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Jan 11 2013

[Lounge #395]

babysquid2

This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. Baby squid demands that you obey it. You will ooobeeeey it NOOOOOOOOOOW.

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread

719 comments

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  1. 1
    cicely

    All hail Hypnotoadbaby squid….
    -

  2. 2
    Inaji

    Ohhhhhh, itsy bitsy hypnosquid…d’aaaaaaw.

  3. 3
    ck

    All glory to the hypnosquid!

  4. 4
    chigau (違う)

    I don’t want to be first.
    So I hope I aten’t.
    What are we talking about?
    [dam'. baby squids are cute.]

  5. 5
    chigau (違う)

    further to my #4
    even though what I see as their brain is probably their gut-sac

  6. 6
    feralboy12

    Yeah, he’s cute. I especially like how you can see his brain.

  7. 7
    Inaji

    feralboy12:

    Yeah, he’s cute.

    Or she.

  8. 8
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Is that brain, innards, or ink-sac that I’m seeing?

  9. 9
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Baby squid: it’s what’s for dinner.

  10. 10
    Dutchgirl

    Vegan cooking almost done, a day of sunshine fading into cool night, happy ratsies to keep me company. That is all.

  11. 11
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    WMDKitty: that is a sac all right…of another kind.
    (I think I may be in heat)

  12. 12
    Inaji

    My happy rats are busy dining on plates of freshly steamed corn and a large bowl of chocolate ice cream.

  13. 13
    chigau (違う)

    Caine #12
    pictures please
    Like, you can do that one handed, right?
    Shirley the rats can help.

  14. 14
    Inaji

    Chigau, I’ll try. :D

  15. 15
    Inaji

    Chigau, check Rattitude.

  16. 16
    chigau (違う)

    Caine
    squeee!

  17. 17
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Gave Gracie a good sized pinch of catnip — this should be interesting.

    I’m working on my own good sized pinch of… erm… “catnip” (if you know what I mean), so… yeah.

  18. 18
    vaiyt

    Why are baby squid so cute? It’s not just a small squid. The eyes are big, the tentacles are stubby and the whole body is more rounded. It’s like it was designed to be adorable!

  19. 19
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    I got nothing. The baby squid wins.

  20. 20
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Maybe I have a new something…

  21. 21
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    … and maybe I don’t?

  22. 22
    chigau (違う)

    IJoe
    stop messing with our heads

    poor kitteh
    She just tried to sit on my lap but I’m wearing the nylon sweatpants.
    Back to the heating pad.

  23. 23
    chigau (違う)

    Improbable Joe
    Are you OK with ‘IJoe’?
    There are so many variants of ‘joe’ hereabouts and sometimes I can’t spell ‘Improbable’.

  24. 24
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    chigau:

    “IJoe” is fine, and I find “iJoe” to be funny in a “mocking of Apple-branding” sort of way. If people just call me Joe that’s cool too, although I accept that the name is too common to always be thrown around that way and maintain clarity.

  25. 25
    ednaz

    All Hail Mighty Squidling!
    -

    Caine – Thanks for the *squee* pictures. I wanted to ask – What do the ratties think of the glurp glurp gullump?
    -

    IJoe it is! : )

  26. 26
    chigau (違う)

    ednaz
    If you hurry to your USB there might be a wee dram of rum…

  27. 27
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    Congrats on the b-day & nym fix, Oggie, and the guitar, iJoe.
    (iJoe! LOL, I had to use it.)

    Would it be too mean to suggest starting a twitter campaign to consult Renee on any proposed purchase? Really? OK, OK, I won’t. We have just gone out and ordered a 2m long TV stand/media storage unit – custom built in Tassie Oak. Nice. And only $200 more than the cheap nasty plywood & particle board model from the discount furniture store. 4-6 weeks to Greater Loungeroom Tidiness.

  28. 28
    Lofty

    Ooooh, Tassie Oak. Noice! (Not to be confused with Tassie Smoke.)

  29. 29
    mildlymagnificent

    Yaaaay. Minormagnificent #1 has paid the deposit on a wedding venue.

    And now we’re shopping for an engagement present – party in a few weeks. And I’m invited to accompany her to one of those bridal expos. My crook back and sore feet might suddenly get terribly burdensome if I find tracking around just one too many of those tacky displays gets me a bit tetchy. Thankfully we’re not expected to pay for a.n.y.t.h.i.n.g because the happy couple are control freaks extraordinaire about what they want.

  30. 30
    ednaz

    Hee hee! Thanks, Chigau!

  31. 31
    rq

    Good morning!
    Today I get to practice being professionally sociable to four ‘Murcan visitors because I know English. I’ve never done this before; I have nerves. What if they don’t like me??

    ednaz
    Thanks for the writing compliment. ;) It happens from time to time! And yes, it was a very educational seminar. It’ll be my gold standard for seminars, especially for next week.

    Improbable Joe
    Nice guitar (thanks Grandma indeed!). *thumbs up* When do we get to hear it in action?

    Tony
    The basic rule to wearing a fedora is to wear it with flair. ;) And I don’t know about heat, but I think going out (after a long period of not going out) is full of jittery excitements and feelings of anticipation (in a good way). :)

  32. 32
    rq

    Alethea
    You bought an entire TV??? The shaaame!

    mildlymagnificent
    Hooray for the minormagnificent+SO, and also hooray for having things taken out of your hands. The relief! And good luck bearing with the expos. At least it’s not an annual/monthly thing! ;)

  33. 33
    PatrickG

    Warning: This post will ramble and not be particularly on point. It’s late, but it’s something I’ve been sort of shy about asking for help with and that’s a silly reason not to ask for help.

    Short version: Volunteering for a women’s reproductive health organization in Kentucky. Volunteering takes form of website design and management. Not experienced with online technical skills in the service of social/human issues. Want to tap into atheist/humanist circles to help it. Am fairly new to the online scene and have been daunted in trying to find resources.

    Long version:

    My partner is on the board of an organization that provides direct services to women facing obstacles to reproductive health access, no small thing in Kentucky. They also work in partnership with domestic violence and trans*-friendly organizations. They were in need of someone to help them develop a better presence online for both fundraising and client services, and since I have the requisite technical skills… well, just a natural fit!

    It recently occurred to me that, y’know, I read a great deal about these issues in the community here, and why the fuckity fuck am I not tapping into said community for help with things I’m not good at?

    The things I’m not good at are legion. :) But the three issues I’m hoping to find help with are these:

    1) I haven’t had much experience in “commercializing” websites, or linking them to social media, or maximizing search accessibility, etc. My experience lies more in in-house technical sites. If people with knowledge would be willing to point me to guides that are a bit more … useful … than the crap that comes up with my inefficient googling… I’m not trying to sell a Plushie doll, I’m trying to maximize the online presence of a social justice organization. I would happily accept instruction on how to do this effectively.

    2) Design issues…. no, you don’t get to know who I’m volunteering for (yet)! I put up the crappiest website ever in a very short time. I’m working on an expanded site with greater functionality, which will also be more aesthetically pleasing, but unless you’re willing to help with logos/graphics (one of my weak points), professional pride and sheer embarrassment prevent me from letting you see the current site. They needed something for a letter writing campaign (i.e. venue for donations), I threw up something quickly. That said, I’m weak with graphics, and the person they’ve volunteer-contracted with is being extremely slow with product. I’ve contacted a few people, but if anybody out there is a wizard at this kind of thing and has some free time…

    3) I’d really like to find a way to tap into the incredibly fabulous community that I’ve found online. I confess I’m really confused about how to approach this. This organization is going to deal with a population that’s vastly religious (source: rural Kentucky, QED). I’ve read so many threads about trying to bring secular groups into practical humanitarian work and I confess that when faced with this personally I’m just baffled. I’ve talked about it with the people in this group, and they’re pretty sure that any kind of link to the dreaded baby-eaters (my words, not theirs) would be highly detrimental to providing support to women in crisis. They’re the ones doing the work, they know, so that’s that, but if there’s a way to get support for this group from atheist/humanist/secular sources beyond the scope of what I’m asking here personally (i.e. items #1 and #2), I’d very much appreciate suggestions (by which I mean I’d pass them on to the organizers — this is their thing, not mine).

    So yeah, this is something I really care about, and would really, really, really, really, really appreciate help with. I want to reiterate that this group focuses on reproductive health access and provides transport, travel expenses/lodging, a hotline, access to alternative housing services in cases of domestic violence, and so forth. The work they’re doing is so vastly important, and I’m thrilled to be a part of it, in whatever meager way I can. Any help would be appreciated.

    And apologies for the wall of text.

  34. 34
    ednaz

    Hi rq!
    I have read your posts for quite a while and you always sound like a very nice person. So I can’t imagine you having any trouble with your guests.
    BUT…
    Even if they don’t “like” you, you’re helping them, so I would think they would at least be polite and civil, right?
    As I said earlier, I can’t imagine your guests not liking you.
    I hope this came across right. *crossing fingers and holding thumbs*

    -

    Also, I look forward to your next (seminar) report. : D

  35. 35
    ednaz

    Turning in early tonight. Goodnight All.

  36. 36
    rq

    Goodnight ednaz, thanks for the words! ;)
    At least it’s a professional setting. :)

  37. 37
    Inaji

    Ednaz:

    I wanted to ask – What do the ratties think of the glurp glurp gullump?

    Nothing. The *gloooomp* is out in one of the front rooms. The ratses are in my studio with access to the annex and bathroom. They aren’t anywhere near the *glooomp*.

    The *gurgle* *glomp* *glooomp* *gurgle* is all over with now, anyway.

  38. 38
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    rq, we didn’t but a TV, we bought a piece of furniture – a set of shelves and drawers. To store DVDs, and to put the TV & associated gadgets on. I’m sure Renee makes do with bricks and boards.

  39. 39
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    * We didn’t BUY a TV.

  40. 40
    ednaz

    Oh, rq, I have to fix that sentence!

    I have read your posts for quite a while and you always sound like a very nice person.

    That should read:
    I have read your posts for quite a while and you are clearly a very nice person.

    -

    I rarely post ’cause I’m sure I’m gonna screw things up. AArrgghh.

    -

    Hope you understand. Hope I didn’t make it worse.

  41. 41
    ednaz

    O.K. Turning in again.

  42. 42
    rq

    ednaz
    No worries, I got your meaning, and keep posting! :) No better way to learn.

    Alethea
    Sorry, my bad, misread your post. But *gasp* real furniture!
    I doubt she even goes as far as bricks, though. Probably finds the nearest rocks and fallen sticks for support. Oh wait, is electricity a luxury, too?

  43. 43
    rq

    Skeleton should so be the Latvian national sport.

  44. 44
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Good morning
    Went to see the Hobbit again yesterday. We had the small cinema all for ourselves (me and some friends) so we could make fun while watching. Still like it, but the Elves were proving once again why they’re an evolutionary dead end. There’s armed guards standing all around Rivendell, but a bunch of heavily armed dwarves enter it unchallenged and are greeted by unarmed Lindir.
    Talking about “no nice things for poor people”, my dad really disappointed me yesterday. For a bit of background, there’s a city programm where women who have been unemployed for a longer time help old people and families with members with special needs. They don’T do stuff like cleaning or nursing, but like playing board games and simply watching folks. This is free for the families, the women get a bit more than just social security and “work experience”. So, “our” help for quite a while is a wonderful woman about my age with two kids who really has become a friend. So, when he told sister that after buying warm stuff for her kids she had no more money left for buying herself warm stuff sister dug up a few decent sweaters.
    What does my dad? Complain that “but she has one of those I-phones!”
    Ehm, no, she has a smartphone which was a gift from her boyfriend when he had still a job…

    Yay for paycheck, Tony

    Esteleth
    Yay for raise.

    +++

    Same with caraway, dill,…

    Nasty stuff, both of it.

    Joe
    Cooooooooooooool

    Alethea
    I was thinking about something like that, too, and then I thought that no, that’s harassment and we’re better than that. And I guess that’s the differnce between good people and Renee: We still have nasty thoughts, but we don’t do it.

    Patrick G
    I’m sorry I can’t help, but you’re doing good.

    +++
    Also: Dragons for everybody
    I think you could easily make the eyes out of felt or buy “cat eyes” in a craft store.

  45. 45
    katenrala

    Why when a Christian lays out a logical proof for god, like the the Kalam Cosmological Argument, not the only logical proof they use, just one for example:

    1. Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
    2. The universe began to exist.
    3. Therefore, the universe must have a cause.

    How is it then that they can leap from that to say that not only is that first cause a god, but the specific Abrahamic God and even more specifically, the Christian version of that God?

    I’ve never perceived in a debate between atheists and Christians, online in forums or in videos, even when flat-out pressed by an atheist to justify the gigantic leap from the generic meaningless god/creator of the proof to the specific Christian God character the Christian explaining their leap. I know the real answer is that “you just gotta have faith” but that is so unsatisfying and pathetic for a response.

    Has anyone actually gotten a response or read or heard one from a Christian that isn’t the faith response when pressed to justify their leap from their proof to the god they believe the proof proves? What was the response you perceived?

  46. 46
    strange gods before me ॐ

    katenrala,

    Over in Thunderdome, we have a quarantined Christian by the name of joey. He’s been actively commenting recently, so you might be able to get a response out of him.

  47. 47
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    Has anyone actually gotten a response or read or heard one from a Christian that isn’t the faith response when pressed to justify their leap from their proof to the god they believe the proof proves? What was the response you perceived?

    Loosely speaking, yes. Jesus was the only prophet who claimed to BE God. So we know he was telling the truth.

  48. 48
    patterson

    Katenrala

    Or you could try over at Bad Catholic and you’re likely to get something along the lines of “Because the catholic god is the most perfect being that can be conceived of and if we can conceive of perfection then perfection must exist therefore the catholic god exists.”

    I think that’s pretty much their argument for anything.

    And, as this is the lounge and I am compelled by the baby squid to be nice, I have to say that they really are a bunch of lovely people.

  49. 49
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Katenrala/patterson

    Anselm’s Ontological Argument: Link here.

  50. 50
    katenrala

    @ 46 strange gods before me

    I don’t normally read the thunderdomes but I’ll check the next one to see if Joey pops up. Thank you.

    @ 47 Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven

    That answer would make my brains melt had they been made out of thinking chocolate instead of thinking meat. d:

    @ 48 patterson

    I’ve read a proof that was essentially what you said. It’s difficult for me to grasp that our fine individuals don’t notice the black hole in their proof. See, Godzilla is the most perfectist and has zilla + God as a name.

    Caine, Fleur du mal +

    I’d describe you as one of a few people on the internet as being “actively nice” to me even though what interations we’ve had have been limited; and I’ve been wondering if you’d like me to draw something for you.

    My favorite thing to draw is the figure with fantasy or sci-fi elements or such a vibe, even furry, and so would you be interested in a drawing of any fantasy or sci-fi characters you have or a soft-core nude, male or female of some type? I draw in US comic book influenced styles and mostly do lineart but coloring isn’t out of he question. I could do a fan-art image too if you’d rather like that. I offer this to be nice too and to hopefully help me get out of a drawing funk that depression has sunk me into since November.

    If you want to email me about the offer my email is my comment name @gmail.com.

  51. 51
    katenrala

    @49 theophontes (坏蛋)

    Thank you.

    I’m mainly interested not in the original proofs, but how Christians, preferably lay Christians, leap from a generic god entity many proofs posit or conclude with to their specific entity: like how does a god that could be any of an infinite variety of different undefined gods become their version of God and any stories of atheists here can share about the responses they’ve got from lay Christians?

  52. 52
    katenrala

    Off to bed for me. Perceive you all my morning. (:

  53. 53
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Was at one of my favorite beer bars yesterday and got into an argument with some schlub. After talking about a few things including me traveling in a few weeks to the Dominican Republic and needing to get a flu vaccination because I’d been slacking, well that opened the floodgates of dumb.

    More people die of the flu vaccine than the flu. Did you know?

    Chemotherapy is a scam. He knows because his wife died of cancer.

    He stays healthy because he doesn’t take any medicine except for aspirin.

    He was in the military and they all got vaccinated yet people still were getting sick. Because, anecdote!

    Big Pharma!

    I don’t put anything in my body that i don’t know exactly what is in it. Oh really, what’s in that Belgian wild ale you’re drinking there?

    sigh

  54. 54
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Rev BDC

    Chemotherapy is a scam. He knows because his wife died of cancer.

    people shouldn’t be allowed to participate in adult society until they understand the most basic stuff about chance, risk and probability.

  55. 55
    rq

    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Chemotherapy is a scam. He knows because his wife died of cancer.

    This is why, after chemo had done all it could, Husband’s mother was convinced by sister-in-law’s boyfriend that eating a teaspoon of jet fuel a day would cure her (because it cures everything, because anecdote). Woo.

    +++

    Wow. Turns out, Americans are people, too! That went well.

  56. 56
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Katenrala:
    I think it is due to years of religious indoctrination instilling the belief in the one, true Christian god. I rarely went to church as a kid, so this is mostly speculation, but I do not think many believers stop to consider (or even know of) all the other gods humans have created. That’s why in discussions of the truth of a specific religion, I often state “I do not believe in your god, nor the thousands of other gods humans have believed in, such as…”.

    ****
    Patrick:
    I wish I were able to help, but I lack the experience, skills, and knowledge. Your goals are admirable and to be commended.

  57. 57
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Sally
    I see you have been thoroughly lectured by our Best Feminist Ally Ever™ over at Almost Diamonds

  58. 58
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Giliell:
    Would you, by chance have a link for the above?

  59. 59
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Tony
    here.
    Please note that Stephanie has requested everybody to abstain from engaging him because apparently he has been too upset by people callin him out on his bullshit.

  60. 60
    Pteryxx

    Oglaf today on statistics in hell. ….ow my brain…

  61. 61
    Johnny Au Gratin

    PatrickG

    I’m in Louisville, and while I probably don’t have the strong skills that you are looking for, I do have some friends who have helped me with some web projects before and some friends who would certainly support your cause as I do. I’m not sure how much overlap there is as the web stuff hasn’t related to these sort of issues, but I can ask around. If I can effectively be of assistance, I’d like to help. Feel free to contact me at My nym (no spaces) at gmail dot com, or reply in comments.

  62. 62
    ChristineRose

    Having been a Christian who talked to other Christians about the ontological leap, what you usually get is something along these lines.

    Christianity (specifically the doctrine of redemption by divine sacrifice) makes sense. Other religions don’t make sense.
    Muhammad never claimed to be God, so he shouldn’t be taken seriously.
    Jesus claimed to be God, and mountains of evidence prove he was telling the truth.
    All the contradictions in the Bible are illusions–they are addressed on various websites.
    The Bible is proved divine over and over again by fulfilled prophecy.
    My life is wonderful; Jesus cured my cancer; the doctors told me I had only a 10% chance. This proves Jesus exists and does miracles.
    Other religions are sincere and maybe God will even forgive people for not being Christian, but Christianity is the true religion.

    This was very frustrating to me because it seems obvious that they are starting with the conclusion and working backwards. I started questioning the doctrine of redemption at about age seven. Statistics took a bit longer, and basic theology came next, and textual criticism sunk in around age 13.

  63. 63
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Urgh, fuck, somehow an entire bottle of pipe cleaner spilled in out teeny tiny larder. That’s one chloride smelling mess.
    OTOH, the floor needed cleaning anyway.

  64. 64
    rq

    Giliell
    Leave some porridge out. ;)

  65. 65
    Charles Thornton

    People are wondering who might replace the Rev’d Gigolo at the inauguration. I was wondering if the massed ranks of atheists might suggest that well known man of the cloth and FTB – Deacon Duncan?

    Just thinkin’ …

  66. 66
    ChristineRose

    Pipe cleaner as in stopped-up sink, or pipe cleaner as in smoking accessory? The later may be less dangerous, but at least with the former you have a chance of finding out what you have spread over the floor.

  67. 67
    dexitroboper

    This story is kind of funny, but the weirdest thing for me is: Why would someone working in a hospital have to wear a tuxedo?

  68. 68
    PatrickG

    Johnny Au Gratin:

    Thanks for the offer! I’ll contact you shortly.

  69. 69
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Christine Rose
    Pipe cleaner as in sink.
    It’s amazing how well you feel after a good puke…

  70. 70
    rq

    Giliell
    Depending on the reason for the puke. But I think I have to agree.

    +++

    Watching My Best Friend’s Wedding because it’s on TV. Aside from all the other things wrong with the movie, why – in romantic movies where guy-goes-to-get-girl – does the man (at the end) always end up with the girl that he wants, yet Julia Roberts, for all her wiles and manipulation, still gets shafted when it’s all about girl-trying-to-get-guy-back?
    I think I know the answer, but still… Why are men never convinceable that, no, really, I like the other guy better?
    (Questions mostly rhetorical.)

  71. 71
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    How about Four Weddings and a Funeral?

  72. 72
    LykeX

    For those who haven’t already seen it, this is quite funny, as well as relevant for topics that sometimes come up on this blog.

  73. 73
    x

    RevBDC;

    We sometimes visit Charleston (IIRC you live thereabouts). What is the name of this favorite beer bar you speak of? I always like to affect savoir faire when traveling, so little tidbits of knowledge like that are always welcome.

    Grand Cru, nominally a wine bar, is my favorite local spot in Baltimore, although Max’s, downtown, probably can’t be beat for selection. The Pratt Street Alehouse, on the other side of downtown, is my favorite brewpub.

    I’ll be tasting the Wookey Jack tonight. I’m quite looking forward to it, seeing as how the Black Cannon was so delicious.

  74. 74
    x

    Forgot to mention, Grand Cru has a rotating cask conditioned ale, tapped on Thursday when they open; when it’s gone it’s gone. I prefer to go there on Thursday or Friday, just to be sure, if I’m in that mood.

  75. 75
    rq

    Beatrice
    I have not seen that movie. But you have intrigued me; I’ll be looking into this!

    +++

    Also, good night!

  76. 76
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Hello.

    Hanging out in the PRT (People’s Republic of Threadruptia).

    Wife and I went for a drive today. Didn’t bring the camera because we were totally fogged in. Got up on the Pocono Plateau and (guess — go ahead, guess) . . . .

    Had lunch at Salad Works. Good chain.

    Am making turkey egg rolls (with ground turkey, garlic, ginger, sherry, soy sauce, Napa cabbage, celery, sweet peppers, onions) for dinner.

    Currently drinking a Saranac Black Bear Bock.

    Had a dream last night that was another walking away dream.

    TRIGGER WARNING

    I dreamt of my abuser and him forcing me and another scout into sex while he took photographs. I took my friend by the hand and we walked away. Of course, we were wearing our cub scout shirts, no pants, no underwear, no socks or shoes, but hell, its a dream, right? So we just walked away from our abuser.

    This is the second dream like this.

    So am I walking away from the problem? Am I putting it behind me? Am I ducking out on the ramifications of my abuse? Am I over-analyzing my brain taking a dump? No idea. But I woke up feeling happy.

    This is weird. And I really do feel uncomfortable feeling good.

    Anyway.

    Happy life.

  77. 77
    chigau (違う)

    Oggie
    I think you feeling good is good.

  78. 78
    Inaji

    Katenrala:

    I’d describe you as one of a few people on the internet as being “actively nice” to me even though what interations we’ve had have been limited; and I’ve been wondering if you’d like me to draw something for you.

    My favorite thing to draw is the figure with fantasy or sci-fi elements or such a vibe, even furry, and so would you be interested in a drawing of any fantasy or sci-fi characters you have or a soft-core nude, male or female of some type? I draw in US comic book influenced styles and mostly do lineart but coloring isn’t out of he question. I could do a fan-art image too if you’d rather like that. I offer this to be nice too and to hopefully help me get out of a drawing funk that depression has sunk me into since November.

    If you want to email me about the offer my email is my comment name @gmail.com.

    Wow. I would love to have a piece by you. As soon as I have tea and my brain is percolating, I’ll send off an email. Thank you. ♥

  79. 79
    Inaji

    I just heard from Edward Gemmer about Adam’s petition:

    I can’t sign that. The issue is that atheists are rude and disrespectful to each other on the internet. Atheists on Pharyngula are just as guilty as anyone else, which you allude to. The petition is just another excuse for one group to see their actions as fine and demonizing the same actions of people with whom they disagree. It is amazing the amount of hostility that has erupted between groups that for the most part agree on all the basic issues. I imagine this is why Protestants and Catholics battled for so long. Sigh…

    Man, it was nice to ban him from my blog.

  80. 80
    Inaji

    Katenrala, email sent.

  81. 81
    Owlmirror

    Recently reading about explosions, N-amino azidotetrazole, and the *gloop* *glurp* *gurgle* got me thinking:

    An explosion is something turning to gases very rapidly.

    Fermentation involves, among other things, part of the fermenting material turning to gas very slowly.

    Therefore, fermentation is basically a slow-motion explosion.

    Enjoy your reaction products!

  82. 82
    John Morales

    “slow-motion explosion” is an oxymoron.

  83. 83
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    “slow-motion explosion” is an oxymoron.

    Well, there are different rates of explosion (for instance, using two types of explosive lenses to make the pressure wave hit the Pu evenly).

    One of my fellow workers will sometimes do a slow-motion explosion.

  84. 84
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Heads up for the monitors. Reap has appeared under the moniker of “Ha ha” in the Curious about Bradley Manning? thread. Just more of his juvenile and obsessive bullshit.

    Meanwhile, the slymepitter sees this action as yet an other blow against the empire.

  85. 85
    Inaji

    Owlmirror:

    Enjoy your reaction products!

    We shall. Thank you!

  86. 86
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    “Fermentation may have been a greater discovery than fire.” — David Rains Wallace

  87. 87
    chigau (違う)

    Janine
    I sent an alert a few minutes ago.

  88. 88
    John Morales

    Janine, pretty sad it is to count coup by posting here, but it’s all he’s got.

    <shrug>

    I did note it in the Thunderdome when it was happening.

  89. 89
    PZ Myers

    Wow. Reap Paden really is a moron.

  90. 90
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    So am I walking away from the problem? Am I putting it behind me? Am I ducking out on the ramifications of my abuse? Am I over-analyzing my brain taking a dump? No idea. But I woke up feeling happy.

    It means you’re safe now, that you’re the one in control. That’s a good feeling.

  91. 91
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    John, the slymies like to think that the fact that they ban no one means that they support free expression. And that PZ is the “Chairman” who gives us our talking points. And that PZ is silenced by all of the PC feminists who do not allow for dissent.

    They are not the clearest thinkers.

  92. 92
    Inaji

    PZ:

    Wow. Reap Paden really is a moron.

    Aaaaand he keeps insisting on proving it.

  93. 93
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    PZ, did you watch that video?

  94. 94
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Therefore, fermentation is basically a slow-motion explosion.

    Enjoy your reaction products!

    The secret of grog…

  95. 95
    John Morales

    In the news: Legendary crossword setter reveals he’s dying in puzzle

    Reverend Graham, 91, said it seemed to be the natural way to announce his news and he was touched by people’s reaction.

  96. 96
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    John Morales

    Damn. Where can I get a copy of that crossword puzzle, anyway?

  97. 97
    PZ Myers

    Janine: Yes, with growing amusement. My enemies love to make themselves ridiculous, tasteless, and repulsive, don’t they?

  98. 98
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    They are not the clearest thinkers.

    Too obvious of a straight line. Must resist…

  99. 99
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Making some spicy harissa and carrot dip with grilled naan for this party I’m going to later. I’m not sure it will make it there.

  100. 100
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Just how did they get a camera into you home?

  101. 101
  102. 102
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    John Morales

    Thank you!

  103. 103
    John Morales

    Over the years, PZ has accrued quite a list of implacable nemeses.

  104. 104
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Damn, at times I can really be slow on the uptake. One of the heroes of the stymies, Hoggles, proudly engages in angry masturbation. Yet Reap just made a youtube video with help from his fellow slymies making the claim the PZ masturbates to; well, know with whom we are dealing with here.

    If I did not know any better, I would swear that this is prime duckspeak.

  105. 105
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Well.

    Hot mustard.

    My sinuses (sinae?) are now clear.

    The egg rolls were delicious. The ground turkey is indistinguishable from ground pork. And has less fat.

  106. 106
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Over the years, PZ has accrued quite a list of implacable nemeses.

    I first made this joke a few years ago and I will repeat it. It is like a gathering of nemeses of the Aqua Teen Hunger Force.

  107. 107
    ChristineRose

    @ Ogvorbis: Uncomfortable because I relly do feel good.

    Lucid dreaming. It has been recommended to me as a treatment. Typically you keep a dream journal and plan the endings.

    My nightmares have never been quite so coherent though. Also, I’d be tempted to summon a pair of magical AK-47s instead of walking away.

  108. 108
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Over the years, PZ has accrued quite a list of implacable nemeses.

    Can anyone think of a PZed nemesis who has not resorted to either lying or cherry picking in attempts to show PZed is a hypocrite, or destroying atheism, or any of the other bullshit claims out there? Have any been honest in their attacks?

  109. 109
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Also, I’d be tempted to summon a pair of magical AK-47s instead of walking away.

    I think that if my dream went that direction, I would be completely and totally freaked out.

  110. 110
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    I think that if my dream went that direction, I would be completely and totally freaked out.

    No kidding. I’m already Oneirophobic, that sort of shit I don’t need.

  111. 111
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Odd. For the last week, I have been getting arabic language spam.

  112. 112
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Thank, you, Caine. I just learned something new today. Which means I am alive and thinking.

  113. 113
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    Oh no! Not Araucaria! Such an awesome setter. Still, I suppose he’s 91 so one can’t complain too much.

  114. 114
    Owlmirror

    “slow-motion explosion” is an oxymoron.

    Can an oxymoron fling mash to the ceiling? Hah, no, it cannot!

    Therefore, your argument is invalid.

  115. 115
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    Thank, you, Caine. I just learned something new today. Which means I am alive and thinking.

    I’m oneirophobic and hypnophobic. A legacy from my past and the ones that will always be with me. The only way I sleep is to stay up until complete exhaustion takes over or using specific, heavy meds. I generally stay up. As it stands, I also have absurd requirements for when I do try to sleep (I have to be alone, in a separate space, with absolutely no one entering that space while I’m not conscious.)

  116. 116
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Ymaelodi Â’r Ymylon-Super Furry Animals

  117. 117
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Caine:

    I’m lucky. Most of the time (unless I am waiting for a shoe to drop) I can sleep almost anywhere. Though curled up with Wife is definitely my favourite.

    Sometimes I am scared to go to sleep because I know that I was triggered during the day and I know it’ll come home to roost at night.

    Hugs to you.

  118. 118
    Inaji

    Thank you, Ogvorbis. Mister is a can sleep anywhere type. He actually fell asleep while showering once. :D

  119. 119
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    rq,

    How about Four Weddings and a Funeral?

    My ex watched that every night for about a month straight. It’s easily in the top ten “lead characters I want to strangle” and the story is tepid with a megadose of fridge horror. Apparently there’s some wonderful point to the movie I’m missing.

  120. 120
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Oggie, I’m glad to see you’re doing well. That’s why I’m going to allow last night’s vicious attack on the Official SpokesGuitar pass. :)

    Good news on the diet/exercise front. I don’t know how heavy I got there in Virginia the year I lived there, but in the five months from when I got a VA drivers licence until today when I got a New Mexico licence, I’ve lost enough weight that it is VERY noticeable in the pictures.

  121. 121
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Manzinita-Dave Alvin

  122. 122
    rorschach

    Err, this is embarrassing, I’m such a lousy gamer. Anyone know how to kill the wounded frostbite spider in the “Golden Claw” quest in Skyrim?

  123. 123
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    rorschach, please let me help with your gaming dilemma.

    First thing you do is make sure you’re playing an actual game, not that Skyrim crap. Second, play the hell out of the actual game. :)

  124. 124
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    rorschach

    Here: The Golden Claw

    The UESP can meet all your Elder Scrolls needs, man.

    IJoe

    To each their own, man. Skyrim lets me get out of my (admittedly broken) head and into a whole other world where, instead of sitting here on my tail in a wheelchair, I’m out adventuring and slaying dragons and doing adventure-y things.

  125. 125
  126. 126
    opposablethumbs

    But I woke up feeling happy.

    Sounds good to me. I think it’s wonderful.

  127. 127
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    WMDKitty

    Just teasing… those sorts of games always seem like sort of work to me though. You have to sort of… know stuff, and think about things?

  128. 128
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    iJoe:

    Fender? Hell, I’ve got four of those.

    On my car.

    I’ll stick with My Favourite martin.

  129. 129
    Hekuni Cat, MQG

    rorschach:

    Anyone know how to kill the wounded frostbite spider in the “Golden Claw” quest in Skyrim?

    It’s been a while, but I think we killed it by keeping well back–preferably just on the other side of a doorway too small for the spider to get through–and shooting it with a bow. Poisoning your arrows also helps a lot in most circumstances.

  130. 130
    Hekuni Cat, MQG

    Ogvorbis – Happy Birthday! (I know I’m a day late, but it’s the thought that counts, right?)

  131. 131
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    (I know I’m a day late, but it’s the thought that counts, right?)

    Haven’t you gotten the memo? We’re not supposed to think. We just mindlessly parrot PZed’s ideas.

  132. 132
    Hekuni Cat, MQG

    cicely:

    Defining species by their Alignment is so limiting.

    Also, *pouncehug*

  133. 133
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Jeez, Oggie… are we going to wave our peckers/pecker-surrogates at each other? Because with this crowd, we should absolutely consider charging admission. :)

    Martins are fine guitars, nothing to sneeze at. I prefer Taylors mostly because I’m a bigger fan of the concert/auditorium style guitar rather than a dreadnaught, except for this one incredible Martin that LOOKS like a Taylor and costs like $3000 and I would totally sell your car to make it my own. :)

  134. 134
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    IJoe

    Skyrim is like an interactive “choose your own adventure” mega-novel. Yeah, there have been times when I’ve had to just put down the controller and “walk” away for a while because something was getting annoying or frustrating.

    But there have been books that were like that, too, with the “walking away for a bit because of XYZ that bothers me.” (the “Twilight” saga was like this, because Edward is so. clearly. abusive. with the watching Bella sleep (creepy), manipulating her emotions and affecting her decisions (using the promise of marriage to get her to stay human just a bit longer; running off to Italy and nearly committing suicide because “it was for her own good” (thus alerting the Volturi (the Big Bad) that a mortal was in the know, and prompting Bella to do ever more dangerous things (and very nearly dying from her stupid stunts))), telling her to stay away from the Natives (controlling who she has contact with)…

    And yet, despite all that stalkeriffic abuse-y shit, I was compelled to finish the series. Partly because I’m really obsessive-compulsive about book series — I am incapable of just reading partway through. And partly because… you know that thing where you don’t want to look, but you can’t help yourself? It’s like that.

    What disturbs me the most is that we’re holding that up as a “romantic” ideal (along with the “keep pursuing her until she says yes” trope), effectively grooming young women for abuse.

  135. 135
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    iJoe:

    Mine is a 1964 D-35 that belonged to my dad. The sound is so rich and deep it can even make me sound good.

  136. 136
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    G’night, all.

    Gotta head for bed. Tomorrow is Monday, after all.

  137. 137
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    WMDKitty:

    I had a snarky one-sentence answer for you on that, something along the lines of “I don’t like choices”… but the truth is, I DON’T like choices, or at least not too many choices. I don’t like sandbox games, or games with too many side quests, because I’m trying to relax and check out from making choices rather than putting myself in a situation where I need to make a million more choices.

    Although… my favorite game of last year involved choices. I’d recommend that everyone here with the least interest in FPS games give Spec Ops: The Line a shot. It is probably my favorite game since Portal 2… it gives you choices, and then makes you pay for them with your soul. …ok, that last bit was a little dramatic, but so is the game. In a good way, good enough that I’d like to play it again, although nothing can really top the first time you play through it, and see the moral lines that the game is drawing throughout.

  138. 138
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    G’night Oggie.

  139. 139
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    ‘Night, Ogvorbis — sleep well.

  140. 140
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    So is there an official list of PZs nemeses? I’m curious how well they stack up against Batman or Spider-Mans rogues galleries.

  141. 141
    Steven Brown: Man of Mediocrity

    Hey gang…
    Anyone else keep getting forced randomly onto what appears to be a mobile version of the website?

  142. 142
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Hey Tony! I guess you’re at work?

    At least comic book villains have powers and costumes and interesting origins and cool names. The Peez has a rogue’s gallery consisting of a bunch of boring middle-class white guys with standard college degrees and the most interesting name just substitutes zeros for the letter “O”. Their only power is being aggressively and publicly stupid across multiple social media outlets. It is one step DOWN from being “The Fart-inator” and being equipped with footie PJs with a butt flap, a can of beans, and a microphone hooked up to a Radio Shack karaoke machine.

  143. 143
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    stevenbrown,

    That keeps happening to a lot of people randomly. The folks running the site are apparently aware and working on a solution, but if it goes on another week I’m going to personally lose my motherFUCKING SHIT OVER IT!!

    *deep breaths*… it is being worked on, as far as I know.

  144. 144
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    stevenbrown, Ijoe

    That happened a few times before I switched everything over to the Chrome browser. Haven’t seen it since. (I think there’s a bug in the latest Firefox release, because it was giving me all kinds of hell with Yahoo mail, too.)

  145. 145
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    IJoe:
    One shiny Internetz for #142!
    ****
    Now I am imagining an FtB video game with PZ, Greta, Jason, Stephanie, Ophelia, and Jen. It’s one of them level games where you fight a boss at the end. You get to pick which blogger to play, and each has their own unique abilities. I cannot figure out who the final boss would be. Reap? Vacula? Abbie Smith? Thunderf00t? One of the levels, of course, has the player venturing into the Slymepit to rescue a fellow blogger. Tee hee, the visual I have of PZ dressed as Link is quite funny. Somehow, someway Rebecca Watson must do a cameo to say those four famous words.

  146. 146
    cicely

    We got now-exDiL moved out, and into her new apartment, before the wintery mix arrived. Yay!
    -
    I think I’ll go with iJoe.
    :)
    And shouldn’t there be some sorta black-silhouette-thingy of iJoe rockin’ out with the Spokesguitar?
    Or am I thinking of the wrong brand? I’m kinda tech-toy detail impaired.
    -

    This story is kind of funny, but the weirdest thing for me is: Why would someone working in a hospital have to wear a tuxedo?

    And the obvious next question is, why would anyone expect a dollar store to offer valet parking???
    -
    Ogvorbis, congrats on the Persistence of Feeling Good. I’m sure the discomfort will pass.
    :)
    -

    Mister is a can sleep anywhere type. He actually fell asleep while showering once. :D

    Hopefully he wasn’t hurt? Slippery surfaces….
    -
    Hekuni Cat
    *pouncehugback*
    -

  147. 147
    Tabun

    Although… my favorite game of last year involved choices. I’d recommend that everyone here with the least interest in FPS games give Spec Ops: The Line a shot.

    That was a very interesting game. The gameplay itself wasn’t particulary enjoyable, but the plot was easily one of the best I’ve seen in a game. Pretty disturbing in parts as well.

  148. 148
    PZ Myers

    Unfortunately, my nemeses are all lame and pathetic.

  149. 149
    Inaji

    Cicely:

    Hopefully he wasn’t hurt? Slippery surfaces….

    In fairness, he and his crew had been sent to do some *fix it! fix it! fix it! NOW!* work in Philly and had been working around the clock for over 2 days. When they got back to their hotel, he wanted to shower before falling face first into bed. Nice thought and all, but he was barely in the shower before he started snoozing. He woke up as he was falling, and clutched the shower curtain. He broke all the curtain rings on his way down. He was fine, though. Got to make an interesting call to the desk to request a new shower curtain. :D

  150. 150
    strange gods before me ॐ

    It’s obvious.

    Final boss is John Kwok.

  151. 151
    Inaji

    PZ:

    Unfortunately, my nemeses are all lame and pathetic.

    Yes…but who says you have to stick to reality in game creation?

  152. 152
    Inaji

    SG:

    Final boss is John Kwok.

    Uh oh.

    :holds up tentacles in arcane position to ward off Kwak appearances:

  153. 153
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Does any one want to point out to the big boss man that he really should not use “lame” like that?

  154. 154
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Lose to Kw*k, you lose all your facebook friends.

  155. 155
    Inaji

    Janine:

    Does any one want to point out to the big boss man that he really should not use “lame” like that?

    Sure. Hey, PZ! Lame, when used in an insulting manner is ableist language and should be avoided. I argued against this at one point, and was gently hammered into the ground.

  156. 156
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ katenrala

    like how does a god that could be any of an infinite variety of different undefined gods become their version of God and any stories of atheists here can share about the responses they’ve got from lay Christians?

    I suspect it is generally through an accident of birth. They were born into a community that emphasises whatever it is they claim to believe.

    Which leaves the question: “What about people who convert to a religion?” This is a question that is a little harder to answer, but has been dealt with in quite some detail by market researchers (yup, those boffins who try to work out who will change from Pepsi to Coke, and the like). Though some people are inured to conversion, some will readily do so. This independent of wether the product in question is cthonic or sugary!

  157. 157
    Inaji

    Theophontes:

    Which leaves the question: “What about people who convert to a religion?”

    Conversion is an interesting study, when it’s someone who is already religious switching teams, so to speak. Generally, it’s a matter of the different religion fulfilling some wished for spirituality, which isn’t being found to satisfaction in the first religion. A fair amount of conversions are done due to marriages and breeding, and in a lot of those cases, people seem to view religions as fairly interchangeable.

  158. 158
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    Ogvorbis
    Great to hear that the feeling better continues.
    Caine
    *hugs* You have my sympathies. Both the people I live with have similar problems, although the details of what’s needed for sleep vary.

  159. 159
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Ogvobis

    So am I walking away from the problem? Am I putting it behind me? Am I ducking out on the ramifications of my abuse? Am I over-analyzing my brain taking a dump? No idea. But I woke up feeling happy.

    IMHO (n=1): This sounds very good. What you can try, is to start willfully influencing your dreams/nightmares by getting consciously involved in them. When you dream, say to yourself that you are dreaming. Recall then that you can control your dreams. Don’t wake up (this happens too easily), but rather summon someone (rather than Christina Rose’s AK47) who you trust, if need be, to help you face down what/who it is that is frightening you.

    Before you go to sleep, assume that you will dream, and that the subject of your dreams will be the nightmare. Prepare for that. Tell yourself what you are going to do. If you dream of something else, try involving yourself anyway. You will feel empowered realising you have the control, and it is good practice.

    Is this woo? Not at all, it is something you can do with little practice, and it does help. You have already started to do this subconciously, in your dream, by removing yourself from the problem. It appears already to be working.

    Hals- und Beinbruch!

  160. 160
    Inaji

    Dalillama:

    Caine
    *hugs* You have my sympathies.

    Thank you. ♥

    I’m now having the fun of dealing with a part of the brain insistently ordering me to RUN! FLEE! NOW! along with this almost physical feeling of deep dread from having talked about it briefly. Just a bowl of cherries, being all fucked up. Yeesh.

  161. 161
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    Fuck. I have the evening free (although it’s really no longer evening) and I really want to get out and hang out and have a few drinks with someone but NO ONE I KNOW seems to not have plans or illness. >.>

    Any suggestions? What do “normal” people do in this kind of situation?

  162. 162
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Who is John Kwok?

  163. 163
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    I wonder why some people remember their dreams while others (like me) seldom do (when I do, it’s fragments here or there).

  164. 164
    Inaji

    Tony, do a search. I’m sure you can find all you want to know at the Pharyngula wiki. It exists for a reason, you know.

  165. 165
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    PZ owes Kwok a Leica…….

  166. 166
    thunk: turmite city

    Hi all. Weird and cool stuff happened.

    in re dreams:

    I don’t have memorable dreams most days, but on certain occasions, they are extremely long, detailed*, vivid, and have at least some form of storyline. Usually, those examples are lucid (or they eventually get to be), but it’s often hard to fight the predetermined course of events (like some sort of tug of war on a body part or object). They’re also very visual, and sort of like movies, with me sometimes sitting back and watching, or sometimes controlling the flow of events.

    *detailed to the point of having warning signs saying “This water is at a temperature of 95 degrees C, and if you cannot get to the edge of the pool in 14 seconds, do not jump in”.

  167. 167
    thunk: turmite city

    Caine:

    Falling asleep in the shower is surprisingly common at my school. One of my friends nearly did so this morning, almost missing an event xe had to go to.

  168. 168
    Inaji

    Thunks:

    Falling asleep in the shower is surprisingly common at my school.

    Are ya all being worked to death? I don’t think it should be common. Yikes.

  169. 169
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Azkyroth

    “What do normal people do in this situation?”

    …you’re asking us?

    I wouldn’t know “normal” if it came up and bit me in the ass!

  170. 170
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    Caine
    I actually can’t find anything on that topic on the Pharyngula wiki, although some Googling seems to indicate that it’s a combination of time between REM periods and awakening and the mind simply not paying enough attention during the dream to retain it. I also don’t recall dreams at all, Tony.

  171. 171
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Dalillama

    John Kwok is, apparently, this guy.

  172. 172
    Inaji

    Dalillama:

    I actually can’t find anything on that topic on the Pharyngula wiki

    Oh FFS. It’s right here. That’s what Tony was asking about. I don’t know what you’re talking about.

  173. 173
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    Caine
    I’m sorry. I interpreted your #164 as a response to his #163, not #162.

  174. 174
    Jafafa Hots

    Whew.

    Had a tiring day burning bridges.

  175. 175
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    Caine, it sounds as if you’d like a bed-cupboard with doors you could lock.

  176. 176
    katenrala

    @ Caine, Fleur du mal +

    You have adorable rats. I once had one, she was too cute to allow her to become someone’s snake feeder rat, so I picked her up even though I had no intention of getting a rat when I went to the pet store. They’re very smart, loving creatures.

    Replied.

  177. 177
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    Well, there are at least non-autistic people here. It was worth asking. >.>

  178. 178
    Jafafa Hots

    I have a soft spot for mammals.

  179. 179
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Azkyroth

    We’re all mad, here…

  180. 180
    katenrala

    @ Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven

    You’re autistic? Awesome. (:

  181. 181
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Caine:
    I haven’t used the Paryngula wiki much (and never for a person), so I didn’t think to check that. I have done so now.

  182. 182
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Thunk:
    Good to hear from you. I hope all is well.

  183. 183
    Inaji

    Markita Lynda:

    Caine, it sounds as if you’d like a bed-cupboard with doors you could lock.

    No, that would be problematic. I have locks, don’t use them. It’s more to the point that I not be trapped, in any sense.

    Katenrala:

    They’re very smart, loving creatures.

    Agreed, all the way. Off to check email.

  184. 184
    Inaji

    Jafafa Hots:

    Had a tiring day burning bridges.

    Oh? May I have a story, please?

  185. 185
    katenrala

    Bleach is on.

    I don’t get it.

    It’s just stuff happening, and then more stuff happening, but the ultimate why that contextualizes everything has never been presented.

    I don’t know why a story teller would write stuff about stuff happening with no rhyme or reason or end in sight but the possible end of cancellation, creator boredom, or burn-out.

    Drawing tarot cards for one’s own amusement-reading are good for one’s inspiration sometimes if others here are creators experiencing a block too.

  186. 186
    mildlymagnificent

    Fun at the cinema last night. It’s been a loooong time since we went on a Satdy nite and were in a completely full theatre. We saw Quartet. And the audience applauded at the end. The last time I remember clearly that in a movie was the original Star Wars. There was one other but I don’t remember the details.

    They also stayed to read the credits – because, apart from listening to a sublime recording of the quartet, you get to see all the details of the real musician performers who had roles in the film. From a bloke who played trumpet in Frank Sinatra’s band through to someone who accompanied a local choir for a few years in the 40s?50s? as well as the opera singers and other stage performers. (They didn’t include any movie or tv credits though – we’d still be there now if they’d done that.)

  187. 187
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Good morning.

    Dreams: I’m constantly amazed by the fact that I have neither problems falling asleep nor do I usually have nightmares (after I kicked the evil twin out). School and college wander in and out of them, sometimes positively, sometimes negatively (having to sit a maths exam again without any preparation whatsoever is horrible.)

  188. 188
    rq

    Mornings, too.
    My latest nightmare consisted of me typing a comment here (and I can’t remember what, because on waking, I’m sure it was something as innocuous as ‘All animals are intelligent, except birds and dinosaurs’ (I’m pretty sure I said something about dinosaurs)), and then Pteryxx being very very angry with me and typing loudly at me and not letting me apologize. Glad I woke from that one!

    Otherwise, I have very vivid, story-line dreams that could be movies. My favourite was the animated one about Mr Flamingo who decided to go see who was living in the old empty-seeming house next door, and it was Mr Stork. Picture simple, unshaded drawings in bold colours, and top hats on Mr Flamingo and Mr Stork, and everyone speaking in polite British accents.

    +++

    The christian in this country is showing. The Saeima (parliament) building has a chapel. It’s apparently a christian chapel. They won’t let a hindu hold prayers there (though why he would want to, beats me), because this is a christian country and it should be kept that way. Outrage over this? Probably zero, besides some racist comments about coloured people wanting to take over the country and eat our culture.
    Currently trying to find our constitution to see if it has god or a christian god in it. I know our anthem is all about how god blesses this country. *sigh*

  189. 189
    AshPlant

    Pharyngulites, you’re basically the largest pool of intelligent people I know of. Do you mind if I pick your brains about something I’m writing? It involves relativistic space travel, and my extensive researches have revealed to me that..I cannot relativity. At all.
    Thankfully I’m not quite daft enough to revolve the whole story around something I don’t understand, but there are a couple of questions I really need to resolve, because while I’m taking several liberties with the technology I don’t want to try and mess with the fundamental fabric of spacetime. The majority of the story takes place in one locale, but first they need to get there…

    If anyone’s interested, I’ll synopsise the story and explain where I’m lacking.

    BTW, Azkyroth @119: What’s the fridge horror in Four Weddings and a Funeral? I’d never thought of it that way.

  190. 190
    rq

    Azkyroth
    Your alternative view of Four Weddings and a Funeral has also intrigued me. Fridge horror? Sounds very forensic.

  191. 191
    katenrala

    @ AshPlant

    Share. (:

    I write sci-fi too, and my current ‘verse has a no-faster-than-lightspeed rule, so relativity (though I don’t understand all it’s details either) is something I deal with from time to time.

  192. 192
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I haven’t watched Four Weddings and a Funeral in years, but I remember liking it. I had to look up what fridge horror is. Nothing I can remember from the movie fits the description.

  193. 193
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ AshPlant

    Let me try in one paragraph:

    Bounce a ball on the floor of a train. It goes down a distance, d and up in a certain time, t. Now do the same when the train is moving and it all appears as before. However, to a stationary outside observer, the ball is moving both forward with the train and up and down as before. You will see (relative to yourself) a trajectory that looks like this: | but the observer sees a trajectory that looks like this: V. All well and good. We understand this because you are moving at the speed of the train. But now it becomes interesting: Shine a light on the floor. The same thing occures, but because light moves at an absolute and constant velocity, c, both yourself AND the observer must percieve it as travelling at EXACTLY the same speed. Velocity is given as v=distance/time. But because the velocity of light is constant, distance and/or time must vary to account for the velocity (ie of the light beam) being the same for both observers.

  194. 194
    Matt Penfold

    I haven’t watched Four Weddings and a Funeral in years, but I remember liking it. I had to look up what fridge horror is. Nothing I can remember from the movie fits the description.

    Maybe there is some confusion with Curtis’s next film, Notting Hill, which did have a scene involving a fridge.

  195. 195
    John Morales

    You really only need to know the Lorentz factor.

  196. 196
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    PS: Just checking you can relative velocity? We can go through this in more detail before going on to Relativity. I feel I am about to be corrected in saying it is as simple as I have set out above. What is important is to realise just how incredible and outstanding, hell – even flabbergasting- the implications of this are. Both time and space are not fixed! They vary according to your velocity.

    Hafele and Keating went so far as to prove this works by experiment. They stuck atomic clocks on some jets and flew them around a bit. The differences in time with clocks left on earth showed that time is variable: Link here

  197. 197
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    Hey John, you are getting all mathematicky!

  198. 198
    AshPlant

    Welp, the story hinges around one bit that I do understand: time dilation. We have two ships following each other at a couple of centuries’ distance; settling ships heading to a different planet. The first one goes with minimal staffing, to build complexes, set up the settlement and do a bit of light terraforming in preparation for the one with all the settlers to arrive a generation or three later.

    The story is set rather more than Twenty Minutes Into The Future, so there’s:
    Genetic immortality so the crew can survive travelling for several hundred years
    Massive, lavish ships with plenty of space and resources to keep the crew occupied
    A.I running the technical aspects of the ship. TAIAP, ship and A.I are one.
    Ships have shielding and kinetic absorption technology to protect them from radiation and allow high acceleration
    And very efficient engines, plus massive one-shot deceleration-engine-complex, to allow them to accelerate to near-cee (I don’t know how near exactly) and then ‘brake’ unfeasibly fast when they arrive.

    (Basically all the expected problems with space travel have been handwaved :P but there is a greater point to most of these fantasy improvements)

    Anyway. What I’ve written so far follows the second ship encountering a problem, and having to stop unexpectedly somewhere along the line. The reason appears to be external, and remains mysterious as they sit floating, trying to figure it out. They either pick up an unexpected anomaly in the pings the first ship has been sending, or grab a distress signal, and follow it to find that the first ship has crash landed on a nearby planet. Presumably, they encountered the same issue as 2, but didn’t brake in time, and suffered catastrophic damage that allowed or forced them to limp to safety. So 2 follows to locate them – what other choice do they have?
    The crew of 1 have been there for centuries by the time they arrive. Or at least their descendants have. The ship is massively damaged, immovable and leaking radiation. If it wasn’t for all their genetic improvement, they’d be dead. Instead, they’re all mentally subnormal from generations of radiation damage and only live an average human lifespan. They don’t remember what they were. The titles of the crew survive as naming conventions. They live in a rusty, dilapidated subsistence-level village, on a barren planet that only barely has oxygen and water; scavenged from the machinery and fabric that was on the terraforming/settlement ship. They can’t move far away from the ship, because they need the remaining power it provides – they’ve run huge cables out of the flagging, damaged reactors – but the radiation it exudes is killing them. The inside of the ship is unliveable. And the main reactor is losing containment, but most of them don’t know that. And so ship 2′s problems are only beginning, as they orbit the planet and try to decide what to do…

    So the relativity issues are really only the setup for the main event. But I still need to know:
    1) Assuming I stick with the ‘accident in space’ explanation for the stops, what would be ship 2′s experience of the signals – daily ‘pings’, basically – from 1? Assuming that 1 hit the buffers, changed course to hit the nearest planet, and that the planet was less of a distance away than the distance between the two ships. So 1 reaches the planet before 2 crosses the radio shell of pings emitted since disaster. By the time 2 has to crash-stop, it’s inside…look, you know what? Time for question:

    2) Would it make my life significantly easier if ship 2 simply arrived at the previously specified destination for the two ships, to find that 1 has crashed and gone all to buggery instead of setting up their nice neat new city for them? If so, how much on-ship-time warning would they have via ping, given that there are two hundred years or so of pings from a stationary position, and ships travel at near-cee until the final few hours of their journey?

    3) How long would a 1500-odd light year journey take from inside a ship that could get up to, say, 0.95c fairly quickly? What’s a reasonable timeframe for acceleration to such a speed? I just need ballpark figures, really, but I can’t even figure that out meself.

    4) Anything else you think I’m doing egregiously wrong from what I’ve written here.

    5) What should I call ship 1, since the Hugo Gernsback is clearly out :P (I’ve got a name, but I thought I’d better acknowledge my inspiration…)

    I appreciate your patience with my ramblings.
    @katenrala in particular, this is why I prefer magic. Sooo much simpler to write. “How did that happen?” “Magic!” No rules required…

  199. 199
    rorschach

    @129,

    It’s been a while, but I think we killed it by keeping well back–preferably just on the other side of a doorway too small for the spider to get through–and shooting it with a bow.

    Yes, that worked!!! Was almost harder to kill the draugrs in the next room, actually!(until I realised I had lost my companion somewhere on the way) I was well on my way to the next quest, but had to go to work, damnit.

  200. 200
    AshPlant

    John @194: I’m afraid even that’s beyond me. I have been all over the pfft! and other simple explanations to try and figure this out meself, and while I get the general idea, the maths is too much for me. I don’t have the grounding, which is probably why I went for the humanities. It’s (ahaheehee!) all Greek to me, if you will (o the wit!). I’m basically just sticking to two definite, specific situations, and if I accidentally write any more space travel, I’ll just have to stop myself.

    theophontes @192: see, that’s what gets me. Why does light think it’s so special, huh? :P

  201. 201
    rq

    AshPlant
    Because light is what lets us visualize, I think. It’s the fastest form of perception we have (except for tachyon-based ESP, right), so it’s kind of the standard for perception, and thus for keeping time and things like that. Maybe if light travelled slower, we’d all live longer. Or at least, we’d appear to live longer. Maybe. I don’t actually know, but I think if we had an even faster form of perception, we’d probably use that as a sort of Gold Standard of Universal Speed. (This is just a guess, by the way.)

    I love reading about experiments where they slow light down to a visibly perceptible speed. Like this one.
    And, I love the premise of your book. Will the crashed people believe the newcomers are gods, or will they make the connection with their past? DUNDUNDUNNNNN!!!

  202. 202
    AshPlant

    rq: I notice that light is special beyond that, though. For example,flinging a massy projectile out the front of your .75c ship at .1c results in a projectile going at .85c…but shining a beam of light out the front results in, well, a beam of light. I’m also fascinated by the fact that its properties appear to be an absolute, and wonder if that’s necessary or just a coincidence.

    And the crashed people…will stare blankly at the newcomers, and then ask their priest-class what to do. The ‘Janeers’, you see, are still intelligent…possibly still even first-generation(?). After the officer class died in the crash, the ship’s engineers had most of the knowhow necessary to set up a survival-situation…and manufacture anti-radiation drugs for themselves…and order people around…and communicate with the ship…and control their degenerating underlings. Good intentions and all that. Intelligent or not, they’ve fallen prey to a fair degree of mysticism…regarding the remains of the ship’s AI as an oracle and welcoming the coming nuclear apocalypse when the ship finally fails entirely and the reactors go as an inevitable circle-of-life thing. So they’d resist ship 2′s rescue attempts, for e.g, and what they do, everyone else follows

  203. 203
    Owlmirror

    I had an amusing dream.

    I was walking along a street, and a couple of young children — a small girl and a somewhat older boy — came up to me to earnestly explain creationism to me. They had a large folded poster with colored rectangles that basically formed a script or flowchart of things they were supposed to say. I looked at the poster, and said something like “that’s like a computer program, isn’t it?”, and the boy cheerfully agreed.

    And then I started to get really enthusiastic about countering this, so I kinda started to lecture them.

    “Well, the thing is, a computer program like this needs to be connected to reality. Take that car over there. It was designed by someone using a drafting program, but the designer had to take into account the reality of the materials the car was going to be made of. I mean, if the headlight cover was made of wood, it would block the light, right? So, the thing is, creationism isn’t connected to reality. If it were true, we would expect to see all animals and plants and everything just popping into existence 6000 years ago. But that isn’t what we see when we look at everything. Or take the flood. All of the geological strata we see were supposed to have been laid down in a flood. But in a lot of layers, we find mudcracks. You know how when the earth gets all muddy, and then dries up, it forms a layer with lots of cracks in it? Well, sometimes those get fossilized; that layer with cracks gets covered up and preserved. How is that supposed to happen in a flood? . . .”

    I woke up before I could get to radiometric dating. Oh, well.

    It’s vaguely amusing to me that I’ve argued with creationists and thought about countering creationism enough to have this didactic spiel ready to flow even while I’m unconscious.

    It’s somewhat wonky, I see looking at it while I’m awake, but, oh well.

  204. 204
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Silver Linings Playbook (imdb), a romantic comedy that doesn’t trigger gag reflex? Yes, no?
    Friend loves romantic comedies and it would be nice if we could watch one that won’t cause a near-fatal eyeroll (for me, she tolerates all kinds of crap).

  205. 205
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    theophontes:

    I have never, ever, in any circumstance, in any dream, been able to influence my dreams. They just happen.

    I do assume that I will dream and assume that, the dreams I remember, I will remember and the ones I remember will be bad ones. I’m just along for the ride.

    Dreamed last night about being back in high school, having no clue what my schedule is, no clue the layout of the building, no clue where my shoes, socks or underwear were, no clue which books I needed, no clue where my locker was, no clue what language everyone was speaking. Like I said, I was just along for the ride.

  206. 206
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Ashplant

    Light is easy, space/time is difficult ;)

    The answer can be gotten from my above linky (or John’s):

    Your Lorentz factor for your crafts’ speed (you say: 0,95c), gives:

    γ= (1-v^2/c^2)^-.5 = 3.2025

    Therefore: Your time= T = γ*Te= 3.2025 x Earth Time

  207. 207
    katenrala

    @ AshPlant

    Why would a ship stop? Do you mean it turned around and deaccelerated to a “standstill” relative to it’s destination or are the engines special? My ships have no engines but can manipulate a space-field thingy, not warp, but they can just grab all their matter and go from rest to near c at once and then stop on a dime. The miniaturization of this tech to finger ring sized units plays a major role in my story.

    1) This feeds to 3 in its way.

    2) This would be more dramatic if the focus is on the peoples’ struggle instead of the technical details itself. How much warning ship 2 has leads to 3 though.

    3) I actually would like an answer to that question too, in my story I’ve fudged it so the journey is as long to the passengers of my colony fleet as the story needs it to be after failing to google up something that I could figure out.

    4) Nothing wrong that I can tell really.

    5) Names are tough, I have synesthesia and so pick names by the color and shape of letters, numbers, and combo for words. However there shouldn’t really be a reason not to reference a person from the past if that is what you’d like to use. A name that conjures exploration or struggle or hope may work thematically depending on your choice of theme and willingness to telegraph foreshadowing or irony.

    I wish I could have been more helpful, you have the same problems with relativity concerning time dilation as I do. d:

  208. 208
    katenrala

    To illustrate my colors, my name for example is fuschia-coolgreen-invisible-yellow-coolred-warmred-coolgreen-white-coolgreen. My characters are picked by what color combos I like too.

    I see a formula for time dilation is here. Yay!

  209. 209
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Ashplant

    There I went and got all mathematicky. Right there on John’s linky was an easier way:

    Linky to chart.

    @ Ogvobis

    [dreams] They just happen.

    I used to think that. Then I learned that such is not the case (at least for me). The surprise that something could be done in this way helped set me up to actually do it.

    There is another way too, which I unfortunately cannot help you with, and that is to actually have the problem acted out. (I gave the example a couple of months ago of my uncle “killing” my demon in RL when I was a child. This made such an impression on me that it disapeared from my nightmares.)


    A pharyngula experiment: Perhaps if anyone tries influencing their dreams and it works they can report back.

  210. 210
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I used to think that. Then I learned that such is not the case (at least for me). The surprise that something could be done in this way helped set me up to actually do it.

    When I was being treated for depression (after a suicide attempt (obviously unsuccessful)), my psychiatrist worked with me to try guiding my dreams. No dice.

  211. 211
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I think I already retold the story about one of the recurring nightmares of my childhood. I would dream that monsters (undefined, I just knew they were there) chasing me across the apartment. I would see members of my family and beg for their help, but they ignored me/couldn’t see me. I would run to the kitchen and the balcony and jump. That would make me wake up.
    As the nightmare repeated, I would “know” that I have to get to the balcony to stop it.

    I don’t know how much that counts as influencing dreams, since I don’t think it was really a conscious effort. I don’t know how to describe the fact of “knowing” in the dream what I had to do in order to wake up.

    The last dream of that sort I had was really creepy. I ran to the balcony, jumped, everything went dark, but when I opened my eyes, I was lying on the concrete behind my building and was surrounded by those monsters that were chasing me, seeing them for the first time. Then I woke up, scared as hell.

  212. 212
    culch

    The recent FTB page format annoys me. The left column is taking up a third of the page. These older eyes need the text magnified somewhat, and I thought that was the problem. But no, when I decrease the magnification, that column still takes a quarter of the framed page, with wave pattern filler left and right.

  213. 213
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Ogvobis

    No dice.

    :(

    (But then again, it does sound that you are resolving things, of late, in RL. And this is feeding into your dreams. There is at least that occuring between your dream and waking states.)

    @ Beatrice

    Eeep, that sounds scary. Perhaps just running at it by yourself? You can be as angry as you like.

    I was looking for something about dreaming on teh interwebz and came up with this: Lucid Dreaming

    Perhaps you are W.I.L.D dreaming and this brings on the monsters?

  214. 214
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    (But then again, it does sound that you are resolving things, of late, in RL. And this is feeding into your dreams. There is at least that occuring between your dream and waking states.)

    Oh, definitely. My dreams were very much a reflection of the worries and terrors of the daytime. Now that I have thought through (with immense help from the heartless and cruel meanies compassionate, caring and intelligent Pharyngula Commentariat) what happened, what I did, what others did, and how I fit into it in a realistic manner, the dreams have changed significantly.

  215. 215
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    theophontes,

    Haven’t had that dream it at least twelve years. Including that scary last one. But it stuck with me, as only one other nightmare every did.

    I used to be a bit vary of the lucid dreaming topic, since the first time I encountered the term was in one of our wacky woo-laden alternative science shows At The Edge of Science (Na rubu znanosti). Since the show was about pyramids in Bosnia, magic crystals and alien species visiting the Earth, I was a bit vary of anything I heard there.
    It does seem interesting though, I’ll have to read a bit more about it.

  216. 216
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    On Friday, I got a medical bill from NYU Hospital. For a CAT scan (I have only ever had one, and that was a Cardiac CAT after my still-mysterious chest pains). On a day that I was at work. In Scranton. Two years ago. I called them on Friday and, when the supervisor gets back from vacation, he will call me. Weird.

  217. 217
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Dreams: It’s me telling myself something. It would be much nicer sometimes if I just wronte me an email.

  218. 218
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    Midnight in China —–> Time to go to sleep start the experiment.

    :D

  219. 219
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    It’s me telling myself something. It would be much nicer sometimes if I just wronte me an email.

    :)

    Seconded.
    And not an “I must have been drunk while typing this” email, but a nice clear statement. No metaphors and shit.

  220. 220
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    No metaphors and shit.

    For the longest time (well, the last year-and-a-half (which is how long ago I admitted to myself what happened to me)), the dreams about my abuse were very straight forward. Now that I have discovered that I really didn’t have a choice, though much of the pain is still there and the stress is kinda gone, my dreams have gone all meadow-for-ical. I keep taking someone’s hand and walking away from the abuser(s). Not sure what it means, but I like it.

  221. 221
    Jadehawk

    confession time: I’m 9one of those people who can rarely be assed to get a flu vaccine, because a)I rarely get the flu, and b)when I do, I usually spend the entire duration in bed, feeling sorry for myself, and consequently don’t tend to infect anyone else.

    This time, I managed to get the flu just in time to throw up at the Minneapolis Amtrak station, consequently exposing everyone at 4 train stations, 2 trains, 2 airports, and one transatlantic flight to my flu.

    oops.

  222. 222
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Jadehawk:

    (This may be outside my pay grade, but) You are hereby banned from the Spanking Couch and the Comfy Chair until you have been without symptoms for at least four days.

    And please stay at least 10 inches from any open USB ports?

    Hope you get well/are getting well quickly.

  223. 223
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Dreams? I have dreams.

    I have these dreams about having to do an impossible task, and I keep trying and failing. I can rest, but only when I’m done. Sometimes it is sorting books, or playing a level in Castlevania, or clearing a building of zombies… the specifics don’t matter, the completely not restful sleep is what matters.

    Sometimes I’m being chased by an unstoppable enemy, through buildings or across rooftops. Sometimes I’m armed, sometimes I have to protect someone else. Often, I wake up just as I’m having the life squeezed out of me.

  224. 224
    Jadehawk

    Hope you get well/are getting well quickly.

    that flu-story was actually from my flight to Germany, so that was almost a month ago. it ruined part of my vacation, and now that I know there’s a flu epidemic in the US I feel oddly responsible for that, given how ridiculously many people I managed to expose on that trip.

    meaning I’m physically fine now, just guilty about contributing to the epidemic so very efficiently

  225. 225
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Ogvorbis,

    Ok, that’s a nice metaphor and obviously for something good. But if my subconscious mind ever sends me an email, I’d rather it be clear.

  226. 226
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Jadehawk:

    Ah. I rescind my banns. Not that I actually have any right to issue banns (me not being a priest and all (though I have seriously considered getting myself frocked as a minister just in case anyone in PA wanted an atheist to bless their marriage)).

    So you are saying the flu epidemic in the US is your fault?

    [Burns]Interesting.[/Burns]

  227. 227
    Jadehawk

    So you are saying the flu epidemic in the US is your fault?

    clearly.
    though, i guess the flight would have been more likely to cause one in the Netherlands :-p

  228. 228
    athyco

    I keep taking someone’s hand and walking away from the abuser(s). Not sure what it means, but I like it.

    You’ve been doing that around here for a while, Ogvorbis. All the years’-worth-of-effort regulars have. There are lurkers who pick and choose and fine tune the diversity of arguments against whatever cluelessness and privilege and cruelty through willful ignorance that drop in. Some days I want to comment with what I see as a Sastra persona–open and accepting but surgically excising the tumor in an argument. Other days I want to shrug into the Caine persona and wield the vorpal blade. (Snicker snack!) And sometimes I’d like to show the Ogvorbis persona, when the poster seems to be holding a position I used to hold and may be ready to step away from it rather than dig in. Yeah, you often hold out your hand for someone to take and walk away.

  229. 229
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Germany actually doesn’t hacve routine flu vaccinations for everybody. I got mine this year, not because I can remember actually ever having had it, but because clearly this year with my grandma being so fragile and myself barely halfway healthy again I really didn’t want to risk it.

    Being sick on a flight is among the worst things ever. I remember having a bad case of sinusitis (I always get sinusitis unless I use tons of nose-spray, which in turn leads to a chronic blocked nose…) on my flight home from Venezuela. Air condition did not help it and I tried to fix it with 2 small bottles of red wine (thanks Iberia). Worst about it: When I got home that fucking catholic world-youth pope Palpatine worship festival was in Germany and of course I had to go by train through that region. So, not only did I miss two of my trains, they were also all full of a bazillion happy and friendly catholics singing about god’s love. The only thing that kept me from comminting mass-murder with my bare hands that day was my 39° temperature inability to do so.

    Talking about catholics: Catholic church trying to stop a bill that would provide free contraception and sex ed to the poorest people in the Philippines
    Tell me again they’re somehow a frce of good in this world?

  230. 230
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    And sometimes I’d like to show the Ogvorbis persona, when the poster seems to be holding a position I used to hold and may be ready to step away from it rather than dig in. Yeah, you often hold out your hand for someone to take and walk away.

    Thank you. I didn’t realize that was what I was doing.

    I guess that I remember just how accepted my racism, misogyny, bigotry was just a few short years ago. When I was exposed to just how toxic it is when it is allowed free reign, it scared the crap out of me (literally. it was in some of those threads that my memories started to shake loose and that crap has been dominating my life for the past year-and-a-half). So I am not consciously trying to take them by the hand and walk away but I am reminding myself just how easily it would be to slip back into my old -ist ways. If it has the side effect you describe, even better.

  231. 231
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Tell me again they’re somehow a frce of good in this world?

    The Christian definition of doing good in the world is so warped by the souls-saved scoreboard as to be useless.

    And in my mind, I added an ‘a’ to your ‘frce.’ A farce of good. If it weren’t so lighthearted, it would be appropriate. But it doesn’t engender the feeling of absolute evil done by doing godgood.

  232. 232
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    From a church sign.

    IF UR FAITH IS BIG ENOUGH
    FACTS DNT COUNT

    So much is said in so few (misspelled) words.

  233. 233
    Socio-gen, something something...

    Greetings and hello again! I’m finally feeling somewhat close to “healthy” again and the left side of my face is back to normal size. Which is great since tomorrow is the first day of classes — and, of course, I have three of them on Mondays.

    Planning to spend today cleaning all the things some things while kicking myself very very hard. I mixed up my dates and, thanks to not feeling so hot, missed the deadline to submit my paper and poster for MSS. *sigh* (Note to self: plan to submit everything a week before you think it’s due.)

    Jadehawk:
    Um… I feel bad. I helped spread the epidemic around Fargo-Moorhead about 6 weeks ago by taking the bus to do my shopping and whatnot even though I wasn’t feeling great. In my defense, I didn’t know I had the flu (or was actually sick) until a few days later when I was all but bedridden; I thought it was just stress and exhaustion from the upcoming end of term.

    So, feel free to blame me instead. :)

    Ogvorbis:
    Belated happy birthday wishes!

    (though I have seriously considered getting myself frocked as a minister just in case anyone in PA wanted an atheist to bless their marriage)).

    No need! When my son and his now-former fiancee were planning their wedding, we discovered that one does not need a minister or officiant of any sort, thanks to the Quaker/Amish communities. PA has a “self-uniting license” which allows the couple to simply marry themselves in front of witnesses. You can choose to have a host or MC, if you want, (no paperwork required) and as simple or formal a ceremony as you want, without any religious clap-trap. And you are not required to be Quaker or Amish in order to use it. (It is slightly more expensive, however.)

  234. 234
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Socio Gen
    Welcome back, happy health recovery!

    PA has a “self-uniting license” which allows the couple to simply marry themselves in front of witnesses.

    Funny enough, in Germany people always marry themselves BUT it has to be in front of an appointed state servant* who makes sure all the paperwork is in good order. The lady who “married” us explained to us in great detail that she cannot marry us and neither can anybody else. We can only marry each other and she’s just there to make sure we get the state’s recognition.

    *It used to be the law that churches were only allowed to marry people who had done so in the state office before. Now they’re allowed to marry people in a church wedding which is not recognized by the government.

  235. 235
    rq

    Socio-gen
    Welcome back!! *confetti! good health! happiness!*

    +++

    re: recurring dreams
    I’ve had two recurring dreams in my life: one was about Frankenstein coming after me and my family, and while I was able to hide from him (behind the door), my family had no idea he was coming and I was unable to warn them. The other was about setting sail across the giant lake/sea that was behind our house (which was on a hill with a slight slope downwards in the backyard; this bit was the beach to the lake) to the island in the middle, which was inhabited by natives with no heads but with a single giant eye in their bellies (Marco Polo, anyone?), who would attack, and would try to follow me back. My canoe was always faster, and each time the dream would progress a bit further – the first time, I made it to shore; the second time, so did the natives; the third time, they entered the house and I realized that not only were they not hostile, they had no idea how to pet a cat, so I tried to teach them.
    The one dream I tried to influence (running through molasses-thick air from a potential assailant), I couldn’t influence much, no matter how hard I concentrated, and I only had to run around from the front to the backdoor… And I couldn’t even punch the guy fast, no matter how hard I concentrated.
    Now I just enjoy my vivid movie dreams.

    +++

    re: marriage
    You can have a ‘civic’ (and civil, if you wish, which is what I first wrote) marriage here, kind of like what Giliell said (where you marry yourself), and that’s called a civil union (so none of this living together for 3+ years crap, that’s not a marriage!). Or you can do it through the church, which is a religious marriage, and you still get all the state paperwork done, but it all gets signed at the church, rather than the notarial office (the dzimtsarakstu nodaļa – the genealogical department).

  236. 236
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    Re Four Weddings and a Funeral: it seemed to either intentionally or thoughtlessly validate a lot of really fucked up ideas about how relationships form and work, as well as the main character’s idiotic sense of entitlement and passive-aggressive selfishness. If all that was window-dressing for making the point that the gay couple in the film were more of a healthy, reasonable, married couple than most of the people around them, as i think someone suggested, it’s a pretty bad case of the tail wagging the dog.

  237. 237
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    So, well, we’re going to get mum to the university hospital. Things aren’t getting better and a small hospital with no specialists plus an asshole doctor isn’t going to do her any good, especially since they have no psychological support whatsoever.
    In other news sister managed to calculate her Child-Pugh score
    It’s 11.
    Fuck.

  238. 238
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Giliell,

    *hugs* and hoping for the best

  239. 239
    rq

    Giliell
    *lots of hugs*!!!

  240. 240
    rq

    Azkyroth
    That’s what I was afraid of. I’ll probably take a look anyway, because… because. It’ll probably be on TV sometime soon. It seems to appear fairly regularly hereabouts. *shrug*
    One day they’ll make a real movie about a proper relationship. How boring! ;)

  241. 241
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Beatrice
    Thanks. Sister is still like “There have been cases of spontaneous recovery, very rare, but they exist”, but I guess my cynic doesn’t allow for that.

    +++
    Something completely different. Ireally like her work.
    Plus: At least in Germany the Youtube add before the video is from that misandric pants charity.

  242. 242
    Parrowing

    Hi everyone. So I’ve been lurking for a while (not quite sure how long) and I’ve been building up the courage to finally post here. So… here it is. I deal with anxiety and depression and it can make commenting online incredibly stressful. Baby steps. Posting this is a fulfillment of a not quite New Year’s resolution but a thing-I’ve-wanted-to-do-for-a-long-time-and-now-I-can-use-the-new-year-as-an-excuse-to-finally-do-it resolution. Hope it sticks.

    All I’ll say for now is:

    I’ve really enjoyed reading all of you awesome people.

    I overuse the word “awesome” and I’m trying to fix that.

    I have said a few words to some of you on Twitter. That was me easing myself into the idea of posting here. So, hi! to you Twitter peeps and thanks for helping me manage my anxiety enough to post this :) .

    And lastly, part of why I’ve been scared to post: I have an MRA brother. Not just that he agrees with their general stance so I might as well call him that. No, he’s an actual Reddit atheist (the rest of our immediate family is religious) and refers to himself as an MRA. I don’t think he comments; he is just a lurker like me. But I’ve been worried that if I started posting and he found out somehow, he’d become active. I guess this is me taking that risk.

    PS. Sorry if I’ve fucked up the formatting.

  243. 243
    Inaji

    Hallo, Parrowing and Welcome to Pharyngula. Unfortunately, all MRAs are related to people, nothing you can do about that. You can easily and happily grow and sharpen your fangs here, though, which is a right useful thing.

  244. 244
    chigau (違う)

    Welcome Parrowing.
    I like your kitties.

  245. 245
    Lofty

    Parrowing, may this place give you strength. I mostly sit and watch too, always something new to learn.

  246. 246
    Lofty

    Oh yes, and of course, my kitty says hello to your kitties.

  247. 247
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Hello and welcome, Parrowing!

  248. 248
    opposablethumbs

    Giliell, I’m so sorry. Another bunch of hugs on the pile, and I hope you have good support around you in RL. {{{hugs Giliell}}}
    .
    .
    Hi Parrowing, good to meet you. Curious nym … does it have any parrots in it? Relations with your brother must be a bit fraught sometimes, I guess!

  249. 249
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Parrowing:
    Welcome. Pull up a chair. I think Portia is fixing sangria.

  250. 250
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Parrowing, at least you know that you are not alone in dealing with people like your brother.

    It is always nice to see people delurk. It is a constant reminder that all of this painful squabbling is not being done in a vacuum.

    I hope that you brother comes around. Sadly, I have no words of wisdom about how that might happen. I have one brother that I barely speak to and, as of this time, no desire to do so.

    Despite my rather pessimistic words, I hope you find something of value here.

  251. 251
    Parrowing

    Thanks for the welcomes, Caine, chigau, Lofty, WMDKitty, and opposablethumbs!

    *

    Caine, one day I hope my fangs will be as sharp and sniny as yours!

    *

    Chigau, my kitties like you, too.

    *

    Lofty, the kitties looked up from their fight/lick session to say “Mjau!” in unison to your kitty.

    *

    Opposablethumbs, I think originally the nym reminded me of sparrows. Maybe the parrot was hanging out with them. Yeah, it’s been awkward dealing with my brother, but we do live in different countries so there is a lot of distance for now. We’ll be seeing each other in two months though, :-/ .

    *

    I’m off to bed. See you all soon!

  252. 252
    mildlymagnificent

    Baby steps, parrowing – and just as those progress, you’ll be running and jumping before long.

    We all have relatives. They come in all shapes, sizes and opinion formats – none of them are perfect, some of them are downright disagreeable. Your unwonderful brother is just another.

  253. 253
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Rick Perlstein now has a blog at The Nation.

    How The NRA Became An Organization For Aspiring Vigilantes (Part 1)

    How The NRA Became An Organization For Aspiring Vigilantes (Part 2)

    It is obvious that Perlstein is drawing from his research for his upcoming book about Ronald Reagan (Though Reagan was a large figure in Nixonland. But it is a needed historical perspective that is missing in most of the talk about gun control. Sadly, most of the people who try to use history gets it so wrong, it is more accurate to call it fantasy.

  254. 254
    Lynna, OM

    Here’s a Moment of Mormon Madness in praise of cleaning the toilets in the Lord’s House.
    https://www.lds.org/callings/meetinghouse-care/reverence?lang=eng

    [Disney-movie-ish music] “Let’s be the first one to clean the toilets.” [Quivering lip, and near-blubbing adult mormon delivery of dialogue, ala "I'm giving my testimony testiphoney" style]
    “Learning obedience to the prophets.”
    “Service and sacrifice help us gain a testimony of holy things.”
    “Learn why others have chosen to participate in cleaning and caring for meetinghouses and how their testimonies have grown because of it.”

    A few years ago the Mormon Powers That Be decided that they could save money by firing all the janitors that were cleaning church buildings and substituting “volunteer” members who would be given a “calling” to clean. Since that time, blowback has been considerable, hence the need for massive PR.

    Mormon leaders built a several-billion-dollar mall, but they can’t afford to pay for janitorial services?
    And the result of all that cleaning, or failing to clean, by amateurs (including “the youth)? Dirty, stinky mormon houses of worship that are rapidly becoming health hazards.

  255. 255
    Lynna, OM

    Ex-mormons and doubting mormons discuss the “Every member a janitor” ploy of mormon leaders:
    http://mormondisclosures.blogspot.com/2013/01/lets-be-first-one-to-clean-toilets.html

    What if bowl brushing members were ever to find out that the top leadership enjoys perks of summer homes and beautiful country-side recreation camping? If they learn these are paid-for/owned and/or operated by the church to be used exclusively by the top church executive leaders, what would be their reaction?

    Then there is the woman that at first says she is excited, then discouraged and again excited to clean the toilets because in this way, she lifts the burden from everyone else and gets closer to God. Yes, folks, you can get closer to the God of Monson and Joseph Smith by cleaning toilets. Why? Because Smith’s god is crap and cleaning crap will help you to understand him.

  256. 256
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    I made through two minutes and fifty seconds before my brain started to frizzle and fry.

    Not just the lips of the first man to speak were quivering. So was his voice.

    Lynna, all of that money that could have been paid for janitorial staffs were needed to try to keep people like me from marrying someone that does not fit their ideals.

  257. 257
    Steven Brown: Man of Mediocrity

    @Lynna (#253)
    Wow. The music in the background is… Well clashing with the shots of people mopping and scrubbing toilets.

    I chuckled.

  258. 258
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Call that the Multicultural Clean Up Crew™.

    Does cleaning toilets make one white and delightsome?

  259. 259
    JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness

    Hey everyone! I’ve been rather absent again due to The Sickness makes rounds among the family again. We just all started feeling better. Then Bam! We start coughing so hard it causes us to throw up, sleeping 13 hours a day and the sore throat that feels like hell. Not to mention the swelled and mucus bursting sinuses.

    Well, the family and I went down to emergency care yesterday and found out it’s bronchitis. We’re all taken care of because of state heath insurance. Roomie is not.

    Roomie is finally eligible for benefits as of Friday and filled out the paperwork. Yay!

    But it won’t kick in for several weeks and he most likely has bronchitis like the rest of us. Boo!

    They actually had to send him home sick after filling out heath care forms. Heh.

    This is place and a doctor that can get him checked out and medicine for just under $100 so I’ve asked Eseteth for that money. His check is short from take sick days 2 weeks ago the first time we all got sick.

    Meanwhile I have the funds for the dentist but can’t go til next week when I’m not leaking infection and all that.

    Blehhhhhhhhhhhhh. I feel like warmed over death still.

  260. 260
    athyco

    Hi, Parrowing. I have a fundamentalist Christian, MRA, NRA uncle. He’s got two drawbacks when dealing with me. (1) He spouts off about “women this” and “guns that” and “atheists the other” so often that he doesn’t remember who’s been in his audience for what bits, and (2) he’s got no original research on his side, just talking points.

    So, when I know I’m going to see him in a couple of months, I stock up. Then I preempt him by bringing something up from the MRA list as the funniest stupidity I’ve ever seen. My attitude: “How could anyone ever believe this?!?” (Stuff here is primary, but Manbooz is another great resource.) It works well both one on one and in groups. If he comes up with something on which my background info is weak, I interrupt him with “No ranting, Uncle. What are the facts?” It makes even him feel the point is weak, and he knows I’m going to get back to him later. One of the best was when his granddaughter visited Google on her phone and read counterpoints in the middle of one MRA tale of outrage.

    I know that the next time I’ll see him, he’ll bring up the EEEEEEbil gun control. So far, I’ve got that idiot Alex Jones and a USA Today article about firearm-related deaths versus traffic accident fatalities in this decade (2010 numbers: 10 in 100,000 for firearms, 12 in 100,000 for traffic accidents), and I’m able to point to a YouTuber who said that you have a THOUSAND times greater chance of being killed by a car than by a gun. (He then gave the relatively accurate 40,000 as the annual number of traffic fatalities, not even numerate enough to realize that meant for his gun death number.)

  261. 261
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    Gilliell
    *hugs*

    Parrowing
    Welcome. As others have said, you can’t pick your relatives.

    Lynna
    I am deeply unsurprised, both about the church trying to save money that way and the quality of the results they get.

    JAL
    Glad to hear you’re feeling a bit better. I don’t know if you caught my comment in the last thread, but I know basic to intermediate web design/blog design stuff. What sort of thing are you after?

  262. 262
    rorschach

    @228,

    Talking about catholics: Catholic church trying to stop a bill that would provide free contraception and sex ed to the poorest people in the Philippines

    The Phils are in fact a picture child of how religion fucks up everything. The current militant conflicts there are largely based on the fact that Muslim traders from Borneo landed in Mindanao in the South in the 14th century, made their way as far as Luzon, and then got beaten and confined to Mindanao by Spanish Catholics who arrived after 1564 and converted the whole place to Catholicism within a century.

    Spain got sick of it and sold the place to the US for 20 million at the end of the 19th century, which brought in increasing numbers of evangelicals/protestants. So now you have a largely Catholic ex-fisherman, ex-hunter-gatherer society, with an Islamic population in the South, and an increasing number of evangelicals(still only about 5% or so)in the bigger cities, all competing for the filipinos’ souls. And that with a populace that is notoriously fatalistic and resigned to their fate in a “what will be, will be” way. It’s a perfect hunting ground for missionaries, and easy pickings for organised religion.

  263. 263
    Inaji

    I’ve started Legion, a Pharyngula inspired piece. I might even finish it someday! :D

  264. 264
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Oh joy…

    My dog blew out an anal gland thing today. We’re off to the vet in the morning. She’s pretty miserable about the whole thing.

  265. 265
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    O.O

    Best wishes for dog. x.x

  266. 266
    JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness

    *looks back*

    Oh, yeah the blog question. I don’t even remember what it is now. It might not have been a real question, just a blurry, fuzzy mind not working right so I don’t understand what I’m doing right now question.

    If it’s an actual problem or I remember I’ll pose the specific question. Thanks for offering help though. =)

  267. 267
    cicely

    thunk!
    *pouncehug*
    Why is your hull overheating?
    -
    Socio-gen: Glad you’re feeling better!
    -
    Giliell: *hugs* Sorry about your mother.
    -
    Hi Parrowing; welcome in!
    I’m given to understand that I, also, over-use “awesome”.
    :)
    Sorry to hear about your brother; but MRAs do sometimes recover.
    -
    JAL: Glad you’re feeling better, too. Bronchitis isn’t improved by stereo presentation.
    -

  268. 268
    chigau (違う)

    Last year, when I took myself to the walk-in-clinic (Canada, “free”)
    I was in the little exam room, quietly coughing:
    Doctor walks in: “Why you so skinny?”
    me: “? *cough* Been coughing for more than two weeks.”
    Doctor: “Bronchitis. Take off shirt. Hmm. Neurofibromatosis.
    [Listens to wheezing.] Here prescription for antibiotic.”
    me:” neuro… Elephantman? [to retreating white coat] Thanks…”
    Fell in love with the Doctor, took the antibiotics, got better.
    YAY socialised medicine.
    meh. Who needs ‘bedside manner’?

  269. 269
    NightShadeQueen, resident nutcase

    Anon‘s claiming that they took down mit.edu to avenge aaronsw’s suicide.

    (MIT says otherwise)

  270. 270
    NightShadeQueen, resident nutcase

    aaronsw = Aaron Swartz’s MIT username.

  271. 271
    SallyStrange

    Caine – your piece makes me smile.

  272. 272
    Inaji

    Sally, thank you. That makes me really happy. ♥

  273. 273
    chigau (違う)

    So.
    When I put on the sourdough this night, I fed it a cup of ‘potato flour’ and it went waaaay strange.
    all lumpy surrounded by bubbly…
    I’m currently stirring and adding tiny amounts of water and pinches of dry yeast.
    I may need to stay awake all night just in case I need to nuke it from orbit…

  274. 274
    JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness

    Oh, Caine I just saw your Legion project post. I love it. I’m all teary eyed but in a good, happy way. =)

  275. 275
    chigau (違う)

    So, is this just another slow night period of time, or do I need to threaten my netbook with an axe?

  276. 276
    Inaji

    JAL:

    I’m all teary eyed but in a good, happy way. =)

    We’re holding hands. Always. ♥

  277. 277
    Inaji

    Chigau, slow.

  278. 278
    chigau (違う)

    Fine, then.
    It’s garbage day tomorrow, I’ll just haul stuff to the alley.
    [uphill in both directions]
    [but it's only -12°C]

  279. 279
    A. Noyd

    And the shitty person of the week award goes to the asshole dude standing behind me at the crosswalk coming back from eating out just now. He was cheerfully telling his pals about his problems with getting distracted too easily and said something along the lines of, “I fired this one person because I couldn’t focus while training him because he was too beautiful.” He followed this with another instance of complaining about someone else’s good looks not “letting” him get work done. Ugh.

  280. 280
    Inaji

    A. Noyd:

    “I fired this one person because I couldn’t focus while training him because he was too beautiful.” He followed this with another instance of complaining about someone else’s good looks not “letting” him get work done. Ugh.

    Jesus Christ. There’s a whole lot of ugly walking about and I’m not talking about looks, either.

  281. 281
    ednaz

    Caine, you are just so very cool. Thank You.

  282. 282
    ednaz

    Hello Parrowing and Welcome. : )

  283. 283
    chigau (違う)

    ednaz #280
    Hard to argue with that.

  284. 284
    Inaji

    Ednaz:

    Caine, you are just so very cool. Thank You.

    Ha! ‘Bout time being weird morphed into coolness. :D

    Thank you.

  285. 285
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    [dream experiment]

    Well that did not go well. Perhaps because I did not sleep well. Some staccato images of pages (?). All a bit abstract and non-controllable. Also alarm clocks are not a good idea. Nor theaphontes waking one to say she can’t sleep. Got a vague idea how to solve the relativity_two_spaceships problem, but cannot recall any images.
    :(
    Aah well, back to the drawing board.

    @ Parrowing
    Welcome on board, AaaaaaRRRgh!

    @ Caine
    You are bloggus-non-grata in China. I shall have to wait in order to see the Legion.

  286. 286
    chigau (違う)

    theophontes

    @ Caine
    You are bloggus-non-grata in China.

    Wow.
    Just Wow.

  287. 287
    Inaji

    Theophontes:

    You are bloggus-non-grata in China.

    Well, the nerve. I tells ya. Can you get to my zenfolio? If so, I’ll upload a pic there.

  288. 288
    Inaji

    Okay, Theophontes, try here.

  289. 289
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Caine:
    I too like your “We are Legion” project. When finished it might look great as a flyer to be distributed or a poster. On a tee shirt or coffee mug would be awesome too. You are good people. I hope you know that.

  290. 290
    Inaji

    Tony:

    I too like your “We are Legion” project. When finished it might look great as a flyer to be distributed or a poster. On a tee shirt or coffee mug would be awesome too.

    Heh. Well, there’s that pesky “motherfucker” in there. I don’t need to tell you how much people focus on a naughty word to the exclusion of all else.

    You are good people. I hope you know that.

    Aaw, thank you. So are you, you know. It’s one of the best things about Pharyngula – it’s stuffed full of the best damn peoples I’ve ever had the privilege to know.

  291. 291
    chigau (違う)

    Ah. So.
    Some tricksey color thing with the ‘motherfucker’.

    “YOU see WHAT????”

  292. 292
    Inaji

    Chigau:

    “YOU see WHAT????”

    Hahahahahahahahaha. That’s more work than I’m willing to put in, but that’s a great idea.

  293. 293
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Ashplant

    We have two ships following each other at a couple of centuries’ distance

    Not necessary. They can leave together and time dilation can take of the rest. If their speeds and trajectories are different, you can run all the discrepancies through time dilation.

    What I’ve written so far follows the second ship encountering a problem, and having to stop unexpectedly somewhere along the line.

    Seems a little unnecessary in terms of the larger plot. Why not send both ships to the same (original) destination. The first has landing problems. The planet is not quite what they expect. Not because it cannot support life, but through their own othering of the new environment. They wanted to be “just like home”, but now with the damaged ship, cannot make it so. They are alienated not by the planet, but by themselves. Your story works perfectly well in all of this.

    ‘accident in space’ explanation for the stops

    Unnecessary. Also the pings can be a course set out by stationary (decelerated) ping pods.

    if ship 2 simply arrived at the previously specified destination

    Better. Also the last ping-pod was dropped prior to the accident.

    How long would a 1500-odd light year journey take from inside a ship that could get up to, say, 0.95c fairly quickly?

    About 4500 years. You have more than enough time to accelerate.

  294. 294
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Caine

    Thanks.

    I can get on zenfolio. (You are not as subversive as I thought!) ;D

  295. 295
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    There is so much here that does not compute:
    ” Atheist” used to mean someone who does not believe in the existence of God. Unfortunately, it no longer does.

    Thanks to Richard Dawkins and his ilk, “atheist” now means someone who is (and acts as if he is) intellectually superior, and who mocks and derides the deeply held and personal religious beliefs of less intelligent others by pointing out how wrongheaded and stupid they are to believe what they believe.

    Virtually all of Dawkins’s contemporary examples of how evil, oppressive and destructive religion is come from Islam. There is no question that Islam is an evil, oppressive and destructive force, but that does not mean all religions are. In fact, I would contend that, apart from Islam, most contemporary religions throughout the world today are for the most part forces of good most of the time.”
    http://bigthink.com/e-pur-si-muove/why-i-am-not-an-atheist

    I do not even know where to start.
    The definition of atheist?
    Mischaracterizing Dawkins?
    Islam=bad, other religions=mostly good?
    Or, later on, his insistence that real scientists know things with absolute certainty?
    How can a site like Big Think have someone of the caliber of Adam Lee, while also giving a platform to Satoshi Kanazawa?

  296. 296
    John Morales

    theophontes, interstellar ship. Pretty expensive, less so when amortised over a couple of centuries. That’s one ship. Two?

    How long would a 1500-odd light year journey take from inside a ship that could get up to, say, 0.95c fairly quickly?

    About 4500 years. You have more than enough time to accelerate.

    Um. From inside the ship, about 1580 years. :)

  297. 297
    John Morales

    Tony, I’d start by noting the meaning has not changed (rather its connotations) and therefore it’s an appeal to consequences regarding a truth-claim.

  298. 298
    birgerjohansson

    “Mouse eats scorpions and howls at the moon” http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn23072-zoologger-mouse-eats-scorpions-and-howls-at-the-moon.html

    What the…here I try to come up with ideas for “”interesting GM organisms, and you have this marvellous specimen of carnivore rodent all along!

  299. 299
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    ‘morning

    Thanks for the hugses

    Opposablethumbs
    I have a most wonderful husband, a loving sister, two great kids who make me laugh no matter what and a therapist where I can let my hair down, so to speak.

    Parrowings
    Welcome to the Lounge

    Caine
    That’s a great project.

  300. 300
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ John Morales

    Check the graph you linked: Lorentz Graph.

    Also, similarly, I got:

    γ= (1-v^2/c^2)^-.5 = 3.2025

    Therefore: Your time= T = γ*Te= 3.2025 x Earth Time

    (Unless Ashplant is not referring to earth years? Imagine, for simplicity, that the space ship left earth for 1500 years and returned. That is the sense I understood.)

    OK, this is cool: Dream map of Shoreditch.

  301. 301
    John Morales

    theophontes, γ is the factor from Earth’s frame of reference relative to the ship.

    People in the ship will see γ units of time elapsing on Earth for every unit they experience, and people on Earth will see the reciprocal (1/γ) elapsing on the ship.

    (Consider: c is a scalar (distance per unit time) so at c the journey time is 1500 years and at .95c the journey time is 1500 × 1/.95 = 1579 years)

  302. 302
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ John Morales

    Er, John…. that is not the Lorentz equation you are using. :/

    Check my linky to this: Hafele and Keating Experiment The bit about time dilation (don’t use the binomial one), just bung the numbers in and off you go!

    (More speed … more time.)

  303. 303
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    John:
    As good a place as any to start.
    How are thing down under my good man?

  304. 304
    opposablethumbs

    ‘morning!

    Glad you have such great people around you, Giliell (knew about your OH and kids, but I guess there’s no such thing as too much support when things like this are going on).
    .
    Legion looks set to be wonderful, Caine - so powerful.
    .
    Hope the dog is OK, iJoe. Poor beast :(

  305. 305
    Inaji

    Giliell & Opposablethumbs, thank you.

    Giliell, that dragon of yours is a prime example of how much I wish I could deal with a sewing machine and all that goes with it. That’s the cutest freaking thing I have ever seen. You could sell those, so easily.

  306. 306
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    Hang on. This linky is much easier: Online calculator

    “Page Down” once for the Time Dilation calculator.

  307. 307
    Moggie

    birgerjohansson:

    Mouse eats scorpions and howls at the moon

    This is great:

    Even the poisonous scorpion cannot escape the savage monster’s little pink paws. It fights bravely, stinging its attacker on the nose. To no avail. The mouse ignores the painful venom and cruelly breaks the scorpion’s tail by pummelling it into the ground, then bites its head and feasts on its flesh. Throwing its head back, the murderous animal howls at the moon.

    Southern grasshopper mouse don’t give a shit!

  308. 308
    John Morales

    Cool change atm, Tony. Puppy got castrated Friday — three days latter, he doesn’t even notice.

    Theophontes, I did get it reversed.

    Assuming instant acceleration, then
    * Earth time, the time taken is 1579.
    * Ship-time, the time taken is 1579 ÷ 3.2025 = 493 years.

  309. 309
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    Latin dilatare, “to spread wide”

    Are there no quantum physicists out there? John (1/3) vs theo (3)…. help us out here!

    (Hey, we could run bets!)

  310. 310
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    Speed, like time, has deleterious effects: One gets shorter, slower and puts on weight . Ask any decrepit tardigrade.

  311. 311
    AJ Milne

    (Blinks at ‘I fired him because he was too beautiful…’)

    Man. I have lost more jobs that way…

    Sorta more seriously, I can’t remember which evangelical type was not so much defending as advising such dismissals, though he seemed more specifically to be advising the firing of apparently excessively attractive women, if Mr. Lust-Addled Hetero Boss just can’t trust himself to stick to the task at hand…

    This must be equality. Progress!

    And maybe not that seriously, given the recently mentioned stats on how, generally, the better looking men are paid better, I suppose we have to conclude this isn’t exactly a rampant problem. But still… What?

    I’ve worked around some lovely people on my time. And I suppose there probably even have been very brief instants of business time lost, here and there, when I found myself very briefly distracted by such loveliness, had a brief ‘Now where the hell was I?’ moment… I think that’s as bad as it’s ever been. And I always assumed I was, relatively speaking, a bit distractible that way. Yet somehow, I seem to manage to get through the day without regularly stapling myself to anything…

    Seriously, sounds to me like buddy has to get a grip. Desensitize himself, maybe? Watch more Hollywood movies full of improbably pretty people? How could this actually be a problem in 2013? They have those, now.

  312. 312
    AJ Milne

    … Oh, and seriously, if you can’t do your job because you find your people are too beautiful, it seems to me the person who should be fired is you.

  313. 313
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Caine
    Thanks. I already have one request from a friend.

  314. 314
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Good morning. Happy Tuesday to one and all.

    9/11 dream #2 last night. Compared to the cub scout dreams, it barely counted as a nightmare.

    Gilliel:

    Hugs to you and yours.

    Parrowings:

    Welcome.

  315. 315
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Zagreb is a bit snowed in. When I say a bit I mean there is a fuckton of snow and still falling. Luckily, boss went home early and I hitched a ride. My poor parents will probably have to walk home.

    I have no idea how I’m going to get to work tomorrow if the trams don’t start going. Or rather, I have – by foot. *sigh*
    That is going to take at least an hour.

    —–

    Parrowings,

    Hello, welcome!


    Giliell,
    Seconding that you could sell your dragons.

    —-

    ….I forgot what else.

  316. 316
    katenrala

    @ AJ Milne 310

    Guy needs to imagine Daniel Craig and Colin Salmon giving each other a bubble sponge bath.

    That’d desensitize anyone right quick.

  317. 317
    AJ Milne

    I confess. I laughed. McSweeney’s: First, they came for my assault rifle.

  318. 318
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Caine,

    Your project Legion is brilliant!

  319. 319
    AJ Milne

    katenrala/#315

    See, that’s the kind of thinking outside the box that firm obviously needs.

    A. Noyd, if you see him again, tell him I’d like the number of his HR department. I have just been handed a very constructive suggestion.

    (/To be followed by anyone with the same problem. After they fire him.)

  320. 320
    Inaji

    Beatrice, thank you!

  321. 321
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    So. I’m supposed to take over customer support and care for an application my place of work uses. I add people, but they kept asking me about “installing” the thing. My mentor kept taking care of that and Ifinally asked what the hell they were all talking about and what was he installing since there is, as far as I know (but I’m new, I could have missed something), nothing to install. There’s a link on the main page. That’s it.

    He had to make them a shortcut on the desktop because otherwise they didn’t know where to find the link to the application or that they just have to follow that same link every time or whateverthehell was the problem. *headdesk*

    A shortcut == installing

    *headdesk*

    I’m sending the new ones links in the email, with a helpful advice to put them on the desktop. They should be able to figure it out.

    Any IT person I ever asked a stupid question: I’m sorry. I’m so very sorry.

  322. 322
    birgerjohansson

    “You will ooobeeeey it NOOOOOOOOOOW”

    But the hypnotic command is countermanded by both my Mohdri brain parasite (Zahn: “Night Train to Rigel”) and my arachnid parasitic group mind (“Sensation”). I am not certain how the brain chip implanted during my abduction is responding to the disturbances.
    — — — — — — — — —
    “Rice-cell cocktail kills cancer cells, leaves normal cells alone” http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-01-rice-cell-cocktail-cancer-cells.html Interesting.
    —- —- —- —- —- —– —- —-
    I am leaving work now. I hope the book “Emperor Mollusk” has arrived at home.

  323. 323
    Matt Penfold

    Any IT person I ever asked a stupid question: I’m sorry. I’m so very sorry.

    It is not the first time a user does or asks something silly that is irritating. It is when they do or ask the same thing over and over again.

    I once had to explain three times to a deputy head of a university school of computing that in order to use a network printer he had to be logged onto the network. In the end we gave up and forced him to login.

  324. 324
    A. Noyd

    AJ Milne (#318)

    A. Noyd, if you see him again, tell him I’d like the number of his HR department. I have just been handed a very constructive suggestion.

    I wish I could! And I wouldn’t mind getting the name of the guy he fired to tell him what the douchebag had done in case they still have contact somehow (like through their jobs). Alas, I didn’t get a good look at him since he was behind me and it was dark.

  325. 325
    rq

    Parrowing
    Welcome!

    Caine
    *thumbs up* for the picture!

    +++

    Day 1 down.
    And another anxiety-filled nail-nibbling wait on that marvellous institution calling itself bank. Because the official reply to all our questions will be tomorrow.

  326. 326
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    But unofficially, you have a confirmation that everything is ok?

  327. 327
    rq

    Beatrice
    Unofficially, yes. But we’re not popping the real champagne until we have official word (you know, just in case, and last-minute, and all that…). Meanwhile, I’m getting virtually drunk because I’m still drinking my never-ending bottle of champagne, and the whole wait is making me way too nervous about the whole thing. I mean, I know it’s supposed to be nerve-wracking anyway, and it’s a bank – never known for their incredible speed, unless they want to collect on that huge interest you owe. *sigh*
    Sounds like your work is going great, though. :P :) How do you feel about the job?

  328. 328
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    Meh. It’s supposed to be training for my profession, but since my profession is applied mathematician, it was difficult to find anything appropriate in this fucked up economy.

    So I’m basically in IT, in information systems but dealing with all kinds of things (no programming, it basically comes down to customer support in working the application). And actually not learning all that much. Taking notes at meetings unrelated to our department, tasks the new employee usually gets. Bosses seem really nice and will try to send me to seminars and things that can look good in the CV. Still, nothing remotely related to applied mathematics. I knew I should have been a better student so that I could pursue a doctoral degree abroad and rock the world of mathematics and shit.

    In short:
    You know – working for the government. That should tell you a lot.

  329. 329
    rq

    Beatrice
    It does. ;) Same as me. Low funding, a lot of bureaucracy, and a lot of work external to the job description. Gotcha. ;)

    katenrala
    Funny, your As and Es are the same colour as my As and Es (although my As are probably a bit more minty than coolgreen) – and your Ks are not far off from mine (they vary from bright red to maroon for me, depending on what’s next to them). :)
    But my Rs are black, and Ns a light blue. ;)

    birgerjohansson @297
    See, they drop those little tidbits for your inspiration. :) Now be inspired and do better with that poor little vole!

  330. 330
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    None if it would be as bad if I were paid as a regular first-time employee. But they took me on this government measure where I’m payed some little bits of nothing from the unemployment services. (converted to US dollars, it’s about $280 a month)

  331. 331
    rq

    Beatrice
    Ooooh right, you mentioned that… Is there any chance of getting hired as a first-time employee
    (do you have a set length of employment?)? Or do you have to grin and bear it, and have it look good on your CV?

  332. 332
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    Grin and bear it. I can break the contract if I get a real job, but they sure won’t be the ones to offer it to me before the year is up.
    There is a slight possibility of staying there after this year, as a normal employee.

  333. 333
    Parrowing

    Thanks Tony, Janine, mildlymagnificent, athyco, Dalillama, cicely, ednaz, theophontes, Giliell, Ogvorbis, Beatrice, and rq

    *

    Tony, sangria?! Where is it?!

    *

    Caine, I love your project!

    *

    Improbable Joe, I hope your dog feels better soon :(

    *

    rq, I’m holding my thumbs for you in hopes that you won’t have to wait much longer for official confirmation. I’ve never bought a house before and it seems really exciting and terrifying. I hope you manage to feel more of the former than the latter :).

    *

    AshPlant, it’s really interesting reading about your story. I just had an idea for a new book and I will end up having to solve a similar problem to yours. I really should just finish the book I’m writing now but I’m not feeling nearly as excited about it as I was, mostly because I realized that there’s a major flaw.

    *

    katenrala, Whenever I read another synesthete’s letter colors, all I can think is “No, no, no, that’s completely wrong.” I’m sure my colors would seem just as wrong to someone else ;).

    I actually conducted a mini-experiment that had to do with synesthesia a few months ago. My sample size was one, the experiment wasn’t blinded, and the rest of my methods were shoddy. Would you like to hear about it? :)

    *

    So yesterday I was doing the dishes and a glass broke while I was washing it. It did a number on my hand, though thankfully I don’t need stitches. Right now it’s all bandaged up, which is making it rather difficult to type, but the pain has mostly gone away. Can’t really do the dishes anymore though, so they’ll be piling up until my husband, who’s got a bad cold, can get to them. In the meantime, I think I’ll attempt to invent some sort of contraption that will do the dishes for me. And it shall be called Plate and Other Kitchen Items Scrubber and Cleaner! Catchy, huh?

  334. 334
    Parrowing

    Oh and:

    Janine, it makes a world of difference being able to watch people here. Not only does it help me hone my own arguments, but it keeps me from letting myself feel gaslighted, and reassures me that there are incredibly intelligent people who are willing to take this shit on over and over again. I’m trying to be one of those people.

    *

    Athyco, that is an impressive effort you’re putting in with your uncle. I’ve never felt really good at debating, although I suppose with my brother and with your uncle, it’s not so much a debate as it is trying to convince them not to be such assholes.

  335. 335
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    Public service announcement:

    You will often find that employers, university departments, and the like provide resources that will make your life much, much easier.

    Avoid them.

    Because the minute you start to get accustomed to making your life easier by making use of those resources, they will start finding excuses to either take them away entirely or limit them in a way that prevents you from actually making your life easier with them.

    And they will also start finding ways to twist words and introduce sneaky assumptions to make you sound like a total asshole for objecting to having completely unanticipated inconveniences introduced for arbitrary-to-nebulous reasons.

  336. 336
    rq

    Parrowing
    Thanks for the thumbs! ;) Theoretically things should be cleared up by last Friday, so the weekend was a bit pins-and-needles. And theoretically all should be well.
    But you know how the waiting is.
    And yes, it is exciting and terrifying. Right now – nerve-wracking. :)

  337. 337
    Pteryxx

    eee, welcome Parrowing to the shark tank, and take care with those bandaged thumbs. ;>

  338. 338
    cicely

    I agree that Legion would make an awesome tee shirt—and people who are unduly distressed by the use of “motherfucker” in this context probably need to be distressed; shake ‘em out of that complacent, “We don’t discuss such unpleasant things!” viewpoint.
    -

    What the…here I try to come up with ideas for “”interesting GM organisms, and you have this marvellous specimen of carnivore rodent all along!

    So, you super-size the grasshopper mouse and put it in the same ecosystem with the giant scorpion.
     
    Or, wait! You super-size the mice, then use them as mounts for the nomadic gnomes of the desert wastes. In their off-time as mounts, the mice act as sentries for the camp-site, eating anything that wanders too close…including Player Characters, if they make an incautious approach….
    *scribbling notes…for later*
    -

    And it shall be called Plate and Other Kitchen Items Scrubber and Cleaner! Catchy, huh?

    Positively daQuirmian!
    :D
    -

  339. 339
    Parrowing

    Thanks, Pteryxx! And I will.

  340. 340
    rq

    Azkyroth
    Are sympathies in order?

    Parrowing
    Also, I hope the dish-washing hands heal fast but not too quickly. ;) If you know what I mean. And be careful with the glass wound, my sister got one once (squeezed some crystal a bit too hard while washing it), and while initially it was deemed not-that-bad, she ended up needing 6 stitches… Take care of it!

  341. 341
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Hey folks… :) Back from the vet. Apparently some dogs have anal glands that go POP! if their diets and pooping schedules change. Ginger has had some pooping issues since we moved here(dehydration and altitude-related, if my own health is any indication), so that explains that. No infection, no permanent damage. Nothing major, just antibiotics and pain meds for the next week or so, and canned pumpkin added to her food for bulk. YAY!

    Caine: That’s a great looking project you got going… one criticism. Can you make the “motherfucker” a little bigger? :)

  342. 342
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    A Noyd#278
    I actually just saw an article a couple months ago about a court case in I think Alabama, holding that that was a perfectly legitimate reason to fire someone

  343. 343
    rq

    Improbable Joe
    Fewf, well that’s some good news about the dog! :) Hooray indeed!

  344. 344
    Tony! The Queer Shoop

    Parrowing:
    Ouch. I second rq’s suggestion to get taken care of thoroughly.

    ****
    You know for a “We are legion” teeshirt, I wonder if people would whine about MOFO, rather than the full word…

    ****
    IJoe:
    So good to hear Ginger is ok.

  345. 345
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Thanks for the well-wishes aimed at my puppy. I told her that everyone thinks she’s the sweetest thing ever… not that she understand “Daddy’s friends on the Internet machine hope you’re OK!” but she appreciates the attention in any case.

    And it was relatively cheap too, which once you know your dog is well becomes the main concern. It was just a little over $100, which is about 18 times cheaper than that time she ate a whole ham bone and perforated her intestines. She’s insisting I go take a nap with her, so ya’lluns don’t let nothing interesting happen while I’m gone. :)

  346. 346
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    It seems like every division here thinks they understand interpretation. Just got a sign for a restored piece of railway equipment. The sign is not to agency standards. The writing is poor (first sentence: passive voice, ends with a preposition (all sentences but one are passive voice (actually, worse than passive — would have been, would be))). But, it comes from someone higher than me in the hierarchy, so I mounted the damn thing.

    iJoe:

    Good news about the canine.

    rq:

    Fingers and toes crossed.

  347. 347
    rq

    Ogvorbis
    You can cross your toes? You must have monkey in your family tree somewhere. ;) (Thanks! I appreciate the thoughts!)

  348. 348
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    ou can cross your toes? You must have monkey in your family tree somewhere. ;)

    On both feet, toe three rest on top of toe two. And toe four is partially under toe three.

    And yes, yes I do.

    Wait. Are you talking about Old World Monkeys or New World Monkeys? I think the New World Monkeys split off before the monkey/ape split.

  349. 349
    rq

    Ogvorbis
    I meant the monkeys, but you know how it is with all these hairless apes of several shades – they all look the same, tail or no tail. ;)

    You sound like you have ballerina toes.

  350. 350
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    You sound like you have ballerina toes.

    No, more like hammer toes.

    And now that I think of it, where the split between Old and New World Monkeys takes place doesn’t affect our being related, it would just change how far back the node was. Sorry.

  351. 351
    rq

    Ogvorbis
    Well, if you want to go back far enough, we’re all just oversized rats anyway. Or fish. Or amoebae. Or… self-replicating molecules in a sludge of poison.

  352. 352
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    True. But we are still more closely related to even a new world monkey than we are to a rat.

  353. 353
    Parrowing

    rq, Oh, I really hope I don’t end up needing stitches. The biggest cut is fairly wide but not very deep, so I’ll give it a few days. The one health care center I can get to without paying a lot for transportation doesn’t take drop-ins anymore, so I’m back to feeling like I shouldn’t go to the doctor unless absolutely necessary, like I felt when I was in the US.

    By the way, back when you gave out the link for your choir, I voted. Your choir sounds amazing and now I get to be proud of the Latvian text message I received :).

  354. 354
    Pteryxx

    random lawl: Oh internet weirdness, never change.

    via BB:

    Pixelated indie RPG Minecraft now has the ability to use animated textures for its chunky world-blocks. Perhaps you’re thinking that the modding community will be use this feature to create subtly-windswept vegetation and more convincing lava? No. It will be used to make you retch. [via RPS]

    youtube video, warning for motion sickness

  355. 355
    Pteryxx

    Parrowing, it’s your hand that’s cut? Is the cut somewhere you can wrap it or tape it and have it stay well closed and dry and all that? IIRC (and IANAMD) stitches need to go into a wound that won’t stay closed otherwise, *and* while it’s fresh, because after a few days it might need to stay open rather than get closed over potential infection. (Someone with better first aid help me out here?)

  356. 356
    Parrowing

    It’s taped down pretty tight right now and I’ve got butterfly bandages keeping it closed. My MIL is a nurse so she came right over and wrapped it up for me. We’re low on first aid supplies, though, so she doesn’t want me to change the dressings until Thursday…

  357. 357
    Pteryxx

    Yikes, plz rest it and keep it dry, Parrowing, you only just started typing here. <3 (Plastic bags help; so does duct tape…)

    —–

    Other news: Armintrout's first chapter of The Boss is up, a day early!

    http://abigailbarnettestheboss.blogspot.com/2013/01/chapter-one.html

    Background on the project: http://jenniferarmintrout.blogspot.com/2012/11/super-big-announcement.html

    Years ago, I did an interview with The Hathor Legacy in which I said that I didn’t think it was possible to write a feminist romance novel. At the time, I really didn’t think it would be possible. Then 50 Shades of Grey and all of its weird little copycat stories came along, and lo, I realized that it would be entirely possible to write a feminist romance novel. And I could do it in the exciting new genre that Cyndy at Brazen Reads called ” “unrealistic erotica involving little research and even less editing”. All I have to do is the exact opposite of everything in those books.

  358. 358
    rq

    Parrowing
    Sounds like you’re in good hands. ;)
    And thanks for the vote that time! I’m glad you treasure your Latvian SMS. If you ever need another, let me know!

    Ogvorbis
    True enough.

    +++

    Up early tomorrow again, so I say good night and best wishes to all! Pile of hugs and a stack of drinks of choice.

  359. 359
    katenrala

    Sad. Unhappy. To tired to be angry.
    >
    I had to get medi-gap insurance as I’m on medicare for my disability and there were only two companies in the state of Nevada I could sign up with. One company I don’t remember the name of anymore, the other was Anthem blue cross.
    >
    I signed up for a individual policy at $180 a month, but the first bill I got was $290 because they just raised their rates. Well I heard on the news a few days ago that they were raising their rates again and my policy now costs $350 a month. That’s more than half my social security check I get for disability after medicare fees and my prescription drug insurance take their cut. I called and talked to them and no there’s nothing I can do.
    >
    It’s not right that they can just raise their rates willy-nilly on the backs of the sick just trying to scrape by.
    >
    Freaking money grubbing companies are going to turn serfs out of all of us, suck our energies dry at the workplace with longer shifts, larger workloads, and less pay. They don’t want us to have hobbies; to be creative; to have the mental energy to think; or have free time in general. No they want people to get home, eat a joyless meal, and sleep so we can give them our precious energy and time the next day. They believe we are stealing from them by having our own energy and time left over after work. How dare we not give them our all! My mother’s workload tripled this year and yet she has to take another pay-cut as well, on top the pay-cuts over the last four years. She’s making now the same pay she started at in the 90′s at the same place she started at. And these insurance companies get to decide the worth of our lives and who gets to live and who gets to die because death is profitable, like the case where that teen girl needed a liver but her insurance said no, or that man who had to sue for his very life as his insurance did not want to continue to bear the costs of treatment for him. I myself have had my catastrophic pay that was owed to me not ponied up and have been kicked out of hospitals and denied cancer treatment at others over money, and necessary drugs denied me by my insurance, drugs too expensive to buy without my insurance.
    >
    I’m going to take a nap now.
    >
    What’s up with the line breaks… again?

  360. 360
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Pteryxx,

    Already read the first chapter of The Boss and I like it. It reminds me of something, and it’s not Fifty Shades of Abuse.

    —-
    katenrala,

    *hugs*
    I can’t decide whether I should go with “fuck US” or “fuck capitalism”.

  361. 361
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I can’t decide whether I should go with “fuck US” or “fuck capitalism”.

    How about, “Fuck the perverted version of Spencerian and lassaiz faire capitalism that the US has injected into the world?

  362. 362
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    How about, “Fuck the perverted version of Spencerian and lassaiz faire capitalism that the US has injected into the world?

    Sounds good.

  363. 363
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    Er, not good good. Fitting.

  364. 364
    cicely

    *hug* for katenrala.
    -
    Beatrice, in this case I’d go with “fuck the for-maximium-profit-ness of the insurance companies”.
     
    Once upon a time, we had insurance through our work, and it was wonderful; it literally saved my life at least once, probably twice. Then they started to jack up the price, year after year, and to contest every. single. pay-out, even for services explicitly spelled out in the policy—my suspicion is that the plan was to wear people down, make it seem not worth the hassle, and just pay the damned bill. Eventually the company could no longer afford it, and it was even more laughably out of reach to even dream of getting an individual policy. If my face were to swell up and try to kill me now, we’d probably just have to let it.
     
    I think that the local insurance companies have finally learned not to send their salespeople here, because I will tell them, in long and bitter detail, the failings of their wares.
    -

  365. 365
    David Marjanović

    *peeks in*
    *sees reason to dump heap of hugs on the floor*
    *does so*
    *tries to leave*

    I agree that Legion would make an awesome tee shirt—and people who are unduly distressed by the use of “motherfucker” in this context probably need to be distressed; shake ‘em out of that complacent, “We don’t discuss such unpleasant things!” viewpoint.

    Yes yes yesssss!!! Absolutely.

    And I’m surprised that WordPress is blocked in China. I guess I shouldn’t be – Blogspot is blocked there, but I thought that was because it’s owned by Google…

  366. 366
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    /whinge

    Still snowing.
    57cm as measured in one part of the town, and 68cm in another (where I live)

    This is not going to be fun in the morning.

  367. 367
    David Marjanović

    *adds carefully arranged plate of Newtonmas cookies*

  368. 368
    David Marjanović

    Whoa. Over here, there are, like, 1 or 2 cm of snow, and I have to be happy there’s any at all.

  369. 369
    Jadehawk

    Um… I feel bad. I helped spread the epidemic around Fargo-Moorhead about 6 weeks ago by taking the bus to do my shopping and whatnot even though I wasn’t feeling great. In my defense, I didn’t know I had the flu (or was actually sick) until a few days later when I was all but bedridden; I thought it was just stress and exhaustion from the upcoming end of term.

    So, feel free to blame me instead. :)

    Alright, so I guess we have this all sorted now: you infected the boyfriend while driving around Fargo; boyfriend infected me; I infected a shitload of people at various transportation hubs across 2 continents

  370. 370
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    Complaints:
    (1) I have sprained (unknown how) my left wrist. Hurts! Have put a brace on it, which helps, but also makes for awkwardness.

    (2) It is fucking January. I should not worry about my snow tires suffering heat-related failure.

  371. 371
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    Also, this pattern is not acceptable:
    Days 1-4: Snow, adding up to 50+ centimeters.
    Day 5: Clear and sunny, just above freezing.
    Days 6-8: Cloudy, around -10 C.
    Days 9-10: Clear and sunny, around +15 C.

    Seriously. There is a fucking lake of mud.

    Oh, and today (day 11) it is around 4 or 5 C. With another bout of 30-40 cm of snow in the forecast, followed by sub-freezing temperatures and high winds.

  372. 372
    cicely

    *flyingtacklepouncehug* for David Marjanović .
     
    Before he Makes Good His Escape.
    -

  373. 373
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    We have no snow on the ground as yet, but based on the snowfall I was seeing on my way to work, I’m looking at seeing a good coating on my way home.

  374. 374
    Inaji

    Thank you, rq, Parrowing, IJoe, Cicely & David! ♥

    Katenrala, that absolutely sucks. I’m sorry. Anything I can do? Anything I could send you?

    Esteleth, the whole “fucked up my left wrist” business is not supposed to be contagious!

  375. 375
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Good evening

    So, by now I’m convinced of the incompetence bordering on maliciousness of the hospital mum is in. Remember that they wanted to call the university hospital for transfer if things didn’t look better today? Well, let’s postpone it to Wednesday because we can’t be arsed to call today…

    katenrala
    Oh fuck, I’m sorry

    rq
    Carefull “YAY” for the house

    +++
    I have to admit that I simply don’t like the word “motherfucker”. Don’t like the conotations.

  376. 376
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    giliell
    *headdesk* Wow. That’s really, really, really not good.

    “Motherfucker” is rather Oedipal, don’t you think?

  377. 377
    dianne

    Beatrice, in this case I’d go with “fuck the for-maximium-profit-ness of the insurance companies”.

    I disagree. Fucking is fun and they shouldn’t be having it.

    Feed private insurance companies that are more interested in their bottom lines than their customers to hungry hagfish.

  378. 378
    Dalillama, Schmott Guy

    Katenrala
    That makes my insurance headaches sound positively heavenly. Of course, I h ave one of those public sector ‘cadillac’ health plans. *spits* Worthless fucking excuse for a fucking country. There are days when I just hate Americans soooo fucking much, because it seems lik two thirds of the fucking country is so mired in hatred and propaganda that it’s like wading through hip deep fucking crazy glue to try to even discuss fucking reality with them, let alone get anything fucking done.

  379. 379
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Looks like NOM is trying to have influence in France.

    So that explains why Brian Brown (and possibly other NOM staffers) are over in France. These conservative Catholic Republicans from the United States are trying to tell the French people how to conduct their affairs. Because being told what to do by Americans is something the French people love, right?

  380. 380
    Jadehawk

    NOM is trying to tell the French how to have relationships?

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  381. 381
    Jadehawk

    I’m sorry but I just can’t get over this. NOM in France? the country with the 2nd lowest marriage rates, where domestic partners can obtain the same* benefits as married couples? Where civil unions are what straight couples do?

    HAHAHAHAHAHA

    sorry folks. French marriage is toast, no matter how much you hate on gay people.

    - – - – - –
    *except for inheritance, apparently.

  382. 382
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Jadehawk, I am pleased that I brought you great amusement.

  383. 383
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    Hi Parrowing; welcome! I also have 2 kittehs.

    Caine, I LOVE that project. What colour scheme are you planning?

    katenrala: *hugs*, that sounds terrible.
    Isn’t the dreaded Obamacare supposed to stop that sort of thing? If not, what bloody use is it?

    I don’t usually remember my dreams because I wake up naturally these days. I need to wake from REM sleep to do that – usually that means an alarm, or possibly a cat. But the last couple of days I’ve had poor sleep and bad dreams. One’s a variant of the “can’t move” dream where it’s my motorcycle that won’t move. It can’t get up a hill, all the acceleration has gone, I’m stuck. (Yes, that does seem metaphorical)

  384. 384
    birgerjohansson

    Isn’t Zagreb in the fortunate part of former Yugoslavia, way up north in Slovenia that broke loose before the genocidal madness started? Slovenia had the right idea.
    — — — — — — — — — —
    Cicely:
    Great idea, but what will we use as herbivores for the monster-infested ecosystem? Ankylosaurs? Or that T rex turned herbivore with its three giant claws on each hand?

    — — — — — — — — — —
    I have what should be the official theme and official video of the People’s Republic of Pharyngulia:

    “Shriekback – Nemesis” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bMM61Y5CEU
    That stuff takes me back.
    .
    “We have made Evil
    an exact science..”
    “We suck the juices of the dying”
    .
    -Wait a minute. They are running a US insurance company! They are one-percenters!

  385. 385
    Inaji

    Alethea:

    Caine, I LOVE that project. What colour scheme are you planning?

    Shades of gray. :D

    Thank you!

  386. 386
    Jadehawk

    anyway, on a more serious note: fuck NOM, and I hope the same-sex marriage & same-sex adoption bill the French government is talking about right now passes; and that someone explains French marriage-statistics and trends to the NOMs, just to shock and disappoint them as hard as humanly possible (bonus: someone please mention to them that there’s such a thing as a certificat de concubinage notoire).

  387. 387
    Jadehawk

    Shades of gray. :D

    perfect

  388. 388
    birgerjohansson

    Dianne,
    Hagfish are too good for those greedy sociopaths. Try “maggot farm”.
    — — — — — — — —
    Purring furry predator sitting at my keyboard trying to lick my nose. I feel fine.

  389. 389
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Here’s Gracie, taking over the bed.

  390. 390
    rorschach

    And I’m surprised that WordPress is blocked in China

    My wordpress.org blog isn’t. Maybe it’s just WP.com, or they filter individual ones.

  391. 391
    FossilFishy (NOBODY, and proud of it!)

    I don’t do T-shirts as a rule these days. Especially not ones with words on them. That said, I’d be pleased as all fuck to have one with that on it Caine. Fantastic.

    Giliell Fucking hell that’s stupid. I’m so sorry.

    rq Oh I’ve been there. Bank, it’s a four letter word that shouldn’t be uttered in polite company.

    Framing on Chez Fishy (Ghost Trail Villa) is suppose to commence on the 23rd. We’re having a slab party next weekend. I love the process of spousal idea osmosis (SIO). Alethea, IIRC, suggested a slab party and I mentioned it to Mrs. Fishy. Now, weeks later, she comes up with the idea completely “independently”.

    This is another instance where I wish I was a bit younger. A slab in Australia is a package of 24 beers, also known as a two-fer in Canadianese. Having a slab on the slab would be perfect but there’s no way we’re drinking that much. The only friends we have here that would be willing to help are expecting a baby, all the rest are wine drinkers.

  392. 392
    FossilFishy (NOBODY, and proud of it!)

    “Shriekback – Nemesis”

    Any song correctly using a seven syllable word for asexual reproduction gets my vote.

  393. 393
    Azkyroth Drinked the Grammar Too :)

    …so, apparently, one of my meatspace friends is now mad at me for suggesting that technical sales might be an enjoyable career for him, since he equates it with retail which he thinks he’s above, and the other is probably now mad at me because I find her “derangement syndrome”-type behavior regarding gun control unpleasant. It occurred to me today that she is still furious with a friend of a friend who “jokingly” suggested, a year ago, that she should kill herself, and yet she blows off accidental deaths due to mishandling of guns as “Darwinism in action.” A third, who follows through on making plans with me and keeping in touch with me infrequently enough to make it difficult to count, is now moving to Bakersfield this week.

    I need better friends. Anyone have a spare?

  394. 394
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Azkyroth

    *headbonks*

  395. 395
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Brian Brown of NOM pretends that he is part of the French Revolution.

    I write to you from France, where a pro-marriage rebellion is underway! Francois Hollande, the ultra liberal President of France, swept into power last May, promising among many other things a swift legalizing of same-sex marriage and adoption. But the people of France did not want this to be. You see, the French people know in their bones that every child deserves a mother and father. And so they took to the streets – hundreds of thousands of them! I am proud to be a part of this historic moment in France. I have been so excited to be part of this new international solidarity movement in defense of marriage, children and family. I will certainly be reflecting more on this experience on my flight home.

    And I would ask you to join me in thinking about more creative ways we can proclaim our pro-marriage views with passion and conviction…and in the public square where our fellow Americans can see our fervor and resolution. I can’t wait to come back to the country I love. But I am inspired to see that those of us in America who hold the institution of marriage sacred truly have so many friends overseas and around the world. A new day is dawning for marriage. As I said when I ended a speech last night before a group of French leaders in the fight to protect marriage: Vive le Marriage — Vive la France!

    The prose is so purple!

  396. 396
    Inaji

    Giliell, motherfucker still has the power to shock, which is why I think I used it initially.
    Now that I have the small piece in the works, I think I may do a large version at some point, with more silhouettes and a different colour scheme. That one I could do ‘clean’, with it reading “We are legion, and we will not be silenced.”

  397. 397
    katenrala

    @ Caine, Fleur du mal +

    I don’t need anything but thank you for the offer.

    @ Everyone Else

    Thank you for your support.

    (:

  398. 398
    Inaji

    Jadehawk & Fossil Fishy, thanks!

    Janine, that prose is puke inducing. Yikes.

    Rorschach, I’m not wordpress.org, but one of the gazillion blogs on wordpress.com. I’m pretty sure it’s not me, ’cause a blog about needlework is hardly subversive.

  399. 399
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Janine, that prose is puke inducing. Yikes.

    I am sure you can feel that in your bones.

  400. 400
    Inaji

    Janine:

    I am sure you can feel that in your bones.

    Yeah, pretty much and they all feel sick. It’s an absolute horror, how cheerful that assclam is at the thought of successfully oppressing others. It’s difficult to express my contempt.

  401. 401
    birgerjohansson

    The prose could have been written by a robot programmed with cliches. Sadly, much of what I read on-line about politics in USA sound the same.
    — —- — —
    “Still has the power to shock” until the generations that grew up with “South Park” are in majority.
    — — — —
    “Chimpanzees successfully play the ‘ultimatum game’: Confirmation of apes’ sense of fairness” http://phys.org/news/2013-01-chimpanzees-successfully-ultimatum-game-apes.html -Obviously a necessary tool for survival, proving Ayn Rand wrong for the millionth time.
    — — — —
    Gene flow from India to Australia about 4,000 years ago http://phys.org/news/2013-01-gene-india-australia-years.html
    The event seems to coincide with the arrival of the Dingo.

  402. 402
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Here, Caine, is a photo of Brian Brown crying when LGBT marriage was passed in New York.

    Hell yes I will laugh at his tears.

  403. 403
    Jadehawk

    Francois Hollande, the ultra liberal President of France

    the one time it would have actually been accurate to call someone a socialist, and they go with “ultra liberal” instead.

    *facepalm*

    But the people of France did not want this to be.

    1)Hollande campaigned on legalizing same sex marriage, and the French elected him
    2) over 60% of the French have been in favor of same sex marriage, consistently, for years. And as of the latest poll, 53% are in favor of gay adoptions.

    You see, the French people know in their bones that every child deserves a mother and father.

    which is why about 20% of French children live in single parent households.

    this new international solidarity movement in defense of marriage

    it’s dead, Jim Brian.

  404. 404
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    it’s dead, Jim Brian.

    I’m still waiting for an non-hysterical reason why the Readhead’s gay cousin marriage to his partner of 20+ years hurts the Redhead’s and my marriage of almost 40 years…Nothing but idiocy to date….

  405. 405
    Inaji

    Janine:

    Hell yes I will laugh at his tears.

    More like a tantrum, I’d say. I’ll bet a full stamping of his feetsies followed.

  406. 406
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    But Jadehawk, there is still three marriages for every two civil unions! Therefore, the french people in their bones know that children have to have a mommy and daddy This is moral law we are ranting about!

  407. 407
    FossilFishy (NOBODY, and proud of it!)

    It’s difficult to express my contempt.

    Heh, as one whose prose tends towards the ultraviolet I’m willing to have a go.

    Oh Brian Brown, your tears are salt upon the earth, scorching the land ’til it resembles the barren wasteland that is your compassion. To those who would have people love as they will your crying is like a balm unto their wounds. For your weeping in the joy time of others means that that joy has been made manifest in the law of the land, and now your pain has become the water of life to our dry and dessicated garden of love. Or….

    Fuck you, you motherfucking bigoted sinkhole of hate, ignorance and regressive values.

  408. 408
    ednaz

    katenrala – I am so sorry. Is it o.k. that I yelled ‘Fucking Assholes Insurance Company!!’ when I read your story? If so, I am wide awake and I will be pissed off for you.
    The civlized side sends *hugs*.
    -

    Esteleth – Your poor wrist! I’m so sorry. Sendings *hugs* and hot tea (or something stronger if you wish).
    -

    rq – I hope you have confirmation by the time you read this. *hugs* Waiting on pins and needles is No Fun.

  409. 409
    chigau (違う)

    It snowed about 10cm of fluffy snow during the day.
    Now, at night, it’s raining.
    fucking stupid weather

  410. 410
    ednaz

    chigau @ 282 –
    (teal’c voice) Indeed. (teal’c voice)

    We must toast with (bottles) of rum! : )

    -

    IJoe – So glad Ginger is going to be o.k. *hugs* (for you) and gentle pets for Ginger

    -

    Beatrice – I read the first chapter of The Boss. I found it interesting right away. Look forward to getting your opinion. : )

  411. 411
    Inaji

    Watched Frankenweenie tonight. Wonderful.

  412. 412
    ednaz

    FossilFishy @ 406

    Fuck you, you motherfucking bigoted sinkhole of hate, ignorance and regressive values.

    -

    Seconded.

  413. 413
    cicely

    Feed private insurance companies that are more interested in their bottom lines than their customers to hungry hagfish.

    “A change we can believe in!”
    -

    Great idea, but what will we use as herbivores for the monster-infested ecosystem? Ankylosaurs?

    Souped-up ants (just add venomous stings!), maybe some variant termites (scenarios practically write themselves).
    -

  414. 414
    chigau (違う)

    Rum
    It’s not just for breakfast any more!
    [I just googled the origin of that 'breakfast' trope.]
    [wholly fork. Anita Bryant and orange juice.]

  415. 415
    FossilFishy (NOBODY, and proud of it!)

    Great idea, but what will we use as herbivores for the monster-infested ecosystem? Ankylosaurs?

    Zombie Atkin’s dieters : “Grains, GRAAAAAINSSSS…..!”

  416. 416
    Amblebury

    Shriekback? Shriekback got a mention?

    Best concert I’ve ever been to, hands down. Even better than the Elvis Costello concert where Steve Nieve got all pissy and kicked his keyboard over.

  417. 417
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ David Marjanović

    [wordpress,google]

    As a simple rule-of-thumb, the government hate all (particularly western) social media and google. There is a huge element of arbitrariness in all this. I can, for example happily log on to Pharyngula via my wordpress account. Some features of google work sometimes. My colleague goes onto facebook with his smartphone and google’s DNS (seriously WTF?) but cannot via computer. It appears their left hand knows not what the right hand is doing…

  418. 418
    Hekuni Cat, MQG

    rorschach:

    Was almost harder to kill the draugrs in the next room, actually!

    Have you noticed that if you look closely, you can tell the difference between the just dead bodies and the draugrs waiting to surprise you in the catacombs? If you recognize them and have a bow, you can eliminate them before you get close enough to activate them. Of course that won’t help with the free-range draugrs.

    Giliell – I’m so sorry about your niece. *hugs*

    Parrowing – Welcome to the Lounge! Your kittehs are beautiful. And sorry about your hand.

    JAL – I hope you all feel better soon.

    katenrala – *hugs*

    David Marjanović – *pouncehug*

    Esteleth – I hope your wrist heals quickly. *hugs*

    Caine – Legion is wonderful. ♥ And I would love to have a t-shirt of it too.

  419. 419
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Hey Parrowing don’t I know you from somewhere?

    Thanks ednaz but no petting Ginger tonight. She bit my wife pretty badly during an failed attempt at giving Ginger her antibiotics.

    Fuck hospitals, fuck insurance companies, fuck capitalism. Profit is theft!

  420. 420
    cicely

    [I just googled the origin of that 'breakfast' trope.]
    [wholly fork. Anita Bryant and orange juice.]

    Ah, yes, I remember it well. Ms. Squeaky Clean essentially torpedoed her career.
    -

  421. 421
    chigau (違う)

    nonono, cicely
    “gay people” destroyed her career.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Bryant#Career_decline_and_bankruptcies
    I don’t know which ‘career’ this was.

  422. 422
    katenrala

    @ 332 Parrowing

    katenrala, Whenever I read another synesthete’s letter colors, all I can think is “No, no, no, that’s completely wrong.” I’m sure my colors would seem just as wrong to someone else ;).

    I actually conducted a mini-experiment that had to do with synesthesia a few months ago. My sample size was one, the experiment wasn’t blinded, and the rest of my methods were shoddy. Would you like to hear about it? :)

    Sure, that’d be interesting to read. :)

    @ 407 ednaz

    katenrala – I am so sorry. Is it o.k. that I yelled ‘Fucking Assholes Insurance Company!!’ when I read your story? If so, I am wide awake and I will be pissed off for you.
    The civlized side sends *hugs*.

    That’s the correct response. :) Thank you.

    @ 417 Hekuni Cat, MQG

    Thank you. :)

    __
    I love the commentariat here, people are so much nicer and caring than the last blog I invested a lot of time in.

  423. 423
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    Joe, I realize the cat’s already out of the barn, but next time… drape the cat in a towel from the neck down so she can’t get her claws out. Make sure she’s really wrapped up so it won’t fall off half-way through. Kneel down behind her, crossing your feet on the floor to create a cave. Lean over her and back her into the cave so she can’t run away. Put one hand under her jaws and use thumb and forefinger to apply gentle pressure at the sides to open mouth. Use other hand to feed medicine.

    Or, if it’s a solid, put it into a Pill Pocket and toss it to her. Bless whoever invented Pill Pockets.

    I’ve been down that road. Make sure that your wife gets the antibiotics that are recommended for cat bites, not just the usual ones. This is really important! Failure to do so cost me about six months of work and in an earlier era would have lost me a hand.

  424. 424
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Special content (Scientology propaganda) in The Atlantic on January 14, 2013.

    Dread Cthulhu Leads His Cult To Milestone Year

    (Something I learned today; my spellcheck recognizes “Cthulhu”.)

  425. 425
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Good morning
    Bah, fresh snow.

    Caine
    Oh, you know I have nothing against “bäd wördz”. I just don’t like that particular one.

    Hekunicat
    I have a niece?
    Thanks anyway, I suppose you meant my mum ;)

    +++

    You see, the French people know in their bones that every child deserves a mother and father. And so they took to the streets – hundreds of thousands of them!

    We in Europe call that commuting

  426. 426
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    Katenrala, the only thing I can suggest is to call your congresscritter and ask if anything can be done about insurance rates being raised after a company has accepted you or arbitrarily.

    At least some of the Catholic hierarchy are deluding themselves that ANY artificial contraception is. abortion: “Preventing fertilization is not a surgical, but a chemical or medical abortion,” said Father Melvin Castro, executive secretary of the Episcopal Commission on Family and Life, of the Catholic Bishops Conference of Philippines. (CNN story)

    Hugs for all, expecially katenrala and JAL and iJoe’s wife.

  427. 427
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    From waaaay back:

    Joe
    Congratulations on the Spokes-Guitar-In-Waiting!! How very awesome.

    Ogvorbis
    Happy late birthday and *thumbsup* on the nym post script : D

    But I woke up feeling happy.

    HOOOORAAAY. This warms my heart for you.

    Tony and Esteleth
    Woot for bigger paychecks!!!

    Giliell
    lots of hugs and best wishes for you and your family.

    Hi Parrowing! Welcome.

    Tony

    I think Portia is fixing sangria.

    Sorry I slacked on my sangria duties! I was off slurping margaritas and then have been trying to catch up on all you lovely people again before commenting. I’ve done some catching up, you can see, but not all. In the spirit of jumping back in, because I miss you all, I’ll say hello and then continue to read.

    I spent the weekend in Chicago with SO and his cousin, P. P has a flight back to her home in South America tomorrow. We showed her the city and some sights. (Sites? Sights and sites). It was an enjoyable time. We saw a fun band on Friday night and SO danced his dorky, rhythm-free, I’m-enjoying-myself dance. It was adorable and fun. I think we managed to show P a fun time, but she is so hard to read that I’m not sure : /

    = *deposits a pile of hugs onto the floor of the Lounge, along with a large pitcher of sangria* =

  428. 428
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Markita Lynda

    At least some of the Catholic hierarchy are deluding themselves that ANY artificial contraception is. abortion:

    Wait, wait, so now it’s “abortion” because conception was prevented?

    Does that mean I’m a serial killer? I haven’t ovulated in over 10 years, and I have been sexually active. And is that one abortion per non-conceptive sex act (including non-vaginal sex), or one abortion per month-without-ovulation? (Yes. I’m weird.)

  429. 429
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Caine

    I’ve started Legion, a Pharyngula inspired piece. I might even finish it someday! :D

    Very very cool. This gave me chills. I am so happy to have a warrior like you out front for people like me.

    Joe

    My dog blew out an anal gland thing today. We’re off to the vet in the morning. She’s pretty miserable about the whole thing.

    Poor Improbapup. : (

    ““““““““““
    And now I’m going to try to sleep. Catch you in the (CST) morning!

  430. 430
    rorschach

    Of course that won’t help with the free-range draugrs.

    It occurred to me that I was supposed to have a companion. Apparently I gave Faendal a “wait” command at some stage, and then marched on without him. When I went back and fetched him, the draugrs became more easy too kill!

    As I said, I suck at gaming…

  431. 431
    Ing

    @Rorschach
    pretty sure you’re aware but the best benefit of the companion is the decoy value. They can’t die from enemy attacks, but can die from yours….so at higher levels they become a burden (if not for the extra carrying capacity) due to the tendency to run in front of my arrows!

  432. 432
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    I’ve got two morons telling me that it’s “not abuse” to destroy another person’s property as “punishment”.

    I backed up my claim with sources. I suspect these two idjits are going “nuh-uh” because admitting I’m right would make them abusers, and “we can’t possibly be abusers!” (Please. You HIT YOUR KID to gain compliance, you destroy his property because “LOL, I bought it, so I get to control it.”

    What a couple of assholes.

  433. 433
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Ing

    Sounds like a case of Artificial Stupidity.

  434. 434
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    birgerjohansson,

    Isn’t Zagreb in the fortunate part of former Yugoslavia, way up north in Slovenia that broke loose before the genocidal madness started? Slovenia had the right idea.

    Nope. The capital of Croatia.
    The capital of Slovenia is Ljubljana. I am part Slovenian, btw.

    And I managed to get to work with relatively little trouble. Walked only part of the way.

  435. 435
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    Yes, so now you know that the whole “fertilized egg is a baby” was a lie, because even in the absence of a fertilized egg, the Catholic priests shake the whole “abortion = too terrible to allow” flag to shame and control women.

  436. 436
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    So it really is all about controlling the women and keeping us as nothing more than baby factories.

    Fuck.

  437. 437
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Can someone please explain this to me?

    If you take and destroy another adult’s property, it’s considered a crime, and is, in fact, a form of psychological abuse. But if you take your kid’s property, and destroy it, that’s your “right” as a parent.

    If you assault another adult for any reason beyond self-defense (and sometimes even then!), it’s a crime. But it’s just fine to smack your kid’s ass to teach him not to hit!

    People have this misconception that beatings, screaming matches, and “things that leave a mark” are “real” abuse, and anything less is something to be brushed off. And I just. don’t. get it. Some of the most damaging shit I went through was stealthy, insidious sneak-into-your-head-and-make-you-think-you-deserve-it head-games. Destroying my property — even taking a knife to a wheelchair cushion while accusing me of “caring more about a cushion than [I] do about [him].” And you know what? Dismissing that as “not really abuse” isn’t cool. It doesn’t help victims or survivors, because we already feel bad enough, and we don’t need society telling us that what we experienced wasn’t “real”.

    I still sometimes feel bad/guilty for calling myself a survivor, because a lot of what I went through wasn’t of the screaming, beating, leave-a-mark variety, but was of the mess-with-your-head manipulative cut-you-off make-you-small-and-worthless variety.

  438. 438
    John Morales

    WMDKitty:

    If you take and destroy another adult’s property, it’s considered a crime, and is, in fact, a form of psychological abuse. But if you take your kid’s property, and destroy it, that’s your “right” as a parent.

    Hm. When I was a child, everything I owned was given to me by my mother.

    (So far as I was concerned, it was her property)

  439. 439
    rq

    Good morning, and ‘fess up, whoever left that wonderful stomach virus in my USB last night. It’s already a stressful week, and now I’m forced to take a day off from seminars and thinking about banks to puke and feel generally miserable while Husband fixes me teas and soups… Hmmmmmmm, on second thought… Well, I could do without the puking, at any rate.

    +++

    *hugs* and sympathies for those who need them, and also a few right angry words at the screen for katenrala‘s insurance company.

    +++

    Beatrice
    Glad you made it to work ok! That’s a lot of snow, how’s the rest of city traffic moving?? I can imagine it’s terrible, especially closer to downtown where the old city doesn’t allow for vehicle traffic…

  440. 440
    WMDKitty -- Survivor

    Nope. Once it’s given, you lose any and all right to it.

    Would you accept that same logic if, say, your boss gave you a new chair for your desk, and then decided to destroy it?

    No?

    Then why expect a child to accept it?

  441. 441
    rq

    Also thanks to everyone holding thumbs and generally wishing well on the house. We’ll know soon soon soon…

    I am also planning on reading The Boss and will share my opinions here. Still have to get started, but once I do, I’ll give word!

  442. 442
    John Morales

    WMDKitty,

    Then why expect a child to accept it?

    I guess it’s up to the child themself.

    As for me, it was expected of me, and I had no problem with it.

    (Not to say other things weren’t problematic, in particular with respect to dashed expectations)

  443. 443
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    If the boss gave me a new chair, it would belong to the office.

    Speaking of “good without God,” this kidney donor is an atheist who can be found on Facebook in Military Atheists & Secular Humanists.

  444. 444
    John Morales

    WMDKitty, I want to make it clear I’m not trying to diminish your point, just to note different people have different experiences, and we grew up in different milieus to boot.

    I can see how a child who has personal stuff and someone cruel enough to destroy it would be exceedingly hurt.

  445. 445
    ednaz

    rq – My goodness! I hope you feel better soon. Well enough that you’re not miserable, but not so well that you don’t get waited on a little. : )

  446. 446
    John Morales

    Quite interesting: Early Australian migration wave linked to first dingoes

    Professor Alan Cooper from the Australian Centre for Ancient DNA unravels the story of the first dingoes to reach Australia.

  447. 447
    Lofty

    All property rights are conditional. Just the same as a government sets rules on what conditions ownership ceases under, a child should have the rights to ownership clear in their mind. So for a particular infraction of clearly stated rules, the child’s posession may be temporarily or permanently revoked. The rules have to be 100% clear up front and enforced without fail, or the child will not know what discipline is.
    However if there are no clearly stated rules and posessions are randomly removed or destroyed as punishment for unknown offences then that is cruelty. I think that if you expect a child to grow up properly understanding justice, it must first be fairly applied by their parents.

  448. 448
    John Morales

    Lofty,

    I think that if you expect a child to grow up properly understanding justice, it must first be fairly applied by their parents.

    I can’t agree with that.

    I reckon being subjected to injustice would be quite an incentive to seek justice.

  449. 449
    Lofty

    John Morales, of course some kids learn by example and some learn by being shown what not to do.
    Sample size: one, my lad was given clear rules and it seems to have worked. At 28 he’s pretty good. I always felt he needed rules and procedures because without them he floundered and couldn’t manage. Not every child learns the same way.

  450. 450
    John Morales

    Lofty, exactly! :)

  451. 451
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    So, I made it to college at about 20mph. Fuck snow and fuck trucks drivers who think that magically they are the ones who this time will get up that hill.

    Also, sometimes early 20s chill-girls can be funny. Subject of the seminar today was gender neutral language. In many languages you have a male and a female form where the male is treated as default (of course), so in German or Spanish you need to make pairs: Studentinnen und Studenten, chicos y chicas. In the discussion I pointed out that while most women will dismiss this as “unnecessary”, actually research exists that shows that women feel unconsciously excluded and unwelcome when you only use the male form.
    Other opinions (several of the young women echoed this): “Oh, I really don’t mind if there’s only the male form, it really doesn’t matter, I know they mean me, too, but, actually well, it is nicer if there’s the female form, too.”
    Let’s hope they grow out of this phase.

    +++
    WMDKitty
    Ah, but didn’t you know that children are chattel and parents have rights? Children as actual people, you have ideas…

    If you take and destroy another adult’s property, it’s considered a crime, and is, in fact, a form of psychological abuse. But if you take your kid’s property, and destroy it, that’s your “right” as a parent.

    Well, I once broke my daughter’s pencil in two because she intentionally poked me with it hard. I file it under self-defense.
    Legally I’m the steward of my children’s property*. I am allowed to accept or reject presents in their best interest, I am allowed to handle their posessions. Which includes taking them away for a while or indeed throwing stuff away. I don’t see how “intentionally destroying their stuff in order to punish them” an be in their best economic and other interest.
    To me, I’m generally only their steward. I’m in charge of their rights and lives until they’re old enough to be in charge themselves.

  452. 452
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    rq,

    It’s chaos in the city. The new trams are too low and get stuck in the snow, so it’s mostly the old ones out there. And they get stuck in the snow too, or lose electricity or get suck waiting for someone to push a car that can’t move off the rails .

    And it’s snowing heavily again, after a brief break this morning.


    re. children’s property

    Technically, your child’s things are actually yours. But I would mostly go with Giliell’s explanation. I feel John Morales’ argument is taking some sort of decency on the parents’ part as granted. Yeah, if you get pissed off because your kid is playing the toy keyboards too loud, you can take the keyboards and break them. You could even do it in front of them and force them to gather the bits and throw them in the trash themselves. That would certainly teach the kid a lesson, no? But I wouldn’t characterize this action as particularly good parenting.

  453. 453
    birgerjohansson

    “Swedes brace the chill in ‘no pants’ subway ride” http://www.thelocal.se/45594/20130114/
    — — — — — — — — —
    Tough crime in Scandinavia: “Brits accused in Sweden garlic smuggling racket http://www.thelocal.se/45506/20130109/ (vision of gangsters with tommy guns fighting over a share in the lucrative illegal garlic business)
    —- — — — — — — — —
    “Team finds gene – NEK2- that promotes drug resistance in cancer” http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-01-team-gene-drug-resistance-cancer.html -Brigham Young University? At least some Mormons do something more constructive than hating gays.
    — — — — — — — —
    Scientists find a new way to boost common cancer drugs http://medicalxpress.com/news/2013-01-scientists-boost-common-cancer-drugs.html

  454. 454
    Pteryxx

    Capriciously destroying or throwing away our treasured possessions was and remains one of my parent’s main abuse techniques. (Along with gift-giving as a means of control.) To this day I barely allow myself to *have* possessions and am always on guard, hiding anything important to me, and presuming it’s going to disappear. I ran away when this habit of disappearing possessions extended to pets. Absolutely it’s a form of abuse; the parent’s misusing their legal right as a means of control and intimidation, like a stalker misuses their legal right to communicate.

  455. 455
    rq

    While I see Giliell‘s point about stewardship, actively destroying your child’s/children’s toys is abuse. We always make a point of apologizing if we step on and break one of their cars, even if it has been left out through their own neglect. They don’t get a replacement, but they get an apology, and we work on their clean-up skills.

    Beatrice
    Sounds like lots of fun. The new trams, eh? We’ve got those, now, too, so technically, we can expect something of the same in the future. Whee!

    birgerjohansson
    The illegal garlic trade? Pfft. The end of last year, there was a great maple syrup heist in Canada. Perhaps they’re linked (the thieves work for a steak-and-rib marinade company)…?

  456. 456
    mildlymagnificent

    The new trams are too low and get stuck in the snow, so it’s mostly the old ones out there. And they get stuck in the snow too, or lose electricity …..

    Hah! So it’s not just authorities in hot countries who buy the wrong kind of public transport vehicles. Our lot bought some a few years ago where the airconditioning couldn’t cope above 28C or so. Seeing as we always have a few days 38 and above every year this is a very bad idea. Strangely enough the paying customers weren’t overly thrilled.

  457. 457
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    Subtle, but touching. Pearls Before Swine

  458. 458
    Matt Penfold

    No one can beat old British Rail for the best excuse as to why trains were having to be cancelled. A spokesperson for them once said, in all seriousness, that it was not the snow that was the problem, it was that it was the wrong type of snow.

  459. 459
    Lofty

    Kitty pic: http://i.imgur.com/MGZGA.gif

  460. 460
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    mildlymagnificent,

    We didn’t just buy them. We made them.

  461. 461
    rq

    Beatrice
    … Are you making ours, too?
    We ordered trains from Spain but apparently that project fell through, because someone mentioned we could just make our own.

    Lofty
    *thumbs up* for kitty pic and thanks for the smile.

    Matt Penfold
    That’s the best excuse ever.

  462. 462
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Food.
    Better.
    I didn’t expect to be in college that long so I didn’t pack lunch. Big mistake.
    But: Now I haz access to journals from home. No more stupid abstracts, yay for the real thing.

    Lofty
    Best booby-trap ever.

    property again

    Technically, your child’s things are actually yours.

    Not around here. The property belongs to the child as the rightful owner. I am allowed to make reasonable decissions and use stuff for the benefit of the child. So, I could use money from their savings to buy things for them. Like when some gran or relative gives me 20 bucks to buy them something and I spend that money on clothes for them. Or say one of them learned an instrument and I could take the money and buy that instrument. Those are decisions I make in the interest of the child and it’s still their stuff. I also throw away stuff that is broken because that’s a reasonable decision in their best interest.
    But there are, for example actual laws about what children can do with their allowance and one of them says that I don’t get to decide what they buy with it.
    Yeah, sometimes we accidentially break things, and yes, I admit that sometimes I’ll make them realize that now their toy is gone because they left it in a place where I was bound to step on it. I still apologize. One of the double-standards my parents had was that whenever I spilled something/knocked something over/broke something because that thing was totally out of place and bound to be spilled/broken it would be my fault for not being careful and I had to clean it up. If they spilled/broke some of my out of place stuff it would be m fault for letting it lie around and I had to clean it up and heavens forbid I would mention that they weren’t careful enough.

    +++
    Something positive: Today the Deutsche Gesellschaft für Sprache announced the “Unwörter des Jahres 2012″ (un-words), which is something they do each year in order to point out word-creations that defame, discriminate, are big fat euphemisms and such.
    This time, the winner is “Opferabo” (victim subscription), a word the meteorologist Jörg Kachelmann coined. He was accused of having raped his ex and was acquitted due to lack of evidence (and she was not prosecuted for false accusations, just to mention it) . He now tours the world talking about how them eebil wimmenz wrongly accuse good men of rape to ruin them.
    I say: Thank you!

  463. 463
    Pteryxx

    *headshake* Yeah, the property thing is abuse. Just the topic coming up burned me for the rest of the day.

    XKCD What If: From what height would you need to drop a steak for it to be cooked by the atmosphere before it hits the ground?

    http://what-if.xkcd.com/28/

    As far as I know, this steak question originally came up in a lengthy 4chan thread, which quickly disintegrated into poorly-informed physics tirades intermixed with homophobic slurs. There was no clear conclusion.

    To try to get a better answer, I decided to run a series of simulations of a steak falling from various heights.

    This involved a lot of research.

  464. 464
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Good morning. Happy Wednesday.

    Just got my windshield fixed (fist sized rock hit (and chipped) the wind screen last week). No charge since it could be filled with resin).

    No bad dreams last night. None at all. Weird shit.

    (1) I have sprained (unknown how) my left wrist.

    I could toss something in here about practicing save masturbation. But I won’t. But I did. Without doing it.

    Hey, at least you didn’t go blind!

    Maybe Caine could teach you how to do it safely? Er, maybe not. Y’all are doing it wrong!

    I hope you and Caine recover quickly.

    NOM in France?

    NOM, and the rest of the anti-gay-marriage crowd, have been very, very good at shooting themselves in the foot.

    Multiple times.

    Shades of gray. :D

    How many shades of grey?

    Rum
    It’s not just for breakfast any more!
    [I just googled the origin of that 'breakfast' trope.]
    [wholly fork. Anita Bryant and orange juice.]

    Insert the sound of a needle being dragged across a 33 1/2 rpm LP of Tiny Tim singing (?) Tiptoe Through the Tulips.

    So it really is all about controlling the women and keeping us as nothing more than baby factories.

    Well, duh.

    Technically, your child’s things are actually yours.

    If someone gives me a gift, that gift, unless there is something criminal involved, belongs to me. When I give my son a steam locomotive kit, that kit is his to do with as he will. When I give my daughter a collection of the complete works of H.P. Lovecraft, that book is hers to do with as she will. When my inlaws gave me a ca. 1920s trench lighter, that present is mine to do with as I will. Or am I missing something major, here?

  465. 465
    Pteryxx

    Man who helped six children at Sandy Hook now getting harassment from truthers:

    http://www.salon.com/2013/01/15/this_man_helped_save_six_children_is_now_getting_harassed_for_it/

    Rosen, a 69-year old retired psychologist who now runs a pet sitting business and volunteers to read books to kids in schools, initially called me to ask if I thought he should reach out to the FBI about the harassment. I said it probably couldn’t hurt. When I asked if I could tell his story, he was reluctant at first. “Here’s my fear: If I start talking like this, will one of these Truthers read this and will it embolden them? Will they say, screw that guy, how dare he impugned our credibility or question our intellect, I’m going to go one step farther? Am I being stupid?” he asked.

    After thinking about it, Rosen decided that he had to speak out: “I talk to you about this because I feel that there has to be some moral push back on this.”

  466. 466
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Pterryx:

    That is sad. But unsurprising. At least the comments are (so far (and I hope it remains so)) positive and supporting.

  467. 467
    Nakkustoppeli

    Beatrice/rq,

    The local tram company here tested some Croatian trams from Zagreb 5 years ago and found them unsuitable for the twisty and hilly Helsinki tram network. The problem they ran into was that they couldn’t cope with the steep hills we have here. Apparently no standard tram can cope with the tight corners downtown and the steep hills we have in the area I live in.

    The last series of new trams from Germany (Variotram, which was purchased more than a decade ago) has had a lot of problems with bodies of the trams breaking due to too much stress from cornering, which meant they had to buy used trams from Mannheim, which would have been scrapped otherwise, as a stopgap measure in order to have enough working rolling stock.

  468. 468
    Jadehawk

    In the discussion I pointed out that while most women will dismiss this as “unnecessary”, actually research exists that shows that women feel unconsciously excluded and unwelcome when you only use the male form.
    Other opinions (several of the young women echoed this): “Oh, I really don’t mind if there’s only the male form, it really doesn’t matter, I know they mean me, too, but, actually well, it is nicer if there’s the female form, too.”

    interesting language anecdote on this topic:
    in Polish, many job-titles don’t change genders (you just add a “Ms.” in front of it), so when she moved to Germany, she insisted that she was an Ingenieur (engineer), not an Ingenieurin (female engineer), because to her, the distinction felt more like what they do to sports-teams here, when they name the guys’ teams for example The Lions, and the women’s teams become The Lionettes or something similar.

  469. 469
    Jadehawk

    note to self: don’t post before coffee. the “she” in the above anecdote is my mom.

  470. 470
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Morning all.

    Sipping coffee and waking up. I skipped Rotary this morning like a rebel.

    When I was a kid, my mom instituted Toy Jail, which held the toys of persistently misbehaving children. But the rules were set, we knew what we were in for if we kept going with whatever we were doing.

  471. 471
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Portia:

    Would that make you a rebel with a clue?

  472. 472
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Hm, I have a couple clues but not all of them. Since my main motivation for avoiding a meeting at any time is its similarity to church (prayers, tithing, self-congratulation)* maybe it’s a bit of a clue, ha.

    *elements I realize are not universal throughout Rotary clubs.

  473. 473
    rq

    Ogvorbis
    re: children’s possessions
    I agree, the steam train you give your son is his to do with as he pleases… BUT. If he keeps dropping it from the roof and watching it smash and keeps asking for another one, do you keep buying him a new one? (Theoretically speaking, of course. And context changes – if he’s doing an experiment on what happens to toy steam trains when dropped from the roof and needs a certain number of repetitions and it’s all for the cause of science, that’s a bit different – but if he’s doing it just for the heck of it? I suppose that’s kind of what I mean by stewardship (of children’s toys)… Not that they aren’t theirs, but I can’t provide them with an endless supply of toys if they keep breaking them for no real reason.)
    But the main point of the discussion was, as you pointed out, that children’s toys belong to children. And that breaking a child’s toys as a form of punishment is abuse.

    Nakkustoppeli
    How does your city have trams in the first place, if none of the new ones are suitable?? Perhaps the municipality should look into straightening the streets and levelling the hills, to better accomodate the new trams… /snark

  474. 474
    rq

    Portia
    I didn’t know you had such a rebellious streak. :P

  475. 475
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Breaking toys as punishment: It seems like doing anything just to be mean is capital-B Bad.

    rq
    Oh yes, I’m a wild child. Having my coffee at home instead of two miles away : )

    Funny, you saying that makes me remember that I’m rather the “black sheep” in the family for having become part of the “establishment.” :D My hippy SIL once bemoaned that she’s “related to a suit.”

  476. 476
    Beatrice, an amateur cynic looking for a happy thought

    I have to admit, I don’t know the laws about children’s property, so saying that their property is “technically” their parent(‘s/)s’ (guardian’s) was pure assumption on my part.

  477. 477
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Beatrice
    In the U.S., as far as I know, most states hold that parents are the owners of children’s property.

  478. 478
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I agree, the steam train you give your son is his to do with as he pleases… BUT. If he keeps dropping it from the roof and watching it smash and keeps asking for another one, do you keep buying him a new one?

    No.

    One of the things Wife and I were very big on when the kids were young was the idea of cause-and-effect relationships. Including the ’cause-and-effect’ that you do not get a new one because you broke your current one. We saw everthing as a teachable moment.

    But (going back to the original comment which spawned this conversation) no way would I break a toy as a punishment (that would send the wrong message).

  479. 479
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    In the U.S., as far as I know, most states hold that parents are the owners of children’s property.

    But are we speaking of this in legal terms? or in helping-children-to-become-rational-adults terms?

    When Boy was 11, he decided he no longer wanted his Brio trains. We outlined his options and asked him what he wanted to do with them. He decided to sell them (at well under market value) to family friends with twin 5-year-old boys (they offered $110.00, he countered with $50.00 because he knew that they had been hit with some unplanned expenses). Yes, he sold them with our permission but it was still his decision. Does that make sense?

    =======

    By the by, if anyone sees an extra ‘y’ running around, could you insert it into my #477? Thanks.

  480. 480
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Ogvorbis
    I was speaking in terms of the law, it’s where I’m most comfortable :) In the spirit of that, I would say that your story in analogous to federalism and Constitutional rights. You are a state government and your son is a citizen. You have to give him a minimum set of rights, among them food, shelter, etc. You retain the legal right to control “his” property. This does not restrict your ability to expand his rights as you see fit, i.e. allow him to decide the disposition of his trains.

    In the same way, the State may be allowed by the federal government to conduct dog-sniff searches without a search warrant, but the State may choose to restrict their police forces from doing so. Thus they may choose to expand their citizens rights beyond what the US Supreme Court has required as a minimum.

    Yup, I do overthink a lot, why do you ask?

  481. 481
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Portia:

    I do not disagree on legal ownership. I do disagree in how that ownership is actually used even if that use is legal.

  482. 482
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Ogvorbis,

    I figured we were on the same page.

  483. 483
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Morning. This is a rare coffee morning for me, I usually shun caffeine… but I found my Aperture Science mug so I have coffee occasionally now.

    Woke up to my keyboard on the floor with one of the angling dohickies on the back broken off. Cat food everyone on the floor in the kitchen, and a roll of paper towels shredded all over the house. Lovely.

  484. 484
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Morning iJoe. How is Bossnurse’s bitten hand?

    Finish and savor that coffee before you start cleaning up after the kids : )

  485. 485
    dianne

    He decided to sell them (at well under market value) to family friends with twin 5-year-old boys (they offered $110.00, he countered with $50.00 because he knew that they had been hit with some unplanned expenses).

    What an excellent child you’re raising! (Or have raised: I’m not sure about boy’s age.) He clearly has learned some of those values that religious people claim atheists don’t have, like generosity and fairness.

  486. 486
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Good morning, iJoe.

    iCat was just showing hir love for you.

  487. 487
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Portia I have no clue how my wife’s hand is doing, but I’d guess “hurts like a motherfucker” based on the fact that she left the house at like 5AM instead of 6:30. I’m guessing it hurt too much for her to stay in bed. She hasn’t answered my morning text yet, but she usually doesn’t get free until about an hour from now.

  488. 488
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    Oggie

    There are four cats total, and I’m sure that one or two or them were ganging up on a third, and that’s how the food got scattered everywhere.

  489. 489
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    What an excellent child you’re raising! (Or have raised: I’m not sure about boy’s age.) He clearly has learned some of those values that religious people claim atheists don’t have, like generosity and fairness.

    He is now 22 (and only 23 credits from a BA in history (next step (his planned next step, anyway) is to pursue an MBA or MPA (trying to head for a career in museum management (his current job (management at a Turkey Hill) will reimburse most of his tuition))) and, except for not doing his dishes after he cooks a meal! he is doing pretty damn good.

  490. 490
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    … and I clearly need another cup of coffee’

  491. 491
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    rq
    Well, if they break their stuff they break their stuff. If they break my stuff I feel free to take their money to replace it.
    I try to work with consequences. They might look punishment to small children, but I hope as they grow older they’ll see the logical connection. That’s why I don’t remove toys for toy-unrelated things. Toys get removed for things like fighting about them (if you can’t agree on who gets it I get it), not cleaning them up (if I have to do it they go into my wardobe for a while) and the worst crime ever which is getting on my nerves by making too much noise when I already have a headache. I want them to be make reasonable projections and logical connections. No more favourite toy isn’t a logical consequence of spilling your milk. Cleaning up your milk is.

    Jadehawk
    Yeah, those pairs totally wouldn’t work in English either, just think about Governor and Governess

  492. 492
    opposablethumbs

    Hey, Pteryxx, I just read that What If a few minutes ago – snap! I love the fact that someone will actually work out how many laser sources of what power it would take to move the moon … or how many bullets it would take to stop a train, and how you’d have to line up the shooters to achieve this … or what would happen if all the rain in a whole storm fell as a single drop. Irresistible.
    .
    I did send in a question once, but I don’t think it will ever come up – it’s not a physics one, I thought of asking because there have been a few xkcds about money. It was, what would happen (and how much would each person have) if all the cash and liquid assets and shares and property-at-current-prices etc. etc. everywhere in the world (including what’s been squirrelled away by tax-avoiding multi-billionaires and crime lords (oops, that was a tautology)) were equally divided between all the people in the world.
    .
    Come to think of it, anyone here fancy a go at that? Go on ….
    go on go on go on go on go on go on! /Mrs. Doyle

    ::whistles innocently::

  493. 493
    opposablethumbs

    Oh, there’s a bloke called Tom Foss over on Almost Diamonds (e.g. The Other Petition thread) who seems pretty great, doing loads of good comments on that thread and a pleasure to read. Has he been around here?

  494. 494
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Oh, in good news (well, yeah, that’s actually what counts as good news around here), my university is running a gender-week next week and there’ll be a talk on trans* issues and identieties and it’s at a time I can go there.

  495. 495
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    As a complement to Lynna’s Moments of Mormon Madness, may I humbly present a Moment of Mormon Self-Awareness, in the form of a chat conversation with my dear friend, R.

    R: This is what I read today. Well, there’s a lot of talk about amber necklaces, about how they’re good for teething babies and other general pain relief, which I’m highly skeptical of but haven’t lost sleep over it or anything. But today! Today they were talking about how over time, the amber beads lose their effectiveness and you have to recharge them. And you’re not supposed to get soap on them because that blocks their effectiveness as well.
    So…. one of the suggestions was to put them in mineral oil and set them in the moonlight overnight.
    Yep. That’ll do the trick.
    P: I’m literally busting up laughing. That’s priceless
    R: Now, I REALIZE that from -your- perspective, there’s no difference between that and other just as suspect Christian beliefs, ha, but I figured we could laugh at this one together. ; )
    P: This is definitely a good one for raising an eyebrow
    `-`-`-`-`
    I was sort of taken aback that she referenced my general skepticism. I don’t talk about it openly because I’ve valued her friendship for over a decade now and I really don’t want to get into that stuff with her or her husband. But coupled with my mom’s casual description of me as an atheist to friends over Christmas, I’m starting to wonder just how transparent I am. I don’t hide my (lack of) belief, but I didn’t think I was out-but-not-out to such a high degree. I don’t use the word “atheist” (anti-theist is really more accurate if I had to pick one). *shrug*

    A question for you all who are atheists with close religious friends. How do you deal with these passing references to your views of their views? Do you think it’s self-consciousness that makes people preempt your thoughts? It occurs to me that I never have ever said anything derogatory about her beliefs, or responded snarkily when she talks about other preposterous superstitions. So what makes people quip like that?

  496. 496
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    opposablethumbs:

    Tom Foss has been here awhile under a couple of different names. “Doubting Tom” maybe? I follow him on Twitter and he changes names every could of weeks there.

  497. 497
    Parrowing

    Thanks Pteryxx!

    *

    You’re welcome, rq :)

    *

    Thanks for the welcomes Alethea, Hekuni Cat, and Portia!

    *

    katenrala: I’m so sorry you have to go through this with your insurance company. I wish it was possible to make a company feel shame, but I guess that would preclude them from making every last possible cent /snark. Info about the experiment is forthcoming, by the way.

    *

    Improbable Joe: Yes, I think you just might :).

    *

    Giliell: I hope the hospital gets going on transferring your mom quickly and of course, if it’s not too forward from a newcomer, I offer hugs if they are wanted.

    I would so be there at the trans* issues and identities talk if I lived near your university. Let us know if you come away with anything interesting/useful?

    *

    Portia, I get that occasionally from some family members and one friend in particular (though she isn’t religious, just very much into woo). I’ve always taken it the way you did, which is just self-consciousness. They want to talk about the things they feel are important and they want to talk to you about it even though they know you’ll have a different perspective. Maybe it’s even a good thing in that case?

    *

    I’ve also just read the first chapter of The Boss. I don’t want to say anything yet so as to avoid spoilering anyone, but thank you to whoever originally linked to Jennifer Armintrout (or now, Jenny Trout). I’ve been enjoying her Fifty Shades recaps for a couple months now.

  498. 498
    Nakkustoppeli

    rq,

    The next series of trams will be custom designed for small curve radii and hills as were the trams that came before Variotram (It remains to be seen how the new ones will fail…).

    For some reason the tram network designers here haven’t avoided tight curves even though this is no medieval style city with very narrow and twisty little streets, but a mostly a late 19th and early 20th century style city. Maybe the small-radius curves were less of a problem in the old days when trams were slower and shorter.

    I think the hills were mostly problem for the Croatian trams that were optimized for a flatter city, the Variotram is as far as I understand quite good at climbing hills.

    About the steepest hill: A lot of people live just on that hill (10 000 – 15 000) and they’re heavy users of trams. Levelling it might not be a good idea. :-)

  499. 499
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    Pteryxx@464, Holy crap. WTF is wrong with these people? It isn’t enough that these idiots deny that we are rendering our world uninhabitable or that the people are being fleeced by the wealthy or that the US could actually legitimately elect a black man to the highest office in the land. Now they have to deny that madmen are gunning down our children? And they have to harass a kindly old grandfather in the process.

    Here’s my gun violence proposal. New ammo–every 100th round will blow the head off the shooter.

  500. 500
    Portia (aka Smokey the Advocate)

    Parrowing
    You’re probably right. I just would hate for her to feel like I was always silently judging her for her beliefs. (An impulse that is there, but I make more effort to curb it with her than anyone else). *shrug* I guess I’ll have to let her feelings of self-consciousness about the silliness of her beliefs be her own, and not take responsibility for what she may or may not be perceiving from me that I don’t intend.

    `-`-`-`

    Started some tedious legal research and after a few minutes just found a law review article for free that seems to address my exact research question. Hooray!

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