Botanical Wednesday: High times »« Chiroquackery in Morris, Minnesota

Comments

  1. Evader, the parasite-infested branch on the evolutionary tree says

    How long will it be before PZ is autotuned?

  2. Evader, the parasite-infested branch on the evolutionary tree says

    Oh, nevermind. Found one…!

  3. cthulhusminion says

    “unless you hate autotuning, in which case it will fill you with rage”

    How often have Fred Rogers and filled with rage appeared together?

  4. Agent Silversmith, Feathered Patella Association says

    Apathy is A Path To Why. No wonder it’s verboten.

  5. opposablethumbs says

    roasting garlic – yes, in the oven. I just have a tendency to overdo everything if I’m not careful – if a bit of X is good, then a bit more X must be even better, right? :-)

    Fortunately I usually keep this tendency (more or less) under control (it doesn’t help that I actually like everything spicy-hotter than anyone else in the family) and even more fortunately I am not the cook. There are certain odd tasks that are always mine (pizza base from scratch; pancakes; the spicy egg mix for dipping things in before you dip them in breadcrumbs), and apart from just those very specific things (and a bit of helping out) it’s Other Parent of Spawn who is the cook (everyday and specials). Even more fortunately still, he’s a very good cook though not like some amazing examples I’ve seen around here.

  6. says

    That is the only auto-tuned thing I can honestly say I loved. I lived a couple of blocks away from him when I was an undergraduate at the University of Pittsburgh. I actually was his neighbor. He was a beautiful human being and I really miss him.

  7. keenacat says

    Tony, your leetle Krystal is such a cutie.
    Today I checked the website of the animal shelter at my hometown and they do look for volunteers (duh, right?). When I get back I will definitely start to help out there and provide cuddlies to the pets. Maybe I even find a companion?

  8. Brownian says

    How often have Fred Rogers and filled with rage appeared together?

    I saw an old episode of Candid Camera where they accidentally caught Fred Rogers. The set up was a TV critics’ convention, but they disabled the TVs in the critic’s room. The bellhop would show the guest around the room, opening curtains to show off the beautiful scenery by way of apologising for the broken TV, and the TV critic would mutter and curse about what a terrible hotel it was, and how as a TV critic, the only thing that mattered was a working television. The camera was set up in the ersatz defunct TV.

    And then Mr. Rogers checked in, and they tried to play with him.

    “I’m sorry, sir, but the TV is broken.”
    “Oh, that’s no trouble. I don’t watch much television.”
    (Bellhop goes to open the curtains) “But the view is lovely.”
    “It certainly is. Thank you.”
    “We can move you to another room if you like.”
    “Oh, there’s no need. I’m sure I’ll be quite comfortable here. Thank you very much for all of your help.”

    Finally, realising they can’t flap him, they tell him he’s on Candid Camera. They point out the camera, he peers in at it, all smiles.
    “Oh, there it is. Ha-ha! What fun.”

  9. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Gah, panic attack! The Redhead will be released in a couple of days, so I have to get the house ready. I’m not ready. She’s not ready. The house isn’t ready. Short notice. AAAUUUGGGGHHHHH!

  10. Richard Austin says

    Nerd:

    First: YAY!

    Second: AAH!

    Clean ALL the things! Any friends you can bribe into helping?

  11. opposablethumbs says

    Nerd, that’s great! I mean, the not-ready panic maybe isn’t great but it’s wonderful that she’ll be coming home – sooner than expected, I guess, or do they just not bother to let you know in good time?

    Anyway, happy homecoming in a couple of days!

  12. Funny Diva says

    Longtime lurker, first time TET poster, I think.

    Hi, everyone. Just had to say how much all y’all RAWK. Not only do you have great minds, you’ve got tremendous hearts as well.

    Caine: come back soon, OK? (this goes for all TET break-takers). Also, sorry about Chas and very happy about the New Ratties.

    Keenacat: hang in there.

    Tony, therefore god: do please look into getting help.

    Audley and Mr Darkheart: Congrats and all best wishes for the parenting adventure.

    Ms Daisy Cutter: I, for one, love your spiffy Hugo Boss suit. You go right on kicking (x)’splainin’ butt and taking names.

    Louis: come back soon, you invariably crack me up. Have you got your Mollie yet?

    And I can’t remember who just lost a beloved dog suddenly and tragically. Whoever that was, my condolences and hugs if you want them. It really sucks to lose a pet.

    *waves to all Seattle/PNW Hordelings*

    I promise to try to say something original next time.

    FunnyDiva

  13. nonny says

    The chorus- “It’s good to be…curious..” gives me goosebumps, I guess because curiousity is one of my favourite emotions, whether in humans, cats or octopuses.

  14. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Clean ALL the things! Any friends you can bribe into helping?

    We’re working on that. It’s the bed, ramps, stairlift, etc. I worry most about.

  15. Pteryxx says

    Tony re cock sauce:

    My comment was more ‘gutter-minded’. Hell, I was probably in the sewer with what I was thinking :)

    And this is a problem how? ~;>

    Re: spices=evil
    Thanks for the link to your comment. I’m puzzled though. Believers love to say homosexuals are a sin, an abomination, and unnatural. If gays are unnatural/a sin/an abomination what does that say about herbs and spices which are natural? Is everything evil?

    I guess everything good or interesting in the world is evil, or highly suspect, yeah. The best explanation I’ve seen is that it’s a massive task-saturation scheme, to keep all the flock constantly policing themselves and each other so there’s no time or energy left for constructive thought.

    But then I spent lots of time in detention for asking too many questions in fundie school. I *never* got a halfway sensible answer for any of this.

  16. Part-Time Insomniac, Zombie Porcupine Nox Arcana Fan says

    Previous thread:

    nifty: Christ on a pogo stick, that’s scary! Actually now you have me worried. In two days the year will be over, and the principal still hasn’t called any of the teachers or aides down to renew contracts. Suddenly the possibility of him being called away to a principals’ meeting in Hartford doesn’t seem so nice.
    ———————————————-

    Congrats to Audley and Mr. Darkheart!
    ———————————————

    Spices are good. Spicy food is good. I am biased, no doubt, because I like spicy food (although the thought of vindaloo makes me tremble slightly). Don’t be asking me to ingest hot peppers straight, though – that’s my brother’s area of expertise.
    ————————————————

    Gillel: That cocktail sounds delicious. I think I will try to make it sometime this summer.
    ————————————————

    Ice cream: I was going to try a recipe for homemade ice cream that I got from one man’s YT channel. But alas, I don’t know where the food processor is and we don’t have heavy cream.
    ————————————————

    Ing: It sucks to lose a pet, but to lose one in such a tragic way is even worse. I’m sorry.
    —————————————————————

    This thread:

    Brownian @ 11: He was just unflappable, wasn’t he? Good ol’ Mr Rogers. I don’t know how well he’d be received on TV nowadays.

  17. Pteryxx says

    …Oh gods. Commenters over in the spouse abuse thread just capped the bland-food discussion for me.

    (warning for submission)

    Susannah
    13 June 2012 at 3:03 pm

    BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) @108

    … even mild disagreement like “I don’t like lima beans” was reason for long lectures about gratitude and accepting whatever the Lord sent your way.

    It gets passed down from generation to generation. I never knew that my mother had favourite foods, or foods she didn’t like, until she was in the middle stages of Alzheimer’s, and her control slipped.

    Once – once that I ever found out about – she wrote a poem hinting at the difficulties of marriage. She hid it away, and we never saw it until after she was in a care home. We were here, according to what she taught us, to obey God and take what He gave, uncomplainingly. Whatever it cost us.

    I SAW my mother do this (express no food preferences) and I didn’t understand what was going on. That’s horrible. Gaaaah….

  18. Owen says

    Wow, they really do exercise control over every little aspect of life don’t they?
    I’ve been reading Albion’s Seed, at the recommendation of someone upthread, I think, and it had a section on Puritan food. It was severely plain like their clothing and building – basically “put meat and veg in a pot and boil until dead” – so I wonder if this is part of the same strain of Christian self-mortification.

  19. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Except apathy. No apathy allowed.

    Out of Apathy Error. Reboot Imagination.

    How often have Fred Rogers and filled with rage appeared together?

    Back in the 1980s, our local Moral Majority chapter was on a tirade against Mister Rogers. All that acceptance.

    Nerd:

    That is fantastic.

    And scary.

  20. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Er, hello. *waves awkwardly*

    I delurked on the Faith/acquiescence thread and decided Mr. Rogers was a good reason to drop by TET.

    Tony: Thank you for sharing. I’m sorry for your loss.

    Ing: Losing a pet is difficult, but a sudden loss is more so. My condolences.

    Audley: Congratulations to you and the Mr. on your daughter!

    I am firmly in the cilantro = soap camp. Growing up, the only spice my mother used was (I kid you not) 1 tsp of salt in the spaghetti water, and sometimes cinnamon-sugar on toast. I’m not even sure if she owned pepper. This apparently caused my taste buds to wither and left me unable to tolerate anything spicier than Heinz yellow mustard for years.

  21. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    BCPA_Lady:

    Hello.

    Welcome.

    Look around.

    Enjoy.

  22. says

    In re food and spices, I laughed my arse off when out last doctoral student (since graduated) gasped in horror/awe when I took a bite out of a red bell pepper like an apple. I assumed she just didn’t know what it was, and offered a slice from the other side. No, it turned out that red bell peppers were WAY too hot for her. They’re what, a .003 scoville?

    I made salsa for a lab meeting and kept aside some for her before I did anything fun to it. Just the black pepper and onion was almost too much. We got her palate trained up a bit before she left.

  23. says

    I actually like autotunes! The ones from Symphony of Science are often beautiful (one of them has a clip of our tentacled overlord!). Actually, to clarify, I used to hate autotunes because most sound awful, but after seeing some of the Symphony of Science ones, I watch them over and over and find them very restorative. :D

    Hi, Funny Diva!

    Part-Time Insomniac, yes, it is a worrying situation – hopefully, all the teachers will be back and this new principal will be professional.

    Someone mentioned a ways back that the nifty offspring are probably old enough not to be adversely affected by this, even if the new broom sweeps all the good teachers and curriculum away. And that is how I feel, too. But the issue is larger for me – it’s the only freaking school in the region which is not Christian god-soaked – and therefore the only choice not just for secular parents who want a secular, science and reality-based education for their children but also for minority religion parents. We have a much higher ratio of Muslim, Jewish and “other” families in that school than is at all typical of hte community at large and hte reason is because it advertises as an independent non-sectarian school.

    Why can’t the godbots leave this one little corner of secularism alone? They have the rest of the educational field in a throttle hold, but this last little island of reason had to fall too? ARGH!

    But, maybe not. I am probably over reacting.

    Anyway, if I see or hear anything really alarming happening – ie changes tot he science curriculum or similar – then I think this timid atheist may just start to speak up beyond the internet.

  24. Pteryxx says

    nifty: could you contact the other families you mention, and move pre-emptively to just let the teachers know you all are concerned?

  25. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Pteryxx @ 22:

    I SAW my mother do this (express no food preferences) and I didn’t understand what was going on.

    As far as I know, no woman in my family (other than those of us who escaped) has never expressed any preference or dislike…of anything. Although, I see it in women of all ages, regardless of background. I think it’s wrapped up in the “female appetites are dangerous” and “mothers are self-sacrificing” nonsense.

  26. Pteryxx says

    And I ran around this school defending the girls’ rights to do and wear what they wanted… ARRRGH

    HOW did I not get sent to a camp?!

  27. Francisco Bacopa says

    Also, note: Mr. Rogers’ Neighborhood had a CAT puppet.

    TWO cat puppets, Daniel Tiger and the cat that lived in the same tree as X The Owl. What was her name?

    There were no squids, but I am sure if PZ had talked to Mr. Rogers back in the seventies, The Land of Make Believe would have gotten a shoreline and a squid puppet.

  28. Patricia, OM says

    Nerd – Woo-hoo! Glad to hear the Redhead is about to come home.

    Unfortunately, the new pullet patrol is too young to do a welcome home fly over.

  29. 'Tis Himself says

    Nerd

    Happy happy joy joy!

    BCPA_Lady

    Welcome to Pharyngula and Teh Thread™. Pull up a fainting couch and enjoy your stay.

  30. Ava, Oporornis maledetta says

    Francisco: I forgot all about Daniel Tiger. According to WIkipedia, the cat was Henrietta Pusscat. The Neighborhood of Make-Believe also had: Ino A. Horse, Elsie Jean Platypus, and Robert Troll, among many others. No cephalapods.

  31. Agent Silversmith, Feathered Patella Association says

    Despite being brought up in a spice-starved household, I soon discovered that it was a great way to hide the taste of vegetables. Not that the veges are entirely to blame, as these are often cooked well past the point of freshness. Trying to consign army-tank greens to the dustbin of history is still an ongoing process in my household.

  32. laurentweppe says

    @birgerjohansson

    Yes: there’s not enough rage about Prometheus.
    I’m not talking about the symbolism: I’m talking about the plot holes: the soul-crushing, mind-numbing, enormous, sadistically paibfull plot holes.

  33. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Our spice cabinet is filled to overflowing. One time we were have some people over (might have even been Thanksgiving), and just before they arrived, the screws holding the cabinet up pulled out of the plaster wall (real plaster, 1920 wall). If it comes out of the wall now, there will be huges holes from the expansion bolts.

    Then there was the time the dishwasher backed up and flooded the floor as people were arriving. That was a broken water pump.

  34. says

    Pteryxx, already did that. Mr Nifty and I wrote a pointed letter to the board when the pending firing of the current excellent principal was announced in February. It had no effect. A few other parents have mentioned some disturbance about the firing, but it seems that we are the only ones who wrote. :-( The upshot we got from our one clos-ish acquaintance on the board was that the decision was final and even if there was an outcry, the board was not going to back down and look foolish. We and the other parents feel helpless because it is clear that what we think simply doesn’t matter.
    Then, they went on to decide on this candidate and then they cancelled the meetings where parents should have had a chance to have a say.
    This is probably why I am so uneasy, obviously.
    I think we had rested complacently for several years and then were shocked and unprepared to deal with the sudden fait accompli. They did an end run around us.
    I can’t think why, unless it is to destroy the school. The board is not made up of only parents. There are a couple of parents and the rest are city people in various professions/retired etc. I am totally parnoid now, but the fundy churches in the area are so freaking powerful, I actually am entertaining thoughts that destruction of the school may actually be the goal. For the good of the community, don’t you know. Get rid of that godless school.
    Bah, I am getting wild-eyed and conspiracy-thinking now.
    I think it will be OK – but I will be paying much closer attention from now on. It has been a great school – I had no worries until lately.

  35. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    ‘Tis and Ogvorbis: Thanks for the warm welcome.

    Agent Silversmith @ 45:

    Thankfully, my mother was/is an avid gardener and believed in the health benefits of fresh veggies over cooked. During summer vacation, my siblings and I used to make “t-shirt salad” for lunch — which was basically going into her “Hundred Acre Garden” and piling our favorite vegetables in our shirts before going to build forts (and the occasional campfire) in the woods.

    To this day, raw green beans are one of my favorite snacks.

  36. Pteryxx says

    nifty: I don’t know, I’m not there, but I just get the strong feeling that this is a situation where lots of parents are probably concerned but aren’t connected with one another. Also, that if connections are made with the teachers so they know they have support, they’ll be better positioned to defend themselves. People are vulnerable when they’re kept isolated and things are being done secretly. What if they’re under a gag order, or don’t know their legal rights? If nothing happens then no harm’s done by being prepared. If the state ACLU has a hotline for this sort of thing I’d call them and ask for advice, seriously.

    I know, I’m a buttinski and this is the sort of thing I do when there’s a problem. There’s nothing else I CAN do to try and help.

  37. Agent Silversmith, Feathered Patella Association says

    Patricia

    Apparently some people’s taste receptors are configured in such a way that cilantro really does taste like soap to them. I’m in the opposite camp – there’s essentially no upper limit of cilantro that can be added to a dish.

    BCPA_Lady

    Am with you on raw green beans. I’d much, much rather have those than cooked ones.

  38. spamamander, hellmart survivor says

    @15

    Hello from Yakmanistan! There’s a few of us non-psycho-conservative types on the dry side of the mountains… but I think we mostly hide under rocks and stuff, like the scorpions.

    Thus why I encouraged my oldest to go to U of W and be around actual interesting people and culture. She’s been home for all of two days and already a bit depressed I think at the utter lack of anything interesting around here.

  39. cicely. Just cicely. says

    The Redhead will be released in a couple of days

    Huzzah! *confetti&fireworks&champagne*

    Funny Diva, welcome in!

    Also welcome in, BCPA_Lady!

    In re food and spices, I laughed my arse off when out last doctoral student (since graduated) gasped in horror/awe when I took a bite out of a red bell pepper like an apple. I assumed she just didn’t know what it was, and offered a slice from the other side. No, it turned out that red bell peppers were WAY too hot for her. They’re what, a .003 scoville?
    I made salsa for a lab meeting and kept aside some for her before I did anything fun to it. Just the black pepper and onion was almost too much. We got her palate trained up a bit before she left.

    But I’ve never been a doctoral student!

    Bell peppers (any color), black pepper, raw onions: Painful Hot Objects, all.
    -

  40. John Morales says

    Secular saint, this fellow Mr Rogers?

    Bah.

    (People will believe anything)

  41. Hekuni Cat, MQG says

    Nerd, great news! Good luck and take several deep breaths before deciding what absolutely needs to be done. The rest can wait until you have time to address it. (I’ve done the caretaking gig a number of times. This was the only solution that worked for me. It was way too easy to get distracted by what I would like to have done rather than what needed to be done.)

  42. Patricia, OM says

    Agent Silversmith – I’ll put massive amounts of cilantro in almost anything. It’s great! Yesterday I did basil marinated tomato slices, can’t over basil me either. Yum!

  43. Cunning Pam says

    Cilantro = soap.

    That’s a bit harsh.

    Not really, just factual. There’s a percentage of people whose taste centers react strongly to the aldehydes in cilantro. I’m one of them, and I can tell you for a fact, cilantro does indeed taste like soap to me. I find the taste completely revolting.

    Flavor chemists have found that cilantro aroma is created by a half-dozen or so substances, and most of these are modified fragments of fat molecules called aldehydes. The same or similar aldehydes are also found in soaps and lotions and the bug family of insects.

    Soaps are made by fragmenting fat molecules with strongly alkaline lye or its equivalent, and aldehydes are a byproduct of this process, as they are when oxygen in the air attacks the fats and oils in cosmetics. And many bugs make strong-smelling, aldehyde-rich body fluids to attract or repel other creatures.

    From what’s pretty much the definitive article about why some people hate cilantro: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/14/dining/14curious.html?_r=1

  44. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Patricia, OM @ 51:

    I have very weird taste buds. Cilantro tastes like soap, microwave popcorn tastes sugary, and candy canes or peppermint hard candies taste salty.

    @ cicely, Hekuni Cat, niftyatheist:

    Thank you!

  45. Jessa says

    Nerd of Redhead:

    Yay for the Redhead’s release!

    Audley:

    Congrats! I’ve never spawned myself, so I don’t have much to offer in the way of advice. Having changed many a diaper for both the niece and nephew, though, I highly recommend Boudreaux’s Butt Paste Spray. Plus, it has an awesome name.

  46. John Morales says

    Fucking ain’t spawning, and neither is parturition.

    Mammals do not spawn.

    </terminological irritation>

  47. Funny Diva says

    Thanks for the welcome, nifty, Audley and cicely (just cicely).

    Hi, spamamander! I once had a co-worker who called that part of the state Yaki-vegas. Sorry your daughter has summer vacation blues already. But it’s still gray, wet and cold here in UW-land (I work in the Health Sci building), so it’s not that much better. ‘Cept for more things to do, maybe.

    Speaking of work, sort of. Anybody else really _hate_ updating their resume? I totally need to do mine and look for something that pays just a little better, but…Haytee! We hates it, preciousssss!

  48. Patricia, OM says

    Cunning Pam – That is interesting, and being a fan of handcrafted soap I do know lots of herbs go into soap. I also don’t think lavender tastes like soap, lavender ice cream is one of my favorite dishes.

    BCPA Lady – Wow taste buds like that must make trying new dishes an adventure!

  49. Jessa says

    John:

    Fucking ain’t spawning, and neither is parturition.

    Mammals do not spawn.

    Yes, I know that. I just like using the word “spawn”.

    (Personal, though incorrect, preference)

  50. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Whew, finally got tonights tasks done. Typical fiaso, with the drills battery running down and the back-up even worse. Ate while it recharged. But, the Redhead’s clothes from the old broken rack are now back on an intact rack, the knitting books restacked, and the pathway to the window fan opened for bigfoot. (At least there I put the fan on a remote switch we use for the Holiday tree lights, so I can it on/off from the door.)

    Cilantro doesn’t taste like soap to me, but I find both parsley and cilantro tasteless. Add it to the guacamole, and I don’t taste the difference.

  51. Agent Silversmith, Feathered Patella Association says

    Fucking ain’t spawning

    Though it does follow spooning, sometimes.

  52. Patricia, OM says

    Nerd!

    Knitting books restacked ..*taps dainty foot*… just what were you doing with the Redheads knitting books?

  53. FossilFishy (Lobed-finned Killer of Threads) says

    Late to the party. [grumph, stupid time zones, grump] Congratulations Audley! Very glad to hear that you and the bub are well.

    Warning, warning, incoming baby birthin’ anecdote, you have 2 seconds to make minimum safe distance.

    My wife and I decided to not find out the sex prior to birth. After the Dr. pulled her out by her feet, giving a good, hard tug when her head stuck in the incision. (I really shouldn’t have looked over the screen at that point) I asked “Well?”. Instead of telling me he pointed my daughter at me, genitals first, and asked “What do you think?” The fucker. I’m betting, what with the swelling and distortions, that new-borns possess, a certain percentage of hoping-for-a-boy fathers get that question wrong and that that amused this Dr.

    I can see the humour value for him but at that point, with my wife weeping uncontrollably with fear and despair over the sudden change in our birth plan I did not need his attempt at humour.

    Mind you, after they got my daughter all cleaned, sorted, APGARed [A 9, I was so proud :)] and swaddled, she was handed to my wife. I’ve seen, and experienced, countless sudden turns in emotions where a stubbed toe or a dropped glass suddenly ruins an otherwise fine mood. But I had never before seen such a profound and abrupt shift in the other direction. Instantly my wife’s tears of anguish turned to tears of joy. It was awe inspiring.

  54. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Wow taste buds like that must make trying new dishes an adventure!

    Oh yes! I mostly eat at home or choose the salad option if eating at a restaurant or a friend’s. I love situations where I can try a small bite of a new dish before committing. All hail the buffet option! :)

    However, things that doesn’t taste right in one form will be perfectly fine in another. Peppermint, for example, tastes perfectly normal in anything other than hard candy; popcorn is fine if it’s made on the stove-top.

  55. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Knitting books restacked ..*taps dainty foot*… just what were you doing with the Redheads knitting books?

    Bigfoot set off an avalanche of a 4′ pile (aided by the larger cookbooks pile behind it) trying to tiptoe the window fan.

  56. laurentweppe says

    @ChasCPeterson

    Like Prometheus then, the director’s hubris ought to earn him a hepatectomy-by-vultures.

    I love that line.

  57. John Morales says

    Nerd, I just want you to know my feelings: yay for you, yay for the Redhead!

  58. Patricia, OM says

    Nerd – Well, OK… just so long as you weren’t coveting the Redheads knitting books, or changing their order or bookmarks.
    That would be blasphemy!

  59. Patricia, OM says

    BCPA Lady – You would have been safe eating anything at my old fundy church suppers, they always served the same bring a meat/salad/side/dessert dish of your choice.

    Always the same, jezus hated suprises.

  60. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Patricia: That sounds like every one of my former church’s suppers. They did change up a tiny bit — either half-burnt pans of scalloped turkey (even months) or overcooked sliced ham (odd months). But always, always the orange jello with carrots…. *shudder*

    Off to bed, I suppose. 5:30 am comes much too soon.

  61. says

    Almost completely threadrupt. Hooray for the Darkheart family! Hooray for Nerd and Redhead!

    And hooray for me, because I just finished my first ever final paper, and it’s a good one.

    And now, the drinking! (Not really. Really the drooling comatose onto my pillow while I gaze at something brainless for an evening.)

  62. says

    …someone just came in asking if we sold asphalt grindings to private contractors.

    Never mind whether we do or not, who the fuck comes in at ten at night asking about stuff like this? This isn’t the fucking 7-11, we have actual operating hours and when we’re in after hours someone else is paying for us to be here. Even if you don’t know that specifically…this is a construction company; construction work usually gets done during the day unless special arrangements are required.

    /rant

  63. Patricia, OM says

    Humm…we never had unclean (sliced ham) food at my old fundy church suppers. The biddy police would have howled bloody murder to pastor about it.
    Sows.

  64. Agent Silversmith, Feathered Patella Association says

    I really hate the police now.

    The date and country are hard to believe, but there they are.

  65. John Morales says

    Setár, you don’t figure representing your employer falls within your purview?

  66. says

    John:

    1. it’s not my department, first off, that’s actually an arrangement that needs to be made with a sales rep higher up. I told them pretty much that — “you need to arrange that with the office and the office is closed”.

    2. IT’S TEN AT NIGHT! And everything in the yard other than my shack is all dark and locked up. It doesn’t take a genius to look at that and think ‘maybe I should come back during the day’.

  67. Just_A_Lurker says

    …someone just came in asking if we sold asphalt grindings to private contractors.

    Never mind whether we do or not, who the fuck comes in at ten at night asking about stuff like this? This isn’t the fucking 7-11, we have actual operating hours and when we’re in after hours someone else is paying for us to be here. Even if you don’t know that specifically…this is a construction company; construction work usually gets done during the day unless special arrangements are required.

    /rant

    Someone from Arizona?

  68. Patricia, OM says

    I might be leary of someone that came in at 10:00 pm and asked for grindings too.

    Sounds like a pervert to me.

  69. chris says

    Patricia, lavender* and soap have different flavors. To those of us with our taste buds tuned specifically to detect aldehydes, cilantro tastes exactly like what happens if soap gets in your mouth when you wash your face.

    I am also a “supertaster.” There are little squares of paper that you can place on your tongue with a certain mix of chemicals. One quarter of the population will not taste a thing, one half will taste a bit of “something”, and one quarter will gag, spit and scream that it is revolting. I am in the last group, and I kept trying to wash the taste out.

    Now here is the very freaky weird part: at last year’s TAM9 in Las Vegas I had a bit of a musk stick from the Australian Skeptics table. I actually liked it. Which surprised a very sleepy deprived Rachel Dunlop. It reminded me of bubble gum and cotton candy, not at all unpleasant.

    My family teases me about being the typical Scandinavian with who needs things to be bland. But I like dark chocolate and broccoli! Except last week I spent a great deal of time trying to get the taste of home made borscht right, especially when I thought I had put in too much fresh garden dill. The entire family declared that it was bland, and dear hubby declared it too beety. Le sigh.

    I have heard that taste and smell are very interesting research topics. (I was a community presentation of food subjects from archeology to community gardens to taste science when I had the taste square)

    * Lavender will impart a lovely flavor if used in moderation. This evening I had lavender lemonade, which was tasty. My Christmas turkey includes a rub using rosemary, sage, thyme and a tiny bit of lavender. I only started to use the lavender in food a few years ago after I removed the harsh resinous gray colored stoechas varieties, with a more culinary angustifolia variety.

    Living in a maritime climate I can have an herbes de Provence garden. It is a section between a rockery and a driveway that I grow rosemary, lavender, thyme, and winter savory. I do have bronze fennel, but it is in the rose garden because it is tall (but it tastes too much like licorice, which I hate, so it is grown only for looks). I also have a front fence of espaliered apple trees.

    This is a connection to my Yakima roots, where my dad is from. He joined the Army there, so growing up my “official” address was his aunt’s house on Tieton Drive. I really only knew it from visits, including spending time at the small orchard of my mother’s cousin in Naches. But it was my legal residence, so I attended the Univ. of Washington as a resident despite graduating from high school in Texas (I was seventeen, and only spent ten months in Texas… as an Army brat).

  70. Just_A_Lurker says

    I might be leary of someone that came in at 10:00 pm and asked for grindings too.

    Ditto.

    I’m hyper vigilant as it is, when it goes dark I jump to paranoid.

    Sounds like a pervert to me.

    I was thinking they needed to get rid of a body.

    It’s probably something more mundane like they just got off work/didn’t see the signs and such.

  71. says

    Carlie:

    the only flavoring he gets to have is fat.

    Ha! You’d think. But my MIL rinses off the ground beef after she cooks it. Not with hamburgers, I don’t think, just with crumbles for pasta sauce and like that, although they are the most damn flavorless hamburgers I’ve ever had.

    I absolutely love the Simpsons spice rack scene.

    Audley:

    my mom is 1) scared of using spices (she never learned how) and 2) cooks the daylights out of everything ‘cos OMG FOOD BORNE ILLNESS!

    Now, waitaminnute. How did I not know you were Misterc’s sibling? Yes. The first time I ate steak at their house was a very sad occasion for me. I had not previously known that steaks could be gray. For me, who had grown up with steak as a rare treat and something to be treated reverently, it was tragic.

    It’s not that the only flavor they have is fat — fat has been Teh Devilz for a long time now — it’s that nothing seems to have any flavor at all. And spicy things are right. out. They don’t eat curry or anything. I think you’re dead on about being scared to cook with spices and herbs if you never learned how. And it doesn’t help any that when MIL looks up new recipes online, she has no way to tell whether they make sense or should taste good, so she has turned out a fair few really gross recipes, and now she’s probably gunshy.

    But at rock bottom, we’re talking about people who, when they realized that red wines are a vast and complicated field that they didn’t know anything about, simply decided they wouldn’t drink red wine. Ever.

  72. Patricia, OM says

    Chris – I’m getting this hint (board up-side head) that this taste thing is very real, but I have never encountered a super taster in my life. Usually just a squeamish adult, or sulky kid.

    Yakima is really familiar to me, I live in the Columbia River Gorge.

    Along with our organic egg business, we also have a lavender field, mostly fragrance, but some culinary & cosmetic varieties as well. My two favorite things to enhance with lavender are roasted chicken & red potatoes, they taste super earthy with lavender. I had some hot pepper/lavender jelly once, but the peppers overwhelmed the whole thing for my taste.

  73. says

    JAL #98:

    I’m hyper vigilant as it is, when it goes dark I jump to paranoid.

    Same here. We had an issue around Christmas with someone picking up salt late at night, claiming he had permission when he most certainly didn’t (at least, not to come at night). We also had a Bobcat and the truck it was sitting on stolen out of the yard about two months ago (we got them both back).

    This is an out-of-the-way yard sitting at the end of a dead-end road on the river bank in the middle of an industrial sector. At night, it’s completely dead around here, or would be if the freeway construction weren’t overlapping with the area. It is damn suspicious to see someone poking around at 10 PM asking sales questions.

  74. chris says

    Wow, I don’t often post to these threads (I am more of a Respectful Insolence denizen), so they move quickly.

    Back in the days before caller ID I would answer any phone call after 10pm with “It is after ten, this better be important.” This actually stopped many crank calls. Though it once confused my sister.

    Though right now I seem to have a rash of calls from those wanting to do surveys and get donations at six in the evening. I have kids. Kids like to eat at a set time, which means dinner sometime between six and seven. I really get irritated when I get a phone call as I try to feed ravenous teenagers.

  75. Just_A_Lurker says

    It’s not that the only flavor they have is fat — fat has been Teh Devilz for a long time now — it’s that nothing seems to have any flavor at all. And spicy things are right. out. They don’t eat curry or anything. I think you’re dead on about being scared to cook with spices and herbs if you never learned how. And it doesn’t help any that when MIL looks up new recipes online, she has no way to tell whether they make sense or should taste good, so she has turned out a fair few really gross recipes, and now she’s probably gunshy.

    That’s me alright, except for the whole “Fat is Teh Devilz” part. I’ve just used salt and pepper forever.

    Thank dog for you guys and Roomie who went to culinary school. I’m slowly learning things. I just super scared because if I ruin something we still have to eat it. Tight budget. Same worry about buying spices.

  76. Patricia, OM says

    Sorry…10:00 pm, grinding, dark, pervert….

    Poor attempt at sexual inuendo. Asphalt grindings…kids on…
    oh never mind.

    wanders off

  77. Just_A_Lurker says

    Same here. We had an issue around Christmas with someone picking up salt late at night, claiming he had permission when he most certainly didn’t (at least, not to come at night). We also had a Bobcat and the truck it was sitting on stolen out of the yard about two months ago (we got them both back).

    This is an out-of-the-way yard sitting at the end of a dead-end road on the river bank in the middle of an industrial sector. At night, it’s completely dead around here, or would be if the freeway construction weren’t overlapping with the area. It is damn suspicious to see someone poking around at 10 PM asking sales questions.

    Oh, shit.

    =/

  78. Just_A_Lurker says

    Sorry…10:00 pm, grinding, dark, pervert….

    Poor attempt at sexual inuendo. Asphalt grindings…kids on…
    oh never mind.

    wanders off

    OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    Jeez I’m dense sometimes. And I’m usually the one cracking dirty jokes!

  79. FossilFishy (Lobed-finned Killer of Threads) says

    Or, more politely: Your a supertaster chris? Cool, there’s a song about you.

  80. chris says

    Patricia:

    . My two favorite things to enhance with lavender are roasted chicken & red potatoes, they taste super earthy with lavender.

    I have done the roasted the chicken mostly by added a bit into the cavity. I must try it with red pepper, thanks!

    And yes, FossilFishy that that is true. We supertasters will keep you from drinking bad water, perhaps.

    Out of one husband and three children I have only one who is like me. He alone will not mock me for avoiding cilantro and curry. But at least he eats tomatoes, which his sister avoids (just like my brother!).

    Oh, and Australian musk sticks are really nice. Trust me, I’m a super taster.

  81. Patricia, OM says

    Just A Lurker –

    just super scared, because if I ruin something, we still have to eat it.

    My little circle of gal pals have get together lunches, and we do a “Bring Something New” day once a month. That way the most outrageous recipe can be made small, cheap, and grinned or gagged over with the least amount of embarrassment.

  82. chris says

    Myself:

    Oh, and Australian musk sticks are really nice. Trust me, I’m a super taster.

    And if you trust me, please turn in your skeptic card to the nearest postal box. They’d be just as confused.

  83. chris says

    Myself, again:

    I have done the roasted the chicken mostly by added a bit into the cavity. I must try it with red pepper, thanks!

    I meant “potatoes.” My excuse is the glass of wine next to my laptop. I will try to not knock it onto the keyboard. Which I have done, which ruined the laptop… that had completed homework for a advanced engineering mathematics class. One of the dangers of going to school as an adult.

  84. Patricia, OM says

    Chris

    You may want to try this – 1 chopped garlic clove, a tablespoon of olive oil, 1 chopped tblspn tarragon, 1 tblspn chopped rosemary, 1 chopped tblspn thyme, 2 tblspns lavender buds (Provence, Royall or White French if you have it), 1/4 teaspn salt – make this into a paste – gently loosen the skin over the body, breast and legs of a whole roasting chicken (about 3 pounds) – and rub the paste under the skin.

    Then shove 3 whole garlic cloves and a lemon that has been quartered up the chickens cavity *ahem*

    Roast it at 425 degrees for about 45 minutes, add any veg you like – yellow squash, red potatoes, onions? Bake 20-25 minutes longer and let chicken rest 10 minutes – enjoy!

  85. Patricia, OM says

    *Please note*

    Shoving 3 cloves of garlic and a whole quartered lemon up a chickens ‘cavity’ was written long after the Pullet Patrol ™ had gone to roost.

  86. FossilFishy (Lobed-finned Killer of Threads) says

    My excuse is the glass of wine next to my laptop. I will try to not knock it onto the keyboard.

    I can’t for the life of me understand why people use stemmed glassware*. Sure, I know that the idea is that you hold it by the stem to keep from heating the wine. But if you’re not wandering around with it why bother?

    *Not saying that a stemmed glass is why your computer came down with a with a drinking problem of course. Speaking for myself, I could spill a 1/16th full glass with a counter-weighted base that’s been epoxied to the table….whilst sober.

  87. theophontes (坏蛋) says

    @ Audley

    SQQQUUUEEEEEEeeEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!

    @ Nerd

    SQQQUUUEEEEEEeeEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!

    {relurks}

  88. Patricia, OM says

    FossilFishy –

    I can’t for the life of me understand why people use stemmed glassware…why bother?…whilst sober.

    Damned good question. (s)

    I get stemmed every chance I get, never whilst sober, and I have a glass when ever I can. The life of a foodie can get rough.

  89. Pteryxx says

    vernonbalbert from #48 on the previous thread:

    On Facebook a godly relative posted some information about a study on children raised by homosexuals which basically said that these children have more trouble than children who are not.

    Zinnia’s takedown of a recent research paper might be helpful to you:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/zinniajones/2012/06/regnerus-deconstructed-how-a-new-study-misrepresents-same-sex-parents/

    A recently published study by sociology professor Mark Regnerus purports to show that children of same-sex parents experience a significant degree of negative outcomes, contrary to numerous earlier studies on LGBT parenting. Most notably, the new study alleges that the children of lesbian mothers are more likely to be on public assistance, more likely to be unemployed, less likely to be employed full-time, more likely to be cohabitating, less likely to be married, more likely to have had an affair, more likely to have had an STI, more likely to have been in therapy recently, more likely to have recently thought about suicide, more likely to have been raped, and more likely to have been molested by an adult.

    These findings would certainly be surprising – if they were supported by the evidence. While these results have been widely reported as representative of the parenting skills of same-sex parents, the study itself can tell us almost nothing about this. The shortcomings of its design make this impossible.

  90. Owlmirror says

    Mammals do not spawn.

    According to the Oxford English Dictionary (and the Online Etymological Dictionary), you’re several hundred years too late to prevent figurative use of the term as applied to humans, O spawn of prescriptivism.

    /spawn of descriptivism.

  91. FossilFishy (Lobed-finned Killer of Threads) says

    Patricia

    The life of a foodie can get rough.

    Yes, I can see that. Not for the faint of heart.

  92. John Morales says

    Owlmirror, figurative it is, but that too is worth noting.

    (I like nuance, and wish others to be able to partake in its appreciation)

  93. Pteryxx says

    For y’all’s information, guest comment/post over at Jason T’s from Jacqueline S. Homan of godlessfeminist blog.

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/lousycanuck/2012/06/13/a-little-perspective-on-the-troll-cry-of-witch-hunts/

    The good ol’ boys complaining about “witch hunts” over being told that there should be anti-sexual harassment policies for their conferences and events wouldn’t know what a real witch hunt was if it hit them upside their collective snot-locker.

    And if they think that all these laws specifically targeting women for invasive body policing and stripping us of our most basic of human rights, namely the right to life, bodily autonomy and bodily integrity, in a society saturated with rapists’ rights in a culture of impunity for men is merely “special interest issue” that the good ol’ boys — who will NEVER have to suffer an unwanted and/or medically dangerous pregnancy against their will and possibly die from it or end up incarcerated for any result that does not culminate in a healthy, bouncing baby — is all so unimportant, I wonder if their girlfriends, wives, mothers, sisters, daughters, nieces, and future potential sexual conquests and bed victims know just how irrelevant their lives are in the eyes of the movement’s privileged white maledom that somehow gets to decide for the rest of us what is a “witch hunt” and a “special interest issue” and what is not.

    Another name worth taking notice.

  94. John Morales says

    FossilFishy, food fights are obscene waste enabled by privilege, and they disgust me.

  95. keenacat says

    Good morning horde.

    First things first:
    Nerd,
    YAY for the Redhead coming home!! *dances*

    All former lurkers,
    welcome. Make yourselves at home.
    _________________________________________

    Today is not a good day. I feel weighted down and saaaaad. At least the sun is shining. I shall try to run errands and maybe work a bit in the garden.

  96. Pteryxx says

    for the preggers: neato article on Skepchick about common health advice myths in pregnancy. Vitamins or no, should you avoid changing the catbox, etc:

    http://skepchick.org/2012/06/guest-post-science-based-pregnancy

    The most important thing is that during pregnancy, the litter has to be changed LESS THAN EVERY FIVE DAYS to avoid this rare but lethal risk. My beau still insists on changing it for me, and I’m very appreciative. If you know a pregnant woman who lives alone and has a cat, changing their litter box would be a very nice thing to do to help out and keep her safe.

  97. John Morales says

    Hey, keenacat.

    Many years from now, may you think back with sympathy at the who (and where) you are today.

    (We all have down days, that’s normal)

  98. Pteryxx says

    Aaaand an article from Kotaku about how annoying and prevalent booth babes are at E3:

    http://kotaku.com/5916237/e3-makes-me-really-appreciate-the-pax-ban-on-booth-babes

    Most notable for this excellent comment (among a bunch of crappy ones with no way to direct link, be warned) which actually *cites research* for sexism in advertising:

    Learn2Sociology @fiffer86
    Let’s break this down:

    A) It (unnecessary or gratuitous sex in advertising) is ubiquitous, so it’s acceptable.
    B) It works as advertising, so it’s acceptable.
    B2) Sex is only on display at press shows/sex is not usually a selling point of video games.
    C) It’s not as bad here as in other shows, so it’s acceptable.

    A) Wrong. People have devoted their careers to studying the effects various forms of advertising and media have on people as a whole/as members of large groups. Over time, things like the ubiquity of scantily clad models (or sex in advertising in general) take a toll on the public consciousness and reshape the way we think of the world. It shapes our definition of ‘normal’.

  99. says

    Audley, congratulations on finding out. Now the namingfest can truly start! I recommend giving lots of names, so she will have something to choose from. Ayaan Hirsi Ali Marie Curie Greta Christina Susan B. Anthony Alice Babette Toklas Darkheart, something like that.
    ====
    Nerd, congratulations on the Redhead coming home!

  100. says

    Good morning
    What are my intestines doing to me? This hurts!

    Hello all you new people here, glad to have you on board.

    FossilFishy
    Couldn’t they just hand your wife your daughter before washing her? I mean, she probably just pissed and pooped all over the place anyway, I’m sure she wouldn’t have minded a bit more goo on her baby. I had the two of mine in my arms before the cord was even cut, because, since there was no necessary medical procedure to be performed, that was the most important thing

    ++++

    Patricia, lavender* and soap have different flavors.

    I have lavender soap *ducks and hides*

    ++++
    Nerd
    Yay for you and the Redhead. I hope she can settle back in nicely even though the two of you don’t feel ready for this.

    ++++
    Tony
    Krystal looks great. The idiot will never know what a great dog he missed.

    ++++
    People who have a healthy baby and complain about the sex (given that you’re not a woman living in a society where having a girl puts you in danger) don’t deserve to have children at all. I’m not talking about “slight preferences”, I had them, too. I was very happy that #1 was a girl, but I would probably have been very happy about a boy. I’m talking about “the other sex is a consolation prize”. Because even if those folks get the “right” sex I fear for a child who will have some clear cut gender expectations to face.

  101. keenacat says

    I managed to be angry at him earlier but today I just want him to come back again. :(

  102. says

    keenacat
    great big hugs are coming. And Doppelkekse and lavender soap.
    I understand that you feel lonely.
    I’ve been feeling about my mum like that lately. I’m glad that I have some distance now, and it is good for me and it would have destroyed me if I’d gone on like that but damn I miss her.
    +++++
    Since we’ve been talking about food and morals and that post over at skepchicks, there’s another meme I’ve come to hate lately.
    The “if you eat a healthy diet you don’t need food supplements and vitamins.”
    Now, I agree that you shouldn’t just eat whatever junkfood that comes in your way and then take a pill to make everything OK, but there are people with medical conditions that just doesn’t make it possible to meet all the needs by just keeping a healthy diet.
    By now my second breakfast consists of a handfull of supplements because the thyroid needs more Selen, the medication makes me have cramps unless I take Magnesium oh and having a heavy period means I need more iron. I could probably meet those needs if I centeredmy whole diet carefully around those things, thereby neglecting the needs of all those people who depend on me making the meals, but, well, no. It’s not a fucking moral failure that I don’t.

  103. mehitabel, wotthehell wotthehell says

    Hi everybody, I just delurked over on TZT to express my thanks (and great sense of relief, really) to everybody on Pharyngula who’s opposing sexism in atheism/skepticism. And everywhere else, of course. I’ve lurked here for quite a while, and finally worked up the nerve to actually say something. I hope I’ll make a habit of it.
    Also, if it isn’t absolutely too weird coming from a stranger, congratulations to Audley Darkheart (way cool’nym) on the daughter. (In my defense, I have a spanking new week-old niece, and am giddy about all things baby at the moment.)

  104. opposablethumbs says

    keenacat, I get that :( And I’m sorry! But you are a pretty damn awesome person, and we are all rooting for you to get through the sorrow. ::clenched tentacles of encouragement::

  105. carlie says

    More hugs to pile on keenacat.
    Totally understandable feelings. You’re exactly right to try to distract yourself with something else to cope with it.

  106. says

    keenacat
    Urgh, sorry, i just realized that the above reads like I was making it about me, instead of you.
    What I wanted to say was: I understand, I can relate to that feeling of wanting to have things back to the way they were before even though I know that it’s neither possible nor would it be good, but i know that imense feeling of loss.

  107. says

    If anyone’s looking for a chewtoy, someone over at Greta’s seems to think that regressive policies work and is dismissing all historical evidence to the contrary (which amounts to…all historical evidence that I know of) as assumptions.

    If you don’t feel that your fangs are sniny enough for that, the same thread also has an idiot who thinks that “balance” means letting anti-choicers frame the terms of the abortion debate.

  108. Sili says

    The most important thing is that during pregnancy, the litter has to be changed LESS THAN EVERY FIVE DAYS to avoid this rare but lethal risk. My beau still insists on changing it for me, and I’m very appreciative. If you know a pregnant woman who lives alone and has a cat, changing their litter box would be a very nice thing to do to help out and keep her safe.

    I coulda sworn once a cat had had toxoplasmodium once, it was immune, and couldn’t carry the parasite anymore.

    As I understood it, the far bigger risk was dirt and unwashed vegetables because the parasite does hibernate in the ground.

  109. keenacat says

    Urgh, sorry, i just realized that the above reads like I was making it about me, instead of you.

    It doesn’t.

    i know that imense feeling of loss.

    *hugs*

    I’m off to get some groceries and fresh air. Maybe that will help.

  110. FossilFishy (Lobed-finned Killer of Threads) says

    John: That’s a fair criticism. I stretched my mind for a riff on Patricia’s foodie comment and was rewarded not with a sproinnnnng…boing…..biong…….biong……but with a thud.

    Giliell: I don’t know why they did what they did. It might have been because it was a an emergency C-section.

  111. Beatrice says

    re : Prometheus (spoilers behind rot13)

    Watched it yesterday. Friend declared it boring. We both agreed that Vickers fubhyq unir orra gur znva punenpgre. Fur jnf gur bayl frafvoyr punenpgre gurer. Jryy, rkprcg jura fur tbg tbnqrq vagb n shpx whfg orpnhfr gur pncgnva nfxrq ure vs fur’f n ebobg (vg’f bayl n ovg yrff vafhygvat gung gurl unq ure shpx uvz nsgre gung, guna vs ur’q pnyyrq ure n pbyq ovgpu vafgrnq bs ebobg naq tbg vagb ure orq).
    Naq gur jnl fur jnf xvyyrq? Nygubhtu, V fubhyqa’g or fhecevfrq. Vg’f boivbhf gung jr jrer fhccbfrq gb qvfyvxr ure, naq fhpu punenpgref trg penccl qrnguf.

    Qnivq jnf na vagevthvat punenpgre. Ur’f abg ernyyl fhccbfrq gb unir nal bgure zbgvingvbaf orfvqrf sbyybjvat uvf znxre’f beqref, ohg ur ghearq bhg n zhpu zber pbzcyrk punenpgre guna gur jubyr erfg bs gur perj. Vg pbhyq naq fubhyq unir orra rkcyberq zber.

    Funj. Htu. “V pubbfr gb oryvrir gung” vf ernyyl abg n tbbq nafjre jura nfxrq sbe rivqrapr. Naq vg znxrf vg ernyyl boivbhf gung ab bar jnagrq gb obgure jvgu zber rkcynangvbaf. Bu V xabj, jr’er fhccbfrq gb jnvg sbe gur arkg zbivr.

    Gur raq: Funj fgvyy unf snvgu (gung frrzf gb or zbfg vzcbegnag). Naq gurl tb bss va frnepu bs tbq. Lnl

  112. Walton says

    Today is not a good day. I feel weighted down and saaaaad.

    I know the feeling. :-( Feel better soon.

  113. says

    Sili

    I coulda sworn once a cat had had toxoplasmodium once, it was immune, and couldn’t carry the parasite anymore.

    No, in fact cats are the only creatures that are permanent hosts. Everybody else will just have it, feel a bit sick and then be immune.
    You can have an optional toxoplasmosis test here in Germany and if it comes back positive, i.e. you already had it you can relax.
    Rates are much higher in Europe than the USA. IIRC in Germany by the age of 80 about 80% of people have had it.
    It comes down to risk management. My test cam back negative, so living the way I lived for the 28 years before pregnancy didn’t give it to me, but I wasn’t willing to take the risk that it would happen during that particular 9 months, so, no raw meats and sausages.

  114. Louis says

    ‘Rupt. Back from long weekend. 2nd day of hangover. Why? WHYYYYYYYYY?

    Health kick part 283746872 starts tod…tomo…this week.

    I need bacon to cure myself (no pun intended). I’m off to a corner to grumble at things.

    Louis

  115. says

    SQB

    Especially since Toxoplasma gondii seems to change your risk perception.

    Hmmm, but in that specific case it seems to be void. If your risk management is “normal” before toxoplasmosis you make the adequate decission. And if you’ve had it already it doesn’t matter :)

  116. says

    Anyway, the antiques store down the road from my office has an honest-to-goodness lawn jockey on display.

    But, you see Audley, it was racist back then, now it’s just a quaint relic from the past.

    BTW, I had to search that shit. Didn’t know what it was. From your headdesk I gather it’s a Jocko, not a Cavalier Spirit.

  117. says

    Sili, from that same Tumblr, I liked the sign reading “Senators should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we could identify their corporate sponsors.”

    And just about everything else on that Tumblr.

  118. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Ugh. I was startled awake by a massive crack of thunder which made me think my apartment was collapsing. After 1.5 hours, I gave up on going back to sleep. This will make for an awesome day of running the 50 million errands needed to get things accomplished before my trip. Not.

    kristinc @ 86: Hooray!

    Setar @ 89: For several years, I worked for a company that sold new and refurbished industrial electronics at hamfests (amateur radio club events). Among other duties, one of my jobs was driving the Ram3500 and 20′ trailer to and from these shows. One November, I arrived back after 15 hours on the road from Ft. Wayne IN, part of which was spent creeping through a blizzard from hell around Erie, with only one thought on my mind: unhitch, toss the keys in the dropbox, and get the hell home. It’s going on 11pm, I’m unhooking the trailer, and a guy comes around the corner of the completely dark warehouse and offices to ask if we sell computers. Uh, no, and really, you couldn’t wait till morning for that?

    Patricia @ 90: We were Presbyterians, so no “unclean” animals, although eating seafood (other than self-caught fish) was considered extravagant and gluttonous. Also, the senior deacon was also a pig farmer.

    chris @ 97: My oldest son is a supertaster. He had the “eww, ack!” reaction to the test paper in his 7th grade science class (lo, these many years ago). His skin is also highly sensitive (as in, clothing tags and most detergents/soaps cause irritation; wears his socks inside out because the “fuzzy” inside feels “funny” to him.

    kristinc @ 99: Oh gosh. Are they related to my former in-laws? My former MIL could do some horrible things to meats, most of which was roasting/frying until it was shoe leather. She also had no ability to get a whole meal to the table. The green beans might come out first, with a half-hour wait for the chicken and the gravy showing up after dessert. The kicker: she was a home-ec teacher for 30 years!

    FossilFishy @ 116:

    I can’t for the life of me understand why people use stemmed glassware*.

    My guess would be the belief that a stemmed glass makes you look sophisticated, while a juice glass makes you look like an alcoholic. I have no real clue. Heck, I only learned this year (at the ripe age of 40-mumble) that there are different glasses for red and white wines. I grew up in a place where “good wine” is RedCat…in a Solo cup.

    Pterryxx @ 120: Holy flawed methodology! Talk about lumping non-like groups to get the result you want. I’m a non-trad sociology/women’s studies student and my Quantitative professor would fail me if I presented tripe like that.

    and @ 125: Ask me about responses to sexism/gender and women’s under-representation in elected office….or not. It’s exactly the same crap. My undergrad research project is depressing so far, but conforms to existing literature.

    keenacat @127: Thanks for the welcome and *hugs* from a newbie should you want them.

    Giliell @ 132: I hate that disappointment some people have about the sex of their child. Really, you have a healthy child but are unhappy? WTF?

    Although I’m trying to work on it (or working to express it more nicely), I slso dislike those who bemoan the horrors of having had to use pain meds or (worse) needing a c-section due to health issues (planned or emergency). The “I am an utter failure as a woman because I couldn’t fulfill my superwoman role of pushing the watermelon out while amazing others with my pain tolerance” types.

    I’ve had people tell me how sad and terrible it is that I missed the [Morgan Freeman voice] great womanly and fulfilling experience of birthing my children [/Morgan Freeman]. (I had 3 c/s due to health issues).

    Fuck that. All that mattered to me was leaving the hospital with three healthy babies. I don’t care how I got that result.

    Now, off to make some breakfast…and maybe take a nap.

  119. Sili says

    I can’t for the life of me understand why people use stemmed glassware*.

    By holding the stem rather than the bowl, you reduce the heating of the wine from its ideal temperature.

  120. says

    BCPA Lady

    Although I’m trying to work on it (or working to express it more nicely), I slso dislike those who bemoan the horrors of having had to use pain meds or (worse) needing a c-section due to health issues (planned or emergency). The “I am an utter failure as a woman because I couldn’t fulfill my superwoman role of pushing the watermelon out while amazing others with my pain tolerance” types.

    That stuff, too.
    We just can’t win as women.
    We have to have children, we have to be Saints during pregnancy, we have to birth them in the right way, breastfeed happily from the beginning (only that we should also be back to work like 5 min after delivery or else the pay gap is our fault), co-sleep only that we’ll kill our children that way, wear them until their feet are dragging over the floor.
    I would have loved to have pain management with my two…

  121. laurentweppe says

    @ Beatrice
    (Prometheus spoilers galore, in rot13 as well)

    “V pubbfr gb oryvrir gung” vf ernyyl abg n tbbq nafjre jura nfxrq sbe rivqrapr. Naq vg znxrf vg ernyyl boivbhf gung ab bar jnagrq gb obgure jvgu zber rkcynangvbaf.

    Be gung gurl unq qht gurzfryirf vagb gbb qrrc n cybg ubyr gb pyvzo bhg.
    *
    Orpnhfr rvgure gur vatrarref, juvpu ner fgngrq gb or fb trargvpnyyl pybfr gb hf nf gb or gur fnzr fcrpvrf, xvpxfgnegrq hf n srj gubhfnaqf lrne va gur cnfg, juvpu jbhyq zrna gurl unq gur yhpx gb svaq n cynarg jurer gur angheny fryrpgvba cebprff nyernql cebqhprq Terng Ncrf nyernql fb pybfr gb gur Vatrarref gung fpvragvfgf jbhyq arire unir svtherq bhg znaxvaq jnf abg n cebqhpg bs angheny fryrpgvba…
    *
    BE, gur vatrarref xvpxfgnegrq yyvsr ba rnegu ovyyvbaf bs lrnef va gur cnfg, juvpu bcra n jubyr pna bs dhrfgvbaf: ubj pbzr gung gur Vatrarref ohvyg n ovyyvbaf bs lrnef ybat Greensbezvat, lrg ng gur fnzr gvzr zvpebznantr vg gb gur cbvag vg riraghnyyl cebqhpr gurve bja zvav-zr juvyr znxvat vg ybbxf yvxr angheny fryrpgvba, jvgu frrzvatyl enaqbz zhgngvbaf unccravat nyy bire gur cynpr.

    ***

    Gur raq: Funj fgvyy unf snvgu (gung frrzf gb or zbfg vzcbegnag). Naq gurl tb bss va frnepu bs tbq. Lnl

    Gur jbefg cneg? Fur tbrf sebz fgneel rlrq ebznagvp jub jnagf gb zrrg ure znxref gb natel fpbearq juvyq jub qrznaqf nafjref. Naq gur guvat vf: vg’f n cresrpgyl perqvoyr ribyhgvba sbe gur punenpgre gb tb sebz bireyl anïir gb wnqqrq ohg fgvyy va frnepu sbe nafjref bapr ernyvgl ovgrf ure.
    Ohg jul, bu jl qbrf’ag fur pbzr onpx gb rnegu? Qnivq’f urnq fgvyy xabjf ubj gb cvybg gur fcnprfuvcf, Rnegu vf ba gurve znc, fb jul qbrfa’g fur pbzrf onpx gb Rnegu gb jnea gur erfg bs hf bs gur rkvfgrapr bs trabpvqny nyvraf jvgu ubeevsvp ovbjrncbaf? Jul qbrfa’g fur guvaxf nobhg gur orarsvgf bs ergeb-vatrarrevat gur fcnprfuvc, bs cercnevat n ovt nff rkcrqvgvba vafgrnq bs fhvpvqnyyl tbvat nybat jvgu ebobohqql’f urnq? Fb jr unq va gur zvqqyr bs guvf cybg-ubyr srfg n punenpgre juvpu jnf univat na vagreerfgvat ribyhgvba, naq Onz! Gurl qrpvqrq gb pbapyhqr ure punenpgre’f nep jvgu nabgure uhtr cybg-ubyr.

  122. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Good morning. Happy Tuesday to one and all!

    Thankfully, my mother was/is an avid gardener and believed in the health benefits of fresh veggies over cooked.

    My parents were big on fresh veggies. My best friend’s mother was firmly in the ‘cook it until it is dead’ camp. Even lettuce had to be steamed or ‘you’ll get worms’.

  123. says

    BCPA lady and Giliell:
    That’s exactly why I am loving my doctors right now. Dr Jen and Dr Bonnie have both told me that what I want and my comfort/safety come first. After discussing my delivery options yesterday, Dr Bonnie specifically said using an epidural does not make me “less of a woman” and I should tell anyone who judges me for my choice to mind their own business. :D

  124. keenacat says

    I’ve had people tell me how sad and terrible it is that I missed the [Morgan Freeman voice] great womanly and fulfilling experience of birthing my children [/Morgan Freeman]. (I had 3 c/s due to health issues).

    Were they trying to sell “VBAC ZOMG teh awsum” on you, too? I heard you can get merit badges. :D
    http://www.regretsy.com/2010/06/23/vbac-tmi/

    Also, I take all hugs I can get right now. The man was supposed to have children with me and stuff.

  125. lexie says

    I’m another lurker popping into TET. I’ve been lurking for just less than a year and wanted to wait a little longer before posting but I just wanted to weigh in on the Toxoplasma discussion that was going on. I’m an Aussie vet students so of course as a student I may be wrong but we’ve been taught that the best advice for pregnant women is that litter trays need to be cleaned daily preferably by someone other than the pregnant woman (so not sure if that is good news or bad). This is because toxoplasma gondii oocyts sporulate between 1 and 5 days. If you’re cleaning litter boxes then it would be advisable to wear gloves. If you have indoor only cats then they may not carry toxoplasma as indoor cats are less likely to have parasites, you can check if they are currently shedding by doing a faecal float, though even if it comes back negative I don’t think that this will change the advice (that’s just an opinion and can’t find it in my textbook so it may be wrong) it’s probably a waste of money.

  126. lexie says

    I just thought that I had a significant omission from my previous post. In my comment on indoor cats, this doesn’t apply if they have been adopted from a rescue centre as then they are likely to have picked it up before adoption. I was really referring to cats bought as kittens from small breeders who also keep cats indoors. So I’m sorry for being unclear.

  127. carlie says

    Hi all the new people!!

    After discussing my delivery options yesterday, Dr Bonnie specifically said using an epidural does not make me “less of a woman” and I should tell anyone who judges me for my choice to mind their own business. :D

    Sounds like a great doctor. I had been adamant with mine that I wanted to try to get through the whole thing without medication (ha!). Then I had to go in and get induced (Pitocin, ha!). When I finally broke down and asked the nurse to call my doctor to get orders for an epidural, she smiled and said “She pre-authorizes all her patients for it, so just in case they decide they want it they don’t have to wait”. I loved my doctor.

    But yeah, years of feeling like a failure for having a c-section rather than being superwoman granola mom. Nobody should go through that.

  128. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Wife had epidurals for both births. She liked that she could still feel what was happening but was separated from most of the pain.

  129. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Giliell @ 160:

    We just can’t win as women.

    Nope; whatever you do, you’re doing it wrong — and people will line up around the block to tell you why.

    Nursing…ugh. My oldest and I had a horrible experience, and I was relieved (he probably was too) when he had to be put on formula at 6 weeks because my breasts simply couldn’t keep up with demand. I was even more relieved that being diagnosed with Addison’s and put on corticosteroids during my 2nd pregnancy meant I didn’t ever have to try it again. Not that the risk of steroid exposure stopped the fanatics from harassing me.

    Ogvorbis @ 161: Eww. I can’t even eat lettuce on burgers because warm greens is just wrong. And cooked spinach is a crime against humanity.

    Audley @ 163: Supportive docs are wonderful. My OB became pregnant with her 4th during my 3rd pregnancy and had a terrible time. We commiserated a lot during my appointments. I think her experience made a real difference in how she approached her patients’ care and how they responded to her. (Not that a non-mother wouldn’t have been as good, but I think I trusted her judgment more when she said something was normal or not because “she would know.”)

    keenacat @164: They lobbied hard, and the whole “death or permanent damage” thing did not deter them. Most were of the opinion that I should have at least “tried it.” Um, no. If I’m going to risk death, I’d rather be doing something fun.

  130. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    I can’t even eat lettuce on burgers because warm greens is just wrong. And cooked spinach is a crime against humanity.

    I partially agree.

    However, If you slice some thick-sliced bacon into matchsticks, brown it, drain off the fat, scrape the pan with some white wine, add olive oil and 10 cloves of thin sliced garlic (cook very slowly until the garlic is translucent), put the bacon back in, then put in a bunch of baby spinach and saute over high heat until the spinach is warmed through and wilted, it is delicious. Trust me.

    Steam lettuce, or boiled lettuce, or steamed celery, are all an affront to (damn, whatever the god is in “The Monstrous Regiment”).

  131. mehitabel, wotthehell wotthehell says

    I’ve had people tell me how sad and terrible it is that I missed the [Morgan Freeman voice] great womanly and fulfilling experience of birthing my children [/Morgan Freeman]. (I had 3 c/s due to health issues).

    Were they trying to sell “VBAC ZOMG teh awsum” on you, too? I heard you can get merit badges. :D

    Wow. Lol at that regretsy. These people get to me too, not only because of a merit badge mentality, but also because when you scratch them sometimes you find tons of misinformation. That happened recently with someone I care about and I hope if I put this out here some of you may be able to help me. It’s Demon Pitocin–I knew induction had gotten very unpopular and stigmatized, but I’d never come across the variety of this woman’s objections to pitocin. Apparently pitocin’s to blame for not only ZOMGAutism, but assorted behavioral problems and even some sort of delayed sexual development in boy infants. She also believed oxytocin was exclusively a female hormone, and it seems she’d gotten all this information from one person. Hmm. Made me dubious. I’ve been searching for research on any of this outside of the basic oxytocin claim that I was at least able to let her know was wrong, and I don’t find much to support the other ideas. But I am out of my depth. Has anyone else come across these pitocin claims before? She seems genuinely scared, and that makes me furious. Especially if the claims about pitocin are based on flimsy evidence.
    keenacat, if you are accepting hugs and would like one from a newbie, please have. I was moved by your comments and by the strength you are showing.

  132. says

    BCPA Lady,
    Dr Jen has two young children that she has talked about, but I think she’d be really good even if she didn’t. I feel like my appointments are all about me and the docs are always willing to answer all of my goofy ass questions and that goes a looooooooong way. :)

  133. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    carlie @ 167:

    But yeah, years of feeling like a failure for having a c-section rather than being superwoman granola mom. Nobody should go through that.

    I should be clear that, in my comment to Giliell above, my annoyance was aimed more at those who create these impossible ideals and then want to make me (and others) feel badly about how things turn out.

    I think I was spared the guilt because merely surviving was an accomplishment, first for my oldest son who was in severe distress and then for myself with the last two.

    Having a healthy child was the icing on the cake and I couldn’t see it as anything else.

  134. birgerjohansson says

    Toxoplasma?

    Since so many regressive politicians are middle-aged, it would probably not be unethical to spread a little toxoplasma at their meetings (them being beyond childbearing age).

    If infected, they are more likely to participate in risky behaviour, like speaking their mind instead of using “dog whistle” terms. Imagine Mittens* saying
    “I really don’t care about women having choices” in front of a live mike…

    (* Or Pat Buchanan speaking his mind about uppity n*ggers.)
    — — — — — — —
    Every SF film should be “vetted” by nit-picking SF fans before the premiere. Most plot holes could be easily patched up, if only the film executives cared.

  135. says

    Every SF film should be “vetted” by nit-picking SF fans before the premiere. Most plot holes could be easily patched up, if only the film executives cared.

    QFT. Though that is what the test screening SHOULD be. Often it goes the other way though.

    Fucking “I Am Will Smith Legend”

  136. carlie says

    I should be clear that, in my comment to Giliell above, my annoyance was aimed more at those who create these impossible ideals and then want to make me (and others) feel badly about how things turn out.

    Oh, yes. I was trying to bemoan the social mores that I bought into that made me feel that way.

  137. Rey Fox says

    This Prometheus movie must be pretty good if it’s led to so much discussion. :D

  138. says

    Julie Bindel, best known for her rabid transphobia, has admonished bisexual women to stop sleeping with men, for the sake of “politics.” The essay could be best summarized thusly:

    People keep telling women whom they should want to have sex with. The problem is that nobody has yet identified the right people women should be fucking. And I’m not telling bi women what they should do, just pointing out that they’re brainwashed by society, and if they don’t take my advice, they’re a bunch of traitors to their sex.

    I saw it posted here, where the radfems of LiveJournal are applauding in agreement and informing the bi women there that because “the personal is political,” whom they choose to fuck is not their business alone.

    Fucking radfems.

    /scrolls up to catch up on everything else

  139. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Every SF film should be “vetted” by nit-picking SF fans before the premiere. Most plot holes could be easily patched up, if only the film executives cared.

    And every historical movie should be vetted by historians with expertise in that era/genre.’

    And every movie with prehistoric beasties should be vetted by palaeontologists (sorry, I just had an image of a movie titled The Revenge of the Anthracosaurs).

    And every movie that involves trains should be vetted by railroad historians (seriously, I think the only railroad movie I have seen in which the railroading was done right was The Train with Burt Lancaster).

    Eksetra, eksetra.

    We go down to Florida a couple of times a year to visit relatives. Occasionally, we will go and do something at one of the Disneys, quite often Disney Marketplace, for a day of dissociative weirdness. There is a restaraunt there called T-rex and, outside, they have a full-scale model of an Argentinosaurus. Huge. Magnificent.

    Wrong.

    The sacrum should isn’t fused with both ilia. The sacral vertebrae are so separated from the rest of the dorsal vertebrae in front that that poor Argentinosaurus would be paralysed, incontinent and approaching DEAD. The femur is backwards. And finally, there isn’t enough room between the pubes or ischia for a turd to pass through, let alone a sauropod egg the size of a soccer ball. All of which could have been corrected by a competent palaeontologist for a relatively small sum of money compared to what they spent on building the damn thing.

    So, not just sci-fi, but every damn thing done in any popular entertainment — when they get it right, it is by accident! Hell, the only correct piece of military equipment in the movie Patton was a genuine WWII jeep that got BLOWN UP!

    Sorry for the rnat.

  140. FossilFishy (TMI, that's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI) says

    My wife was devastated by needing to have a C-section. We went through a clinic that was run by a group of woman MD’s who specialised in low-intervention birth plans for low-risk pregnancies. We wanted to do it as natural as possible while still reserving the option of the full panoply of modern medicine. We wanted to be in a place where, should the very worse happen, if the qualified assistance wasn’t right there in the room, they were just a short walk away.

    All was good, my wife’s waters broke two weeks after the due date. Baby fully cooked: check. We hied off to the hospital and they found that she wasn’t dilated at all and knowing that we wanted low intervention they sent us home to wait for the contractions to begin.

    But they didn’t start, at least not real full-on ones. Twenty four hours later we go back to the hospital and they tell us that the baby’s head has not dropped into the pelvis and that she’s breach, in the pike position. Because there’s almost no fluid left there’s almost no chance at turning the child. And then the kicker came, this hospital did not do breach births. Ever. It was policy. We did not know that, we never asked and if that information was given to us in writing, highly likely I suspect, we missed it.

    They let us wait to see if anything would start on it’s own for a couple of hours. Then the foetal monitors began to show that the bub was becoming less and less active. And that was that. Into the surgery she went.

    I sat in the hall, scrubbed up, holding my mask in my hand, counting its perforations, contemplating the sign that said “No pictures.” and wondering just how many fathers had taken a picture of it. Anything to quell my fear and to keep me from crashing through the doors to comfort my wife, whom I could hear weeping as they prepped her.

    When they finally let me in my role was clear: distraction. I comforted her as best I could. I pointed out that this was one small moment when taken against the whole of our life with our child-to-be. I told her that if she thought this was bad wait until our child brings home a boy or girl friend with tattoos! That got a wane smile and the reply “You have a tattoo.” “See, see I know what I’m talking about.” That got a laugh from the Dr. whom I admonished to mind his knitting.

    As I mentioned up thread, pain turned to joy when mother and child finally managed to hold and be held. And today we have a healthy, happy, intelligent four year old daughter who’s means of entry to this world is naught and less than naught to her.

    My wife and I do not talk about it. I have not looked into whether the C-section was in fact medically justified. I don’t care, except for the fact that my wife regrets how things turned out. That is my privilege, I understand that. No one has ever, or will ever, criticise *me* for our birthing choices.

    I tried my best to deflect any incoming criticism from my wife. We are bicycle ridin’, left leanin’, greeny sorts with deep ties in the music community and the “natural” childbirth zealots abound in our circle. I announced electronically that we’d had a C-section and that if anyone dared to question that decision I would get them down on the ground and put the boots to them until the stopped moving. And, in my addled, sleep deprived state I most assuredly meant it. Not an impulse I’m proud of now, but there it is.

    I do not tell this tale as a caution, with the exception of reminding expecting parents to be better informed than we were. To talk through as many contingencies as you have stomach for, both together and with your birthing team. We thought we were prepared and we were not. Had we been it would have been much easier to deal with. Mea culpa.

    I do not tell this tale as a criticism of the Drs and hospital. They acted professionally and with compassion, baring the Dr’s one ill-advised attempt at humour also detailed up thread. I want no part of that particular battlefield in the so-called “Mommy Wars.”

    I tell this tale because I cannot do so very often. Because this thread pushed it up in my mind again. And because the day they cut open the person whom I love more than any other to retrieve the person who continues to show me that I had no idea what love really meant is a huge part of my history, my identity.

    I tell this tale here because rightly, wrongly and/or perhaps ironically, given the recent TET/TZT split, this place feels like somewhere where I can do so safely.

    Thank you for this place PZ, filled with these people from whom I’ve learned so much as I skulked around its edges. This fractious, funny, comforting, confronting, beguiling, battling community is truly exceptional and though I cannot claim any substantive credit for its creation or nature, I cherish it.

  141. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    mehitabel: Omylanta….

    I have absolutely zero medical experience and my only experience with Pitocin was not good*, but I’ve never heard any of that before now.

    I did a quick search on JSTOR (which is the only database I have access to from home) and a search for “pitocin and autism” found one lit review from 2006 that suggests it might be useful to research potential beneficial effects of oxytocin in autism spectrum disorders because of its effect on social-bonding — based on work on prairie voles, for whatever that’s worth. (I’m in sociology; it could be important…)

    Searching “pitocin and delayed sexual development” shows some old and very old stuff (1932, 1946, 1957, 1964, 1975, etc) I can’t access, but which seem mostly to be about the endocrine system.

    Google search turns up only woo sites for “pitocin and sexual development” or “pitocin and autism.”

    *USAF hospital, 25 years ago. They were determined to induce and I was on a drip, 10 hours a day for 6 consecutive days. (This is apparently a very bad thing, from what I learned since.) It didn’t work and may (possibly) have caused/contributed to his going into distress and the c/s.

  142. says

    I didn’t have high hopes, but at least some modicum of hope watching Iron Sky: it was made by sci-fi fans, for sci-fi fans and largely funded by sci-fi fans. That hope was shot down within opening minutes when the first gunshot was heard on the Moon. And it pretty much went downhill from there.

  143. mehitabel, wotthehell wotthehell says

    BCPA_Lady: Ohmylanta indeed. I got similar results, but her fear frightened me and it’s been affecting my judgment. Not to mention that a bit of what I was reading made me dread that pitocin could become the next big villain in the autism panic. It looked like a logical extension of an anti-vaxxer’s mentality. Now I’m feeling better about telling her that that stuff sounded like rank BS. That’s just mind-boggling about your pitocin experience. I’m glad you made it through okay.

  144. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    FossilFishy: I have a teary smile on my face, because your love just shines through your words. Thank you for sharing your story.

    To talk through as many contingencies as you have stomach for, both together and with your birthing team.

    I wonder how much of the “positive thinking” nonsense we’re inundated in contributes to the intense guilt when a pregnancy or birth does not go as planned/imagined? Women especially are castigated for expressing any doubts or concerns or attempt to plan in the event that things might not go well.

    My pregnancies were in the late 80’s/early 90’s and I remember being admonished by friends and family not to think about potential complications. “Don’t tempt fate!” My sisters went through the same thing with theirs, spanning the late 90’s to last year.

    Having had one that went awry at the end and a chronic endocrine disorder with possibly-fatal risks, I was able to ignore those who wanted me to pretend everything would be rosy and joyful. The one OB who said, “Don’t worry about it” when I posed a question was quickly replaced with someone who would be honest.

  145. says

    Hello to all our newcomers! (Also, thanks, Funny Diva! ^^)

    More hugs to you, Keenacat. Hang in there.

    Tony, Krystal is very cute. I am happy that you were there for her, and she for you, at the right moment.

    Nerd: YAY!!!! The house will come together — the important thing is that the Redhead will be home.

    Nifty, this is probably a stupid/privileged question, but is moving to a different area an option at all?

    Ava, smoked paprika is amazing. It’s a great way to impart some bacon flavor to a dish without the bacon. (“Liquid Smoke” is another good way.)

    I don’t remember “Robert Troll” on Mr. Rogers’ Neighborhood. Did he say things to the other characters like “LOL U MAD”?

    Owen, I was the one who rec’ed Albion’s Seed. I think that you have to balance the degree of influence Calvinist theology had on Puritan cooking with the fact that spices used to be extremely expensive and hard to obtain — and that boiling stuff to death has traditionally been common throughout the British Isles. So I have to echo my previously stated opinion that it’s a matter of ideology reinforcing extant cultural habits and prejudices.

    The more I read about extreme fundie families, where girls aren’t even permitted to express food preferences… the more grateful I am to have grown up in a time, place, and family where all of that was utterly alien.

    I don’t care for raw green beans. I like them steamed until they’re a bit soft, or sautéed with garlic and olive oil. But that’s me.

    BCPA_Lady

    And cooked spinach is a crime against humanity.

    I hope you’re not including spinach in dishes such as omelets/tortas or lasagna…? Also, spinach sautéed or roasted with bacon and potatoes is fucking NOMZ.

    Francisco, re squid puppets of the ’70s: There may have been one on Sigmund and the Sea Monsters, but that show was a different, er, kettle of fish.

    Chris, flower flavorings are really interesting in cooking. I am very partial to rosewater when used in sweets, but I’d also love to try, say, a rose-flavored yogurt. And if I ever have to go to Dallas for any reason, I’m going to visit Out of a Flower:

    This exotic confectionery serves up lots of enticing and imaginative flavors of ice cream such as rose geranium blossom, French lavender, red ginger and red port, and orchid vanilla. Palate-cleansing sorbets include margarita; peach and champagne with mint.

    Setar, the first commenter at Greta’s is a champion ‘splainer, and the second one sounds like yet another chump who thinks other people’s rights are an intellectual parlor game and so it “can’t hurt” to be “fair” to the people trying to take them away.

    Regarding “crunchy motherhood”: “If you don’t do everything the way Mothering magazine and La Leche League says, you’re a failure as a mother! But I am soooo not judging you!”

    (Amy Tuteur is kind of an asshole, and I don’t agree with her on everything, but I think she’s a much-needed correction to the shit-tons of mother/child woo out there.)

  146. says

    Fossil Fishy,
    If I could, I would give you and your family a GINORMOUS hug. Your post was so touching.

    I love this place simply because it’s free of the mommy wars crapola. I know that I can talk about my plans and choices and I will receive advice and support, not judgement. And that means the world to me right now.

  147. Matt Penfold says

    Chris, flower flavorings are really interesting in cooking. I am very partial to rosewater when used in sweets, but I’d also love to try, say, a rose-flavored yogurt.

    Rosewater can be used in mild curries as well. Kormas quite often have rosewater added.

  148. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    mehitabel: Yup. I’d call it myth busted.

    Luckily, all’s well that ends well, even if you can’t sue the Air Force for its incompetent medical idiots. The pitocin might have played some role or no role at all, but it doesn’t matter since OldestSon suffered no ill effects after birth and is a healthy, happy, productive and law-abiding member of society. :)

    Guess it’s time to get some actual work done. The fun never ends…

  149. says

    Spinach is awesome this time of year, when it’s still young and fresh (well, at least where I live) as a salad. Add something like roasted pine nuts and olive oil (or what the hell, whatever you want) and that’s pretty much it. Lovely. :)

  150. mehitabel, wotthehell wotthehell says

    BCPA_Lady: Smiles, congratulations, and hugs if you want them to you about OldestSon. And many thanks for the help. But I see that I missed your spinach remark before, and we may have to become sworn enemies, or develop some sort of rift, possibly a deep one. Alas, so soon! Spinach enchiladas are no crime! Far from it, they are works of art. Canned spinach on the other hand…

  151. says

    FossilFishy
    Thank you for sharing your story.
    I’m sorry that the birth went a bit wahoonie-shaped, but I’m glad that all went well. After all, birth is just 1 day out of a few thousand you’re hopefully going to spend with your child.
    I think the problem starts with women being told that interventions are bad.
    That idea stems from a deeply misogynistic background, even though most people are not aware of it. It stems from the idea that pooping out children is what women are for and that all the stress and the pain are necessary (remember Eve and the apple? her fault).
    Nobody would ever spew such a bullshit about any other area of health. Nobody would suggest that you have to make it through a wisdom-tooth extraction without pain-management.
    Nobody would say that the pain you have in an apendicitis is an important and essential part of it.
    Many interventions like epidurals and picotin are often solely beneficial for the well-being of the mother and that’s where you get a big push-back. Can’t have women have pain-free births.
    Most clinics and doctors don’t do breeches for good reasons. They have a high risk for complications. Basically they’re not worth the risk.
    I had low-intervention births, so to speak. With #1 I got the antibiotics IV because of Strep and I had an epistiotomy. I wanted an epidural but I didn’t have time (about 75min from water broke to kid out). With the little one the midwife offered me picotin to speed things up. I knew I didn’t need to speed things up, but I said yes please. Less than 45 min of labour and an easy birth.
    But I don’t feel glad about the pain and the vaginal birth. I’m just happy I have the two little monsters running around.

  152. keenacat says

    Spinach –> pizza. ’nuff said.
    There are few things a good pizza with spinach, feta cheese and garlic can’t fix.

    Salad: Spinach salat never goes without bacon and grilled mushrooms at my house.

    Having babies: I was planning to get preggers in about two or three years… Was really looking forward to it, too. Blech. I hope I’ll find someone to start a family before I get too old. :(

  153. says

    Every day there’s more campaign finance news to depress me.

    We all know that Scott Walker, Republican Governor of Wisconsin, bought his way out of a recall election by outspending the Democratic candidate ten to one. Link. With spending like that, plus several more months of campaigning available to him, Walker should have won by a landslide. He didn’t. But that’s really no consolation. The real lesson was that election results can be bought if you have enough cash.

    Walker stripped collective bargaining rights from public sector unions, gave tax breaks to rich people, and lied about balancing the state budget (he used mortgage relief monies for other purposes). He made his campaign a national referendum on Republican help-the-one-percenters, and on the idea that recall elections are evil. He filled the airwaves with propaganda. He won.

    According to recent campaign finance filings, Romney’s pulled in $37.1 million from financial-sector donors. Obama got only $4.8 million from the financial sector. Wall Street plans to buy the election for Romney. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0612/77368.html

    If Wall Street needs help buying the election for Romney, Sheldon Adelson is there to help. He plans to give up to $100 million to Romney.Forbes link.

    Romney is raising more money than Obama. This is fucking sad, but the very people who suffered the most in the recession are going to have to send millions of tiny donations Obama’s way if we don’t want to be stuck with a brain damaged guy who doesn’t recognize a lie when he tells one.

    The middle class lost 40% of their wealth. http://blogcritics.org/politics/article/middle-class-wipeout-median-household-net/

    Income inequality is getting worse. And poor people, seniors, minorities, students and others likely to vote Democratic are being systematically stripped of their voting rights as various Republican-controlled states reduce early voting, require I.D.s not previously required, use inaccurate lists to purge voters off the roles (Florida), and say a concealed-carry permit is acceptable I.D. while a student’s university I.D. (Texas) is not acceptable.

    Unfortunately, it will take massive influxes of cash to run a campaign that will slow this trend down. We will have to pay.

  154. Richard Austin says

    keenacat: I realize there are all sorts of complications to being a single parent in general and a single mother in particular, but you don’t need to wait to find someone else if being a mother is really so important to you. It’s your choice, your body, your decision.

  155. Pteryxx says

    keenacat: *infinite cornucopia hugs*

    They tell us in abuse recovery that it’s not so much mourning the partner as mourning the life one could have had with their good side. But there’s no way to live with *only* the other person’s good side… there’s no way to get the axle grease out of that cake.

  156. says

    Lady parts and legislatures, another reason to defeat Republicans.

    The Michigan House yesterday passed a sweeping set of anti-abortion bills. In the video above, sent around by House Democrats, you’ll see an example of Democrats trying to soften the bills with amendments and getting gaveled down. You’ll also find this exchange:

    Democratic Representative Lisa Brown: I have not asked you to adopt and adhere to my religious beliefs. Why are you asking me to adopt yours? And finally, Mr. Speaker, I’m flattered that you’re all so interested my vagina, but no means no.

    [Brief cheering from the gallery]

    House Speaker: Members, I do ask that you respect the decorum of the House.

    I’m not sure whether the Speaker means that you shouldn’t say “vagina” like that in the Michigan House, or whether he means that you shouldn’t cheer for vaginas if someone mentions them, or what….

    Video also available at the above link.

  157. says

    keenacat
    Should we stop swapping our happy and not so happy childbirth stuff? I’m serious.
    We could also only talk about the gross stuff ;)
    I understand that this is hard for you at the moment.
    But wait, you’re a few years younger than me IIRC, so I think that time is still firmly on your side. Many parents didn’t know each other 2-3 years before they became parents and the perks of being a woman is that even if the romantoc stuff doesn’t work out it’s still possible to have sproglets with a minimun male involvement (although German law is fucked up in that area)

  158. Richard Austin says

    Lynna:

    We all know that Scott Walker, Republican Governor of Wisconsin, bought his way out of a recall election by outspending the Democratic candidate ten to one.

    Not entirely true. The recall was running upwind to begin with, Barrett lost last time he ran against Walker, and a huge portion of the people who voted in the recall – even those who voted against Walker – didn’t think a recall was appropriate without actual legal malfeasance. The money was likely a factor, but it was a minor factor.

    That isn’t to say the national level will be the same thing, but the notion that “Scott Walker bought the election” is far too simplistic and ignores the more significant factors.

  159. keenacat says

    Giliel,
    no, by all means, please don’t. Keep talking. I am working on envisioning spronglets in my future without ex, and this helps somehow.

    Pteryxx,
    that is so true. I guess I am mostly grieving my future with him now, rather than the relationship itself. I managed to get quite mad at him last time I talked to the counsellor and felt pretty sure he wasn’t the right person to continue being with. But letting go of all the “should-have-beens”.

    Also, found this on Cracked today.

    The moral here is not to go around giving puppies to depressed people, because surprise gift puppies are always a bad idea. The point is that a person is driven to suicide by a whole bunch of different things, which build a wall around them, piece by piece, until the last piece falls into place and the wall is sealed so that there’s no way out. Sometimes we look at all the problems that build up someone’s wall of hopelessness and think there’s no way any of the insignificant things we could do would be able to take it all down. But to break the illusion of there being no way out, you don’t need to take down the whole wall, you just need to make one crack in it. One puppy lick, one phone call from Laila Ali, one corny song, one Internet stranger, one old Australian guy asking if you want to come in for a cup of tea.

    Read more: 8 Tiny Things That Stopped Suicides | Cracked.com http://www.cracked.com/blog/8-tiny-things-that-stopped-suicides_p2/#ixzz1xmo5JWAE

  160. keenacat says

    One puppy lick, one phone call from Laila Ali, one corny song, one Internet stranger, one old Australian guy asking if you want to come in for a cup of tea.

    One horde, obviously.

  161. says

    Yet another example of logic-impairment spreading like a virus among right wing politicians.

    Three weeks ago, we saw the first hearing, in which Senate Banking Committee Republicans, led by Richard Shelby (R) of Alabama, upbraided the Commodity Futures Trading Commission for not doing more to prevent this. Regulators explained that they still have limited powers in this area, but for GOP senators, this not only didn’t matter, it was inexplicably used as a rationale to give agencies less authority.

    If lawmakers gave regulators a hard time about JPMorgan’s fiasco, surely they’d be apoplectic when JP Morgan Chase CEO Jamie Dimon appeared before the same committee yesterday, right? Well, not exactly….

    They fawned over Dimon. Link to video of fawning episode, plus additional text.

    Meanwhile, Romney has again assured us that he will reduce regulations on the financial sector.

    A New York Times editorial provides more details about the JPMorgan Chase loss.

    …The senators did not press him nearly hard enough. Some Republicans even praised Mr. Dimon for his bank leadership and let him critique proposed financial regulations, while one Democrat sought his advice on how to fix the deficit.

    A month after the trading losses were first revealed, Mr. Dimon has yet to offer a thorough explanation for what happened. One of the big questions is whether the loser trades were really, as Mr. Dimon claims, hedges intended to protect against potential losses on other of the bank’s positions, or proprietary trades — speculative bets — placed for profit….

    BTW, it looks like the loss is going to be more than $2 billion.

  162. says

    (checks nym – all in order – SNTAU*)

    #76, fossilfishy, thanks – you just made my day!

    #86 kristinec hooray for you on the good final paper!! Congratulations!

    setar (several posts about late night asphalt) that did sound creepy. I can’t blame you.

    #125 Pteryxx, damn she rocks! (going to find that blog!)

    #133 keenacat, those are understandable feelings. Sometimes we prefer the not-so-good that we know to the who-the-hell-knows-how-bad-it-might-be that we don’t know. If I may offer something to think about – how would you like to see this situation play out? If you could make it work out exactly to your preferences, what would happen? Maybe thinking about these things and thinking about how well they match up with the reality you know about your former partner and yourself, may help you see things more clearly. Either you will be able to see a realistic path to reconciliation or you will begin to come to terms with branching out on a fresh path of your own.
    Break-ups are painful and your feelings are totally normal and understandable. You will survive it, but that doesn’t mean you must deny how painful it is. You are entitled to take your time and work through your grief, because you are mourning the loss not only of a relationship, but of a shared history – a part of your life that is never going to be done over again. In time, you will be able to look back fondly on the good parts of those years, while not being so hurt by the way things eventually turned out. ((hugs))

    Argh, only halfway caught up but am being paged.

    * Situation Normal Threadrupt As Usual

  163. Sili says

    Go me!

    Just bottled 5,5 l of elderflowercordial.

    I guess I could still make another batch, but then I’d have to buy more bottles. And I’d have to start drinking more of it.

  164. says

    From Daisy’s link: (Warning, kind of graphic) unassisted home birth?? What the hell? Why would you do that?

    Because doing it right is much more important than having a healthy baby in the end. The major proponents of that crap and of the untrained-wannabe-midwives-assisted homebirth almost all have a dead baby of their own or have watched over a completely preventable neonatal death.
    Even when it goes right, the pictures of the newborns mostly don’t look like neonatals should. A distinctly blue colour is not what you’re aiming for, it’s what you’re trying to avoid.

  165. says

    What a pile of odious mansplaining. Women don’t know the “real” reasons they’re driven away from skeptics meetings. Also, “we need much more data,” which apparently “we” don’t have, and maybe wimminz aren’t biologically equipped for skepticism? MOAR DATA!!! Despite a previous commenter having said, “Uh, we have the data…” NO, YOU ONLEE HAZ ANECDATA!!

    Setar, thanks for going after jerks like that, although I suspect that Greta is going to wag her finger at you for your “tone.”

    Ariel sounds like yet another conservative whining about “ideological diversity.” Waaah, reality has a liberal bias!!

    Finally, how nice that Skeptifem is dragging her anti-pitbull crusade over there, too. Anyone who wants a thorough debunking of the frequently cited DogsBite dot org can go here. As I said at Greta’s, I’d much rather listen to people who have experience raising, working with, and rescuing dogs than to someone whose only actual experience with them is having been attacked by one.

  166. Brownian says

    Threadrupt, and I’m on a productive roll today, so I’m not staying.

    But I bought the iOS game Waking Mars last night, and it’s pretty fun. You play an explorer on Mars who has to navigate a complex underground cavern by learning about and manipulating Martian flora and fauna to create ecosystems of a sort. It’s reminiscent of the Logic Factory’s 1997 The Tone Rebellion in some aspects, particularly the visuals, if not at all the same in terms of gameplay. Here’s a good review.

    Bonus: while the player character is male, none of the (two, so far, and probably only) human characters in the story are white.

  167. says

    #184, fossilfishy, this was so moving. I send congratulations (belated, but sincere) to you and your wife for a successful delivery of a beautiful child. I treasure stories like this coming from a father/man because it restores my often wavering faith in humanity.

    Do you write a blog? Your writing – apart from the moving subject matter – is fantastic.

  168. says

    Not entirely true. The recall was running upwind to begin with, Barrett lost last time he ran against Walker, and a huge portion of the people who voted in the recall – even those who voted against Walker – didn’t think a recall was appropriate without actual legal malfeasance. The money was likely a factor, but it was a minor factor.

    Sort of true, but not entirely true.

    Walker used a lot of that $30 million to push the the concept that the recall was inappropriate. One can argue about whether or not Scott Walker met the criteria for recall. I think he did.

    State Rep. Robin Vos, R-Burlington, this past legislative session proposed a constitutional amendment limiting recalls to officials to those charged with serious crimes or ethical violations to be recalled.

    Nineteen states allow recalls of state officials, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures, which provides research and support for lawmakers and legislative staff.

    Only eight states list specific grounds for recall.

    Meanwhile, Walker may still be taken to court over funds that went missing from Operation Freedom.

    Meanwhile, lots of people are looking into Walker’s oft-repeated lie that he balanced the Wisconsin budget.

    …the Walker administration quietly certified to the federal government on Dec. 29 that the state had a deficit….

    How can the Walker administration say that the 2011-’13 state budget is both balanced and in deficit?…

    There are a lot of questions about Walker’s job numbers as well.

    From Live Leak http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ecf_1329360113

    Scott Walker’s balanced budget needs more money to be balanced, but instead of admitting he needs new revenue sources to fix the gap, Mr. Walker is going to steal from the mortgage settlement to fix his problem.

    …all he had to do was ask his Republican friend in the Attorney Generals Office to help him. With the help of the Attorney General Office, Scott Walker is going to take to $26 million from the mortgage settlement to help balance the Wisconsin’sbudget.

    Scott Walker the “CEO of Wisconsin” didn’t use Generally Accepted Accounting Practices, or otherwise known as GAAP to balance the budget. [Might want to ask 'Tis Himself about this.] Mr. Walker promised to use GAAP to balance the state budget, but that was just a campaign
    promise…

    Mr. Walker did balance the budget using the cash accounting method. This is the method used by small businesses because it is very basic, money comes in and money goes out, and don’t have to account future debts, not until they are due. The IRS doesn’t allow business with gross receipts of more than five million dollars to use this method. …A real CEO that acted like Scott Walker would also spend time in jail for cooking the books and lying to shareholders (taxpayers) about the
    financial well being of the corporation(state)….

    Walker spent $5.7 million on a voter ID bill. He spent $3 million on a concealed-carry law.

    He plans to end corporate income tax in Wisconsin: http://www.onewisconsinnow.org/press/walkers-latest-15-billion-promise-end-corporate-income-tax.html

    Scott walker did reduce funds for public education, while giving wealthy Wisconsonites about $140 million in tax breaks. You can argue about whether or not there would be more money for education if the tax breaks had not been given. There’s not a direct correlation.

    There’s also the point that states without “Right to Work” laws lose corporate investment to states that bust unions (i.e., have Right to Work laws). I don’t think this rush to the lowest common denominator when it comes to pay and working conditions is a good excuse for busting unions.

    Walker has hired unqualified relatives of lobbyists for high-ranking state jobs.

  169. says

    Giliell,
    You know, in no way does “choosing to deliver your baby by yourself in the toilet” fit my definition of doing it the right way. (But I know that you understand that!)

    *sigh* I want as many options as possible open to me (and other pregnant woman), but some choices are just reckless and stupid. Sorry if there’s any crunchy granola DIYers out there, but that shit is wrong.

  170. Pteryxx says

    And in case anyone missed it, the *latest* pile of atheist misogyny fail over at Stephanie’s:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/almostdiamonds/2012/06/13/the-great-penis-debate

    Wendell Henry contacted me over the weekend to let me know about conversations he’d been having with the crew of The Ardent Atheist about anti-harassment policies, etc. Emery from Ardent Atheist wanted to take these conversations public, and Wendell felt a woman should be holding up the feminist side. It was another one of those discussions that didn’t promise to be exactly friendly, but I agreed in principle.

    Circumstances conspired to make it such that Wendell went to bat for anti-harassment policies on his own. I haven’t caught up on sleep since Women in Secularism (May 18-20). This was supposed to be my weekend for that, but then this happened. I left Wendell hanging as I ran out of time and energy. And he took care of it.

    This is the result. [ETA: If you're not sure whether you're up for more nastiness on this, read the comments before deciding whether/how much to watch.]

    It’s bad. It is BAD. Points to Wendell though for stepping up, and to Kate Donovan of Friendly Atheist for slogging through the hate to write a transcript… she has to keep taking breaks.

    (This is why I’m behind on reading TET, or Greta’s thread… there’s just too much going on. Which of course means the hate tactic is working as intended.)

  171. A. R says

    Confetti and hugs as appropriate!

    Spices: I grow my own horseradish, but I’ve been having trouble getting any heat out of it. Thoughts anyone?

    Sili: I just bottled some myself!

  172. says

    “Son, I’ll buy you a laptop if you promise not to be gay.” Here’s the text of the flagged Craigslist post in question:

    I am selling my son’s macbook pro 15 inch. He found out that there is going to be a new macbook so I will be buying that for him. I bought it last summer so it isn’t even a year old yet. It is on pretty decent shape. I am pretty firm on the price.

    Just a footnote, I don’t want to get a ton of messages from you guys saying that I am spoiling my son and turning him into an entitled monster. There is a backstory that you aren’t even aware of. My son was committing homosexual acts and got caught in the act. We made a deal that if he chose to be straight, that we would buy him more nice things. So don’t message me saying that I am a bad parent for spoiling him. It’s quite the opposite, I am a good parent and I’m working with him to correct his problem.

  173. says

    A.R.
    AFAIK you need to make sure that it has a constant but not too high water supply. If they have too much water they won’t get hot and if they have too little they grow hard.

    Hi Pteryxx
    That’s a great big pile of shit.

    Audley
    Yeah. i defend their right to do all that shit, because until the moment the baby is out it’s their decission and theirs alone, but that doesn’t mean that their decissions are stupid, dangerous and selfish.

  174. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    So don’t message me saying that I am a bad parent for spoiling him. It’s quite the opposite, I am a good parent and I’m working with him to correct his problem.

    No, you are not a good parent and you are bribing him to be someone he is not, someone that, in your bigotted homophobic mind, is acceptable.

  175. cicely. Just cicely. says

    Howdy do, mehitabel; settle down and chat a spell. :)

    *hugs* and encouragement for keenacat. Maybe make and keep on hand a little list of reminders of why the two of you are not a couple any more?

    Hi, lexie; welcome in!

    Steam lettuce, or boiled lettuce, or steamed celery, are all an affront to (damn, whatever the god is in “The Monstrous Regiment”).

    Nuggan.
    Damned near everything is an abomination unto Nuggan.

    From the same website: Steampunk octopus

    “Unique necklace” is not unique; I’ve got one like it in pewter, and I’ve seen manymanymany takes from the same “original”.

    I’m also given to understand that it isn’t “steampunk”, but I admit that I am less-than-knowledgable in that spectrum.
    -

  176. A. R says

    Giliell: Thanks, I’ve been using a soaker hosepipe on them for a few hours every day, so I suppose I can just cut back on the time I water.

    Og:

    No, you are not a good parent and you are bribing him to be someone he is not, someone that, in your bigotted homophobic mind, is acceptable.

    +1

  177. Richard Austin says

    Ogvorbis:

    No, you are not a good parent and you are bribing him to be someone he is not, someone that, in your bigotted homophobic mind, is acceptable.

    What he’s likely doing, practically speaking, is bribing his son to lie better and be craftier. I’d laugh – hard – if said son was using this laptop to chat with guys online and/or download porn.

    (I won’t laugh when Dad catches him and goes apeshit. That’s not likely to end well.)

  178. opposablethumbs says

    Since the dad is an unmitigated pillock and a miserable shit and a fuckhead for thinking like that about people in general and wanting to shoehorn his own child into a straitjacket, I hope the son takes the laptop, lies successfully until such time as he can escape and escapes as soon as possible.
    Fuck. How can you do that to your own child.
    I know, it’s all too common … but fuck.:(

  179. Richard Austin says

    Chances are, if the son refused the “deal” he’d be punished and/or treated badly anyway, so this was a non-choice choice.

    I’ve known too many people who were never given a choice and simply thrown out.

  180. Richard Austin says

    Ms. Daisy:

    Granted, sorry. Someone else mentioned “dad” and I just propagated it. Either way, it’s a crappy position in which to place the son.

  181. Richard Austin says

    … Or, maybe I just saw “he” for “son” and continued it. Oh well. We’re all imperfect, and I apologize for the gendering.

  182. A. R says

    According to the text analysis I did here, it looks like it was his mother who wrote the post. I imagine that bribing is the first tactic, threatening to throw the poor kid out is probably next.

  183. says

    Richard, no worries, I just wanted to point that out.

    A.R, I’m really, really wary of analyzing text for gender, having been mistaken for a man online before (when using gender-neutral nyms) because I speak my mind forcefully, use profanity, and don’t cater to men’s egos.

    Kitty, I wasn’t saying that just about any interesting worked metal should be called “steampunk”! :D I was giving an example of how the term is abused.

  184. A. R says

    Ms. Daisy: Yeah, I’m wary as well, IIRC, some troll or other used the gender guesser thingy and decided that Nerd was a woman.

  185. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Nuggan.
    Damned near everything is an abomination unto Nuggan.

    Thank you. My failure of memory was, I am sure, an abomination unto Nuggan.

  186. says

    AR:
    Didn’t you know that Nerd is the only woman of Pharyngula?

    Anyway, yeah. Back when I was using my old ‘nym*, all the trolls thought I was a dude. I have no idea if it’s changed or if I’ve just stopped paying attention to it.

    *OurDeadSelves.

  187. says

    I’d laugh – hard – if said son was using this laptop to chat with guys online and/or download porn.

    This would, let’s face it, be only just.

    Y’know. When life gives you lemons.

    (/Or Apples. Whatevs.)

  188. opposablethumbs says

    Oh, I did that too – assumed it was the father, without checking properly. My bad, definitely.

    In fact, come to think of it, that’s not even the only reason it would have been better to refer to their being a shitty parent. It’s certainly shitty parenting, that’s for sure.

  189. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Checked a few more things off the to-do list. Yay! Now if I can just get the rest done before Tuesday afternoon, I’ll be thrilled.

    Re: cooked spinach. Unfortunately, no matter how it’s prepared or how well it’s hidden (believe me, my mother tried) I taste moldy grass clippings. Simply can’t tolerate it. Leafy goodness in salad or on sandwiches, however, I’m there.

    Audley @ 215: I’m always amazed at how casually people are willing to risk their child’s life. I have can’t count the number of times I’ve seen people allow their kid(s) to ride in the car without being an (age-appropriate) safety seat or seatbelt. It freaks me out every time, because I can’t help but wonder how much sympathy they’ll expect when a crash kills their child. (Probably a failing on my part, but my answer is “not much.” I’ll be sorry for their loss, of course, but I’ll still believe it’s their fault.)

    Ms. Daisy Cutter @218: Oh fer the love of Maude. WTF is wrong with people that they just cannot love their child “as is”? Unconditional love is, duh, unconditional.

    I have to send my kids some virtual hugs now…and hang on one more week for the real thing.

  190. laurentweppe says

    (I won’t laugh when Dad catches him and goes apeshit. That’s not likely to end well.)

    There’s a slight chance that by the time dad finds him, the offspring will have grown bigger and stronger than daddy -or mommy- and end up being the one doing the beating: 10% of parents are beaten up by their kids: where do you think this comes from?

  191. says

    Amusing/depressing notes from the ‘oh, feminism has done its job now anyway’ files…

    So, as noted earlier, I usually watch my food energy intake a bit this time of year. This year I started getting a bit more systematic about it. Spreadsheet level, y’know, make sure things added up, web searches to check levels on stuff where I don’t already know, so on…

    Observation 1: the browser and laptop combination on which I do many of these lookups is used by no one else but me. Curiously, the various cookie-based ad services are now offering me dating services whenever I use this browser…

    … mostly for meeting straight guys, from what I can determine.

    Working theory: as far as these services are concerned, only straight women (and those interested in dating) care how many calories are in their food.

    … and okay. I s’pose I might give ‘em a break there if there’s actual market research behind this one giving ‘em some nice odds there or something. And hey, mebbe it’s all odds-based, who knows how automatic, just possibly no one’s fault really* if that’s genuinely an association some very automatic and unattended algorithms are genuinely finding. I guess. Somehow, I’d find this surprising… Seems to me somehow more likely there’d be rather a lot of people of various ages and sexes and orientations who’d find such numbers useful, and this is more some exec who just walked through a time machine off the place that inspired Mad Men just checking the boxes on keywords he likes, but anyway, ‘kay, technically, I don’t know. But then there’s…

    Observation 2: in the interest of putting relatively little wear on my aging joints (and which I will also need for far more important things when the snow returns), and ‘cos being surrounded by cooling fluid is just about the only way I can at all comfortably burn serious Joules in the summer, I’ve been using swimming for part of my aerobic/endurance training. Figuring I could use a refresher on my breast stroke before trying to do it in a lane swim for like forty minutes straight, I went looking for a video advising on form online.

    It’s not like you wouldn’t expect, this, but seriously, if you find a nice video on YouTube on such a subject, and it contains, in fact, women in bathing suits, and you not wish to become terminally depressed about what general shits your species doth contain, don’t read the comments threads below them.

    Amending, actually: just don’t read any YouTube comments threads. Ever.

    (*/Except, of course, insofar as you have to then realize, down a level from here, what social forces would be creating that association.)

  192. Louis says

    AJ,

    Working theory: as far as these services are concerned, only straight women (and those interested in dating) care how many calories are in their food.

    Vicious lies!

    I care.

    Afterwards.

    Then I have a cake to cheer me up and all is right with the world!

    ;-)

    Louis

  193. says

    BCPA_Lady

    I’m always amazed at how casually people are willing to risk their child’s life. I have can’t count the number of times I’ve seen people allow their kid(s) to ride in the car without being an (age-appropriate) safety seat or seatbelt. It freaks me out every time, because I can’t help but wonder how much sympathy they’ll expect when a crash kills their child. (Probably a failing on my part, but my answer is “not much.” I’ll be sorry for their loss, of course, but I’ll still believe it’s their fault.)

    Talk about it. I think that about 50% of the kids who’re brought to my daughter’s kindergarten aren’t in appropriate seats. Yeah, should something happen they’ll of course be victims, instead of their poor children.
    And I nearly freaked out when I lately read an article in a newspaper. Well, it was written by the mother of a boy with disability. The boy loves dogs. Unfortunately the boy neither understands that he can’t just touch any dog nor that he mustn’t pull their hair, push them or hit them if they don’t do what he wants them to do. And she chats away how she caught him pushing a doggie into a pool or pond, and how she saw him hurting another dog and I wanted to scream at the magazine “what kind of stupid idiot are you? That’s not one of the risks you need them let take, your son is not capable of understanding the risk he’s running get the fuck off your ass and make sure your child is safe.”

  194. Richard Austin says

    There’s a slight chance that by the time dad finds him, the offspring will have grown bigger and stronger than daddy -or mommy- and end up being the one doing the beating: 10% of parents are beaten up by their kids: where do you think this comes from?

    I don’t think that’s necessarily a “better” resolution. But even if there isn’t physical violence – from either party- it’s still not going to be pretty. I used to hang out with – and help out – people who ran the youth center in West Hollywood, which mostly dealt with runaways and kids thrown out of the house for being gay. And they were the “lucky” ones – they got away. Lynna’s posted enough about the re-education camps and “conversion therapy” that most people here have an idea of what happens to the unlucky ones (and that’s discounting the suicides).

    … and with that, I think I need to go surf zooborns for a few minutes.

  195. says

    AJ Milne

    Curiously, the various cookie-based ad services are now offering me dating services whenever I use this browser…

    … mostly for meeting straight guys, from what I can determine.

    Well, going by the adds on Pharyngula it’s used only by people looking for a religion ;)

  196. Richard Austin says

    … okay, I didn’t get far, but there’s a light out there in the darkness:

    Officials said Thursday that they’re planning the first-ever event to recognize gay and lesbian troops. They declined to give details about what the event will be, but officials said Defense Secretary Leon Panetta feels it’s important to recognize the service of gays in the armed forces.

  197. A. R says

    Audley @236: Yeah, it’s interesting to see the reactions trolls have to gender neutral ‘nyms.

    Louis: Hi!

  198. Shplane says

    I like autotune when it’s used cleverly, such as here.

    I hate autotune when it isn’t, such as everywhere that isn’t a mildly amusing Youtube video.

  199. Sili says

    Talk about it. I think that about 50% of the kids who’re brought to my daughter’s kindergarten aren’t in appropriate seats.

    Which reminds me that the police usually manage to catch hella speeders on the first day of school when parents drive their kids in because “it’s too dangerous to bike there in the traffic”.

  200. dianne says

    @Richard Austin: I have a story about one of the “lucky” ones that might make you feel better (or worse). I’ve told it here before, I think, but it’s worth repeating, IMHO. A year or so ago, I did an asylum evaluation for a young man from, IIRC, Uganda. He’d been persecuted by everyone from his father to the local police for being gay. His brother had actually been killed for being or being perceived as gay.

    This young man made his way to the US, with his mother’s help. He spent a lot of time here hating himself and his feelings, but eventually found help from a group in Greenwich Village. He eventually was able to accept himself and his sexuality (though, at that time, was still struggling with the fear of being deported by a certain government without any common sense–quite apart from his very legitimate fear of his country’s government, he was the perfect immigrant: young, smart, eager to learn and work…what more could any country want?)

    Anyway. As part of his deposition, he told a story about being confronted on the street by a jerk who looked at him and said, “What a queer!” He responded, “Yeah. I’m queer! And you can’t do anything about it.” Then he walked away.

    I hope the kid in the story with the laptop some day tells his parents the same thing. And, if necessary, walk away as well, though I hope that a reconciliation might be possible some day.

  201. says

    Sili
    To my knowledge, most kids get hurt on their way to school when they’re entering and leaving their parents’ car…

    Oh shit, talk about mysogynist women.
    There’s a documentary on TV at the moment about extended breastfeeding.

    “Women don’t have the right to decide when they want to wean. It’s the right of the child!”
    “Yeah, nipples may bleed and hurt, but that’s what you have to put up with”
    “I have no sympathies for women who give up breastfeeding just because it hurts”
    *vomit*
    They can breastfeed until the kids get married, but just leave your misogyny out of my bra.

  202. keenacat says

    They can breastfeed until the kids get married, but just leave your misogyny out of my bra.

    Bbbbbbbut you can’t decide for yourself, Giliell. Wimminz have to carry the cross of childbearing and -rearing for JEEBUS. And for wombynhood. Because your womb and your wombfruit define you.

  203. laurentweppe says

    I don’t think that’s necessarily a “better” resolution

    I don’t think it’s a better solution either. But the fact that more often than people realize, kids fight back as violently as their parents should not be ignored.

    ***

    Well, going by the adds on Pharyngula it’s used only by people looking for a religion ;)

    Or a mate: i’ve had a lot of “find your Muslim Life Partner”

  204. Tony... therefore God says

    Arghh.
    Backed up on the thread.
    Annoying fly in my room that keeps disappearing before I can away it.
    Laptop sez: your computer won’t start but windows is attempting to fix this problem. Please wait as this process may take several decades (it really says minutes but I can’t use tags on my cell phone). also means I won’t be posting much for a while but still try to keep up. I have come to really enjoy the social outlet TET provides. You folks are awesome (poopyhead is pretty cool too).
    Hello and welcome to former lurkers/new TETers.

  205. says

    keenacat
    Saddest thing, it’s German women. They don’t seem overly keen on Jeeebus.
    There’s the woman who blames bottle feeding for all the bad things that happened in her life and the mum whose doc is begging her to take care of herself because she’s permanently sick and at the end of her strength “but my children are healthy”.

  206. keenacat says

    The extended-breadstfeeding-women currently on german tv creep me the fuck out.

  207. Louis says

    Hi A.R. and Chigau….and obviously everyone else.

    I had a good weekend. A little too good as it happened. I got to go to my favourite pub.*

    Louis

    * It is still a 2, under my personal classification system. That refers to the depth in centimetres of piss on the floor of the gents toilet. Never go into a pub that’s a 4 or more unless it has truly exceptional beer. Or you have wellies.

  208. Tony... therefore God says

    FossilFishy: your story moved me to tears. I’m so very happy for you and your family. BTW there’s not much I consider TMI. Did you wind up attempting to take any pictures (and why is that forbidden?

  209. Cipher, OM, Fighting Fucktoy says

    [Crossposting TET/TZT]
    I got an A in German, despite messing up the oral exam! I was feeling really bad and discouraged today, so this is a lovely boost for my mood and confidence. Yay!

  210. keenacat says

    [Crossposting TET/TZT]
    I got an A in German, despite messing up the oral exam! I was feeling really bad and discouraged today, so this is a lovely boost for my mood and confidence. Yay!

    *tacklehug*
    Soooooooo… you gonna visit us in germany?? :D

  211. says

    keenacat
    What is really striking is how these kids lack boundaries and coping mechanisms. Preschoolers who have never learned how to go to sleep alone aren’t more secure and and centred IMO, but the kids seemed extremely insecure and completely depending.

  212. A. R says

    Cipher: Confetti and champagne!

    Louis: 2cm is a great deal of urine. I’m glad I don’t drink beer!

  213. Louis says

    A.R.

    Perhaps I should clarify. That’s the depth of piss there before I arrive.

    Louis

  214. Louis says

    And Grats to Cipher. In both threads and indeed real life.

    Whatever that might be.

    Louis

  215. Tony... therefore God says

    Ms Daisy Cutter:
    Re: Taslima
    I find her blog severely unreadable. The massive generalizations and questionable citations as well as poor arguing on her part make me question why she’s at FTB.

  216. A. R says

    Louis: You continue to amaze me with your utterly amusing love of beer and contempt for designated locations for urination!

  217. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Giliell:

    Unfortunately the boy neither understands that he can’t just touch any dog nor that he mustn’t pull their hair, push them or hit them if they don’t do what he wants them to do.

    *sigh* And this is how I ended up being labeled “over-protective” for teaching my kids how to approach dogs safely (after first asking permission of their owner) or requiring helmets when skating/biking, or putting the safety netting up around our trampoline. Yet, it was irresponsible to allow them to walk/ride bike to their respective schools instead of driving them. (Very small town, one K-6, one 7-12, both within a block of our house, and we practiced for quite a few months before they flew solo.)

    Of course, this last part made more sense after the president of the PTA hit a crossing guard with her SUV because she was texting and didn’t realize he had stopped traffic. He survived, but was permanently disabled. Six months later, another parent clipped the NEW crossing guard because he decided to speed up and try to get past before the CG (and the line of kids) blocked the road.

    Sili @ 249: Yep. Our little police force made beaucoup bucks the first few weeks of school on speeders trying to get their little & big ones to school. They got more serious after the incidents mentioned above.

    Giliell @ 251: Groan. I hate these ridiculous guilt traps. Do what works for you and leave everyone else alone! Although I can’t imagine bleeding nipples working for anyone, but if you want to martyr yourself, I can’t stop you.

    Cipher @ 262: Congratulations! I took German in high school and only passed by doing alternate projects for credit (like making an authentic German meal for the entire class) because…well, I just didn’t care. I did manage to learn how to ask for the restroom, the airport, and say: “I’m an American; take me to the embassy.” (It was the 80’s. *shrug*.)

  218. Louis says

    A.R.

    Oh no. I see we has a misunderstandingism. I merely meant I turned up to the pub with a mop and bucket…

    Louis

  219. Tony... therefore God says

    GILIELL:
    For my part none of the topics anyone has spoken of has been gross/over the top/too much. I don’t have much knowledge of pregnancy or child raising (desperately want kids though) but I find the information as well as the anecdotes interesting and informative.

  220. Sili says

    I find her blog severely unreadable. The massive generalizations and questionable citations as well as poor arguing on her part make me question why she’s at FTB.

    Have you tried educating her?

    No snark. I’m honestly interested to know if she responds to criticism.

  221. A. R says

    Louis: Oh, ok. [A. R forms visual image of Louis arriving in the pub to superhero music carrying a mop while wearing a cape.]

  222. Tony... therefore God says

    Giliell: I’m sorry. I read your comment out of context and thought you and keenacat were discussing the appropriateness of your sharing stories here. My apologies.

  223. keenacat says

    Giliell: I’m sorry. I read your comment out of context and thought you and keenacat were discussing the appropriateness of your sharing stories here. My apologies.

    She was so kind to ask if they should stop sharing baby-having business because of my breakup. :)

  224. Tony... therefore God says

    Sili:
    I’m having difficulty using my phone for this so when computer is up and running I can link you to the posts by Taslima I’ve responded to. She has not really give an adequate answer to any question I’ve directed het way. I don’t know if I’m qualified at all to educate someone, but when I ask questions about the serious flaws in her blog posts and she provides no response I’m left feeling she doesn’t care to consider another pov.

  225. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    You continue to amaze me with your utterly amusing love of beer and contempt for designated locations for urination!

    Okay, A.R., where is the strangest place you have urinated (and in your pants does not count)? I mean, who hasn’t found themselves in a difficult situation, needing to pee now!, with no handy portajohn or restroom available?

    Cipher:

    Herzlichen Glückwunsch!

  226. Sili says

    when I ask questions about the serious flaws in her blog posts and she provides no response I’m left feeling she doesn’t care to consider another pov.

    Thanks. That’s not good, no.

  227. Tony... therefore God says

    Re: stemmed glassware…
    Sigh…some people are interested in keeping up appearances of sophistication. I see it frequently dealing with wine. It’s even worse when people whine about drinking out of plastic cups. Some are demanding to the point where my eyes roll independent of any desire on my part. I want to tell them: the liquor is the same in glass, plastic or your hand!

  228. Sili says

    where is the strangest place you have urinated (and in your pants does not count)? I mean, who hasn’t found themselves in a difficult situation, needing to pee now!, with no handy portajohn or restroom available?

    Against the Firenze cathedral, I guess.

  229. Tony... therefore God says

    Louis:
    I’ve had to poop in the ocean. My first trip to Charleston, SC on a trip to the beach I had one of those uncontrollable urges shortly after a sign that read”next rest stop 40 miles” I don’t know how fish do it. It was….awkward.

  230. says

    Tony, re Taslima: Agreed. And the commenters she draws… ugh. The kinds of creeps who are against burqas not because they give a shit about women’s freedom but because they feel entitled to see as much female skin as possible in public. Plus run-of-the-mill Muslim haters. Not that there isn’t overlap.

    Sili, she either doesn’t respond or she responds with more of the same, and the tone of the criticism doesn’t seem to matter.

    Ogvorbis, I peed in Narragansett Bay once while hanging off the side of a sailboat, but I don’t think a lot of people would consider that “strange,” especially those who sail a lot.

  231. Sili says

    I want to tell them: the liquor is the same in glass, plastic or your hand!

    It is, yes.

    But the point of good wine and booze is the smell. All taste (almost) is due to retronasal smell, and the temperature of the drink and the shape of the glass has some influence on the profile of flavours that get channelled up your schnozz.

  232. Tony... therefore God says

    A.R.
    Oh I know. I’m not wholly knowledgeable on all the forms of glassware but I’ve read up a little. I just dislike how some people direct their frustrations about stemware to the bartender.

  233. says

    Giliell:

    I think the problem starts with women being told that interventions are bad.
    That idea stems from a deeply misogynistic background, even though most people are not aware of it. It stems from the idea that pooping out children is what women are for and that all the stress and the pain are necessary

    Actually, at least in the US, a lot of it began as a backlash against another kind of misogynistic background: the routine of processing women though childbirth in exactly the same way and with exactly the same routine of interventions, like so many cans to be popped open as efficiently as possible and with the maximum convenience for Doctor.

    It wasn’t so very long ago that every woman got whatever pain med (including twilight sleep) was de rigeur, every</i woman lay flat on her back to give birth because Doctor Says, every woman had an episiotomy with a “husband knot” and every woman was required, essentially, to shut up and not get in the way of people who knew what they were doing. Every woman was required to give birth without her husband or support person present. Every baby was hauled out with forceps, and everybaby was smacked and then whisked away to be washed and dressed and fed and walled away behind glass in the nursery and brought to see Mom and Pop when the hospital allowed them to “visit”. A birthing woman was a child, her wishes did not count, her subjective experience of childbirth did not exist.

    I’m well aware that this kind of thing has not actually been routine in American hospitals for decades (the hospital I gave birth to my son in, 13 years ago, didn’t eve have a nursery). But the wariness of interventions and much of the natural childbirth movement started there, with the idea that maybe it was important for a woman to feel okay about what was being done to her and her baby, maybe we weren’t cans to be popped open on the assembly line, and maybe there were a lot of interventions being done that weren’t needed or were actively detrimental (like lying flat on the back and routine episiotomies). I think a lot of that wariness persists. Natural childbirth gurus learn from older natural childbirth gurus who do vividly remember the days of shut up, lie back, and push when we tell you to and not before.

  234. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    I suppose I should add mine:

    I have pissed over the rim of the Grand Canyon.

    Beat that!

    Firenze Cathedral. Hmmph.

  235. says

    When I use italics I must hit Preview.
    When I use italics I must hit Preview.
    When I use italics I must hit Preview.
    When I use italics I must hit Preview.
    When I use italics I must hit Preview.

    I’ll go and write it on the blackboard 95 more times.

  236. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Heard in the Ogvorbishouse:

    “I am omni-potent! I can impregnate a Dodge subcompact.”

    “That’s how Optimus Prime got started.”

  237. A. R says

    Tony: Yeah, I’ve learned that most bars/pubs don’t have proper whisky glasses, so I recommend ordering single malt in a wine glass.

  238. Beatrice says

    French speakers, help!

    How would you say plot hole in french?

    If there isn’t a specific term I could blather about incohérences logiques et spatial ou temporelles, but it would be nice if I could put it a bit shorter.

  239. Sili says

    Firenze Cathedral. Hmmph.

    The drinks were cheap.

    And my partner developed a winning strategy for five-in-a-row in less than half an hour.

    After I’d spend a good deal of my highschool breaks playing that.

  240. Sili says

    “I am omni-potent! I can impregnate a Dodge subcompact.”

    I see. So you’re the guy in suspenders those pictures with the tailpipe?

  241. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    “I am omni-potent! I can impregnate a Dodge subcompact.”

    I see. So you’re the guy in suspenders those pictures with the tailpipe?

    No. I do not wear suspenders.

  242. Sili says

    And imagine, Sili, that wasn’t even the worse I’ve seen today.

    I have to no doubt.

    That’s why I stick to looking at pornographic depictions of characters from children’s cartoons.

  243. says

    Sili,
    <blockquoteThat’s why I stick to looking at pornographic depictions of characters from children’s cartoons.

    shudders

    Though I’m one to complain. My tumblr dashboard is political and social activism by day (with cute stuff, fashion, and other assortment of goodies), but turns into gay porn at around 6 or so. Here have another. This one is special because after Jewish people told them to stop, they didn’t.

  244. keenacat says

    *whew*
    Got feedback from my doctoral advisor today. He was understanding and said he was sure my personal reasons for delaying my dissertation are important, as he knows me as an “exceedingly reliable person” and he was looking forward to having me back on track.
    Another issue that had me worried, but this is incredibly relieving.

  245. Tony... therefore God says

    Just heard that Maria Shriver, a Catholic, consulted a psychic spiritual advisor for help in deciding whether or not to get a divorce. I guess the catholic church is silent on the issue.

  246. says

    kristinec and giliell re childbirth: I think it is a little of both. Definitely when I was a young expectant mother, the scenario kristinec mentions was fresh in womens’ cultural memory: My MIL was unconscious for the births of her children and felt she had no choice, to her immense sadness. My mother, more feisty, was awake but with no pain meds at all – since she was going to be like that – she doesn’t regret it, but the cruelty left scars.
    I think giliell’s take is more pertinent today with the rising of religiosity – ugh ugh ugh.
    I have given birth to five live children (and one miscarriage at 11 weeks). It was in the late 80s when the transition from automatic interventions -> avoid all interventions was at its peak. I wanted to keep an open mind about meds – I’d try on my own for awhile and see how it went. For my first three children, I was never even offered any pain medication. For my last delivery – an extremely high risk pregnancy which was supposed to be closely watched – the doctor did not believe me when I said I was in labor, told me to settle down and get some sleep (I was in hospital already for the high risk stuff) – I was having twins – one breech – very premature. We had already been through hell. I should have had an epidural for the highly likely c-section. ANyway, he shamed me for “putting on a show” of breathing through a contraction, patted my head and left the hospital. My boys were born within an hour – no meds, no epidural in case of emergency section, nothing.
    Fucking bastard had the gall to joke about it at the 6 week check. I never went back (obviously) This was also the practice that kept vital information from me about the seriousness of our complications earlier on. I was newly moved to a new country and was frightened and intimidated so I didn’t have the presence of mind to ask more questions – I trusted that my care was important to my doctor. But, it wasn’t. The baby is all that is important to religious doctors (and these turned out to be religious – this was before I was tuned in to the cancerous growth of religion in every corner of society). I was literally just a vessel.

  247. says

    Though I’m one to complain. My tumblr dashboard is political and social activism by day (with cute stuff, fashion, and other assortment of goodies), but turns into gay porn at around 6 or so. Here have another.

    Do you have any idea how upset I am that this did not lead to porn? Apologize immediately!

  248. Rey Fox says

    It’s a cute idea, but I think Mr. Rogers’ voice is too nasal to sound good here. Not as musical as Carl Sagan. :)

  249. says

    Heard in the Ogvorbishouse:

    “I am omni-potent! I can impregnate a Dodge subcompact.”

    “That’s how Optimus Prime got started.”

    Haha! My dad had a dodge omni – one of the worst cars he ever owned – wait, it was the worst! That old wankle engine always sounded like a bunch of tin cans rattling around under there about to fall out at any time!

    Heehee points for the Optimus Prime reference too! The Ogvorbis family sounds cool!

  250. says

    Ing,

    Do you have any idea how upset I am that this did not lead to porn? Apologize immediately!

    I have pictures of models on my tumblr, if that’s any consolation.

  251. opposablethumbs says

    Beatrice

    How would you say plot hole in french?

    Something with une lacune, I think. Need confirmation, though.

    keenacat, great news about your doctoral advisor!

  252. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    How would you say plot hole in french?

    Dunno. How does one say, “Star Wars”?

  253. says

    I really think misogyny about childbirth and intervention can be described in two distinct waves: first, when pain medication came down the pike, it was how dare the bitchez not want to suffer. But pain medication for birth was a genie that culdn’t be put back in the bottle, and once the dudely medical world realized that, they switched gears to fine, if the bitchez want medicine, they’ll get medicine, and they better shut up and let us be in charge of it.

    Giliell is correct of course that we have to beware of a cultural creep back into the thinking of “suffering during birth is morally elevated”. But both poles of misogyny are still misogyny.

  254. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    Found out today the Redhead can, with very little assistance, get in and out of our Ford Probes. Makes it easier/cheaper to get her home, and to medical/dental appointments this next several days. Progress.

    And the official release date is Saturday. I think she’s ready to come home. Tried to send everything but the proverbial kitchen sink home with me today, which was driving me both crazy and tired with many trips to the car. However, she does recognize the need for a hospital bed (which is on the way, held up by lacking signatures for the insurance to cover). There is room in our old living room for it, so the house is “ready”, but not clean. The cleaning brigade comes in Saturday morning. Coffee, donuts, and chocolate will be on hand…

    Looks at todo list *sigh!*.

  255. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Le Star Wars.

    Voila! That is how you say plot hole in French!

  256. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Nerd:

    That is wonderful.

    A little scary, but wonderful.

  257. says

    I really think misogyny about childbirth and intervention can be described in two distinct waves: first, when pain medication came down the pike, it was how dare the bitchez not want to suffer. But pain medication for birth was a genie that culdn’t be put back in the bottle, and once the dudely medical world realized that, they switched gears to fine, if the bitchez want medicine, they’ll get medicine, and they better shut up and let us be in charge of it.

    Giliell is correct of course that we have to beware of a cultural creep back into the thinking of “suffering during birth is morally elevated”. But both poles of misogyny are still misogyny.

    QFT I think this is exactly right.

    keenacat, hooray for the relief/reassurance from your doctoral advisor!

    Nerd, good news re the car and getting ready. You’ve got challenges but you seem to be hammering away at them. Good for you!

  258. Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls says

    A little scary, but wonderful.

    I think somebody else beat you to that description, but it is very accurate to the way I (and the Redhead) feel. The next week will be very interesting as we adjust and adapt.

  259. Beatrice says

    opposablethumbs , thanks!

    … or I could just use Le Star Wars instead of plot hole while talking about Prometheus. I’m sure that wouldn’t be confusing at all. ;)

    (there is a question about movies in my French exam and Prometheus is the last I saw so I can complain about it in detail)

  260. laurentweppe says

    Dunno. How does one say, “Star Wars”?

    We say “La Guerre des Étoiles”
    So, yes, we mistranlated Star Wars into Stars War

    ***

    How would you say plot hole in french?

    If you want to sound like your speaking correct french, say “Une incohérence scénaristique”, or “une incohérence”, as in “Le film est plein d’incohérences”: don’t use “spatial” or “logique” or “temporelle” unless your trying to pass a Master Degree in french litterature
    If you want to sound like an actual angry frenchman leaving the theater, say “Ce putain de passage qui veut rien dire” (This fucking passage makes no sense)

  261. opposablethumbs says

    … il y a plusieurs lacunes importantes dans l’intrigue de ce film ….?

    Certaines lacunes sont aussi à souligner au point de vue du scénario …

    bof

    Oi, where are the proper francophones, eh? :-)

  262. opposablethumbs says

    Oops, sorry laurentweppe – that’s what I get for posting without refreshing!

  263. cicely. Just cicely. says

    I got an A in German, despite messing up the oral exam! I was feeling really bad and discouraged today, so this is a lovely boost for my mood and confidence. Yay!

    *high five* and *hug* for Cipher!

    keenacat, I’m glad to hear that your advisor is being so understanding. :)
    -

  264. Beatrice says

    Une incohérence scénaristique it is.

    Thanks!

    I’m not getting any kind of degree out of this, it’s just a payed french course for which I seem to be trying a bit too hard. The last time I started discussing meat industry and GMO – a bit too complicated for the third semester of french.

    And with that, I’m off. I have a survey appointment early in the morning (shitty job, but someone’s gotta bother people with a badly made survey).

    Good night.

  265. Ava, Oporornis maledetta says

    Patricia, #51: That’s shorthand for “I’m one of those people for whom cilantro tastes like soap.” A discussion from the previous incarnation of the thread.

  266. laurentweppe says

    @opposablethumbs

    Honestly, “lacunes” is a pretty good choice as well.

  267. Ava, Oporornis maledetta says

    Why the hell is Vimeo blocking Periodic Table of Swearing?
    &&$*%&#$*(#$)#%$)#$(!!

  268. says

    Cipher:

    I got an A in German, despite messing up the oral exam! I was feeling really bad and discouraged today, so this is a lovely boost for my mood and confidence.

    *high fives!*

    GH:

    Anyone want’s to see a stupid pro-life gif?

    Pro-life and a misogynist. How precious.

    (Seriously, how did he know that the fetus was male? Most abortions are done in the first trimester, before the fetus is sexed.)

    (Speaking of, I think my riot grrrrrrl band is going to be called Fetal Vulva.)

    (Or that would make a lovely Mormon name.)

  269. Nutmeg says

    Argh. It has not been a successful day in the lab.

    Anyone know if tissue sections in paraffin will be completely and utterly ruined if the infiltration step occurred at a temperature 100C hotter than usual? Just out of general curiosity, you understand.

    *goes off to throw things in a corner of the lab*

    (Yes, I’m still in the lab at 9:30. Why do you think I’m so cranky?)

  270. Mattir says

    I have finally completed all the horrid mandatory trainings for running summer camps. The upside of this is that I got to spend TWELVE HOURS spinning and knitting to avoid leaping out of my chair to point out the various condescending paranoid wrongnesses being presented as truth. The paranoia was mostly about being afraid of random people who might be around merely watching kids in summer camp in a public place, and how we needed to be Very Very Diligent to take kids inside if there were any Dangerous Strangers about. Also instructions to call the police at once if you see anyone taking photos in the vicinity of campers. This one I did leap up for and point out that it’s totally legal to take pictures of anyone, including children, in a public place. I’ve even completed almost all the paperwork for the camp I’m running next week, which is sort of amazing since I’m usually doing paperwork the morning camp starts…

    Now I have to get DaughterSpawn off to pound nature-related knowledge into Boy Scouts for the summer (she’s packed an electric razor so that at some point, when some troll nags her about her hairy legs, she can carve patterns into her leg hair and outline them with Sharpie marker).

    @Audley – since DarkFetus is a girlfetus, I have to ask – how opposed are you to yummy-looking but very bright yellow and pink items? I might have, hypothetically, at some point in the past, bought some baby yarn in such a colorway because I thought the color was pretty appetizing and made some sort of item figuring that a baby of some sort might materialize. DarkFetus is the first prospective baby, or either sex, likely to materialize since the hypothetical item might have been completed. But if one didn’t know this backstory, yeah, it would look pretty much like a hideously stereotypically girly item… (I totally understand if you think you’ll receive way too much pink stuff from other sources – someone in The Other Mr. Mattir’s circle of friends will probably spawn at some point, and they’re way less likely to worry about gender stereotyping in handknit baby items.)

    And just to maintain my reputation as a recipe swapper, today was Strawberry Shortcake Day. Hope you all celebrated accordingly.

  271. Cipher, OM, Fighting Fucktoy says

    Thanks, everybody! *runs around high-fiving and hugging everybody*

  272. Funny Diva says

    Nutmeg:

    Sympathy and chocolate for you! And maybe bacon, too.
    Going in the corner to throw stuff? Now there’s a novel thought…I was always more prone to donkey-kick the cabinetry. Satisfying sound-effects, but sometimes hard on the feet and joints.
    Sorry, I know nothing about paraffin embedding.

    Louis:
    Welcome back! I’m a huge fan. Do you have your Order of Molly yet?

    Mattir: OK, that description of camp leader training made me laugh. Guess I’d better get out the last of the fresh strawberries to eat with my invisible shortcake. What? I’m on the Left Coast, I haven’t missed Strawberry Shortcake Day yet!

  273. Funny Diva says

    Oh, and Cipher:
    Well. Done. You.
    Sorry, I never learned that one auf Deutsch. Anyway, *high fives back*

  274. Nutmeg says

    Funny Diva: Thanks. I seem to have depleted my emergency chocolate stash – I’ll have to fix that at the earliest opportunity. USB chocolate will help for now!

  275. Mattir says

    Camp leader training also involved a fair amount of advice about how to keep children from hugging, or indeed touching, adult staff. No kidding – advice included turning away and stepping out of the way of an approaching child who looks likely to hug. It’s like a bizarro behavioral code yanked straight from the imaginations of various EGate trolls, only directed at 5 to 10 year old kids.

    Sure, I like teaching kids to ask before hugging, and not to hug strangers, but I’m not particularly comfortable with the “turn away” stuff, which can verge on rejecting or shunning.

  276. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Thanks for all the nice comments and virtual hugz folks. They’re much appreciated.

    Audley @207. I got into it once with a “Freebirther” on a very famous mommyblogger’s site. The FBer had been chastising the blogger for taking anti-depression meds through her second pregnancy. Those meds were obviously necessary because the blogger ended up institutionalising herself after her med-free first child.

    The FBer’s contention was that the risk of harm from birth defects was too great on those meds. The blogger’s contention was that a child being without a mother because she committed suicide was the greater risk of harm. I looked into the stats because although my wife was not yet pregnant the decision had been made, and I knew nothing of either of these topics.

    It turned out that the rate of complications resulting from the meds was one in six thousand IIRC. A reasonable risk when balanced against a known history of suicidal depression. I dug a little further and found out that the risk of umbilical cord prolapse, where the cord is collapsed during birth before the baby can sustain itself on its own, is around one in two thousand. This is a problem that is well known and competent, trained medical help reduces that risk to acceptable levels.

    I pointed out how the FBer was in fact risking her child at a much greater level than the blogger and was rewarded with utter nonsense. I was told that birth is a sexual act and as such was private, and that done properly it is, and I shit you not, this was her exact term: a birthgasm. I couldn’t facepalm, nor headdesk because I was shocked into a fainting goat paralysis.

    This was a clear case of one woman’s desire to have a particular personal experience outweighing any other consideration. The baby was merely a means to gain that experience. It was appalling.

    And to be clear: I support her right to have a birth on her own terms. But the thing that makes this different from the abortion issue is that this baby was wanted, or at least by implication it was. I think that someone who holds the desire to bring another human in the world does have a responsibility to make that process as safe for that baby as possible. Her desired experience after all required a live birth at the end of it. Gah. Just gah.

    keenacat: I made mention earlier that I’ve suffered from depression and was at the literal knife edge of suicide on one occasion. It’s such a subjective thing that I hesitate to give advice, but I will say that everything I’ve seen here about your coping methods speaks to a person who’s strong, a person who will come through this given time.

    I hope your journey back to “normal” for whatever value of normal you happen to hold is as rewarding as mine was. I can’t say that I would choose to live my life again unchanged, were such a thing even possible, but I can say that my depression and recovery did indeed leave me with unexpected positive outcomes.

    The greatest of which is that I know, as empirically as one can know anything about one’s self, that I have the strength to handle just about anything. I know this because my disease did it’s level best to kill me and yet, I. AM. STILL. HERE. Everyday that I’ve lived beyond that knife point is proof of that strength and I hope with all my being that you too can get to a place where you can see that strength in yourself.

    Nifty @213 Good writing? Uh, thank you. I rather think it’s the subject matter though. Grammar and I have an acquaintance relationship that only requires a little nod and half smile when we pass each other in the hall. When I lose myself down the rabbit hole of nested thoughts and the sentences start to run on their own I tend to spray commas around willy-nilly and escape in the confusion. I do have a blog, he says with a rising inflection and scrunched eyebrows. It’s a bit neglected these days so if you wish to poke around try not to stir up the dust too much ‘kay? :)

    Tony @261. I did take some pictures, including one of the sign. It didn’t turn out too well, I’d shut off the flash to avoid getting caught. The idea of that sign was to remind people that they were not allowed to take pictures of staff members without permission. I can understand that. I did get some good shots of the bub in all her gooey, bloody glory as she was getting weighed and I have a cherished pic of mum and daughter upon their first face to face meeting.

  277. Ava, Oporornis maledetta says

    Audley, Chiagu:

    In the 80s in Portland Maine there was a female punk group named the Twatones. They were once right before us, a straight classical choral group, on a program!

  278. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    In the 80s in Portland Maine there was a female punk group named the Twatones.

    Oh hell yes! One of the woman led bands in the musical community I was a part of were called Pangina. They found great amusement in some people’s discomfort with it.

  279. says

    FossilFishy:

    And to be clear: I support her right to have a birth on her own terms. But the thing that makes this different from the abortion issue is that this baby was wanted, or at least by implication it was. I think that someone who holds the desire to bring another human in the world does have a responsibility to make that process as safe for that baby as possible. Her desired experience after all required a live birth at the end of it. Gah. Just gah.

    That was what I was hedging around about with the unassisted home births– sure it’s your delivery (and as I said, I want ALL THE OPTIONS! for myself), but at the end (hopefully) there’s another little person involved and the expectant mother should take that into consideration.

    On the other hand, locally we’re having a problem with some of the hospitals cutting their OB/GYN departments to save money. The real shame is that this has happened in rural counties, so assuming that a pregnant woman goes into labor, she would have to drive at least a half an hour to a hospital equipped to handle a delivery. *headshake*

    Basically, women are screwed. We’re either fed misinformation about the woojoys of natural childbirth or we can’t access the healthcare we need.

    I know how lucky I am to live where I do and to have the support that I have. I just wish every woman could access the same resources that I can.

  280. Mattir says

    @ FossilyFish:

    I think that someone who holds the desire to bring another human in the world does have a responsibility to make that process as safe for that baby as possible.

    This is the exact reasoning that leads to fetal endangerment laws, with their appalling disparate impact on minority and poor women. You really might want to think about how to argue with the FBer without going there. Hint – the pregnant woman does not lose her rights to bodily integrity and medical autonomy just because there’s a BABBY ZOMG! I remember dealing with this sort of reasoning from medical professionals when I was pregnant, and when I went and examined the literature about whatever the risk-du-jour was, I’d find that the risk was miniscule, the screening test had a false positive rate above 95%, or even that the association between [clinical observation] and [bad outcome] was purely anecdotal and hadn’t been supported by ANY research.

    Plenty of people make bad decisions. Pregnant women get to make bad decisions just like everyone else. Go after the woo-peddlers, but leave the pregnant women out of your “responsibility” pronouncements.

    [This response was SIGNIFICANTLY gentler than I would have made it if I had not known that FossilyFish generally did not seem like a Pregnancy Policing Patriarch™.]

  281. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Mattir: Fair enough, and thank you for your forbearance. I guess my confusion lies in not understanding why anyone would choose to prioritise a particular experience of birth over a successful birth, where success is defined as everyone coming out of it alive and healthy.

    In the FBer’s case a live birth is the goal after all. They explicitly do not want their baby to die, but are willing to bear an increased risk of that outcome to satisfy an ideal of the birthing experience. I don’t understand it, but despite my confusion nowhere in that process is there room for outside imposition of responsibility. Got it now. I didn’t intend to imply that, but I do see it there, now that you’ve pointed it out.

    [drops that particular argument into the waste bin, tries to superstitiously nudge it out of sight]

    In the end I guess it’s about tolerance of risk, and as person who’s risk aversion is quite high these people baffle me.

  282. Mattir says

    We make assessments of risk that aren’t entirely rational all the time – today I drove to a meeting instead of getting up earlier and carpooling from my office or giving myself enough time to drive slowly. We discussed cosleeping here a few threads back – a lot of us decided that the tradeoff between increased risk and better sleep/nursing schedules was worth it. Pregnancy and childbirth are really intimate, even invasive experiences, and it’s really a bad thing to subject a woman’s decisions about medical care to external review.

    Thank you for your graceful reconsideration.

  283. dianne says

    Every baby was hauled out with forceps,

    I don’t disagree with most of what you’ve said. The history of OB is ugly-look up how J. Marion Sims learned to suture some time when you’re in the mood to lose all faith in the goodness of humanity. However, I don’t know of any time or place where forceps were required for every delivery. Certainly not within the US in the last 50 years. Or at least not universally in the US in the last 50 years since I know people born 40-50 years ago who were not removed with forceps. Maybe some other time and place?

  284. Cipher, OM, Fighting Fucktoy says

    TAM speaker who posted on the original DJGrothe thread and was not received with what Kylie felt to be the appropriate deference. I just posted about it over on the thread where she was mentioned.

  285. dianne says

    Re the natural childbirth movement in general, it may have started with some goals of being less sexist, but it quickly evolved into something pretty sexist. Not to mention eugenic. I’ve been told flat out that my daughter and I should have died during labor because I had obstructed labor and couldn’t delivery her without a c-section. For the good of the species, you know. So that I didn’t propagate my inferior genes. Also that I was a wimp for having an epidural for obstructed labor. So much for supporting women and their choices.

  286. thunk = ∫ SQRRAWK! d(MQG) + C says

    Bah, summer’s got me completely introverted. I need to get out and *Do SOMETHING*.

  287. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    dianne:

    I’ve been told flat out that my daughter and I should have died during labor because I had obstructed labor and couldn’t delivery her without a c-section. For the good of the species, you know.

    Holy fuck, that’s cold. It speaks to a level of othering, of dehumanising, that would have me backing away slowly and looking for a weapon were I to hear it in meatspace.

  288. Mattir says

    I have to go to bed, as fun as it might be to stay up all night and pound on tone-trolling bloggers in the cover-up thread. I really think there should be some sort of special award for having been banned on some other FtB blog due to being one of those mean Pharyngula people…

    Also, pro-tip – do not read the JREF forums. Not pretty. Not skeptical. Not safe. If those are TAM’s audience, then I’m not remotely surprised that their conference is held in Vegas or that they have a tad of a problem sexism, harassment, and flat-out assault…

  289. Pteryxx says

    Mattir, thanks for fishing in there. I was going to try but I don’t think I have the stomach or bandwidth for it.

    And yeah, skepticism DEFINITELY has a sexism problem.

  290. says

    Ms. Daisy Cutter #189:

    Setar, the first commenter at Greta’s is a champion ‘splainer, and the second one sounds like yet another chump who thinks other people’s rights are an intellectual parlor game and so it “can’t hurt” to be “fair” to the people trying to take them away.

    Both of them are the sorts of “centrist” charlatans that we need to evict with a hefty dose of skepticism.

    Unfortunately, both of them also seem to have pulled the old post-once-and-run that ‘smart’ regressives seem to love so much these days.

  291. says

    I did get some good shots of the bub in all her gooey, bloody glory as she was getting weighed and I have a cherished pic of mum and daughter upon their first face to face meeting.

    We have a picture of our oldest son, exiting his mother through an emergency C-section. I was going to say I made it, but remembered that I had handed the camera to (I think it was) the midwife.

  292. says

    Good morning

    Fossil Fishy

    And to be clear: I support her right to have a birth on her own terms. But the thing that makes this different from the abortion issue is that this baby was wanted, or at least by implication it was.

    The problem is that it’s opening Pandora’s Box. At the moment there’s woman sentenced to life imprisonment in the USA because of a stillbirth at age 15(!)
    As Mattir said, it’s risk asessment and some women make a different one than others. And most women who go for that crap are fed lies. Something that got me thinking was a Coroner in Australia suggesting mandatory counselling for women who plan to give a home birth.
    My gut reaction was “hell no!”. But on the other hand, this coroner just investigated the unnecessary deaths of four babies, whose parents had sued because they had been lied to, so I’m inclined to think that some form of informed consent could help, like those fact-sheets you get here before surgery.

    kristin
    First: yay for paper
    Secondly: I think that those are two sides of the same misogynist coin. Actually the Natural Childbirth Movement wasn’t started by women who wanted better birth experiences. Lamaze is a guy. Rudolf Steiner is a guy. They don’t empower women and they’re just as bad as the “do as I say, bitch” crowd 50 years ago. Because they don’t offer women choice. They only respect the choice they approve of.
    BTW, there’s zero evidence that labouring on your back is detrimental or that doing so on hands and knees is good. That doesn’t mean you should have to do either, but think about this tiny bit: If you get an epidural, you obviously can’t push the baby out running, so those two things get connected as detrimental and bad.
    As bad as “old fashioned obestetrics” were, I’ll give them that: their focus was on getting mother and child out alive. That the completely ignored the fact that women are capable adults in the process is another thing.

  293. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    SQB:

    We have a picture of our oldest son, exiting his mother through an emergency C-section.

    Heh. I didn’t even think of attempting that. Too much was going on, though I did peek over the screen at that point. I’m now very glad I got to see my daughter’s very first appearance in the outside world but at the time it was pretty startling. Her head got stuck in the incision and the Dr. had to put a bit of muscle into his pull to get her fully out. It was “Yikes!” at the time, but on later reflection it was obviously a whole lot gentler than vaginal birth would have been.

    Gilielle: Oh yes, Mattir set me straight and I thank her, and now you, for it. One of the most aggravating things about privilege blindness is how even when you’re aware of it, it still can repeatably trip you up. It’s like wandering around in a lightless house, you’re choices are to get used to sore shins or to never move at all. :)

    Informed consent seems like a good idea so long as the information is backed up by proper science. But as Mattir pointed out there’s a great deal of distortion and ignorance in this area.

  294. says

    Fossil Fishy
    Yes, that’s why I was thinking of those pages you get in Germany. I don’t know if something like that exists elsewhere, but here you have to read and sign a document and discuss it with your doctor (still woefully inadequate because most people don’t understand “medical”) which has the actual facts and numbers on them, like that the risk of complications with an epidural is 1 in 200.000 and such.
    Of course it would help if people would actually understand probabilities. They would buy a lottery-ticket for a bug because with a chance of 1:200 they could win 200, but they refuse a c-section because they think that a 1:200 chance of having a dead baby with a vaginal birth is small.

    Fun fact: In our birth preparation class (we chose one for both partners), the midwives told all those expecting dads that should they faint during delivery or C-section that people would just gently step around them.

  295. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    the midwives told all those expecting dads that should they faint during delivery or C-section that people would just gently step around them.

    Heh. In our class they told the story of how it was the nurses at the hospital who convinced the doctors and administrators that fathers should be allowed in the birthing room.

    Unfortunately, the first dad allowed that honour fainted, hit his head, and suddenly they had two patients to deal with. IIRC it was another year before they managed to convince the-powers-that be to try again. Progress, it’s never smooth is it?

    I don’t doubt for a second that we signed some kind of informed consent document. You’ve got me curious now, I’ll have to go digging to see if it’s in our birth/baby folder with the post natal eat/excrete diary and such like. Anyway, if it does exist the details of it didn’t register with me at the time, and as I said up thread, I take full responsibility for that omission.

  296. keenacat says

    Fossil Fishy,
    thank you so much for your story. I will write a longer post about my battle with depression tonight, after I get back from the spa with my mom (hooray).

    And please don’t feel like I’m piling on, but on battling FBers:
    You can not criticize her choices on grounds of the babby, as was pointed out to you already. How very much it might pain us to see babies die unnecessary, don’t forget that a good chunk of the anti-choice movement operates on this sort of pain.
    You can, however, criticize those people because the are lying to other women about how safe it is to freebirth/homebirth. You can criticize them for borking their risk assessment on untrue facts and endangering other women who might have made another risk assessment if they weren’t lied to.

  297. Louis says

    When my wife had our son she had a (planned) C-section. He was in breach position with the placenta over the cervix end of her uterus. Vaginal birth would have likely resulted in his and her death (from what I was told, IANAObstetrician). Basically, the awkward little fucker was stood on the placenta with his arms bracing himself against the inner wall of his comfy palace and he wasn’t coming out EVAR!

    I watched the whole C-section live and my wife watched it on a TV screen, we were both too curious (and geeky) not to. It was very cool, I’m not a Blood ‘n’Guts™ fan but I have to confess a certain level of interest in this procedure!

    Luckily neither of us have encountered too many of the hippy-dippy-oh-but-isn’t-forcing-a-large-melon-with-limbs-out-of-your-hoohoo-magical brigade, but if we had, the verbal shellacking they would have gotten would be at least a level 3, possibly 4.

    One day I hope we live in a world where women’s choices about themselves are just that; every day, unremarkable choices. Want an abortion, hey, it’s your body, your right. Want a home birth with dolphin noises and a hand woven wicker birthing pool made from organic bamboo and specially locally sourced bumfluff? Go for it. Want a hospital birth with double drugs and extra gas and air for the father/attendant birth partner/other mother/party guests? Have two!

    And Dianne, had I been present when someone said that to my wife…hell if someone said that to anyone…I would have offered that someone a similar choice of their own. With some venom!

    Louis

  298. Louis says

    Addendum to my above:

    I support the right for women to chose their own birthing practise/process as long as it’s medically feasible and supported. I.e. there’s a qualified midwife there to shift things to a hospital if needed and the relevant medics have cleared the expectant mother and infant for such a process. I obviously support the informed consent angle.

    It’s very much a class thing here in the UK. Home/”alternative” births are a very middle class/trendy thing to do. They are “aspirational”….yes…I know…

    Louis

  299. says

    Hell, I’m writing on my dad’s computer. Not only is this thing slow, I also can’t remember the last time I typed at a real keyboard.

    BCPA_Lady

    Well, yeah, common sense isn’t really common. I also thought that things like “ask dog owners, wear a helmet and a seatbelt”are just what you do, but my daughter is also about the only child in our estate who wears a helmet on her running bike.
    But it’s nice to see the reaction of adults on biciles when they hear hear exclaim loudly “Look!They’re not wearing a helmet, that’s dangerous!”

    Natural Birth Movement
    Well, they’ve all forgotten about the fakt that it’s very natural for women and children to die in childbirth.
    I fiercly support their right to choose. I don’t support their choices. Some choices are simply stupid choices.

    I support the right for women to chose their own birthing practise/process as long as it’s medically feasible and supported.

    No, Louis, don’t go there.
    No “right to choose as long as they do what I find reasonable.”
    I fully support fierce legislation for people who claim to be profesionals and who support these women (and lie to them, and who cover up their crimes, who are not insured against malpractise and such).
    But you can’t make any rules about this that won’t throw innocent women under the bus, like scared and desperate women who give birth in secret because they can’t tell anybody, like women who have very rapid births. Because the average 10 hours for the first child include the woman who went on for 24 hours and me.

    Something else about care-providers: They don’t only have to think about you and your baby, but also about themselves. In our preparation class the midwives swapped birth-stories, too. One was very short: he was a breech and therefore we had a c-section. Greatly reinforced my trust in them. The otherone is a midwife married to an OB/Gyn, so, although she had her own birth team, there were two professionals there. nd she had a long labour and little progress. They decided not to have a c-section and wait. Because they were professionals who knew the risks and made their own asessments. But she also said that with any client she’d strongly recommend a c-section at that point, because the average parents can’t make the asessment like they did and she didn’t want to be responsible if things go wahoonie-shaped. She could take that risk for herself, but not for somebody else.

  300. says

    MDC:

    Setar, thanks for going after jerks like that, although I suspect that Greta is going to wag her finger at you for your “tone.”

    I actually doubt it, considering that I only inched close to ‘invective’ when dealing with the anti-choicer, and even then I made sure to hammer my point about how they were using false balance charlatanery. And even then, I was still way more generous than I would have been here.

    As far as my response to Ariel goes, the only finger-wagging for ‘tone’ I could possibly get on that one is for daring to say that history supports liberalism. Because that’s just me being a tribalist who hates conservatives.

    My only real issue is that both those posters ran off, so I don’t get to expand on my points at all, nor do I get to watch a “centrist” get the skeptical deconstruction they deserve.

  301. opposablethumbs says

    First time I went into labour, we were down the pub. (well, when I say “went into labour” I actually mean “started having contractions” – there were hours to go yet). So we finished our drinks (I was averaging a half of cider about once a month, iirc – I just stopped wanting to drink all on my body’s own, without any conscious interference from me) and walked home.

    I found out afterwards that the publican, who happened to have my face in his field of vision at the time, almost shat himself. He thought I was going to drop the sprog right there in the lounge bar or on the pool table or something. Oh how we laughed.

    (Epidurals are BRILLIANT btw, though it’s a bloody nuisance that they limit your physical control. Second-and-last time around I had a “walking epidural”, which was great as you can position yourself freely. What I hadn’t realised, though, is that the “walking” kind don’t block pain from the last stage (forgotten the proper term) but at least that stage didn’t last long. (“Domino” – not a bad arrangement, I suppose, to be with a midwife in charge of care – with whom you’ve discussed everything beforehand – but having an obstetrician just down the hall in case of emergencies.)

  302. Cipher, OM, Fighting Fucktoy says

    Littlewoman is back, if someone else wants a chew toy. It’s not been a good night for me. I hit one of those triggers that’s like a Dementor’s Kiss, used rage to power through it, and then read that little shit’s post. I can’t deal.

  303. says

    opposablethumbs

    (“Domino” – not a bad arrangement, I suppose, to be with a midwife in charge of care – with whom you’ve discussed everything beforehand – but having an obstetrician just down the hall in case of emergencies.)

    That’s very much the German system. Midwives (and thereby I mean trained professionals) are actually the only caregivers allowed to “conduct” a birth. They’ll call the Ob/Gyn when things get busy (no use having them stand around for 8+ hourse while you’re busy dilating). For #1, the doc poked in his nose every once in a while and then went back to whatever he was doing. For the little one, he missed it.
    Hihi, I suppose the publician only knew birth from TV, where the first contraction means that women start screaming and need to be brought to a hospital with an ambulance.

  304. Louis says

    Giliell,

    I don’t think I said that women have the right to choose as long as what they do is what *I* find reasonable (far from it), but as long as it’s medically reasonable. After all, pretty much every patient (barring psychiatric patients under certain extreme conditions) has some say in their treatment, at least here in the UK.

    If you’re talking about legislation against “bullshit in birthing practise” then you (should) know I’m going to support that 100%. Obviously woo-practitioners of all stripes should be stomped on heavily.

    So what are you saying, that non-medically attended births should be outlawed? Because I’m doubting we’ll differ vastly here tbh.

    Louis

  305. Tony... therefore God says

    BCPA:

    microwave popcorn tastes sugary

    When I was watching Buffy reruns on FX years ago, I remember eating some popcorn and thinking it tasted funny. I got through half the bag and just couldn’t eat any more (I like my popcorn not sweet). It was sometime the next day that I discovered it was kettle corn. Blecchh.

    And cooked spinach is a crime against humanity.

    I’ve found wilted spinach can be tasty. Fully cooked though, that texture thing rears its head again. Ick.
    I *so* love a spinach salad though. Especially with a fresh vinaigrette, a few sunflower seeds, bacon (the real stuff, not imitation), sliced red onions, boiled egg whites, and sliced carrots. Oh, and lightly blackened salmon (skin on, with a slight char).
    __
    Patricia:

    unclean (sliced ham)

    So we’ve got evil spices and now unclean meat (I’ve never heard of that). What’s next, Satanic Soda? Demonic Desserts?

    __
    Chris @ 97:

    But I like dark chocolate and broccoli!

    Together?

    It is a section between a rockery and a driveway that I grow rosemary, lavender, thyme, and winter savory. I do have bronze fennel, but it is in the rose garden because it is tall (but it tastes too much like licorice, which I hate, so it is grown only for looks).

    I’ve never heard of winter savory (and I’m with you on fennel; that’s why I can’t drink Jagermeister) what does it taste like?

    @110:

    We supertasters will keep you from drinking bad water, perhaps.

    If you ever come to Pensacola, don’t drink the water then.
    http://www.northescambia.com/2009/12/study-finds-pensacola-has-the-nations-worst-water

    keenacat:

    Today is not a good day. I feel weighted down and saaaaad. At least the sun is shining. I shall try to run errands and maybe work a bit in the garden.

    I’m sorry to hear that. Does garden work lift your spirits?
    __

    lexie:
    welcome. Whattayahavin’?
    Gin & Tonic?
    Lynchburg Lemonade?
    Where does PZ keep the good stuff? Ah, there’s some Crown Royal Reserve and Johnny Walker Blue…(uh, probably not together though).
    __
    Ing @172:
    Whedon did a fantastic job with that movie. My expectations were really high based on his body of work thus far, and he blew me away. The camera work during the climactic fight was just amazing. I really liked Scarlett Johanssen. She got to shine more than in Iron Man 2.
    I got called a ‘geek’ (not in a bad way) at work tonight because I talking about Prometheus and the new Spider-Man movie coming out soon. I wear that badge [geek] with pride.

  306. says

    Louis

    So what are you saying, that non-medically attended births should be outlawed? Because I’m doubting we’ll differ vastly here tbh.

    Hmmm, no.
    I’m saying that for planned procedures informed consent should be given. I mean, that’s the practise we (well, at least we here) have with stuff like C-sections and epidurals.
    Long before the actual push comes to shove (whatan appropriate expression). I remember that I had to watch a movie about epidurals, read and sign the information form (not consent form!), see and talk to the anaesthesist, so that I could make up my mind long before actual labour started.
    I want that people who provide any kind of care, be it homebirth midwives or those unspeakable doulas have to inform women with accurate data and evaluation and that they are held responsible to the very standard any other care-provider is held.
    Obviously, if a woman chooses an unassisted homebirth there’s no such person, but I really don’t want to “outlaw” that because it would inadvertedly hurt women who are not making a stupid choice.

  307. Just_A_Lurker says

    It was sometime the next day that I discovered it was kettle corn. Blecchh.

    OMFG Kettle Corn! I’d totally forgotten about that. Now I think I’m going to treat myself with some next time I go to the store.

    My father got a huge cardboard box full of packs of kettle corn one time. My two friends and I had never had it before and ate the entire box that weekend. So awesome.

  308. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Audley @ 348:

    she would have to drive at least a half an hour to a hospital equipped to handle a delivery.

    I was listening to “As It Happens” last week, and they were talking about rural town in Canada where the hospital had to close the maternity ward due to a lack of providers. Women there are advised to move to [??], an hour or two away IIRC, in advance of their due date. Which means staying with friends/family, getting a hotel room, or making a mad dash if baby decides to arrive early or you can’t afford/don’t have alternate housing.

    Ah, found an article.

    Mattir @ 349: Thank you. I needed that figurative head-bonk as well and will try to be more conscious of the slippery slope in my arguments that can and does lead to punishing women for “choices I don’t like.”

    dianne @ 356: Ugh! I would be extremely hard-pressed to remember I am a pacifist in the face of that.

  309. Louis says

    Giliell,

    Ah we’re on the same page then I think. I can only support these sorts of births in the case of medical suitability and with full info. I should have perhaps emphasised that a little more.

    Louis

  310. carlie says

    It was sometime the next day that I discovered it was kettle corn. Blecchh.

    .

    Kettle corn is a scourge on humanity.

  311. birgerjohansson says

    Ogvorbis,
    do not get pissed while at the edge of the Grand Canyon.

    (I am told that in the English English, “pissed” is synonymous with “plastered”)
    — — — — — —
    We Are Fucked, part 1000: “New model suggests ocean pH falling more rapidly” http://phys.org/news/2012-06-ocean-ph-falling-rapidly.html
    — — — — —
    (Some) Jews had a dying messiah myth a century before Yeshua ben Joseph got his biography shoehorned into the role.
    “The Dying Messiah Redux” http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier/archives/1440/
    Rather like how The Last Supper got edited to mimic the Mithras rituals.

  312. says

    Louis
    Yep, that’s about it. I’m not saying a homebirth can never be sensible or feasible, the examples of women living in remote areas without quick access are an example, but I hell lot of support policies more that would make it possible for those women to go to a safe place for their birth.
    And let’s face it, the Natural Childbirth Movement isn’t about poor women in medically depraved areas. It’s middle- and upperclass women with a better than thou ’cause I pushed out the watermelon while singing “we shall overcome” and simultaneosly breastfeeding my 5 and 8 year old attitude.

  313. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Tony: I like kettle corn, but only if I know that’s what I’m eating. Although it’s best when made fresh and purchased from eager Girls Scout troops or 4-H clubs during Old Home Days.

    Yep, piggies are unclean meat, along with swimmy things that don’t have fins and scales. Says so in the babble. (Leviticus 11:7-9.)

    Giliell: I’d like some kind of super consent form(s) in plain language that spell out the risks with statements to be initialed indicating they’ve been read. The woman would be given plenty of medically-accurate information, is able to make any choice she wants (no matter how stupid I think it may be), and states for posterity that she accepts the potential consequences.

    For example:

    “I understand that [name] is not a medical provider, is not licensed to practice medicine, and is not trained in obstetrics/gynecology and does not hold any certifications.” Or “…does hold the following license(s) or credentials: [short/long list].”

    “I understand that there will be no/some/lots of medical stuff [defibrillator, oxygen, etc] available in the event of complications.”

    “I have a signed, dated statement from [family doctor or OB/GYN] affirming my current health status. I understand that potential complications can arise during labor and delivery despite otherwise good health during pregnancy.” With an additional statement for those who do have health issues to state that they “understand the specific risks of [death, dismemberment, flying monkeys, etc.]” presented by their condition.

    Signed, dated, and witnessed by someone other than the doula/midwife/birth assistant/family friend with 12 kids. In triplicate, notarized, with one copy to be held by the doula/birth assistant/midwife/friend for a period of 5 years and to be presented to [authorities] in the event of complications/disability/death and/or legal action arising from such.

  314. says

    BCPA Lady:
    As far as I’m aware, the specific rural hospitals I was thinking of didn’t even offer guidelines to pregnant woman– there’s very much a “just deal with it on your own” attitude. What makes the whole situation even scarier is that the average age of pregnant woman in that county (as of last year) is 17 years old.

    Giliell:
    I think you nailed it: the natural birth movement is all about economically privileged women and it’s got nothing to do with helping anyone else (unless you count shaming them).

  315. says

    I’m in like writing mode right now. I’ve totally decided the best character possible for the Spirit of Destruction – was originally gonna be a creepy monster-like guy living in the sewers, but I thought one better. He’s now a banker. Kinda looks a bit like Bill Gates – not even remotely threatening. No one would suspect him of being the most evil being in the universe!

    Also I’m happy cause the office of coroner was invented back in Medieval England – so there’s precedent for the one character to be that, as well as knowing something about blood spatter, and also a surgeon (all things kind of connected to one another in a way.)

    I do have one question that I don’t really know so much about. In a Medieval city, what did middle-class peoples’ homes look like? I’ve seen so many representations I don’t know what’s true or not. I’ve seen the row homes style of building in so many different stories, but is that accurate?

    @carlie:

    Ugh, totally agreed, although my mother’s take on kettle corn is better cause she pours a bunch of season salt on it – cuts back on the overly sweet flavor.

  316. birgerjohansson says

    More film nitpicking.
    There should be a steep fine for each case of bloody stupid inconsistencies.
    Like in Raiders of the Lost Ark, they are chasing each other on a road on an alluvial plain, and suddenly they are on a road perched at the edge of a steep cliff.
    And then the protagonist holds his breath while the Nazi submarine travels a couple of hundred nautical miles underwater. (maybe he is the ancestor to Kevin Costner’s water-breathing mutant in Waterworld)
    — — — — — —
    In the second film, they have vampire bats turning up in Asia instead of the Americas. Jeez!
    Velociraptors trade continents with Deinonychus. Old West gunfighters manage to hit a barn at ranges exceeding twenty feet.
    — — — — — — — —
    Speaking of vampires; Considering all the superpowers vampires and zombies have, should they not team up with the baddies fighting Superman or Batman? But that is really meta-weirdness. Ordinary films have enough inconsistencies.

  317. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    It’s Friday night and I’m at home, trying to find a nine letter word using O,L,I,D,G,O,E,E and D. My wife just put bread into our new, very fancy toaster. I know, know, you’re wondering how a scene making social maven, a hard partying, trend and taste bleeding edger such as myself finds the time to post here….

  318. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Louis

    It’s middle- and upperclass women with a better than thou ’cause I pushed out the watermelon while singing “we shall overcome” and simultaneosly breastfeeding my 5 and 8 year old attitude.

    Oh owww! Hot tea does not feel good when it comes out your nose. However, you forgot spinning wool for baby blankies and updating her blog.

    I do know someone exactly like this and, worse, she’s related to me. Luckily our interactions are confined to a single event per year.

  319. opposablethumbs says

    Spirit of Destruction – was originally gonna be a creepy monster-like guy living in the sewers, but I thought one better. He’s now a banker.

    YES

    Ahem. What is kettle corn? (oh all right, I’ll google it)

    And then the protagonist holds his breath while the Nazi submarine travels a couple of hundred nautical miles underwater.

    But they did that on purpose. It was funny.

  320. says

    Katherine

    I do have one question that I don’t really know so much about. In a Medieval city, what did middle-class peoples’ homes look like? I’ve seen so many representations I don’t know what’s true or not. I’ve seen the row homes style of building in so many different stories, but is that accurate?

    Shorts answers: It depends.
    What time in the Medieval period, what country, region?
    Here’s aomething about York, for example.

    BCPA_Lady
    Well, all family connectionsI ever had to such a person were fortunately dissolved. It’s only that blogs weren’t popular back when she had her children.

  321. Tony... therefore God says

    opposablethumbs:
    It’s sweet popcorn with a touch of salt. Not like caramel popcorn though.
    From wikipedia:

    Kettle corn is a sweet-and-salty variety of popcorn that is mixed or seasoned with typically, a light colored refined sugar, salt, and oil. It was traditionally made in cast iron kettles, but in modern times other types of pans are used.

    __
    Carlie:
    I agree about the scourge of kettle corn.
    We need to gather up all the mosquitoes, chiggers, and scabies, and toss them on an island with the world’s supply of kettle corn.
    __
    To all:
    I was about to ask if anyone has heard of sushi dessert (I had not, but I’ve had an idea in the back of my head about rice krispies treats, caramel, dark chocolate and graham crackers; with a hint of Hot Cock Sauce). Lo and behold:

    http://shewhoeats.blogspot.com/2005/05/different-looks-same-tastes.html

  322. says

    @Giliell:

    Generic medieval. From what I’ve been reading, they’re generally ‘town home’ sort of styles. Thin, two or more stories, with a shop on the bottom floor, living areas behind and above.

    Of course, in my world, sanitation is extremely important. The goddess of Creation has used some of her knowledge to say “oh yea, clean up after yourselves or you’ll get sick.” (How crappy would a god have to be to not pass on general knowledge of sanitation and cleanliness?) So they don’t have nearly the problems of unsanitary living – and all major cities have a reclaimer’s guild, basically a city-wide janitorial service.

    So seems like I’m accurate enough with the ideas I had for the homes of a few of my characters.

  323. Louis says

    BCPA_Lady, #393,

    I WISH I’d said that!* Sadly, it was Giliell.

    Although I’d kinda said the same thing at #369/#370, so I’m claiming precedence and will be putting my case of originality to the Royal Society forthwith. If not fifth, or possibly, sixthwith.

    Hurrah!

    ;-)

    Louis

    * You will, Oscar, you will.

  324. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    SQB: There is nine letter word in there somewhere. It’s a newspaper puzzle where you make as many four letter and greater words as you can, all containing the letter G this time. There’s always a nine letter one, and with all those vowels I’m betting it’s some odd compound word….annnd I should say no more lest the authorities see this and come to remove my child from such a hedonistic environment.

  325. opposablethumbs says

    To those who loathe kettle corn; what’s the (main) difference between this and ordinary popcorn?

    Call me a philistine if you will. I am woefully ignorant of proper popcorn appreciation.

  326. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Kettle corn is cooked with a sugared oil so it comes out with a light sweet coating

    My wife loves it.

    And frankly, I’m not a sweets eater but I’m having a hard time understanding how anyone can “hate it”

  327. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Katherine: How long before your story takes place did the sanitation wisdom get revelled? Given enough time the society should be seeing an up swing in population as disease drops dramatically. That’s the thing about real, credibly evidenced divine revelation: the effects of new knowledge would hit societies like a cannonball because IMO there would be little resistance to their adoption.

  328. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Flew to Nashville and back yesterday for work.

    last leg of the return flights delayed three hours getting me in around 11:30PM last night after getting up at 4:30AM to catch my flight

    Not what you want to have happen.

    the in flight wi-fi did not make up for it.

  329. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Audley: Makes me wonder what the maternal/fetal death rates are… and knowing I will not be pleasantly surprised.

    FossilFishy: No, not a word puzzle. Must…resist….

    *grabs pen and paper*

    Giliell: She’s an otherwise nice person and always kind and supportive, but she’s really bought into the cult of true womanhood.

    opposablethumbs: Think popcorn balls, but loose, with a thicker candy coating, and dusted with chunks of salt. It is very different from regular popcorn which is buttery/salty goodness.

    Louis: Whoops! That’s what I get for scrolling too quickly. I note your contribution to the idea and shall now proceed to blame Giliell for the pain I experienced.

  330. carlie says

    Rev – because it’s not what popcorn is supposed to taste like. Other sweetened corn, like caramel corn, is easy to spot, and looks like it should be sweet. Kettle corn does not. It looks like normal popcorn, and your brain says “Yum, popcorn!” and then you get it in your mouth and your brain goes “Oh yuck what the hell?!”* It’s evil.

    It’s a weird sweetness. It’s not like it’s a separate sweet flavor like caramel, it’s just… there. It’s like the popcorn was dipped in a vat of sugar water. I’m sweets all the way, but there’s just something that’s wrong about kettle corn.

    *Yes, even if it’s out of a bag clearly labeled with “kettle corn” on it. Brains are little fuckers that way.

  331. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Rev – because it’s not what popcorn is supposed to taste like. Other sweetened corn, like caramel corn, is easy to spot, and looks like it should be sweet. Kettle corn does not. It looks like normal popcorn, and your brain says “Yum, popcorn!” and then you get it in your mouth and your brain goes “Oh yuck what the hell?!”* It’s evil.

    Well that I can understand. The shock of your mouth not getting what your brain thinks it is getting.

    *must keep dirt thoughts subdued…

  332. opposablethumbs says

    So the sugar and salt are cooked in, rather than just being scattered on afterwards. Okay.

    I pop corn on the hob with a little corn oil in the bottom of a saucepan with a glass lid, so we can watch the kernels pop. I still love that.
    Then sprinkle on sugar and a pinch of salt and scarf down while still hot. Mmmmmm. Watch your teeth on the incompletely popped ones left at the bottom of the bowl, though.

    Right, I’m off out in a few minutes – here’s wishing you all a good Friday; read you all tomorrow. ::waves::

  333. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Revealed? Revelled? Whatever. So long as everyone is consenting right?

  334. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Has anyone brought this up? I’ve been out of the loop

    Michigan State Rep Barred From Speaking After ‘Vagina’ Comments

    During a heated debate on the floor of the Michigan state House, Rep. Lisa Brown made an impassioned speech against a bill that seeks to put new regulations on abortion providers and ban all abortions after 20 weeks.

    Lisa Brown
    Michigan State Rep. Lisa Brown (D-West Bloomfield).
    Brown, a Democrat, argued that her Jewish faith allowed for therapeutic abortions when the mother’s life is in danger without regard to length of pregnancy.

    “I have not asked you to adopt and adhere to my religious beliefs. Why are you asking me to adopt yours?” she said. But what came next is what got her in trouble: “And finally, Mr. Speaker, I’m flattered that you’re all so interested in my vagina, but ‘no’ means ‘no.'”

    The Detroit News reports today the House Republican leadership did not allow Brown to speak on a bill about the retirement of school employees.

    The News reports:

    “‘What she said was offensive,” said Rep. Mike Callton, R-Nashville. ‘It was so offensive, I don’t even want to say it in front of women. I would not say that in mixed company.’

    “Majority Floor Leader Jim Stamas, R-Midland, determined Brown’s comments violated the decorum of the House, said Ari Adler, spokesman for the Republican majority.”

    Brown called a press conference, today, the Detroit Free Press reports. She defended her use of the word “vagina,” saying it is the “anatomically medically correct term.”

    “If they are going to legislate my anatomy, I see no reason why I cannot mention it,” she said according to the Free Press.

    “Regardless of their reasoning, this is a violation of my First Amendment rights and directly impedes my ability to serve the people who elected me into office,” Brown added in a statement released by her office.

    Brown was not the only woman silenced on the floor today. Rep. Barb Byrum was also not allowed to speak on the floor.

    “Byrum, D-Onondaga, caused a disturbance on the House floor Wednesday when she wasn’t allowed to introduce an amendment to the abortion regulations bill banning men from getting a vasectomy unless the sterilization procedure was necessary to save a man’s life,” the Detroit News reports.

  335. says

    BCPA_Lady
    I think I’m justified in saying that my cousin’s ex-partner is not a nice person. She still puts her bogus philosophy over the wellbeing of her children (no vaccines, no antibiotics, no cortisol, no, not even if your child is crying and scratching himself into a bloody mess, here’s something homeopathic). She never married him because that would have given him some legal rights to his children and when they were old enough that they could simply decide what to do for themselves she kicked him out. Would you believe that she got all upset that he has a new partner?

  336. says

    FossilFishy and BCPA_lady (“No, not a word puzzle. Must…resist… *grabs pen and paper*“), you’ll like Quiddler then.

    I think Ogvorbis is our resident Scrabble master, playing SuperScrabble and whatnot.

  337. says

    @FossilFishy:

    This story takes place 1000 years after a cataclysm that wiped out a huge percentage of the world’s population. The Goddess revealed the knowledge far earlier than that, about the time the people began spreading to the far corners of the world. The cataclysm wiped out around 90% of the people living outside of the continent the story takes place in (and about 35% of the people living inside the continent.)

    Population growth has been rather impressive, the people have begun expanding outwards to different areas – across the central sea towards the other side of the continent. They’ve not yet left the central continent though, mostly because outside there it’s a far more untameable world.

  338. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    BCPA Lady: Mmwuhahaha! Excellent… [/Monty Burns] Plugging those letters into an on-line scrabble generator = totes cheating. “Overhearing”, accidentally of course, the answer? Not so much. :)

    The levels are 15 words, good, 23 words, very good and 30 words, excellent. They use a specific dictionary though and some things that I know are real English words don’t appear in the answers. I’m at 18 words and am too tired to continue.

  339. carlie says

    Quiddler can go sit in the corner with the scabies and the kettle corn. My brain shuts entirely down when confronted with letters in the wrong order. I’m not sure why. I love word games that involve words, but I can’t even touch the ones that involve rearranging letters. The only one I’ve had any success at all at is eight letters in search of a word, and I think that’s because it has very generous scoring.

  340. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Giliell: I would agree with you! I’m lucky K. is not quite that bad. She’s more of the “pioneer spirit in the 21st century” type — loves all the back-to-nature stuff while also liking modern medicine and amenities. She’s off the grid, built an earth house, gets electricity from her own windmill, gardens on a massive scale, raises her own meat/poultry, still nursing (though infrequently) a 7yo in addition to a 4yo and twin 2yo’s because “it’s her duty.” She also vaccinates and seeks medical care for herself and the munchkins when ill or injured. Her first two births were at home with a family practice doc who is also an off-the-grid advocate, but after complications with the 2nd she took his advice to go the hospital route for the last pregnancy.

    Rev. BDC:

    “‘What she said was offensive,” said Rep. Mike Callton, R-Nashville. ‘It was so offensive, I don’t even want to say it in front of women. I would not say that in mixed company.’

    That whole article had me doing the “Wait…what?!” thing, but this… Does he think women have never heard the word “vagina” before? Does he expect female lawmakers to speak on a bill affecting women while using terms like “hoo-ha,” “special place,” or “where babies come out”?

  341. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Katherine: I like it! Sounds like the kind of setting I really enjoy.

    I asked about population growth because in so much fantasy they insert some magical thing like credible divine revelation and then don’t account for all the ramifactions one would expect to see because of it.

    Take the lightsaber in Star Wars. If that kind of tech existed, sure, you wouldn’t see too many folks without mystical powers using them as weapons. The learning curve is too steep when failure results in one cutting off one’s own leg, But I can guarantee that every thief in that universe who didn’t already have a silent cmpact tool that can cut through anything was scheming to get one. If I’d written Star Wars the last Jedi would have had to conceal their lightsabers because anyone seeing them would think thief first. [/pet peeve]

  342. lexie says

    Tony – I don’t regularly drink alcohol preferring coke or lemon juice (diluted with water and a little sugar) but I like mojitos and a couple of other alcoholic drinks and hate 白酒 (it’s a Chinese spirit – which I do drink but still hate)

    Fishy fossil – I’m now doing your word puzzle rather than studying my cardiovascular pathology which is definitely more fun but I’m not very good at word puzzles so I don’t know what the nine letter word is.

    Re popcorn – I find sweet popcorn strange and the idea of combining sweet and salty just seems odd but I suppose I’ll try it before I pass judgment

  343. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    and the idea of combining sweet and salty just seems odd

    salted caramels

    try this, you must

  344. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    On another note: There’s an insurance company in my paper that’s offering a Free Will Kit. Does this mean that they are omnibenevolent too?

  345. Beatrice says

    Back from my french oral.

    I almost got into a quarrel with my professor’s mentor… about evolution.
    o.O
    I did not expect that.

  346. Beatrice says

    Does he expect female lawmakers to speak on a bill affecting women while using terms like “hoo-ha,” “special place,” or “where babies come out”?

    The day I heard the term vajayjay (spelling?), a piece of me died. Thanks, Oprah.

  347. says

    @FossilFishy:

    Oh trust me, I’ve taken things like that into consideration since day one. I’ve had to rewrite complete areas of my stories simply because of realizing certain things just wouldn’t work without waving it away to ‘a wizard did it.’ (I have very few ‘a wizard did it’ scenarios.)

    Another thing that makes it slightly easier for me is that the continent is about the size of Australia (if Australia had a big sea in the center.) So there’s plenty of room to grow. I used to have all the cities kinda far apart, but now they’re still the same distance, but there are smaller towns at about the perfect distance from the city you’d need to plop down an inn. I’m now on the stage of figuring out how, precisely, the different towns and cities grew to what they are now.

    Another consideration is magic in my world. It exists, and everyone can cast minor cantrips (light spells, small protective shields, minor wound healings, that sort of thing.) As far as high magic goes, it’s an entirely different situation, requiring years of study to know precisely how to channel it, and there are just some people who can’t do it or don’t want to take the time to learn how.

    Plus, every major city and town has set up wards that cover the city with a blanket of anti-magic protection. They wear out over time, and have to be renewed diligently.

  348. lexie says

    Rev Big Dumb Chimp

    salted caramels
    you must try this

    Is this something I make or something I buy from a supermarket?

    Ok I’m sorry that the whole thing is in block quote but I can’t figure out how to make work

  349. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Ogvorbis,
    do not get pissed while at the edge of the Grand Canyon.

    (I am told that in the English English, “pissed” is synonymous with “plastered”)

    Okay. I whipped out me willie and urinated onto an outcrop of Kaibab Limestone about 500 metres west of The Abyss on West Rim Drive. Better?

    (And I was 10 or 11 years old).

    “‘What she said was offensive,” said Rep. Mike Callton, R-Nashville. ‘It was so offensive, I don’t even want to say it in front of women. I would not say that in mixed company.’

    He doesn’t want to use the word ‘vagina’ in front of people who have one? (This is intentionally gendered) What a dick.

    I think Ogvorbis is our resident Scrabble master, playing SuperScrabble and whatnot.

    Scored a 72 out of a possible 92. Is that good?

    (First time I ever played it).

    Second try (same game), 82 points.

    (No help, just me and my little brain).

    Knowing the non-u ‘q’ words helps a lot.

    I don’t know if I would call myself a master. Wife and just play. We aare both usually in the 700 to 900 zone and have occasionally topped 1000. We’re amateurs.

    Back from my french oral.

    Out of context, that sounds odd. In context, I hope you did well.

  350. says

    BCPA_LAdy
    Well, I could live with that.
    Lots of gardening and an own windmill sounds good :)

    Audley
    Well, “Französisch” has more than one meaning in German…

    ++++

    That whole article had me doing the “Wait…what?!” thing, but this… Does he think women have never heard the word “vagina” before? Does he expect female lawmakers to speak on a bill affecting women while using terms like “hoo-ha,” “special place,” or “where babies come out”?

    Damn, my kids are unfit for American Senats and Houses, and they haven’t even started school yet…

    +++++
    Speaking of vaginas, today the boys at the kindergarten pulled down #1’s pants. The teachers handed it appropriately, I think. But damn

  351. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Lexie: I live in Australia, which means* that I dwell in the FUTURE…Future…future…. All the people who are now relying on your understanding of cadiovascular pathology just called me, they asked, quite politely I must say, to tell you to get back to work.

    * Yeah, I’m paying the odds that you live on the other side of the world from me. :)

  352. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Is this something I make or something I buy from a supermarket?

    I’ve never made them but you can probably find them at more “upscale” grocery or candy shops.

    I can find a recipe if you’d like?

  353. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    lexie

    for blockquoting

    <blockquote>quoted text here</blockquote>

    gives you this

    quoted text here

  354. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    SQB: That’s just cruel. How am I supposed to get ready for my trip when such temptation is put in front of me?! Which probably means I ought to go and do some of the packing….in a little bit.

    FossilFishy:: Cheating is totes bad and wrong….unless you’ve wasted more than 6 hours and innumerable brain cells without figuring it out.

    carlie:

    Quiddler can go sit in the corner with the scabies and the kettle corn. My brain shuts entirely down when confronted with letters in the wrong order.

    :-D My daughter feels the same way. She says she has a hard enough time with words when the letters are in the right order. Sudoku, on the other hand…she’s a whiz while my brain does the mental equivalent of the blue screen of death.

  355. carlie says

    salted caramels

    try this, you must

    Also salted chocolate.

    And bacon chocolate.

    Or just bacon dipped in maple syrup.

  356. lexie says

    Fishy fossil – unfortunately your statistically sensible assumption that I live on the either side of the world doesn’t pay off. I’m an Aussie too :)

    Rev BDC – if you have a recipe you know is good that would be great but if it’ll put you out don’t worry. I’ll let you know how it goes when I finally get around to making it which will probably be in about two weeks when my exams are over.

  357. Predator Handshake says

    Those of you hating on kettle corn: I just wanted to make sure that you’ve had freshly-made kettle corn rather than the microwaveable kind. I also once thought I hated the stuff, but then I tried some at a festival that was made in a huge kettle as the name implies. It probably helped that I was stoned, but there does seem to be a world of difference between the bagged and fresh varieties.

    I can definitely relate to the “unexpected taste” thing though. When I was grocery shopping the other day I spotted some freezer pops and realized I probably hadn’t had one for at least 10 years. After waiting what seemed like way too many hours for the things to freeze, I dug through the bag and found myself a green one (my favorite flavor from childhood). I carefully sliced the top of the plastic tube off (because I apparently don’t own scissors), took a bite, and realized that this green thing was not lime-flavored at all! Who would make and sell apple-flavored freezer pops, and have them so close in appearance to the far superior lime flavor? Luckily the bag also contains lime flavored ones, but I have to make sure there’s plenty of light and inspect the color very carefully before committing.

  358. Beatrice says

    Note to self : always follow oral with exam (now, that sounds strange out of context)

    I did well. The topic I got was media and at some point I started talking about how documentary channels have gone to shit. The example I gave was the mermaid documentary. Mentor said that there might be something to it. I started talking about evolution and how the story about people going to live under the sea is just an unsupported fictional story (I really don’t know enough French to go into deep analysis of the aquatic ape theory), to which she said that there is still a lot we don’t know about oceans and about evolution. At that point I just sat stunned.
    It takes some serious bullshitting to get from oceans are largely unexplored to there might be humans with fins down there.

    I always get tangled into discussions for which I lack language skills on these exams.

  359. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Katherine: If you tell me that you’re putting as much work into character development as you are in world building I might just swoon. Do you know hard it is to find good fantasy these days? Stuff that isn’t just a bodice ripper in disguise or an eleventieth generation facsimile of Lord of the Rings? Do you!? Of course you do. So you’ll take this in the twitching’, sweating’, jonesin’ for fix kinda way that it’s meant: step away from the Internet and get back to work!

  360. lexie says

    Audley & Rev BDC: thanks, yah I can do it now

    Carlie: There is salted chocolate? I will add this to the list of things to try but I’m veggie so I won’t try the others (I am majorly gullible/struggle with sarcasm so I can’t tell if the bacon suggestions were a joke or not so sorry if it was a joke and I missed it I really am just that terrible, if it was a joke feel fee to laugh at me)

  361. says

    Scored a 72 out of a possible 92. Is that good?

    (First time I ever played it).

    Second try (same game), 82 points.

    (No help, just me and my little brain).

    If you’re talking about today’s Quibbler, the top score (which IIRC you only get to see if you log in and submit your own) is a staggering 112 (you get bonus points for longer words).

  362. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    Note to self : always follow oral with exam (now, that sounds strange out of context)

    Seems that for health’s sake you might want to reverse that…

    sigh

    sorry

  363. says

    @FossilFishy:

    For every character I come up with, I write a five-to-six paragraph biography detailing their life up to the start of the book. After that I give them an interview questionnaire detailing things like their feelings about their parents, inspirations, aspirations, regrets, and feelings about relationships (which is freakin’ difficult. I can’t answer personality-type questions about MYSELF let alone imaginary characters!)

    And yes, I stressed every for a reason – I’ve gotta do this for four more characters as of now – two guards, a murderer, and a dead guy – and the dead guy died within the first page of the book. Why do I need to write about a dead guy’s personality?

    Cause our personality shows through with our home and our work, that’s why. And if guards are going to go and investigate his home, it has to stand that it’s a reflection of his personality.

  364. birgerjohansson says

    Returning to Toxoplasma Gondii:

    The whole “let’s invade something” thing is not affected, since the wartime risk-taking will be done by others than the chickenhawks themselves. So releasing a modified strain will not necessarily increase the likelihood of wars.
    — — — — —
    I suggest making a strain that is only viable in people with XY chromosomes and short telomere caps, thus targeting middle-aged guys as they hang out in back rooms smoking cigars and making deals. The resulting risk-taking behaviour will be subtle but significant.
    Fundamentalists will decide to give the snake-handling thing a chance. Politicians will forego checking the mikes are off before making jokes about heebs and n*ggers. And when they go hunting for the weekend they will be even less likely to observe basic safety protocols.
    The result would be a cumulative Darwinian weeding out of stupidity.

  365. Rev. BigDumbChimp says

    I’ve never actually made them myself but I have friend who is an amazing candy maker type person

    I’ll ask her

  366. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    lexie: Doh! Ah well, it’s not like I’ve never been wrong before, hell, it’s not like I haven’t been wrong already on this thread. Mind you, when I start telling strangers on the Internet what to do, even humorously, it might be time for bed. Good luck in your studies.

    Night all.

  367. says

    @FossilFishy:

    And heck. I introduce a lesbian tallis couple on the third page. And they’re normal. And no one bats an eye at their marriage (yes, marriage.)

    (and in case you’ve not paid attention – the tallis are a race of human-sized, draconic mammals who are basically like three parts ADHD, two parts “FOR SCIENCE”, and eleventy-billion parts Steampunk fucking rocks!)

  368. says

    Lexie,
    Bacon chocolate is a real thing. Not sure I would try making it with tofu “bacon”, though! :)

    There’s a candy store not too far from me that makes dark chocolate Buddhas that have their tummies filled with salted caramel. Yum!

  369. Rey Fox says

    What is kettle corn?

    See the immediately preceding comment.

    and the idea of combining sweet and salty just seems odd

    You’ve never gotten chocolate in your peanut butter, or vice versa?

  370. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Giliell: I like most of it, in general. I just dislike the holier-than-thou “I’m saving the planet while owning a microwave makes you an evil minion/puppet of the oil companies and using daycare means you don’t care enough about your kids” attitude that comes with it.

    Also, it’s much easier to do all of those things when you are supremely well-set for life financially (due to the tragic death of her 1st husband that resulted in an 8-figure settlement).

  371. lexie says

    Rev BDC – yes please. thanks

    Fossil Fishy – I like the we are in the future thing besides the advice was good, even though I haven’t yet actually taken it and am still procrastinating and will likely go to bed to further put off pathology study. Also I owe you an apology for screwing up your nym in my previous post.

  372. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    If you’re talking about today’s Quibbler, the top score (which IIRC you only get to see if you log in and submit your own) is a staggering 112 (you get bonus points for longer words).

    Yes, todays.

    First time I ever tried it.

    Meh. I may try again on another day.

    The worst thing about Quiddler is that it’s in English.

    You mean there are other languages? But the Bible was written in English, so it must be the only one!

    —-

    And I love chocolate covered caramels with a sprinkling of big crystal sea salt.

    I can even get them at my local Wegmans (I love Wegmans).

    And I am now on a restricted sodium diet.

    NOT FAIR!!!!

  373. lexie says

    Rey Fox – No, I’ve never had chocolate and peanut butter. I occasionally put peanut butter on toast but I don’t eat it with anything else really. I don’t think I even have peanut butter in the house so I definitely can’t try that combination now. However, I’m definitely going to have to experiment with this whole salty sweet thing since I am completely ignorant and apparently it’s good.

  374. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Katherine: Great, just great. Now I have to clean my shorts. You’re killing me here. :) My favorite author is Guy Gavriel Kay and I have no idea if he does that kind of indepth biography for his characters, but it feels like he does and I want more of that sort of reading. I want it the way mosquitos want blood, the way that trees want sunlight, the way that politicians want whatever they think that you think that they should want*. And I want it NOW! No pressure.

    *Yes, that sentence did in fact make sense to me. It really is time for bed.

  375. says

    BCPA_Lady
    I only say Uglyness, thy name is Privilege.

    Urgh, today I’m earning my dinner.
    I’m sitting one grandma, two kideses and two rabbits of which one is currently roaming free…
    Oh, that means running upstairs and downstair like every 5 minutes

  376. says

    Yes, todays.

    First time I ever tried it.

    Meh. I may try again on another day.

    I forgot to mention that you did way better than I did.

  377. Rey Fox says

    Lexie: Just go out and get a Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup. You will be converted.

  378. Rey Fox says

    Also, wait for the next few comments wherein my Philistine taste in corporate American candy is roundly disdained, and all the good sweet-salty suggestions come.

  379. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Katherine: No. No, you’ve gone too far. Desire has now turned to hate. Lesbian, science, steampunk dragons!? In a book that has careful character development and a culture lacking the sexual bigotry of our own? I hate your book now because my bed time reading is my last unread issue of Analog, which I stockpile for days like today when I run out of new book smack. And there you are, mocking my poverty by dangling, oh so carefully just out of reach, eleventy billion kinds of awesome. Cruel, oh so cruel. I will dry my tears of rage and frustration on the cold, pulpy pages of short speculative fiction and try to dream of a more just world.

  380. FossilFishy (TMI? That's not TMI, *THIS* is TMI.) says

    Sorry Rey. Reese’s aren’t readily available in Australia. I miss them so. If you put them in the freezer the chocolate gets hard while the centre stays soft. It’s like eating bugs made of awesome.

  381. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Just go out and get a Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup. You will be converted.

    I love peanut butter. I love chocolate. I have yet to find any candy that includes peanut butter that I like.

    Just me.

    Philistine taste in corporate American candy is roundly disdained,

    But I love Snickers. And Cella’s cherry cordials. And Whitmann’s samplers.

    Some mass-produced candies are excellent. No disdain here.

    Just drool.

  382. says

    Not on the outside, but around the espresso, yeah, I think so. I wouldn’t call is awful, though. Apparently, it’s readily available in Germany, but not in The Netherlands. He gets it straight from Italy (he has family there).

  383. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Rey Fox:

    Also, wait for the next few comments wherein my Philistine taste in corporate American candy is roundly disdained, and all the good sweet-salty suggestions come.

    Two words: Gertrude Hawk.

    No, wait…four words: Gertrude Hawk AND Junior Mints.

    I love Cella’s chocolate-covered cherries as well but only around Xmas time. I think because that was the only time my mother bought them when I was younger.

  384. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    Oddly, Gertrude Hawk chocolate (I am currently sitting 2 miles from their plant) seems to have gone downhill over the past few years. It has gotten more expensive (which I can understand), but the chocolate is not as flavourful nor is it as smooth. There is a certain graininess to it now.

    And I am so glad the kids are no longer coming home, two or three times a year, with the Gertrude Hawk Candy Sales. With no relatives in the area, it was hard for them to sell. Especially since every child in both valleys sell it multiple times per year.

    I do like their salted caramel with dark chocolate.

  385. says

    Man, this thread…

    Pocket coffee, huh? Bacon chocolate, huh?

    These are both things? I must try these things.

    I mean chocolate-coated espresso beans are among my favourite things in the whole world. The thought that there may be something better still (or even comparable) in the same general category is a little frightening. And as to bacon chocolate…

    Seriously, that should probably be illegal, or somethin’. But seein’ as it’s not, yet, I’d better get on this.

  386. says

    @FossilFishy:

    I’m not even remotely close to examining the awesome that is my story, and yes. No sexual bigotry – seeing as the living, breathing, manifestation of the goddess of creation exists and is a woman, it’d be really stupid to say women aren’t for anything other than making babies.

    And the female character in the investigative unit, guess what she doesn’t become at the end of the book. She doesn’t become the main character’s girlfriend. Yea that’s right, I wrote a strong female character into the book who’s not been designed for the sole purpose of marriage – as tends to happen with almost every female character ever.

    There is a female character who’s designed to be another character’s girlfriend, but it makes logical sense because she was already his girlfriend – but they had a period where they had to break it off even though they both really really like each other.

    So yes. Compelling characters, a progressive fantasy world, strong female characters, it’d very easily pass the Bechdel test, and it’s basically a cop drama wrapped up into the pages of a fantasy novel.

  387. Beatrice says

    Does it still have that awefull sugar crust?

    It does. I would love Pocket Coffee if it weren’t for that crust.

  388. Matt Penfold says

    I sometimes make a chocolate and salted caramel tart, with chocolate pastry just to add to the goodness.

    It would be far too sweet without using salted caramel.

    The recipe can be found here.

  389. cicely. Just cicely. says

    kettle corn

    *gag!*

    Kettle corn is a scourge on humanity.

    And an abomination unto Nuggan; loathed by god and (this) (wo)man alike.

    Yep, piggies are unclean meat, along with swimmy things that don’t have fins and scales.

    Likewise, linen/wool blend fabrics. Which aren’t, in any case, very tasty, making it easily the easiest of the dietary prohibitions to obey.

    Speaking of vampires; Considering all the superpowers vampires and zombies have, should they not team up with the baddies fighting Superman or Batman?

    Vampire Batman? Hmmm….

    And frankly, I’m not a sweets eater but I’m having a hard time understanding how anyone can “hate it”

    Effortlessly, Rev. Effortlessly.

    And I am a sweets eater.

    Reese’s Peanut Butter Cups are dangerously tasty.
    -

  390. carlie says

    Aero bar.

    I have a standing order with anyone I know going to Canada to please bring me a bar. :)

    Reese’s Peanut Butter Cups are dangerously tasty.

    The chocolate to peanut butter product ratio seems to be quite important. The Resse’s easter eggs have the absolute best ratio, and taste the best. The christmas trees are not quite as good, and the peanut butter cups are next. The mini-reese’s cups are meh, and the super-mini ones out now are an abomination. I couldn’t even force myself to eat half a pack of those.

  391. A. R says

    carlie: If you have a store with an international foods section, you may be able to find them there! (Oh, and you speak truth about peanut butter cups)

  392. Matt Penfold says

    I am surprised Aero’s are so popular. I have never really taken to them, although I used to rather like the mint one. Tried one the other day, and found the mint taste very artificial and the whole thing way too sweet.

  393. chigau (違う) says

    Whatever that is in Reese products, it ate’nt peanut butter.
    I like Coffee Crisp.

  394. amblebury says

    Reads thread. Can’t handle the muchness of it.

    I’ve been told flat out that my daughter and I should have died during labor because I had obstructed labor and couldn’t delivery her without a c-section. For the good of the species, you know.

    Gott in Himmel, that’s awful.

    I recommend the English English Walnut Whip, for the sweet toothsome treat.

  395. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Ogvorbis: *big smile* I actually know exactly where that is!

    I did notice the quality had dropped; something about it being harder to get cocoa butter or something and the various companies were trying to have “chocolate” redefined…I think? (It was a while ago and my Google-fu is weak today.) I still love their dark chocolate orange cremes.

    I think every parent in NEPA has suffered through those candy campaigns. I was thrilled once the last one finished elementary school and said goodbye to their sales careers. Of course, right after that, our district decided that they would no longer do fundraisers that required the kids to go door-knocking, in the interest of safety.

    Katherine: Okay, I’m joining the chorus of “write faster!” This story sounds so interesting and I already want to know more about this world and the characters!

  396. Richard Austin says

    Obama’s stated that he’ll stop deporting “dreamers”.

    The Obama administration will stop deporting young illegal immigrants who came to the U.S. as children and who do not pose a security threat, senior administration officials said this morning, a move that could prove important in a presidential campaign that will turn in part on who wins over Latino voters.

    Effective immediately, young immigrants who arrived in the U.S. illegally before they turned 16 will be allowed to apply for work permits as long as they have no criminal history and meet other criteria, officials said.

  397. BCPA_Lady (now appearing in MN!) says

    Katherine: Oh. Darn. And they probably expect you to actually work too, huh. *sigh* I’ll just wait over here then….

    :)

  398. says

    @Richard:

    Yup! It’s awesome. And the best part is that the Republicans can’t do anything about it or they’ll even further lose the Latino vote. The parts they likely were most worried about are gone, since it’s not actually a road to citizenship like the DREAM act was going to be. They’ll still have to go through the steps to becoming a citizen, but this keeps them in the States until they get that opportunity.

  399. Richard Austin says

    Here’s another LA Times story about a transgender child and some of the options available nowadays.

    Possibly too-close-to-home for some, so read on cautiously:

    Just a few clinics around the nation serve transgender children. It wasn’t until about five years ago that doctors began treating them with puberty-blocking drugs to give them time to explore their gender identity before taking hormones whose effects would be irreversible.

    The medication is approved by the Food and Drug Administration for children who start puberty prematurely but not for transgender adolescents. Two professional organizations that study hormonal and gender issues recommend the drugs’ use in certain transgender cases, but doctors remain divided on whether to prescribe the controversial and expensive medication.

    Supporters say the drugs can prevent the devastation a transgender girl feels when she grows facial hair or her voice drops and when a transgender boy develops breasts or begins menstruating. They can reduce depression and anxiety and eliminate the need for some future surgeries, said Jo Olson, Amber’s doctor and the medical director of the transgender clinic at Children’s Hospital Los Angeles.

    “Puberty in the right body is hard enough,” Olson said. “Puberty in the wrong body is really hard.”

  400. Richard Austin says

    @Katherine:

    Yup! It’s awesome. And the best part is that the Republicans can’t do anything about it or they’ll even further lose the Latino vote. The parts they likely were most worried about are gone, since it’s not actually a road to citizenship like the DREAM act was going to be. They’ll still have to go through the steps to becoming a citizen, but this keeps them in the States until they get that opportunity.

    I especially like the fact that the exemption is renewable, so that it’s not a use-or-lose, one-shot option. Different people go through the citizenship process at different rates, but from what I understand it’s almost always slow.

  401. Ogvorbis: Ignorant sycophantic magpie. says

    NCPA:
    Oh, I love their dark orange creams. I had no idea they were having problems getting some of the ingredients.

    What do you think of the Michael Mootz candies?

  402. says

    I see Aero bars a lot in the local (New Jersey) supermarkets. Far less frequent is the UK candy bar I prefer: Lion.

    Reese’s peanut butter cup peanut butter would make pretty bad normal peanut butter, but normal peanut butter doesn’t taste nearly as good in a peanut butter cup as Reese’s peanut butter cup peanut butter does.

  403. carlie says

    Audely – thanks for the offer; I think the Wegman’s a little ways away might have them, I just rarely get over there. :)

    I adore the fact that digital photography means that I can snap as many pictures as I want, but then going through them… urgh. I let a few months pile up on my sd card, and just had to go weed and ditch probably 500 or so. First world problems, blech.

  404. says

    …normal peanut butter doesn’t taste nearly as good in a peanut butter cup as Reese’s peanut butter cup peanut butter does

    Much as Reese’s(es) are lovely, try also the following:

    Take one (1) Stoned Wheat Thin cracker (a saltine would prolly be more or less the same deal, if you do not have such things in your area)…

    Smear cracker w/ peanut butter…

    Sprinkle on a few dark, semisweet chocolate chips.

    Ver’ nice, in my ever so humble opinion, tho’ not quite in the same direction as a Reese’s. Less sweet, more salty, and you can taste the chocolate more distinctly.