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Jan 11 2012

Episode CCXC: Might as well give up

We’re hated. I guess we might as well surrender.

OR FIGHT BACK. GRAAAARRR! RAAAAGE!

(Episode CCLXXXIX: Hope, struggle, and change.)

687 comments

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  1. 501
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    OFFS. Went through our every-six-months third-degree questioning to stay on food assistance, and for no apparent reason, they have cut our assistance from over $100/month to $35/month. $35.

    We were carefully doing okay with the food assistance we got. I have no idea how we’ll do it with only $35.

  2. 502
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    @Irene/cicely:

    But it’s hard to sleep when you’ve got kitty paw up your nose. Not to mention the allergies.

  3. 503
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Note: I really do not need advice on making ends meet with little grocery money. I know I can feed my family ramen and beans. I don’t want to feed my family only ramen and beans.

  4. 504
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    And one for us techo-geeks:

    IBM researchers make 12-atom magnetic memory bit.

  5. 505
    Ing

    “This bill has no vindictiveness, it is not personal, but it is intended to protect,” he said. “I have a wife, three daughters, two granddaughters, and there is no way, if some man thought he was a women and thought he had the privileged or the right to go into a women’s bathroom, I would no way and stand there and allow that.”

    According to The Times Free Press, Floyd said he came up with the bill after reading a story about a woman in Texas who claimed she was fired from a department store for violating LGBT policy by attempting to stop a transgender teen from using the women’s dressing room.

    “It could happen here,” he reportedly explained. “I believe if I was standing at a dressing room and my wife or one of my daughters was in the dressing room and a man tried to go in there — I don’t care if he thinks he’s a woman and tries on clothes with them in there — I’d just try to stomp a mudhole in him and then stomp him dry.”

    He added: “Don’t ask me to adjust to their perverted way of thinking and put my family at risk. We cannot continue to let these people dominate how society acts and reacts. Now if somebody thinks he’s a woman and he’s a man and wants to try on women’s clothes, let him take them into the men’s bathroom or dressing room.” ,

    I love how people directly contradict themselves; reminds me of a conversation I was having with the SO, about how in the X-files, the conspiracy was so mismanaged and blatant that Mulder could have exposed it easily if he wasn’t busy discrediting himself by conforming to every impression of crazed conspiracy theorist.

    2) This is just bizarre. Gendered bathrooms/dressing rooms are a matter of store policy, not law. It’s not illegal to use the wrong gendered room. What are people afraid of in there?

  6. 506
    Ing

    “The potential for pedophiles and molesters to come into the restroom and claim the same thing, that they think they’re of the opposite sex and they think they’re something else, something they’re not, they can do the same thing that transgender people do,” Floyd argued. “[...] We’re talking about society getting picked on by a few.”

    …so why not pass a law preventing unsupervised minors from entering any dressing room or rest room?

  7. 507
    Ing

    Other than the inevitable puddles of urine such a law would cause.

  8. 508
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    Serendipitydawg: Breathtaking.

  9. 509
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    The horror!
    The horror!

  10. 510
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    The best bit of appealing to popular journalism is the quote:

    “We kept building larger structures until we emerged out of the quantum mechanical into the classical data storage regime and we reached this limit at 12 atoms.”

    They say that like they are putting another steak on the barbeque.

  11. 511
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    So what, is Floyd going to require bathroom cops in front of bathrooms and dressing rooms to ensure a person’s birth certificate matches their driver’s license? This law not only hurts trans* people but also feminine men and masculine women – those men and women who were born men and women who have features more classically associated with the opposite sex.

    It’s disgusting, and wrong. Transphobes need a swift kick in the ass. (and I bet you that 9 times out of 10, trans* persons can walk into bathrooms and dressing rooms without issue anyway.)

  12. 512
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    SallyStrange:

    An article showed up on my Facebook feed, and the title sounded familiar. Indeed, it turned out I’d seen in as part of the URL you posted at #407 here. But I think you must’ve pasted the wrong link, because the article at that URL has no apparent (to me, anyway) connection to the NY Times, nor to the whole “Truth Vigilante” thing, nor to Clarence Thomas’ tax forms. Instead, it’s a deservedly vicious takedown of Ron Paul, comparing him to David Duke and pointing out in excruciating detail why progressives/liberals who are tempted by some of Paul’s positions to support him… er, shouldn’t be!

    I mention this only because people who passed it by the first time ’round, for whatever reason, ought to give it a look.

  13. 513
    Ing

    So what, is Floyd going to require bathroom cops in front of bathrooms and dressing rooms to ensure a person’s birth certificate matches their driver’s license? This law not only hurts trans* people but also feminine men and masculine women – those men and women who were born men and women who have features more classically associated with the opposite sex.

    It’s disgusting, and wrong. Transphobes need a swift kick in the ass. (and I bet you that 9 times out of 10, trans* persons can walk into bathrooms and dressing rooms without issue anyway.)

    Damn if my insane mind isn’t firing up an odd memory. Wasn’t there an old Drew Carry show episode where Craig Ferguson refused to hire Drew’s cross-dressing brother and they set up a test like that to prove he couldn’t tell the difference?

  14. 514
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    kristinc:

    I know I can feed my family ramen and beans. I don’t want to feed my family only ramen and beans.

    Oh, but you must: You have to atone for the sin of poverty through your own suffering, and that of your children! </bitter_snark>

    This just infuriates me. I just got home from lunch at Friendly’s with my wife and mother-in-law — no lobster or caviar, mind you; just fairly plain sandwiches, fries, and soft drinks — and that alone cost us ~$36. $35/month for food “assistance” isn’t just cosmically inadequate, it’s insulting: It doesn’t actually help much, but it serves to remind people how “undeserving” they are. Gahhhh!!!!!

    I know this doesn’t help you feed your family today (but let us know if there’s some way we can help; this community has been known to do that), but this points out… again, for the 143,789,342th time it seems… why we must have a guaranteed living income for every single person. Economic downturns are precisely when need the “welfare state” the most, and predictably that’s when “good ‘Murricans” are most eager to demonize and dismantle it.

  15. 515
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Who’s heddle?
    I saw the post but the name doesn’t ring a bell

    Ah, Giliell, how I envy your ignorance on this subject!
    *sigh*

    Yeah. Don’t look, Giliell. You will say “I wish I hadn’t wasted my time.”

    +++++
    It seems no one has polled Muslim women in France to see if they feel more or less in touch with their government as a result of this.

    The government estimates between 350 and 2,000 women cover their faces in France, out of a total Muslim population between four and six million.

    It might have made more sense to appoint as officers of the state some Muslim woman who don’t veil, give them no instructions but to reduce veiling, and expect each to have measureable results within two years or be fired.

  16. 516
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    @We Are Ing:

    Maybe? I remember an episode of Boy Meets World where Shawn dressed in drag because he was doing an article for the newspaper about the trouble that high school girls had, and it got into the whole situation of innapropriate expectations of sexuality and ‘I can touch you cause you’re pretty.’ (Not sure the episode name, but the article was called “Chick Like Me” so that’s possibly the episode.)

  17. 517
    Ing

    @Katherine

    Looked it up. Yes they did have it. And they even clarified that it didn’t have to do with sexual preferences O-o. Odd moment of progressiveness there.

  18. 518
    SallyStrange

    An article showed up on my Facebook feed, and the title sounded familiar. Indeed, it turned out I’d seen in as part of the URL you posted at #407 here. But I think you must’ve pasted the wrong link, because the article at that URL has no apparent (to me, anyway) connection to the NY Times, nor to the whole “Truth Vigilante” thing, nor to Clarence Thomas’ tax forms. Instead, it’s a deservedly vicious takedown of Ron Paul, comparing him to David Duke and pointing out in excruciating detail why progressives/liberals who are tempted by some of Paul’s positions to support him… er, shouldn’t be!

    I mention this only because people who passed it by the first time ’round, for whatever reason, ought to give it a look.

    Hey, thanks Bill! The article by Tim Wise is indeed excellent! I must have gotten my copy-pasting mixed up, because I was linking to both articles around the same time.

    The Tim Wise article is far more interesting. Here’s the link AGAIN, just in case. http://www.timwise.org/2012/01/of-broken-clocks-presidential-candidates-and-the-confusion-of-certain-white-liberals/

    The NYTimes public editor thing is more just an item of curiosity. It is pretty funny, though, with the continuing avalanche of negative comments. http://publiceditor.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/01/12/update-to-my-previous-post-on-truth-vigilantes/

  19. 519
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    @my 516:

    Scratch that, Cory was doing the article originally. He wasn’t able to pass (walk was bad, outfit was bad, hair and makeup were bad) and Shawn could, so they got Shawn to do it instead.

    @Ing:

    That is pretty neat. I’ll have to check out the show – even though I can’t stand Drew Carey anymore.

  20. 520
    Pteryxx

    gratz to the newly employed, horrible ID photos and all!

  21. 521
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    LM:

    It might have made more sense to appoint as officers of the state some Muslim woman who don’t veil, give them no instructions but to reduce veiling, and expect each to have measureable results within two years or be fired.

    It would have required our current Neo-Conservative government to be sensible on the subject of Muslim immigrants. They can’t afford that, unless they want to lose the support of the traditionally xenophobic nationalist right-wingers just a year before a presidential election.

    /cynic

  22. 522
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Thanks, Bill. Yeah, that’s exactly it — it’s insulting. I’m having dental surgery on Monday and I want to be able to get some sorbet and juice and things like that for the recovery period, and that’s about the only reason I didn’t just tell them to fucking cram it.

    I mean, who is in enough financial difficulty to apply for assistance, but $35 is going to make a difference for their family of 4? It’s just ridiculous.

  23. 523
  24. 524
    JeffreyD

    My License/ID photo makes me look like a retired IRA gunman.

    In other news, my mouth tastes like a vultures crotch and multi-coloured secretions are leaking from head orifices. That said, I seem to be getting better. At least the coroner has stopped hanging out in the front yard.

  25. 525
    Dhorvath, OM

    Why Jeffrey, you almost make that sound interesting rather than unfortunate. Get well.

  26. 526
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    My new employee ID makes me look demented. My eyes are open too far and my chin is jutted forward. It is horrific.
    Kristinc, $35 for a family of 4? That much, for a single person, comes close to being insultingly low. Jebus.

  27. 527
    StarStuff, a soulless cunt

    CFI conferences are expensive :(
    There’s a big one close enough to me in March (partly over my spring break even!), but it’s too much money. And then I’d have to get a hotel. *sigh* I might as well just not even think about it.

  28. 528
    Pteryxx

    @StarStuff, do CFI attendees room-share? It’s worked out great for me with fan-type cons, and really cuts the cost.

    Maybe $35 is just enough to provide cover for the lazy/ungrateful accusations. Sheesh. kristinc, just say the word.

  29. 529
    opposablethumbs

    All it takes is not dressing and coiffing oneself in accordance with the stereotypes, as I know from my own experience – I’ve already had someone attempt to eject me from the allocated loos on the basis of hair length and clothing ::rolleyes::

  30. 530
    alanbagain

    #339

    In #172 Tethys asked me:

    If you would care to explain (or provide a link to further reading) how sand dunes could form underwater I would appreciate it. It was my understanding that sand dunes are by definition formed by wind. Ripples have a very different structure than dunes, so I don’t find it accurate to refer to them as such.

    Let me start by quoting definitions of 3 terms: ripples, dunes and sandwaves. I am using the Collins Dictionary of Geology but other technical dictionaries will contain the same thoughts in different words.

    1) Ripples (or ripple marks)

    “small-scale ridges and troughs formed by the flow of wind or water over loose sand-grade sediment. They are usually less than 3 cm high, with spacing distances less than 30 cm. …” [It then goes on to define different types of ripple marks formed under different flow conditions.

    2) Dune

    "a mound or ridge of unconsolidated, usually sand-sized sedimentary particles, formed by the action of a fluid medium which may be wind or water. Dunes are larger bedforms than ripples and are formed at higher current speeds. Sub-aqueous dunes range from about 50 cm to several metreshigh and have wavelengths from 1 to 5 metres ..." [Again, it goes on to define different types of dunes.]

    3) Sandwaves

    “large, asymetric, fluvial [of or pertaining to rivers] bedforms, commonly with straight or sinuous crests and lacking localuised scours on the lee-side. In a river bed they may be up to 200 m long and 2 m high, but bedforms interpreted as sandwaves on some areas of the continental shelf are up to 15 m high, with wavelengths of up to 1 km…”

    Note that larger sub-aqueous dunes were formed when lake Missoula flooded and carved out the channelled scablands of Eastern Washington e.g.

    http://www.nps.gov/history/history/online_books/geology/publications/inf/72-2/
    (Section 4 in particular)

    Also note that larger sandwaves have been found in San Francisco Bay and off the coast of China:

    http://soundwaves.usgs.gov/2006/09/research.html
    http://www.ouramazingplanet.com/833-huge-underwater-dunes-discovered.html

    One last dictionary comment (from Appleby and Appleby, “A Dictionary of Earth Science”:

    dune bedform (‘megaripples’) Mounds or ridges of sand which are asymmetrical, and are produced sub-aqueously by flowing water. The external morphology is similar to the smaller ‘ripple’ and larger ‘sandwave’, with a gently sloping, upstream side (stoss), and a steeper downstream side (lee).

    What do I conclude from this?

    1) Ripples, Dunes and Sandwaves are similar bedforms with the main difference being scale.

    2) As the energy in the fluid increases the maximum scale of the bedforms also increases:

    Wind Ripples and Dunes only: nothing larger than sand (0.062 to 2 mm) is moved.
    Rivers Dunes composed of sand and pebbles.
    Marine: large waves and tides Sandwaves.

    3) While not covered in detail here, the size and surface appearance of the fragments in these different bedforms, along with details of the bedform structure, are similar, but not the same, in eolian and sub-aqueous environments.

    For an exhaustive explanation of sandwave formation see:

    http://lvov.weizmann.ac.il/Literature-Online/Literature/Papers/Models/2003_Tidally_Generated_Sand_Waves.pdf
    Unless you are into hydrodynamics and all that implies in math understanding, DON’T BOTHER. Just know it’s there!
    For a gentler description see:
    http://www.navis.gr/meteo/sandwave.htm

  31. 531
    Grumps

    It seems God’s dabbling in retail now.

    Tesco slump due to divine intervention, says Christian pressure group

    Tesco declined to comment

  32. 532
    Walton

    Instead, it’s a deservedly vicious takedown of Ron Paul, comparing him to David Duke and pointing out in excruciating detail why progressives/liberals who are tempted by some of Paul’s positions to support him… er, shouldn’t be!

    I read that article, and I found it very powerful and thought-provoking. And I agree with the majority of what Wise says; for me, Paul’s history of racism, his continued pandering to racists over the issues of immigration (an issue which is of considerable importance to me personally, as you know) and “states’ rights”, and his extremist anti-abortion stance, are absolute deal-breakers. That’s why I can’t and don’t support Paul, and would not consider voting for him (if I could vote, which I can’t).

    Nonetheless, I think Wise is being a little unfair to the likes of Glenn Greenwald. Greenwald wasn’t suggesting that progressives should support Paul, nor does he himself support Paul. He was, however, pointing out that there are certain specific issues – the warfare state and the security-industrial complex, military detention, targeted killings, the War on Drugs, and the erosion of civil liberties, in particular – where none of the other candidates, Obama included, are seriously challenging the disastrous authoritarian status quo. Does that mean progressives should be saying nice things about Paul personally? No, of course not, for all the reasons Wise gives; indeed, I don’t think an honest and consistent progressive can support Paul, to any extent, because of his terrible positions on a number of fundamental social justice issues. But it does mean that we need to seize the opportunity to hold both parties to account on those issues and to point out the awful record of both Republicans and Democrats in this regard.

    I would almost certainly vote for Obama, if I could vote. I firmly believe that a Republican presidency would be a catastrophe, and I think Newt Gingrich’s plan to destroy the independence of the federal judiciary (an idea which seems to have gained a scary amount traction with the other candidates, notwithstanding that Gingrich himself is unlikely to be the nominee) may be the most dangerous idea in modern American politics and should be opposed at any cost. But that doesn’t mean I’m going to hold back from criticizing Obama when it’s warranted.

  33. 533
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    @Grumps,

    It seems God’s dabbling in retail now.

    He/she/it just can’t stand that Tesco donated £30,000 to the Pride movement, at least in the minds of the xians.

    Tesco themselves admitted recently that their marketing over xmas was inadequate and was the most likely reason for them not doing quite so well, unlike Sainsbury and M&S, who basically blitzed all possible media.

  34. 534
    Walton

    OFFS. Went through our every-six-months third-degree questioning to stay on food assistance, and for no apparent reason, they have cut our assistance from over $100/month to $35/month. $35.

    We were carefully doing okay with the food assistance we got. I have no idea how we’ll do it with only $35.

    That’s… unbelievably awful. I’m really sorry that happened to you.

    Is there any prospect of appealing? It sounds like they may well have simply made a bureaucratic error of some description (overestimating or miscounting your sources of income, for instance), though I don’t know how the process works.

  35. 535
  36. 536
    The Sailor

    Good dog! (Smart shelter.)

  37. 537
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Does that mean progressives should be saying nice things about Paul personally? No, of course not

    Well, it’s a nice thing to say about a person that their “voice needs to be heard.”

    It’s not a good idea to give any positive attention to Ron Paul. It’s entirely possible to say that Democratic candidates should be doing X Y and Z while not even mentioning the racist candidate who advocates X Y and Z.

    There are ways to talk about these issues that are less likely to send people in the direction of libertarianism.

    That’s what Tim is getting at: “the stronger Paul gets, the stronger libertarianism gets, and thus, the Libertarian Party as a potential third party: not the Greens, mind you, but the Libertarians. And the stronger Paul gets, the stronger become those voices who worship the free market”.

    But that doesn’t mean I’m going to hold back from criticizing Obama when it’s warranted.

    What is this noise? Do you just reflexively toss in a strawman to kindle the fire?

  38. 538
    cicely

    kristinc, WTFF? Is there any kind of secondary assistance you can get?
    -
    @ janine: Gahhhhh!
    -
    *hug* for Jeffrey. Get betterer.
    -

  39. 539
    SallyStrange

    It sounds like they may well have simply made a bureaucratic error of some description (overestimating or miscounting your sources of income, for instance), though I don’t know how the process works.

    Yeah, sure… like when my health care premium went from $0 to $33 to $50 to $65. Bureaucratic error, and the system is an asshole.

  40. 540
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Is there any prospect of appealing? It sounds like they may well have simply made a bureaucratic error of some description (overestimating or miscounting your sources of income, for instance), though I don’t know how the process works.

    I keep thinking it’s so ridiculous it has to be a mistake, although that’s probably insufficient cynicism on my part.

    Spouse and I will certainly do our best to contact Social Services and find out what the hell happened, but a) my experience is that Social Services workers go beyond apathetic and into actively obstructionist and b) apparently half their phone lines have been broken for over a month now, a fact we only learned when spouse couldn’t get hold of anyone by phone for a week and finally went in to the office to make contact (after we got the letter threatening to cut off our assistance if we didn’t contact them).

    tl;dr, I will do everything up to and including a formal appeal but I don’t have much hope.

  41. 541
    JeffreyD

    cicely – thanks for the hug, but you should really go disinfect yourself now. ;^)

    (Cough! Cough!! Cough!!! Wow! So that is what a lung looks like.)

  42. 542
    chigau (違う)

    I’m trying to make a grocery list for 4 people for a month for $35.
    I can’t do it.
    I think “cruel” is an even better term than “insulting”.
    Can you buy toothpaste and bandaids and etc?

  43. 543
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    those of us who oppose the drug-war, who oppose the Patriot Act deserve better than Ron Paul.

    Ta-Nehisi Coates on Ron Paul /psa

  44. 544
    Walton

    It’s not a good idea to give any positive attention to Ron Paul. It’s entirely possible to say that Democratic candidates should be doing X Y and Z while not even mentioning the racist candidate who advocates X Y and Z.

    In my experience, that’s easier said than done. Whenever one talks about the security-industrial complex, civil liberties abuses, and so on, outside leftish communities like Pharyngula, someone usually chimes in with a comment about Paul. The difficulty for progressives is that Paul has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the public mind with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex. Of course there are progressive politicians who have equally good or better records on those issues – Barney Frank and Dennis Kucinich being two who spring to mind – but, of course, none of them are running for president right now.

    I do often, in fact, end up explaining (particularly to friends of mine who are British libertarian Tories, among whom Paul is oddly popular while the other Republicans are viewed as ridiculous) the reasons why I can’t support Paul or take him seriously on the civil liberties front, and bringing up his history of racism and continued pandering to racists. I think it’s necessary to do that, because however much I might agree with him about specific issues, I can’t support him because bigotry is an absolute deal-breaker for me; and I think his most illiberal stances, such as his explicit anti-immigration views and his extreme opposition to abortion, should be publicized.

    But that doesn’t mean I’m going to hold back from criticizing Obama when it’s warranted.

    What is this noise? Do you just reflexively toss in a strawman to kindle the fire?

    Fair point – of course Wise wasn’t suggesting that we shouldn’t criticize Obama. (I possibly read too much into his criticism of Greenwald in that regard.)

    Forget Paul for a minute, though. I do want to concentrate on this part of Wise’s essay, and two particular points therein which are of wider importance.

    Meanwhile, at what point do you stop being so concerned about whether a presidential candidate is pushing the issues Paul raises (so many of which do need raising and attention), and realize what every actual leftist in history has realized, but which apparently some liberals and progressives don’t: namely, that the real battles are in the streets, and in the neighborhoods, and in movement activism? It isn’t a president, whether his name is Ron Paul or Barack Obama who gets good things done. It is us, demanding change and threatening to literally shut the system down (whether we mean Wall Street, the Port of Oakland, the Wisconsin state capitol, Columbia University, a Woolworth’s lunch counter, or the Montgomery, Alabama bus system) who force presidents and lawmakers to bend to the public will.

    In short, if you’re still disappointed in Barack Obama, it’s only because you never understood whose job it was to produce change in the first place.

    Most obviously, I take issue with the last sentence because Obama hasn’t just failed to produce change; he’s actively continued awful authoritarian policies, and I think he can be called out on that. Of course he’s done so for political expediency, much of the time; and of course, if he were not the type of person who is willing to compromise for political expediency, he would never have been elected. (It is the greatest failing of representative democracy: competitive elections select for people who want public office and who are willing to compromise their principles as necessary to get it. But that’s another issue.)

    Of course, that’s got nothing to do with the central thesis of Wise’s article, which is that Ron Paul should not be supported by progressives (which I agree with) and that saying nice things about Ron Paul, even hinged with qualifiers, is a risky business (which I also agree with, as far as it goes). I agree with Wise that Paul is too tainted by racism, both in his personal history and (more importantly) in his present policy agenda, to be supported even to a limited extent. I wish more attention were focused on, say, Gary Johnson instead; who, although far from perfect (he’s still a free-market libertarian), has comparatively progressive policies on immigration, drug law reform and a range of other issues.

  45. 545
    Walton

    (I wanted to say more about Wise’s comments on popular mass movements being the way to produce change, but decided to leave that for a different post later, because it wasn’t directly pertinent to the issue at hand and I didn’t want to create confusion as to what I was arguing.)

  46. 546
    GeekMelange (formerly thepint)

    I’m convinced the entire purpose of having a picture ID is to make you carry around an image of yourself that is nowhere near your best. Waiting around in either too cold or too hot rooms and then having your photo taken under the never-flattering exposure of fluorescent lighting just about guarantees you’ll look like the walking dead.

    JeffreyD – Sounds like the nasty that had the Husbeast in its clutches over the holidays and refused to let go until recently. I hope that whatever has crawled down your throat dies a horrible death and you get well soon!

    —-

    This whole “Friday the 13th wooo!! look out!!” superstition can bite me. I got the best possible news today about a near and dear yearly gig. I do a lot of volunteer work with my old grade school/junior high and since 2010, I’ve gone back once a year to spend the day teaching the kids in gym class about poi spinning (last year a friend came with me so she could teach hula hooping as well) as part of their World Games studies section (they do things like learn about Cricket, bocci ball, etc, for a month in PE). It’s been an unpaid volunteer thing – I do it because I love the school community and the kids and my friend likes sharing her skill. We were reimbursed for gas costs and my former 5th grade teach bought us a nice lunch and we had a grand old time, though.

    This year, however, the PE teacher and my old teacher (who’s now the academic dean for the school) convinced the administration to request I bring a group of performers to start the study session by giving a 20 min performance with LED/blacklight spinning tools and a Q&A with the kids about the different tools we use at the Monday morning assembly. This way we can spend more of PE class actually working with the kids. I’m thrilled about the change in format and the gravy on top is that they’ll actually pay us this year! I’m bringing in 3 of my closest friends to help out (I’m stunned all 3 of them are actually free on less than a month’s notice because they’re all busy with their own projects, especially as 2 of them are prepping their fire troupe for auditioning for America’s Got Talent) and it’s going to be freaking AMAZING.

    So now I’m just going to have to try not to freak out about semichoreographing 20 min of performance between 4 people using multiple tools like flags, poi, staffs, double staff, hula hoops, mini hoops, rope dart and lord knows what else in 3 weeks when my only free time is after my 9-5 desk job. Yay?

  47. 547
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    I’m trying to make a grocery list for 4 people for a month for $35.
    I can’t do it.
    I think “cruel” is an even better term than “insulting”.
    Can you buy toothpaste and bandaids and etc?

    In my state, Social Services weasel out by saying that food assistance is food assistance and not meant to cover all of a family’s food expenses.

    How that is at all helpful to families who have no other form of income for food, I don’t know, but fortunately we’re not one of those families.

    Nobody will starve (or lack bandaids or toothpaste), but it was stressful feeding a family of 4 good, varied, tasty food on a grocery budget that included over $100 in assistance and it’s going to get a lot more stressful trying to do it on less.

  48. 548
    Tethys

    Thank you, alanbagain! The computer generated fly-through at the soundwaves link is really cool!

  49. 549
    strange gods before me ॐ

    I wish more attention were focused on, say, Gary Johnson instead; who, although far from perfect (he’s still a free-market libertarian), has comparatively progressive policies on immigration, drug law reform and a range of other issues.

    Holy Jesus. We have a party in the US called the Green Party. Tim even mentioned it. They have candidates for the presidency. Given the choice between wishing for attention to them or the Libertarians, you’re picking an LP candidate. You are running with a bad crowd. Are you on the marijuana? Go get yourself acquainted with the various kinds of politicians that are involved in Green primaries. Kent Mesplay is running again, as is Jill Stein.

  50. 550
    strange gods before me ॐ

    In my experience, that’s easier said than done. Whenever one talks about the security-industrial complex, civil liberties abuses, and so on, outside leftish communities like Pharyngula, someone usually chimes in with a comment about Paul.

    This is not a reason for Glenn Greenwald to say Paul’s voice needs to be heard.

  51. 551
    chigau (違う)

    kristinc
    Ah, “assistance”.
    That makes all the difference!

  52. 552
    The Sailor

    Hooray for being officially employed! (The paycheck is the conga rats the ID and office is just frosting;-)
    +++++++++++++
    Ing: the Camels w/ Hammers post was bad, the comments were worse. I agree with your take. Bringing a knife to a gunfight ON PURPOSE is a very bad idea.
    +++++++++++++
    Kitty, it doesn’t matter how many pillows you buy for Floyd, he wants yours.
    +++++++++++++
    If some of my comments seems disjointed, it’s because I can only get all of TET to load in one out of 3 – 5 tries.
    +++++++++++++

  53. 553
    Tethys

    This is another interesting article (2006) found on the soundwaves site.
    Cat Parasite May Affect Cultural Traits in Human Populations

    Although this sounds like science fiction, it is a logical outcome of how natural selection leads to effective strategies for parasites to get from host to host, said Lafferty. Toxoplasma gondii is a parasite of cats, both domestic and wild. Although modern humans are a dead-end host for the parasite, Toxoplasma appears to manipulate human personality by the same adaptations that normally help it complete its life cycle.

  54. 554
    Walton

    Holy Jesus. We have a party in the US called the Green Party. Tim even mentioned it. They have candidates for the presidency. Given the choice between wishing for attention to them or the Libertarians, you’re picking an LP candidate. You are running with a bad crowd. Are you on the marijuana? Go get yourself acquainted with the various kinds of politicians that are involved in Green primaries. Kent Mesplay is running again, as is Jill Stein.

    Looks good, generally, and their immigration platform is not bad at all. They’re also saying good things about criminal justice reform, including ending the death penalty and legalizing marijuana. I do have a few qualms – in particular, I’m in favour of nuclear energy, and disagree with the Green position on that issue – but generally I like them, and would like the Green voice to be stronger in US politics. So I don’t disagree with you.

    But the reason I brought up Johnson is because he’s actually been a state governor, and has a far higher profile than most third-party candidates; if there’s anyone outside the two major parties to whom people might conceivably pay attention, it’s probably him. I also favour building bridges between leftists and libertarians when it comes to issues that ought to be of concern to both, like ending the drug war and adopting a less restrictive policy on immigration; Johnson is someone who could possibly do that.

    That said, I don’t support him (if nothing else, because it’s a waste of time to support a third-party candidate in America), and, as I said, I would vote for Obama, if I could vote. The biggest danger is someone like Gingrich or Santorum getting into office – or even Romney, especially if coupled with a Republican Congress – and doing irreversible damage, wrecking the few remaining safeguards against tyranny (such as the federal judiciary) and making bad policies even worse. I am entirely in agreement with you and Bill that that would be an absolute disaster.

  55. 555
    Walton

    I also favour building bridges between leftists and libertarians when it comes to issues that ought to be of concern to both, like ending the drug war and adopting a less restrictive policy on immigration; Johnson is someone who could possibly do that.

    That said, there are also major issues which would probably stop me supporting him, if he were a serious candidate; in particular, he has very conservative economic views which I don’t share. It’s always a struggle. But he’d be a huge improvement over any of the Republicans in the race, for certain.

  56. 556
    strange gods before me ॐ

    But the reason I brought up Johnson is because he’s actually been a state governor, and has a far higher profile than most third-party candidates; if there’s anyone outside the two major parties to whom people might conceivably pay attention, it’s probably him.

    If that’s your criteria, Jesse Ventura has better economic policies.

    Roseanne is very ambitious this year. She’s running for president of the US and prime minister of Israel.

    Fucking libertarians. Dangerous nonsense. There’s no defending that.

  57. 557
    chigau (違う)

    I’m making baked beans for the pot-luck tomorrow.
    If there’s any left after I finish sampling.

  58. 558
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    This beer:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0fURJg-K0A

    is super-cool(ed). Nice.

    [h/t Revolutions Blog]

  59. 559
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Ralph Nader got 0.56% of the vote in 2008, Bob Barr 0.40%. Barr was probably a better known candidate than Johnson. Tbh I think there’s going to be other, bigger third party candidates this year than Johnson anyway.

  60. 560
    David Marjanović

    Complaining on Pharyngula seems to have an effect!!! Winter has begun! There’s a cm of snow on the grass and (now frozen) slush on the sidewalks! :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

    Christmas tree still up.

    Pteryxx: *cinnamon cookies* *aniseed cookies* *chocolate cookies*

    I’d like to thank everyone for their welcomes, and for the kind words about my conversion.

    Deconversion. :-)

    The best bit of appealing to popular journalism is the quote:

    “We kept building larger structures until we emerged out of the quantum mechanical into the classical data storage regime and we reached this limit at 12 atoms.”

    They say that like they are putting another steak on the barbeque.

    For a good reason! It’s exactly what they did: using the needle of a tunnel microscope, they took one iron atom after another and deposited it till they had 12 together.

    It’s an actually sharp needle. Its tip is a single atom. :-)

    Why Jeffrey, you almost make that sound interesting rather than unfortunate. Get well.

    Seconded.

  61. 561
    Lynna, OM

    On January 12, 2012 a bunch of regressive religious dunderheads signed an “open letter” that confirms their anti-gay stance.

    Just in time to provide more embarrassment for Mitt Romney, one of the guys signing the letter is Bishop H. David Burton, Presiding Bishop, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

    Mitt embarrasses himself fairly well and fairly regularly, but it’s nice that his fellow mormons keep him company in the vale of ignominy.

    Excerpts from the letter:

    Dear Friends:

    Oh, good lawd. Do they have to do that passive-aggressive “Dear Friends” bit? Off-putting already. But let’s press on.

    The promotion and protection of marriage—the union of one man and one woman as husband and wife—is a matter of the common good and serves the wellbeing of the couple, of children, of civil society and all people. The meaning and value of marriage precedes and transcends any particular society, government, or religious community. It is a universal good and the foundational institution of all societies. It is bound up with the nature of the human person as male and female, and with the essential task of bearing and nurturing children.

    And …. yadda yadda. We’ve heard the “universal good” claim before. Not proven doofuses, doofi.

    … we believe the most urgent peril is this: forcing or pressuring both individuals and religious organizations—throughout their operations, well beyond religious ceremonies—to treat same-sex sexual conduct as the moral equivalent of marital sexual conduct. There is no doubt that the many people and groups whose moral and religious convictions forbid same-sex sexual conduct will resist the compulsion of the law, and church-state conflicts will result.
    These conflicts bear serious consequences.

    Does anybody else hear a not-so-veiled threat in the above bit? Sounds like guns will be blazing.

    …By a single stroke, every law where rights depend on marital status—such as employment discrimination, employment benefits, adoption, education, healthcare, elder care, housing, property, and taxation—will change so that same-sex sexual relationships must be treated as if they were marriage…. religious adoption services that place children exclusively with married couples would be required by law to place children with persons of the same sex who are civilly “married.” Religious marriage counselors would be denied their professional accreditation for refusing to provide counseling in support of same-sex “married” relationships. Religious employers who provide special health benefits to married employees would be required by law to extend those benefits to same-sex “spouses.” Religious employers would also face lawsuits for taking any adverse employment action—no matter how modest—against an employee for the public act of obtaining a civil “marriage” with a member of the same sex….

    Yep. Sounds good to me.

    … In short, the refusal of these religious organizations to treat a same-sex sexual relationship as if it were a marriage marked them and their members as bigots, subjecting them to the full arsenal of government punishments and pressures reserved for racists.

    Again, sounds right. The bigots will be called bigots.

    …We especially urge those entrusted with the public good to support laws that uphold the time-honored definition of marriage, and so avoid threatening the religious freedom of countless institutions and citizens in this country. Marriage and religious freedom are both deeply woven into the fabric of this nation….

    Link to PDF of letter.
    The letter is signed by more than fifty righteously most reverend religious leaders, including the National Commander of The Salvation Army. Don’t put money in those holiday buckets.

  62. 562
    Cipher

    *pounces and hugs David M

    just ’cause*

  63. 563
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    @Dr David,

    For a good reason! It’s exactly what they did: using the needle of a tunnel microscope, they took one iron atom after another and deposited it till they had 12 together.For a good reason! It’s exactly what they did: using the needle of a tunnel microscope, they took one iron atom after another and deposited it till they had 12 together.

    Yeah, but it’s still a very casual way to phrase it! I do remember when they first developed the microscope and couldn’t resist drawing the IBM logo in atoms. There was an interview on the news where the inventor was shuffling atoms while blithely saying something like “.. and we just pick this atom up here and put it here…” that made me laugh out loud.

    Physicists, you have to love them.

  64. 564
    Cipher

    Hmm. Unfortunately, I feel I may have to watch Firefly some more. I know it’s going to be hard and a struggle, but I will push through it.
    <..>
    Oh, and I have some very important reading to do for my book club. I can’t let them down, no matter how arduous it will be to read one of my favorite books over again.
    <.<
    I may not have time to work on my translations tonight! Darn.

  65. 565
    Cipher

    Darn it, html, I forgot how you work. :(

  66. 566
    The Sailor

    “Physicists, you have to love them.”

    No, … but … if … you … don’t … we … will … obliterate … you[/Stephen Hawkings voice box] (which would take ~11 minutes)

  67. 567
  68. 568
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    OFFS. Went through our every-six-months third-degree questioning to stay on food assistance, and for no apparent reason, they have cut our assistance from over $100/month to $35/month. $35.

    We were carefully doing okay with the food assistance we got. I have no idea how we’ll do it with only $35.

    That is horrible. This pernicious idea that we have to prevent the poor being happy, or having anything, or even having decent food or medical care, is one of the worst things that modern evangelical Christianity has wrought.

    I think there’s going to be other, bigger third party candidates this year than Johnson anyway.

    I fully expect Santorum to run as a third party True Repulican if Romney gets the nomination. And it really could split the GOP into the economic and social conservatives. Which will be a (short-term) disaster across the board as it will bring all the right wing whackos out in force which will allow the coservatives to dominate state and local offices, as well as the US House and Senate.

    ================

    Wife and I had a huge lunch. So for dinner, I am having a small bowl of Karamel Sutra, and Wife is having some peach and almond Haagen Dahz for dinner.

    I feel like I am sinning.

    And I like it.

  69. 569
    Cipher

    Also, *hugs* to kristinc. I can’t believe they’re doing that. What the hell is $35 even supposed to do anyway, for a family of four? Fuck. Make sure and leave them a metaphorical box of decaying porcupines from me, especially if they continue being obstructive and unhelpful.

  70. 570
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    Two things:

    Ridiculous Standards of “Beauty”

    I think being transgender, the ridiculous standards put on women to be beautiful (in unrealistic ways) is largely what causes me to question my own attractiveness and whether or not I could be even considered attractive if I did decide to transition. If that standard of beauty were not put on me, then I’m sure I would not be so worried about becoming who I am.

    Bruises

    I’ve discovered why I have bruises on my knee – cause when I sit down I slam it into the corner of my computer desk – like a moron.

  71. 571
    Dhorvath, OM

    Katherine,
    Knowing that the standards aren’t fair does little to keep us from fearing people exercising them. I hope you can find a way to thread that needle that lets you be you and happy for it. In the meantime, hugs if you are taking.

  72. 572
    Walton

    That is horrible. This pernicious idea that we have to prevent the poor being happy, or having anything, or even having decent food or medical care, is one of the worst things that modern evangelical Christianity has wrought.

    Actually, I don’t think it’s caused primarily by evangelical Christianity; given that we have increasingly harsh anti-poor policies in the UK too, despite the fact that the UK is a much less religious society and lacks a large-scale US-style politicized evangelical Christian movement. (This is not to say that there aren’t right-wing Christian activists in the UK, but they’re much less numerous and powerful than in the US; and evangelical Protestant fundamentalism in particular is much less common.)

    Don’t get me wrong. There are other things which are much better in the UK – in particular, there is much less homophobia, and much less organized opposition to reproductive rights – largely thanks to the fact that politicized right-wing Christianity is much less widespread in the UK. But the impulse to hurt and punish the poor seems to be common to both societies, regardless of the different levels of religiosity.

  73. 573
    The Sailor

    kristinc, nothing but {{hugs}} coming from my way. It is wrong on so many levels, from the local to the national. My sympathies.

    ++++++++++++++
    TLC, from a long ago thread, it’s taken you a lot fewer years to discover what I finally learned. Just listen, don’t try to fix it, don’t think of how I would do it differently, don’t come up with ‘solutions’, just listen.

  74. 574
    ibyea

    @gliell
    Heddle is one of the most irritating godbots out there. Seriously, he is not worth it.

  75. 575
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I don’t think it’s caused primarily by evangelical Christianity; given that we have increasingly harsh anti-poor policies in the UK too, despite the fact that the UK is a much less religious society and lacks a large-scale US-style politicized evangelical Christian movement.

    I see what you mean. Here in the USA, the ‘Prosperity Gospel’ has been used by the no-tax anti-government assholes as a recruiting tool to bring social conservatives into the fold and, along with homophobia and forced-birth, convince poor and middle class voters to vote against their best interest. I did not intend (though reading my usual piss-poor writing, I can see where that came from) to imply that this was either the only, nor the main, impetus behind the pro-rich, anti-poor punishment of anyone who actually needs aid. I should have been more careful when writing.

    When I first began working for the government, my pay was low enough that, with one child, we were eligable for WIC (Women, Infant & Children) — in 1990, Wife and I, combined, earned $8,300; in 1991, we made $13,200. The dairy, cereal, legumes and fresh vegetables provided by WIC made it possible to pay our rent, our car payment, and all the other expenses that allowed me to keep working. And it also meant that we were buying foods (spending money (though in voucher form)), adding money to the economy, that we would not have been able to do without the aid. Last month, there was a letter to the editor in the local print edition of one of our newspapers (oddly, not in the on-line edition (that I could find)) lamenting seeing WIC vouchers being used to buy such luxury items as cherries, endive salad mix, and name-brand cereal. Left unsaid was ‘how dare those working poor people have good tasting food.’

    Unfortunately, the worship of greed, the idea that the rich deserve to be rich, comes with the attitude that, if the rich deserve to be rich, the poor deserve to be poor — it is their fault, so helping them stops them helping themselves. And in the USA, people buy this shit, partly because of the Prosperity Gospel.

    Anyway, sorry. I’ll try to write more clearly.

  76. 576
    ibyea

    @james
    Twilight Sparkle vs. Voldemort XD

  77. 577
    Walton

    Unfortunately, the worship of greed, the idea that the rich deserve to be rich, comes with the attitude that, if the rich deserve to be rich, the poor deserve to be poor — it is their fault, so helping them stops them helping themselves. And in the USA, people buy this shit, partly because of the Prosperity Gospel.

    Yep, that’s certainly true; and I don’t doubt that the particular strain of highly-politicized evangelical Protestant Christianity which has long been disproportionately powerful in the US bears a lot of responsibility for perpetuating some of these cultural memes. So I don’t disagree with you at all on that point. I just wanted to observe that the tendency towards contempt for the poor happens elsewhere too, although the justifications offered are different.

  78. 578
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I just wanted to observe that the tendency towards contempt for the poor happens elsewhere too, although the justifications offered are different.

    Again, I understand that other nations have found different ways to acceptably villify the poor. I did not intend to imply otherwise. Honest.

  79. 579
    Walton

    Again, I understand that other nations have found different ways to acceptably villify the poor. I did not intend to imply otherwise. Honest.

    Fair enough. Sorry I misunderstood you.

  80. 580
    ibyea

    As for the conversation of what I would do with a Death Note, the first thing I would do is kill some dictators like Kim Jong Un and Bashar Al Assad. In principle, I rather throw it away, and in fact, I wouldn’t trust myself with it, but I admit that my impulse to kill terrible people like them would be too great.

  81. 581
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    I wouldn’t use a Death Note cause once you do you’re fucked. I don’t think I could want to kill anyone enough to forfeit my own life.

  82. 582
  83. 583
    Walton

    As for the conversation of what I would do with a Death Note, the first thing I would do is kill some dictators like Kim Jong Un and Bashar Al Assad.

    …which wouldn’t help in the slightest, because other dictators would simply step into their places.

    I think MLK was right:

    Through violence you may murder the liar, but you cannot murder the lie, nor establish the truth. Through violence you may murder the hater, but you do not murder hate. In fact, violence merely increases hate. So it goes.

  84. 584
    Walton

    In other news, in yet another attack ad, Gingrich attacks Romney for speaking French.

    Because, apparently, Real Americans shouldn’t learn foreign languages. Or something. (Never mind that Gingrich’s doctorate is in European history; apparently that doesn’t count.)

  85. 585
    Patricia, OM

    Oh kak, has there been another Heddle sighting? His calvinist shit infuriates me.

    Today was my food stamp interview too. It is so humiliating to have to apply, and then when you get treated like scum on top of it all makes it just perfect. $35 is terrible! Can you even feed one child for a month on that?

  86. 586
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Walton:

    I will just say this about Tim Wise’s comments about Glen Greenwald’s comments about Ron Paul: I have personal experience with solid progressives — people on the left edge of my circle of Democratic activist friends — who seriously flirted with supporting Paul in 2008, because a handful of his positions are superficially progressive[1]. Luckily, I believe the people I’m thinking of all stepped back from the edge before it was too late, but influential voices like Greenwald’s giving Paul even the tiniest bit of credibility scare me. This shit isn’t hypothetical to me.

    ***
    [1] I say “superficially” because, for just one example, his “progressive” anti-war stance is, AFAICT, rooted in pernicious isolationism, which I don’t hold to be a truly progressive value. It’s the state-level equivalent of libertarians’ focus on individualism over communitarianism.

  87. 587
    The Sailor

    Ogvorbis, Walton; a lot of countries are going the ‘austerity’ route right now. and not a single one of those assholes endorsing it will have to live it.

    It’s not original, but if there were stock in tumbrels, and I had money to invest, that’s where I’d put my money.
    +++++++++++++
    Completely unrelated; Did the USMC draft soldiers during Vietnam?
    My personal knowledge says different, but anecdote/anecdata is not evidence. My Google Fu has failed me.
    +++++++++++++
    On the bright side, (always look on the bright side [/Python]), I’ve showered, didn’t shave, and I’m going out tonight to see my favorite regional band play at a local venue.

    As soon as my long, flowing, gray, locks dry.
    Otherwise in 14F temps they might break off.

  88. 588
    carlie

    is largely what causes me to question my own attractiveness and whether or not I could be even considered attractive if I did decide to transition.

    I know this wasn’t the point, but you’re objectively lovely. Fantastic hair, cheekbones to die for, and a kind, approachable look. Just sayin’.

  89. 589
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Did the USMC draft soldiers during Vietnam?

    Yes. From 1945 through the discontinuation of the draft in 197something, a portion of the draft class was assigned to each service based on that services needs. A majority went to the US Army as that was the largest service; Navy and Air Force recieved fewer draftees, but they recieved (give or take a few 10ks) the same number; and Uncle Sam’s Misguided Children, being the smallest service, got the smallest number. The USMC also had a higher proportion of volunteers than the US Army. And the average Marine was also shorter than the average soldier, sailor or airmen.

    Do you know the difference between the USMC and the Boy Scouts?

  90. 590
  91. 591
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Glenn Greenwald. I knew I should’a looked that up!

  92. 592
    Patricia, OM

    Sailor – Not sure about the USMC, but I can ask. (I volunteer two days a week at my County VSO)

  93. 593
    ibyea

    @walton
    As I wrote that, that is what exactly what came into my mind. Which is why I would rather just throw away the imaginary Death Note. But as I said, I don’t trust myself in throwing it away.

  94. 594
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Did the USMC draft soldiers during Vietnam?

    No, they drafted Marines! <rimshot>

    Actually, in my (limited) experience, military folks can be quite picky about terminology. When I was working on a proposal related to a jet fighter for the U.S. Navy, I was informed by more than one ex-Navy coworker that there are no pilots in the Navy; they’re aviators. And you don’t take off from or land on an aircraft carrier; you launch and recover.

    That was decades ago; mebbe things are different now. Funny how stuff like that sticks with you!

  95. 595
    Benjamin "Derp" Geiger

    changeable moniker:

    Brian Brushwood does some pretty awesome stuff. Do you watch Scam School?

  96. 596
    lizdamnit

    I wouldn’t use a Death Note cause once you do you’re fucked. I don’t think I could want to kill anyone enough to forfeit my own life.

    Not so. According to the rules if you don’t accept the Eyes of The Shinigami (a deal that lets you know anyone’s name on sight in exchange for half of your life span) and aren’t felled by another Deathnote you can live out your entire life span.

    The rule in question that says humans are punished from using the death note states that no one who uses a Death Note can enter heaven or hell….but it’s a lie by omission because the Death Note later explicitly states there is no afterlife. It’s technically true but misleading.

  97. 597
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    And you don’t take off from or land on an aircraft carrier; you launch and recover.

    And splash. Don’t forget splash.

  98. 598
    lizdamnit

    …which wouldn’t help in the slightest, because other dictators would simply step into their places.

    Does the fact that the Death Note lets you control the manner of death and the details leading up to it, so you can dictate that the person leaves a message or the like, change your opinion of it then?

    Would knowing you could have them write or give a public announcement saying “I am being killed for my crimes by a supernatural entity, take heed and don’t repeat my mistakes” before inexplicably dying change your answer?

    So I guess that changes the question from ‘Would you kill someone with it’ to ‘would you use it to create a golden lie’?

  99. 599
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Is it right that naval aviators have left and right wings because port and starboard are always relative to the carrier?

  100. 600
    chigau (違う)

    Hi lizdamnit
    You found us!

  101. 601
    ibyea

    @lizdamnit
    Another way one could do is since you could control their actions, have them implement reforms before being offed, say a few years down the line. But that still makes me uncomfortable.

  102. 602
    carlie

    I would destroy the Death Note.

    Because it would make me feel smugly superior to anyone who would use it.
    ;)

  103. 603
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    So I guess that changes the question from ‘Would you kill someone with it’ to ‘would you use it to create a golden lie’?

    Which makes me (and this is just me) feel uneasy. Using the death note, no matter the justifications, the reasons, or the lessons, would make me the judge, jury and executioner — extra-legal and extra-constitional judge, jury and executioner — which would make me as bad as, or worse than, those who I am killing.

  104. 604
    Benjamin "Derp" Geiger

    *sigh*.

    A Facebook ‘friend’ just posted an “epic shot” he took of a rather large woman on a bicycle, saying “you create the caption”.

    The first two comments: “Thar she blows!” and (referring to the McDonald’s in the background) “I’m lovin’ it”.

    And people wonder why it’s so hard for the overweight to exercise.

  105. 605
    Benjamin "Derp" Geiger

    Response from the “Thar she blows!” guy, after I called him out for being a small-minded chucklefuck:

    Small-minded is one thing that I am not. For one, who’s to say that she’s “exercising?” My issue is the mid-drift being exposed while riding in the middle of the street. It’s funny because, coincidentally, she’s riding by a McDonald’s. So yes, it’s freaking hilarious. At best, you may say that I’m a bit mean or rude for the statement. However, do not insult my intelligence or limit my thinking capabilities for a comment that you may find harsh or offensive. Thank you.

  106. 606
    Walton

    Benjamin: Indeed. I don’t know why so many people feel entitled to shame and stigmatize others for their bodies. It’s one of the most depressing and psychologically-destructive features of our culture.

  107. 607
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    mid-drift?

    So she was sliding the bike round a corner, or your “intelligent” mate can’t spell?

  108. 608
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    Reminds me of the “furore” over the fat republitard who bemoaned the first lady’s apparently growing ass.

    The standard of what constitutes “the body beautiful” these days are impossible to achieve even if it’s your full time job

  109. 609
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    and let’s face it even the beautiful people don’t actually look like that.

    http://vimeo.com/34813864

  110. 610
    chigau (違う)

    captions:
    “Look, a person on a bicycle.”
    “Wow! Is that the new Mid-Drifter 32-speed bike?”
    “I wonder who does her hair. I love the color.”
    “That fucking muckdunalds is a eyesore.”

  111. 611
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Trouble
    Oh trouble move away
    I have seen your face
    and it’s too much for me today
    .
    .
    .

    haven’t seen it in a long time. Need to watch it again.

  112. 612
    GeekMelange (formerly thepint)

    I can’t figure out if I just did a good deed or created a monster. Was having a good conversation with a liberal Christian friend about sexism and how frustrating it can be to address it in our respective communities, when it came out she had no idea what MRAs were. So I gave her some links. “Waitaminute – these guys are REAL?? There’s actually a movement for this shit?? @!$!@$!@!!!”

    This could yield some unexpected results…

  113. 613
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    Morgan the kitty is a cutie. She went to jump onto my lap (yes, that’s my knee) just know. She’s even cute in motion!

    I have learned a few things, though. Most are not a problem, though her habit of using the toilet as a water dish is a bit perturbing. Nothing leaving the lid down won’t fix, though.

  114. 614
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Goddammit. It’s totally unacceptable that Kristinc is trying to feed a family of four on $35 worth of foodstamps. Fuck, I hate this country.

    Kristin, I’m sorry if this embarrasses, you, but I’m takin’ up a collection. Lord knows I’ve had to ask for help in the form of foodstamps, welfare, and my friends many times in my life, so I don’t see anything out of the ordinary about people helping each other out.

    Those who want to contribute to the Fuck The Welfare System, A Body Deserves To Eat fund, please email me at [email protected]. If you’re willing to trust me, I’ll collect donations and pool them, then send the money to Kristinc. I’ll keep track of the total collected and make that available to any donor who wants to know. People can stay anonymous if they like (so long as you help me figure out how to accept funds from anonymous people). Few of you know me in meatspace, but I give you my word I’m trustworthy.

  115. 615
    Benjamin "Derp" Geiger

    Lmao. Ahhh shut it, Tubby.

    Such a reasoned and cogent response.

  116. 616
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    And yes, it seems that Morgan is her name. Nothing else seems to fit properly. I may fiddle with it slightly (such as Morgaine or similar), but I think she and I have come to an understanding.

  117. 617
    ibyea

    On a lighter note (heh, pun intended), Deathnote Spongepants:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poHps71RkBk

    ^_^

  118. 618
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Oh, important: Don’t make any comments, please, about the fact that you can’t/won’t/wish you could donate to the Fuck Welfare fund. This is entirely voluntary and no one should be called out for whatever they choose to do. Please keep it private.

  119. 619
    chigau (違う)

    Josh
    look at kristinc #547.
    I’d still support your fund.

  120. 620
    rorschach

    If it has already been mentioned here, my apologies. I thought some people here might find this interesting : Rainbow Flags Over Margaret Court Arena

    Serendipitydawg

    Funny, and because of nothing in particular, I just watched ‘Inside the Actos’s Studio” with Ricky Gervais half an hour ago, and he mentions “serendipity” as the word he dislikes most…:)

    Now back to watching the David Warner Show.

  121. 621
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    chigau

    Josh
    look at kristinc #547.
    I’d still support your fund.

    It’s been a long day, and I’m sorry, but please help me by pointing out what I’m missing. :)) What did I overlook?

  122. 622
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    rorshach

    I think she went from hitting balls to talking balls for Jesus and now runs some fundie church in Perth. Hope she has a full free and frank discussion with Martina Navratilova, who is certainly more than capable of pointing out the flaws in Margaret’s “thinking”

  123. 623
    rorschach

    I think she went from hitting balls to talking balls for Jesus and now runs some fundie church in Perth.

    It’s her own fundie evangelical church in fact, and she preaches biblical literacy, and hate against homosexuals. Not a nice lady.

  124. 624
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    Weird, at least former boxers and American football players have the excuse of brain damage when they go full fundie, wonder what fried her brains?

  125. 625
    rorschach

    Oh, and what’s with this ? Salt Lake City Ranked ‘Gayest’ City in America in 2012

  126. 626
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    That, rorschach, is funny, is what that is.

  127. 627
    rorschach

    I can’t tell if the link above is a prank, actually, looking at their criteria for choosing the winner :

    This formula consisted of adding up points – which were assigned to cities based on things like the number of LGBT elected city officials, number of WNBA teams and the number of nude yoga classes – and then dividing that number by each city’s population.

  128. 628
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    Just looked at Wiki, apparently it’s her own church, preaching a version of the prosperity gospel. Apparently was raised Catholic and went Pentecostal in the ’70s

  129. 629
    andrewbrown not the one from the grauniad

    @ 625
    Nowt so queer as folk!

  130. 630
    Esteleth, [an error occurred while processing this directive]

    Well, I haz the sleepies. Goodnight, all.

  131. 631
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    So Happiestsadist emailed me this link and asked, “Why is this homophobic shit on FTB?”

    Good question. Both of us left comments there that, at this writing, remain in moderation.

    Sally: That’s a splendid essay by Wise. It ended up on DailyKos…. and, well, as you can imagine, a lot of squawking commenced. I’m not sure which contingent I despise more, the diehard Obama loyalists, or the lefties who freak out when asked to even think about their privilege.

    Walton: None of the other presidential candidates may be raising those issues, but other public figures who do not carry the same baggage Paul does are and have been raising them for some time. Decades, even. However, the corporatist media is unlikely to pay attention to people like Dennis Kucinich or, even more so, Angela Davis.

    I agree with LM here: The more positive attention Paul gets, the more his repulsive ideas are validated, along with his one or two good ideas that he arrived at in entirely different ways than we would.

    I’m a much stronger critic of Obama than Wise is, but I agree that too many people on the (nominal) left think that their political duties begin and end in the voting booth.

    Benjamin: Defriend. Who needs that crap.

  132. 632
    Mr. Fire

    It’s not a good idea to give any positive attention to Ron Paul. It’s entirely possible to say that Democratic candidates should be doing X Y and Z while not even mentioning the racist candidate who advocates X Y and Z.

    Sorry man, but sometimes I love you a little more than moderately.

  133. 633
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    @rorschach,

    Funny, and because of nothing in particular, I just watched ‘Inside the Actos’s Studio” with Ricky Gervais half an hour ago, and he mentions “serendipity” as the word he dislikes most…:)

    In the days before he became so ubiquitous he had a whole piece on words. I remember that serendipity was one of his bête noire and the reasons were certainly funny, but I can’t for the life of me remember even the gist of it!

    He had a thing about Schadenfreude as well, if I remember correctly.

    Oh well, 04:12 and the last instalment of David Copperfield has finished, so it’s time for bed! ‘nigh all.

  134. 634
    Ing

    I have a hippy “I have no religion, I’m not even a atheist” Zeitgeist dumbass acquaintance on Facebook who is promoting Paul blathering about how Paul is so awesome because his Hippocratic oath had him reject medicare and medicaid and treat people for free.

    Bullshit.

  135. 635
    Nutmeg

    I had an official Good Date (TM) last night, a first for me. We went to a tapas restaurant and had a few delicious dishes full of flavours I couldn’t identify. I’m embarrassingly old to be having my first enjoyable date, but it’s good to know it’s not impossible.

    Tonight I’m home nursing a head cold with ice cream and about to start watching Firefly for the first time. Various people online and in meatspace have raised my expectations – hopefully I enjoy it.

    The rest of the weekend will probably be spent in the lab, doing mindless benchwork for the paper that does not die and probably will be rejected anyway. Any suggestions of good podcasts to listen to while I’m working?

  136. 636
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    Can’t happen soon enough. Except, of course, that a power vacuum never stays that way.

  137. 637
    SallyStrange

    Salt Lake City, the gayest city? Do you think they were trying to get under the Mormons’ skin?

  138. 638
    rorschach

    Do you think they were trying to get under the Mormons’ skin?

    And in a funny way, yes, I think so…:-)

  139. 639
    rorschach

    Unless there’s something about nude yoga that I’m missing here…

    Treadmill time !

  140. 640
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ love moderately ॐ 515 (and previous)

    You make better suggestions in the debate on veils while drunk/hungover than I do sober.

    @ alanbagain 530 (& Tethys)

    If you have any two fluids flowing over each other, you will tend to get wave formation. By fluids we of course include water and air – which gives waves on a body of water – or air on air which gives those ripple like clouds one sometimes sees. But we should also include anything that has the ability to flow …. like sand, hence sand dunes (air/sand) or sandwaves/ripples (water/sand).

    (Sorry, my forgettory is working to well to go into the details off the top of my head.)

  141. 641
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Josh, I seriously don’t know what to say. I’m very touched that the Horde would be so concerned about me and my family, especially given that I’m barely even a regular. I’m pretty much blown away.

    I feel guilty about accepting help when I know none of us are going to actually have empty bellies, but I suspect that this is a function of learning to be ashamed of having financial difficulty — as long as there’s someone hungrier than me I don’t deserve help and shouldn’t complain, I bet you know the drill.

    So I’m torn between reiterating that my family isn’t in danger of starving, and saying that if the smart and kind people here think I’m worth sharing with, then I should accept it graciously and with thanks. So I guess I’ll do both. If anyone sends money we’ll use it for a treat that would otherwise have to be cut out of the budget.

  142. 642
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ rorschach

    Followed your linky and clicked away. Ended up on a site called “christianhire”. There are apparently things called “christian jobs”. What next “christian maths”?

    The most important qualification is: “Must agree with CP’s Statement of Faith.” The rest is padding.

    (Kind of thing you would expect from Monty Python. “Neurosurgeon required. Must believe: “… God, in His own time and in His own way, will raise the dead and that Christ will judge all men in righteousness. The unrighteous will be consigned to Hell, the place of everlasting punishment. The righteous, in their resurrected and glorified bodies, will receive their reward and will dwell forever in Heaven with the Lord.”” What planet are we on?)

  143. 643
    Gyeong Hwa

    Hello Thread! :3

  144. 644
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    So Happiestsadist emailed me this link and asked, “Why is this homophobic shit on FTB?”

    Good question. Both of us left comments there that, at this writing, remain in moderation.

    Um, yeah. Edwin Kagan can go fuck himself. Homophobic son of a bitch thinks it’s funny to joke that he’d rather die, or let his friend die, than “suck the poison” out of a penis.

    Piss off you bastard.

  145. 645
    Hekuni Cat, MQG

    JeffreyD, I hope you feel better soon. *virtual hug* – which totally avoids the whole contagion thing.

  146. 646
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    And just so no one accuses me of taking anything out of context, here’s what Kagin said:

    Some years ago, on a camping trip, my friend Joe Ray and I resolved that should one of us be unfortunate enough to be bitten on the penis by a venomous serpent, and oral suction by the other was the only life saving measure available, then the afflicted party would simply have to die. My liberated stepdaughter finds this view “homophobic,” meaning fear of homosexuality. I don’t think so. I am not afraid of homosexuality; I simply find the idea of people of the same sex having sex unaesthetic and curious and do not understand why up to ten percent of the world’s population wants to do that.

    Source: http://freethoughtblogs.com/kagin/2012/01/12/on-homosexuality/#comment-827

    Fuck you Edwin Kagin. You just bought yourself a date with one fightin’ faggot.

  147. 647
    Weedless Monkey

    Josh, the email address you gave doesn’t work. Please fix :)

  148. 648
  149. 649
    Weedless Monkey

    Thanks, got it. I figured that “spokesgey@” was a typo, but didn’t want to risk it.

  150. 650
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    I can’t stand it. I’m just furious:

    My liberated stepdaughter

    Yeah, she’s (har-har-har) “liberated”. As in “silly young folk and feminists, thinking they’re all revolutionary.”

    No, fucker. She’s enlightened and humane. Unlike her retrograde embarrassingly archaic father. I’m so very sorry we can’t offer you a seat in 1965 Class – all the seats are full up, Sir.

  151. 651
    Walton

    Walton: None of the other presidential candidates may be raising those issues, but other public figures who do not carry the same baggage Paul does are and have been raising them for some time. Decades, even. However, the corporatist media is unlikely to pay attention to people like Dennis Kucinich or, even more so, Angela Davis.

    True – indeed, I said as much at #544 above. But that’s precisely the problem to which we need to seek a solution. Among other things, Paul has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the public mind with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex. While Dennis Kucinich, Barney Frank, Russ Feingold, etc., have equally good or better records on these issues, Paul is the one who gets listened to. That isn’t good, but it seems to be the way it is.

    I’ve had this experience several times, when I’m talking about abuses of civil liberties, and a libertarian friend or acquaintance chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul. I always explain that I don’t support Paul because of his pandering to racists on issues of immigration and “states’ rights”, his own racist history, and his extreme anti-choice stance on abortion. And of course Paul’s really not a libertarian in any real sense, civil or otherwise; he’s a traditional Southern paleoconservative. He wants a smaller federal government, but he seems to be perfectly happy to let state and local governments be as oppressive as they please, without any check from the federal courts or federal civil rights laws. That isn’t what I’d call a commitment to individual freedom. So, on one level, I agree with Wise; and I’m annoyed that Paul has hijacked the issue of civil liberties, and the support of most libertarians, despite being profoundly illiberal on some very important issues of personal freedom with huge implications for millions of women, immigrants and ethnic minorities.

    What I really want, then, is to figure out how to present a stronger progressive voice on issues of personal freedom, and build bridges between liberals and (genuine) libertarians on those issues, while marginalizing racist pseudo-libertarians like Paul and not letting them hijack this movement to promote themselves.

  152. 652
    rorschach

    Who’s this Kagan fellow ?

    *goes looking*

  153. 653
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Rorschach:

    He’s a Freethought Blogs blogger. And if I remember correctly, one of the founders of Camp Quest. I believe his wife, Helen, died in the past year or so. Someone who’s done great things for secularism, but needs smacked upside the head for this.

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/kagin/2012/01/12/on-homosexuality/#comment-827

  154. 654
    Walton

    Yeah, I saw Kagin’s post earlier. That anecdote at the beginning was homophobic and pointlessly nasty. (And bizarre; I didn’t really see what the point was, or what it added to his argument.)

  155. 655
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Josh

    Kagan

    Methinks that he doth protest too much.

    What a bizarre start to his screed. Perhaps he feels the need to distance himself from accusations of having teh geyh for what he has to say thereafter. And then close with the same manner of brainfart.

    Kagan: “I want to talk about “On Homosexuality” but I’m not gay, I’m not! Srsly! Please believe me …. look I’ll add a snide remark to prove it. Look, I brought my snakebite kit! Seee…”

    Theophontes: “I’ll be in my bunk.”

  156. 656
    JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness

    Hey everyone, hope all is well. I unfortunately can never keep up with TET.

    I have a problem. I’ve lost all of my bookmarks and am trying to find the ones for feminist/rape/abortion issues, most of which I got from here actually. I’ve looked on the wiki but I couldn’t find a page for that info. I’ve started looking through the older threads but that will take forever since my google fu is weak. I can’t remember any of the site you guys always link. =(

    Anyone have a reference handy, can link me a post that has it or could email me a list of links? I’d greatly appreciate it, if not its cool.

  157. 657
    JAL: Snark, Sarcasm & Bitterness

    Oh Christ on a stick, I just read the last few comments and now I feel like an ass. I’m so sorry =/

  158. 658
    SallyStrange

    Hey, allow me to show off my handiwork for a minute. Observe my first successful crocheted hat! #2 is already halfway done.

    http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/827/photo91w.jpg/

  159. 659
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Lurker,

    Nothing to apologize for or feel sorry about, really.

  160. 660
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    If someone could please remind me tomorrow that the Melody Stuck In My Head That I Must Put Into Musical Notation is in f minor I’d be much obliged. Too lazy to write it down tonight. Thank you.

  161. 661
    SallyStrange

    (And bizarre; I didn’t really see what the point was, or what it added to his argument.)

    Well, like Theophontes pointed out, it mostly seems to function as a “I AM TOTALLY NOT GAY, SEE HOW GROSSED OUT I AM BY GAY STUFF!” announcement.

    Which, you know, non-homophobic people would feel no need to insert in a post about gay rights.

  162. 662
    SallyStrange

    F minor, got it.

  163. 663
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    There is no point to Kagin’s screed except crystal pure ignorance. He’s so bloody unaware of how wrapped up he is in hetero guy privilege that it doesn’t even occur to him that there’s something almost sociopathic about saying “I’d sooner die or watch my friend die than I would have to touch his penis with my mouth to save his life.”

    It’s such a ridiculous and contrived scenario, of course. And it’s telling.

  164. 664
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ SallyStrange

    Sorry, the linky didn’t work for me. (But I am sure it is a damn fine hat.)

    Re: Kagan

    What would he do if the hypothetical snake bit his bestest male friend on the hypothetical bum? … or best female friend? … a child?

    It is not even about SEX for god’s FSM’s sake, it is about saving a person’s life.

  165. 665
    Tethys

    Kagan’s post is not amusing. Homophobic jokes are offensive, unless you’re animated Bette Davis.

    The Snake Bite

    Sally

    Nice work!

  166. 666
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Homophobic jokes are offensive, unless you’re animated Bette Davis.</blockquote.

    Tethys, I heart you! You get it.

    “Heels!”

  167. 667
    Inaji

    Josh, I’ll send a bit of money for Kristinc. It’s fine with me if you want to organize it, but we can also send direct. Up to Kristinc.

    :mutters I prolly lost your house address, I’ll dig for it tomorrow:

    Kagin, asspimple homophobe:

    should one of us be unfortunate enough to be bitten on the penis by a venomous serpent, and oral suction by the other was the only life saving measure available, then the afflicted party would simply have to die.

    I simply find the idea of people of the same sex having sex

    Just what universe is this asspimple inhabiting, where saving a person’s life is sex?

  168. 668
    rorschach

    Kagan :

    But there are many things I find annoying, don’t understand, don’t want to do, and don’t know why anyone else would want to do, like being left-handed

    Surely, he’s not that stupid ? Surely ?

  169. 669
    The Sailor

    Bah, it’s an old stupid joke and the punchline is “the doctor says you’re going to die.”
    As a scenario it’s slightly less believable than the ticking bomb/terrorist torture trope.

    Never double down on ignorance, you can’t win, and you end up being twice as ignorant.

  170. 670
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Surely, he’s not that stupid ? Surely ?

    Never overestimate the self-awareness of other people. You’ve been witness to the sexism wars, Rorschach. This is just another sad, tired, common iteration of same. I’ve been dealing with it my entire life as an out gay man.

    Homophobia is just a baroque elaboration on good old-fashioned misogyny.

  171. 671
    Inaji

    My comment to Kagin is awaiting moderation. It may or may not show up, so here it is:

    What’s going on in your little universe that you equate saving someone’s life with sex? I have a bit of news for you – sucking venom out of a body part is not a blow job, nor is it sex.

    For you to say something like this is, indeed, homophobic and it’s also amazingly stupid. Personally, I am disgusted and dismayed to see such utter shit posted at Freethought blogs.

    Exactly why were you and your friend discussing such a situation in the first place? Playing a game of “I’d suck you here to remove venom but not there?” And you honestly didn’t bother to give any thought to this idiocy?

    Kudos to your stepdaughter, in spite of your asinine descriptor of liberated who recognizes homophobia when she sees/hears it.

    I’m sure it feels good, Mr. Kagin, to have your head so firmly lodged up your anus, but you might want to pull it out for a bit. Get some air.

  172. 672
    theophontes (恶六六六缓步动物)

    @ Caine

    Your comment is awaiting moderation.

    It appears that my seconding of your comment is awaiting moderation.

  173. 673
    Inaji

    Theophontes:

    It appears that my seconding of your comment is awaiting moderation.

    I have my doubts as to their appearance, as Kagin took a defensive and remarkably stupid stance with the last post before ours. He seems determined to have his homophobia and deny it too.

  174. 674
    rorschach

    My quest to find every bit of film work that Maggie Q has ever done has turned up a most peculiar yet strangely fascinating and compelling movie called Priest. You should watch it !

  175. 675
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    How old is Kagin? As The Sailor points out, it’s a reference to an oooold joke. A homophobic and stupid old joke. I’d be inclined to cut him some slack if he’s maybe over 60 or so, because all the rest of what he writes is supportive of gay rights.

    And by “cut him some slack” I don’t mean letting it pass, but just being a bit gentle in pointing it out. Poor old creaky dude was brought up in a bad bit of history… (half snark half serious.)

  176. 676
    strange gods before me ॐ

    True – indeed, I said as much at #544 above. But that’s precisely the problem to which we need to seek a solution.

    I guarantee you it doesn’t involve libertarianism as a template.

    Among other things, Paul has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the public mind with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    Dude Glenn Greenwald has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the minds of those who read his column with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    That’s why there’s no well-considered reason for Greenwald to lean on Paul like this. If he needs the clicks, he can get them with fuck Paul for not owning up to racism.

    +++++
    Walton, I don’t think anybody is actually providing you with segues to your talking points.

    I’ve had this experience several times, when I’m talking about abuses of civil liberties, and a libertarian friend or acquaintance chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

    This has nothing to do with anything. Tim was talking about when one’s leftist acquaintance or maybe The goddamn Nation chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

  177. 677
    strange gods before me ॐ

    True – indeed, I said as much at #544 above. But that’s precisely the problem to which we need to seek a solution.

    I guarantee it doesn’t involve libertarianism as a template.

    Among other things, Paul has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the public mind with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    Dude Glenn Greenwald has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the minds of those who read his column with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    That’s why there’s no well-considered reason for Greenwald to lean on Paul like this. If he needs the clicks, he can get them with fuck Paul for not owning up to racism.

    +++++
    Walton, I don’t think anybody is actually providing you with segues to your talking points.

    I’ve had this experience several times, when I’m talking about abuses of civil liberties, and a libertarian friend or acquaintance chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

    This has nothing to do with anything. Tim was talking about when one’s leftist acquaintance or maybe The goddamn Nation chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

  178. 678
    strange gods before me ॐ

    True – indeed, I said as much at #544 above. But that’s precisely the problem to which we need to seek a solution.

    I guarantee it doesn’t involve libertarianism as a template.

    Among other things, Paul has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the public mind with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    Dude Glenn Greenwald has done a pretty effective job of promoting his own brand in this regard, such that his name is heavily associated in the minds of those who read his column with civil liberties and rolling back the security-industrial complex.

    That’s why there’s no well-considered reason for Greenwald to lean on Paul like this. If he needs the clicks, he can get them with fuck Paul for not owning up to racism.

    +++++
    Walton, I don’t think anybody is actually providing you with segues to your talking points.

    I’ve had this experience several times, when I’m talking about abuses of civil liberties, and a libertarian friend or acquaintance chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

    Nothing to do with anything. Tim was talking about when one’s leftist acquaintance or maybe The goddamn Nation chimes in with a comment supportive of Paul.

  179. 679
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Hi there
    I’m just skimming through, so sorry if I missed something.

    kristinc
    That’s fucking sick. Please, don’t feel bad, guilty, whatever. It’s not a character fault to be poor.

    Those eeebil homosexuals
    Well, since the pope told us that homosexuals endager mankind itself, and the nice bishop alarmed us, that the UNESCO wants to turn us gay anyway, Mr. and I have been discussing whether we need to stop having contact with his brother in order to avoid contracting Teh Gay.
    But then we figured out that, since the little one has taken to calling me “little daddy” as oposed to “daddy”, it’s probably too late anyway.

  180. 680
    NuMad

    I thought the word “deviation” had a negative moral connotation, so I was surprised when I read it used by Kagin to describe both homosexuality and left-handedness, side by side with a disclaimer that he doesn’t think that either are morally reprehensible.

    Either I’m mistaken or Kagin might be a little tone deaf.

  181. 681
    Kevin, Youhao Huo Mao

    @carlie (last night, I was asleep):

    Thanks for the compliment. Wasn’t really the point like you said, but getting compliments is a good thing too.

  182. 682
    JeffreyD

    Re #674 – Priest is a surprisingly good movie and second rorschach’s recommendation. Also recently enjoyed Pontypool and Tucker and Dale Vs Evil. I got Lost Command for xmas and am saving that for a rainy day. Been watching a lot of free movies on Amazon Prime on the computer since I have been ill this past week. Watched Purple Rain last night, still enjoy the ending couple of songs.

    Hiya to the H Cat and virtual (sterile) hugs back.

  183. 683
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    What would he do if the hypothetical snake bit his bestest male friend on the hypothetical bum? … or best female friend? … a child?

    It is not even about SEX for god’s FSM’s sake, it is about saving a person’s life.

    Well, now you went and did it… you went and got me wondering. I remember reading in a survival guide somewhere or other that the old ‘suck the poison out of the wound’ trick emphatically DOES NOT WORK.

    Not only is it a crude and unfunny homophobic joke, IT’S NOT EVEN ACCURATE.

    If any of you are ever bitten anywhere on the body by a poisonous snake, genitals or otherwise, please seek prompt medical attention, and please do not attempt to suck the poison out.

  184. 684
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    *thinking, not wondering. Brainfart.

  185. 685
    Weedless Monkey

    Well, it truly is Freethoughtblogs. Kagin being homophobic,
    Fincke giving it up and leaving his spot for for some wiccan apologetic, and this Loftus guy doing… I don’t even know what.

  186. 686
    rorschach

    Deep rifts ! Must sleep.

  187. 687
    PZ Myers

    NEW THREAD!

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