A Texas poll »« Oh, hey, like artists really know how to do stuff

[Lounge #375]

This is the lounge. You can discuss anything you want, but you will do it kindly. Hey, it’s another long weekend of traveling for me, but you’re all going to be extra-specially nice to one another while I’m hindered from monitoring the threads, right?

Status: Heavily Moderated; Previous thread

Comments

  1. says

    Misuse of statistics is scarily pathetic these days, especially with polls conducted every hour. Funny part is how gullible some people are, and it is scary that they vote, serve on juries, and double down when they are corrected.

    No wonder people do not understand “allele frequency” or “13.7 billion years”.

    Big numbers or big terms. Do not need them, do not understand them, so best to use “common sense”

    Here is an example of one such illustration (follow the comments to see one ignoramus doubling down).

  2. robb says

    hello everyone. just got an Android phone last night. my first smart phone.

    anyhoo. does anyone have any good apps to recommend, for what ever reason. free is nice. also, since i am in physics, sciencey stuff is good too. not really interested in using it as a game platform. my xbox 360 is fine for that.

    p.s.
    i am considering buying one of those smart phone controlled drones. they are on Amazon!

  3. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    John Morales @118, last thread:

    Sorry for creating confusion where the numbers don’t add up. The vacillating undecideds are greyed out on the chart and create the remainder of the electoral college votes. blf referenced that with a correct guess.

    Later on down thread it was mentioned that several polls still had Obama barely leading, but realclearpolitics does take an average of a number of polling organizations, such as Gallup, the news magazines (Time, US News, etc.), cable news channels (CNN, MSNBC, etc.). They do include polls from Faux News and Rasmussen, which will obviously skew things right, but the rapid drop wouldn’t be affected by that since the whole averaging score fell.

    There’s a ridiculous number if people in the country that are basing their vote on a debate, and PZ has already had a few articles on the uselessness of debates as a source of real information. It’s baffling and a major piss-off when one has hope of an election based on fact.

  4. Oenotrian says

    Having done my civic duty and voted in the presidential election, I believe it is time for a glass of wine.

  5. says

    @8, RCP averaging is better than one poll, but treats all polls (and only polls) as essentially equal. In terms of its predictive power it is better than nothing, but if you actually care to separate older polls from newer ones, combine battleground polls, weight trends, biases etc., Nate Silver’s 538 site is pretty decent. (you probably do know that already).

    http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/

    Then there are others:

    http://election.princeton.edu/, and one of the first of its kind
    http://www.electoral-vote.com/

    I am not convinced that the debate themselves are moving the polls that much, I think that the monies that are being poured into ads after a debate gives that impression. In October alone the Romney SuperPacs have spent some 130 million (halfway through), and that is what’s having an effect.

    The spending is 2:1 on that front, and I suspect will get to 6:1 or more in the last two weeks or so, and will push Romney over.

    Of course the media (which drumbeat-ed the Iraq war) will hide the influence of that money and play up the “debate performances”

  6. erikthebassist says

    Robb,

    Life in android is so much easier if you get yourself a gmail address and a google voice #, then the google voice and gmail apps.

    Why? Respond to test messages via email, make phone calls from your PC, get voicemails as email attachments, to name just a few advantages.

    Also, if you port your contacts to gmail, they autosync with the phone, makes life easy when you inevitably get a new phone. Same thing with calendar.

    DroidLight is a good free flashlight app, very handy.

    I like Feedr for all my rss feeds, because I use google reader.

    Dropbox is really handy, I pay the $10 a month for 100g so I can keep virtually everything I care about including my whole music collection in there, and thus can get to it from my phone at any time.

    Google Sky is just fun and neat, especially if you do any sky gazing.

    Swiftkey 3 is my favorite keyboard mod, you wouldn’t believe how good the predictive typing is, saves me a ton of hunting and pecking.

    I find facebook messenger much easier than texting for the people I’m constantly chatting with.

  7. mildlymagnificent says

    The premise of consuming ground up pig thyroid to promote normal thyroid function seems implausible to me, and I’ve advised her that she may be getting sold snake oil.

    Funnily enough it does work better for many people – with one huge caveat.

    Ground up animal thyroid was the only treatment available before we synthesised it, of course. And the caveat comes in when you realise that the dosage is pretty variable when using it. Just as it is when using whole herbs instead of synthesised chemicals.

    The advantage kicks in if your metabolism is on the ‘thyroid resistant’ side. Whole pig thyroid contains both T3 and T4. People whose system doesn’t readily break down T4 into its useful bits at various important organs and tissues often do better with the whole thyroid thing.

    Of course, you can get your endocrinologist to do more detailed thyroid testing and get an additional prescription for T3 as well as the routine T4. But I suspect it might be a bit expensive in the USA. It’s fairly restricted access in Australia. We can’t just determine that it’s needed and go from there. We have to keep going back for an endocrinologist certification that we meet the criteria.

  8. Nepenthe says

    Snake! Snakey-snake! Eeeet’s so cyooooote! I have been waiting for snake!!!!

    *breathes into a paper bag for a bit*

  9. erikthebassist says

    mildlymagnificent

    That is great info thank you very much. So my default assumption that an over the counter supplement with no research that I could find was likely sanke-oil was wrong, which is why I asked. =)

    I love The Horde™ *sigh*

  10. maia160 says

    Long time reader, first time poster. I’ve been following the whole sexism debate since the beginning and I’ve really learned a lot. I’m also much more aware of sexist language when I see it. Just wondering if anyone else ever feels like the lone voice speaking up in communities that just don’t give a damn?

    During the past year, I started gaming and I’ve been on the Mass Effect 3 forums a lot recently. The casual gendered insults and even promotion of gang rape of certain characters just goes by like nothing happened. So, here I am calling it when I see it and being labeled a whiner, etc. Guess I’m just looking for a bit of support as it’s starting to get to me.

  11. chigau (棒や石) says

    maia160
    Welcome.
    Keep calling the bullshit and stop by here for the occasional break.
    ——-
    [meta]
    If you have “…been following the whole sexism debate since the beginning…” you must be really, really old. ;)

  12. robb says

    @erikthebassist,

    thanks for the tips. i already have a gmail/google account and have been using it for gmail and recently, calendar. i will have to sync them up.

    i got google sky map, but it doesn’t work as well as i had hoped. when i turn to view the sky where my phone is pointed, it doesn’t keep up and doesn’t line up correctly. i couldn’t even get ursa major to appear on my screen!

  13. maia160 says

    chigau

    Thanks for the welcome! ha! I meant the debate in the atheist community.

    I’ll continue to come here. Just saw a lot of sexism on the boards today and got some of the guys riled up by calling it out. It can get tiring. One of the women I spoke to privately on the boards just doesn’t feel like its even worth the effort to say anything. Ah, well, I’d heard about how bad gaming communities can be. I’m just experiencing it for the first time.

  14. erikthebassist says

    maia160

    I’m in the same boat. I have a lot of people in my life that I’ve grown up with or known for years, and I had no idea just how backwards and fucked up their thinking on gender issues are until I really became educated about it. I first became interested in feminism because of Skepchick, back in 2004 or something, the very early days of the SGU. Elevator gate has really put it all in perspective for me.

    I’ve just now started to confront it, sometimes, with the people in my life. It’s hard. If not done correctly it can strain relationships and make you appear to be a buzzkill, or like you said a whiner, to those who don’t know any better.

    All I can say is, pick your battles, try and understand that you were once just as ill informed as they still are, and that changing minds takes time.

    But also count on the fact that you are ultimately going to lose some friends over it. I have, but they’ve been replaced by enlightened people who appreciate my candor and willingness to stand up and be counted.

  15. erikthebassist says

    hrmm robb, mine always works fine, you may need to calibrate your motion sensor, I think it requires chanting something and waving the phone in a figure 8 pattern but I don’t quite remember and may vary from manufacturer to manufacturer so your owner’s manual might be the place to check for that.

  16. strange gods before me ॐ says

    Later on down thread it was mentioned that several polls still had Obama barely leading, but realclearpolitics does take an average of a number of polling organizations

    McCthulhu, (this is more or less what shripathikamath said about aggregators, but) nothing I listed is a single poll. Nate Silver’s FiveThirtyEight and Sam Wang’s Princeton Election Consortium are both modeling from averages. Pollster.com does this too, and they have Obama winning barely.

    The other links were markets and bookies; you can be certain the markets are not based on single polls, and the bookies’ odds almost certainly aren’t either.

    +++++

    The spending is 2:1 on that front, and I suspect will get to 6:1 or more in the last two weeks or so, and will push Romney over.

    shripathikamath, I think that’s pessimistic. Nate Silver has Obama already recovering from the sharp decline after the debate. There aren’t that many undecideds still out there; it may be that he already hit the floor, and Republican ad money will get swiftly diminishing returns. Am I sure of this? No, but it’s plausible, the numbers currently can support it, and expecting a bad outcome isn’t helpful (expecting a close outcome is).

    +++++
    I’m unfamiliar with Pollster.com’s modeling, but I remember Electoral-Vote.com and I think it’s pretty clumsy:

    What algorithm formula) is used to compute the map?
    In 2004, we ran three different algorithms. The main page just used the most recent poll. The second algorithm averaged three days’ worth of polls using only the nonpartisan pollsters. The third one included a mathematical formula for predicting how undecided voters would break based on historical data. The second one was most stable and gave the best final result, so this time a slight variation of it is used: The most recent poll is always used, and, if any other polls were taken within a week of it, they are all averaged together. This method tends to give a more stable result, so the colors don’t jump all over the place due to one unusual poll.

  17. sirbedevere says

    Anyone else enjoying a nice bit of schadenfreude about Newsweek announcing they’ll be going “online only” after the first of the year? (And “offline entirely” before too long after that, I’d wager.)

    I mean only last week the magazine was saying heaven is real. Soon it’s going to find out. :)

  18. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Threadrupt, but in other news I’ve finally found a mixed drink (other than a Roy Rogers) I actually like – 3 parts tawny port to 5 parts Vanilla coke.

    I’m sensing a pattern here.. O.o

  19. erikthebassist says

    I didn’t sg, thanks for pointing it out, I will check it out. Time is a commodity I’m sorely lacking in but I did suggest it so I’ll try and make some effort in the coming weeks.

  20. cicely says

    It looks like the tee shirts may have to be tote bags, instead. This makes me sad.
    :(

    Esteleth: :( :( :(
    That kind of excitement, you did not need.
    At least it sounds like you’ve got a landlord who gives a shit.

    Five days ’til DarkFetus!

    Setting Countdown Timer.

    Huh? Isn’t that when the skies cloud over, it rains and thunders for weeks on end, great rifts open in the Earth, the dolphins and mice leave, the seas boil, there’s a run on flaming swords, wizards finally figure out what the knob on the end is for, and the Moon finally hatches?

    Indeed. Plus you got the whole “dogs and cats living together” thing.


    Hi, maia160; welcome in!

    Just wondering if anyone else ever feels like the lone voice speaking up in communities that just don’t give a damn?

    Sadly, I think this is a frequently-occuring thing. The ones who have the privileged end of the stick are often unaware that the other end even is muddy; and if they do know it, they don’t want to let go of the clean end.

    Or even wash the damned stick off.
    -

  21. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Taking a breather before heading into the crazy weekend of finishing two papers, writing a blog post for my media class, reading a gazillion pages for four classes, and — at some point — getting groceries. Oh, and prepping for moderating a panel at the regional women’s studies conference my college is hosting on Friday. I’m excited to have been chosen, terrified because I’ve never done this before. I’m terri-cited!

    In other news: Because I did something on Monday that’s caused my sciatic nerve to hate me, I’ve been taking Tramadol before bed — which has resulted in some whacked-out dreams. The one a last night takes the cake, however.

    I dreamed, literally, an idea for a research project on sexism and atheism, right down to where I could recruit subjects (Pharyngula, of course, other internet sites and some offline groups as well) and even some of the questions I should ask. I woke up thinking it was the most awesomest idea in the world. In the non-Tramadol’d light of day, it seems rather more difficult a proposition. (Surprising, amirite?!)

    It’s still doable, just more time- and effort-intensive than my dream suggested. And probably more than an undergrad should attempt — at least not until the winter break. :)
    — —

    Previous thread:

    Audley @ 655:

    Five days ’til DarkFetus!

    I am strangely excited, for the first time ever, by an impending birth that wasn’t one of my own. (The excitement in those three cases, however, could be summed up as “Please, just get out of there already!”)

    blf @ 668:

    Walsh responded, “Absolutely. With modern technology and science, you can’t find one instance,” he said.

    Oh someone’s god! I guess I should be relieved that my 32-year-old cousin’s life wasn’t actually in any jeopardy ten years ago when she had a stroke at 6 months pregnant. Oh wait. I seem to remember something about her being life-flighted to a hospital in Philadelphia…. but in Walsh’s world it was probably because she just wanted to ride in a helicopter.

    New thread:

    maia160:
    Welcome!

    I feel that way a lot of the time. Without any kind of support, it’s exhausting to keep speaking up, and I often find myself having to let things go simply because I don’t have the energy to fight the same battle for the millionth time, against multiple opponents.

    Pharyngula is my haven from it. Even if I don’t have time to comment, just scrolling through the threads and seeing other people thinking the same way as I do is a huge relief.

    *orders herself sternly to get back to work*

  22. cicely says

    I’m excited to have been chosen, terrified because I’ve never done this before. I’m terri-cited!

    Or excified.
    :D
    -

  23. johnharshman says

    So this is weird. Over the last week or so, my view of Pharyngula periodically loses all formatting and graphics, giving me a page with no variation in type font, missing all graphics, and generally a visually boring and awful thing. And then it periodically comes back to the real page.

    Has anyone else experienced this? Does anyone know what causes it? Does anyone know how it can be avoided/fixed?

  24. onion girl, OM; social workers do it with paperwork says

    Live-blogging of Rhinebeck part one of who fucking knows how many:

    “Katherine Lorraine has the best boobs.”
    Esteleth: “Kat has detachable boobs and I have a detachable penis, so between the two of us, we’re set.”
    *cue Kat falling on the floor in hysterics*

    (said penis is a purple, glow-in-the-dark penis)

    Thus far, we have had sing-along sessions to I like Big Butts, Dance (A$$), La Tortura, and My Humps, Afternoon Delight.


    Sili is trying to understand how one ‘finds the target’ while using a detachable penis.
    Esteleth: “It’s called triangulation.”


    Sili has a handelbar mustache.


    More to come. There is pizza, cupcake, ice cream, and lots of beer. (Including root beer for moi, who is allergic to alcohol.

    Current attendees: Sili, Kat, Ibyea, Jules, Spurge, rollei, Jadehawk, Esteleth, Sandi, trisekelethecat, mattir, liriodendrons.

  25. John Morales says

    johnharshman, it is your browser and not the site.

    (You might check what add-ons and/or plugins you’re running on it)

  26. cicely says

    *big pile o’ hugs* for Rhinebeck attendees…especially the ones I haven’t had the chance to *hug* in a while.
    -

  27. Valindrius says

    I apologise for intruding here since I know that this is an area for regulars not to deal with as much random stupidity but I was wondering if I could ask for help. I know it’s really tactless for me to do that when my only other posts around FTB have been effusive and hollow but this seemed like the only place that could provide a relevant and fairly quick reply.
     
    Specifically, it seems Damon Fowler might need some form of communication with those that blogged about him, helped raise funds, and provided any private support in the past. Sadly, I have no idea who the most prominent people were, which method would be best to contact them, whether it warrants their attention given how busy they will be, or even if I should be alerting them to it without his permission.
     
    If you wish to judge whether it’s necessary then he has made a scathing, pessimistic post on the ‘Support Damon’ Facebook page. It seems as if he’s misunderstood the reasons bloggers had for focusing attention on him, appears to feel used, and appears to think he was abandoned by a fickle atheist movement. Other people may judge it entirely differently and understandably think there’s nothing worth dealing with so I’d like to check with those most likely to be informed about such things (i.e. the people that tend to post here).
     
    The reason I ask is because I know there are a lot of problems to deal with, that lots of atheists suffer horrific pain or rejection without any attention at all, that this may be temporary despondency that will pass on its own, and that his thoughts may be linked to other life circumstances but it seems wrong to be silent when I know somebody feels this way after losing their familial support network by simply upholding the law. If thinking he was used and ignored by prominent figures is causing anguish, however wrong he is to think that after they helped to raise money and praised him, then should such people dispel those notions if they have the time and desire? (I realise that might seem as if it’s intended to be rhetorical but it’s genuine) If my empathy is completely misfiring then please do tell me that I’m an ass so I don’t make that mistake again.
     
    Once again, sorry to intrude and take time with this. I’m grateful if you read this far and for any reply that people are willing to give. I’m clueless and have very little experience in activism so I simply thought it best to defer to those that have the experience, knowledge, and honesty. If taking such a stupidly large amount of space on people’s screens was an error and all of this was based on my cluelessness then I apologise. Wishing you well.

    (P.S. Another apology if this is a double-post, my internet is being erratic so I don’t know if this submitted or not).

  28. Pierce R. Butler says

    Remember Damon Fowler, the kid from Louisiana who was thrown out by his parents and his hometown for challenging prayers in a public school?

    He’s not happy with organized and/or online atheism, and is dropping out of the speakers’ circuit:

    While some bloggers may have covered my story partially for non selfish reasons, some directly told me that they got a ton of page views from it. This is why I’m done. You’re all a bunch of fucked up people. I suppose that’s most of humanity though.

    In a later comment following the same post, he adds:

    … I’ve decided to work on bettering myself and my life instead of appeasing everyone else with my anecdote which hardly does anything more than reinforce negative stereotypes and make people feel sorry for me (though this could just be pent-up emotional pessimism talking). Sure, it inspired a few people, but my job is done. … I’d like to say thanks to everyone for the support. It meant a lot to this poor kid who just did what he felt was right. I learned a hard truth early in my life last year, but I also learned of the compassion and overwhelming support that humanity can still offer those who need it.

    Needless to say, he’s catching a lot of shit.

  29. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Current attendees: Sili, Kat, Ibyea, Jules, Spurge, rollei, Jadehawk, Esteleth, Sandi, trisekelethecat, mattir, liriodendrons.

    [looks around]

    Sigh.

    [makes puppet out of hankie and price stickers]

    “Hello there skeptical person.”

    [drops voice]

    “Hello there, Fishy.”

    “Very nice to meet you, er, Mr. Socks.”

    “And you. Would you like to have a lovely craft brewed beer and speak of things rational and ridiculous, horrifying and humourous and all points betwixt and between?”

    “Why yes, yes I would.”

    Sigh.

    [goes back to work]

  30. John Morales says

    Valindrius:

    Specifically, it seems Damon Fowler might need some form of communication with those that blogged about him, helped raise funds, and provided any private support in the past.

    There’s this thing called e-mail, which these prominent figures do provide.

    If thinking he was used and ignored by prominent figures is causing anguish, however wrong he is to think that after they helped to raise money and praised him, then should such people dispel those notions if they have the time and desire?

    One cannot be both used and ignored.

    (Also, ‘should’ is a subjective thing)

    I’m grateful if you read this far and for any reply that people are willing to give.

    You’re welcome.

  31. says

    Android apps:

    Swype is a very cool keyboard. Using it now. Fast, once you get used to it.

    Note Everything is a nice note pad.

    You can get Kindle for it. Also Overdrive (great for ebooks from the library). I have both, along with less famous free ereaders; they all work fine.

    Opera Mobile is a good, fast browser.

    The only sorta sciencey apps I have are more for programming. Frink is kinda neat, though. Unit conversions built into the language.

    I have a tonne of music and language type stuff, too. Non free dictionaries, so on. Assuming that’s not so much of interest.

  32. johnharshman says

    johnharshman, it is your browser and not the site.

    (You might check what add-ons and/or plugins you’re running on it)

    Conceivable, but I haven’t changed anything lately. No new plugins.

  33. Pierce R. Butler says

    John Morales @ # 39: One cannot be both used and ignored.

    Not simultaneously – but Damon Fowler exists in the timestream.

  34. says

    Additional Android advice:

    If you’re going to root it, consider doing it early. On my device, unlocking erases user data as a security measure, forcing you to jump through more backup hoops if there’s a lot on the device. It’s doable (I managed), but more involved.

    (I rooted mine because otherwise I couldn’t get Jelly Bean on it with any dispatch. Carrier was taking their sweet time.)

  35. John Morales says

    Pierce, well then, if not simultaneously, then when he’s being used, he’s not being ignored and when he’s being ignored, he’s not being used.

    (Right now, what is the case?)

  36. chigau (棒や石) says

    John Morales
    Are you trying to start a fight in The [Lounge]?
    When PZ is “hindered from monitoring the threads”?

  37. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Thanks Esteleth, and I hope you’re having sacks of fun in the exact opposite way to sacks of hammers…er, that sounded better in my head, moving on:

    All right chigau, I have a peanut butter sandwich and some Sodastream diet cola and a willingness, hell, an eagerness I’d go so far, to hear some opinions. Lay ‘em on me! A warning though, should they contain references to sport or the weather I might just become sarcastic.*

    *If you are what you eat, what diet would account for sarcasm?

  38. broboxley OT says

    Estelethe has a detachable glow in the dark penis,
    looks in shorts….I have a sad

    Tony, like Lynna said, no point in taking it to thunderdome, She has her reasons to ignore my opinion, and that is what it is. I spend very little time watching any tv except sports. I do spend most of the time (when not at work boss) looking at news sites from all across the spectrum as well as economic historical and what I call geopolitics articles. There was a sportscaster called Olbermann who some folks swore to preach the real deal. He should have stuck to sports.

    Maddow does not pass the fair and balanced test that I use. Fox news is a repulican franchise. CNN is useless and pbs merely drones the party line in sinecured lockstep. msnbc will tirelessly promote the democratic party and demonize the republicans. Thats fine, sometimes they will get things right.

    When Lynna promotes something that I know to be factually suspect and lists Madow as a source I post opposition and a reminder that Maddow is an entertainer not a journalist.

    Its not a shot against Lynna, a provider of great stuff. Just trying to keep it honest, from my point of view.

    I will maybe try to look in on TD tomorrow, I just got home from the HS and need to be back there at 4:30am for a rotc drill competition in Tennessee tomorrow, Sunday college scouts will be viewing all of the lacrosse games so need to schmooze there as dotter is playing goal. So forgive me if you dont have a quick response.

  39. chigau (棒や石) says

    FossilFishy
    *ahem*
    Professional Team Sports are a good way to Channel The Energies of Potential Axe-murderers.
    The Weather is Fine. What’s yer problem?
    I think an UltraBland (eg. traditional British) diet provokes sarcasm.

  40. allencdexter says

    Don’t want to be critical, but you’re forgetting the Why I am an atheist section again. Please bring it back.

  41. chigau (棒や石) says

    The party-across-the-street are having a party game that involves occasionally shouting “BONSAI!”.

  42. StevoR says

    Via :

    @3.hyperdeath on the Texas Poll thread :

    If you want a poll to crash, you can change the ratings of Atheism Plus definitions on Urban Dictionary:

    http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Atheism%20Plus

    The page is currently under attack from MRAs. (Note the links to “pussy beggar” and “mangina” at the end of their preferred definition.)

    Also in case folks haven’t already mentioned / linked here.

    (Got to rush out the door in a sec! Did have time to vote thumbs down / up there, thanks hyperdeath.)

  43. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Heh, good job chigau. I wonder if the Axe Murder Mitigation hypothesis has ever been studied. I have to admit that back in my school days I often hoped that those of my peers who participated in organised sports would end up on the wrong end of an axe. But was that keeping them from do such deeds themselves?

    It’s a fine spring day here, one of the nicest in months, and I’m stuck inside at work. And of course, of COURSE, every customer who comes in just has to point that out, and tell me just how much they are/are going to enjoy their bike ride today. /grump

    Ah English cooking. My father would only accept such. (boil it some more dear, it still has some flavour) After he died we were free to have more, er, exotic things, like, oh, stir fry, or even tacos on one exceptional occasion. But that lasted a very short time before Mum decided to cook very healthy, no salt, no fat, no flavour because she was unfamiliar with most spices. Is it any wonder I ended up be addicted to hot chillies and the like? Don’t get me wrong. Fresh foods can be very tasty without spicing, but we were poor and variety was lacking.

  44. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Heh, bonsai or banzai? Radical horticulturists or anachronistic radicals?

  45. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Just wondering if anyone else ever feels like the lone voice speaking up in communities that just don’t give a damn?

    YES D: *throws things at the physics and engineering students, and one or two of the faculty*

  46. chigau (棒や石) says

    FossilFishy
    *generic tentacles up*
    I have been told that there is now a sushi restaurant in walking distance of my mother’s house.
    Xmas shall be fun.

  47. John Morales says

    chigau:

    I have been told that there is now a sushi restaurant in walking distance of my mother’s house.

    Won’t last long — sushi has a limited shelf life.

    (Shoulda made it out of building materials, instead)

  48. chigau (棒や石) says

    John Morales
    So you already know about the life-span of shops in strip-malls.
    —-
    ednaz
    BANSAI!
    (my 日本語の勉強 is taking a beating tonight)

  49. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    I for one, would be worried if a sushi restaurant walked up to my mum’s house. :p

    Though if you could send one my way I’d be much obliged. We have two bakeries, two pizza joints, one Chinese, one Moroccan and one fancy-pants restaurant with an accredited chef and linen napkins. Not bad for a tiny town but I do miss sushi.

  50. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Oh, and two burger/fish and chips places. How could I forget the chippies, not very Aussie of me that.

  51. thunk, Blob Alert! says

    Bonsais are great.

    Everyone who is at Rhinebeck– have great fun. I’m currently doing quizbowl, and thus am in the wrong direction for this. Sqrrawk!

    Also, yeah Walsh. Fuck that dipshit. I hate him with a passion.
    Especially now.

  52. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    broboxley:

    I will maybe try to look in on TD tomorrow, I just got home from the HS and need to be back there at 4:30am for a rotc drill competition in Tennessee tomorrow, Sunday college scouts will be viewing all of the lacrosse games so need to schmooze there as dotter is playing goal. So forgive me if you dont have a quick response.

    Thanks for the explanation.
    No need to look in the Thunderdome. I was just curious at how you arrived at the opinion you have and some of the issues you take with Maddow. Your response here gives me a general idea.
    Take care.

  53. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    allencdexter:

    Don’t want to be critical, but you’re forgetting the Why I am an atheist section again. Please bring it back.

    This is pure speculation on my part. I don’t think PZ has forgotten. I just think he’s incredibly busy.

  54. chigau (棒や石) says

    FossilFishy
    Moroccan and chippies and fancy-pants in walking distance?
    I’m moving into your basement.

    Hi thunk

  55. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    DLC:

    Yes, you read it here first. The American Patriarchy Foundation thinks Bullying is just fine and dandy.

    It’s like they don’t even realize that it’s not just gay kids getting bullied…

  56. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    日本語の勉強

    “Man… I don’t know what the F**K you just said, Little Kid, but you’re special man, you reached out, and you touch a brother’s heart.”

  57. chigau (棒や石) says

    日本語の勉強
    Just copypaste to google translate. It’s really harmless.
    Japanese language study

    I have ctrlshiftbuggerfucked my keyboard.
    Ièll be right back.

  58. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Well, we live 4k out of town, so it’s an easy bike ride or a longish walk. No basement, but the farm house we’re living in once housed 12 people, or so we’re told, we’ve got room. Feel free to drop by.

    We are just a 50 meter stumble from the local pub though. They make a really nice dahl, which is pretty unusual for a country pub. And they have Guinness on tap. One of the reasons we bought a block of land there rather than in town.

    I miss The Louisiana Purchase, The Blue Pear and The Blue Plate. And now I’m ravenous…

  59. says

    @23

    shripathikamath, I think that’s pessimistic. Nate Silver has Obama already recovering from the sharp decline after the debate.

    Here’s my take on it. It’s kinda hard to do it here, but Obama has not recovered nearly enough.

    Yet.

    Nate Silver did have him recovering, but he has fallen since yesterday, and this is the third Friday in a row that Romney has shown good results at the polls.

    Hampshire has gone to a toss-up. The only firewall for Obama is that he has Ohio, Nevada, Wisconsin and Iowa holding or increasing slightly.

    When that collapses, he is done.

    I am not voting for either of them, but of the two I’d like to see Obama win, but I suspect that in the end, the SuperPACs will pour in enough for Romney to eke it out.

  60. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    It’s like they don’t even realize that it’s not just gay kids getting bullied…

    Collateral damage. One must not take the chance that a fag, dyke, he-she or what ever get away free from be bullied. Also, the children need to be taught the proper way to treat a hell bound deviant.

  61. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    Thanks, shripathikamath @10 and SGBM @23.

    I had the most crap sleep I have had in months last night just from seeing that one graphic of Rmoney ahead. Even with the more accurate data, I am so genuinely freaked out by this election that my usual election complacency, cultivated via Canadian politics, has been thrown out the window.

    Becoming a little more involved lately, I found one of the most annoying GOP hack activities by accident on Yahoo.com (which is asking for trouble, since it seems to be the inner sanctum of the proudly ignorant. And PZ thought YouTube was bad). I have been wading into debates with anyone that wants to tout bullshit for Rmoney. I was making posts that were being thumbs-downed by over a dozen users. The thing is, the thumbs-down were appearing within 5-10 secconds of me making the post. There is no way in hell that anyone could have read more than the first two sentences of what I had written, never mind the entire post. There’s no debate going on there, just mindless GOP-bot attacks of anything remotely anti-Rmoney/pro-Obama. I wanted to break things, like these dishonest morons’ necks, but I have since discovered this would be considered quite against the election laws. Pity.

  62. chigau (棒や石) says

    FossilFishy
    FYI
    Guinness ordered in Alberta comes cold.
    It is refrigerated, like all Beer™.

  63. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    Ing @78:

    Good freakin’ question. I am incredulous at the crap memory, misogyny, racism, greed and ignorance required to even momentarily consider a vote for Rmoney. It’s like being stuck in one of George Orwell’s nightmares after he ate too many cheap hot dogs from a NYC cart vendor.

  64. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    What makes it even sadder is, if it isn’t the debate, the fucking stupid are being taken in by the ads. It’s like the policies on paper don’t even exist, just soundbites and ominous music.

  65. nms says

    I am incredulous at the crap memory, misogyny, racism, greed and ignorance required to even momentarily consider a vote for Rmoney.

    Social issues aside, people are worried about their jobs, and Romney is the JOBS CANDIDATE. He is America’s Fairy Jobsmother and he will make unemployment disappear by waving his sparkly supply-side wand.

  66. erikthebassist says

    If you happen to know a democrat that isn’t planning to vote for Obama on 11/2 because they are too busy or just don’t care, do me a favor and tell them to WAKE TEH FUCK UP.

    That is all.

  67. Patricia, OM says

    Onion Girl @32 – Damn it, damn it, damn it!!! You are all at Rhinebeck & I am in fucking Oregon.

    Damn it.

  68. says

    What makes it even sadder is, if it isn’t the debate, the fucking stupid are being taken in by the ads. It’s like the policies on paper don’t even exist, just soundbites and ominous music.

    so we’ll wind up electing a fucking corporate pirate who doesn’t care about 47% and is openly running as a robber baron ticket as the fairy jobs mother.

    IF he wins this is proof that we are so fucking stupid that there’s no need to even lie well. They have literally bought America.

  69. Patricia, OM says

    If somebody at Rhinebeck sees Franklin Habit, will you please report that he is alive, or a zombie, because he hasn’t blogged since July and everyone is scared for him?

    =======================================================
    Audley – Five days to Darkfetus arrival, it will be a close race with the Misters hat. Finished it today, M has the same hat size, it is a snug fit, but you live in one hell of a cold zone! So hat gets it’s bath this weekend and mailed out on Monday – the race is on! :D

  70. says

    Americans, please. Ixnay on the Omneyray.

    Look. The world is still recovering from that gibbering chucklehead who gave us Iraq II. It’s gonna be a while, looks like. Please stick with guys who just keep the current wars bleeding slowly along, if that’s the best you can do. These messianic monstrosities that start new ones, seriously, we just can’t handle it, right now. Too much, dammit.

    You hear me? No more, fuck. Not now, especially. Seriously, what the hell are you people on?

    In unrelated, I think “fucking Oregon” should be some kind of thing…

    You know… Like, maybe, they could put it on state highway signs, tourist kiosks, license plates…

  71. McC2lhu doesn't want to know what you did there. says

    I wish I could be in ‘fucking Oregon.’ I seem to perpetually pick the abysmally celibate provinces and states to live in.

  72. DLC says

    Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze @72 : It’s not collateral damage, it’s deliberate. If you are in any way not part of them then you are less than human and so to be got rid of.

    Obama’s message is taking hold, slowly. The good news is, Romney still has to “run the table” of the swing states. He cannot win without all of those, under the current projections. We’re getting 5 to 7 robocalls a day here. it’s annoying.

  73. says

    Good morning

    Onion Girl and Co.
    I so wished I could just beam over

    Hi Maia!

    D3
    So, Google-magic I did some time ago came up with the fact that although you really, really neeeeeeed some amount, the upper amount that is safe to take is very high.
    My various supplements provide me with 10u, which is 200% RDA. Which is why I looked it up.
    Now, your body stops producing it at 250u a day. Chronical poisoning starts at about 500u, acute poisoning at 2500u I think, so, just taking more shouldn’t be a problem unless you take the whole package.

  74. broboxley OT says

    quick post before snooze. The polls show romney ahead. Remember, these polls are 2-3k people polled on land lines. They are always skewed to the right.
    Obama sucks but will pull in enough barely to win the presidency. The races will be more nuanced in the congress and senate where I predict republican gains in the house and no veto proof majority in the senate.

  75. broboxley OT says

    Leaned on privilege tonight. We had highschool homecoming. Which means that instead of a half time marching band show we had to do the homecoming song and dance. The two highschool’s bands were waiting after the game to get on the field. The stadium announcer asked for the field to be cleared twice. Fuck that
    There is benefits to looking like Jack Nicholson in the last scenes of the shining.
    “coach, I need you to clear the field now! everyone is just grabassing!” then to the away coach same message. Went to the rear hometown defensive meeting with the same message “what you gonna do if we don’t move?” gave them the hairy eyeball. they moved.

  76. opposablethumbs says

    Petition to get Nick Griffin (leader of the racism party in the UK, the BNP) banned from twitter for breaking their ToS and posting the rl address of the gay couple who won their discrimination case against the B&B owners. Griffin urged his fellow homophobes to demonstrate outside the couple’s house “to protest heterophobia”.

    He shouldn’t just be banned, he should be prosecuted for incitement to violence/hate crime.

    http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/get-griffin-off-twitter?utm_source=action_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=12223&alert_id=iqCyzLZpjx_xpKEEyrBkJ

  77. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    Five days ’til DarkFetus!

    FOUR days until DarkFetus!

    Current attendees: Sili, Kat, Ibyea, Jules, Spurge, rollei, Jadehawk, Esteleth, Sandi, trisekelethecat, mattir, liriodendrons.

    You so lucky! Today, a four hour train ride plus dealing with three different projects which will take about six hours to deal with which need to be done NOW, DAMNIT! and have been sitting on someone’s desk for three weeks and need to be done by Monday.

    [Is ‘axe-murderer’ even a ‘thing’ anymore?]

    Oh, yes. Definately. Last year, one hundred and seventy two axes (some single blade, some double blade) were murdered in cold sap.

    . . . but I do miss sushi.

    If you knew sushi,
    Like I know sushi,
    Oh, oh, oh what a fish!

    No, I haven’t slept the last two nights so I am tired. Why do you ask?

  78. carlie says

    I’m going to have to stay off the internet all weekend, lest I get too jealous.

    But it’s a beautiful day to, let’s see what’s on the weekend list… write a test? Make a lecture? Repaint a window? Mow the lawn? So many choices…

  79. says

    Patricia:

    Five days to Darkfetus arrival, it will be a close race with the Misters hat. Finished it today, M has the same hat size, it is a snug fit, but you live in one hell of a cold zone! So hat gets it’s bath this weekend and mailed out on Monday – the race is on!

    Oh hell yes! :D

    Anyway, today is Asshole Sister’s baby shower. I really really really don’t want to go, but everyone is telling me to “be the bigger person” and put on a smile and pretend like I want to be there. Blarg. It doesn’t help that I’m sore and crampy and and tired and I generally feel like shit. I’ve also lost all patience with her we need to run every medical test imaginable attitude– she’s acting like she wants something to go wrong, you know? Totes frustrating.

  80. Matt Penfold says

    Anyway, today is Asshole Sister’s baby shower. I really really really don’t want to go, but everyone is telling me to “be the bigger person” and put on a smile and pretend like I want to be there. Blarg. It doesn’t help that I’m sore and crampy and and tired and I generally feel like shit. I’ve also lost all patience with her we need to run every medical test imaginable attitude– she’s acting like she wants something to go wrong, you know? Totes frustrating.

    Can you not plead a twinge or something ?

  81. Matt Penfold says

    You can have some of my choc chip cookies as well. Only been out of the oven 15 mins, so the choc chips are still slightly melted.

    I must resist though, they are for this evening.

  82. Matt Penfold says

    I prolly spelled it wrong– but colloquially, it’s like make an appearance, make some small talk, kind of inconsequential party talk, you know?

    And it normally implies that you would rather be doing something else. You would not schmooz(e?) with good friends for example.

  83. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    DLC, I was the one who make the snarky comment about collateral damage, not Tony.

  84. chigau (棒や石) says

    Google translate does Yiddish.
    שמוז (Şmwz) apparently means schmooze.
    Wasn’t that helpful?

  85. erikthebassist says

    I’ve always thought of and used the term, and heard the term used mainly to refer to socializing with the intent of gaining some benefit, like rubbing elbows or the more PC “networking”.

  86. Matt Penfold says

    I’ve always thought of and used the term, and heard the term used mainly to refer to socializing with the intent of gaining some benefit, like rubbing elbows or the more PC “networking”.

    I don’t think the way Audley is using the term is that different from how you use it. I get the impression Audley is going to her sister’s baby shower to avoid family strife, and so she can be considered to be going for that benefit.

  87. erikthebassist says

    squee!! I just realized my plans happen to be in perfect alignment with the @csiroadtrip today!

    My GF and I were planning a drive to see the fall colors and were heading to Ellicotville for no other reason than there’s some good scenery on the way, but since @csiroadtrip is going to Lily Dale, it’s only a few degrees on the compass to go there instead, and about the same distance with similar scenery.

    So if I get lucky I may get to meet Rebecca and tell her in person how inspiring she is.

  88. Matt Penfold says

    So if I get lucky I may get to meet Rebecca and tell her in person how inspiring she is.

    Tell from all of us!

  89. says

    We don’t need no stinkin’ binders full of women to consider for leadership positions … not here, not there, not anywhere. Bryan Fischer makes the case that women should not serve, well, not in any position where they may be in leadership positions over men.

    …According to Fischer, “masculine leadership in society over the nation” is “God’s basic plan for today,” and “political leadership ought to be … reserved for the hands of males.” Anticipating criticism, the religious right leader added that those who believe in gender equality won’t offer a “reasoned” response to his shameless misogyny…

    Fischer is a Mitt Romney supporter. 1:53 video of Fischer here:
    http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/10/20/14577839-this-week-in-god
    or here: YouTube.

  90. Matt Penfold says

    Fischer is a Mitt Romney supporter

    Romney’s supporters really aren’t doing him any favours. I imagine Romney feels like David Cameron does when one the more right-wing party members goes of on one about gays or blacks.

  91. says

    Oh, no, signs of cooperation among the fundies and mormons are multiplying. Not good. Not good at all.

    Less than a year after prominent Southern Baptist pastor Robert Jeffress condemned Romney’s faith — he said the candidate is “a member of a cult” — Jeffress now says he’s “made peace” with Romney’s Mormonism because he opposes President Obama more.

    Jeffress says that Obama has his “fist in the face of god.” Rile the base with fight metaphors. Cheezits.

    On a related note, a reference to Mormonism as a cult was scrubbed from the website of the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association after Graham met privately with Romney.

    In other news, one comedian said that Romney’s jokes were good at the Al Smith dinner, but that he didn’t enjoy telling them, that Romney looked like a guy trying to smile while a knife was stuck in his gut. Video of speech.

    Obama’s speech at the Al Smith dinner.

  92. says

    This is a follow up to my post at 120. Remember when Bryan Fischer spoke at the Values Voter Summit in September? Fischer’s anti-woman broadcast last week reminded me of one of his sound bites from the Values Voter Summit, one that I rather hope comes true.

    “If Barack Obama wins this election the Republican Party as we know it is finished, it is dead, it is toast — you can stick a fork in it. And conservatives, grassroots conservatives, are either going to start a third party or they are going to launch a hostile takeover of the Republican Party.”

    Ah yes, please do suffer the Republican party to be toasted. Let them devolve into an ever-harder, ever-dumber, and most especially, ever-smaller kernel of nutbaggery.

  93. carlie says

    I’m definitely not staying for the full 4 hours.

    FOUR hours??? Is this an “open house” baby shower where people come and go as they please, or do they really expect people to be there for four hours?

  94. says

    Regarding the Boy Scouts link at #119, we’ve discussed before how closely the LDS Church is intertwined with Scouting, especially in western states. The release of the “perversion files” dating back to 1953 gives us plenty of proof that the LDS Church has played a part in perverting the Boy Scouts program in more ways than one.

    Ex-mormon Steve Benson collated some samples from the documents that were released by court order.

    Link.
    … The case file shows the scout master attempted to be a scout leader in several states after being banned in Arnold. He moved to Scottsdale, Ariz. and attempted in 1976 to apply as an adult leader there, but his attempts were refuted. In 1978, however, files indicate he was allowed alone with scouts in Pennsylvania. A letter from a scoutmaster there, dated May 1979, identifies him as a former scoutmaster of a troop sponsored by the Church of Latter Day Saints or Mormon Church in Bedford, Pa.

    Link.
    The lawyers highlighted a 2010 court case, in which an assistant scoutmaster in a Mormon Church-sponsored troop sexually molested a boy in the 1980s.

    Forbes link.
    The lawyer who forced the public release of the Boy Scouts files probably won’t win too many popularity contests. Kelly Clark won a $20 million verdict against the Scouts on behalf of six plaintiffs in 2010, and his website lists other areas of practice that include “Mormon abuse”

    Link.
    Today, a whopping 34% of Boy Scouts troops nationwide are co-sponsored by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. But sources who have scrutinized the BSA’s so-called ‘perversion files’ report that fewer than 2% of the cases documented therein are connected with Mormons. It is believed that LDS Church may have handled child abuse cases internally rather than reporting them to BSA officials.

    Yeah, that’s too kind by half. Mormons “handled” some cases by simply covering them up, by transferring the troop leader to another ward, and by even excommunicating the victims in some cases fer chrissake.

    As Steve Benson noted:

    Lisa Davis–a solid and respected journalist who is a stickler for facts, a gifted writer and a former writer for the Phoenix, AZ, “New Times”–wrote a book entitled “The Sins of Brother Curtis: A Story of Betrayal, Conviction, and the Mormon Church” [New York, New York: Scribner, a divison of Simon & Schuster, Inc., 2011], 354 pp].

    The LDS Church’s defense of “Brother [Frank] Curtis”–a pedophilic LDS Scout leader who had been excommunicated and then, astoundingly enough, re-baptized, where he continued to have Mormon youth under his “care”–was disingenuous, disgusting and pure evil.

  95. broboxley OT says

    If Barack Obama wins this election the Republican Party as we know it is finished, it is dead, it is toast

    yup all of those democrats from the 1960’s who stole a perfectly good party can go crawl under a rock and stay there. Hopefully some progressives can put it back to what it once was, a party of freedom for americans, less spending on the defense department and a viable interstate transportation system.

  96. says

    maia160: Hello and welcome! Feel free to stop by any time you get frustrated with those assholes. I used to be a low-brass player, so I know the feeling.

    In related news, my housemate just told me that he is a Republican and that he doesn’t know who he’s voting for in this election. I knew there was a reason I’ve never really liked him. But he’s a white gamer-guy from a relatively rich family who thinks he’s super smart, business-savvy, and generally better than everyone. I guess I shouldn’t really be surprised. I’m trying to prepare myself for when he eventually votes for Romney so that I don’t punch him in the face or anything. The fact that he’d even consider Romney at all makes me never want to talk to him again.


    erikthebassist:

    So if I get lucky I may get to meet Rebecca and tell her in person how inspiring she is.

    Tell from all of us!

    Yes, please do.

    Last night my friends and I went out to play pool and then filled our flasks with whiskey and went to a corn maze, where we wandered around drunkenly for about an hour before eventually finding our way out. Then we bought a pumpkin from the lovely people who owned the cornfield and went to get midnight breakfast at IHOP. It was great.
    Today I am writing a paper on Ezra Pound and then going to a little musical get-together at a friend’s house. My boyfriend and most of my friends are all music graduate students, so we get together at my friend’s house and play through pieces that we’ve been working on. It’s a cool way to share music in a no-pressure environment, and also a great excuse to drink and hang out with a bunch of musicians and professors.
    I wish all of you could come. One of these days a conference will happen close enough to me that I’ll be able to actually meet some of you IRL. In the mean time, I offer you all pumpkin muffins via USB.

  97. Portia says

    Four hours is ridiculous for a baby shower.

    But not totally surprising for someone with the personality of Asshole Sister. The longer it’s all about her, the better.

  98. Matt Penfold says

    Four hours is ridiculous for a baby shower.

    Yeah, everyone will get that wrinkly skin from being wet so long!

  99. chigau (棒や石) says

    Long ago …
    Baby showers (and wedding showers) were alcohol-absent, women-only affairs that involved elaborate rituals for present-opening, tiny sandwiches and *shudder* party games.
    They could easily last four hours.

  100. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    everyone is telling me to “be the bigger person”

    …has this phrase EVER been used to refer to anything except capitulating to and rewarding a bully? Because that’s literally the only usage I can remember ever seeing.

    I won’t tell you what to do, but I certainly wouldn’t show up and try to make nice at an event that had been deliberately scheduled to inconvenience me. :/

  101. says

    Good news from the Land of Minnesota: there’s a chance Michele Bachmann may be unseated. Her opponent, Democrat Jim Graves, is being outspent 10-1 by Bachmann, but the race is now within the margin of error according to polls that show 48% for Bachmann and 46% for Graves. Independent voters lean toward Graves by a 15-point margin.

    Graves believes the tipping point in the district was the combination of Bachmann’s presidential campaign creating embarrassment for constituents and a more recent self-inflicted scandal. “I think a turning point was Ms. Huma Abedin and the whole Muslim brotherhood conspiracy theory. And when people in the district saw that Speaker Boehner and Senator McCain said this has no basis in reality, I think that woke people up here. That’s not what a person in Congress or especially a person on the intelligence committee should say.”

  102. carlie says

    Baby shower agenda, 4-hour plan:

    Hour 1: tell the expectant mother how beautiful she is pregnant

    Hour 2: play horrid baby games, half of which involve how well you know the expectant mother and can therefore lay claim to the status of being one of her BFFs, the other half of which involve being a slightly bitter, very worn-out mother of many children whose only solace is winning those stupid games where you have to know every brand of formula and every spit-up stain removal technique in existence.

    Hour 3: watch expectant mother open her gifts, act excited and thrilled that she is getting all of those things for her baby, who of course deserves the very best, which means every item in the proper color and style that the expectant mother picked out on her baby registry.

    Hour 4: coo over the gifts, tell expectant mother how awesome she is, and volunteer for unlimited babysitting of the little angel after it arrives. Remember, this is the most attention the expectant mother has gotten since her wedding, she is never likely to get so much attention ever again, so you’d better make it worth it for her.

    ;)

  103. says

    Oh god, I remember all too well when I tried to fit in with the other young mothers in my suburban neighborhood.

    Baby showers. How much fucking cooing wedded to greed and oneupmanship can one take?

    Tupperware parties. Tupperware is useful. Parties to sell it? Not so much. More like training for focusing on the trivial.

    Makeup parties. Skin rash for weeks afterward. Peer pressure to be a good sport and engage in new agey skin care practices.

    Fucking soul-destroying, all of it. Well, I did like the exchanges of garden produce.

  104. maia160 says

    Thanks to everyone for the warm welcome! This place is like a refuge from the idiots.

    Last night, I had the chance to explain the problem of gendered insults to one guy that was willing to listen. Despite the shit that I took from some of the other assholes, this guy actually listened. Getting through to one person actually made all the crap I took worth it.

  105. chigau (棒や石) says

    carlie
    Baby shower agenda, 4-hour plan…
    Yup.
    Every excruciating minute of them.

  106. says

    Thanks, Janine, for the music links. Good way to wash away the PTSS from exposure to Stepfordwifeish suburbs (in Minnesota, no less, dangerously close to Michele Bachmann’s territory).

  107. Matt Penfold says

    There are times when being a privileged male really seems worthwhile. Going through life without ever having had to go to a baby shower is clearly one of those times.

  108. opposablethumbs says

    I remember all too well when I tried to fit in with the other young mothers in my suburban neighborhood.

    Makes me almost grateful that I live in a soulless inner-city neighbourhood of a grimy and heartless megalopolis. Mind you, I’m unusually lucky in that the other people living in the building are a decent lot (and one of them not only knows who Rebecca Watson is, he strongly supports her. What are the odds, eh? In the soulless inner-city neighbourhood of a grimy and heartless megalopolis, I ask you. All I need now is to acquire some Pharyngulite neighbours).

  109. dianne says

    I must admit that the baby shower for my daughter went on all afternoon, i.e. 4-5 hours. As I remember, it went something like this…

    First 1/2 hour: Relatives who haven’t seen each other in 5+ years.

    Second 1/2 hour: Open presents. Feel smug that since we refused to reveal the fetus’ gender, the clothes aren’t all pink. Also, it’s good to have a baby shower given by relatives who have had kids. They tend to give very practical presents.

    Second hour: Cake!

    Rest of afternoon: Sit around gossiping and not moving around much after eating old school Midwestern high carb cake.

    I guess the moral is that long baby showers work best when everyone’s in a carb coma.

  110. opposablethumbs says

    PS I had never even heard of baby showers until relatively recently – and then only in films/on TV. Guess I really am lucky (and I’m not even a privileged male, Matt! ;-) )

  111. says

    All I need now is to acquire some Pharyngulite neighbours).

    At one point in time in the not-too-distant past we Pharyngulites were going to start a commune in Alaska, taking over my eldest brother’s property. He gave his permission.

  112. Patricia, OM says

    The thing I hate most about baby showers are all the horror stories of labour and birth. Why in the hell do women tell such awful stories with such great glee to a woman probably just a few weeks from delivery? By the time I leave every baby shower I’ve ever been to I want to stop off at the chastity belt shop and by a model in steel.

  113. opposablethumbs says

    PPS of course we never received any baby-shower-type presents either – but baby gear can be really cheap in the charity shops! Babies don’t care what they wear as long as they’re comfortable and mostly dry, and they grow out of everything in about thirty seconds anyway :)

  114. opposablethumbs says

    Good on your brother, Lynna! Isn’t it cold there, though?

    I thought PZ was going to organise a tropical island with a volcano lair …

  115. Patricia, OM says

    Hopefully PZ will get to hear Richard Dawkins talk about something other than how stupid Romney is, and how stupid the American voter is if he gets elected. That’s mostly what he talked about at the FFRF convention last week. Sort of pissed me off, does he think the FFRF membership is mostly shithouse stupid? Sheesh.
    /grinching

  116. says

    I have to admit that Tupperware parties the way Dave Barry described his sound … fairly entertaining.

    Also, showers and parties of any kind at my uncle’s house tended to go past the 4 hours mark but that was because he had a pool and most of us ended up in it, and everyone brought kids, and blah blah blah. (My wedding was at my uncle’s and the guests had a pool party after we took off for our honeymoon … I wish we had stayed for a few more hours and broken out wedding swimsuits instead.)

  117. Matt Penfold says

    Sort of pissed me off, does he think the FFRF membership is mostly shithouse stupid? Sheesh.

    Maybe he confused the FFRF with the Secular Coalition of America. Some of the members of the later are indeed shithouse stupid.

  118. says

    My baby shower was held by my now mother in law and her dried-up, old-biddy Catholic friends. It wasn’t till my son was about 10 that I had the lightning-flash realization that said shower was entirely about them basically patting themselves on the back because I (an unwed 19-year-old who had not planned to get pregnant) “chose life”. No, they did not invite any of my friends or family; the only person there who I had met previously was my now mother in law. Yes, I am still enraged on 19-year-old-me’s behalf.

  119. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    All Shook Up-Ry Cooder with Larry Blackmon

    I did not know this was on the Cocktail. In some ways, I am blessedly ignorant of pop culture.

  120. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    Chigau, I feel pretty much the same way.

    Surprising, isn’t it.

    I remember when that song was popular.

    *shudders*

  121. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Patricia: “Hopefully PZ will get to hear Richard Dawkins talk about something other than how stupid Romney is, and how stupid the American voter is if he gets elected.”

    Dawkins suffers from that Anglo smugness that derives from having had a quasi-functioning democracy/economy/society for a couple of centuries. I remember it well from my travels. An American or Brit or Aussie (rarely Canadian, interestingly) would start to lecture the denizens of a third world shithole on why they lived in a third world shithole. I would of course cringe and mouth “Sorry” over the shoulder of the lecturer.

    I suppose now that 8 years of Bush have turned the US into a third world shithole, we will have to get used to it.

    I remember one very satisfying episode, though. A German was lecturing a woman from California about how stupid Californians must be to have elected Governor Arnold.

    “Yeah,” I chimed in. “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    If looks could have killed, I would have been a lump of green putty on the floor.

  122. opposablethumbs says

    Plus, brother has a greenhouse.

    Sounds good to me.

    No, they did not invite any of my friends or family; the only person there who I had met previously was my now mother in law. Yes, I am still enraged on 19-year-old-me’s behalf.

    Hell, you’re entitled to hunt them down and shoot the sanctimonious swine. What a totally shitty way to behave. Any chance of revenge …? Never too late for a good revenge.

  123. Portia says

    “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    BOOM. Please accept these high fives.

  124. Patricia, OM says

    Matt – Oh, I didn’t know that. Hopefully someone is at the Texas show and they will chime in with what Dawkins speaks about. AronRa, Matt Dillahunty & PZ sounds like a great line up. Unfortunately I fell asleep before Julia Sweeney performed in Portland.

  125. Socio-gen, something something... says

    *looks around blearily after 6 hours of reading and note-taking*

    Oh hai! Does someone have a thesaurus I could borrow? Chandra Mohanty is challenging my belief that I have a good vocabulary. Good stuff, but oh my hannah, dense language.

    carlie: Yep. Sounds like every baby shower I’ve ever attended, save one.* Although, in my family circle, Hours 1 and 2 are also spent passive-aggressively complaining about the food being served on the buffet. “Oh, you made potato salad with onion? Well I never make it that way. JimBob and the [horde of brats] don’t really like exotic food.”

    Also, you forgot the part where, for those four hours, every mother in the room tells a birth horror story in graphic detail that would make a SAW movie look like Reading Rainbow and tells you how to do everything — from pain relief to potty-training.

    *My brother and his g/f are atheists and activists and sorta-crunchy camping/hiking types in their 30’s. For their shower, they requested that, instead of gifts they didn’t need, guests make donations of baby supplies to the local shelters and food banks.

    It was co-ed, multicultural, and turned into an hours-long event (was only scheduled for 3 hours) because no one wanted to break up the party. Most of the afternoon and evening were spent eating from a dish-to-pass buffet of locally-grown and organic and/or ethnic foods, listening to their musician friends jam, and discussing politics, religion, Occupy, civil disobedience tactics and strategies, and whether or not A. felt up to doing a hike to Buttermilk Falls, as well as a side discussion among the women of feminist strategies for subverting media narratives. Best shower ever!

    Lynna:
    Ugh. Brings back memories of the soul-numbing hours I wasted attending those stupid “buy overpriced things” parties. I have no idea what is in Mary Kay cosmetics but I know the foundation causes me to break out in hives. I looked like someone had covered me in skin-tone Play-dough patches. That was attractive.

    maia160:
    Congratulations! That feeling of finally getting through to someone is so wonderful.

    Patricia:
    The horror stories were a must at any of my family’s showers. I’m sure it’s half the reason I still feel nothing but relief that I had to have c-sections. (The other half being that I was 3 for 3 for healthy babies.)

  126. opposablethumbs says

    “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    Niiiice.

  127. Patricia, OM says

    a_ray – Amen to the 8 years of Bush turning us into a third world shit hole. Perhaps Dawkins doesn’t know how his Oxford accent sounds to Americans? I felt like a three year old getting a finger jabbed at me.

  128. carlie says

    Tim Tebow has patented “tebowing”, that move that football players have been making for decades already. srsly. Not sure if it refers to the move, or just calling it by his name.

  129. Patricia, OM says

    Socio-gen – re:the baby shower horror stories, I always felt like I was the only one sitting there like a deer stunned by headlights just before a Kenworth hits it. But then I’m always the only childless by choicer at baby showers. I used to get endless grilling about why I wasn’t pregnant back in my old fundie days. The only way out was to LIE sweetly, We haven’t been blessed yet. *gag*

  130. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    Patricia, even when she was a True Believer™ could fulfill what her purpose was for.

    Missed out on her chance to be A Clown Car For Jesus!

    *snort*

  131. Patricia, OM says

    Janine – yeah, having grown up in jesus camp I decided to mind Mrs. Reagan and just say NO! *smirk*

  132. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Yep, it’s either lie or tell the truth and be stuck listening to everyone tell you that you’ll change your mind as soon as you get pregnant, it’s God’s purpose for you and you’re doing womanhood wrong for denying him because “greatest blessing EVAH!” Sadly, when I was still soaking in the fundie-haze, I did that to the few women I knew who’d chosen to be childless.

    When I was at one of these things and about 15-16yo (and utterly ignorant as my parents wanted), my mom’s cousin mentioned that she’d chosen not to have kids. And I asked how her husband handled her not wanting to have sex. Because that was the only way I knew of to avoid having babies and they were married, so….

    She laughed and laughed….

  133. UnknownEric says

    Fairport Convention

    Ooh, I love Fairport Convention. Especially the glorious Denny/Thompson era.

  134. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    Socio-gen, despite all of the misgivings I have about how my parents raised us, I still feel lucky that I did not have yours (or Patricia’s) upbringing. I have nothing but respect and awe for those who have been able to escape it.

  135. says

    I survived! Stayed for about 45 minutes (dropped off the gift, ate some food, yadda yadda) and now I’m home, feeling hella crampy (DarkFetus dropped this morning and now I’m feeling wicked uncomfortable. But I can breathe!).

    You guys want greedy? Asshole Sister is throwing the shower for herself. Totally tacky, no?

  136. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    UnknownEric, that was from their first album. (And Richard Thompson was still a teen.) Judy Dyble was the singer.

  137. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    Also, Richard Thompson is about the closest thing I have to a musical deity.

  138. UnknownEric says

    Also, Richard Thompson is about the closest thing I have to a musical deity.

    He’s definitely on my shortlist.

  139. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Janine, it’s still a struggle sometimes. There’s still a lot of baggage left over, but Pharyngula helps tremendously there.

    People who were nice and concilatory to my religious nonsense were, in effect, giving me permission not to challenge the old patterns of thinking. The people, back then and now, who called bullshit and didn’t play nice about it, they were the ones who gave me permission and courage to even think those “blasphemous” thoughts I’d avoided so diligently. (Women are the equals of men?! Error! Error! Reboot! Pray harder!). They started me on the path of recognizing BS for what it was and being able to admit to myself, and then out loud, that I was an atheist and feminist. They helped me be myself instead of that caricature I’d created to meet everyone else’s expectations.

    Audley:
    45 minutes? You have a much higher tolerance than I.

    Sounds like DarkFetus is prepping for her entrance!

    *raises eyebrows* So, she’s an asshole to everyone then, such that no one was willing to throw a greed-fest for her?

  140. UnknownEric says

    But I can hear Clive Gregson and Christine Collister.

    On the topic of Clive Gregson, I’ve always had an odd soft-spot for the first Any Trouble record. Yes, it’s regurgitated early Costello, but it’s really good regurgitated early Costello.

  141. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    we’ve discussed before how closely the LDS Church is intertwined with Scouting, especially in western states.

    Lynna, my scoutmaster in Arizona was a stake president(?) in the LSD. I don’t know if any of us reported what he did but, after I left cub scouts (after about two years), he, quite suddenly, moved down to Havasu City. I wonder if someone reported it or if it was just a job change.

    Part of me wants to find the Arizona files and look at the troops and packs involved to see if, once reading it, I remember the asshole rapist’s name. But part of me does not want to go there. Then again, my brain keeps going there all on its own, so I have no idea what I will have the courage to do. It scares me so much on so many levels. What if my failure meant some other kid went through hell at his hands?

    Baby showers. How much fucking cooing wedded to greed and oneupmanship can one take?

    And don’t forget the attempts to completely and totally gross people out — melted Snickers bar or some butterscotch pudding in a diaper, for instance.

    At one point in time in the not-too-distant past we Pharyngulites were going to start a commune in Alaska, taking over my eldest brother’s property.

    I thought it was going to be on somebody-or-other’s secret tropical island lair? Alaska? Up to 900 mosquito bites per minute?

    Not sure if it refers to the move, or just calling it by his name.

    Maybe it refers to being a good athlete who is totally inept at the position and is only popular because he is a right-wing authoritarian asshat christianist dominionist idiot?

    DarkFetus dropped this morning and now I’m feeling wicked uncomfortable. But I can breathe!

    I got dropped out of the back of a VW Microbus when I was 6 months old. Does that count?

    Audley, you are a far more patient person than I.

    Well, pregnancy makes women whole. Women suddenly become ultra patient. And it is the only time in their life when something they do is actually called labour!

    ==========

    META:

    Sometimes I feel mildly multi-personality when I comment. I spend some of the comment treating y’all like therapists (sorry) and the rest of the comment tossing in one liners. Must read very strange to some of you.

  142. says

    Found this link while haunting DemocraticUnderground.com. The author laments that he saw so little support from “humanist/atheist groups” at an important local charitable event, and makes the bald claim that “Without fail, surveys show people who are religious are vastly more generous.”

    It made me mad for too many reasons to write about more than once, so I went on at length here: “Compassion of the Godless” (Links open in new tab.) Especially in light of the last couple days of Greta’s life and blog, with the outpouring of compassion and help that was sent her way thanks to all’y’all and many others… grrrhg.

    Even when atheist groups do donate and sponsor charitable works, they can be turned down, as ACS and ACLU did recently, among others. The stigma against atheism is so strong that even when we try to join in common cause with our natural allies, sometimes they don’t want us!

    I think there’s a lot more to it than that and my thoughts are in my post… I was hoping to hear from some of you FtB lot about godless giving? A UC Berkeley study suggests that Nones are more generous than the highly religious, but motivated by compassion. The religious appear to be motivated by “other factors” like “reputational concerns” (shades of Paul Ryan’s pot-washing photo-op).

    Me, I’m a broke-ass student, so I’m not in a great position for donating either money or time. If I wanted to, though, there is not a single food bank or soup kitchen in my town that’s not in a church. What about you?

  143. says

    Lynna, my scoutmaster in Arizona was a stake president(?) in the LSD. I don’t know if any of us reported what he did but, after I left cub scouts (after about two years), he, quite suddenly, moved down to Havasu City. I wonder if someone reported it or if it was just a job change.

    Part of me wants to find the Arizona files and look at the troops and packs involved to see if, once reading it, I remember the asshole rapist’s name. But part of me does not want to go there. Then again, my brain keeps going there all on its own, so I have no idea what I will have the courage to do. It scares me so much on so many levels. What if my failure meant some other kid went through hell at his hands?

    That asshole no longer controls anyone, I bet. You do what is best for you.

    As for failing, if you want to call it that, kids fail. Kids are not responsible. When kids fail it is not failure, it is just being a kid. Freakin’ LDS church adults are responsible. When they fail, we should put them in jail.

  144. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Woo-hoo, got the handicapped placard for the Redhead in the mail today. I didn’t worry about loading/unloading her in a handicapped spot if I parked elsewhere, put she did. One less worry.

  145. broboxley OT says

    got a nice score today 1987 complete encyclopedia Britannica good condition, just dusty. Nice thing about books one cant just take down a link and watch the information disappear

  146. erikthebassist says

    So yay we did get to meet Rebecca! and Jon Ronson, Richard Wiseman and Joe Nickell.

    They were extremely nice even though we kinda walked up on them while they were doing some filming and waited until they stopped to go up and introduce ourselves.

    I think I took them all off guard by knowing their names. Joe did some magic tricks for us with his wooden nickel business cards and then gave them to us and we chatted with them for about 10 minutes or so.

    So I was able to tell RW face to face what giant she is in my eyes, and how much respect I have for the way she has stood up in the face of viscous attacks for the past couple of years. I’m glad I had that chance. I don’t think she can hear too many times how much good she’s done.

    I also sent her greetings and salutations from Pharyngula. She says “Hi Pharyngula”

    FTR, I’m not much in to hero worship. Most celebrities don’t deserve the adulation they get, but in the case, I have to make an exception.

  147. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    As for failing, if you want to call it that, kids fail. Kids are not responsible. When kids fail it is not failure, it is just being a kid.

    I am not Catholic. I have never been Catholic. But I swear that I have enough guilt because of this asshole to keep a good sized parish in confession forever. I should have had the strength to say no, stop; I should have told someone; I should have refused to do anything to that little girl; I shouldn’t have forgotten her name; if I had told, maybe I would have kept some other kid from being abused; and on and on. I know that I am not at fault, but there’s a part of me that keeps telling me that it’s my fault. And I’ve noticed that when I write about this, I don’t even think about my phrasing yet my phrasing keeps hinting (or saying it flat-out) that I am in fault.

    I didn’t even consider that the LDS would have been protecting the rapists as well as the BSA. That’s disturbing. And scary. I wonder how long the LDS perversion files are?

  148. cicely says

    I’ve always thought of and used the term, and heard the term used mainly to refer to socializing with the intent of gaining some benefit, like rubbing elbows or the more PC “networking”.

    Me, too; with a strong undercurrent of up-sucking. Maybe a side-order of smarm.

    So, Jiddisch “schmooze” seems to have taken a completely different turn than German “schmusen” which is snuggle.

    Possibly by way of “to cozy up to someone”?

    At one point in time in the not-too-distant past we Pharyngulites were going to start a commune in Alaska, taking over my eldest brother’s property. He gave his permission.

    *whiny voice*
    But it’s cold in Alaska!

    And I don’t want enough global warming for that to no longer be true!

    “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    :D

    Missed out on her chance to be A Clown Car For Jesus!

    WIN!

    You guys want greedy? Asshole Sister is throwing the shower for herself. Totally tacky, no?

    Totally tacky, yes. And congratulations on your Early Escape.

    I thought it was going to be on somebody-or-other’s secret tropical island lair? Alaska? Up to 900 mosquito bites per minute?

    See? See?!?

    I thought we were all going to move into PZ’s Supervillain Stronghold and be his minions and live happily ever after….

    META:

    Sometimes I feel mildly multi-personality when I comment. I spend some of the comment treating y’all like therapists (sorry) and the rest of the comment tossing in one liners. Must read very strange to some of you.

    ‘Sall good!
    :)

    As for strange…it would need to be very strange indeed to out-weird my Dreaming Brainz. I have the sad duty to tell you…your comments aren’t even in contention.

    blf, on the other hand….
    -

  149. mildlymagnificent says

    Showers? Tupperware parties?

    The best I remember was a wedding shower, not a baby one. A Tupperware one where all the purchases went to the bride. My sister’s friend organised it – at our house. Back in those days, we never had booze at such events. But we finished up at 11pm dancing in a conga line around the traffic roundabout anyway!

  150. ednaz says

    carlie @ #135 – Jesus, Carlie, you can not get more accurate than that.

    Lynna @ #137 – Yes, exactly. And ‘Sorry’ and *hugs*.

    “Getting through to one person actually made all the crap I took worth it.”
    Hooray for maia160 !!!

    dianne @145 – Enjoyed that! : )

    Patricia @148 – THIS.

    Socio-gen, One good party after so many awful ones. You ARE a survivor.

    Patricia,OM –
    “We haven’t been blessed yet. *gag*”
    You have my sympathies.

  151. ednaz says

    kristinc @159 –
    “…I had the lightning-flash realization that said shower was entirely about them basically patting themselves on the back…”

    What an awful thing for them to do! No wonder you’re still pissed.

    opposable thumbs – If there’s gonna be revenge, count me in. : )

  152. ednaz says

    Ogvorbis @ 201
    META:

    Sometimes I feel mildly multi-personality when I comment. I spend some of the comment treating y’all like therapists (sorry) and the rest of the comment tossing in one liners. Must read very strange to some of you.

    Ogvorbis – Makes me feel right at home. Thanks! and many hugs to you.

  153. says

    …I know that I am not at fault, but there’s a part of me that keeps telling me that it’s my fault. And I’ve noticed that when I write about this, I don’t even think about my phrasing yet my phrasing keeps hinting (or saying it flat-out) that I am in fault.

    I didn’t even consider that the LDS would have been protecting the rapists as well as the BSA. That’s disturbing. And scary. I wonder how long the LDS perversion files are?

    Well, intellectually knowing you are not at fault, and emotionally realizing that are not the same thing. Besides, that’s what LDS and Boy Scout coverup criminals are good at, instilling guilt and confusion so that their victims don’t fight back and don’t tell.

    If it helps at all for you to talk about here, go for it. Feeling like you are at fault does show that your humanity, your empathy, is far greater than any LDS Stake President pervert. Even as a kid, you were a more developed human being.

    I wish we had access to LDS files. Those mormons keep good records, and then they hide them really well.

    The current release of Boy Scout perversion files may not be the last. This release consists of 14,500 secret and redacted pages. The documents cover 1965 to 1985, and they detail molestation accusations against Boy Scout volunteers, along with criminal convictions. However, I read elsewhere (NPR) that the perversion files kept by the Boy Scouts go back to 1910. I don’t think we’re done with this. It will be like the Catholic abuse scandals, with details emerging bit by bit.

    The attorneys also asked Thursday for the Boy Scouts to voluntarily release its so-called “perversion files” from 1985 to 2011. A Texas judge on October 4 ordered the release of the post-1985 files, but the attorneys said they expect the Scouts to appeal that order.

  154. ednaz says

    Ogvorbis, I hope my post to you came across right and did not sound flippant. I am woefully unqualified to offer any advice. I can only offer hugs and a good ear.

  155. says

    Okay, everybody is complaining about the location of the Pharyngulite commune in Alaska. There is a brief shining moment in the autumn when cold nights have killed the mosquitoes, and the days are still tolerably warm. I suggest we have a commune vacation home that we can frequent then and only then. [effing wimps, says the former Alaskan who no longer has to live there]

    Abrupt, neck-snapping change of subject: Romney’s flight into a yet larger Kingdom of Lies ALL Lies, was noted by Matt Taibbi of RollingStone. Long article, but well worth reading. Fun … and tragic.


    Romney has spent his whole political career being so careful: in all his previous races, he’s used his admittedly very quick mind and slick presentation skills to walk one political tightrope and rhetorical razor-edge after another, trying to run as a pseudo-conservative Republican in traditionally liberal Massachusetts, while in primary season this year, he tried his best to maintain a whiff of centrist cred as a national politician even as the immediate demands of the Republican primaries forced him to veer sharply right. The psychic energy it takes to internally manage all of those past contortions (and future calculations) while publicly walking a razor’s edge is no joke: it takes a special man to do it.

    But now Romney’s finally all the way to the endgame, and he’s just letting go. No more being careful, and weighing himself down on debate stages with painstakingly parsed positions … Now there’s no more future to worry about and he’s just casting off from his moorings and being what he basically is at heart, which is a salesman and bullshit artist of the highest order.

    Romney’s realized that numbers don’t matter, and past facts don’t even matter that much: he’s run all fall on completely made-up, mathematically-incoherent jobs and tax plans, and not only is he not suffering, he’s made it all the way to a statistical tie with the president (or even a lead, if you believe the Gallup polls), and the presidency is in sight. He’s finally released the burden of all those internal contradictions, and the inventions and devious distortions are coming so fast and so furious now, it’s energized him psychologically, and he seems to be taking flight before our eyes….

  156. chigau (棒や石) says

    ednaz
    FYI
    If you type
    <blockquote>paste quoted text here</blockquote>
    this will result.

    paste quoted text here

    It will make your comments easier to read when you’re quoting someone.

  157. says

    … unemployment remains high after all these years, and a candidate with a real plan to make things better could make a strong case for his election.

    But Mr. Romney, it turns out, doesn’t have a plan; he’s just faking it. In saying that, I don’t mean that I disagree with his economic philosophy; I do, but that’s a separate point. I mean, instead, that Mr. Romney’s campaign is telling lies: claiming that its numbers add up when they don’t, claiming that independent studies support its position when those studies do no such thing….

    Excerpted from Paul Krugman’s Snow Job on Jobs.

    For those that want details, all of Krugman’s general statements are backed up by facts.

  158. carlie says

    Okay, everybody is complaining about the location of the Pharyngulite commune in Alaska.

    I had a dream about Alaska last night. I went to a big fossil dig, and we got there, and then came off of the plane and I realized I was in Alaska, but hadn’t known before that was where we were going so I didn’t have anything packed for the cold. And we were going to be out camping for all of it. We went through a weird shopping center on our way out of the town, and I tried to stop and buy some gloves but the information person said they only sold gloves at the KFC window. I went to it and tried to buy gloves, but after I got them, realized they had sold me slippers instead. I tried to run back and buy gloves, but then once I got out the door, saw that the ferry had just left with the entire collection team on it and I had no idea how to catch up to them or where exactly they were going and now my career was RUINED.

    Spouse asked me if I ever have good dreams. No. No, i don’t.

  159. says

    Paul Krugman’s take on Romney’s claim that, “When I was 37, I helped start a small company.”

    Ahem. It’s true that when Bain Capital started, it had only a handful of employees. But it had $37 million in funds, raised from sources that included wealthy Europeans investing through Panamanian shell companies and Central American oligarchs living in Miami while death squads associated with their families ravaged their home nations. Hey, doesn’t every plucky little start-up have access to that kind of financing?

  160. says

    I tried to run back and buy gloves, but then once I got out the door, saw that the ferry had just left with the entire collection team on it and I had no idea how to catch up to them or where exactly they were going and now my career was RUINED.

    That’s okay, Carlie. Don’t worry. I will send my brother into your dream. He will pick you up at the surreal store. You can warm your hands in the ruff of his dog with the best winter coat ever. And he will loan you all the gear you need to camp in Alaska, and to stay warm while doing so.

  161. carlie says

    Lynna, that might actually help me get to sleep tonight. It’s been one of those weird ones that’s stuck with me all day. :)

  162. says

    Gleeful, ecstatic bullshitter, Mitt Romney, should add to his ridiculousness by dressing as a pirate.

    Andrew Kaczynski at Buzzfeed reported that while “Romney has often used Chinese piracy and intellectual property theft as an issue while attacking President Obama on China,” he had invested in “Youku, a Chinese version of YouTube” that “became a haven for downloading illegal American content.” He also invested in a Bain fund with a major stake in GOME, a Chinese electronics company that, according to the Boston Globe, “is being sued by Microsoft Corp. for selling computers with pirated versions of its Windows and Office software.”

    I have my own theory regarding Romney’s headlong dash into Liar Land. His mormonism does not allow him to drink, of course he can’t do drugs, and even his methods of fornication are limited. So how does the man get high? He lies.

  163. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    If it helps at all for you to talk about here, go for it. Feeling like you are at fault does show that your humanity, your empathy, is far greater than any LDS Stake President pervert. Even as a kid, you were a more developed human being.

    Thanks. I don’t feel that way, but thanks.

  164. broboxley OT says

    Lynna, where in the wonderland of alaska is your brothers place? I would invite you all to hooperbay but it is already overcrowded

    900 mosquito bites per minute? You must be city folk

  165. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    I mentioned a thread or two ago that it was possible for a five year old to feed an ostrich while sitting on an adult’s shoulders. Apparently Mrs. Fishy snapped a picture.

  166. cicely says

    rowanvt, I recognize that expression. Our late Merp-cat wore it when we clipped her down to a stubble one summer.

    In our defense, she’d let it get incredibly matted and snarled.
    -

  167. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    I remember one very satisfying episode, though. A German was lecturing a woman from California about how stupid Californians must be to have elected Governor Arnold.

    “Yeah,” I chimed in. “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    Threadrupt, but LOL

  168. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Brother Ogvorbis,
    Awhile back, I was listening to Fresh Aire. Terri was interviewing a guy who has been living in an assisted living facility from a very young age due to severe Parkinsons. He had previously lived in a Buddhist Monastery. Anyway, he said one thing that I took away and remembered because it spoke to me.

    He said that Gautama had learned to shine the light of compassion inward. That was a revelation to me–the idea that we could have compassion for ourselves…both our past and present selves.

    I do not know you in real life. I do know you from your posts here sufficiently well to state with some confidence that you are not enough of an asshole to hold a child accountable for something no child should ever have an understanding of. It should not matter that that child was your former self.

  169. Mattir says

    Ogvorbis, I just wanted to say that I completely understand the guilt and shame that results from having been a child who sexually abused another child. It is and was not your fault, and the guilt and shame belong to the person who abused you, not to the child you were. This is, of course, easier said in a blog comment than remembered during a random moment of ruminative and intrusive memory.

    Rhinebeck is wonderful – I bought some new spindles, including a lovely little ring-weighted one with a brass spider, about the size of a wolf spider, on the top of the whorl. I plan to use it whilst leading children’s nature programs and camps. I did the spinning competition again and came in fourth, but the person who came in fifth was also a Pharyngulite, who recognized one of the Rhinebeck Horde by the t-shirts we made for Reason Rally. So I think the Horde was definitely the winner in the blog-readership spinning competition category. I really love this group.

    And I wish DarkFetus all the best in her transition to DarkInfant. Hooray for Horde Spawns (and for the fact that mine had a scouting obligation this weekend and can’t be here at Rhinebeck, so I get to be as non-respectable as I wish!!!)

  170. Jessa says

    broboxley:

    Duke won, that is all

    Well, it had to happen eventually. It’s been, what, nine years?

  171. rowanvt says

    Chigau:

    It’s his halloween costume. I’m gonna get some pet-safe hair coloring goo and paint little X X X marks around his neck, tail, and limbs.

    Frankencat.

    It’s also because he’s an obsessive groomer and has waaaaaay too many hairballs.

  172. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    *whiny voice*
    But it’s cold in Alaska!

    It is incipiently the last full week of October and we are STILL getting 80+ days. I just got an email “reassuring” students that the central plant boilers will be starting up this week (wait…so you’re telling me RVR 1005 gets that fucking hot WITH NO HEAT RUNNING? HOW?!), so I will soon no longer have the reasonable temperature sanctuary of Sequoia Hall.

    Go soak your head. ;(

    (Seriously, can we please just buy terrarium-style heat lamps for all the damned poikilotherms instead? I’m sure it’d be cheaper…)

  173. chigau (棒や石) says

    rowanvt
    You did note that he’s sticking-out his tongue at you?
    —-
    While I have your attention, can you recommend a technique for trimming a cat’s claws?
    With two of us, we can get one toe clipped per session.
    (the vet did all toes on both front feet in a matter of moments but it was done out of my sight)

  174. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Dear god did we just get a jackass in the Amazing Atheist thread

    Yes, it is very concerned…

  175. broboxley OT says

    jessa #238 9 years is a very long time when you co-habit with a die hard duke fan. hmm maybe I can leverage this

  176. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    broboxley:

    got a nice score today 1987 complete encyclopedia Britannica good condition, just dusty. Nice thing about books one cant just take down a link and watch the information disappear

    Sweet!

    As a child, I would get a kick out of randomly reading an entry in parents’ encyclopedia Britannica set.

  177. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Ing:
    Speaking of the Amazing Atheist, I read Stephanie’s recent post (or rather, re-post) about that fucker. I didn’t know anything about him until the recent shit he said. Now that I know more…ooooh he makes my blood boil.

  178. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Whoa!
    What’s this about 900 mosquito bites/minute??

    Who’s on the ‘attract mosquitoes away from everyone else’ team with me again? I despise mosquitoes, but I’d venture up there for the chance to meet you wonderful folks. Granted I might be wearing 15 layers of clothes (which they would likely *still* bite through)…

  179. cicely says

    As a child, I would get a kick out of randomly reading an entry in parents’ encyclopedia Britannica set.

    And then that would cross-reference to something else, which would cross-reference to something else. Sorta like TV Tropes.
    :D
    -

  180. chigau (棒や石) says

    Yeah.
    My sibling won a set of World Book Encyclopedia ca. 1967.
    There were days when we had the whole lot opened on the livingroom floor.

  181. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Now I feel a little bad about giving away the 1989 set I got from my parents after their move. >.> But I really, truly don’t have space for them. :/

  182. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Wow, those scumbags in the Amazing Atheist thread are… y’know I don’t think I have words for people that bad.

  183. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    chigau:

    Oh Eternal one, are blackflies the ones that bite?

  184. chigau (棒や石) says

    Tony
    If one wears a ‘bug-jacket’ the mosquitoes are thwarted.
    Blackflies are tiny and just walk through.
    Mosquitoes insert that teensy proboscis and suck some blood.
    Blackflies bite-out a chunk of flesh.
    (and they come in hundreds)
    Blackflies walk carefully through the places you missed in your application of DEET and gather, daintily biting, in every nook and cranny.
    Blackflies are an abomination unto … everything.

  185. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Ok, so at this Alaskan commune, how about YOU get the blackflies, and I’ll take the skeeters?
    K?
    Cool :)

  186. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    Encyclopedias got me through school. I used to sit in the back of the classroom, snake an encyclopedia off the shelf, and sit there reading it during class. I’d be giving half an ear to the classroom discussion, and when nobody else could answer a question, I’d raise my head, give the answer, and go back to reading the encyclopedia. Several teachers let me get away with that, and no kids beat me up for it. I was quite lucky.

    I never could afford my own set of encyclopedias, though, until I stumbled across a set printed in 1911 at a garage sale somewhere. They were compact, and quite interesting, but too much out of date. I got a more modern set, and an unabridged dictionary, somewhere, and felt quite accomplished.

    Then there was a fire in my apartment, and my entire library was smoke damaged beyond recovery. I tore the covers off everything, and recycled the paper, and cried.

  187. says

    Good morning
    So, the big baking-cooking-partying marathon starts today. A girl turns three only once!
    So, I’m working with some American recipies and, HOW THE FUCK do you do the shopping?
    I mean, metric system recipes, I combine the amount of butter needed in all recipes, and of flour, I can easily half a recipe and so on. And how on earth do you meassure 1 1/2 cup of cold butter?

    Ogvorbis
    Hmm, I do that, too.
    I most often write a post with what’s happening around here on the top, and in times of stress that’s about my personal issues.
    And then I write something to what this person said and that person said and on some topic or other.
    As for the guilt-tripping yourself: I can do that perfectly myself. And since that makes me curl up and not do anything at all anymore, it starts a vicious circle.
    It helped me to visualize and “anthropomorphize” that part of me as “the monkey brain”. When I get those thoughts I make myself aware of this being the monkey brain talking.

    cicely

    Possibly by way of “to cozy up to someone”?

    Probably. In German the conotations are almost 100% positive except in the noun “Schmusekurs”, which would be “to cozy up to someone”.

    Baby-showers
    Well, I actually like the idea of having one (minus stupid games and stuff). Becase around here people will show up with their gifts after the delivery. So you can’t plan ahead (do I need to buy 3 or 20 onesies?) and people are getting on your nerves when you don’t have any anyway.

    Audley
    Yay for DF dropping. Only 3 more days!

    Fossil Fishy
    Cute!
    But in my experience they will lower their head happily ;)

    +++

    “Yeah,” I chimed in. “You guys elected an Austrian. And the Germans know what happens when you elect an Austrian.”

    That’s funny but actually not true. Hitler was appointed, not elected.

    Menyabal
    That’s, that’s horrible!
    I admit that I have quasi-religious feelings about books.

    Me, I wants an OED. And the house to keep it in.

  188. Tethys says

    Good Morning Giliell

    And how on earth do you measure 1 1/2 cup of cold butter?

    It comes in 1 pound packages, with the butter wrapped in 4 sticks. Each stick is 8 tablespoons = 1/2 cup. Happy baking, and happy birthday to the three year old!

  189. mildlymagnificent says

    Tethys, thank you, thank you, thank you.

    I look at appealing US recipes and groan as I flip to the next one because I have no idea what a ‘stick’ of butter might be. If it’s a quarter of a pound it’s near-enough-is-good-enough to 100 grams – I cut our 1/2 kilo butter blocks into quarters for cooking anyway. When I cook recipes like sponges where precise measurements are essential, I use the old trick of weighing according to the weight of the eggs you’re using anyway.

    And your tablespoons are smaller than ours. I’ve made some horrible mistakes using cheap spoon sets where the ‘tablespoon’ is 15 mls rather than the 20 mls (4 teaspoons) Australian standard. So your 8 tablespoons would be ….. 6 of ours, so 1/2 a cup.

  190. says

    Thethys
    German butter comes in neat 250g packages.
    I find those cups, sticks and tablespoons horribly imprecise.
    I mean, with most recipes it doesn’t matter if it’s 10g more or less, but for some things it does.
    If people were at least consistently using ounces, I could live with it ’cause my scales allow me to switch.

  191. katchen says

    Giliell – I can’t remember where I got it from, but I use 225g = 1 US cup as a conversion rate for butter.

  192. katchen says

    Also – the Pharyngula commune sounds pretty nice ‘right now; can I book a spot in lurkers corner? I promise I usually talk more than I type!

  193. opposablethumbs says

    Fossilfishy, that’s a really lovely photo – looks to have been a pretty special moment for a 5-year-old!

    Back rubs if wanted to Audley and good wishes to the imminent DarkInfant!

    Happy baking 3rd birthday to Giliell.

    Hugs to Ogvorbis. And seconding what a_ray said – setting aside for one moment that this was your former self, it would be easier to see that this child was not to blame and that all the blame quite clearly lies with the adult who forced you all. For what it’s worth, if sometimes talking it through here is of even the least scrap of help in any way then I hope you go on doing it. That boy was a victim, and was forced to be the instrument that someone else, the adult in authority, used to do harm.

    Menyambal, did you ever manage to replace all the books or just some of them?

    My parents had an ancient complete Encylopaedia Britannica. When I was about 10 or so my French teacher at school (a woman) once said that it makes sense for “genius” in French to be “le génie” because geniuses are naturally overwhelmingly men. I went through the entire first volume, drawing up a list of all the women mentioned, to prove her wrong – but she just said being named in the EB didn’t make you a genius (yeah, true enough – but where was the whole rest of the discussion we should have had, huh?!?!?!?). I was too young and inexperienced to come back at her, which I still resent.

    And the worst of it is, she didn’t mean any harm. And the school I was at at the time was an all-girl’s school, too.

    I hadn’t remembered that for years …

  194. slowdjinn says

    @Patricia OM #173

    Perhaps Dawkins doesn’t know how his Oxford accent sounds to Americans? I felt like a three year old getting a finger jabbed at me.

    I’m sure someone must have mentioned it to him. He doesn’t just sound like that to Americans – last time I heard him speak I came away agreeing with everything he’d said, and still wanting to slap him.

  195. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Giliell, that particular feeding protocol came from the cheeky goat below the ostrich. If the Small Fry held the bucket at her level the goat would push all the other animals out of the way except for the male ostrich. Small Fry isn’t too impressed by goats, if she wants to feed one we just go a couple of paddocks away from our house. Giant dinosaur ancestors on the other hand are “Just so cool Dad.” :)

    I sold used books for almost 20 years and in all that time I only saw one set of the Unabridged Oxford English Dictionary in it’s full sized form. It was beautiful, full leather, marbled end papers and edges and absolutely massive. It’s much easier to find the Compact version which came with a magnifying glass to read the super-tiny print. I always meant to buy one and never got around to it, I regret that.

    Menyabal: Damn, that’s horrible. It’s funny, I have no reverence for books as such. Part of the job in the used book business is the disposal of volumes that are surplus or damaged. I’ve been directly involved with, or directed others in the slaughter of many thousands of innocent books. But once they belong to an individual they change, they become friends somehow. Weird, but there it is.

  196. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Opposablethumbs: I’m not sure how big a deal it was to her, but it was a really great day for me. One of those times that you hold onto when it all goes a bit pear shaped and you wonder what ever possessed you to have a child.

    Your story about your French teacher made me sad. The well meaning do just as much damage in their own quiet way as the outright malicious.

  197. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Er, that would be “…giant dinosaur decedents.”

  198. opposablethumbs says

    She really did mean well. Got me an au-pair gig in France once, when I was older. But she was Rong with a capital R! :)

    Off to listen to a jam session in a pub now. Hugs to all the Horde!

  199. says

    Fossil Fishy
    Yeah, goats are bastards. Although nice ones. But I usually have to distract the big billygoat as well when the kids want to feed the little goatlets (how’s a baby-goat called anyway?)

    katchen
    I just used an approximation of 1 cup = 250g, which works well for sugar as well. Flour’s a different thing, of course.

    Now, the pumpkin cupcakes are in the oven. I’m under the impression that US muffin tins are bigger than ours as well. I halved the “yields 32″ recipe and still got 24…

  200. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    That was a revelation to me–the idea that we could have compassion for ourselves…both our past and present selves.

    When I feel like this I have a hard time seeing myself as deserving of anything, much less compassion.

    . . . you are not enough of an asshole to hold a child accountable for something no child should ever have an understanding of.

    And I would not hold a child accountable for molestation. Or rape. Except that part of me knows that it was really my fault so I should be accountable.

    It should not matter that that child was your former self.

    It does matter, though. I cannot hear the little voice in someone else’s mind that is saying ‘it really was your fault.’

    . . . and the guilt and shame belong to the person who abused you, not to the child you were.

    The problem there is, I have a hard time separating who I am now from the child I was. I have a horrible tendency to assume that the child I was had the same values, knowledge, experience, and willingness to speak up that I have now. Which is totally not fare in any way.

    And enjoy Rhinebeck. Someday I hope to meat the Pharynguhorde in meatspace.

    Duke won, that is all

    Unfortunately, it was ‘Duke 1, the other team 51’?

    What’s this about 900 mosquito bites/minute??

    In Dinosaurs under the Aurora (Life of the Past), Gangloff (2012), he talks about the difficulty of palaeontology on the North Slope of the Brooks Range along the Coleville River. Which includes small mosquitos who are around in such incredible numbers that they can give a human sized target 900 bites per minute.

    When I get those thoughts I make myself aware of this being the monkey brain talking.

    Its not that hard to differentiate for me. I know, on a conscious level, that these negative thoughts, that it is all my fault, and that I am at fault for letting it happen to others, are not true. It doesn’t stop them from doing weird things to me, though.

    That boy was a victim, and was forced to be the instrument that someone else, the adult in authority, used to do harm.

    I know. But at the same time, that nasty little voice points out that I enjoyed what the rapist did to me and I enjoyed what he made me do with other children which means that it was my fault which is bullshit but the ideas are part of who I am if that makes sense.

    But I usually have to distract the big billygoat as well when the kids want to feed the little goatlets (how’s a baby-goat called anyway?)

    Baby goats are kids. So you can have the kids go out to feed the kids. Which should lead to some fun humour.

  201. Mattir says

    Ogvorbis, please email me at mattir 17 at the gmail thingamabob. And are you at work today? Because we’re going to be driving through Scranton on our way home form Rhinebeck and were talking about stopping…

  202. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    Mattir:

    Done, but I am on a train ride out of the park today. Sorry.

  203. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Ogvorbis,
    I didn’t say it was easy. However, the fact that we can even feel shame at past actions is an indication that we have grown. Compassion does not mean ignoring the consequences of actions. It means that we realize that as humans we make mistakes, but that as humans we can also grow. It means placing yourself outside yourself and seeing through the eyes of another. That that other happens to be yourself just happens to make this one of those annoying recursive paradoxes that arise out of the idea of a self in the first place.

    Only an asshole blames a child. You aren’t an asshole.

  204. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    the fact that we can even feel shame at past actions is an indication that we have grown. Compassion does not mean ignoring the consequences of actions. It means that we realize that as humans we make mistakes, but that as humans we can also grow. It means placing yourself outside yourself and seeing through the eyes of another. That that other happens to be yourself just happens to make this one of those annoying recursive paradoxes that arise out of the idea of a self in the first place.

    Only an asshole blames a child. You aren’t an asshole.

  205. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    What the hell. That is not what I wrote and copy-pasta’d. Trying it again.

    the fact that we can even feel shame at past actions is an indication that we have grown.

    Unfortunately, I have a hard time with the idea that I can feel shame for something that is not my fault. I know that is nonsense, but that is still bouncing around my skull.

    Compassion does not mean ignoring the consequences of actions.

    I know this happened with I was a child but I also know that one of the (possible) consequences of my (non) action was that more children may have been hurt. And I get really mad at people who allow children to be abused. Which includes me.

    It means that we realize that as humans we make mistakes, but that as humans we can also grow. It means placing yourself outside yourself and seeing through the eyes of another. That that other happens to be yourself just happens to make this one of those annoying recursive paradoxes that arise out of the idea of a self in the first place.

    It really is hard. I agree totally with you but that voice is still there telling me that the only reason I can feel empathy towards others is that I don’t know the thoughts in their head. I don’t know their guilty little secrets. Or big ones. Anyone else could forgive what I did and what I allowed. Me forgiving me is meeting a lot of resistance from me.

    Only an asshole blames a child.

    Agreed. You aren’t an asshole.

    And I wish I could believe that.

  206. says

    Ogvorbis

    And I wish I could believe that.

    Sometimes you just have to trust the judgement of others because your own judgement is just screwed up on that issue.
    I have to do it all the time because I really forgot how to do it myself. I’m learning again.
    So, from time to time I have to stop and ask my husband “is that OK or would that be selfish?”
    He is, so to speak, my walker. I need to lean on him. Sometimes he needs to stop me and ask “what about you”, because I forgot to do it myself.

  207. Socio-gen, something something... says

    FossilFishy:
    That is a cute photo!

    Menyambal:

    Then there was a fire in my apartment, and my entire library was smoke damaged beyond recovery.

    Oh, that makes me so sad. I love books beyond what most people would consider normal, and nowadays, I can barely handle loaning mine. When we lost our house in 2009, I had to downsize my library because what little we were keeping was going into a storage unit. From ~2500 books to less than 200 keepers.

    It was a wrenching 3-week process because I kept trying to save them from the sale pile. The worst was dealing with the damaged and taped-together books I’d kept for years for sentimental reasons. I put them in a box and had my brother “take care of them” at his house because I couldn’t bear to put them in the trash myself or see someone else do it.

    Giliell:
    That, I suppose, is one good thing about baby showers — getting everything ahead of time when you’re less likely to be rude and more likely to have showered.

    Ogvorbis:
    I’m sorry I don’t have any advice or even words of comfort. Just *hugs* if you want them.

  208. says

    Wait, are there others of you that live in Alaska? Can we hang out?? (Actually, Alaska is a big place, and knowing my luck you all live like 500 miles from Fairbanks.)

    Menyambal:

    Then there was a fire in my apartment, and my entire library was smoke damaged beyond recovery. I tore the covers off everything, and recycled the paper, and cried.

    Oh no, that’s awful. I’m glad you were safe, but that must have been really terrible anyway. I would be so upset if I lost my library.

    Audley: I hope you feel better soon. I don’t know if I’ve said this yet, but congratulations on the near-arrival of DarkInfant. I hope that everything goes smoothly and that you are both happy and healthy.

    Giliell: Mmm, pumpkin cupcakes. That sounds absolutely amazing. I think I might have to take a break from the paper-writing today to do some baking.

  209. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    Mosquitoes and black flies? Surely you meant Finland and just accidentally typed Alaska instead?

    Hi Horde, long time no see.

    PS: It’s quite hard to type while kitteh is humping one’s right arm.

  210. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Ogvorbis: “I agree totally with you but that voice is still there telling me that the only reason I can feel empathy towards others is that I don’t know the thoughts in their head. I don’t know their guilty little secrets. Or big ones.”

    No. The reason you can feel empathy is because you DO know that they have shameful thoughts and secrets. You know they are human, just as you are.

    Perchance, have you ever read “The Fall,” by Albert Camus. There is a concept in the book of a “Judge penitent”. It’s Camus, so I wouldn’t recommend it when you are depressed. However, it might resonate

  211. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Welcome all newcomers :)

    katchen:
    Of course you’re welcome to come with.

    ****

    chigau @276:

    I think Caine will be quite happy to know she’s part of a group of rats.

    ****

    Minnie The Finn:
    I’ve had cats all my life and I’ve never had a kitty hump my arm. That’s a new one.

  212. broboxley OT says

    I remember being in berry camp about 15 miles from hooper bay and bared one of my arms and had spouse take a picture, you could not see any flesh thru the mosquitoes. This took about 10 seconds.

  213. dianne says

    When PZ takes over the world and makes me Minion of Public Health, complete destruction of all mosquitoes will be a top priority. Unless it turns out that mosquitoes are important for the environment or something unfortunate like that.

  214. Portia says

    Socio-gen

    And I asked how her husband handled her not wanting to have sex.

    Oh, my. You were at least ahead of me in that department. I didn’t quite know how babies were made at that age.

    FossilFishy @231

    Apparently Mrs. Fishy snapped a picture.

    Cuteness, what a fun memory to have :)

    Menyambal @258

    Then there was a fire in my apartment, and my entire library was smoke damaged beyond recovery. I tore the covers off everything, and recycled the paper, and cried.

    How tragic : (

    Ogvorbis

    I’m sorry you’re having more tough times. No advice or constructive feedback, just virtual cups of tea. : /

    -===-

    I got invited to a facebook group by a friend I had in college. It’s about Proverbs 31 (which I haven’t read since I read the whole damn book in my early teens), and sounds a lot like it’s a group for married Christian women to be more submissive. It grosses me out, but I can’t “decline” because the updates from the group are horrifyingly intriguing. For example:

    Wondering: who will commit to (silently, without expectations, no hope or desire for ANYthing in return) “doing good” to their husband today (and perhaps even throughout the entire 31 days)? Find some way to honor him, to make him smile, to ALLOW and ENCOURAGE him to be the man God created him to be.

    Every day, every time I read (and re-read) this chapter, you guys… the Holy Spirit convicts me MORE… and on NEW STUFF. (Sometimes… um… the same stuff… ‘cuz I can be kinda thick-skulled sometimes. But a lot of new stuff even though the words haven’t changed.) How’s everyone doing with serving/encouraging/uplifting/NOT expecting things in return with their hubsters?

    Gawdly women shouldn’t have needs! It’s all about yer hubsters, ladeez!

     
    bleck

  215. Portia says

    Audley-

    I hate that crap. HEY XIANS, I’M A DAMN PERSON. ARG.

    The local Catholic church has vom-worthy signs:

    “50 Shades of Grace”
    “Ipod, Iphone, Ipad…try Ipray.”
    “The Lord’s Chalice is not for Whiners.”

    …talk about WTF.

  216. carlie says

    J-ESUS FIRST
    O-THERS SECOND
    Y-OURSELF LAST

    WTF?

    Oh, that’s a big one. I remember my therapist asking me why I could never bring myself to take any time to do what I wanted to do, and I told him that little acronym I had been taught growing up, and he…didn’t quite know what to say for a minute or two.

    “hubsters”?? Ew. And I’m about 85% sure that “doing good” meant “sex”.

  217. Portia says

    “hubsters”?? Ew. And I’m about 85% sure that “doing good” meant “sex”.

    hahahaha I kind of thought the same thing based on the odd phrasing of doing it “to” the husband instead of “for” the husband or “with”. Gross. (Blowies for Jebus? That’s a new one.)

  218. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Portia:

    I went to public school. :) Although it was a small town and we were all pretty ignorant. Still… you picked up things.

    I got invited to a facebook group by a friend I had in college. It’s about Proverbs 31

    Oh no. Not Proverbs 31 women. *shudder* They take holier-than-thou femininity to a whole new level.

  219. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Portia:
    You’re a better person than I am.
    I’d decline that in a heartbeat.

  220. Portia says

    I went to public school. :)

    Ah, that would definitely help. I was literally given a pamphlet that said “I am Jane’s body” I picked up a little bit from a public-schooled cousin, but it was so little as to be laughable.

    They take holier-than-thou femininity to a whole new level.

    Shudder indeed. Which is why I’ve lost touch with so many of the friends I had when I was younger. So many great people lost to the superiority complex.

    You’re a better person than I am.

    I dunno, I mean I only leave the invite un-answered so I can point and laugh and groan :)

  221. Socio-gen, something something... says

    carlie:

    And I’m about 85% sure that “doing good” meant “sex”.

    I’m too familiar with this phrase. It usually means pampering your husband like he’s a small (and ill) child. Making his favorite dinner, letting him have “quiet time” after work (shuffling the kids off to their rooms), letting him control the remote, praising his every move, etc.

    Basically, you give and give and give and expect not so much as a thank you in return. Because you’re doing it for Jeebus, not praise or a modicum of appreciation.

    Although… yeah, that actually is the way sex works as well for these people.

    Portia:
    Sadly, no. Mouths and genitals touching?! Never. BJs are evil, even if they’re BJs for God.

  222. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    All:

    Thanks for the support. I was doing pretty good with this until this latest release pointing to the criminal culpability of the boy scouts. And now the same questions, the same should haves, would haves, could haves have resurfaced.

    I’m too familiar with this phrase. It usually means pampering your husband like he’s a small (and ill) child. Making his favorite dinner, letting him have “quiet time” after work (shuffling the kids off to their rooms), letting him control the remote, praising his every move, etc.

    That sounds so boring! Wife and I have a real relationship, not me and a slave.

    Sadly, no. Mouths and genitals touching?! Never. BJs are evil, even if they’re BJs for God.

    And I suppose cunnilingus is also not allowed? Damn. That sounds so boring!

  223. Portia says

    Socio-gen

    Sadly, no. Mouths and genitals touching?! Never. BJs are evil, even if they’re BJs for God.

    Fair point. No one in my religious upbringing ever told me what particular acts were disallowed within marriage because I wasn’t married so what business was it of mine, all I needed to know was that it was all ebil.

    Og

    Clearly you have not embraced your Gawd-given charter …to be a complete behbeh while also having total control.

  224. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    Clearly you have not embraced your Gawd-given charter …to be a complete behbeh while also having total control.

    Naw. I’d rather have the fun and love and intellectual stimulation of an adult relationship. Sorry.

  225. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Ogvorbis:
    Good heavens, no. Touching the source of all evil with your mouth?! That’s probably just one short step from thinking your wife as a human being. We can’t be having with that nonsense.

    One of the cautions given in my pre-marriage counseling was that sex shouldn’t be to be too enjoyable, lest you forget about God or become obsessed with seeking pleasure. Thus, foreplay should be limited to only what was necessary to make intercourse a “comfortable experience” for a wife.

  226. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    God is so insecure there that he worries that you might stop thinking of him while you are engaged in an activity that he has nothing to do with.

    Self centered schmuck. The very definition of high maintenance. Is this the meaning of all powerful? Or is this one of those mysteries that mere humans cannot even hope to understand?

  227. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    RELLY JESUS

    No idea what they were going for there.

    My mind added a question mark at the end. As in “Really? Jesus?”

    I don’t think that is what they were going for.

    So, Audley, do you feel almost like a little kid on Christmas morning? Or like a little kid waiting for your birthday party? Lots of anticipation? Lots of ‘Oh, goody, it’s finally here?’

    On another note, one of my coworkers is pregnant (she has one boy who is almost a year old, so not quite Irish twins). She is terrified that something will go wrong and she’ll have to have a c-section. Apparently, she thinks that the only way that a mother can possibly bond with a new baby is if it is a natural delivery with absolutely no pain management at all. Without the pain the mother will not value the baby or be able to love it as a mother should. I’ve never heard this before. Is this a new thing? An old thing? A religious thing? A totally bizarre thing? A what-the-fuck thing?

  228. birgerjohansson says

    George Mc Govern has died. Portent for DarkInfant?

    It is sad, I remembered when he lost against Nixon in 72 (I was a wee kid at the time). Swedish journalists found it hard to believe that some proven crook could get re-elected.

  229. Portia says

    My head went to “Really, Jesus?” As in, “Jesus, dude, again? WTF?” Which is sort of how I feel about Christians, were an imaginary being responsible for their behavior.

  230. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    I once found a sex manual in my older brother’s room. Unfortunately, it was a Christian sex manual, outlining what and how to do for nervous ignorant virgins on their wedding night. In a Christly way, of course.

    It said kissing was okay, anywhere ABOVE the waist. I was like, twelve, but I still recall trying to work out the implications, there.

    I’m sure it was the word of God, so there you have it, ladies. You can get your upper-body jollies, but you don’t have to do any of that icky stuff to your husband, and you surely don’t have to grimly endure him doing anything sick and twisted to you, not that he’d bother to try, the selfish bastard.

  231. mildlymagnificent says

    J-ESUS FIRST
    O-THERS SECOND
    Y-OURSELF LAST

    We had jaunty little Joy jingle we used to sing at kids’ club. I’ve only ever been able to remember the last bit of it.

    “Jesus first, Yourself last, Others in between.”

    the only way that a mother can possibly bond with a new baby is if it is a natural delivery with absolutely no pain management at all.

    Nothing new about it, I’m afraid. There are far too many women around carrying unnecessary guilt because they were ‘weak’ and ‘gave in’ by having pain relief or medical/surgical intervention to birth. There are even nurses and midwives who peddle this stuff. Birth is supposed to be a mystical, magical event. Wondrous womanly powers will overcome all obstacles. The fact that it’s the most dangerous thing most women will ever do is neither here nor there.

  232. Tethys says

    Is this a new thing? An old thing? A religious thing? A totally bizarre thing? A what-the-fuck thing?

    Old, religious, bizarre, WTF. Its a punishment from gawd known as genesis 3-16.

    16 To the woman he said,

    “I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;
    with painful labor you will give birth to children.
    Your desire will be for your husband,
    and he will rule over you.”

    The facebook women might have a point if twilight sleep birth was still being practiced with the mother sedated with ether. My MIL and my Grandmother both have zero recollection of giving birth to their infants. Modern anesthetics can block maternal pain without sedating either the baby or the mother.

  233. broboxley OT says

    if the good lord didnt want cunnilingus going on why did he give it such a great taste when it gets juicy?

  234. AshPlant says

    To tempt you into failing his tests, of course, broboxley! So he can punish you for fucking up! He’s got a lot of that going on, IIRC.

  235. Portia says

    Sometimes I wonder how these godbots make any babies at all, let alone whole baseball teams, when sex is so minimally pleasurable.

  236. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Portia:
    Because suffering through such a horrible, horrible thing — repeatedly — proves your love for baby Jesus?

  237. Portia says

    You might be on to something, Socio-gen. Especially for women, it would seem.

    ===
    A friend just asked me if he texts me to much (via text).
    I am refraining from responding “If you have to ask…”

  238. says

    Oggie:
    A kid on Xmas Eve is pretty much how I’d describe my mood right now– excited, anxious, and happy. I can’t sit still. On the plus side, my crampiness has subsided to some extent, so at least I’m more comfortable than I was yesterday.

    And, yeah. There’s a shit loaf* of birth woo out there and unfortunately, I know several women who have bought into it. When I finally announced that I was scheduled for a c-section, most of my friends/family/loved ones were supportive (it’s not what I originally wanted, but it’s the best and safest option now and they recognized that) except for a couple of friends who acted like 1) scheduled surgery is some sort of tragedy and 2) my docs are fuck ups ‘cos they can’t turn DarkFetus. I still can’t get a decent answer as to why doing the safest thing is so horrific– all they say is that it’s not ideal because it’s not natural. Jesus fuck, dying of a treatable infection is natural too, that doesn’t mean it’s the right fucking to do.

    *Was supposed to be ‘load’, but I like the tpyo.

  239. Owlmirror says

    [drive-by pedantry]

    So, Jiddisch “schmooze” seems to have taken a completely different turn than German “schmusen” which is snuggle.

    Possibly by way of “to cozy up to someone”?

    SIWOTI!

    As far as I know, the Yiddish word “schmooze” derives from the the Hebrew word shmu’ot (שמועות); “news” (more literally, “[things one has] heard”; a related term is shma (שמע); “hear! (imperative)”). In an Ashkenaz accent, the word would be pronounced shmu’os, which is how the “z” comes about.

  240. mildlymagnificent says

    Natural! Pffft.

    I spent the last few weeks of my last pregnancy in hospital – along with a whole ward of other women with various conditions. Every now and again one would go off to have her baby. Others had several visits to the high dependency unit when things got really rough, but doctors were trying to keep the pregnancy going for as long as possible to give them the best chance possible.

    So we were there long enough to know just about all the staff. I was dumbstruck when the head honcho boss-of-the-whole-hospital-lady-nurse turned up in our rec room on her rounds one day. There we were in varying degrees of pain, worry, distress and she starts blatting on about how it’s such a shame we had to be in hospital because birth is a natural process and it ‘shouldn’t be like this’.

    Well, if it wasn’t ‘like this’ there would have been a few dead women and many more dead babies.

  241. Sarahface, who is trying to break the lurking habit says

    I’ve been mostly following these threads recently, but not commenting, because who has time for that when there’s lectures/labs/societies/socials to go to? (Also, I’ve been at uni for 3 weeks now. When did that happen?!)

    Audley:
    Best wishes for you, DarkFetus/Infant and Mr. Darkheart :)

    Ogvorbis:
    *hugs* and nice thoughts.

    I grew up with my parents telling me that Jesus/Others/Yourself thingy. I was never quite sure exactly how one put Jesus first, so that probably failed, and then I learned (only recently, in fact) that it’s all very well to be selfless and noble and put others before yourself, but if you have no emotional/mental reserves, then you’re putting yourself in a worse position, and it can have bad results. Probably better to learn that sooner rather than later, though.

    Also, I tried out for the University Challenge team. We play other colleges first, before the final selection for the programme, and having seen the selection questions for this bit, I think I’ll be happy if I make the college team, let alone the team for the show.

  242. carlie says

    I still can’t get a decent answer as to why doing the safest thing is so horrific– all they say is that it’s not ideal because it’s not natural.

    And insulin isn’t natural, and wearing glasses isn’t natural, and living indoors isn’t natural, and cooking food isn’t natural…

    Audley – here is the song I’m singing for you this week.

  243. Menyambal --- Sambal's Little Helper says

    I’d never heard that J-O-Y thing before, thank Jesus. It reminds me of the Peanuts comic strip where one of the kids asks about the purpose of the other people. And reminds me also of the tragedy of the commons.

    It also reminds me of my thought that a lot of religious people don’t seem to realize that when Jesus talked about nice people, he wasn’t talking describing religious people, he was talking to them about not being such jerks.

    My wife got a C-section. Labor had gone on for too long, and her only concern was for the safety of the baby.

    As for “natural childbirth”, as I’ve said before, humans have not yet adapted to big-brained babies. As recently as a hundred years ago, childbirth was the greatest killer of women. Childbirth is THE evolutionary factor for us, like running is for cheetahs—we may be the brainy animals, but getting that brain into the world is not natural. Childbirth places a limit on how brainy were are, and how long childhood must last, and everything converges to make giving birth into THE hardest thing a woman can do.

    Take every help you can get, I say, and I take my hat off to you.

  244. says

    Oh my goodness. The mix of the Proverbs 31 ladies, the “sex shouldn’t be too pleasurable” advice, and the JOY bullshit makes me want to burn shit down. But of course religion has no relation what-so-ever to the white-supremisist capitalist patriarchy that we find ourselves living in. Obviously.

    Oh goodness, I just made the mistake of looking up Proverbs 31 sites. Where is the brain bleach??

    RE natural birth: I find that a lot of people romanticize “natural” birth as being better than anything that includes hospitals, pain medication, or surgery. I think this is utter malarkey, and strongly believe that whatever the mother decides is right for her situation is the best option. Fuck anyone who tries to make you feel guilty.

  245. Portia says

    Whew. I rode 4 miles on my bike out to my uncle’s farm and thank goodness got a ride home. (Er, because it was getting chilly, and the sun was going down). I realized how little I ride my bike but I’m still proud of myself for taking advantage of the gorgeous day. Plus I got to pay my 15 year old cousin the dollar I owed her for the eggs from her hen. It was such a beautiful late afternoon, with the sun hitting the hills and barns with golden hues. I’m not very poetic, but it did inspire some ideas for paintings. I’m very contented this evening. It was a good mental health antidote to the Proverbs 31 crap…
     

    Carlie: I ♥ Gob.

  246. Portia says

    blogofmyself:
    that’s how I felt after I went googling for “Christian Domestic Discipline” sites. Talk about stomach-turning.

  247. Nutmeg says

    Chigau:

    Long ago …
    Baby showers (and wedding showers) were alcohol-absent, women-only affairs that involved elaborate rituals for present-opening, tiny sandwiches and *shudder* party games.

    Wait, there are places where this isn’t still the case? Yay for sanity prevailing somewhere in the universe.

    Socio-gen:

    It was co-ed, multicultural, and turned into an hours-long event (was only scheduled for 3 hours) because no one wanted to break up the party.

    That sounds better!

    Audley:

    I survived! Stayed for about 45 minutes (dropped off the gift, ate some food, yadda yadda) and now I’m home

    Yay for survival, and yay for the impending arrival of DarkFetus!

    *hugs* for Ogvorbis

    Socio-gen

    One of the cautions given in my pre-marriage counseling was that sex shouldn’t be to be too enjoyable, lest you forget about God or become obsessed with seeking pleasure. Thus, foreplay should be limited to only what was necessary to make intercourse a “comfortable experience” for a wife.

    Wow. Just, wow. I spent a lot of time around fundies in my teens, and that still made my jaw drop. So basically, sex is supposed to be no worse than a Pap smear, but heaven forbid it be fun?

  248. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    The wife and I have been domestic as hell this weekend, resulting in a fridge/larder full of:

    1)apple cake
    2)sourdough bread*
    3)french bread dough waiting to be turned into pizza*
    4)cabbage pockets
    5)pumpkin lasagna

    Also on the menu this weekend–grape juice from our own grapevines, apples and pears from a nearby orchard. Fall reminds me of why I live in Maryland.

    *All breads made with freshly ground flour.

  249. Portia says

    One of my favorite things about fall when I was growing up was making grape juice in the cider press. It was a messy, delicious affair.

    But I’m terrible at bread-making. So far. : ) Enjoy your fall goodies.

  250. Patricia, OM says

    I have a cabbage in my fridge. What’s cabbage pockets?

    Just spent time over on You Tube watching the Texas Convention talks posted so far. No Dawkins yet.

  251. says

    Mondays. Bleagh. I thought I’d at least get on the motorbike today but it won’t start. Too long sitting in the shed, I guess – must get the battery onto the charger tonight. Bummer. On the happier side of things, it’s nice and sunny today. And I am making coconut ginger pulled pork for dinner tonight. It’s in the slow cooker right now.

  252. broboxley OT says

    #346 Alethea when leaving a battery sitting for any length of time disconnect the positive cable, as I had forgotten to do with my pickup the last time I drove it. Took all day to get a charge I was comfortable with.

  253. Socio-gen, something something... says

    blogofmyself:

    Oh goodness, I just made the mistake of looking up Proverbs 31 sites. Where is the brain bleach??

    Frightening, isn’t it. Rationalizing being powerless second-class citizens because “God says so” and claiming it’s wonderful.

    Nutmeg:

    So basically, sex is supposed to be no worse than a Pap smear, but heaven forbid it be fun?

    In a word: yes.

  254. Rawnaeris, FREEZE PEACHES says

    I’m taking tomorrow as a vacation day. I think I’m gonna go get a pedicure, and catch up on my knitting.

    There’s a pattern for a TARDIS shawl I want to start. Need to convert it into a cowl pattern first, as I don’t wear shawls.

  255. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Audley

    Yay on the imminent delivery! So exciting! =^_^=

    With five surviving children, plus having hand-held my daughter through her first delivery, I have decided that the only thing that should be natural about labour is… um… backrubs. That’s it! Backrubs should be a natural part of labour! Apart from that, anything that helps to keep mother and infant alive, in the best possible health and in the least possible pain is more than OK with me.

    In related news, I know so many women about-to-give-birth that I keep having dreams in which I’m having another baby. In one of them, the woman in the next bed had a baby gorilla. =Ô.ô=

    Portia,
    Bleck is right! It’s like the church sign I passed the other day:
    J-ESUS FIRST
    O-THERS SECOND
    Y-OURSELF LAST

    WTF?

    That was my primary school motto, embroidered on our school blazers. I was taught that ‘Jesus First’ meant that we should always think about whether Jesus would approve, before carrying out any actions asked of us by Others. Our own approval, of course, wasn’t required, expected or relevent. If we didn’t like what we were asked to do, but felt it was something that Jesus would like, we were to offer our suffering up to him. That mind-set, drummed into small children, stays with one for a lifetime. To this day, a small part of me feels that if I have to put myself first in any way at all, I’m being selfish and sinful.

  256. chigau (棒や石) says

    Audley #354
    Why lol?
    It’s not too late.
    You have, like, 60 hours to go.
    *ducks*

  257. Portia says

    Very well played, carlie. :D You’re my third least favorite Pharyngulite. (I can’t find a clip…my goggle skills are out of wack).

  258. says

    Chigau:
    So you’re saying I should opt for next day delivery? ;)

    Tigger:
    When it rains, it pours. I know an incredible number of pregnant ladies: my Asshole Sister, one of my close friends, one of the docs in my OB/GYN group gave birth two weeks ago, my SiL had her baby 3 months ago, and assorted other friends of friends/distant relations. Most of us are having girls, too!

  259. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Audley, I thought you were very much the better person at that baby shower. I don’t think I could have restrained myself from ‘casually mentioning’ to someone that “I just heard someone saying that, with all she’s had to put up with, it’s such a shame that Sister had to organise her own baby shower” and watch where the flames spread…

    I’m glad you aren’t as wicked as me!

  260. FossilFishy (Νεοπτόλεμος's spellchecker) says

    Interesting, someone mentions goats and suddenly Minnie the Finn appears. [waves] I haz correlation therefor, er, goats are parasitic pan-dimensional prophets come to rid the world of the tyranny of fences. I wonder who will appear if one mentions Goats on Fire?

  261. cicely says

    It turns out that Son is interested in setting up for silk screening.

    It is quite possible that Printer of Shirts can just go fuck its(corporate)self.

    Then there was a fire in my apartment, and my entire library was smoke damaged beyond recovery.

    :( :( :(

    I admit that I have quasi-religious feelings about books.

    Me, I wants an OED. And the house to keep it in.

    Me, too; and, me too, too.

    I halved the “yields 32″ recipe and still got 24…

    IME, recipes are notorious liars on the subject of “yield”.

    Which includes small mosquitos who are around in such incredible numbers that they can give a human sized target 900 bites per minute.

    Which suggests that they have some sophisticated air traffic control!

    Thanks, opposablethumbs. I still feel like poo today, so I had to cancel my visit with Esteleth and David M. :( :( :(

    :( :( :(

    *hugs* for Ogvorbis, and:

    Sometimes you just have to trust the judgement of others because your own judgement is just screwed up on that issue.

    Yes.

    It isn’t shameful that I need the help of the Quad-cane of Extreme—Nay, Excessive—Decorativeness because I can’t walk on my own.

    Let us be your Quad-cane of Self-Compassion.
    :)

    Minnie!
    *pouncehug*

    Basically, you give and give and give and expect not so much as a thank you in return. Because you’re doing it for Jeebus, not praise or a modicum of appreciation.

    Until, one day, your neighbors are bewildered that you would, 1) kill yourself, 2) kill your husband, 3) kill your kids, 4) all of the above. Because you always seemed so quiet, so happy, it was like the two of you were the perfect couple….

    I have a cabbage in my fridge.

    I’m sorry. Maybe, if you poke it with a broom handle, it’ll leave? You could try herding into a bucket of wet cement.
    -

  262. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Audley:
    I thought of you the other day when I was grocery shopping. As I walked through the fruits and veggies, I came across the coconuts and thought of that cake. I had a brief moment of giddiness thinking about upcoming birth of DarkFetus. Are you ready to start getting on the job practice to become one of the world’s greatest moms?
    (ah the tales to come of DarkInfant, DarkToddler, Dark-? (what are the stages between toddler and teen?), etc…)

    @312:

    I have such a love/hate relationship with church signs. My favorite to date was from a couple of months ago on the local Lutheran church:

    This reminds me of one of my favorite signs (not a church one though). There’s an auto repair place that had a sign that said “A great place to take a leak”. I laughed hard at that one.
    ****

    Lynna @219:

    Can you not do that whole neck cracking change of subjects, especially if you’re going to move from pleasantries to facepalms?

    ****

    broboxley @294:

    I remember being in berry camp about 15 miles from hooper bay and bared one of my arms and had spouse take a picture, you could not see any flesh thru the mosquitoes. This took about 10 seconds.

    If I get nightmares tonight thinking about that, can I blame you?

    ****

    RELLY JESUS

    …you were off the radar for a while. What were you *really* doing? Was it just a “phase” you were going through?

  263. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Portia:

    One of my favorite things about fall when I was growing up was making grape juice in the cider press. It was a messy, delicious affair.

    Ah grape juice; in my top 3 juices. Orange, then Apple, followed oh so closely by Grape. Not the flavored beverages. 100% juice. I really don’t like Cranberry and one of the great benefits to Grape Juice is that it changes Cranberry enough so I don’t taste it as much (Pomegranate Juice is similar). I’ve come to like Grape/Cran Juice a bit, Especially with a touch of sparkling water and some flavored vodka or rum (as a N/A drink, it’s good too).

  264. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    cicely:

    I have a cabbage in my fridge.

    I’m sorry. Maybe, if you poke it with a broom handle, it’ll leave? You could try herding into a bucket of wet cement.
    -

    Preach on sister!
    (sorry, it’s Sunday and God’s joy washed over me briefly)

    I wonder if there are other foods we both dislike.

  265. Patricia, OM says

    Now see here – cabbage hate is untoward, unladylike, and ungentlemanly.

    Thou shalt not hate the humble cabbage.

    My question about a recipe for cabbage pockets is seemly.

    So there.

  266. Patricia, OM says

    Thou shalt adore without question the maximums of the goddess Patricia without question, forever and ever APatricia!
    There it is, the 11th commandment.
    Brought to you by the fuckwits at the Heritage Bible Baptist church in my home town.

    My house and my car leafleted once again.

  267. says

    On a trip to a part of town where I seldom go, I saw a huge, three-story Buddhist temple that wasn’t there before, decorated with flags all around. It turned out to be a newly opened temple to “The Living Buddha.” Oh, no–another scam artist piggybacking on a centuries-old tradition to make a soft living.

  268. says

    Tony:
    I woke up ‘cos I’m hungry and here you are, talking about the coconut cake. This cereal just isn’t cutting it.

    Tigger:
    I seemed like the better person, but trust me, I knew how much my showing up would annoy Asshole Sister. I was invited because she assumed I wouldn’t attend so close to my delivery. It’s too bad– I was perfectly polite, but she hated the fact that for the short time I was there, everyone was focused on me. Whomp whomp.

  269. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Yummy cabbage! Among the things I miss about Ireland is the sheer variety (and size) of cabbages. And root vegetables. The stuff grown around here is so pathetically small and embarrassed-looking. I loooove stuffed cabbage leaves.

    Cranberry juice actually can grow on a person. After the first few months I no longer had to hold my nose, swallow as fast as possible and rinse my mouth out afterwards. Now, after a few years, it sometimes even tastes of strawberries.

    On a church sign in Canberra, seen from a bus (even if the bus had been full, there wouldn’t have been enough faces, or palms; I shall never, ever forgive Number 4 Son for pointing it out to me): a picture of the crucified JC with the words “I love you THIS much”.

    Cicely, your summary is terrifyingly accurate. I, trying so hard to be the Perfect Catholic Wife™, and inevitably failing, came this || close to bumping myself off in my twenties. Except that committing suicide was an even worse sin than failing to be the Perfect Catholic Wife™, so I didn’t. Eventually, under the influence of more sensible people, I dropped the ‘Perfect’. And then the ‘Catholic’. Now I’m a perfectly happy wife, instead.

    It isn’t shameful that I need the help of the Quad-cane of Extreme—Nay, Excessive—Decorativeness because I can’t walk on my own.

    Sounds awesome! Will you show me yours if I show you mine?

  270. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Audley, I love it! =^_^=

    So you won, while I expect everyone there (except A Sister) thought you were so thoughtful and kind for turning up in your condition.

    StevoR – thanks for the link! That was brilliant! =^_^=

  271. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Audley:
    It’s a good thing you didn’t like that cake, eh?

    BTW, do you drink? I’ve encountered plenty of pregnant women who say they look forward to being able to indulge in alcohol again.

  272. Tigger_the_Wing says

    I don’t drink, but I do remember that when I was in hospital having my older three (back in the early ‘Eighties) newly-delivered mothers were still being given the traditional bottles of stout. I suspect that the reason given (replenishing iron levels) was a myth; I expect that the real reason was to relax mother and baby and give the ward nurses less work (and the rest of us more sleep).

  273. says

    Good morning!
    Kids and cupcakes delivered in time to the kindergarten, now I’m making brownies for tomorrow.

    cicely
    I expect comercial recipes to lie. That’s why I still keep my brain turned on when dealing with them and have a lot of anotated versions. I usually expect recipes I get from other people to already be the anotated version.
    Not that there’s anything wrong with having 24 cupcakes instead of 16…

    +++

    Apparently, she thinks that the only way that a mother can possibly bond with a new baby is if it is a natural delivery with absolutely no pain management at all.

    During one of my pre-delivery check-ups at the hospital there was a nurse walking around in the delivery ward with a newborn in her arms shooshing and cooing. My midwife asked her what’s up, because that’s usually not something that happens.
    Well, the mum was in another room. Delivery, all natural, was so damn exhausting that after counting legs, arms, ears and eyes the mum just handed the baby to a nurse and fell asleep…
    So much dor bonding.
    It’s an old and a new thing, this all natural bullshit. When before it had the sole religious “they have to suffer” aspect, now it has the “hippie back to nature mother earth” aspect. But of course it wouldn’t take much hold without the deeply ingrained “women are incubators who have to sacrifice everything for their children” mindset. Not that there’s any indication that C-sections or pain-management were bad for the babies, but that has never stopped them.

    +++
    Talking about pain and childbirth, at this very moment 3 years ago I a pushing-pushing-pushing-shit-it-still-hurts. But only for 20 more minutes :)

    +++
    Damn, it really seems like #1’s best friend’s dad died.
    I don’t really know the family well, so I didn’t know. #1 made a remark some days ago and then this morning I noticed that her mum was wearing all black.
    Which also explains why #1 was thinking about little gifts for her friend all the time.

  274. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Damn, it really seems like #1′s best friend’s dad died.

    Oh, damn, Giliell, that’s so sad. Poor kid. Poor family. I hope your #1 is coping OK. It’s hard to explain that stuff to kids. A friend of my daughter’s lost her mother when she was only eight and my daughter was seven. That was hard for both of them. We more-or -less informally fostered the friend for years afterwards; after-school care, having her stay over at weekends, taking her on holidays etc. She once told me that she regarded me as an ‘extra mother’, which made my heart ache.

    rot13 labour stories (no peeking, Audley!)
    Zl ybatrfg ynobhe jnf jvgu gur gjvaf, naq bayl orpnhfr Ahzore 4 Fba, nf fbba nf Ahzore 3 jnf qryvirerq, jrag “Lvccrr! Ybnqfnebbz!” naq ghearq fvqrjnlf. Vg gbbx 18 shegure zvahgrf gb ghea uvz naq qryvire uvz (srrg svefg). Gbgny gvzr, 4½ ubhef.

    Dhvpxrfg jnf zl qnhtugre, 115 zvahgrf. Gur bgure oblf jrer 3½ ubhef rnpu. Ahzore 2 Fba jnf srrg svefg, gbb.

    Zl cbbe qnhtugre jnf va ynobhe sbe 2½ qnlf jvgu ure svefg. Ure frpbaq jnf fb dhvpx fur jnf ubzr gur fnzr qnl.

  275. blf says

    Five days ’til DarkFetus!

    Huh? Isn’t that when the skies cloud over, it rains and thunders for weeks on end, great rifts open in the Earth, the dolphins and mice leave, the seas boil, there’s a run on flaming swords, wizards finally figure out what the knob on the end is for, and the Moon finally hatches?

    Well, it clouded over and rained and thundered most of yesterday and last night…

    (Couldn’t tell if the Moon hatched or not… Too cloudy!)

     ───────────────────────────────

    Over the last week or so, my view of Pharyngula periodically loses all formatting and graphics, giving me a page with no variation in type font, missing all graphics, and generally a visually boring and awful thing. And then it periodically comes back to the real page.

    Put the pint down slowly, pay yer bar bill, go home (walk or take a taxi, don’t drive), and sleep it off.

     ───────────────────────────────

    blf, on the other hand….

    (Wakes up.) Wh? Ehh? Someone call… Waddit do I no—sips some coffeGARRH! cold coffee from last night — Right, er, what did I do now…?
    Or are you confusing me with penguin, mild deranged, the?

    She’s a girl. With cooties. I have a beard. With crumbs.

     ───────────────────────────────

    Thou shalt not hate the humble cabbage.

    Humble cabbage isn’t the problem. It’s the aggressive weirdos that throw the corned beef out of the pot, jump off the stove onto the dog, and joust — using your best chopsticks — with the mice that are the problem.

  276. DLC says

    mmm.. stuffed cabbage. . . my mother’s aunt had a great recipe for a stuffed cabbage casserole. dammit now you’re making me hungry!

  277. says

    Tigger
    I’m feeling pretty bad right now.
    Here I was, worrying all the time that this friendship was taking an unhealthy turn with #1 constantly thinking about how to please her friend and what little gifts to make her (it must have happened already some time ago, #1 mentioned it the week before last, but I hadn’t seen the family since. Dunno if he was in hospital before). I didn’t want her to experience friendship as something you have to buy. And all the time #1 was trying to cheer her friend up in her little helpless ways (not that adults have discovered much better ways).
    All you atheist assholes out there, I think my daughter just shamed you.

  278. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Oh, Giliell, don’t feel bad. Now that you do know the whole sad story, you have an opportunity to make amends.

    If it were me, I’d sit down with daughter and explain that I didn’t understand what was happening and jumped to the wrong conclusion. That sometimes we misunderstand one another and get things wrong. You could tell her you are very, very sorry you misunderstood her concern for her friend (I’m sure she’ll accept that. It’s a common enough experience, after all).

    Honesty, in my experience, is always appreciated. If kids see their parents owning up to and apologising for mistakes, it makes it easier for them to do the same.

    All you atheist assholes out there, I think my daughter just shamed you.

    I agree; your daughter is awesome.

  279. Minnie The Finn, qui devient bientôt vierge says

    I have no idea what cabbage pockets are, but Finnish cabbage rolls are something everyone should learn to make. So:

    Cut the stem off the cabbage (that nasty hard bit at the bottom that you don’t want to eat). Separate outer leaves carefully so they don’t tear*. Steam them soft in a pot with a small mount of water and a pinch of salt. Lift them out and set them aside to cool, careful to keep them intact.

    *Eventually, the cabbage is left with small leaves only, so boil the whole thing soft as it is, and chop them to add to the stuffing.

    The stuffing:
    chop and glace an onion in a bit of butter. Mix the onion, the chopped cabbage, a pound of ground beef, two eggs, a cup of cream, two cups of boiled rice (the stickier the better), salt to taste, white pepper, and some marjoram.

    Spread a cabbage leaf out, put a big dollop of the stuffing on it and roll it, folding the sides in, into a nice log type shape. Repeat with all cabbage leaves. Place the rolls into an oven dish and pour half a cup of dark treacle on them (more, if you like sweetness). Add a few dabs of butter, if you’re not afraid of calories.

    Bake them in an oven at medium heat until they start getting a nice brown color. Set the oven at a lower temperature and let them simmer for an hour and a half. Baste occasionally.

    The juice can be used as a base for a cream sauce for the rolls. If you have any lingonberries, crush them in a bowl with a bit of sugar and use as garnish.

    Bon appetit.

  280. blf says

    I have no idea what cabbage pockets are…

    Like a scalp bag but for the heads of the mice that lose.
    The winning mice are far more civilized and just eat a losing cabbage. Although they get a bit agitated if it had any mice heads in its pocket.

    (The mildly deranged penguin points out there must be mountains of mice skulls someplace… Perhaps near the Spear & Squeak, which I believe is the traditional jousting cabbage drinking den.)

  281. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Wow, blf. I knew that the cabbages were huge at home – but when we were clearing the site for our house, we found a well full of what we assumed to be bovine skulls. I suppose they must have been defeated mice of an appropriate size… =Ô.ô=

  282. blf says

    No, the Daily Fail isn’t a Murdoch paper. It is rather right-wing, wingnuttery even, and in the dim long-ago past (pre-WWII) was openly pro-facist. I don’t think it gives the BNP much time, but as I vaguely recall, it’s somewhat sympathetic to the UKIP(the nutters with Christopher Monckton as their shadow “Science Minister”).

  283. katchen says

    Oh – favourite signs! I love the picture of The Zombie Plumbers van that was floating around the web a few weeks ago: “draaaaains… we fix draaains”

  284. Nick Gotts (formerly KG) says

    Cranberry juice actually can grow on a person. – Tigger_the_Wing

    …so be careful you don’t spill any on yourself!

  285. blf says

    I have no idea who she is (Hey! — I’m in France and avoid horses, peas, and the plague), but apparently one of the BBC’s horse racing commentators is Clare Balding. And, apparently, the BBC won’t be televising much horse racing in the future. In The Grauniad‘s article on the end of a c.60 year history was this wonderful bit of snark:

    Incidentally, those of you concerned that the BBC’s surrender of horse racing will mean an end to the current omnipresence of Clare Balding need not worry. She is to be Channel 4’s main racing presenter, as well as being available on various other TV shows, on radio, in newspapers, in magazines, in book form and, I believe, as a takeaway Chinese meal. Indeed, I am told if Clare fails to appear on any media outlet over a 24-hour period, Social Services are instructed to check on her welfare.

    I was snickering so much in the restaurant over lunch the waiter came over and asked if I was Ok…

    (It occurs to me Horses, Peas, and the Plague could be a band’s name…)

  286. Matt Penfold says

    As a Chinese dinner with cabbage?

    As in every kind of awesome. She is not afraid to call homophobes and misogynists bigots, and she sees no reason to be especially polite when ripping them to shreds.

  287. blf says

    As in every kind of awesome.

    Ah, Ok. Thanks for the tip! (Seems kindof appropriate for someone who is a horse racing commentator, amongst other things…) I am totally unfamiliar with the lady.

  288. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Ugh. Mondays. They suck anyway, but especially so when my last class doesn’t end until 7pm, I’ve only gotten 4 hours sleep, and breakfast is only toast and tea because I dropped the egg carton and smashed every last one.

    Giliell:

    So much dor bonding.

    I got notations in my chart twice for failure to bond with Sons 1 and 2 because I don’t react well to general (#1) or spinal (#2) anesthesia and showed nothing more than polite interest for the first few hours because my brain felt like warmed-over pudding.

    We bonded just fine once the anesthetics cleared my system.

    Honesty, in my experience, is always appreciated. If kids see their parents owning up to and apologising for mistakes, it makes it easier for them to do the same.

    Agreed.

    And Giliell, your daughter has a lovely heart.

    Cranberry juice
    Strangely, I like cranberry juice. I’m sure it’s like cilantro in that my taste buds are just odd.

    Cabbage
    The only way I can stand cabbage is if it’s been boiled half-mushy with potatoes, carrots, onions, and corned beef. And that only once a year because “tradition!” (5 of 8 great-grandparents were Irish immigrants, so even my Presbyterian fundie family celebrated St. Patrick’s.)

  289. dianne says

    Re bonding and childbirth method: FWIW, I had an epidural and a c-section and thought my critter was the cutest thing ever the moment I saw her. I also had very little pain after the c-section. The biggest problem I had was that I had a PCA pump afterwards and couldn’t resist the urge to play with it to see if I could feel the difference between a real bolus and a lock out and so forth. The nurse was concerned when she saw how often I was pushing the button and asked me if I was having pain. I said, “No, I’m just playing with the machine” or something like that. I was on oral meds within the hour so I suppose that was the wrong answer. Can’t say I noticed any difference in pain scale, though. So…don’t believe the horror stories about c-section recovery. It’s not a universal experience by any means.

  290. blf says

    The only way I can stand cabbage is if it’s been boiled half-mushy…

    Try nailing it to the counter. That makes ‘em stand, albeit difficult to cook. The mildly deranged penguin suggests using a blowtorch, which I’ve never actually tried. Indeed, I usually don’t bother nailing ‘em down. Instead, I just put a brick on the pot’s lid to keep them from leaping out. And the brick is handy if they get all feisty and refuse to go into the pot in the first place.

    Just don’t confuse the reddish brick with the reddish corned beef… Try painting “Eat Me!” on the beef. Failing that, the way to tell them apart is to poke with a sharp fork. If there’s considerable resistance, it’s a brick. If it enters easily, it’s corned beef. If it goes “Mooooo!” it’s fresh. If it goes “Oiiiiink!” or “Quaaaack!”, you need to talk to your butcher…

  291. carlie says

    I’m the opposite – cooked is the main way I can’t really stand cabbage. Fresh is good, pickled is good, but please, not cooked!

  292. Esteleth, Elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo says

    Morning!

    Just as I was setting out to return home from Rhinebeck, the landlord called. My hot water heater has been replaced, so there is hot water. But he was very apologetic when he explained that the new stove has not yet arrived. He did bring by a plug-in kettle and a hot plate, so I can make do. Still. *flail*

    Also, my bank decided to be stupid and act like my account was overdrawn when I still had $400 in it. Right now, the website says: “Current balance: $412.52. Available balance: $0.00.” What. I do not approve of this. Hopefully it will figure itself out. If not, and the bank does not rescind that fine for “overcharging” my account, I’m going to complain, because that is absurd.

    Last night, my neighbor did a shitty parking job in the lot of the building, so I (assuming they had parked properly) backed right into them. Negligible damage to their car. My car has a badly dented panel and scratches all up and down that side. *flail*

    In cheerful news, there is an Austrian snoozing on my sofa.

  293. Socio-gen, something something... says

    dianne:
    Epidurals are the awesome! I had one with DaughterPerson and was up and walking (well, shuffling) within an hour and never experienced any of the brain fog of the first two c-sections. It seemed like the pain was less intense as well, but that could be the result of everything that day going so smoothly that I was just more relaxed.

    My experience with the first two definitely cannot be generalized to the population; I just react badly to certain types of anesthesia.

    blf:

    If there’s considerable resistance, it’s a brick. If it enters easily, it’s corned beef.

    You’ve never had my mother’s corned beef, have you? Trust me, very little difference between a brick and corned beef when she’s done with it.

    Esteleth:
    Ugh! and what?! and ugh! But yay! for cheerful news!

    My bank pulled that trick on me a couple times before I switched to a credit union. Since they were a big name bailout bank, my conspiracy theory was that they needed to balance the books by hanging onto my (and others’) money until the auditors were gone.

  294. Esteleth, Elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo says

    Socio-gen, I am at a credit union, and they’re generally very good. I’m just baffled by this.

    (Also irritated, because I’d like to use my money)

  295. opposablethumbs says

    {{{hugs}}} to your daughter, Giliell. She clearly lives in a family that is enabling her to grow into a lovely person.

  296. blf says

    [V]ery little difference between a brick and corned beef when she’s done with it.

    That’s a crime, that is… I hope the remains of the corned beef were decently buried.

    If you’d said corned venison — which I’ve only ever seen(and had) in Ireland — I’d go all mildly deranged penguin. Mistreating corned venison like that is worse that a crime. (And a bloody expensive waste of money.)

  297. Portia says

    Tony

    Ah grape juice; in my top 3 juices..

    In reality, what we made was grape cider. I think you would like that, too, if you haven’t had it. It has a vibrant flavor that is unmatched among juices.

    Tigger

    a picture of the crucified JC with the words “I love you THIS much”.

    Just…wow.

    Giliell

    That makes my heart ache for your #1. She is wonderfully compassionate, and her friend is lucky to have her.

    Esteleth

    I’m going to complain, because that is absurd.

    Complain loudly and persistently! That’s crap.

    -======-
    A cousin’s girlfriend who has a superiority complex related to her raw vegan diet posted a facebook screed in response to this. I’m unclear as to whether it’s original but it clearly reflects her feelings about fat acceptance. I’ve never heard such stuff from someone so decidedly counterculture.

    ‎”I just got sent this article.

    Do I hate overweight people? Of course not! Geez. I have overweight friends I love, and I was once overweight myself. What I don’t like is seeing obese/obviously overweight bodies being promoted as acceptable and normal. I’m sure this young lady is lovely that is not the issue, the problem is this fat-acceptance approach is killing people, the animals and the Planet and saying ‘It’s ok’. It encourages apathy in an already apathetic society, it sends the message –> ‘It’s ok to be overweight and unhealthy, not only is it ok, but it’s beautiful and should be celebrated…’ Please understand I am all for people feeling good about themselves that’s why I promote the lifestyle I do but if I felt comfortable when I was unhealthy I would have never changed.

    Not being happy, not accepting our disempowering situation can be a GOOD thing because it helps motivate us to change, to improve our life. That’s what I did, I stopped lying to myself, got uncomfortable with how I was living life and made the choice to step up.”

    She once insinuated that Littlest is short for his age because he doesn’t eat enough vegetables.
    *harrumph*

  298. Esteleth, Elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo says

    Called the CU. Rhinebeck hotel slapped a $600 hold on my card. Said that the only way to fix it now is to dispute the charge, which I rather cannot do because I was at the hotel and I did give them my card.

    CU says that when the hold is released (prob. tomorrow) they’ll not only erase the overdraft, they’ll say that it never happened, which means that the fees will be refunded automatically. Which is nice.

    CU also gave me step-by-step instructions on how to complain to the hotel. Also nice.

  299. says

    Todd “legitimate rape” Akin compared his opponent, Claire McCaskill to a dog:

    At a fundraiser on Saturday night, Akin decided he should compare Claire McCaskill to a dog. “She goes to Washington, D.C., and it’s a little bit like one of those dogs, you know ‘fetch,'” Akin said. “She goes to Washington, D.C., and get all of these taxes and red tape and bureaucracy and executive orders and agencies and she brings all of this stuff and dumps it on us in Missouri.”

    This the same Todd Akin that insulted McCaskill by saying she was not “ladylike.”

    video here: http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/10/22/14616391-akin-just-cant-help-himself

  300. carlie says

    Esteleth – DEFINITELY complain to the hotel. If it was the same one as last year, they screwed up royally then too. Even though we all gave them our own cards, they kept charging it to Onion Girl’s account since the reservation had originally been in her name; we only noticed when the credit card numbers on the receipts didn’t match up to our actual numbers on the cards we had handed them to pay with. IIRC, it took three runs through the payment system to get it corrected.

  301. says

    Uff, back from college, off to the kitchen
    Currently I’m frying 5lbs of minced meat for a ton of sauce Bolognese for tomorrow.

    I’ll talk to #1 later and I’ll tell the woman I’m sorry for her loss and that her daughter’s always welcome at our place when I see her next. Nothing else I can do.

  302. Richard Austin says

    It was a weekend.

    Found out a credit card was being used by someone in Ohio to buy a plane ticket to Brazil. Yay for fraud detection units (even if they do bug me to verify things when I’m traveling), boo for the hassle of having to have an account closed and a new one re-opened. I think a restaurant I go to may be getting their slips lifted, since it’s the only place I use this card ever.

    Had a friend who decided (in two different parts of a long conversation) that 1) he needed to write a t.v. show to showcase women in science and history who had been overlooked/buried/suppressed/forgotten (which is a “yay!”) and 2) that people with mental illness – all mental illness – should be prevented from buying guns because they were “inherently more violent” (I’ve sent him lit on this as well as slapped him over the head for the discrimination aspect; his reply: “I think life is always more important than rights”, which is so broad as to be useless).

    Now I get to rehearse for a presentation tomorrow in front of some major donors. Oh, and I did my self-evaluation for our review process this morning, so I’m in a wonderful mood.

    And that’s the weekend report. Off to a meeting…

  303. Matt Penfold says

    Found out a credit card was being used by someone in Ohio to buy a plane ticket to Brazil

    Using stolen credit card details to book a flight seems rather a stupid thing to do. If the fraud is detected after the transaction has been approved, all the police would have to do is wait for the person to turn up to catch their flight!

  304. Janine: Hallucinating Liar says

    Remember, according to some accommodationists, we have to respect these people.

    This is from a panel discussion of the Maryland Marriage Alliance. They are affiliated with NOM. We are all worthy of death We who are queer. Those of you who think that we should not be oppressed. Wor-thy-of-death!

    Skip ahead to about the 36:30 mark, just to get a taste of what this man is saying before he makes his pronouncement. Have to laugh at this man’s willful ignorance about his “holy word”. His book is full of god sanctioned polygamy.

    If only we were nicer to these people, they would not be calling for our deaths.

  305. Portia says

    Glad the CU is so accommodating, Esteleth.

    .

    Anyone have advice on dealing with someone close to you that shows signs of untreated depression and anxiety?

  306. dianne says

    Excellent, Audley! Don’t mind me in the background biting my nails over when the labor is likely to start now that there’s no longer a c-section planned…

  307. says

    dianne:
    Hopefully not too much longer.
    Icky medical information ahoy!
    I have started to dilate, so my doc told me and Mr Darkheart that it might be possible to induce labor through seksy tiems– he made sure to spell that out for us after explaining that I have no (additional) physical restrictions. (My doc is awesome. He understood that I was feeling conflicted– I very much want a vaginal birth, but on the other hand, I liked the idea of having a set end date.)

  308. ImaginesABeach says

    Audley – what are you doing here in the Lounge? Get thee to the “induction room” with Mr. Darkheart.

  309. dianne says

    Dilation’s good. Dilation that’s already occurred before labor starts is dilation that doesn’t have to occur during labor. Also good sign for darkfetus being in the right place and head tucked.

  310. says

    YAY Audley!

    Dilation that’s already occurred before labor starts is dilation that doesn’t have to occur during labor.

    True dat! I had a lot of “false” labor with my daughter and it was easy to get frustrated when I wanted things to get hopping, but mostly I kept in mind that labor I was having while I slept, did laundry, went grocery shopping and watched TV was labor I did NOT have to do IN LABOR!

  311. says

    And on that note, LOL: I’m shopping for a permanent form of birth control and would appreciate any informed feedback. Tubal? Essure? I’ve had an IUD for the last 5 years, and it works well for me, but I am really really sure I’m done.

    Cost is not an issue because I qualify for my state’s subsidized birth control plan. The availability of certain methods may be an issue. (I’m not sure I’ll be able to find a place that does Essure and takes the subsidized plan, for instance.)

    Misterc already has the V, actually, but I like to be double sure, especially with the way abortion rights seem to be going down the goddamn toilet.

  312. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Audley:

    Guess who is no longer breech? :D

    *confetti* *ticker tape*

    I have started to dilate

    *fireworks and sparklers*

    Congratulations DarkFetus on successfully preparing for deboarding! Next step: using your seat cushion as a flotation device….er, ummm…no. Sorry, that’s the airplane emergency checklist.

    Carry on.

  313. says

    Thanks, everyone!

    Socio-gen:

    Congratulations DarkFetus on successfully preparing for deboarding!

    Wasn’t I just saying the other day that DF is going to be a genius because she reacts to Daft Punk…

    … Wait a minute! Daft Punk totally flipped DarkFetus! O.o

  314. ImaginesABeach says

    TRIGGER WARNING – Boy Scouts

    I got an e-mail from the Boy Scouts today (BoyChild is a scout):

    With the public release this week of the Boy Scouts of America’s ineligible volunteer files and the extensive media coverage, it’s a good time to remind ourselves and others that Scouting continues to be among the safest places in our community for kids.

    Translation: we have a PR nightmare here.

    BSA’s contemporary youth protection program, strengthened over many decades, is focused on preventing, detecting and deterring abusive behavior. As we review these files from up to 50 years ago, there are reminders of how community expectations have changed from the days when the community participated in keeping some abusive behavior private. Today, we all want abuses to be immediately reported.

    Translation: we are pretending that abuse only happened in the past.

    The key ingredients of our Youth Protection Plan include:

    1. Rigorous screening of prospective volunteers, including a criminal background check and approval by each unit’s chartering organization – such as a church, school, veterans’ organization or police department. This ensures community input into the leader selection process.

    Because certainly a church would never protect an abuser.

    ….

    4. Mandatory barriers to prevent abuse. “Two deep” leadership is required at all times – meaning at least two leaders must be present at all activities with youth members, during or outside of Scouting activities for any Scout volunteer. Separate sleeping, changing and showering facilities for youth and leaders are required. Youth members, for example, are prohibited from sleeping in the same tent as a leader (except his or her parent.)

    This is important – but they should also be be telling parents, volunteers and scouts that anyone who does not insist on following this requirement should be suspect.

    5. Any violation of Scouting’s safety rules by a leader triggers an aggressive, three-part response:
    • Notification of law enforcement authorities
    • Immediate removal of the leader
    • Ongoing communication with families and other affected parties to enforce policies and accountability as well as provide support.

    Do you think this is happening?

    We have all become aware in recent years that there are potential predators almost everywhere in our society: in churches and schools and homes, and in a whole array of youth-serving organizations. Through our comprehensive youth protection program, Scouting minimizes the risk of abuse. Many other youth-serving organizations do as well.

    We can show that Scouting is a crucial deterrent for child abuse in our communities.

    Please know that your children’s safety is always our first concern.

    I hate to by cynical, but it seems to me that if the safety of children was their first concern, they wouldn’t be fighting the release of the perversion files.

  315. ImaginesABeach says

    And that was clearly an error – I actually love to by cynical, but I hate to be cynical.

  316. opposablethumbs says

    Hooray for the newly austral orientation of DarkFetus! (well as long as Audley is in the northern hemisphere I reckon I’ve got wriggle room on calling it austral, right?). And may I just say that you totally rock over in the Bad argument thread, Audley. I love it.

  317. chigau (棒や石) says

    Audley
    YAAAAY!!!!*Kermit arms*
    ——
    DarkFetus
    You’re not doing this thing tonight are you?

  318. otrame says

    Dear Dark Fetus: You are awaited with open and loving arms. Congratulations. Try not to be too much of a pain in the ass to those loving arms, m’kay?

    (Seriously, Audley, treasure every second while they are little…. they change so fast.)

    And on a completely different note, my son, my nephew and I are going to go vote for Obama tomorrow. I love early voting.

  319. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    You know, Audley, a nice Thanksgiving birth for DF would be great, no?

  320. Richard Austin says

    (to the tune of Speed Racer)
    Here xe comes,
    Here comes Dark Fetus
    Xe’s a demon-in-womb…

  321. chigau (棒や石) says

    I hafta be away from the internets for about 5 hours.
    So don’t let anything happen until then, ’cause I haz personhood, too and my needs …
    *cough*
    sorry
    I think I caught something from the Bad argument#3 thread.

  322. opposablethumbs says

    The regional court trying the Italian seismologists for failing to adequately warn of the 2009 L’Aquila earthquake found them guilty of manslaughter a few hours ago on the grounds that they had “downplayed” the level of risk.

    Manslaughter, ffs!!!!!

    At least it goes straight to appeal.

  323. otrame says

    Another month?? Are you high, man??

    *looks sheepish

    My eldest was born on March 10. He was due Feb 24.

    THese days they would never let him go so far past his due date, but at the time I became convinced that I had always been heavily pregnant and always would be.

  324. StevoR says

    @Lounge 373 (previous?) – 136. Markita Lynda—damn misogyny!
    16 October 2012 at 2:14 am :

    .. I dropped in to bring you a poll, which has had only about 30 responses so far: Where should librarians file the books on Creationism?

    ***
    Latest figures :

    If you were a librarian, what Dewey Decimal Classification would you assign to creationism books?
    200 – Religion (64%, 32 Votes)
    813 – Fiction (36%, 18 Votes)
    500 – Science (0%, 0 Votes)
    Unsure (0%, 0 Votes)
    Total Voters: 50

    ***

    Couldn’t vote there so guess those figures are final and the poll is closed now.

  325. carlie says

    Hooray, Audley! Are they still taking you in as scheduled if you don’t go into labor before then?

  326. StevoR says

    @416.Janine: Hallucinating Liar

    I do not think the gays will really be on fire for Todd Akin.

    If you’re going to vote on the gay issue, you probably shouldn’t vote for me.

    What would GOProud and the Log Cabin Republicans says?

    At least he’s honest?

    I mean nobody should vote for Todd Akin at all anyhow (or his political party which shares his views) but he’s actually said “don’t vote for me” which is perhaps the one admirable thing he’s said in his life!

  327. StevoR says

    @Audley Z. Darkheart :

    Best wishes, hope all goes smoothly, safely, quickly and well for you and Dark Fetus.

  328. ImaginesABeach says

    Audley – “they” say you should have started reading to DarkFetus already. I recommend reading to DarkInfant right away. First, it gives you something to do during those long months when she doesn’t do much more than lay there. Second, she learns the sound of your voice when she is being held. Third, if they see you read all the time, reading will seem like the thing to do. I don’t know if there is scientific verification for any of these things, but seriously, what harm comes from reading to them? For the first 6 months or so, my reading to GirlChild consisted of reading out loud whatever I was reading at the time. My reading to BoyChild was whatever I was reading to GirlChild.

  329. Portia says

    Litigated my first trial today.

    Good news: I My client won!!!

    Bad news: I never knew you have to ask for an award of attorney’s fees before you rest your case.

    It was a day for learning! : (

  330. StevoR says

    @411. Richard Austin :

    Had a friend who decided (in two different parts of a long conversation) that 1) he needed to write a t.v. show to showcase women in science ..

    Dunno if xe wants suggestions but I hope xe includes the story of :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorothea_Klumpke

    Some highlights :

    – Despite being a woman, and in the face of fierce competition from 50 men, she secured the post of Director of the Bureau of Measurements at the Paris Observatory.

    – In 1899, astronomers had predicted a great meteor shower now known as the Leonids. The French chose a female astronomer – Dorothea Klumpke – to be the one to ride in a balloon to observe the shower..

    – In 1896 she sailed to Norway on the Norwegian vessel Norse King, to observe the solar eclipse of August 9, 1896 ..

    Remarkable person who is rarely discussed in astronomy history tomes.

    Plenty of other great people and stories in the field of astronomy alone of course.

  331. Portia says

    I nominate Professor Dawn Clark Netsch.

    (Wikipedia fails to mention that she is the first woman to have held state-wide office in Illinois. She also graduated as the only woman in her class from Northwestern Law School in 1952 –top of the class).

  332. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    … Guess who is no longer breech? :D

    Alfred E. Neumann? Wilbur Wright> Ottmar Morganthaler? Darkfetus?

    Darkfetus?

    Yayyyyy! [Kermie hands]

    it’s a good time to remind ourselves and others that Scouting continues to be among the safest places in our community for kids.

    Compared to what?

    Please know that your children’s safety is always our first concern.

    No, the safety of the BSA is the first concern.

    No trigger for me. Yet. Damn, this shit is tiring.

    Latest figures :

    If you were a librarian, what Dewey Decimal Classification would you assign to creationism books?
    200 – Religion (64%, 32 Votes)
    813 – Fiction (36%, 18 Votes)
    500 – Science (0%, 0 Votes)
    Unsure (0%, 0 Votes)
    Total Voters: 50

    And yet, at both of my public libraries, they are in the science section. And outnumber the actual science books that deal with evolution. And climate change denialism is in the climate science section. And outnumber the actual science books that deal with AGW.

  333. StevoR says

    @411. Richard Austin :

    More suggestions for your friend please :

    The story of Pickerings (human) computers :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvard_Computers

    Plus :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jocelyn_Bell_Burnell

    Who I’ve actually had the priviledge to see in the flesh – attended a public lecture she gave.

    Plus :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maria_Mitchell

    one of the pioneers and who protested against slavery and was friends with some suffragettes too.

  334. dianne says

    at the time I became convinced that I had always been heavily pregnant and always would be.

    Wild. When I was pregnant, I was convinced that I’d always been and always would be nauseous from morning sickness and any “memory” I had of being otherwise was an illusion.

  335. StevoR says

    @David Marjanović – #138 on previous Lounge #373 -16 October 2012 at 2:20 am :

    And yet you {Improbable Joe – ed.} still haven’t posted in the Thunderdome.

    Some people never post in Thunderdome – I know because I’m one of them. Perhaps Improbable Joe is too.

    I think there’s more than enough nastiness and bullying online and even here for everyone without needing a dedicated no rules thread where it can happen without consequences. Been bullied and seen enough nastiness in my life not to want to seek out anymore of it thanks.

    It isn’t compulsory to take part on Thunderdome here if people don’t want to do so and it shouldn’t be demanded of them in my view.

  336. says

    carlie:

    Are they still taking you in as scheduled if you don’t go into labor before then?

    Nope! The surgery has been cancelled– I get to wait a week and if I haven’t delivered by next Monday, I’ll talk to my doc about being induced. (DarkFetus is already close to 8 pounds and even though I’ve “excellent bone structure*”, they don’t want her to get too much bigger.)

    Stevo:
    Gracias!

    ImaginesABeach:

    “they” say you should have started reading to DarkFetus already.

    I already have been. :D Everything from whatever trashy mystery novel I’m reading to customer profile sheets while I was at work. I figured it would be a good thing because there is some evidence that newborns know the sound of their mother’s voice right away.

    *Code for “wide birthin’ hips”?

  337. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Dear Dark Fetus: You are awaited with open and loving arms. Congratulations. Try not to be too much of a pain in the ass

    …I didn’t know sex education had gotten THAT bad ;/

    Congratulations Audley.

  338. StevoR says

    @carlie – #156 previous Lounge #373 – 16 October 2012 at 7:36 am

    “This place either has the worst collective ability to read posts or no one wants to comment on my post…” – #151 trinioler – 16 October 2012 at 7:15 am.

    I can’t even count the number of times I’ve posted something I think is of interest, and then within a day or so someone else posts the same thing as a totally new interesting thing. :) People skip around a lot.

    Three words :

    Too many comments! (3 more – Not enough time)

    Too much to read and very easy to miss stuff just on Pharnygula alone. Let alone if you’re also looking at other FTB blogs and other online sites and more.

    There’s a lot of good comments here and you can (& I frequently do) spend hours reading ‘em and still there’s plenty more that you’ll miss. I for one often find the sheer volume here overwhelming.

    Not that bad a thing but an explaination in case trinioler wants one and happens to see this.

  339. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Audley:
    DarkFetus is most certainly a genius!

    Daft Punk totally flipped DarkFetus!

    Obviously all mothers of breech babies should be required to listen to DP from now on. “What do you mean coincidence? No, there’s evidence. I know this one woman whose baby was hanging from her ribs by its fingertips and yet just one session of DP (now for only 3 easy payments of $49.99), and the baby all but swan-dived into her pelvis. Landed in exactly the right position for birth! You can’t say that happened by accident.”

    ImaginesABeach:
    I think cynical is the only way to be when it comes to the BSA.

    Tony:

    You know, Audley, a nice Thanksgiving birth for DF would be great, no?

    I admit it. I laughed. And then laughed harder when I imagined Audley hunting you down…

    Portia:
    Congratulations on your client’s win! Boo-hiss on the attorney’s fees thing. That seems like something someone should have mentioned before now.

    So, does this mean you have to jump through extra hoops to be paid, or that you won’t be paid at all?

  340. Portia says

    Socio-gen

    My third or fourth reaction to the judge’s ruling was that “someone should have mentioned this!!!” : p Especially given all the time I spent in Trial Advocacy class, then Advanced Trial Ad, then Law Practice Management. I really thought that the calculation of damages was a separate portion, even if it was very brief. I see now how little sense that makes in context. That’s what I get for doing internships with government offices where nobody bills clients.

    I won’t be paid at all. I really don’t feel right billing the client when I should have gotten the judge to order the other side to pay me. Feels like my mess up. Although, I’m not sure the judge would even have gone for it. Her ruling for my client was rather grudging. But in the case that the judge didn’t order payment by the other side, client would probably happily have paid me…

    Man, I’m gonna need some ice cream and some good Romney-bashing to redeem this evening. (Some new business to make up the shortfall in cash flow wouldn’t hurt either, if I’m wishing for things.)

  341. StevoR says

    @456. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical :

    yet, at both of my public libraries, they are in the science section. And outnumber the actual science books that deal with evolution. And climate change denialism is in the climate science section. And outnumber the actual science books that deal with AGW.

    Yikes.

    Here in South Australia I can’t recall ever seeing a creationist book* in one of our libraries at all. We do, alas, get climate denier books placed with the legitimate climate ones notably and most commonly our own Climate deniers in chief Ian Plimer and Bob Carter. However, the actual climate science books on HIRGO** outnumber them although still not in the right 98 to 2 scientific ratio.

    ++++++++++++

    * We do however have a “Creation Ministry” up in the Adelaide hills. I’ve delivered hay to them on occasions, years ago for work. They’re pretty quiet and I think widely mocked and rejected but we do find their shitty magazine in newsagencies (spelling?Why is that underlined in red on Chrome?) alongside actual science magazines regularly. Yeck.

    ** Human Induced Rapid Global Overheating as I prefer to call it because I think its more direct clear way of putting it and because “warmth” is generally seen as and associated with good things.

  342. StevoR says

    Pretty sure the third US presidential debate will be broadcast live soon 11.30 am~ish local time.

    I’ll go watch that in a sec but just wanted to say to whoever thought up this one (was going to keep scrolling & find out but probably out of time.) :

    “That is not dead which can eternal lie.”
    Ah! You mean Romney.
    Subthread won.

    (Quoted by David Marjanović #138. 16 October 2012 at 2:20 am
    on previous Lounge #373.)

    Nice one! Classic.

    Although thankfully to quote another proverb / adage thingummy :

    Romney too shall pass.

    (& I hope will never become POTUS, surely!)

  343. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    We do however have a “Creation Ministry” up in the Adelaide hills.

    I read that and immediately pictured it located next to the Ministry of Funny Walks. Then I realized what you meant. Duh. (me duh, not you)

  344. broboxley OT says

    ** Human Induced Rapid Global Overheating

    The average combined global land and ocean surface temperature for September 2012 tied with 2005 as the warmest September on record, at 0.67°C (1.21°F) above the 20th century average of 15.0°C (59.0°F). Records began in 1880.

    it may be a lot of things but averaged over one hundred years and tying temperatures in the last century isnt ed zachery rapid.

  345. Socio-gen, something something... says

    Portia:
    Oh that just stinks! But I can understand your reluctance to charge your client.

    Given that you’re in a small-town (IIRC), it’s a nice gesture of good-will that might be a benefit in the future, but it’s not really much help when the bills need paying.

  346. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Audley – Yay for reading to bumps!

    I did the same. And when they were born, I propped up board books in the corners of the crib, (and pram and cot) even in hospital, tucked between the sides and the mattress, so they had something to look at. Like my mother did with us, I read aloud during pregnancy and breastfeeding, rocking them to sleep, on the bus, everywhere. All five were bookaholics as kids, reading to themselves well before school (even the two dyslexic ones were reading at four; the others could read before they turned three) and are still bookaholics as adults, carrying on the tradition with their own offspring (those that have them).

  347. StevoR says

    Wondering if any HIRGO related questions will come up as part of the “foreign affairs” 3rd POTUS race debate.

    Its not like Global Overheating is going to affect the whole planet after all. /sarc.

    The US (& sad to say Australian too esp. during the Howard years) obstructionism driven by vested interests and rightwing ideologues is something we’re going to badly regret in future years, decades and centuries to come.

    Debate is on (Aussie) TV now – just about to start.

  348. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    it may be a lot of things but averaged over one hundred years and tying temperatures in the last century isnt ed zachery rapid.

    Well, it depends on your scale. In terms of the life of a fruit fly, that is almost forever. In terms of human life, that’s a fair dinkum time. In geologic terms, that’s really really really fast.

  349. broboxley OT says

    Portia! wow, did you miss the intro to Law 101
    “How you get paid”

    no, not you, someone was very remiss in teaching as in any civil case legal fees should be in the very first motion.
    Either to “Dismiss with prejudice plus reasonable legal costs” or “Claim for damages plus reasonable legal costs.” right at the beginning so it is on the table.

    Explaining to your client that you were remiss in not asking for it so you wont bill because you want to be honest and it was your mistake. That is a buttload of free advertizing, much better that trying to collect off of them and have them badmouth you all over the place.

    Also, not sure what the local mores are but you just did your first pro bono case. Keep track of the billable hours as you may be able to use it as leverage elsewhere.

    Congrats on the win

  350. StevoR says

    @473.broboxley OT :

    it may be a lot of things but averaged over one hundred years and tying temperatures in the last century isnt ed zachery rapid.

    Actually it is very rapid in terms of the usual rates of change for climate.

    Rapidity is a relative term and depends on what we’re talking about. For climate HIRGO is rapid indeed.

    @472. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical :

    LOL. Would love to have a Ministry of Funny Walks. If only! (And it would be much more reasonable and useful than the Creation ministry too!)

  351. broboxley OT says

    #477 Og
    In geologic terms it is very fast but in geologic terms it is also noise, not signal

    Yes I do believe we that C02 is a problem as is methane from melting tundra.

  352. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    Socio-gen:

    I admit it. I laughed. And then laughed harder when I imagined Audley hunting you down…

    I guess it’s good I didn’t go with my first choice (jingle bells…)
    ****

    I love that President Obama just called out Mittens on his flip flopping. Oooh, and his comment “I know you don’t have much experience at foreign policy.”

  353. thunk, Blob Alert! says

    Hia all.

    Yay for calling out mendaciousness.

    Tony: You might have a TS with your name on it later today. It’ll probably be a fish storm.

    Audley: Good luck! (what else can I say?)

  354. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    broboxley:

    In geologic terms, the Masstrichtian was noise.

    I agree with you, but it does scare me. I could see real changes in my remaining life. Yikes. That’s fast.

  355. broboxley OT says

    #479 Climate is funny bold is my doing. Point being that there doesnt appear a way to successfully model what co2 forcing currently. We dont know enough about it
    http://www.stanford.edu/~omramom/Cook_SAP_08.pdf its a good read

    • Historic droughts over North America have been severe, the “Dust Bowl” drought of the 1930s being the canonical example, but those droughts were not nearly as prolonged as a series of “megadroughts” reconstructed from tree rings since
    Medieval times (ca. 1,000 years ago) up to about A.D. 1600. Modeling experiments indicate that these megadroughts were likely partly forced by cool SSTs in the eastern equatorial Pacific as well. However, their exceptional duration has not been adequately explained nor has any involvement in forcing from SST
    changes in other oceans.
    • These megadroughts are significant because they occurred in a climate system that was not being perturbed in a major way by human activity (i.e., the ongoing anthropogenic changes in greenhouse gas concentrations, atmospheric dust
    loadings, and land-cover changes).

  356. mildlymagnificent says

    StevoR,

    I’ve never thought to look for that stuff – I get irritated seeing “science” UFO/other rubbish magazines alongside the real ones. I should check. We’re regulars at a couple of newsagents. They wouldn’t mind us relocating them. One proprietor has a bit of a crush on mrmagnificent (he’s so niiiice!) so I’d get him to have a word with her.

  357. carlie says

    The Mitt Romney account is tweeting during the debate, leading to scores of people jokingly chastising “him” for not paying attention during the debate. Jeez, Republicans can’t figure out social media at all, can they? No, don’t make the official account tweet while the guy is live on tv doing other stuff!

  358. broboxley OT says

    #484 Og, yup not sure of your age but you will see changes in your lifetime. I’ve seen it in mine. I have also seen some wins.
    Lake Ontario by a steel plant. In the 1960’s you would put your finger in the water at night and it would glow in the dark. The local fish had extra appendages and lesions everywhere. In 1983 you could catch trout in there and safely eat them. We can do a lot to clean up.

  359. Azkyroth, Former Growing Toaster Oven says

    Sorry, that should be Maastrichtian. My bad.

    Given the influence of denialists on climate policy, does that make this the Ostrichian?

  360. broboxley OT says

    no interest in the debate as I have already voted but keep commenting the good stuff

  361. cicely says

    Patricia, I’m afraid you have badly misread Holy Writ, wherein is written (’cause that’s what happens in Writ):
    Thou shalt not eat the meat of the cabbage, for it is the Devil’s Head, and it is Anathema.

    It is also an Abomination Unto Nuggan.

    Also, I have never in my life met a “humble” cabbage; they have, without exception, been aggressively nasty.

    *high five* for Audley. That’s the way to show A.S.!

    Sounds awesome! Will you show me yours if I show you mine?

    Perhaps tomorrow; The Husband would need to take a picture, then put it somewhere, somehow, that I can link to it.

    ‘Course, soon it will be reupholstered for the month of Thanksgiving.

    If kids see their parents owning up to and apologizing for mistakes, it makes it easier for them to do the same.

    A world of THIS.

    The “never apologize and never explain” approach is…Horses stuffed with cabbages, seethed in peas.

    Minnie, I missed the part of your recipe where the cabbage is plunged into wet cement and allowed to set.

    Epidurals are the awesome!

    Sing it!

    They go particularly well with added oxygen.

    Amazon binder reviews = lolz.

    … Guess who is no longer breech? :D

    Huzzah!

    It isn’t compulsory to take part on Thunderdome here if people don’t want to do so and it shouldn’t be demanded of them in my view.

    I agree.
    -

  362. Tony–Queer Duck Overlord of The Bronze– says

    thunk:
    oooh, I might get a tropical storm with my name. I feel special.
    I’ll appreciate it more if that storm doesn’t strengthen and threaten lives.

  363. cicely says

    Given the influence of denialists on climate policy, does that make this the Ostrichian?

    Win.
    -

  364. Portia says

    Socio-gen
    Yeah, you recall correctly. And hopefully the goodwill aspect works out for me. Plus they were really glad to win this one.
    broboxley

    Either to “Dismiss with prejudice plus reasonable legal costs” or “Claim for damages plus reasonable legal costs.” right at the beginning so it is on the table.

    I requested it in the original complaint, which of course I know now does no good. But yeah, nobody ever said to present evidence as to fees in the case in chief. One of those things where it’s painfully obvious after the fact but totally ungraspable in the moment. (To turn the knife in my heart, the judge went on almost gleefully about not being able to award attorney’s fees because she heard no evidence on it. Ok, maybe her glee was in my head).

    Explaining to your client that you were remiss in not asking for it so you wont bill because you want to be honest and it was your mistake. That is a buttload of free advertizing, much better that trying to collect off of them and have them badmouth you all over the place.

    I mentioned it offhand but I think I’ll put it in the disengagement letter or mention it more explicitly (probably the better choice) when I see the client next (it is a small town, I’ll see her soon). It’s a business with solid numbers in the bank, so collecting wouldn’t be hard, but it just wouldn’t sit well (with either of us, probably) to collect when I told her I could get attorney’s fees. The contract that the defendant breached explicitly provided for attorney’s fees. Sigh.

    Also, not sure what the local mores are but you just did your first pro bono case. Keep track of the billable hours as you may be able to use it as leverage elsewhere.

    Good thought but I’m pretty sure the ethical rules explicitly say that cases for which you expect but do not receive payment don’t count as pro bono. I do have a detailed record of hours. I may send the client a voided out invoice with zero due along with the closing letter to assure her she owes me nothing and to emphasize that I have written off the balance due.

    Congrats on the win

    Thanks : ) It was kind of fun, if nervewracking.

  365. Portia says

    “Iran is a state sponsor of terrorism.” – says the guy who sends bombs to villages in Pakistan. : /

    Not that Romney would kill fewer civilians.

  366. Ogvorbis: broken and cynical says

    I’ve seen it in mine. I have also seen some wins.

    I’ve seen them, too. I remember spending a wonderful afternoon (more than one, probably) watching pikas in the Sierra Nevada and the Uncomphagre Mountains. And some of those populations are gone now.

    We are getting some wins but sometimes I feel like we’re using band-aids on a sucking chest wound.

    Given the influence of denialists on climate policy, does that make this the Ostrichian?

    Failure to grok in fullness.

    Epidurals are the awesome!

    Not sure about epidurals, but I have had spinal blocks for my last seven knee surgeries and they are so much better than general.

  367. Tigger_the_Wing says

    Conga Rats to Portia! Shame about the fees, but think about the reputation! You won! Brilliant! =^_^=

  368. Nutmeg says

    My father was just trying to talk about a dodo bird, and instead said “dildo bird”. And then he didn’t understand why my mom and I couldn’t stop laughing. I am extremely amused with the mental image of a dildo bird.

  369. broboxley OT says

    Ostrichian good . Now what would you consider good climate policy that would actually, really, absolutely guaranty to affect the climate in a manner that you believe it should behave?

    Part of the problem was non scientific hysteria by certain segments of the population. When the predictions didn’t come out or were based on very dodgy information like the Himalaya glaciers a denialist industry was created. Now the denialists and the strident are competing for dollars on the world stage when scientists who actually study climate are watching their funding decrease. The general population distrusts both sides and are broke and jobless so they no longer care very much.