t support their contention or had provided falsehoods, then I “refused to be cowed, refused to be silent” as Ogvorbis said to you long ago.

    To them, it felt like bullying; it felt as though I had insulted their intelligence, but that would be provably false by John Morales’ definition. There was no power imbalance; it wasn’t repeated for the express purpose of causing them harm, it didn’t use prejudicial slurs that would splash damage innocent others.

    You’ve been provided all of this in response to your question on how to fight this crap online–without bullying.

    When do you think you will be able to focus on it?

  41. 541
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    This is why I’m demanding apology otherwise this same crap is going to constantly be brought up, this is friggin’ ridiculous.

    Then I demand your apology for being a fuckwitted idjit who can’t forward their point. Grow up.

  42. 542
    douglas1102

    Nerd says…

    “This is a misconcept, and shows your ignorance. PZ can’t censor. He isn’t the government, or a representative of it on this blog. Since this is private property, so to speak, he can throw out those who are obnoxious. Which he does. But that isn’t censorship. They are free to keep speaking/posting their bullshit elsewhere. Since you are confused about this, I suspect you are confused about other issues.”

    HOLY FUCKING SHIT are you kidding???? Again??? Already???

    I’m speechless… there’s clearly no point in going on without moderation.

  43. 543
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Doug, basics. Start over from the beginning. You are so lost you don’t know where you are.

  44. 544
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    there’s clearly no point in going on without moderation.

    Sorry, there is no moderation on this thread. And if there was, your ass would be deleted due to your inability to get on with your argument. START OVER.

  45. 545
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 541

    Grow up… and when you can prove that I put words in your mouth I’ll be happy to apologize, and that’s clearly a courtesy that would not go the other way.

  46. 546
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    and when you can prove that I put words in your mouth

    What words in your mouth? You prove yourself right. That is what a mature person would do. So, show us your evidence.

  47. 547
    douglas1102

    @ NERD

    What’s the point? So you can bring up the idiotic “I said PZ censors” Bullshit?

    It is not possible to continue until it is conceded that I made no such claim. That it won’t be brought up again, and that bringing up that crap is what derailed the thread in the first place.

  48. 548
    athyco

    For crying out loud, douglas1102. Take all of Nerd’s comment in #538 until the word “elsewhere.”

    Say, “I agree with that. I mean that, too.”

    Then it will be OVER.

  49. 549
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Does anyone here know what the conversation is about? I have no freaking idea.

    Douglas, your writing has been extremely unclear in the previous thread. It doesn’t help that something you haven’t been clear about, you have later explained in an unclear way and then repudiated in an unclear way. The result is that we’ve got no idea what position you actually hold. Or at least I don’t. If others do, they have much more talent in understanding gibberish.

  50. 550
    douglas1102

    @ NERD 546

    See? Pointless… now I have to repeat it, What?? the billionth time now???

    Again, you clearly need a moderator, Athyco could have worked but he doesn’t seem interested in pointing out to you what he already conceded to.

    So we’ll just sit here for how many hours making the idiotic assertion that I claimed PZ censors and blame it on me for it derailing the thread?

    Pointless…

  51. 551
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    It is not possible to continue until it is conceded that I made no such claim. That it won’t be brought up again, and that bringing up that crap is what derailed the thread in the first place.

    What claim? You used censorship wrong. Learn, acknowledge the mistake, and move on. Why can’t you move on?

    This is why you need to start over. You are lost in your own confusion, and you are frustrated. Back to basics with clear language, and no terse comments.

  52. 552
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 548

    No it won’t, it won’t be over until it’s conceded that I never made such an argument otherwise it will be made over and over again

    This is truly astounding, YOU explain it to her.

    This can not progress until that point is conceded

    If you really cared then you would point it out to them because they’re just going to ignore the freakin’ evidence every single time

    YOU Athyco YOU explain it to them.

  53. 553
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Again, you clearly need a moderator,

    No, you need moderation, and somebody teaching you how to forward an argument.

    When will you forward your argument? I, and many others, still see nothing….

  54. 554
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    No it won’t, it won’t be over until it’s conceded that I never made such an argument otherwise it will be made over and over again

    Then you should go away. You don’t make demands from us like a spoiled brat.

    Forward your argument or shut the fuck up. You keep it frozen, not us.

  55. 555
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    douglas,

    Don’t shift responsibility for making your own words understandable onto poor athyco.

  56. 556
    douglas1102

    @ Beatrice

    Athyco is the only one that got it, if he gave a damn about moving forward then he would point it out to everyone that doesn’t.

    This is fucking stupid… how long now arguing this stupid bullshit?

  57. 557
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Um, if you cared about being understood, you would clarify what the hell you are talking about.

  58. 558
    athyco

    Maybe I was reading more into douglas1102 than was merited, Beatrice.

    I read someone who is committed to fighting the Thunderthugs and the pitters. That’s a good thing. I believed that he saw John Morales as a version of those groups and the rest of us “inexplicably” falling in with him as the thread went on. We didn’t understand what the hell he wanted after he seemingly agreed/disagreed with Ogvorbis in the same comment. He didn’t understand why the hell Pharyngula commenters would be piling on him.

    Impulsively, I didn’t want him to go away mad. Go away if he wanted, yes, but not necessarily mad.

    It’s so ridiculous now. douglas1102 uses “censor” for whatever reason; he doesn’t mean it in the YouTube way, but he won’t simply partially copy/paste Nerd’s comment and say “I agree.” And he won’t stop saying “moderate” so that it sounds like nanny coming in the laying down the law to the unruly kids.

  59. 559
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    if he gave a damn about moving forward

    Why should Athyco be the one moving the discussion forward, and not you? Who the fuck are you for that childish bit of egotism? Aren’t you a responsible adult?

  60. 560
    athyco

    Damn computer. I’ve not commented and refreshed so quickly before, and it doesn’t want to cooperate.

    douglas1102, I’ll say it again.

    ♦ Douglas misused “censor” when he meant “moderate” or “banhammer” or “banish to Thunderdome.”

    But douglass1102, while “moderate” is acceptable here, I think you do have some confusion about it. Banhammer and banish are the usual. Occasionally disemvowel. In a Chris Clarke thread, your post gets replaced with a bunny video. Sometimes PZ will drop in with a warning. None of that is merited here.

  61. 561
    athyco

    Sheeeeeesh. Last paragraph not blockquoted, please. Thank you.

  62. 562
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Douglas:

    his is Thunderdome, the unmoderated open thread on Pharyngula. Say what you want, how you want.

    Status: UNMODERATED; Previous thread

    This means PZ applies minimal supervision to this thread. You really have to say do something totally off the charts with bigotry, misogyny, homophobia to get the banhammer here. Nobody talking to you is even close to that. Nor are you.

  63. 563
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Try this one more time:

    douglas1102:

    I suspect this prolly won’t win me any friends here but my experience dealing with “real racists” is that bullying them right back actually works to the point of often changing their view. I even got a couple of Thunderthugs to actually post that he was wrong on harassment policies.

    These guys are group-think cowards and they respond (seemingly only) to intimidation, why do you think you never really hear this crap other than anonymously?

    Me:

    I disagree with the idea of becoming a bully back.

    However, reacting assertively, even aggressively, to racist, misogynist, bigoted, and other prejudicial language is an effective tactic. To the bully-er, it may appear to be bullying — for victims to refuse to be cowed, to refuse to be silenced, can, on occasion, change a mind. I’m not going to go to their (whoever they happen to be) and abuse them, but when they come here,they are fair game.

    I wish it happened more often, though.

    douglas1102:

    @ Ogvorbis

    Hey… said it prolly wouldn’t win me any friends =)

    Now that I read your post I realize I prolly mean “assertively, even aggressively”

    All the times I’ve wasted hours arguing about these things nothing ever works until I finally get fed up and start acting a lot more “”assertively, even aggressively”.

    But where is the line drawn? I’d would genuinely like to know when the line is drawn it comes to responding to this sort of thing. Where does “assertively, even aggressively” end and bullying begin?

    Insulting their intelligence seems to work quite well, but personally… that’s where the line is drawn for me despite the effectiveness.

    This is all before any mention of censorship. You wrote something. I disagreed. You agreed with my disagreement and then disagreed with my disagreement in the same comment.

    What is it you really want to say here? What is you actual goal?

  64. 564
    douglas1102

    Thanks Athyco, now are you going to point out the next time someone accuses me of making that stupid argument or all this bullshit going to happen again?

    Let’s be clear, at no point did I claim that “PZ censors” I’ve made the argument that PZ does not censor on vids like Dillahunty’s for months now and my comments PROVE that I have not only never made that argument but in fact wholeheartedly support that argument.

    Anyone has a problem with this speak up now because I’m so sick of this now I’m am NOT letting it go no matter what happens.

    When everyone can accept this VERIFIABLE fact,THEN we can move on.

  65. 565
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis 563

    Oh no… not until that VERIFIABLE FACT in 564 is conceded and I don’t want to hear it even one more time.

    THEN we can move on to your points and I will address them.

  66. 566
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    When everyone can accept this VERIFIABLE fact,THEN we can move on.

    No evidence other than your word, ergo it isn’t proved. Therefore, you either move on or shut the fuck up.

  67. 567
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Oh no… not until that VERIFIABLE FACT in 564 is conceded and I don’t want to hear it even one more time.

    THEN we can move on to your points and I will address them.

    Why do you get to decide the rules about what I can and cannot discuss in my comment?

  68. 568
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Notice douglas, we don’t let bullies bully us….

  69. 569
    billygutter01

    @ douglas

    Move on to what, exactly? Nobody can figure out what the fuck you’re on about. Is everybody stupid or are you being unclear?

  70. 570
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 562

    Just drop the patronizing attitude a moderator is needed because this is never going to be conceded and it probably the most unbelievable thing I’ve ever seen in any debate.

    I can’t even Believe this is FTB

    If Tf00t did this I’d have posted this thread all over the net.

    Concede the verifiable fact and we’ll move on and don’t anyone dare ask me to explain again.

  71. 571
    billygutter01

    Could you please explain, douglas1102?

    Yes, I dared!

  72. 572
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Douglas why do you think PZ censors people?

  73. 573
    douglas1102

    See what’s going on Athyco???

    I guess they didn’t hear you and they’re not listening to me at all are they? Either YOU sort it out or this is DONE until there’s a moderator willing to do so.

  74. 574
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Concede the verifiable fact and we’ll move on and don’t anyone dare ask me to explain again.

    Again, why do you think you get veto power over what other people write? Why are you telling me what I can, and cannot, discuss on an open thread?

  75. 575
    billygutter01

    douglas1102 is going to take his ball and go home.

  76. 576
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    It just doesn’t make any sense.

  77. 577
    douglas1102

    @ Rev. 572

    FUCKING UNBELIEVABLE!!!! ANOTHER ONE!!!

    READ 564!!!

    !@#$!@! !@#$ !@!@$@

  78. 578
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I guess they didn’t hear you and they’re not listening to me at all are they? Either YOU sort it out or this is DONE until there’s a moderator willing to do so.

    Why are you telling other commenters what they can, and cannot do? And why are you telling Athyco that Athyco must sort out this confusion?

  79. 579
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    But why Douglas?

  80. 580
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    douglas1102:

    Did you, or did you not, write this:

    Hate speech is best countered with better speech, when better speech fails censoring begins.

    However… I defiantly agree with it here, if I were PZ I’d be doing it the same way.

  81. 581
    athyco

    Let’s be clear, at no point did I claim that “PZ censors” I’ve made the argument that PZ does not censor on vids like Dillahunty’s for months now and my comments PROVE that I have not only never made that argument but in fact wholeheartedly support that argument.

    Choose (A) or (B):

    (A) Know what? You can stuff that statement up your ass next to you head. You MISSPOKE, you blithering blowhard, and I’ve said so every time I “explained” it to everyone else. All you had to do is say, “OK, let’s go on from here.”

    (B) Let it be clear, everyone. douglas1102 has, since the moment the argument was first conceived, wholeheartedly supported the “PZ does not censor” argument, his misuse of the word aside.

    Whichever one will get you off this topic. If you expect me to repeat it later, I get to choose.

  82. 582
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    FUCKING UNBELIEVABLE!!!! ANOTHER ONE!!!

    READ 564!!!

    Your post was classical bully “either do it my way or I go home” bullshit. You need to show some maturity, realize you don’t dictate to other adults, and you move you argument forward by yourself now.

  83. 583
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis 574

    You can discuss whatever you want but I’m not going to run in the same stupid circles since I first posted.

    How can you still not get it when Athyco picked it up so quickly???

  84. 584
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Hoping for a starfart here soon

  85. 585
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    athyco,

    Thanks for trying to explain. I would rather see douglas not using you to lecture us naughty kids, though.

    Not an admonishment for you, but for him. You’re just too nice :)

  86. 586
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    That is, I don’t mean that you were lecturing us, athyco, but that douglas is.

  87. 587
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    A)Fine, but NOT as long as it gets constantly brought up over and over and over again.

    B)Can everyone read this??? Do you get it yet???

    But really he still doesn’t get it completely correct, I can easily prove that has ALWAYS been my argument since this bullshit started… long before this thread.

    I’ve honestly made this point over a hundred times now, how can I not be sick of it?

    Nothing will move forward until this point is conceded because obviously it’s just going to be brought up again and again, and I shouldn’t have to tolerate what is verifiable LIE either.

  88. 588
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    So Douglas, do you or do you not think PZ censors? Please set the record straight so we can all finally move on with our lives.

  89. 589
    myeck waters

    This is the best Thunderdome discussion I’ve read since that one about how riding in an elevator was just like being religious.

  90. 590
    douglas1102

    @ Beatrice 585

    Lecturing???? That describes your side a lot better, I’ve been lectured how many times now about censorship despite having made the argument umteen times since this started?

    Like I say, I bet I’ve made the argument even more than any of you have and I can PROVE it yet you still hang it on me how many times now??? It’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever seen.

    I bet if I show you the proof it still won’t make a difference, it hasn’t made a difference when Athyco told everyone so I can’t imagine what will.

  91. 591
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I’m curious about the scintillating conversation douglas will engage us in now that we’ve concluded that he does not think PZ censors anyone and he just used the wrong word before. This is what climbing Mount Everest must feel. You’re finally there, but what is waiting for you at the top?
    My heart can barely stand the excitement.

  92. 592
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Nothing will move forward until this point is conceded because obviously it’s just going to be brought up again and again, and I shouldn’t have to tolerate what is verifiable LIE either.

    Bully engaging in immature bullying behavior. We don’t give in to such behavior. You move on, either elsewhere, or your argument, whatever it is…Your choice cricket.

  93. 593
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Douglas I have a food bloggers lunch at a new pho restaurant but I cannot leave until this matter is finally settled. Please!

  94. 594
    douglas1102

    @ Rev 588

    How many times do I have to say it and where the hell is your evidence that I did?

    “Douglas why do you think PZ censors people?”

    What are you basing that on??? Because everyone else said it???

    How about I play the same semantic game that was played with me?

    You just said PZ censors didn’t you??? Maybe YOU should learn what censorship means eh?

    Now we’ll just talk about how Rev thinks PZ censors.

    You answer me first Rev, “why does PZ censor”? Don’t you understand what censorship means?

  95. 595
    douglas1102

    Wait? Have we finally concluded that point??? Any objections? Good.

    Fine, now we can move on, the floor is open to whomever would like to make the next point and I’ll be happy to engage.

  96. 596
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Fine, now we can move on, the floor is open to whomever would like to make the next point and I’ll be happy to engage.

    We don’t move on until you do. Either forward your argument or shut the fuck up.

  97. 597
    billygutter01

    All that fucking around so you can say… what exactly?

  98. 598
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    “Douglas why do you think PZ censors people?”

    What are you basing that on??? Because everyone else said it???

    No. I (and (I assume) others) are basing it on this:

    Hate speech is best countered with better speech, when better speech fails censoring begins.

    However… I defiantly agree with it here, if I were PZ I’d be doing it the same way.

  99. 599
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Fine, now we can move on, the floor is open to whomever would like to make the next point and I’ll be happy to engage.

    Why do I need your fucking permission to make a comment?

  100. 600
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Since Douglas is holding his breath, turning blue, and not forwarding his argument (he must not have one), what shall we chat about?

  101. 601
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    You answer me first Rev, “why does PZ censor”?

    So you still think he does?

    I thought we had settled this?!?

    Well this has been fun but I’m off.

  102. 602
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Fine, now we can move on, the floor is open to whomever would like to make the next point and I’ll be happy to engage.

    Thank you so very much for giving us permission to talk about things, but I was really looking forward to you finally coming to some point.
    I’m fluttering with excitement. I’m like a hockey player anxiously waiting to get my teeth knocked out for the first time. Don’t leave me hanging. Don’t make me feel like the hockey player finding out he’s the reserve again.

  103. 603
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis 598

    I guess I was wrong, you still don’t get it and I’m sure as hell not going to be the one that explains it to you AGAIN.

    Rev said it too, he was even more specific than me so why not play semantic games with him?

    Or why don’t you just read the posts, and concede the point so we can move on?

  104. 604
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Since Douglas is holding his breath, turning blue, and not forwarding his argument (he must not have one), what shall we chat about?

    Oh, nononono! We have to wait until douglas gives us permission to discuss something else. Until he is satisfied that we all agree that he never, ever, ever mentioned censorship and PZ in the same comment, all is on hold.

    Am I being sarcastic? Hell yes. This is getting ridiculous.

  105. 605
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Tell you what, asshole. I’m walking away from this thread. You can continue to demand control over what people can, and cannot, comment on all you want. You won’t be doing it to me anymore.

  106. 606
    douglas1102

    @ Beatrice 602

    If you and Nerd think me refusing to engage amounts to giving you permission then that’s your problem.

    However I doubt you even think that, but then again I figured I would spend this long waiting for a verifiable fact to be conceded.

  107. 607
    billygutter01

    This is getting ridiculous.

    I’d say that it’s been ridiculous the whole time.

  108. 608
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis 605

    Well fuck you very much for that, I guess that means you’re telling me what I can and can’t do according to the Beatrice Nerd logic.

  109. 609
    douglas1102

    @ Billy 607

    I sure as heck agree with that one.

  110. 610
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Seriously, douglas, you don’t really know how words work?

    You wrote:

    Fine, now we can move on, the floor is open to whomever would like to make the next point and I’ll be happy to engage.

    That very much deserved all the sarcasm in the world about you giving us permission to move on to different comments.

    Actually, this is kinda fun. In a really weird way. Probably why it made me think of having my teeth knocked out, but in a fun way.

  111. 611
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Ogvorbis,

    Ooooh, daring!

  112. 612
    billygutter01

    *facepalm*

  113. 613
    douglas1102

    @ Beatrice 610

    That’s hardly giving you permission, obviously I’m saying I’ll engage anyone who’d like to make the next point but instead now everyone wants that to mean I’m deciding who can do what.

    I’m telling you what I want to do, not what you have to do, and that’s very obvious.

    Tell me, what would my response to that have to be to move on?

  114. 614
    douglas1102

    Btw… the comment I posted from Youtube on my first post is now one of the top comments on Ana Kasparian’s vid.

    I’m gonna go screen-shot because that exactly the kind of thing the might open some eyes.

  115. 615
    billygutter01

    Btw… the comment I posted from Youtube on my first post is now one of the top comments on Ana Kasparian’s vid.

    What does this have to do with anything?

    I’m gonna go screen-shot because that exactly the kind of thing the might open some eyes.

    What. The. Actual. Fuck?

  116. 616
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    If you and Nerd think me refusing to engage amounts to giving you permission then that’s your problem.

    You’re the one wanting to talk about something. We’ve already discussed it several times over the years. You go first and make your ideas known.

    I’m gonna go screen-shot because that exactly the kind of thing the might open some eyes.

    Why do you think we give a shit about videos and comments thereof? They aren’t evidence, they are OPINION.

  117. 617
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    HAHAHAHAH! He won Top Commenter on a Youtube thread.

    Dying.

  118. 618
    douglas1102

    Did you morons actually bother to look at the vid or the comment? Nope, just took it as an excuse to spout drivel and completely miss the point.

    PZ considers YT a cesspool and this is his blog???

    I really expected more, the sick thing is that I now have to concede at least one point to Tf00t.

    I’ll achieve more to stop this hate spread on YT in 10 min. than I’ve managed commenting for hours on this blog. Heck, more than anyone on this blog.

  119. 619
    billygutter01

    Great.

    Here’s your “Hero Of The Year” Award. Now go tell YouTube how shiny it is.

  120. 620
    douglas1102

    And if you do bother to look at the comment or vid I would recommend giving that disgusting comment “thumbs up” Why??? Because then Ana will see it and I sincerely doubt that she’ll approve.

  121. 621
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    I’ll achieve more to stop this hate spread on YT in 10 min. than I’ve managed commenting for hours on this blog. Heck, more than anyone on this blog.

    Sally forth, brave l’il toaster!

  122. 622
    douglas1102

    Thanks Josh and Billy, but I’m not sure why this is something you think is funny.

  123. 623
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I think this might actually be a time when I can use ROTFL appropriately.
    ROTFLMAO, even.

  124. 624
    douglas1102

    Care to explain the laughter?

  125. 625
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Did you morons actually bother to look at the vid or the comment?

    Where is your link to both bigger moron, as everybody knows one must cite what one is talking about? And no, I don’t yootube or the comments therein. Why bother, as I have better things to do, like make dinner.

  126. 626
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Care to explain the laughter?

    You think is furthering your argument. It is nothing but a meaningless side-show from someone who can’t keep to their point, whatever it is. We don’t give a shit what other people think of you. You have and continue to trash yourself here by not forwarding your argument….

  127. 627
    Matt Penfold

    Has douglas1102 actually said what his argument actually is ? Does he even know what it is ?

  128. 628
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd

    “Where is your link to both bigger moron, as everybody knows one must cite what one is talking about? And no, I don’t yootube or the comments therein. Why bother, as I have better things to do, like make dinner.”

    I can barely decipher that, it sounds like you want the link to “both bigger moron” but that doesn’t make any sense.

    Are you asking for a link to the Youtube vid? Here ya go, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcSglVRYe6M

    Hillarious isn’t it? Jackasses>_>

    And you’re close with the evidence thing, but it only applies if I give a damn if you believe what I say.

    Go ahead and make dinner, I’ll quite content helping expose this crap.

  129. 629
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Yeah, Matt, I still don’t know that douglas’s argument is. Which is partly the source of my descent into chat-speak.

  130. 630
    Matt Penfold

    douglas1102,

    I have no interest in watching a video. If you cannot, and it seems you admit cannot, distill your argument down to a paragraph then it would seem to be a poor argument to begin with.

  131. 631
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 626

    My comments are voted down into oblivion and had you all not fallen victim to your confirmation bias you wouldn’t have made that stupid assumption.

    Forward my argument? Sure concede the point I need to forward the argument, a few have done it now. When the rest catch on then we can get somewhere.

    If you wanna debate something I’ll be happy to, but I’m sure you’re already twisting this comment to mean that “I’m deciding what you can respond to”

  132. 632
    douglas1102

    @ Matt 630

    You would have to be really stupid to think I give a damn… jackass.

  133. 633
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I think this last bit confirms that douglas in fact does not know what his argument is, he’s just fishing.

  134. 634
    Matt Penfold

    You would have to be really stupid to think I give a damn… jackass.

    I am under no illusion you give a toss. I just see a person who is arrogant and who is unable to actually say what his argument is. I actually feel a little sorry for you, because you clearly are not aware how pathetic you appear.

  135. 635
    athyco

    douglas1102,

    The comment you quoted in your very first post here–that one is the second of the two Top Comments. And your comment (to which that Top Comment is a reply) has received too many down votes so that you have to click it to show.

    This is winning because…the person who made the vid will be repulsed by seeing the slur-infested insulting comment to you?

  136. 636
    Matt Penfold

    I think this last bit confirms that douglas in fact does not know what his argument is, he’s just fishing.

    I think he is probably hoping one of us will tell him.

  137. 637
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    You would have to be really stupid to think I give a damn… jackass.

    Just like I don’t give a damn about a stupid video I would never watch or the comments therein. WHAT IS YOUR ARGUMENT?

  138. 638
    douglas1102

    @ Beatrice

    Seein’ as you conceded the point I’ll be happy to move on with you.

    You’re right I don’t know what argument you’re talking about, the argument I’ve been making almost entirely on this thread you already conceded to so that can’t be it can it?

    If you want another topic name it.

  139. 639
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    “This is winning because…the person who made the vid will be repulsed by seeing the slur-infested insulting comment to you?”

    You don’t think so?

  140. 640
    Matt Penfold

    You’re right I don’t know what argument you’re talking about, the argument I’ve been making almost entirely on this thread you already conceded to so that can’t be it can it?

    All you have been doing here is complain that people are being mean to you. Given how you have behaved, why would you be expecting people to be nice to you ?

    You have behaved like an idiot. You do not get to complain when people treat you like one.

  141. 641
    athyco

    Uh…versus the 26,000+ others so far who are seeing what is considered by their “peers” to be a top comment?

    No.

  142. 642
    douglas1102

    @ Matt

    For someone that is “under no illusion that I give a toss” you certainly seem to think that I do.

  143. 643
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Oh. That’s underwhelming.

  144. 644
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    If you want another topic name it.

    Your job cupcake. Forward your argument…

  145. 645
    Matt Penfold

    For someone that is “under no illusion that I give a toss” you certainly seem to think that I do.

    Maybe I am hoping you are not total scumbag, and have some sense of decency left. It would seem I am wrong, and that you not only a scumbag but proud of it.

  146. 646
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 641

    You could be right but I’m pretty confident it will.

  147. 647
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Still not seeing any argument being forwarded from Douglas, just attitude. Must be a character flaw.

  148. 648
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I thought there was something beautiful waiting for us at the end. Something witty. An intelligent, well made argument about something.

    But there is nothing.

    I could cry.

  149. 649
    douglas1102

    @ Matt

    Your arrogance is amazing, I really don’t care at all and if that makes me arrogant then that perfectly fine with me.

  150. 650
    athyco

    Do you have any evidence of a vid maker who reversed a stand based on what was voted into the Top Comment section?

  151. 651
    douglas1102

    Lol… at all you losers.

    Here ya go… a present, *ahem*

    “I have no argument and I’ve no idea at all how to put forward an argument”

    Awww shit ya got me o.o

    Now will you please stfu up about that and move on.

  152. 652
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    I really don’t care at all and if that makes me arrogant then that perfectly fine with me.

    Like we care what you think. Since it appears you can’t think well enough to put forward an argument about what you want to talk about other than you….

  153. 653
    Matt Penfold

    Your arrogance is amazing, I really don’t care at all and if that makes me arrogant then that perfectly fine with me.

    Thank you for confirming that you you do not care about being honest, about making yourself clear and about not behaving like an arsehole.

    The thing this, I already knew all that, so there was no need to bother.

    However you are lying. I know this because if you did not care you would not be bothering to comment here anymore. That you thought we would not notice says a lot about you.

  154. 654
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 650

    “Do you have any evidence of a vid maker who reversed a stand based on what was voted into the Top Comment section?”

    Ummm… no. But I’ve tons of evidence of people getting thrown under the bus once the person they’re trying to use discovers what scumbags they are.

  155. 655
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Now will you please stfu up about that and move on.

    No. You will be the one to move on, or shut the fuck up. YOU DON’T TELL US WHAT TO DO…

  156. 656
    anteprepro

    This is a really sad display. Poor douglas has consistently failed at communicating. This has made him run afoul of several commenters here, and it has hurt his fee-fees, because he didn’t really mean what his poor communication seemed to convey. So now he has broken down, able to provide nothing more than frustrated bluster and furious whines. Obviously, the solution to his problem would be just to step back, shut the fuck up, and come back when he has better control of his tongue, rather than blathering angrily and incompetently, mucking things up more, and entering into a downward spiral of frustration. But he is deadset on making noise, unable to peel himself away until he gets a pat on the back and a “there-there”, the poor thing. And now he is at risk of becoming a full-blown troll. Just walk away while you still can, doug. You won’t have to find a bridge to dwell quite yet, if you can stop yourself.

  157. 657
    douglas1102

    @ Matt 653

    “However you are lying. I know this because if you did not care you would not be bothering to comment here anymore. That you thought we would not notice says a lot about you.”

    My god man, your sense of deductive reasoning is simply amazing O.O you simply cannot hang around this blog wasting your powers while so many crimes go unpunished!!! Quickly!!! go forth!!!!

    Yea… I had high hopes, but trust me when I say I’m thoroughly disappointed. Actually, “floored” would be a better description.

  158. 658
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 655

    Says the one telling me what to do, and you didn’t even return the courtesy of saying “please”

  159. 659
    billygutter01

    What, exactly, do you want, doug1102?

  160. 660
    douglas1102

    @ anteprepro

    That’s prolly the nicest thing I’ve been told here. =)

  161. 661
    douglas1102

    @ Billy 659

    I’ve been asked and answered quite a few times now so why don’t you tell me, what do you want?

  162. 662
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Says the one telling me what to do, and you didn’t even return the courtesy of saying “please”

    Who the fuck cares what you want or thinks is polite. QUITE TELLING US WHAT TO DO.

  163. 663
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 662

    It’s QUITE alright, no need to shout.

  164. 664
    athyco

    But…the scumbag that made the comment is…a “nobody.” Not Thunderf00t, not Vacula. Not even King Crocoduck, who most recently linked us to a Vacula video. All of them could (and assuredly will, since there is no evidence that THEY agree with the slur-infected disgusting comment) deny any relationship to it.

    They could say that two FTBers conspired to have this “argument” to make them look bad. And then…post on Pharyngula that we should go there and thumbs up the disgusting comment. AS YOU HAVE DONE. Piss a brick!!

    Did you have to practice to become such a fucking assclam?!? Wow, am I ever glad that anyone who ever traces you back here will have you on full display. I take a faceplant because I thought there might be something to you, but everyone else had you down pat.

    Here ya go–one last “your assumptions without evidence make you wrong.” With Nerd, I wouldn’t be explaining anything to “her.” Nerd of Redhead is a man; Redhead is his wife. And Nerd would not be expecting to hear from me when you say “Ask Athyco. ‘He’ understands.” I am a woman.

    We will NOT be voting up the disgusting comment!

  165. 665
    Matt Penfold

    I’ve been asked and answered quite a few times now so why don’t you tell me, what do you want?

    I would be happy to see you fuck off, but failing that, you could do what many of us have asked you to do, but you have admitted you are unable to to do, which is tell us what your argument is.

    Oh, and whilst it is true you have been asked what your argument is many times, it is not true you have answered many times. Such an obvious lie I cannot understand why you think you would get away with it.

  166. 666
    evilisgood

    I wish the creationist would come back.

  167. 667
    Tethys

    *scrolls and scrolls and scrolls some more*

    I can’t find a point, or an argument, from douglas either.

    So douglas, why are you here?

  168. 668
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco

    “And then…post on Pharyngula that we should go there and thumbs up the disgusting comment. AS YOU HAVE DONE. Piss a brick!”

    That’s a good point, I never thought of that. But I doubt anything will come of it and it sure as hell isn’t going to influence Ana in any way.

    So don’t vote it up, I’m still gonna make her aware. Very aware.

    The comment isn’t going to influence her at all, it’s the vids Tf00t makes that’s gonna do it.

  169. 669
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I want to lodge a complaint about false advertizing.
    Douglas kept repeating that he wants to deal with our misunderstanding so that we can move on. It was implied that he had something to move on to. Some argument waiting for us at the end of the tunnel.

    It was all a lie.

    A fraud.

    I am disappointed.

  170. 670
    omnicrom

    At first I was annoyed with Douglas, then I was mildly sympathetic, now I’m just amused. Douglas has been SO consistently bad at communicating and so Truculant about it it’s hilarious in an awful way.

    Douglas, I have absolutely no reason to believe that you’d be willing to follow my advice but in case the stars suddenly became right here’s what you should probably do:

    1) Lose the defensive attitude. You win no friends and influence no people when you act like an angry child throwing a temper tantrum, and that is what you’ve been doing consistently since you came to Thunderdome.

    2) Take a step back and pause for thought. Why are you on this blog? What do you want to discuss? What questions do you have?

    3) Recognize you are not being clear. If you were misunderstood by one or two people that would be one thing, but the continuing refrain of “I don’t know what the fuck this guy is talking about” suggests that the onus to clarify is on you. WE DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SAYING DOUGLAS! Do not assume we do, because we do not. When you talked earlier about a Youtube comment no one knew what you were talking about. You were angry and called everyone jackasses when you finally provided a link to a video that you referenced in passing as though everyone knew about it. No one knew what you were talking about.

  171. 671
    Argle Bargle

    So Doug made a comment about PZ should be censoring which actually is about PZ not censoring and there’s a YouTube video which proves he gets down votes or something. Plus Doug will make his point as soon as we concede the other point about PZ censoring or not censoring as the case may be.

    I hope Doug finally makes his point. The suspense is killing me.

  172. 672
    douglas1102

    @ Matt

    Seriously? There’s evidence right on the blog.

    You make a lot of assumptions… a LOT.

  173. 673
    omnicrom

    Douglas that comment at 672 is classic you. What evidence? Evidence of what? If it’s right here on the blog can you provide a link or a quote? What assumptions? Assumptions about what? A lot of Assumptions about something? Can you provide links to Matt making these assumptions about things? A lot of links to Matt making assumptions about things? These assumptions are presumably contradicted by the evidence right? Can you provide links to the Assumptions and the Evidence after defining both?

    Douglas your posts read like a bad “Who’s on First” joke.

  174. 674
    Matt Penfold

    Seriously? There’s evidence right on the blog.

    I note you are unable to provide any though.

    Given that, I think you are lying once again. That is a bad habit you have, and not very polite either.

    And again, I note your inability to articulate your argument. You have been asked so many times now, and ignored those requests so many times that the only reasonable conclusion is that you cannot.

  175. 675
    douglas1102

    @ Omnicrom

    Don’t hand me that crap, look how long it took just to concede that I never made the “censorship” argument and people are still making it now.

    Sorry but that’s just plain pathetic, even worse than Youtube.

    Take your own advice.

  176. 676
    billygutter01

    douglas1102, you’re making no sense at all.

  177. 677
    omnicrom

    Douglas I did not hand you crap.

    Your problem is that you’re overly defensive in a very immature way, you don’t seem to have a clear argument at all, and overall you communicate very very badly.

    The reason that people still attack you for censorship is because you said a vague, unclear argument about censorship and people tried (as humans are wont to do) to understand what you were talking about. At no point did you say clearly what you meant to say. You have never ever clearly stated your arguments or your reasons for continuing to post.

    If you did not argue in favor of censorship then explain that. Explain what that post where you used the word censorship means, because we did not understand. Explain your questions about bullying. Explain why you brought up Youtube and how it is relevant. That’s your problem, you never explain things in a way that people understand it. As I pointed out maybe if one or two people had a hard time understanding you but the unanimous consensus so far has been “Huh”?

  178. 678
    douglas1102

    I really used to think the whole PZ Tf00t thing was entirely in PZ’s favor and I had never even really listened to PZ before. I thought that right up until I came to his blog. I still think that overall but the level of discourse is so low despite such an air of believing this is the pinnacle.

    Very disappointing… really no different than YT.

  179. 679
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Here ya go–one last “your assumptions without evidence make you wrong.” With Nerd, I wouldn’t be explaining anything to “her.” Nerd of Redhead is a man; Redhead is his wife. And Nerd would not be expecting to hear from me when you say “Ask Athyco. ‘He’ understands.” I am a woman.

    I thought Athyco mentioned she was a woman, but then I read all the threads. It helps when one interacts with the community. Doug, I’m an old bald man approaching retirement.

    douglas1102, you’re making no sense at all.

    Yep, sounds like situation normal.

    I wish the creationist would come back.

    Me too. My titanium fang is itchy.

  180. 680
    omnicrom

    Well if you feel that Pharyngula is no different from Youtube (incorrect) then leave Douglas.

    No one is keeping you here. If you seriously cannot figure out why you are being tarred (Hint: You’re being overly defensive, your purpose and motives are horribly unclear, and we can’t understand you) then leave. You stated you continued to post because of politeness in the previous thread, but on Pharyngula we don’t consider that necessarily polite. You are not being forced to remain here Douglas, you can leave at any time and try and find another forum. You can leave the comment threads entirely and read only what PZ posts. You can go find another FTBlog and try and communicate there or read those people’s posts. You have unlimited freedom of association on the Internet, if you truly truly believe that Pharyngula is a heinous cesspool the like of Sexist videos on Youtube why stay?

  181. 681
    douglas1102

    @ Omnicrom

    I heard you the first hundred times… a better argument is what you need.

    Again, making the same stupid “censorship” argument is pathetically stupid and that’s 100% on you, trying to pass it off on me isn’t going to work.

    The proof is how easily some posters picked up on first read and the reason they did is because they looked at it honestly. And that’s something no one else did, confirmation bias was EXTREME and you’re a great example.

    You guys don’t even call each other on fallacy as long as it’s supporting your view.

    Sorry but this isn’t some bastion for discourse, Aron’s vid wasn’t bad, but everywhere else has been a pit.

  182. 682
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    So, YT discussions was superior to the discussions here. Now the discussion here is no different from YT.

    Consistency is the hobgoblins of little minds.

  183. 683
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    *yawn*
    This isn’t amusing any more. Just sad.

  184. 684
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Happily satiated with a belly full of Vietnamese food I can’t help but still be concerned with Douglas’ accusation of censorship by PZ.

  185. 685
    omnicrom

    No Douglas, I didn’t say you needed a better argument. I said you needed a clearer argument. If you can’t tell the difference between the two I don’t know what to tell you.

  186. 686
    douglas1102

    ” if you truly truly believe that Pharyngula is a heinous cesspool the like of Sexist videos on Youtube why stay?”

    This is what I mean, I never said “sexist videos on Youtube” not even once, so what part of your bias made you say that? Or was that deliberate? I’m betting on the first.

    Also, I could ask you the same question about me.

    My answer is that I really don’t know and I prolly will leave, so what’s your answer?

  187. 687
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Does anybody else hear Douglas’ comments in the voices of Gollum and Smeagol?
    You know, when it’s damn funny listening to them but it only makes sense if you’ve read the fucking book.

  188. 688
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Blockquote, motherfucker! Can you do it?

  189. 689
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Rev. you meanie.

  190. 690
    douglas1102

    @ Omnicrom

    Actually I meant that you need a better argument rather than repeating yourself over and over.

    And thanks for not being so damn condescending that time.

    I’m starting to think you like me and you just won’t admit it.

  191. 691
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    This is what I mean, I never said “sexist videos on Youtube” not even once, so what part of your bias made you say that?

    Actually, people can have opinions about things that are not derived from you words. Amazing, I know.

  192. 692
    billygutter01

    Sorry but this isn’t some bastion for discourse

    It really is terrible in here, douglas1102. Let’s you and I get out of here for a civilized chat – far away from these rogues who keep asking you to make a point of some kind. Right this way…
    *holds the door open*

    Coming?

  193. 693
    Matt Penfold

    Blockquote, motherfucker! Can you do it?

    I doubt it. He cannot articulate his argument after all.

  194. 694
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Actually I meant that you need a better argument rather than repeating yourself over and over.

    Ah, I was wrong, he’s still funny.

  195. 695
    douglas1102

    @ Jainine

    You talkin’ to me?

    Naw I can’t block-quote, someone was nice enough to show me how but I deleted the copypaste

    If you’ve got a problem with that feel free to post it again and I’ll use it.

  196. 696
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Still hoping for a starfart

  197. 697
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Rev.,

    I’m sure you’ll be excited to hear that when I went to Pharyngula wiki to check what starfart was, I got this little window in the corner:

    Register for next week’s webinar about how content on Wikia is licensed, CC-BY-SA, and how to properly use images on your wiki.

    (Unless you weren’t the person I remember complaining about webinars. In that case… oops, my mistake)

  198. 698
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Douglas I have to think that you not understanding or remembering how to blockquote speaks to your continued misunderstanding of censorship.

  199. 699
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Will the person who is forcing douglas1102 to stay at this site please leave his home?

  200. 700
    Tethys

    douglas apparently can’t use google, in addition to his communication problems. poor troll

  201. 701
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    No that was me.

    Hate webinars.

    And censorship….

  202. 702
    billygutter01

    What Janine said @ 699.

  203. 703
    Argle Bargle

    Doug,

    You are such a poor writer that I cannot figure out what the point about censorship we’re supposed to concede actually is. I might be willing to concede your point, if for no other reason than to stop you whining about it, but I don’t have a clue as to whether or not you think PZ censors, doesn’t censor, should censor, shouldn’t censor, or will or will not censor. So I won’t concede the point because I don’t know what the point is that you want conceded.

    And no, it’s not my fault that you can’t express yourself well.

  204. 704
    douglas1102

    @ Billy

    Yea you guys like clinging to the “can’t make a point thing” and it contagious as hell

    But hey it took almost 20 hours to get any of you to concede even one verifiable fact so I’m not gonna be bothered with that again, heck half of you still don’t get it and the rest that do aren’t honest enough to point it out.

  205. 705
    omnicrom

    No I don’t like you much Douglas, I just have a serious case of trainwreck syndrome.

    Your posts are edifying in a grotesque way. The way you utterly fail to communicate is startling. The total disconnect from what you’re saying and what you seem to think you’re saying is baffling and strangely alluring. Your complete inability at self-reflection and utter refusal to even humor criticism is breathtaking. I continue to respond to you because what you get wrong is so obvious that every time you totally miss the point it becomes an ironic anti-triumph.

    In short I’m responding to you not because I have any faith that repeatedly explaining as plainly and clearly as I can what is wrong with your posts will make you argue better, but because I have almost sublime certainty that you will NOT improve your posts and I find them enjoyable in a very bad way.

  206. 706
    athyco

    Forget the “censorship” thing, everyone. That was entirely an EGO DIVERSION with douglas. Here’s what he wants us to admire him for–his “argument.”

    Ana Kasparian, the co-anchor of the Young Turks made a video responding to one by Thunderf00t: “Do ‘Hot’ Girls Have All the Advantages?” Of course, in it she says all the things that Thunderf00t fans want to hear about how sweet he is, how she wouldn’t ban, block, or delete comments unless they were lunatics. You know–to have an attractive, well-known atheist woman on Thunderf00t’s side to contrast with…(Yeah, you know their logic.) Well, doug’s comment on HER video is an evidence-free, sneery set of assertions about the stupidity/moral failings of the commenters. (Who’s surprised?) It prompted huge numbers of down votes so that it doesn’t even show, but it also prompted one angry response with slurs at douglas. At present, only five people have thumbed it UP, but that was still enough to get it in the Top Comments. Here is the exchange:

    Douglas says:

    “making the movement look like a bunch of perverted weirdo’s”
    Uh no… perverted weirdos and their apologists are the ones making the “movement” look like a bunch of perverted weirdos.
    You’re a sick fuck for suggesting women need to keep silent about harassment because it would tarnish the “movement’s” reputation, it’s victim blaming and it promotes rape culture… go fuck yourself.
    “professional victim” indeed… unfreakinbelievable>_>

    And the reply: (Which douglas sees as SO HORRIBLE that Ana Kasparian will be appalled)

    So I suppose anyone can make serious claims, have nothing to back up said claims and then expect sweeping rules and regulations including ones restricting speech with broad and arbitrary terms?
    If there was sexual harassment at these things that would be a POLICE MATTER. Again, where is evidence of RAPE let alone any real harassment?
    You are a pussywhipped mangina needlessly pushing a effort to stifle free expression on the basis of unverified emotional sniveling. “Rape culture”, GTFO loser.

    Douglas is pleased that the second comment is in the Top Comment section. It’s the first step in his clever plan to “open the eyes” of Ana Kasparian and others regarding the nefarious Thunderf00t and his Thunderthugs so that she will haughtily throw him under the bus. Oh…my head hurts.

  207. 707
    Argle Bargle

    Doug #704

    But hey it took almost 20 hours to get any of you to concede even one verifiable fact so I’m not gonna be bothered with that again, heck half of you still don’t get it and the rest that do aren’t honest enough to point it out.

    All I can do is repeat the last sentence of my post #703: And no, it’s not my fault that you can’t express yourself well.

  208. 708
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    You guys don’t even call each other on fallacy as long as it’s supporting your view.

    What fallacy. Unevidenced assertion *POOF* dismissed as fuckwittery, like every other post….

    But hey it took almost 20 hours to get any of you to concede even one verifiable fact s

    It was never verified. You just claimed it was..;.

  209. 709
    douglas1102

    @ Rodney 703

    It is totally your fault, I just said… one got it right away but unlike the rest of you he was honestly reading the post and not reading it how he wanted it to read.

    Btw my comments up there admitting about the “argument” nonsense and I’m still getting asked about it.

    The fact is the level of discourse here is very low.

  210. 710
    Matt Penfold

    So basically he’s upset because we are refusing to acknowledge what a wonderful person he is ?

  211. 711
    athyco

    It is totally your fault, I just said… one got it right away but unlike the rest of you he was honestly reading the post and not reading it how he wanted it to read.

    I’m still a woman, you shit for brains. And the only thing I can imagine that made me “get it” was that I taught 8th graders for 30 years and understand how many of them can fuck up saying the simplest things.

  212. 712
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    And he totally gets PZ’s censorship.

    And hates YouTube.

  213. 713
    omnicrom

    No Douglas it is not Rodney’s fault.

    Show of hands here, how many of you guys had even the faintest clue what Douglas was saying? I sure as hell didn’t. Athyco is a Saint among Squids for putting in what must have been considerable effort to figure out what the fuck you were trying to say again and again.

    Oh and here’s the kicker, even after the revelation of Athyco, cursed chosen speaker for douglas1102 the inscrutable, the argument you were making is STILL bad and STILL not very clear. ARE you arguing that we should leave messages on Youtube and hope that people who post horrible shit become sickened when people attracted to their horrible shit say horrible shit? I have to ask because not only does that seem like a bad argument but I STILL CAN’T TELL WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY.

    One person being able to understand you does not mean you are being intelligible. In fact if only one person on a site can figure out what you’re saying that’s a good sign that maybe you are unintelligible.

  214. 714
    billygutter01

    But hey it took almost 20 hours to get any of you to concede even one verifiable fact so I’m not gonna be bothered with that again, heck half of you still don’t get it and the rest that do aren’t honest enough to point it out.

    Emphasis mine.

    Those bits in bold are prime examples of why nobody has a fucking clue what you’re on about.

    You spew a word salad of ambiguous ramblings, then wonder why nobody can follow it.

    Learn to communicate more clearly.

  215. 715
    omnicrom

    Sorry, shouldn’t have said just Guys.

    But still, how many people here understood douglas prior to Athyco’s partial translation?

  216. 716
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    omnicrom:

    Athyco is a Saint among Squids for putting in what must have been considerable effort to figure out what the fuck you were trying to say again and again.

    Seconded.

    (also, Athyco, your cited reason for understanding him made me laugh)

  217. 717
    Argle Bargle

    It is totally your fault, I just said… one got it right away but unlike the rest of you he was honestly reading the post and not reading it how he wanted it to read.

    Does someone have a Gibberish to English dictionary? This comment was addressed to me and I’m not sure what it says, other than it’s my fault.

  218. 718
    Tethys

    Oh, I suppose douglas thinks that because he made one comment on YT that we should all recognize him as the great warrior against sexism that he believes himself to be.

    douglas,

    You do realize that you are in a shark tank, right? Poor arguments (like yours) are blood in the water round these parts, and we don’t much care who is making the poor argument.
    PZ himself is not immune, and that is exactly the way he likes it.

  219. 719
    omnicrom

    As far as I can tell Rodney, douglas is being derisive the one (AND ONLY ONE) person could understand him partially so that means that he’s not being horribly unintelligible.

  220. 720
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    I jet wish Douglas would tell us about it because having invested this much time getting to it, it must be very important.

  221. 721
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 711

    I missed your comment where you mentioned your a woman, my apologies.

  222. 722
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Jet=just

  223. 723
    billygutter01

    @720
    Same here, Rev.

  224. 724
    douglas1102

    @ Tethys 718

    “You do realize that you are in a shark tank, right?”

    I really did lol at that one.

    You can think of me as a guppy if that makes you feel even more confidant.

    This is why the discourse is so low, you’re completely convinced that’s the way it is and it never even occurs to you that maybe it’s not.

    I think that’s the only comment that made me laugh so far.

  225. 725
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Xe is still at it? Wow.

    Oh, well. Now that we have all agreed to the verifiable fact that douglas1102 never used the word ‘censorship’ in any way, shape or form, maybe xe can answer this.

    douglas1102 wrote:

    I suspect this prolly won’t win me any friends here but my experience dealing with “real racists” is that bullying them right back actually works to the point of often changing their view. I even got a couple of Thunderthugs to actually post that he was wrong on harassment policies.

    These guys are group-think cowards and they respond (seemingly only) to intimidation, why do you think you never really hear this crap other than anonymously?

    I replied:

    I disagree with the idea of becoming a bully back.

    However, reacting assertively, even aggressively, to racist, misogynist, bigoted, and other prejudicial language is an effective tactic. To the bully-er, it may appear to be bullying — for victims to refuse to be cowed, to refuse to be silenced, can, on occasion, change a mind. I’m not going to go to their (whoever they happen to be) and abuse them, but when they come here,they are fair game.

    I wish it happened more often, though.

    douglas1102 wrote:

    @ Ogvorbis

    Hey… said it prolly wouldn’t win me any friends =)

    Now that I read your post I realize I prolly mean “assertively, even aggressively”

    All the times I’ve wasted hours arguing about these things nothing ever works until I finally get fed up and start acting a lot more “”assertively, even aggressively”.

    But where is the line drawn? I’d would genuinely like to know when the line is drawn it comes to responding to this sort of thing. Where does “assertively, even aggressively” end and bullying begin?

    Insulting their intelligence seems to work quite well, but personally… that’s where the line is drawn for me despite the effectiveness.

    This is all before you didn’t in any way, shape, or form, mention of censorship. You wrote something. I disagreed. You agreed with my disagreement and then disagreed with my disagreement in the same comment.

    So. What is it you really want to say here? What is you actual goal?

  226. 726
    Rumtopf

    I’m bored and read the whole sorry lot from both threads.

    Douglas made the claim that bullying is best countered with bullying, was disagreed with and then asked what actions he considered to be bullying so we could go on from there.
    He didn’t give any specific definitions of what he thought was bullying despite being repeatedly asked, but suggested that insulting someone’s intelligence in general was a vague example of crossing the line(without mention of any context, or any attempt at defining what he meant), which was also disagreed with and left unexplained by Douglas.

    He was also defensive from the start:

    If I said “moderate”[instead of censoring - me] would you quit the patronizing and respond to what I’m actually asking? Sheesh…

    See what I mean? He even acknowledges that he used the wrong word but everyone else was still at fault for responding to what was originally said. Douglas, people GOT that you agreed with PZ banning idiots, they disagreed that it was censorship, and so, after the fact, did you! There was no bloody patronising until later when your continued stupid behaviour warranted it. :/ Why was “oh yeah, my bad I didn’t mean that, I meant this:…” so frikkin hard? Let’s take a closer look at what was said.

    Hate speech is best countered with better speech, when better speech fails censoring begins.

    However… I defiantly agree with it here, if I were PZ I’d be doing it the same way.

    Douglas, you seriously don’t see how everyone read this and thought what they did? Especially the “defiantly agree with it[censoring] here” part. Come on and be honest, admit that you fucked up here, that you were either horribly unclear or you meant what you originally said and scrambled to deny it after realising how stupid it was when people called you on it. Even when you change “censoring” to “moderating” to get “Hate speech is best countered with better speech, when better speech fails moderation begins.
    However… I defiantly agree with it here, if I were PZ I’d be doing it the same way.”
    , the implication that you dislike moderating as you do censorship, that you “defiantly agree” with this instance of moderation, is left in tact(while you cry and whine for more moderation from PZ because of all the meanie-heads). So I call bullshit.

    I actually wonder if he just wanted to throw a claim out there as a debate topic and step back, as if he didn’t have a properly thought out opinion regarding his own claim about counter-bullying anyway. I wondered as soon as I read this:

    “Define to what you refer by ‘bullying’” – John Morales

    Do you mean “define to what you are referring to as bullying?” ‘Cause it sure sounds like you want me to bully. Ignored it??? Whaaa? You block-quoted my example AND responded to it and you block-quoted my question asking when the line is drawn.

    Are you reading this PZ? I’d really like to know how you would react had this been your first time on this blog ’cause so far I’d sooner wait ’till Mon. for the xian to come back to Aron’s blog. Actually… that’s what I’m gonna do, at least he didn’t use lame patronage, he responded to my actual posts and he didn’t try to put words in my mouth.

    Can you say deliberately obtuse? And the “words in my mouth” part was in reference to his mistaken use of the word censor again. So he snivels about it and latches onto this perceived wrong against him instead of moving on with the fucking point. That’s not a sign of someone who wants an honest discussion. Neither are comments like this:

    @ John Morales

    “(Why, what are you trying to accomplish?)”

    Well for one I’d like to discuss where drawing the line is… that’s one of the first things I posted before you started arguing about my imaginary censorship claims.

    … Yet he never properly discusses it by putting forward anything more substantial than “insulting intelligence”, I think he just wanted everyone else to fill in the gaps for him. And the censorship claims were soooo imaginary…

    So yeah, the vast majority of his comments were and continue to be just whining about how everyone misunderstood his totally clear comments and are sooo mean and worse than thunderf00t fanboys!(Fuck you again from me for that, Douglas). And yeah, I realise I have way too much time on my hands, lol.

  227. 727
    omnicrom

    This is why the discourse is so low, you’re completely convinced that’s the way it is and it never even occurs to you that maybe it’s not.

    Explain what you mean when you deride the discourse. What are we completely convinced of? What “way” do we think “it is”? We does not occur to us? Why is this ephemeral “is” that may not be?

    Are you possibly suggesting that you’re a skilled and talented rhetor and we simply don’t understand your genius? If so I’m going to take an hour long laugh break and come back with whatever remaining shreds of empathy I have for you excised. You are not good at communicating douglas.

  228. 728
    Argle Bargle

    If everyone, including athyco, has trouble understanding Doug, then perhaps the problem is with Doug and not with us. I’m just offering this as an off-the-cuff thought because Doug knows he’s clear as the driven snow or something.

  229. 729
    chigau (違う)

    I’m up to #600 and I must say that with the mild fever and the cold-meds this it is bestest Thunder evaaar.
    except [or because of] douglas(meathead)1102
    I’ll catch up.

  230. 730
    billygutter01

    Bah!

    I’ve reached my limit with douglas. I’m going to smoke a bong hit and watch an episode of Law And Order.

    Bon courage, commentariat!

  231. 731
    douglas1102

    @ Omnicrom 727

    “Are you possibly suggesting that you’re a skilled and talented rhetor and we simply don’t understand your genius?”

    Nope… but it sure as hell sounds like you’re trying to suggest something.

  232. 732
    omnicrom

    Douglas I have no clue what you’re saying. I’m making wild suggestions based very loosely on the word salad you repeatedly put on my plate. I can’t even begin to try and describe your speech so I must flail about hoping that maybe you’ll inadvertently arrange the words you type into coherent sentences.

  233. 733
    athyco

    You know what? You’re thinking of understand douglas1102 in terms of non-fiction. You need to be thinking fantasy. If you’ll indulge the Seer of Squid, the story is as thus:

    Prologue:

    ARE you arguing that we should leave messages on Youtube and hope that people who post horrible shit become sickened when people attracted to their horrible shit say horrible shit? I have to ask because not only does that seem like a bad argument but I STILL CAN’T TELL WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY.

    Ahhh, Omicron. Our story finds us cradling one video only, made by the Lovely Ana Kasparian, exalted by the Young Turks, most innocent and pure of heart. She hath been duped, most wickedly duped, by the leering chicanery of Thunderf00t. Did she but know the quality of the social justice knights and warrior princesses at FTB, Skepchick, and A+, her face would blench and her eyes saltily swim; her heart would falter that she had–even once–thought Thunderf00t fair.

    But she cannot not know these doughty fighers! Thunderthugs press close around her; she cannot see beyond. Only Douglas has the wily plan. Douglas will provoke a Thunderthug, smite his mind so mightily that he swings wildly and profanely in YouTube comment response. The Lovely Ana, seeing this perverse thing rise atop the thousands, will break from the spell! “Fie, evil F00t! Hie, evil F00t!” Her shouts, ringing out from the Young Turk battlements, will rout the F00tlings and raise the countryside!

    And the knights and warrior princesses of social justice will call upon all to praise the name of douglas1102.

  234. 734
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 706

    Really? If you were Ana you wouldn’t do the same? I sure as hell would.

    I suppose that should be ignored as well?

    We’ll see what happens =) Actually I don’t think she’d risk the fan base, but we’ll see.

  235. 735
    omnicrom

    Athyco @ 733

    That makes sense

    douglas1102 @ 734

    That makes no sense.

  236. 736
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 733

    Provoke? I call it standing up.

    Did someone from FTB really just suggest I’m a whiteknight?

    I’m kinda tired so if you want me to read comments keep ‘em short please, although I really did enjoy reading yours, I’m thinking of putting it to lute music and writing a ballad =)

  237. 737
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Douglas can you please get to whatever it is?

  238. 738
    athyco

    Someone from FTB suggests that you think you are a knight. Don Douglas Quixote, however, is delusional.

  239. 739
    chigau (違う)

    douglas1102
    Do you enjoy commenting here?

  240. 740
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    There is no it, Rev. Why did he say there was an it when there is no it?

  241. 741
    douglas1102

    @ Rev

    Nope, we’re still not past the “censor” thing as long as idiots want to argue that I think PZ censors there’s no point.

    Ball’s in your court, not mine, and feel free to bring up another topic or point if you’d like.

    But then I guess then you guys couldn’t keep repeating the “can’t get to his point” argument even though I was clear to Nerd and it should have been over with long ago.

    Low discourse… even the Youtubers would have gotten farther.

  242. 742
    douglas1102

    @ Athyco 738

    That’s a flattering description =) Here’s on of my quotes, (seems apt)

    “Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”

  243. 743
    omnicrom

    Wow douglas, that lovely post of yours at 736 finally drained me of all possibly sympathy.

    You attack me at post 686 for extrapolating from what you say when I mentioned Misogynistic Youtube videos and then you take umbrage at an accusation that wasn’t even thrown at you? And it turned out that I was indeed correct and you WERE talking about misogynistic youtube videos? Fuck you. No one has called you a whiteknight, and even if you were Whiteknighting I don’t think anyone could tell WHO OR WHAT you were Whiteknighting. No seriously, Fuck you.

    You’ve had about 400 posts worth of discussion now and you’re still being smug and defensive and imperious and we STILL don’t know what the hell you’re on about most of the time. With the help of Athyco’s and several other people who risked time and brain cells to interpret your babble it turns out you’re likely mightily proud of yourself and you’re possibly annoyed that we haven’t fallen into lockstep behind your brilliance. That was was I thought I saw when you mockingly said that we could call you a guppy at post 724, you seemed to feel smugly superior to all of us because we couldn’t figure out your perfect genius response to bad youtube videos. In hindsight and with some translation you come across annoyingly pleased with yourself for no reason, I suspect the only reason why people haven’t been lambasting you for your attitude sooner is that no-one could figure out what you were talking about. But now that I have a firmer grasp let me just say again: Fuck you.

    You are still giving people commands, you still don’t get how horribly hard it is to communicate with you, you still are smugly satisfied, and you still don’t seem at all interested in getting the slightest clue. So for a fourth time: Fuck you.

  244. 744
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Ball’s in your court, not mine, and feel free to bring up another topic or point if you’d like.

    Actually any topic you bring up other than yourself is appropriate….Didn’t you want to talk about bullying? TALK.

  245. 745
    douglas1102

    @ chigau 739

    Yes, actually I do like it here.(Thunderdome)

  246. 746
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 744

    Don’t tell me what to do. (bet ya didn’t see that comin’)

  247. 747
    chigau (違う)

    douglas1102
    If you wish to continue, stop being boring.
    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/08/01/pharyngula-standards-practices/

  248. 748
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Nope, we’re still not past the “censor” thing as long as idiots want to argue that I think PZ censors there’s no point.

    But you do right?

  249. 749
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Don’t tell me what to do.

    Like I said, who the fuck cares what you think, as you don’t. I bully back…

  250. 750
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Nerd of Redhead,

    I bully back…

    No, that’s bad. Trolling back, on the other hand… *grin*

  251. 751
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    ;)

  252. 752
  253. 753
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Perfect.

  254. 754
    douglas1102

    Anyone who feels I need to “get to my argument” please refer to comment 748

    I’ve genuinely been involved in a semantic argument almost this entire time.

    Sad… real sad.

    Sorry but I’m not going to be told what I “really think” because of a comment I admitted was poorly worded especially when it very easy to validate that I’ve been arguing against such for months at least.

    That is honestly the dumbest argument I’ve ever heard on-line and the most aggressively pushed.

    Sorry but it’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard, and if you can’t see that then you’re either (very) stupid or (very) dishonest.

    It’s the same as Creationist telling an atheist what he “really belives” and attacking the made up belief except I’ve got even better evidence.

    Unbelievable…

    I mean… look at this comment above me, he’s seriously trying to argue what I “really” think. instead of what I tell him I think, he could claim I was lying but I have comments for proof.

    And not one person is honest enough to point out how dumb that is.

    If we can’t get this past accepting an easily verifiable fact then there’s no point going on. You’re not going to get around it.

  255. 755
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Easy as Sunday mornin’

  256. 756
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Douglas, I have now asked twice about your original comment, my reply, and your response to my reply. Do you wish to discuss what you originally decided to comment on, or do you continue to argue what has been agreed (that you didn’t use any permutation of the word censor in any way that could possibly imply that it referred to PZ)?

  257. 757
    Tethys

    You can think of me as a guppy if that makes you feel even more confidant.

    Oh lookie, it’s a piss-poor attempt at negging.
    I assume you mean confident? I will even use it in a sentence.

    I am very confident that douglas is an idiot, whose sole purpose here at this point is to be a chum spreading troll.

    This is why the discourse is so low, you’re completely convinced that’s the way it is and it never even occurs to you that maybe it’s not.

    Wow dude, that’s like so deeeeeeepity and I am totes convinced that um…………what was your point?

    Seriously douglas, quit your whinging about how we are all so mean and bad at discourse and we won’t give you a cookie for making a YT comment.

  258. 758
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    This is what climbing Mount Everest must feel [like? ~cm]. You’re finally there, but what is waiting for you at the top?

    Apparently, after an absolute bastard ice-climb, the last few hundred feet are basically an uphill walk.

    Then you can hear the jetstream.

    I read it in a book. /trufax

  259. 759
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Listen people. Douglas is entitled to his opinion about How PZ runs his blog, no matter how wrong he is about censoring.

    I do wish he’d tell us what the point is he’s been trying to get to.

  260. 760
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis

    Alright, that’s fine with me.

    But you’re going to have to start because I can’t even remember what it was.

  261. 761
    douglas1102

    @ Rev 759

    Now you’re just trolling me

  262. 762
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    563 & 725 (on this thread)

    Hit ctrl-F. Type in a word. It will show you every post in which that word occurs — such as ‘Ogvorbis’

  263. 763
    douglas1102

    @ Tethys 757

    I never claimed that anyone was “mean”

  264. 764
    Argle Bargle

    I get it now. PZ doesn’t censor, Doug doesn’t think PZ should censor, Doug thinks he should censor but only on YouTube so his comments get voted down.

  265. 765
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Apparently, after an absolute bastard ice-climb, the last few hundred feet are basically an uphill walk.

    Then you can hear the jetstream.

    I read it in a book. /trufax

    It’s mostly a question of endurance, surviving the seracs in the Khumbu icefall, having good weather, dealing with elevation and then the logjam of the Hillary Step. Technically it’s no K2 but it has its issues. Obviously.

    Is this what Douglas wanted to talk about?

  266. 766
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Now you’re just trolling me

    No. I’m supporting you.

  267. 767
    douglas1102

    @ Ogvorbis

    “What is it you really want to say here? What is you actual goal?”

    Well for one, I want to find effective way to combat bigotry on-line through brainstorming with like minded individuals.

    I also consider making fun of someone’s intelligence (I worded that very badly before saying “insult someone’s intelligence”) to be very rude. Intelligence isn’t an accomplishment and shouldn’t be praised or made fun of <— my thoughts. However, (and it seems clear that FTB agrees) this can often be an effective means of persuasion especially it seems with bullies. So, where do you draw the line? What should we consider "fair game"? Anything goes? Or should there be lines drawn?

    Your thoughts? (lets finish this before the next comment please)

  268. 768
    douglas1102

    @ Rev 766

    Riiiiiight…. (that was quite clever actually, I lol’d)

  269. 769
  270. 770
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Your thoughts? (lets finish this before the next comment please)

    For some situations, calmly explaining works well. For others, insults work well. Sometimes abuse works. Sometimes using a person’s quotes to damn them works. Sometimes endless repetition works. There are no hard and fast rules for me except no threats, no ablist insults, no gendered insults, no racist insults. I feel free to insult someone’s writings, someone’s inability to grok the next step in what they have written. For me, the line is at certain insults — those that use part of who someone is rather than how they are acting — are over the line.

    This is just me. Others may differ.

  271. 771
    chigau (違う)

    douglas1102

    Intelligence isn’t an accomplishment and shouldn’t be praised or made fun of <— my thoughts.

    I have a three-digit IQ!!!!1!!

  272. 772
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Well for one, I want to find effective way to combat bigotry on-line through brainstorming with like minded individuals.

    Then I suggest you try a Middle School, which would be in-line with your efforts so far. Including your inability to advance your argument…

  273. 773
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Dougie, can I call you Dougie?…

    Now that we’ve all moved past that embarrassing censorship kerfluffle, what topic has you all feistied up today?

  274. 774
    douglas1102

    @ Nerd 772

    I said “Like-minded” not “similar education” Unless of course you’re talking “mind-set” if which case I may agree.

  275. 775
    douglas1102

    @ Rev 773

    We’re doing it now, pay attention.

  276. 776
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Melt-Banana

  277. 777
    PZ Myers

    NEW THREAD.

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