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Dec 31 2011

Episode CCLXXXVII: Them’s good Martians

I have some concerns about the Disneyfication of the classic pulp novel, A Princess of Mars; I’m sure Disney wouldn’t have much trouble with Burroughs’ casual racism, and I see they have an out for the violence — green blood everywhere is OK — but I doubt the casual nudity will make it to the screen. One really good thing, though: those are truly excellent CGI Barsoomians.

And it’s being released for my birthday! How sweet!

(Episode CCLXXXVI: Escape from Wisconsin!)

689 comments

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  1. 1
    chigau (違う)

    ha I

  2. 2
    The Sailor

    From http://notalwaysright.com/:
    Customer: “I’d like 50 Christmas stamps, please.”

    Me: “What denomination?”

    Customer: *befuddled* “Oh, my, has it come to this? Um, give me 22 Catholic, 12 Presbyterian, 10 Lutheran and 6 of the Baptists.”

  3. 3
    The Sailor

    Oh, hai, chigau. Kthxbai.

  4. 4
    Eurasian magpie

    Loved Mars books. Some were even illustrated and it really bothered me that females wore so much clothing when the text explicitely stated that red martians wear only a leather harness.

  5. 5
    SallyStrange

    Womanist Musings is excellent!

    http://www.womanist-musings.com/

    Just thought I’d repeat that for emphasis.

  6. 6
    danielroseman

    I’m sorry, but every time I see that shot of Woola I keep thinking of the Moog from ’80s British kids cartoon Willo The Wisp.

  7. 7
    hillaryrettig

    Nice doggie.

  8. 8
    Kagehi

    but I doubt the casual nudity will make it to the screen

    Just have to wait for the guys that made Pirates, and several other clones, to make, “A Princess Does Mars”. lol

    But, yeah, kind of fed up with the fact that nudity is such a big deal for a lot of bloody stupid people, to the point where even a show “about” the human body, or the like, gets blurred, and movies… one set of breast gets you like R, but two gets you M, or some stupid nonsense? How ever it works, its really idiotic.

  9. 9
    skeptifem

    I didn’t go back to the hot for student thread until this morning. Never thought I would see regulars try to silence me because I was raped. I’m taking a break for awhile from pharyngula. I defended this place when other people said it wasn’t a safe space for women, you know? fuck.

  10. 10
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Ugh re that trailer. Yet another long computer-generated video game blown up to big screen size.

  11. 11
    PZ Myers

    That’s no video game, it’s a pulp novel from 1911 — they hadn’t even imagined video games yet. It has a plot and everything!

  12. 12
    chigau (違う)

    *ahem*
    SallyStrange @672 previous thread
    Ha! I just “discovered” Womanist Musings.
    I ♥ it muchly.
    -
    -
    -
    series of portcullis and cutpaste incidents =
    ha I

  13. 13
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    PZ- I was referring to the visuals. I’m so tired of ubiquitous and overdone CGI in movies. The directors never know when enough is enough. If something can be done then it will be done. So the whole thing looks like a video game. Tears me right out of anything resembling a plot or narrative.

  14. 14
    PZ Myers

    OK, except that there’s no way to do Barsoom without CGI.

  15. 15
    SallyStrange

    @ Chigau

    Yay!

  16. 16
    timgueguen

    Barsoom can easily be done without CGI. Just use styrofoam and bad rubber masks like every pre 1995 sci fi production did.

  17. 17
    stubby

    When I was eleven I was obsessed with the John Carter series. It’s too bad HBO didn’t snag the rights and make a series out of it.

  18. 18
    Cipher

    I didn’t go back to the hot for student thread until this morning. Never thought I would see regulars try to silence me because I was raped. I’m taking a break for awhile from pharyngula. I defended this place when other people said it wasn’t a safe space for women, you know? fuck.

    Skeptifem, I must have missed it (because I wasn’t reading that thread very carefully), but for what it’s worth, I’m sorry that happened and I don’t support it. I hope your break is helpful and pleasant. *off to read*

  19. 19
    Cosmic Snark

    OK, except that there’s no way to do Barsoom without CGI.

    Ed Wood disagrees with you.

  20. 20
    opposablethumbs

    Late and semi-bankrupt, but I hope getting laid off turns out brilliantly for you Illuminata, whichever route you take.

  21. 21
    Sonja

    I read all ERB Earth’s Core books when I was 13 and I think the only Mars book I read was this one. Seeing this trailer makes me want to spend the afternoon re-reading it (but too much other crap to do).

  22. 22
    christophergwyn

    They made another significant change beyond dropping the nudity. The ‘human’ Martians appear to all be white people. Burroughs was quite clear that the predominate ‘human race’ on Mars was ‘red-skinned’. A little skin dye would have helped the book-accuracy of the movie quite a bit. I would have gone for a ‘very tanned Caucasian’ shade with a little bit more of a actual red tone than usually occurs here on Earth. (I wonder if they are going to keep the egg-laying, and if recently hatched Martians have an ‘egg-tooth’, or perhaps ‘egg-claws’ to help them break their way out of the shell.)

  23. 23
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh:

    Yet another long computer-generated video game blown up to big screen size.

    Pfffft. If the computer animated movies were half as good as, well, pretty much any of the popular video games, no one would be complaining.

    The problem is that they tend to be schlock. The animation is a gimmick and the rest of the movie (acting, script, whatever) can’t hold up on its own.

    I’m so tired of ubiquitous and overdone CGI in movies. The directors never know when enough is enough. If something can be done then it will be done.

    One of the big reasons why I love Guillermo del Toro so much is because he mixes animation, puppets, makeup effects, and whatnot to achieve beautiful visuals.

    Anyway, has anyone ever baked with ricotta cheese? I’m making a orange/ricotta pound cake and the batter was whoa thick. Like I had to spoon it into the Bundt pan– there was no pouring happening. Should I be worried?

  24. 24
    feralboy12

    OK, except that there’s no way to do Barsoom without CGI.

    Ray Harryhausen also disagrees with you.

  25. 25
    varys

    It looks like it borrows heavily from Avatar’s visual style, which is a bit of a disappointment. I was hoping for something more like the Frank Frazetta artwork.

  26. 26
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Also, I saw the John Carter trailer last night before Sherlock Holmes. Meh. I’m just not excited about it at all*.

    The Dark Knight Rises, on the other hand….

    *Mr Darkheart and his brother were positively giddy over the trailer.

    Nerds.

  27. 27
    Ingdigo Jump

    Hell, I think Jim Henson would disagree with you.

    Yoda looked better as a puppet.

  28. 28
    Russell

    I recognize the character in the opening still from his reward posters – It’s Jabba the Hutterite, wanted for beard-cutting in nine worlds , five dimensions and Ohio

    I

  29. 29
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Audley -

    On ricotta. . .I’ll bet it will be good even if the batter is thick.

    Movies. . .I wish they’d go back to using more physical effects. They just look more real every time. I especially disliked that the Enterprise in the last Star Trek movie was never a physical model, all CGI. Did it look good? Sure. But no, it simply did not look as imposing and real as an actual detailed physical model.

  30. 30
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh,
    We’ll find out in about 2 minutes when the cake comes out of the oven. If it rose properly, I’ll consider it a success.

  31. 31
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Never mind– success! The cake puffed right up.

  32. 32
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Yes, and sadly that involves giving up on hoping to have any meaningful discussion with any of the incarnations of SGBM ever.

    rorschach, you know that’s an exaggeration.

  33. 33
    shouldbeworking

    I loved the Barsoom books as a little kid. I am willing to give the movie a chance, there are so few movies that remotely interest me. Anyone planning to see “Tinker, Tailor”? I loved the book and the miniseries.

  34. 34
    Inaji

    Audley:

    Never mind– success! The cake puffed right up.

    Yay! Happy New Year’s Eve. :)

  35. 35
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Shouldbeworking,
    Yep, I’m planning to see Tinker Tailor next Friday. I ♥ Gary Oldman.

    Josh,
    Was it you that recommended using a piazza stone for baking? I just tried it and, damn, that’s my first even cake. :)

  36. 36
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Or, the non-autocorrected version: “pizza stone”.

    Why isn’t “pizza” in my dictionary?

  37. 37
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Caine:

    Happy New Year’s Eve. :)

    You too!

    May all of your baked goods rise properly in 2012.

    … Or something like that. ;)

  38. 38
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Yes, Audley, I suggested the piazza stone (I like that better!). Never thought of using it for cake, but it makes total sense that it would spread the heat out for even cooking.

  39. 39
    chigau (違う)

    fucking google

  40. 40
    Russell

    there’s no way to do Barsoom without CGI.

    But PZ, the Martian’s max out at eight arms and only come in five colors- all you have to do is teach cuttlefish method acting

  41. 41
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    *pant, pant, pant*
    I’m almost caught up. Just the latest posts…AUGHHH

  42. 42
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh,
    After you had mentioned using the pizza stone, I was wondering what I should use it for (besides bread). Alton Brown suggests just leaving it* on the bottom rack permanently to help control oven temp.

    Considering that my oven is sooooo oooooooold**, it needs a lot of help to work properly.

    *Actually, he said to use bricks ‘cos they’re cheaper.

    **Remember when that off-white “almond” color was popular for appliances? That’s how old my oven is. And it’s electric, booooo!

  43. 43
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Remember when that off-white “almond” color was popular for appliances? That’s how old my oven is. And it’s electric, booooo!

    I remember when “avocado” was the hot color.

  44. 44
    carlie

    Haven’t sent Christmas cards in years (I can never get through the end of semester with enough energy to do them in time), but still get a few from my stronghold dearest friends. Now I just bought some happy monkey cards, so I have something to send them back and it doesn’t look like it’s late! Yay!

  45. 45
    shouldbeworking

    Every time I read a comment by Dr. Audrey, I am entertained, educated and/or drooling for fresh baking. Is this a coincidence?

    Does the god Dr.have kitchen minions to do the washing up? My kids can’t tell if the dishwasher is full f clean dishes or is empty.

  46. 46
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    shouldbeworking:
    Thanks! You’re sweet.

    Sadly, I have no minions. Mr Darkheart does the dishes after meals, but I wouldn’t wish my baking mess on my worst enemy, so I do my own cleaning up.

    PS: Audley. ;)

  47. 47
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Does the god Dr.have kitchen minions to do the washing up? My kids can’t tell if the dishwasher is full f clean dishes or is empty.

    The Redhead bought a magnetic sign years ago, a hexagon with “clean” and “dirty” on opposite sides, facing in opposite directions. The sign gets rotated 180º when the dishwasher is run, and when it it emptied. Works for us.

  48. 48
    carlie

    Ha! I just “discovered” Womanist Musings.
    I ♥ it muchly.

    That’s definitely a good blog. We need to make a listing of all the blogs we read, so that all the goodnesses can be shared. :)

    Here’s most of mine in my reader, ftb blogs and pharyngulite blogs excluded:

    Feminist/human-positive blogs
    Hoyden about town
    Uppercase woman
    Two whole cakes
    Red no. 3
    Manboobz
    the rotund
    tiger beatdown
    FWD/Forward (defunct, but archives still intact)
    feministe
    angry black bitch
    Pam’s house blend
    Womanist Musings
    Kate Harding
    microaggressions

    Atheist/science/related blogs
    Slacktivist
    panda’s thumb
    atheist experience
    friendly atheist
    daylight atheism
    Coyote Crossing

    Random fun blogs
    awful library books
    Miss Conduct
    Indexed
    hyperbole and a half
    cooking for geeks
    the ridiculous food society of upstate new york
    the mary sue
    not always right
    clients from hell

  49. 49
    shouldbeworking

    Rotten autocorrect. Sorry about that Dr. Audlley. There, I put 2 in because I figue I owe you one and I deleted an ‘r’.

    The cake smells good…damn diet! I’m hallucinating again, aren’t I?

  50. 50
    javierdelgado

    ups… I am 54 and almost cry of joy at the trailer…

    But when I talk to my daughter about Rice Burroughs and Jhon Carter they simply asked , who?..

    Seems the younger generation need to be educated.

    The martian Saga from Rice Burroughs consists of 11 novels:

    A Princess of Mars
    The Gods of Mars (1918)
    The Warlord of Mars (1919)
    Thuvia, Maid of Mars (1920)
    The Chessmen of Mars (1922)
    The Master Mind of Mars (1928)
    A Fighting Man of Mars (1931)
    Swords of Mars (1936)
    Synthetic Men of Mars (1940)
    Llana of Gathol (1948)
    John Carter of Mars (1964)

    And while they can be enjoyed much better if you read between 12 and 19, I think they are better than some more recent novels.

  51. 51
    Tethys

    I remember when “avocado” was the hot color.

    Me too, along with “harvest gold” and a color that was supposed to be bronze, though it was actually a brown with a very orange cast.

    My parents installed some hideous patterned carpeting that had all three colors in the kitchen. It was sold as a miracle carpet fiber that repelled all liquids. Yet another stupid fad from the late sixties/early seventies.

  52. 52
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    shouldbeworking:
    Hell, I was fighting the auto-correct too– I finally got off my lazy ass and turned on the laptop.

    Just to fuel the hallucinations: I made an orange/ricotta pound cake, baked in a Bundt pan, with a really heavy, moist consistency. It just has to cool for a few minutes longer before I make the marmalade glaze.

    I don’t know how I’m going to keep my hands off of it until my parents get here.

  53. 53
    Cipher

    Carlie! Carlie! *bounce* You should add the Mark Does Stuff blogs! Awesome reviews of books and shows, from a geeky, hilarious atheist blogger concerned with and informed about social justice issues!

    Sorry, I’m just all obsessed with those blogs right now.

  54. 54
    chigau (違う)

    Tethys
    Yeah. Carpeting in the kitchen. That was a genius move.
    Did you have carpet in the bathroom, too?

  55. 55
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Still Threadrupt.

    But I am home (and typing on a real keyboard!). We drove straight home from Florida (well, with two gas stops, four restroom stops, and one meal stop (we had some fast food shit (not even sure what it was, but Girl was sol as they had no clue that vegans even exist (to be fair, it was central North Carolina)))) — 1,064 miles in 17 hours flat (and still came in at almost 28mpg).

    Tonight, we wil be having brie baked in Pillsbury Crescent Roll dough, nachos made with blue corn and topped with black beans, onions, cheese, and some homemade carne asada steak, and I will be trying out some Rock Art beer from Vermont.

    I also just ordered to palaeontology books (one on the history of amphibians, and a book by Weisshampel about dinosaurs) and a new tent for summer camping — one in which I can actually stand up.

    ===

    I enjoyed A Princess of Mars back in high high school. I should read it again to see if I still enjoy it.

  56. 56
    shouldbeworking

    Yeah, I should mark a set of atomic physics exams, but there’s this book daughter #1 got me for Xmas “How to Teach Quantum Physics to Your Dog”. I figure if I practice on the neighbour’s dog, I could have a dog that could outsmart the 2 cats who rule my house and then next semester’s students might learn something too. My library has grown a lot since she started working at the bookstore.

  57. 57
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    Made a trip to Central VA to see some good friends after Xmas. In addition to lemongrass chicken and vainitas de pollo (Peruvian chicken with green beans), homemade bread was on the menu. My wife Chelle is a GOOD baker. She makes great bread. Our friend in VA had been having difficulty producing anything but bricks after a hiatus from baking for several years. So they decided to collaborate.

    Our friend has a flour mill–in goes the wheat and out comes a nice light flour with lots of bran. The resulting bread was the best freakin’ bread I’ve ever had. A nice crust and soft moist whole wheat goodness in the interior. Even the next day, the small amount of the two loaves that remained was as good as most bread is right out of the oven.

    So, now we’re looking at flour mills–at about $500 for a good one, but the bread was that much better. Anyone else grind their own flour?

  58. 58
    chigau (違う)

    Welcome back, Brother Ogvorbis.

    I just did a Set for the first time im months: 4 min 37 sec.
    just pitiful

  59. 59
    chigau (違う)

    arids
    We got a small hand-grinder at a garage sale.
    It is a good aerobic work-out and we don’t use it often but we’ve ground corn, wheat, qinoa and poppy-seeds with great success.

  60. 60
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I remember when “avocado” was the hot color.

    Don’t forget the absofuckinglutely hideous Harvest Gold.

    a color that was supposed to be bronze, though it was actually a brown with a very orange cast.

    I really should read more before I start writing my comments.

    Me mam called that Burnt Orange.

    We lived in government housing in the early and mid-seventies (1970s, smartass!). When the NPS bought new appliances (ovens and refrigerators) for the park housing, they did not bother to colour coordinate. We ended up with an Avocado fridge and a burnt orange oven. Odd, though. It only took about three weeks for the park residents to trade them around to get matching colours. Which, of course, drove the property person at the park nuts. Well, maybe not that one, but whoever had to handle the survey outs when they died.

    Welcome back, Brother Ogvorbis.

    Thanks. Good to be back. I hate hotel showers. They never feel right. Nor do the beds.

  61. 61
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    I … I kind of like avocado green.

  62. 62
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    I … I kind of like avocado green.

    I kinda like it, too. Even harvest gold and burnt orange are nice colours. In the 70s, though. Damn. They just put those colours on everydamnthing. Cars, appliances, clothes, dinner plates, wallpaper, carpets, on anything that didn’t move. I remember looking at an apartment in WV (in 1990) that had avocado green, burnt orange and harvest gold wallpaper. In every room. And I mean every room.

  63. 63
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Avocado. Huega carpet tiles. Brown corduroy. Electric hobs.

    Oh Gods, stop it, please. It’s scary. *shudder*

  64. 64
    chigau (違う)

    kristinc
    The appliances called “avocado” green, weren’t.
    They were “bilious” green.
    The thought of a kitchen with avocado green and harvest gold fills me with horror.

  65. 65
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Bro Og: yeah. I think its the combination of three equally strong colors that makes for the queasiness. Some of those colors are stylish again now, probably because of vintage-modern decorating trends, but I like the way they’re being used a lot more: avocado green with creamy white, or harvest gold with very pale turquoise, or burnt orange with soft gray. That’s the ticket.

    chigau: yep, familiar with it. I’ve bought a few vintage pieces in gen-yoo-wine avocado green (not appliances, although honestly, I probably would if I got the chance).

  66. 66
    chigau (違う)

    Years from now they will look back on our stainless steel kitchens and wonder why we wanted to cook in something that looked like looked like an autopsy lab.

  67. 67
    feralboy12

    They were “bilious” green.

    Is that the color Frank Zappa called “dysentery green?”
    Then there’s that abomination called “teal.” I don’t know if anyone made appliances in that color, but damn near every new sports team in the 90′s chose it.
    (The Zappa reference is from a song called “Let’s Make The Water Turn Black” from We’re Only In It For The Money.)

  68. 68
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Brown corduroy.

    Yup. Had that. Three piece dark brown wide-wale corduroy, complete with suede patches on the elbows. I wore it with a nylon shirt which had collar points that went down to my nipples, a very, very, very wide diagonally striped blue tie, and dark brown suede Earth Shoes with crepe soles.

    I really hate that photo.

    ===============

    kristinc:

    Yeah. Combined wiht other colours they work. As giant blobs of hideousness, they fail massively.

  69. 69
    SallyStrange

    This guy is just BEGGING for a verbal stomping. Seriously, he’s asking for it.

    Is it bigotry when it’s satire?

    But am I comfortable labeling this behavior as “misogyny”, “bigotry”, and “racism”? No, I am not. This is something different. It is satire. It is some of the strangest and edgiest satire that anyone can imagine. And I think that is part of the appeal. But this is not real bigotry. These people do not actually believe these statements.

    And that is an important distinction. I have carefully catalogued the real bigots above. They aren’t trying to get a rise out of anyone. They have real, bigoted opinions. And they actually believe them.

    You may call the people on b and r/atheism horrible, horrible trolls who push free speech to the most profound limits out of morbid curiosity. And if you accused them of this, they would probably completely agree with you. But real bigots, they are not.

    Dude claims to be a skeptic supportive of egalitarianism. Yeah, not so much.

  70. 70
    Tethys

    Chigau

    Did you have carpet in the bathroom, too?

    No, thank goodness. The salesman did try his darnedest, but my Mum was not enthralled with the idea of a carpeted bathroom.

    Welcome home Oggie! I too love my own bed, and never sleep well in hotel rooms.

    I … I kind of like avocado green.

    I like it with aqua blue. But as Oggie said above, it was on everything in the 70′s. I remember having some particularly ugly pants (which I eventually hid behind my dresser) that combined gold, avocado, burnt orange, and a shade I call baby-shit brown. *shudder*

  71. 71
    shouldbeworking

    Teal isn’t a colour, it’s a bird! My mom had the avocado stove and fridge, she was quite pleased with them. Colour doesn’t mean much to me, male, old and colour-blind. To coin a phrase ” colour: it’s only a theory!” when my students ask what colour the lasers are I reply “532nm of course!”

  72. 72
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    a shade I call baby-shit brown.

    I had forgotten that colour.

    And now I remember it again. Thank you for that shitty memory.

  73. 73
    jaimeoria

    re ERB and this cine-thing called ‘John Carter’ – of Peoria? of the Bank of the West? – from some of the artwork I’ve seen (never a reliable guide I know) they seem to be going down some misconceived grim n gritty path that totally misses the appeal of ERBs work, for all its hackiness. Where’s all the damn’ color? Not just the red of Barsoom, but the gold and bronze and glitter? To me, it’s all about lush decadence surrounded by sere desert – and awesome desert at that (think Monument Valley, Goblin Canyon UT etc on geologic steroids). And costume-wise you can go pretty darn skimp-tacular sans nudity if what I’ve seen of Brazilian Carnivale is a reliable guide…

  74. 74
    jaimeoria

    Oh – and as far as Deja Thoris being oviparous, read this:

    http://www.tor.com/stories/2008/12/the-film-makers-of-mars

    for a brain-frying and squicky take on that notion. It’s short, but as full of sfnal brain and eyeball kicks as any short work I’ve read in a while.

  75. 75
    chigau (違う)

    Everyone who wants to see the Brother Og photo described in #68, say type “Aye”.

  76. 76
    javierdelgado

    the japanese trailes has more scenes…

  77. 77
    Tethys

    A collection of 70′s interior design at Your Swingin’ Pad

    *warning- some rooms are seizure inducing

  78. 78
    Inaji

    Chigau:

    Years from now they will look back on our stainless steel kitchens

    I loathe stainless steel appliances. My kitchen is red, black and pale yellow, art deco women on the walls and my fridge is a 1952 Philco and my chest freezer a 1954 Zenith. Stainless. Bah.

  79. 79
    chigau (違う)

    Caine
    My kitchen has wallpaper from the 1970′s (yellow flowers) and white appliances and fake brick lino.
    If I could afford to re-do it, I’d do autopsy-room, including a floor drain.

  80. 80
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Caine:

    I loathe stainless steel appliances.

    Seriously. “Almond” for the win!

    Okay, not really. My appliances are hideous, but they work (most of the time and only if you know how to massage their egos) and I’m a renter, so I’m stuck with them.

  81. 81
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    A collection of 70′s interior design at Your Swingin’ Pad

    I would take some of those avocado green couches in a heartbeat. The rooms they’re in, not so much.

  82. 82
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Years from now they will look back on our stainless steel kitchens

    All my appliances are white. Except the big stand mixer. That one is Ferrari Red.

    ========

    Everyone who wants to see the Brother Og photo described in #68, say type “Aye”.

    Nay. Nay. Nay. Neigh. Nay.

    So sorry. You are outvoted.

    (And where did the horse come from?)

  83. 83
    carlie

    I really like 70s colors. Just not as…much of them as they used. Accent colors, not main.

    Lileks has some amazing photos at Interior Desecrations

    I remember looking at an apartment in WV (in 1990) that had avocado green, burnt orange and harvest gold wallpaper. In every room. And I mean every room.

    There is a house in Estes Park, Colorado, that the owners rent out for church groups to use. It is built on a boulder; said boulder juts up in the front room through the floor, which itself is covered with dark brown and light brown shag carpet. There is a stuffed mallard flying overhead near the boulder. The bedrooms are each their own version of 70s decor; there is a pink room with dark and light pink shag, a blue room with teal blue and green shag, a bedroom with yellow and orange shag, a kitchen with globe lights with canary yellow iron bars covering them, and a bathroom with blue tile and pink flower lights. And a shag throw rug. The basement is dark wood paneling with several stag heads mounted on the walls. The interior of that house is seared into my brain.

    Classical Cipher – THAT’S the guy!!! I read some of his Twilight posts quite awhile back and loved them, and then lost the link.
    And he did Hunger Games, and Avatar the cartoon? I sense a big time sink in my near future. :)

    So, now we’re looking at flour mills–at about $500 for a good one, but the bread was that much better. Anyone else grind their own flour?

    In The Hard Winter, the Ingalls used a coffee grinder for all their flour grinding needs. Of course, it did take hours a day to do…

  84. 84
    Tethys

    I loathe stainless steel appliances.

    Seconded! What idiot designed appliances that get horribly fingerprinted if you touch them? Which then proceed to become permanently oxidized on unless you clean them off immediately with special stainless steel cleaner.

    My kitchen is 50′s themed. My appliances are white. Jadite and turquoise accessories with pickled oak cabinetry.

  85. 85
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Oggie:

    I remember looking at an apartment in WV (in 1990) that had avocado green, burnt orange and harvest gold wallpaper.

    When my parents bought their house in 1980, the walls in every room (including the kitchen and bathrooms) were slate blue, with gold carpeting (once again, every room). The way my mom tells it, even the ceilings were blue.

    *shudder*

  86. 86
    carlie

    Science equipment went through color fads, too. I’ve worked with brushed grey and green 50s microscopes, avocado 60s, teal (I think was 70s), terra cotta from the 70s-80s, and then almond in the later 80s, back to a cold silver/grey in the 90s.(times may be approximate)

  87. 87
    The Sailor

    We had the avocado & harvest appliances, the bathroom* and kitchen carpeting & glodenrod sculpted shag carpeting in the living room.

    * the bathroom carpeting was repellent, thin strips of RGB. It repelled anything except stains. The wallpaper was a weird acid induced nightmare pattern. It was shocking when one turned on the light in the middle of the night.
    ++++++++++++++++
    shouldbeworking, you can buy 2w 532nm on the intertubes. One can cut plastic bottles with them.

    My lab’s motto is “never look into a laser with your remaining good eye.”

  88. 88
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Hi, all! Totally threadrupt and just taking a quick break from my break to wish everyone here a happy and productive 2012.

    Re the John Carter trailer: I have to go reread the books, but am I wrong in remembering the airships of Helium as dirigibles? What are these dragonfly-lookin’ thingies all about? Also, I can’t wait for the body-switching brain transplants of The Master Mind of Mars, if the series gets that far. IIRC, that was the first of the books I read, then I went back and read them in order.

    Re CGI: The family and I just got back from seeing The Adventures of Tintin, and it really made me a CGI believer: It has the fantastical feel of an adventure comic, and includes stunts (and camera shots) that would never be physically possible, but the CGI world is so realistically textural that it never feels like a cartoon. I’ve never read the Tintin comics, so I can’t comment on how faithful it is (though I hear good things on that score), but it’s a brilliant piece of film making. (Too bad then could work a few female characters into it, though: I know it’s based on a boy’s comic from the 30s and 40s, but still….)

    And now, off to party….

  89. 89
    The Sailor

    Oggie, I’ll vote neigh, also, too. There’s a picture of me in a lion print dashiki somewhere. Conga rats on the new chapeau. (1k miles in 17 hrs!? It takes me 20.)

  90. 90
    Inaji

    Chigau:

    My kitchen has wallpaper from the 1970′s (yellow flowers) and white appliances and fake brick lino.

    I did my kitchen myself, I prefer old appliances, they have character. (Bought the current ones for $100). The countertops and floor are hideous, I still have to do those.

    Appliances can be painted, I’m not sure why more people don’t do that. There’s a pic of my first fridge here. (2nd shot).

  91. 91
    The Sailor

    No NYE parties for me, I stay home on amateur night.

  92. 92
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    Chigau,
    At this point, we are leaning toward the electric rather than the hand turn. For a good mill, they’re nearly the same price, and 20 minutes of grinding for a loaf of bread does eat into one’s day. The quality of the mill makes a big difference–for instance, the metal grinding wheels tend to get quite hot, which damages both nutrition and taste. If you ever get around to trying homemade bread with fresh ground flour, I’d be interested to hear what you think.

    I probably shouldn’t have been so surprised. I know that grinding ones own spices makes a huge difference, but I hadn’t realized how quickly the oil in wheat starts to go rancid.

  93. 93
    The Sailor

    I had friends with a 50′s Philco fridge that had a ‘V’ shaped handle in the middle of the door that would open the fridge from either side depending on which way you pushed it.
    +++++++++++++++
    Marx Brothers marathon on TCM!

  94. 94
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    (1k miles in 17 hrs!? It takes me 20.)

    This sedan cruises at 80mph with less effort than the minivan took at 65.

    A lion-print dashiki? Details. Please.

  95. 95
    feralboy12

    I would like to take this opportunity to categorically deny that there exists a photo of me wearing a green mohair sweater. The photo, if it existed, would also feature a moptop hairdo and a Mickey Mouse shirt.

  96. 96
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Insufficient Emotion; George Loewenstein; doi: 10.1177/1754073910362598

    Contrary to the many accounts of the destructive effects of strong emotions, this article argues that the most serious problems facing the world are caused by a deficiency rather than an excess of emotions. It then shows how an evolutionary account of emotion can explain when and why such deficiencies occur.

    Reflecting on some of the most critical problems facing humanity at present, and drawing on an evolutionary perspective on emotion, I question whether the most pervasive and important problems associated with emotions may be characterized not by either cell II or III, but instead by cell IV, i.e., an insufficiency of conscious emotions. Like the proverbial dog that didn’t bark, the absence of strong emotions doesn’t naturally come to mind as a major problem. Once one begins thinking along such lines, however, I believe the argument becomes compelling.

    PDF in next comment

  97. 97
  98. 98
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    I have a great big stand mixer in boring brushed silver, and I keep telling myself I’m going to haul it to the auto body place down the road and have it painted sparkly root-beer brown. Or maybe sparkly turquoise. Decisions, decisions.

  99. 99
    Cipher

    Sally, thanks for directing us to that blog post, but now I’m very much out. I (my problem) shouldn’t have been there in the first place, as I had every intention of trying to walk away from the misogyny issue for the day. :(

  100. 100
    DLC

    OT : (for an open thread? ? ) Anyone seen the commercials for “come home to the Catholic Church” ?

  101. 101
    The Sailor

    IRT the lion-print dashiki; it was the 70′s, I was a teenager, spending time among long haired freaks, and it came almost to my knees. I wore it with a white gi belt and went commando. TMI, amirite?

  102. 102
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    feralboy12: your photo does not exist in the same museum of unfortunate images as the photo of me with a spiral perm, the bangs of which are inexplicably permed tighter than the rest of my hair, also does not exist.

  103. 103
    John Morales

    I have perfect colour vision, but I couldn’t care less about the aesthetics of colours.

    (Comes in handy, that)

  104. 104
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    feralboy12 and kristinc,
    Nor, in the same nonexistent museum does there exist a photo of me in a red-and-black plaid flannel shirt, a full scraggly beard and hair halfway down my back climbing up the dorm wall to get to my girlfriend’s dormroom.

    What can I say? It was (er, wasn’t?) the ’70s.

  105. 105
    chigau (違う)

    Caine
    Nice fridge!
    Our fridge is crapping-out, it’s replacement will be as high-tech, energy efficient, ecofriendly, etcetcetc as we can manage.
    I really don’t care about the colour.
    Especially now. Apparently one can paint appliances!

    arids
    I have included a variety of fresh-ground grains (and non-grains) in my bread.
    I don’t think I’ve ever done a batch entirely of fresh-ground.
    I store most of my flour in the freezer, with only a few cups for immediate use in the cupboard.

  106. 106
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    What can I say? It was (er, wasn’t?) the ’70s.

    Bell bottom jeans???

  107. 107
    chigau (違う)

    The Sailor
    re dashiki & commando & TMI
    uuh were you wearing trousers?
    —-
    There is no photo of me in a pink faux-leather mini-skirt.

  108. 108
    DLC

    Bill Dauphin@88 : they’re ornithopters and only work on Mars. Burroughs included them in his stories. They also had dirigibles.

    re: my last, about the RCC and it’s commercials: they’re a buncha smarmy gloating about how they (guided by the holy spirit), compiled the books of the bible. Except for the ones they left out, the ones declared “apocrypha”. Oddly, it appears only on late night cable. I guess the richest church in the world is too cheap to spend money on primetime.

  109. 109
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Happy 2012 from the uk

  110. 110
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Ah. If you want non-existant photos, that would be the one of me wearing long black socks (my calves were sunburned, so I was wearing a pair of my dad’s socks and they went to just above my knees), a railroad engineer’s hat with a C&S patch, while swimming in the Amargosa River in California. I was, I think, four.

    That photo definately does not exist. Anywhere.

  111. 111
    Inaji

    Nerd:

    Bell bottom jeans?

    Pffft, hip hugger bell bottoms.

    Chigau:

    a pink faux-leather mini-skirt.

    Hotpants. Red. Very little material, really.

  112. 112
    Inaji

    Happy New Year, Serendipitydawg! Now that it’s 2012, in the words of Ivanova, everything go boom now?

    ;D

  113. 113
    The Sailor

    “uuh were you wearing trousers?”

    Nope. Full commando.
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++
    I think my Sis has a Polaroid has no picture of me when I was 5 in nothing but cowboy boots standing on a coffee table.

    She showed the non-existent pic to a GF I had in high school. I was aghast, not understanding the awesome power of cute. (PUAs take note;-)

  114. 114
    chigau (違う)

    I used to do tie-dying when you had to boil it on the stove-top.
    —-
    Happy New Year Serendipitydawg!

    We’re on our way out for home-made suki-yaki.
    Yum!

  115. 115
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Caine,

    Very much boom! I am watching the London fireworks on tv… different crew this year and somewhat more innovative than last year.

    London is still very much a poor relation when compared with Sydney because they have a very, very nice bridge to play with and London has a giant ferris wheel, and there are only so many ways to send pyrotechnics round in a circle!

  116. 116
    The Sailor

    Happy New Year, Serendipitydawg!
    Mine will happen in about 5 hrs, if I can stay awake that long. (Well, it’ll happen anyway, I just might be snoring at the time.)

  117. 117
    carlie

    There is most certainly not in existence a picture of me with huge plastic-rimmed glasses, wearing a matching sweater and skirt set in bright fuschia with neon blue and yellow stripes and black polka dots, holding my embossed-with-my-name-on-the-cover NIV Thompson chain-reference Bible. Not at all.

  118. 118
    Inaji

    Serendipitydawg:

    Very much boom! I am watching the London fireworks on tv

    That’s cool. I was going for tongue in cheek about the profusion of Apocalypse/Mayan Calendar/World Ends crap that’s been all over everything here in Dumbfuckistan for the last year. :sigh:

  119. 119
    The Sailor

    chigau, I used to do tie-dye back in the day.

  120. 120
    consciousness razor

    Anyone seen the commercials for “come home to the Catholic Church” ?

    Yes. Pathetic.

    Something completely different: The Gospel of Supply Side Jesus

  121. 121
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Thanks Sailor.

    Our best one was 2000 when we fired the new year fireworks for village called Hawes up in the Yorkshire dales. It rained the entire day that the four of us were setting up about 1.5 tonnes of material and equipment. The organisers very kindly removed a section of a dry stone wall so that we could get the trailers onto the field, however, it was still a bit of a slog.

    We fired the show and then had to clear it all up, after which we found that the place they had made the hole in the wall was an effective trap for trailers unless we could have taken them out backwards… mind you, we did have plenty of drunken helpers coming along and offering advice at two in the morning.

    We finally got away to the cottage at 02:30 when we could join in with the rest of the village and have an alcoholic drink (or ten.)

    Happy days, but these days I stay home and have an early night.

  122. 122
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    So. Is anyone else wondering what photos of PZ do not exist?

  123. 123
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    …I was going for tongue in cheek about the profusion…

    Sorry Caine, I was being a archly literalist!

    I hope we make it to 2013 because I really want to make it to my 40th wedding anniversary :D

  124. 124
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    Is anyone else wondering what photos of PZ do not exist?

    We’ve already seen some. Doncha remember the one with Skatje when she was tiny?

  125. 125
  126. 126
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    I have enough worries about the photos that do exist… my dear friend who created the shrine of Kev would probably pay good money to get hold of them.

  127. 127
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    We’ve already seen some. Doncha remember the one with Skatje when she was tiny?

    That’s more unbearably cute than unbearably embarrassing.

  128. 128
    Inaji

    Serendipitydawg:

    I hope we make it to 2013 because I really want to make it to my 40th wedding anniversary :D

    That’s good reason. We’ll see our 34th in 013. :D

  129. 129
    The Sailor

    Serendipitydawg, sorta been there and done that, but it was lighting and sound equipment. Drunks are OK for pushing trucks out of a muddy field but we would have probably gotten more traction just by putting the rest of them under the drive wheels. (Only one went under, and it was so muddy the truck just pushed his leg farther into the mud.)

  130. 130
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    That’s more unbearably cute than unbearably embarrassing.

    I wouldn’t be embarrassed by any photos of myself from the 70s (or 80s/90s), I looked good, who cares about the clothes? :shrug: Fashions change.

    Of course, I can’t test that, ’cause famblee members destroyed all photos of me decades back.

  131. 131
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Caine,

    That’s good reason. We’ll see our 34th in 013. :D

    It’s great when you find the one ♥ :D

    It’s all settled – the world cannot possibly end until at least 2014, everyone can rest easy.

  132. 132
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Sailor,

    Drunks are OK for pushing trucks

    They didn’t do anything as useful as offering to push, oh no, the best we got was drunken advice and people in the way. We ran over a foot and the soft ground probably prevented harm… it did make them disperse, so it wasn’t all bad. I can imagine the look on the guy’s face when he emerged from his drunken stupor, wondering what where the tyre tracks on his shoe came from.

  133. 133
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    I hope we make it to 2013 because I really want to make it to my 40th wedding anniversary :D

    The Redhead and I will not only do that, but will also celebrate paying off the mortgage on the house. Same month in fact.

    Now out to grill the steaks (37 degrees out) for our NYE dinner (the Redhead must celebrate any and all holidays).

  134. 134
    John Morales

    Huh.

    It’s 37 degrees where I am, but the forecast for this arvo is 41.

    Centigrade.

  135. 135
    Inaji

    John, a lot of us who live in places where we would usually be buried under the result of several blizzards by now are instead experiencing a distinct lack of winter. Here in ND, the temps have been in the 30s/40s (F) with no snow.

  136. 136
    otrame

    To all my brothers and sisters of Pharyngula, have a safe New Years Eve, and a Happy New Year. You all make my life better with your decency, your insistence on dealing with reality, and your wit. I love you guys, even the ones I often disagree with.

  137. 137
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    A happy Gnu Year to all of you.

    I am currently drinking a bottle of Chemay Belgian beer. Made by Trappist Monks. And it runs 9%. So when I am done with this delicious beer, I shall be wobbling off to bed.

  138. 138
    John Morales

    Caine, brr. But that’s good, no?

  139. 139
    Inaji

    Happy New Year, Otrame & Ogvorbis!

    Still 4.5 hours to go here.

  140. 140
    Inaji

    John:

    Caine, brr. But that’s good, no?

    It’s not brrrr here, it’s not whatever below zero. I’m lovin’ it, but I’m not sure it’s saying good things about the planet’s climate troubles.

  141. 141
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Happy New Year, Otrame & Ogvorbis!

    Still 4.5 hours to go here.

    Still 3.5 hours to go here. But I am tired adn slightly tipseyey.

  142. 142
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Cain:

    Ever notice that when ever there is a cold snap, some asshole will alwasy be there saying, “Where’s that global warming.” but, let it be really warm for an entire season (we had a very warm fall here), not a peep?

  143. 143
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ skeptifem #9:

    Erm, “regulars”, plural, trying to silence you for being raped??? Are we reading the same blog? I’m honestly mystified. I’m not even a regular, but I spent a goodly time on that thread recently, reading what everybody posted.

    Going back to the “Hot for student” thread, I see several people disagreeing with you, but others taking up your side, including PZ (and myself, not that I’m trying to cash any points for it). The worse comment about you is probably this, about “generalising inappropriately” from your experience:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/12/29/hot-forstudent/comment-page-1/#comment-231904

    … and even then, the commentator acknowledged that he was talking after remembering incorrectly something you posted.

    That was one person. A few others said that you didn’t talk for them or that some of the arguments you used were straw men. Is it “silencing” when people attack your words but not yourself?

    BTW, I apologise in advance if this seems insensitive. It’s already January 1st, 2012, here in Europe, and maybe my brain is just addled.

    Happy New Year, everyone!

  144. 144
    The Sailor

    Happy gnu year to you too, Oggie. And everyone else of course, I’m still hoping to be awake at Midnight at which time I will do it properly, with guns a blazin’. (A li’l falling buckshot never hurt no one;-)

  145. 145
  146. 146
    Inaji

    Ogvorbis:

    Ever notice that when ever there is a cold snap, some asshole will alwasy be there saying, “Where’s that global warming.” but, let it be really warm for an entire season (we had a very warm fall here), not a peep?

    Oh yeah, I notice. It’s still Fall here and not a word.

  147. 147
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Nerd,

    The Redhead and I will not only do that, but will also celebrate paying off the mortgage on the house. Same month in fact.

    A fortunate coincidence… and conga rats! We bought a new place in 1999 which was twice as expensive as the one that was paid for, so I will probably predecease the mortgage :D

    On the subject of temperatures: we are OK this year. Last year we regularly (and unusually) were down to -10°C with peak lows of -15°C and we had 4 feet of snow piled up that had compacted down to 12 inches of ice on our small, insignificant road… the “main” road was ploughed but it was impossible to get down to that road without the aid of a 4×4 until the farm at the end needed a feed delivery, at which point a nice man with a JCB came down and scraped the ice off :D

    We are 20°C warmer this year but that just gives us our usual wet winter weather.

  148. 148
    mythusmage

    A Princess of Mars predates pulp. For that matter, Burroughs and his contemporaries presaged pulp, originating many of the tropes and memes we’ve come to associate with pulp fiction.

  149. 149
  150. 150
    Oenotrian

    Bankrupt, but I had to comment:

    What idiot designed appliances that get horribly fingerprinted if you touch them? Which then proceed to become permanently oxidized on unless you clean them off immediately with special stainless steel cleaner.

    Probably the same idiot who thought it was a good idea to make shiny, black ceramic stove tops. [shudders]

  151. 151
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Happy new year to all. I’ve just given a cockapoo a bath because he stunk and now he’s running around the house like a crazed rat. Meanwhile, I’m combining Velveeta, tomatoes, black beans and some hot sauce into a White Trash Mexican dip for the party across the street. And also arguing at Camels With Hammers that, no, it’s not logically possible to be “an atheist who believes in God.” Yes, this is apparently contentious.

  152. 152
    Part-Time Insomniac

    From previous ep:

    Daisy Cutter:

    the asshole who thought it was hilarious that her BFF pressured a virgin man into sex (he was Christian, ha-ha, that means he doesn’t deserve bodily autonomy!

    Say WHAT?? If it’s not funny when men do that to virgin women, why should it be any different when the roles are reversed? I hope I don’t personally know anyone who thinks this would be a gas. Life’s too damn short to waste on such trash.
    ***********************************

    This ep:

    I got into the tie-dye thing for a while when I was little. I don’t think we had to involve any boiling water, though. Must’ve been some new kit or other we used. Come to think of it, if I still had that one shirt I loved, and it fit, I’d totally wear it nowadays. Blues and purples all swirled together, maybe a hint of green . . . awesome.
    ——————————————————

    Yep, no snow here either. It’s actually making a me bit nervous. For one thing, when the snow does come, how bad will it get? For another, what is this going to mean for weather patterns in the long run?
    ——————————————————

    One of the reasons I didn’t bother with the remake of The Thing was the CGI. Even if the movie captured the paranoia and suspense of the original, a part of my mind would continually say, “Seriously, you can TELL it’s all done by computer.”

    Bill mentioned the new Tintin movie upthread as an example of when CGI can work beautifully. But sometimes it’s just not enough. I have high praise for motion-capture, though. CG movement can look stiff, and while hand-drawn comes closer, there’s nothing quite like the real, organic movement you get with an actual living person or animal.

  153. 153
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Probably the same idiot who thought it was a good idea to make shiny, black ceramic stove tops. [shudders]

    Word. The only good thing that can be said about those (they’re shit for actual cookery) is that they clean easily. Which is instantly defeated by their property of showing off the smallest smudge.

  154. 154
    carlie

    Probably the same idiot who thought it was a good idea to make shiny, black ceramic stove tops. [shudders]

    I can’t even count how much baking soda I’ve gone through trying to keep ours looking halfway decent… [curses]

  155. 155
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    For the 70s lulz: Happy New Year.

  156. 156
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Carlie, get rid of the fuckin’ thing! Some fool who cares more about style than function will surely buy it and you can get a real stove.

  157. 157
    Rey Fox

    And also arguing at Camels With Hammers that, no, it’s not logically possible to be “an atheist who believes in God.” Yes, this is apparently contentious.

    In this New Atheist Revolution, we shall be posed the question: Which is more annoying, when “atheist” is seen as such a forbidden word that otherwise godless individuals tie themselves in knots trying to not call themselves atheists, or when “atheist” is seen as so cool that everyone tries to claim that title for themselves, regardless of what they actually believe in?

  158. 158
    Weed(less) Monkey

    I’m at my sister’s about 100 km south from my home, and two days ago there was absolutely no snow at all. Only yesterday the temperature dropped a few degrees below zero C and we had maybe a cm or two snow. The year that ended 4 hours ago was the warmest one for about 70 years – even including February that was coldest in living memory: -20 to -35 for several weeks.

  159. 159
    carlie

    Someday, Josh. :)

    Just made some rice pudding. Child 2 asked what it was, I told him, and he said “that sounds revolting, yet oddly compelling”.

    Anyone going on a first day hike tomorrow? The weather’s going to be nice, so I’m tempted. Will be pretty muddy though, and the kids don’t have hiking boots. Not sure what they’d wear.

  160. 160
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Hike? Hell no. Hangover nursing. Some rice pudding would help:)

  161. 161
    shouldbeworking

    I wanna go ice fishing, but our temperature as been hovering close to freezing for some time. I don’t want to get too far from shore if the ice fails.

  162. 162
    consciousness razor

    Which is more annoying, when “atheist” is seen as such a forbidden word that otherwise godless individuals tie themselves in knots trying to not call themselves atheists, or when “atheist” is seen as so cool that everyone tries to claim that title for themselves, regardless of what they actually believe in?

    I vote for the latter.

    It’s more like I’m not annoyed with an (apparent) atheist who can’t admit they’re an atheist, so much as with the societal pressures which are causing them to tie themselves in knots. Whatever they call themselves instead as a defensive measure, if it is reasonably accurate, doesn’t make a big difference to me.

    However, the sort of slimy equivocators who want “atheist” to refer to their preferred brand of goddist nonsense do annoy me. They can fuck right off back to their cults. I don’t give a fuck whether it’s a Wiccan cult or a Christian one, or what the fuck kind of nonsense it is. More politely: that’s not for me, thanks.

  163. 163
    The Sailor

    Josh, mimosas and rice pudding it is.

  164. 164
    Tethys

    It is currently raining here in Minnesota. Normal winter is lots of snow with a normal lowest temperature of -35f. I may have to mow the lawn if this is the new normal.

  165. 165
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Which is more annoying, when “atheist” is seen as such a forbidden word that otherwise godless individuals tie themselves in knots trying to not call themselves atheists, or when “atheist” is seen as so cool that everyone tries to claim that title for themselves

    I’ll take (c) that’s a stupid dichotomy for £1000, please, Alex.

  166. 166
    Weed(less) Monkey

    I wanna go ice fishing, but our temperature as been hovering close to freezing for some time. I don’t want to get too far from shore if the ice fails.

    Just don’t do it until the ice is strong enough.

    It was maybe a month and a half ago when we had -10 °C in Central Finland, for only one day. It was enough for smallest ponds to freeze over, as it had been close to zero for some time. So, naturally, some geniuses decided it was time to get their fishing nets under ice. One of them drowned only 20 metres from the shore, because he couldn’t swim in the ice or get on the fragile ice.

  167. 167
    Anthony K

    ftb is eating my comments. Have I been bad?

  168. 168
    Anthony K

    Okay, figured it out. Was linking to a site ftb doesn’t like, it seems.

    So, what has ftb got against Behr 460E-2 Valley Mist? It’s a lovely colour.

  169. 169
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Oooh: Radar Love. (That was the irregularly scheduled “what’s on the radio right now”.)

  170. 170
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    Happy New Year, everyone!

    I had a lovely peaceful NYE – picked up the Bloke from the airport, took him home and we had fancy sausage rolls and Tassie sparkling. Turned on the tellie to get the new year countdown and ended up watching the Sydney fireworks. I don’t usually see much point to fireworks on TV, but these were very impressive regardless.

    And Melbourne’s fireworks set fire to their venue. Oopsie.

  171. 171
    Anthony K

    Happy New Year, everyone! May 2012 not be the year the robot monkeys eat all our brains.

  172. 172
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    The North East has been warm and rainy, too. It’s in th40s right now, so I’m sitting outside.

    Just under two hours to go. Woooooo! *noisemakers!*

  173. 173
    Rey Fox

    I’ll take (c) that’s a stupid dichotomy for £1000, please, Alex.

    The answer is “Humorless.”

  174. 174
    Cipher

    Erm, “regulars”, plural, trying to silence you for being raped??? Are we reading the same blog? I’m honestly mystified. I’m not even a regular, but I spent a goodly time on that thread recently, reading what everybody posted.

    Since I don’t want to go into depth about a conversation between other people unless it’s absolutely necessary, I’ll leave it at this: that conversation goes back a while. You’re clearly unaware of the history of that discussion, and it’s probably not a good idea for you to argue with skeptifem about what she experienced for that reason.

  175. 175
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Oh and the cake turned out pretty damn good. It was pretty dense, but I should have expected that from a pound cake that’s full of cheese.

  176. 176
    cicely

    The Mark I Unlit Jellyfish is turning out to be more labor-and-time intensive than I expected. Still…onward!!!
    -
    Ah, yes; carpetted kitchens and bathrooms. ‘Cause those floors never experience fluid spills, or dropped condiments (or broken glass fragments). Ranks right down there with kitchens with no counter or cabinet space.
    *gesture of aversion*
    -
    Motel mattresses are required by law to be cast from only the finest concrete. Durable. Unyielding. You’d think that bedbugs would find no purchase there; and yet….
    -

    Everyone who wants to see the Brother Og photo described in #68, say type “Aye”.

    “Aye”.
    -

    (And where did the horse come from?)

    From the nethermost pits of the Hell that spawned it. Duh!
    -

  177. 177
    Cipher

    Sorry – that came off as condescending when I was just trying to be vague :/

    I’m rereading 1984! Jumbled thoughts: I’m persistently envisioning Big Brother as Daniel Day Lewis in There Will Be Blood. The paragraph in which the telescreens are introduced reminds me of the Panopticon – does anyone even need to use the telescreens to spy? It would be more efficient if they didn’t, although the rest of the book seems to kind of suggest that they do. The Two Minutes Hate… I’ve always been frightened by that scene and concept, because crowds are the scariest thing ever. Hey, Winston’s a huge sexist! The life of the proles sounds suspiciously like regular ol’ life. Heh… This book said “Jewess.” Everything has “ess”es. Duckspeak…

  178. 178
  179. 179
    magistramarla

    Happy New Year, Pharyngulites!

  180. 180
    John Morales

    Sway?

  181. 181
    cicely

    Bell bottom jeans???

    In my case, non-existent in lemon yellow, and never worn with a rocket red bodysuit. Or a wide, white leather belt with cut-outs and studs.
    -

    Pffft, hip hugger bell bottoms.

    I probably should have included that these hypothetical lemon yellow pants were, obviously, not hip huggers, either.
    -

    I used to do tie-dying when you had to boil it on the stove-top.

    Me, too.
    -

  182. 182
    The Sailor

    changeable moniker, yes, let’s dance! (p.s. I ran sound for Stevie Ray Vaughn for a few shows just after he recorded the solo in Let’s Dance and before he became famous enough to die in a helicopter crash. I also worked on the Glass Spider tour as a sound tech.)
    ++++++++++++++++++
    T- 68 minutes and counting.

  183. 183
    The Sailor

    I would still wear bell-bottoms if I could find them. As it is I usually wear black peg-legged jeans, and those were popular before I was born.

    I’m not retro, I was never tro.

  184. 184
    The Sailor

    So, I counted them up, and as it turns out I knew 6 people who died this year. Of natural causes. Is my cohort going to gradually increase or is an anomaly?

    Bah, I’ll just put on Wish You Were Here and crank it up.

  185. 185
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Sleep now. Sway:

  186. 186
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Oh, for fuck’s sake. I should know this by now. :-(

  187. 187
    The Sailor

    I wish TLC was here, (and blf and others I can’t recall at the moment.)

  188. 188
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    For me, and for the Sailor:

    Stevie Ray Vaughan – Crossfire

  189. 189
    Cipher

    Where is TLC? :(

  190. 190
    Inaji

    The Sailor:

    I would still wear bell-bottoms if I could find them.

    They’re still made. I have a pair of Revolt Jeans which are bell-bottom and a pair of Lucky’s Legend Bells.

  191. 191
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Had Champagne with the Redhead and toasted in the next year. Happy New Year to All. Now, off to bed to get my beauty sleep so I don’t scare the gnomes…

  192. 192
    The Sailor

    T – 7 and counting.

  193. 193
    ibyea

    It’s almost new year from Eastern Standard Time. So, happy new years, folks!

  194. 194
    ibyea

    Hmm… Having delicious cherries and PZ’s favorite, squid for new year. :)

  195. 195
    The Sailor

    3 … 2 … 1 … Happy New Year!!!

  196. 196
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Happy New Year from the East Coast of the US!

  197. 197
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Oooh, Burlington Vermont is setting off fireworks. . must go outside!

  198. 198
    Inaji

    Still an hour to go here, but I’m headed out for the night. Happy New Year, everyone!

  199. 199
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Happy New Year! May it bring good fortune and less suckitude for all! *downs a shot of Irish creme*

  200. 200
    ibyea

    I wish alcoholic beverages didn’t taste so gross to me. I really did want to enjoy that champagne. I really did. Instead, I grimaced in front of my parents.

  201. 201
    Alethea Kuiper-Belt

    Caine, your timezone is the one showing up for me.

    Here it’s 4pm on the first. We’re contemplating home delivery Thai food for dinner.

  202. 202
    Dhorvath, OM

    Thread! I have missed it.
    So sick this week, couldn’t even focus to lurk let alone string a thought together. Hope everyone is well and a happy New Year from the Island.

  203. 203
    Ibis3, Let's burn some bridges

    Happy Gnu Year everyone!

  204. 204
    cicely

    Dhorvath!
    Sorry you were sick, happy that you’re better.
    -
    Happy New Year to all, and to all a good night.
    -

  205. 205
    Nutmeg

    Happy New Year to everyone!

  206. 206
    DLC

    Happy New Year !

  207. 207
    ChasCPeterson

    hoo
    Drunk in 2012 here on the E. Coast o’ N.A.

    Happy newt year y’all.

  208. 208
  209. 209
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Happy New Year, all (well, y’all in PST have to wait a bit, eh?)!

    Caine:

    [Ogvorbis] Ever notice that when ever there is a cold snap, some asshole will alwasy be there saying, “Where’s that global warming.” but, let it be really warm for an entire season (we had a very warm fall here), not a peep?

    Oh yeah, I notice. It’s still Fall here and not a word.

    Word! Here in New England, we had a devastating snow storm in October, but October-like weather all through the Xmas/New Year’s season. Ski areas are looking at a disastrous season: No snowfall and not enough cold to make snow.

    But, y’know, all that global warming horseshit is just a libruhhhl hoax, right? <sigh>

  210. 210
  211. 211
  212. 212
    Rey Fox

    Happy last fucking year on Earth you crazy motherfuckers. Stay godless

  213. 213
  214. 214
  215. 215
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    Hey, happy PST New Year everyone!

  216. 216
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    No Easy Way Down

    I Can’t Make It Alone
    ————————————————————————
    Willie And Laura Mae Jones

    That Old Sweet Roll(Hi-De-Ho)

    What Do You Do When Love Dies

  217. 217
    John Morales

    “Deep Red Bells”

    Ah — bells!

    (I nearly misread that)

  218. 218
  219. 219
  220. 220
    McCthulhu, now with -25% less fat.

    Changeable Monicker @186: This is my favorite Stevie Ray video. Great tune and funny vid.

    Stevie Ray Vaughan – Cold Shot:

  221. 221
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Classical Cipher:

    Since I don’t want to go into depth about a conversation between other people unless it’s absolutely necessary, I’ll leave it at this: that conversation goes back a while. You’re clearly unaware of the history of that discussion, and it’s probably not a good idea for you to argue with skeptifem about what she experienced for that reason.

    Oh, hum. I’m not contesting the part about judging conversations between other people, at least if you mean “speculating about things that have not been made public”. However, in the same vein, please refrain to presume that you know what I did or didn’t read on the subject previously.

    And even then, please re-read what I wrote. Skeptifem complained about things said on a certain thread. I pointed out that I didn’t see anything on that thread looking like what she accused people of doing. I certainly presumed to tell her what her experience was, just what was appearing or not on this thread. I’m not arguing with her if she feels fed up with some people here, that’s her right. I was only sceptical about the factual claims she made.

  222. 222
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    HI there
    Skimming through, needing 5 min on the couch.
    Our little party was wonderful as always and #1 managed to stay up until new year for the first time to watch the firework which was really nice.
    So generous of people to spend so much money for our convenience, and then standing out there in the cold setting them off so that we can watch them from our kitchen window.

    Will post the figue tart recipe later since it was spectacular.

    Most important of all:
    Happy New Year to all of you

  223. 223
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Last religionist shenanigans before the end of 2011:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/camelswithhammers/2012/01/01/john-lennon-did-not-imagine-that-all-religion-is-true/

    Argh. What a way to usher in the new year >:

  224. 224
    opposablethumbs

    Dear Horde, now that I have (mostly) un-glued my eyes, I would like to wish you all the very best for 2012.

    Somebody in the neighbourhood released one of those paper lanterns with a candle in it and I realised I’d only ever seen them on TV before. Distant fireworks lighting up the sky (and sounding like a barrage of heavy artillery) also pretty. But I lost dismally at cards :-/

  225. 225
    shouldbeworking

    I hope you all had a pleasant NYE. I didn’t overdo the beverages last night, unlike a few in my neighbourhood. Fortunately everyone walked home. And mike our host didn’t bring out the karaoke machine this yer. I hate that thing, the only way I can carry a tune is in an iPod.

  226. 226
    chigau (違う)

    I’m alive!

  227. 227
    birgerjohansson

    Regarding Martians:

    According to this photo, the alien mothership that whacked a high-rise building in “Independence Day” has done the same to London’s Big Ben. http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/01/01/new-years-day-parade-london_n_1178330.html?ref=uk
    Bad alien! Bad alien!

    — — — — — —
    “The problem is that they tend to be schlock. The animation is a gimmick and the rest of the movie (acting, script, whatever) can’t hold up on its own.”

    Word

    Science fiction and fantasy films should be forced to use shoestring budgets, apart from the budget for actors and script writers. If you have seen Tarkovsky’s 1972 version of “Solaris” you know what I mean. There are only a few big sets in the film, the rest is sheer talent.

  228. 228
    birgerjohansson

    Speaking of films…
    When Scienceblog Aardvarchaeology discussed the hilarious “radiation from wolves” rumor, comment # 8 came up with a good concept for a typical film http://scienceblogs.com/aardvarchaeology/2011/11/radiation_phobia_and_wolves.php#comments

    — — — — — — — — —
    “John, a lot of us who live in places where we would usually be buried under the result of several blizzards by now are instead experiencing a distinct lack of winter. Here in ND, the temps have been in the 30s/40s (F) with no snow.”
    .
    Even worse in Sweden. Warmest December in a gadzillion years.

  229. 229
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Birger:

    Science fiction and fantasy films should be forced to use shoestring budgets, apart from the budget for actors and script writers.

    Script writers, yes. Actors? Not necessarily. We don’t want Shia LaBeouf in every-goddamn-thing.

  230. 230
    The Sailor

    Good morning! I slept 9 hours straight thru for the 1st time in years. And no hangy overy thing either. I feeeel good! (well, except for the back pain and sinuses and ‘rhoids. But that’s more a baseline pain level anyway.)

  231. 231
  232. 232
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Hello sailor – your link is borked!

  233. 233
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Me:

    We don’t want Shia LaBeouf in every-goddamn-thing.

    On that note, it would be brilliant if every movie wasn’t targeted at teenage boys.

  234. 234
    Inaji

    G’mornin’, All. So it’s 2012…when is the Apocalypse/Mayan End O’the World/Everything go boom supposed to happen?

  235. 235
    Inaji

    Audley:

    On that note, it would be brilliant if every movie wasn’t targeted at teenage boys.

    Or teen girls or teens in general. ‘Teen Fiction’ was threatening to eat the bookstore when I was there the last two times, sparkly vampires, werewolves and other assorted nonsense all over the damn place. Bleargh.

  236. 236
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Caine:
    December? I think? We’ve got almost a full year of shenanigans left!

    Happy New Year to you and your Mister!

  237. 237
    Ingdigo Jump

    I disagree about the shoe string. I do appreciate the spectacle at times. That said, real sets tend to just look better and get better responses from actors who can actually see what they’re supposed to be interacting with.

  238. 238
    Rey Fox

    Science fiction and fantasy films should be forced to use shoestring budgets, apart from the budget for actors and script writers.

    They should also stop playing on your lawn, right?

  239. 239
    Inaji

    Audley:

    December? I think? We’ve got almost a full year of shenanigans left!

    Hmmmph, that means I don’t get to weasel out of work. Stupid apocalypse.

    Happy New Year to you and your Mister!

    Happy New Year to you and Mr. Darkheart! Did you get the chameleon?

  240. 240
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Caine:

    Or teen girls or teens in general. ‘Teen Fiction’ was threatening to eat the bookstore when I was there the last two times, sparkly vampires, werewolves and other assorted nonsense all over the damn place.

    There really aren’t that many movies aimed at teen girls (despite how much of a monster the Twilight series is), but it seems that every action/sci-fi movie that’s been released in the past few years has been PG-13. (Not that girls and women don’t like their sci-fi, but let’s face it, we’re not the intended audience.)

    I just want my “fucks”, is all. Maybe some nudity, too.

    As for YA fiction– I’m just happy that kids are reading. It would be great if there was less shit available for young teens, but there’s all sorts of shit in any genre.

  241. 241
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Caine:

    Did you get the chameleon?

    That’s the project for tomorrow, woot! We’ve already got the stand for the tank set up right beside the turtle tank, just waiting for its next occupant.

    I might be a little bit more excited about David Bowie the chameleon than Mr Darkheart is. :)

  242. 242
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Hmmmph, that means I don’t get to weasel out of work. Stupid apocalypse.

    If there’s one thing we have learned in 2011, it is that you can never rely on an apocalypse!

  243. 243
    Inaji

    Audley:

    I just want my “fucks”, is all.

    I’ve found In Bruges to be a good remedy. :D

  244. 244
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Birger:

    Science fiction and fantasy films should be forced to use shoestring budgets, apart from the budget for actors and script writers.

    Bah… just because some (or maybe even many) use the high-end production techniques badly, you’d deny them to all? Would you similarly force all sculptors to work only in plaster or papier mache, by giving them budgets that couldn’t possibly cover marble or bronze?

    You’re forgetting Sturgeon’s Law: Even stipulating that 90% of big-budget SF/fantasy is crap, your rule would deprive us of the 10% that isn’t… while leaving the 90% of low-budget SF/fantasy that’s certain to be crap in place!

    If your standard had been in place in the late 60s/early 70s, perhaps Solaris would’ve gotten more notice… but so would 9 of its crappy budget-peers for every 1 of its quality-peers, and we would never have had 2001: A Space Odyssey!

    Besides, with the increasing power and sophistication of computer hardware and software, I’m betting CGI will soon be the very cheapest way to produce movies (if it’s not already), so if you’re trying to hold back the use of CGI, limiting budgets wouldn’t be the way to do it.

    But while watching Tintin yesterday, it occurred to me that the CGI actually made it a much more impressive expressing of the producer/director/designers’ artistic vision: They can’t just hire a bunch of extras for a crowd scene, or buy furniture in a thrift shop to dress a room. Instead, every single pixel of the image must be consciously created according to some artistic process. Maybe the very best live-action films reflect this level of artistic focus, but CGI demands it, at least when it’s used to produce the whole film, as in Tintin.

  245. 245
    Rey Fox

    Any time anyone complains about CGI and how we should go back to puppets and stuff, I point to Mac and Me.

  246. 246
    Inaji

    Movies – I think there’s room for all manner of approaches. I thought Rise of the Planet of the Apes was pretty good and I’m not overly crazy about all GGI flicks.

  247. 247
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Rey:

    Any time anyone complains about CGI and how we should go back to puppets and stuff, I point to Mac and Me.

    You know, every time I get all “bah, humbug” about CGI, I just remind myself about District 9. Damn, the prawns looked good.

    Or, hell, Tron: Legacy was fucking beautiful. Boring, but beautiful.

    However, I still think there’s an over-reliance on computer animation, which is too often the only selling point for a movie. Which brings me back to my original point, that if movies that relied heavily on computer generated special effects had the writing and acting to back up the SFX, no one would be complaining.

  248. 248
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Jeez Bill. We get it – you were super-impressed with Tintin. That doesn’t make it unreasonable to note that very good quality films often arise from low budget productions where the crew is forced to be creative rather than relying on special effects. It’s just simply true. With few exceptions the amount of screentime devoted to CGI effects in a film negatively correlates with the overall quality. You’d have to be completely blinded by oooh-ahhh spectacle not to recognize that. No one’s trying to “deny” directors any tools.

  249. 249
    Inaji

    Audley:

    However, I still think there’s an over-reliance on computer animation, which is too often the only selling point for a movie.

    This^. When CGI is the only selling point, it’s off my ‘to be watched list’, written off as boring, boring, boring. Special fx and all can be great, but easily over done.

  250. 250
    chigau (違う)

    I like this movie.
    The Stunt Man

  251. 251
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Also:
    Rey:

    Any time anyone complains about CGI and how we should go back to puppets and stuff, I point to Mac and Me.

    To those that think that CGI is hot shit, I point to Pan’s Labyrinth. Specifically, this guy.

    Some things are just better with puppets and makeup.

  252. 252
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Oh, Tintin. Now, there’s a movie where CGI (aided and abetted by the pounding music) overshadowed any kind of story the film could have had. Not to mention a distinct “uncanny valley” effect on the characters, even the little dog… ><

    But maybe it's better, because to a fan of Hergé, man, did the movie suck!!!

  253. 253
    Inaji

    Between Carbonbasedwhatever and stonyground, I’m beginning to think this must be the year of the simpering apologist accommodationist. Bleagh.

  254. 254
    The Sailor

    Thanks Dawg! I still feeeel good!
    IRT CGI, it ain’t the tool, it’s the mechanic that counts.

  255. 255
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Should the countdown to the supposed End of the World start now? I’m sure we’ll see even more programs dedicated to ancient aliens, the End Times, and the Grand Kablooey now that 2012 has come.
    —————————————

    You know what I could use? A new computer monitor. One that can be easily angled up and down, unlike the current monster. Standing up once in a while during a raid to stretch my legs isn’t doing my neck any favors so far.
    —————————————

    Suddenly I want fries. With honey. And chicken nuggets from Gourmet Heaven. But I can’t, because they are closed today. Maybe tomorrow.

  256. 256
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    To explain why I’m super-pissy about this:

    I hate how frequently people pull the “you just want those kids to get off your lawn” shit whenever someone like me questions the value of a new geegaw or technology. I’m going to give the benefit of the doubt (note: this is much more than such folks give me) and assume you don’t get how it sounds. So let me tell you. It’s outrageously insulting and it makes me very angry. It’s a complete dismissal of a contrary opinion with no consideration of its merits in favor of characterizing the argument as motivated by mere stubbornness and fear of new things. “You didn’t really think about this; you got to your opinion because you’re Teh Old and you’re uncomfortable with new things.”

    So, fuck right off.

  257. 257
    Inaji

    Josh:

    you got to your opinion because you’re Teh Old

    Heh, you aren’t remotely close to Teh Old. Shit, I have 18 years on ya.

  258. 258
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Caine, I know. Doesn’t matter though, because that’s the root of that dismissal. Glib bullshittery needn’t make sense.

    Gah – who the fuck pissed in my cornflakes today?

  259. 259
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    To all in need of a hangover cure today (*eyeballs Josh*), try a classic pick me up:
    Prairie Oyster:
    1 egg yolk
    Freshly ground black pepper
    1 Tbs Worcestershire sauce
    1 1/2 oz port
    Celery salt

    Slide the yolk into a wine glass, so that it remains intact. Season it with a few grindings of pepper, add the Worcestershire sauce and float the port on top. Sprinkle with a pinch of celery salt and swallow the drink without breaking the yolk.

    Me? I’m sticking to beer.

  260. 260
    Inaji

    Josh:

    Doesn’t matter though, because that’s the root of that dismissal.

    Oh, I know. I get tired of the ‘get off my lawn’ dismissal of valid criticism myself. Yeah, I’m an old broad, one who can fully enjoy things like CGI and who can also find ‘all CGI all the time’ utterly boring.

    All this talk of movies and SciFi…I think I’ll put Forbidden Planet in the blu-ray player today and be happy. /Old Broad

  261. 261
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Dr. Audley,

    I will stick with the hair of the dog that bit me… and I sincerely hope that no oyster ever bites me.

  262. 262
    The Sailor

    High heeled boy prompts protest at school

    Student Autumn Gotel said, “I had on heels yesterday all day long; they let me wear them walking up and down the stairs all day. There’s about five or six of my friends had on heels they didn’t say anything. They say the reason Tyreese couldn’t wear his heels was because it was distracting.”
    [...]
    Administrator James Spanbauer says it was partly a safety issue in case of a fire in the four-story building.

    “I would say there probably are some students who go through the day without us addressing, but our intention is to keep everybody safe and administer the Code of Conduct equally across the board and we do the best we can with 1,900 students and when we see things that are inappropriate we address it,” said Spanbauer, who denied there was a double-standard for boys wearing heels.

  263. 263
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Josh OSG:

    Oh, dear… I didn’t mean to start off the new year annoying you!

    Jeez Bill. We get it – you were super-impressed with Tintin.

    Well, I was… but it’s really just that I stumbled on this conversation immediately after coming home from the theater, and since I see so few movies these days, I don’t have many other recent examples to draw on.

    That doesn’t make it unreasonable to note that very good quality films often arise from low budget productions where the crew is forced to be creative rather than relying on special effects.

    I didn’t say it was unreasonable, and I agree that sometimes an arbitrary external constraint can be artistically fruitful (see also strict poetic forms like haiku, sonnets, sestinas, etc.). But my broad expectation is that good artists will make good art with whatever materials and tools they have, and bad artists will make bad art; it’s about the artist, IMHO, not the tools.

    With few exceptions the amount of screentime devoted to CGI effects in a film negatively correlates with the overall quality. You’d have to be completely blinded by oooh-ahhh spectacle not to recognize that.

    The amount of screentime devoted to oooh-ahhh spectacle often correlates negatively with the overall quality (except, of course, for the odd oooh-ahhh spectacular film that’s also fucking brilliant art); I’m less convinced that how the spectacle was created makes much difference. Sacrificing story, character, mood, etc., for spectacle may be a bad artistic choice, but here again, I put that on the artist, not the tools.

    No one’s trying to “deny” directors any tools.

    Well, no one but Birger: Recall that it was specifically hir “limit the budgets so nobody can afford that shit” hypothetical to which I was responding.

    I guess I’m generally skeptical of assertions that [pick your bleeding edge technology] will be the death of [pick your artform]. Not that I’m putting that attitude on you, personally, but there’s been a flavor of that throughout this conversation. Movies went through huge paradigm shifts with the introduction of sound, and then again with color, and each time there was great handwringing. Now it’s computer animation, motion capture, and 3-D, and I predict the same results: 90% of the movies made with these new technologies will be crap… and the other 10% will be non-crap. (And we’ll all continue to disagree about which is which.) And about the same percentage as always will be masterpieces.

    ***
    Irene Delse:

    Oh, Tintin. Now, there’s a movie where CGI (aided and abetted by the pounding music) overshadowed any kind of story the film could have had.

    Fascinating. I experienced it as pure 190-proof story from beginning to end, and I don’t recall ever even noticing the music after the opening credits, except for the one scene in which an operatic performance provides a key plot point.

    But maybe it’s better, because to a fan of Hergé, man, did the movie suck!!!

    Also fascinating. I, myself, have never read the Hergé originals, but I’ve recently heard interviews with experts on the comic books (including, IIRC, Hergé’s biographer), and they have been universally enthusiastic about the film. I gather, BTW, that Hergé was a huge fan of Spielberg, and was on record as saying that he was the only director who could successfully bring Tintin to the screen.

    “To each hir own, said the lady as she kissed the cow,” eh?

  264. 264
    Cipher

    Skeptifem complained about things said on a certain thread.

    No, she actually didn’t. She said that she had just returned to that thread. That thread happens to be the one in which the accusation by a regular that she had a gaping hole in her intellectual honesty and skepticism due to personal trauma (that is, on being raped) was dredged back up, still with no apology to skeptifem for saying that (although some clarifications were posted, they didn’t constitute or amount to an apology). Saying that someone is unable to judge something correctly because they were raped is about as silencing a tactic as I’ve seen.

  265. 265
    Inaji

    Bill:

    I don’t recall ever even noticing the music after the opening credits

    I’m very sensitive to music in movies, I hate blatantly manipulative use of music (common use, I know, but subtle is good) and soundtracks where the volume of the music is incredibly loud. Either of those things will make me walk away from a movie.

  266. 266
    Inaji

    Classical Cipher:

    Saying that someone is unable to judge something correctly because they were raped is about as silencing a tactic as I’ve seen.

    Very true. However, Skeptifem was placing blame on all the regulars here, which was not okay. A lot of us weren’t in that thread at all, or related ones and don’t use or approve of such shit.

  267. 267
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Josh OSG:

    I don’t know whether this…

    I hate how frequently people pull the “you just want those kids to get off your lawn” shit whenever someone like me questions the value of a new geegaw or technology. I’m going to give the benefit of the doubt (note: this is much more than such folks give me) and assume you don’t get how it sounds. So let me tell you. It’s outrageously insulting and it makes me very angry. It’s a complete dismissal of a contrary opinion with no consideration of its merits in favor of characterizing the argument as motivated by mere stubbornness and fear of new things. “You didn’t really think about this; you got to your opinion because you’re Teh Old and you’re uncomfortable with new things.”

    …was directed specifically at me, and I fear I can’t predict whether the response I was working on mollified you at all, or just further enraged you.

    Let me just quickly say that none of my comments on this subject before my immediate previous response was directed at you personally. The fact that you and I may have different opinions on this subject does not mean I’m dismissing yours, and it certainly doesn’t mean I’m attributing your opinion to some sort of arbitrary, thoughtless crankiness. You are, in point of fact, one of the last people around here I would think that of.

    So, fuck right off.

    Aww, damn. It’s too pretty a day (here, at least, after gloomy weather all through the holidays) to be making anyone feel that way, even unintentionally. I withdraw, sir, with best wishes for a happier day and a happy new year.

  268. 268
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    Walton, 665, last thread:

    Is [Jill Filipovic] the one who wrote that bizarre article claiming that men who don’t want to have penetrative sex with women who are menstruating are misogynists? Or am I thinking of someone else? :-/

    You’re probably thinking of someone else. Though, to be honest, some men do have bizarrely misogynist ideas about menstruating women. It’s one thing not to want to have PIV sex during those times for aesthetic reasons, but going on about how “gross” and “nasty” bleeding women are? Uhhhh… that’s misogynist.

    SallyStrange and Chigau: Womanist Musings is the LAST blog I would ever recommend. Renee has said some remarkably transphobic things, she has implied that two women can’t raise a child together, she passed along a decades-old, disproven smear about Jack Layton when he died, she’s given people of color a lifetime pass on cruelty to animals, and she has promoted the writings of an incredibly misogynist black gay author who has said on LiveJournal that he wanted to kill “str8 white bitches” who wrote slashfiction, using piano wire or a lead pipe.

    Carlie, I’d add that I wouldn’t touch FWD with a ten-foot pole, either. That’s the blog that’s convinced so many social-justice warriors that insults to the intelligence such as “stupid” are “ableist,” as are terms such as “weak,” or “scab” in the labor sense. For all their protestations that the Ableist Word Profile shouldn’t be taken as a means of policing others’ language, that is exactly what has happened, and in fact it has been used to police the language of disabled people themselves.

    Not to mention my loathing for the social model of disability. If wheelchair users, for instance, prefer greater accessibility to a cure for paralysis, that’s their prerogative, but I resent the fuck out of the FWD types universalizing that concept. I have suffered from depression and anxiety for decades; no amount of social acceptance will ever make them not suck.

    As for Feministe, what PTI is quoting at #152 on this thread happened over there. The relevant thread was deleted, and then woo-woo contributor Kloncke wrote a condescending OP about how everybody should take deep breaths to calm themselves down (and that thread was shut down after people called bullshit). Let me add that they still haven’t banned Hugo Schwyzer, to the best of my knowledge.

  269. 269
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Bill – no, that wasn’t directed at you (the post or the fuck-off). Sorry if it seemed that way. I’m not fit for human company today and I apologize for being an asshole.

  270. 270
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    Caine, I didn’t participatein that thread. However, having one’s personal trauma become the subject of debate, particularly when the purpose seems to be to call into question one’s objectivity does seem hurtful.

  271. 271
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ Classical Cipher #264:

    Fine, I’ll copy-paste it for you from what she wrote here in comment #9:

    I didn’t go back to the hot for student thread until this morning. Never thought I would see regulars try to silence me

    If that’s not “complaining about what people posted on this particular thread”, then words fail me.

    I’ll also copy-paste (again, already done upthread #143) the link to the comment admitting that claiming that she was prejudiced was an error:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/12/29/hot-forstudent/comment-page-1/#comment-231904

    Oh, and notice who actually dredged up this topic and why:

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/12/29/hot-forstudent/comment-page-1/#comment-231849

    It doesn’t paint the picture you seem to think it paints. But hey, if it’s not your opinion, fine! Just don’t try to lecture me on what I should think.

  272. 272
    Inaji

    A_Ray:

    However, having one’s personal trauma become the subject of debate, particularly when the purpose seems to be to call into question one’s objectivity does seem hurtful.

    Of course it is! Blaming all the regulars isn’t helpful, however.

  273. 273
    Walton

    You’re probably thinking of someone else.

    Just found it – this is the one I was talking about. (It seems Jill Filipovic didn’t write the original column, but cited it approvingly.) It was discussed on a past Thread here.

    Though, to be honest, some men do have bizarrely misogynist ideas about menstruating women. It’s one thing not to want to have PIV sex during those times for aesthetic reasons, but going on about how “gross” and “nasty” bleeding women are? Uhhhh… that’s misogynist.

    Of course that’s true, and there’s nothing “gross” or “nasty” about it. I agree that using that kind of stigmatizing language about women’s bodily functions is misogynistic, and generally unhealthy.

    But it obviously doesn’t follow that a man not wanting to have “period sex” makes him a misogynist. People’s sexual inclinations are what they are, and some people, men and women both, aren’t into certain sexual activities. There’s nothing wrong with that.

  274. 274
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ Ms. Daisy Cutter #268:

    Womanist Musings is the LAST blog I would ever recommend.

    Wow, thanks for that! I went to check WM last night and I wondered if my brains were wired wrong somehow, because I couldn’t agree with the people who recommended it warmly. This blog has some disturbingly judgemental stuff directed to Black women who don’t conform to some very precise societal canons of beauty inside their community. Women trying to keep women from living their life on their own terms: definitely not cool.

  275. 275
    Inaji

    Adding to mine @ 272:

    It struck me that Skeptifem’s post in the previous incarnation was something of a rebuke for all of us not monitoring that thread and jumping all over the person who was being such an ass to her.

    I looked in on the thread a couple of times and saw, yet again, the ongoing, boring, asinine fight between SG/LM and Azkyroth, which has derailed and fucked up one thread after another and left with an eyeroll. I’m not going to apologize for not wading through yet another of their personal dramas with each other. Anymore, seeing those two in the same thread makes me leave immediately.

  276. 276
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    Caine:

    A lot of us weren’t in that thread at all, or related ones and don’t use or approve of such shit.

    And some of us are not opposed to all porn, and we have every right to voice our opinions without being accused of “silencing” someone who, by my count, went on to make four comments.

  277. 277
    Inaji

    Ms. Daisy Cutter, Skeptifem does have strong views on porn, many of which I don’t agree with, however, that does not excuse, in any way, someone using her rape to impugn her reasoning.

  278. 278
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    Caine: Of course it doesn’t. The person who did that was wrong to do so. However, my impression was that her anger was directed at anyone in the thread who disagreed with her. I’d be happy to be told I’m incorrect on that count.

  279. 279
    chigau (違う)

    Does a “blind spot” really negate the worth of an entire argument?

  280. 280
  281. 281
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ Bill Dauphin:

    I, myself, have never read the Hergé originals, but I’ve recently heard interviews with experts on the comic books (including, IIRC, Hergé’s biographer), and they have been universally enthusiastic about the film. I gather, BTW, that Hergé was a huge fan of Spielberg, and was on record as saying that he was the only director who could successfully bring Tintin to the screen.

    I can understand that many comic book experts are enthusiastic about Spielberg’s vision (or, more accurately, Spielberg-Jackson-Moffat’s), even though it actually steers wide away from the kind of stories Hergé used to create and from his gentle, ironical world view. Part of it may be that what works in a comic book doesn’t necessarily work on the wide screen, or that sensitivities have changed since the time of Hergé. For instance, mainstream movie audiences are now accustomed to faster-paced stories with more in the way of violent action.

    My problem is that the whole premise of the Tintin movie is alien to the universe in which the comic-book took place. From the back-story of the characters to the morals displayed in the movie, everything rings untrue. And I can’t for the life of me understand why the film-makers left out large amounts of genuine, visually entertaining adventure found in the comic books to replace it with stock action movie tropes… Ah, well.

    I’m aware that all movie appreciation is subjective, of course. But it’s worth noticing that no Hollywood version of Tintin was authorised by Hergé during his life.

  282. 282
    carlie

    Ms. Daisy Cutter – I hadn’t seen Renee’s transphobic posts before; I read it sporadically (not that that’s an excuse). I read both her and FWD because it gives me a view into lives and mindsets very different than mine, and I’ve learned a lot of things from both. That’s not to say that I agree with everything in them, or that the signal to noise ratio would make it not worth it for someone else. I never got an absolutist feel for the social disability stuff at FWD, but again I’m looking at it from my own angle and others might see things there that I don’t notice.

  283. 283
    chigau (違う)

    Supper tonight will contain deer tenderloin and daikon.
    I’m at a bit of a loss…

  284. 284
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Chigau, what are you lost about? That sounds yummy.

  285. 285
    chigau (違う)

    Josh
    Not much really.
    Put in casserole, put in oven.
    The meat was a gift and we think it may not have been properly aged before freezing so we’re anticpating a lengthy cooking time…
    Wait! We have a crock pot!

  286. 286
    Inaji

    Oh my, PZ’s an asshole and a bully. Tsk.

  287. 287
    Kagehi

    I am still waiting to see when Archaic Redemption comes out:

    http://community.secondlife.com/t5/Inworld/Archaic-Redemption-in-Second-Life/ba-p/670187

    But, not just because I think it would be interesting, I sometimes participate in City of Lost Angels dark roleplay, though, I am a pansy when it comes to the “dark” part. lol

  288. 288
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Good news, bad news: Susan Jacoby announces her last essay in the WaPo for some undefined time, while she’s working on her next book.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/spirited-atheist/post/american-atheists-must-define-themselves-not-be-defined-by-the-religious/2011/12/27/gIQAovELMP_blog.html

  289. 289
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Chigau, if it’s tenderloin might it not remain tender after a shorter cooking? You might try treating it in the Japanese manner. Thinly sliced the daikon then give it a quick fry in hot oil. Set aside. Then slice the tenderloin and sear it, adding shoyu, garlic, onion, oil, a bit of sugar, and some water for cooking. Add the daikon back in when the meat is halfway done and let sauce reduce a bit.

    Just a thought. I wouldn’t ordinarily combine daikon with a deer meat in a more conventional crockpot-type recipe. It seems to want to be Asian:)

  290. 290
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Caine, I smell socks in that thread.

  291. 291
    Inaji

    Josh:

    Caine, I smell socks in that thread.

    Oh, I wouldn’t be surprised. I was just amused at how little we are into 012 and got the ‘asshole bully’ pronouncement so quickly.

  292. 292
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Caine, I smell socks in that thread.

    Could be. But there has been a Jim who sounds just like that Jim, who pops in every few months to criticize PZ in a similar manner. His post stopped my titanium fang from itching…

  293. 293
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Good lord. Who would have thought that a silly post about a dumb email would bring the trolls out?

  294. 294
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Oh, I don’t think Jim is the sock, but I do think some of the other never-before-seen ‘nyms complaining about tone may be knitted footwear.

  295. 295
    Inaji

    Audley:

    Who would have thought that a silly post about a dumb email would bring the trolls out?

    It seems that a lot of people think a biologist is a fossil expert.

  296. 296
    Kagehi

    Besides, with the increasing power and sophistication of computer hardware and software, I’m betting CGI will soon be the very cheapest way to produce movies (if it’s not already), so if you’re trying to hold back the use of CGI, limiting budgets wouldn’t be the way to do it.

    Yeah, things like this one make it look *very* likely:

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-knights-corner-mic-co-processor,14002.html

  297. 297
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Oh, I don’t think Jim is the sock, but I do think some of the other never-before-seen ‘nyms complaining about tone may be knitted footwear.

    To quote the Mythies, “Plausible”. I haven’t been paying full attention today, as the Redhead has me working on a project for her. *on to the next step*

  298. 298
    Kagehi

    Gah.. Bloody wordpress people need to get this through there heads – If you pick, “I want updates via email on this thread”, it doesn’t mean, “I want to come back an hour later and find something in my email asking me if I **really** wanted to do that.” Had that issue with Atheist’s Chapel, now apparently this blog is generating that bloody BS too.

  299. 299
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Josh OSG:

    Bill – no, that wasn’t directed at you (the post or the fuck-off).

    Whew. Thanks for the clarification.

    Sorry if it seemed that way.

    No worries, mate![1]

    ***
    Irene:

    I can understand that many comic book experts are enthusiastic….

    Just to be crystal clear, the favorable interviews I referred to were with people who are (or at least were presented as) experts on the Tintin books specifically, and/or on Hergé himself, not just “comic book” people in the broader sense. here is the main program I was thinking of, though I’ve heard other interviews and reviews as well.

    …[the movie] actually steers wide away from the kind of stories Hergé used to create and from his gentle, ironical world view.

    It does? As I’ve said, I never read the books, but… notwithstanding the action-driven plot (which IMHO isn’t a bad thing), I got plenty of “gentle, ironical world view” out of the film. You keep telling me about lost elements that I feel I actually found in the film.

    …the film-makers left out large amounts of genuine, visually entertaining adventure found in the comic books to replace it with stock action movie tropes…

    Again, it didn’t feel stock to me. For just one example, the idea of a “stock” pirate-movie swordfight fought with giant cargo cranes instead of swords struck me as brilliantly inventive: I’ve never seen anything like it before. I don’t know how much of that to attribute to Spielberg, et al., and how much to Hergé, but I don’t care: Either way, it delighted me.

    But it’s worth noticing that no Hollywood version of Tintin was authorised by Hergé during his life.

    My understanding is that he had a meeting scheduled with Spielberg to discuss that very purpose, but died before the meeting could take place.

    ***
    [1] Sorry for the faux Australian argot; I’m just back from New Year’s Day dinner at Outback… which has become a sort of family tradition, as bizarre as that seems.

  300. 300
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Hello.

    Had a weird culinary experience today. I decided to make some bean an sausage soup. And, as I was browning the sausages, I noticed a very sweet, almost fruity smell. And I was worried that the sausage, despite being just out of the freezer, had gone bad. Then I actually read the label and discovered that the sausage had cranberry and apricot in it. So I added some apples and cabbage to the bean soup and I hope it will be good. It smells good.

    And, best of all, it does not smell like sockpuppet.

    And a very happy wildebeest gnu year to all.

  301. 301
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Caine,

    Very true. However, Skeptifem was placing blame on all the regulars here, which was not okay.

    If Irene is right to point out that “regulars” plural is inaccurate when speaking about one regular, then I’d like to point out that
    your “all the regulars” is inaccurate when referring to that use of “regulars” plural.

    +++++

    Ms. Daisy Cutter,

    However, my impression was that her anger was directed at anyone in the thread who disagreed with her. I’d be happy to be told I’m incorrect on that count.

    Horses, not zebras. The common complaint about lack of a safe space is that an inexcusable comment is not criticized by a broad segment of the community. And that’s what skeptifem’s complaint looks like.

    Nothing in her comment justifies your invention.

  302. 302
    Inaji

    Happy Gnu Year, Ogvorbis.

  303. 303
    Ms. Daisy Cutter, General Manager for the Cleveland Steamers

    Carlie, #282: Fair enough; even blogs with terrible track records do produce gems once in a while. As much as I’ve come to loathe Shakesville, for example, there are Melissa McEwan essays I will still gladly link to.

  304. 304
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ Bill Dauphin: Well, since you have read none of the Tintin books, it’s difficult for you to compare, right?

    I’m not saying the film isn’t good (although I hated it), only that it felt completely jarring to me and to my tintinophile friends this side of the Atlantic. Notwithstanding what other Tintin fans may think: they are entitled to their opinion.

    As for pacing and so on: the action felt (for us) so breathless that even the cargo crane fight failed to enliven the film. It could have been a crowning moment… But as it is, coming after a long, exhausting tunnel of running, jumping, fighting, OTT slapstick, gratuitous guilt-trips and some sort of ominous back-story for the major characters that didn’t come from Hergé but could have been copy-pasted from any Stephen Moffat scenario, it just fell flat.

    This is the “stock” material I was alluding to: things that you can find in just about any action movie or TV series today, just packaged in slicker CGI than usual. (At least, the landscape, vehicles, etc., were beautifully rendered. The human characters looked more like escapees from the uncanny valley.)

    All in all, like a lot of blockbusters nowadays, it felt more like a park ride than a movie. If you like it, fine. But that’s just not Hergé. A Spielbergian variation on some themes by Hergé, maybe… A very Spielbergian one, with big dollops of Moffat and Jackson, but very little of Hergé.

    BTW, sorry if this sounds harsh, but that’s just how I felt. I wish I could have those 107 minutes back!

  305. 305
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    Fear not! An internet tradition may be saved: Kim Jong-un looking at things.

  306. 306
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ love moderately #301:

    The common complaint about lack of a safe space is that an inexcusable comment is not criticized by a broad segment of the community. And that’s what skeptifem’s complaint looks like.

    Funny that you should say that, after bringing up once again the “inexcusable comment” as tool in your ongoing dispute with another regular…

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/12/29/hot-forstudent/comment-page-1/#comment-231849

  307. 307
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    North Korea called on its people to rally behind new leader Kim Jong-un and protect him as “human shields” while working to solve the “burning issue” of food shortages by upholding the policies of his late father, Kim Jong-il.

    This struck me as quite jarring. Didn’t Kim Jonh-il’s policies continue and worsen the North Korean food shortages? How will upholding his father’s policies solve the problem? Or am I taking this way too seriously?

  308. 308
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    The funniest thing about nudity taboos is that they extend to cows. If you ever look at a school illustration or model of a cow, you’ll notice that the udder is rendered as an amorphous or a squarish blob. In real life, an udder looks like a giant pair of testicles–with veins.

  309. 309
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ Brother Oggvorbis:

    Kim Jong-il succeeded his father at a time when the economy of NK began to deteriorate because of the fall of the Eastern Block: no more aid from the USSR or Cuba. Food shortage and famine ensued. The “solution” Kim and his regime found was to embark in what is effectively nuclear blackmail: give us money unless you want us to feel so threatened that we resort to pre-emptive strikes…

    That was at the end of the 1990s, IIRC. From then on, things have been a little bit better for North Koreans, thanks to direct aid from the UN and the USA and to the strengthening of economic ties with South Korea.

    So it wouldn’t surprise me if many people in NK actually thought that Kim Jong-il’s “bold policy” managed to pull his country from the brink of disaster. Not a cheerful tought :-(

    I recently read B.R. Myers’ (no relation!) book The Cleanest Race: How North Koreans See Themselves And Why It Matters, a useful (if a bit sketchy in parts) account of NK’s history and its ideology.

  310. 310
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    I think my stove is from before Harvest Green, Burnt Orange Pumpkin, Harvest Gold, etc. were popular. It’s so old, the top is cracking. I’d replace it if I could find another top that small.

    Skeptifem, I’ve missed a lot of threads because I couldn’t sign in for weeks, I’ve been travelling, my computer battery is dying, excuses 9 through 14, and I’m allergic to misogyny, but–damn!

  311. 311
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Funny that you should say that,

    Funny would be if I had said “inexcusable comments should never be mentioned; it’s best to look the other way and pretend they didn’t happen.”

    after bringing up once again the “inexcusable comment” as tool in your ongoing dispute with another regular…

    And I probably will again. Because Azkyroth has only said his comment was a tactical error and “could justifiably be considered patronizing”, it appears he still believes he had diagnosed her accurately and he still believes that he can (privately) attribute her disagreement to her rape. While he indicates he won’t come out and say it again, there is reason to believe this continues to color his readings of her — because he said so — and no reason to believe otherwise until he says otherwise.

  312. 312
    The Sailor

    I think some folks here will like this alot!

  313. 313
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ LM:

    Excuse me while I ROTFL. You obviously know exactly what goes on in other people’s mind! Too bad you didn’t quote the part where A said he had recalled incorrectly and that he saw now it was a mistake (and not a “tactical” one)…

    http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/12/29/hot-forstudent/comment-page-1/#comment-231904

    But hey, maybe you’re psychic after all!

    (BTW, this is the last time I’ll write on that subject, because enough is enough. LM, you can be funny at little doses, but too much, and it irritates the stomach.)

  314. 314
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    The Sailor:

    But can one love an alot alot? ;-)

  315. 315
    strange gods before me ॐ

    You obviously know exactly what goes on in other people’s mind!

    When a person tells me what they think, I trust that they actually think what they said they think.

    Azkyroth told us exactly what he thinks: that skeptifem’s viewpoint is attributable to being raped. The fact that he told us this is pretty good evidence that Azkyroth thinks skeptifem’s viewpoint is attributable to being raped.

    Azkyroth has never said that he no longer thinks this. Because he has never said he no longer thinks this, there is no evidence that he no longer thinks this.

    If you believe Azkyroth now believes he cannot attribute her viewpoint to being raped, then you are holding your belief in spite of evidence to the contrary.

    Too bad you didn’t quote the part where A said he had recalled incorrectly and that he saw now it was a mistake (and not a “tactical” one)…

    Too bad you didn’t quote it either. Here:

    She herself had attributed her views in large part to her personal poor experience with the porn industry, as I recalled at the time, and I meant to suggest that she was generalizing inappropriately, not that she was broken and couldn’t think straight or whatever you decided to take it as. I later acknowledged that this was a mistake and shouldn’t have even been brought up.

    I remember the comment he was referring to and I did in fact link to it already. I quote, from that comment and further down the page:

    That said, in retrospect there probably was no compelling reason to bring it up and I can see why it could justifiably be considered patronizing to rationalize someone else’s mistakes for them. I’ll try to avoid that.

    I corrected what were either misunderstandings or misrepresentations of what I was actually saying and why, explained why I didn’t accept the claim that I was “misrepresenting” her, and acknowledged that one portion of what I was attempting to say nevertheless wasn’t helpful and could reasonably be considered patronizing.

    I acknowledged that it could be seen as patronizing and would be avoiding such in the future, explained that I had not intended it to be dismissive, and that I had a reasonable basis for believing it to be true.

    Emphasis mine. That’s an admission that saying it was a tactical mistake, and a clear statement that he still thought his statement was accurate.

    (BTW, this is the last time I’ll write on that subject

    I hope that was a premature statement, having not yet seen the bigger picture.

  316. 316
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Irene:

    Well, since you have read none of the Tintin books, it’s difficult for you to compare, right?

    Right. I said so right up front, didn’t I? In fact, I think I’ve been careful to say so each time I’ve responded to you, specifically because I didn’t want to seem like I was making comparisons for which I lack data.

    …[the film] felt completely jarring to me and to my tintinophile[1] friends this side of the Atlantic. Notwithstanding what other Tintin fans may think: they are entitled to their opinion.

    Ahh. Your original comment sounded to me as if you meant to be speaking for all (or at least most) Hergé fans; that was the only reason I even mentioned the contrary opinions I was aware of. It wouldn’t surprise me if there are cultural, or generational, divides in how the film is received, and it’s far from unusual for people deeply seeped in the source material to be harsh on film adaptations (I’ve been pleasantly surprised at how popular the Harry Potter films have been, given the fanatical geeky loyalty people [including me] have to the books).

    But if your familiarity with the originals has led you to hate the film, then I suppose I’m glad I haven’t read them, because for me the film was 107 minutes of pure (and sorely needed) joy.

    It made me so happy, in fact, that I am officially going to not worry about the suggestion, implicit in your comments, that I’m a superficial hack for having liked it. ;^)

    ***
    [1] Am I the only one to whom this term sounds like some sort of auditory pathology? ;^)

  317. 317
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    [1] Am I the only one to whom this term sounds like some sort of auditory pathology? ;^)

    What, not a paraphilia? I’m feeling kind of disappointed, here! ;-)))

  318. 318
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Also this:

    Too bad you didn’t quote the part where A said he had recalled incorrectly

    is your own mistaken recollection. He has not yet admitted that he recalled incorrectly, though I expect he eventually will.

    (I’m painstakingly familiar with my own collection of King Charles’s heads.)

  319. 319
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    What, not a paraphilia?

    Yeah, that occurred to me after I posted. Missed opportunity, eh?

  320. 320
    Walton

    Bill and Irene, re Tintin: Surely this is a classic case of de gustibus non est disputandum?

    (I haven’t seen the Tintin movie, or read any of the books, but I like many things which others dislike. Garfield, for instance. And diet sodas flavoured with aspartame.*)

    (*Though I did taste a classic Dublin Dr Pepper while I was in Texas – made, of course, with real cane sugar – and I must concede that it was wonderful.)

  321. 321
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    It’s really too bad that the Martian folk will be the wrong colour. Burroughs is dead and can’t object, but Ursula Le Guin was really angry that her protagonist was made white instead of red, especially since young readers had told her that it was important for them to find a non-white hero.

  322. 322
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Bill Dauphin:

    Yeah, that occurred to me after I posted. Missed opportunity, eh?

    Quite the Freudian slip, then ;-)

  323. 323
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    A_ray, check your food processor’s instructions: you might find that it will grind grains. If not, check your local health foods store or food coop – they may have freshly ground — might even let you grind some into a container and buy it by weight.

  324. 324
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    Dr. Audley Z. Darkheart, orange-ricotta pound cake with marmalade glaze? Recipe in the wiki? Or here? Please?

  325. 325
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    We had November like the Septembers used to be, December like the Octobers we used to have, a green Christmas, and now pouring rain for New Year’s Day. This is not the climate I grew up with and I’ve moved north!

  326. 326
    Markita Lynda—threadrupt

    So, how does everyone like the steampunk Sherlock Holmes action hero? Audley?

  327. 327
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    So, how does everyone like the steampunk Sherlock Holmes action hero?

    Pshaw. Steampunk pretender.

  328. 328
    Part-Time Insomniac

    As someone who hasn’t yet seen either of the Sherlock Holmes films (the current one is the second one, right?), I think the steampunk style isn’t a huge stretch.

  329. 329
    Walton

    The other experience I had in Texas: wonderful food. I’ve never had so much excellent Mexican food before. (Something of which we don’t get much in England, sadly; we have good Indian and Chinese food, but Mexican is harder to come by.) And although I’m usually veggie, I had seafood meals a couple of times, and can attest that camarones a la Veracruzana are delicious, as are fish tacos with mahi-mahi. So too is catfish with a pecan crust.

  330. 330
    Inaji

    Walton:

    The other experience I had in Texas: wonderful food.

    It’s good to hear you talk about eating. How is Algernon?

  331. 331
    The Sailor

    Walton, oh yeah, the SW has some awesome Mexican food. It’s one of things I miss about living there.

  332. 332
    Cipher

    I saw Girl with the Dragon Tattoo today.

    *shrugs* (MILD SPOILERS COMING)

    It was all right. I was REALLY out of it for a lot of the time, to be fair, and I also missed a couple of scenes by virtue of not wanting to look at the screen, but overall the impression I got was: I wasn’t as fond of Rooney Mara as I am of Noomi but I grudgingly accept that she did well (she played a very different Lisbeth, in my opinion), Daniel Craig was decent, American-Bjurman was moderately less slimy (I mean, he was still just as horrible, but he CAME OFF less slimy and more harmless prior) but I appreciated some things about his characterization, American-Vanger was awesome, and American-Erika was passable so far but I’m hoping she gets better. I did not like some of the plot changes and I really really disliked the one involving Palmgren.

  333. 333
    SallyStrange

    About the criticisms of Womanist Musings–fair enough, Renee has said some stupid shit. I still think her blog is worth reading on account of her list of contributors. If it weren’t for them, the blog wouldn’t be nearly as good as it is.

  334. 334
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Walton:

    Bill and Irene, re Tintin: Surely this is a classic case of de gustibus non est disputandum?

    Oh, to be sure; I just found it fascinating (the very word I used… twice… in my initial reply to Irene) how two people’s responses can be so utterly different.

    …I like many things which others dislike. Garfield, for instance. And diet sodas flavoured with aspartame.*)

    Well, one outa’ two ain’t bad, I suppose! ;^)

    The other experience I had in Texas: wonderful food. I’ve never had so much excellent Mexican food before.

    QFT… though if you weren’t eating non-sea critters — esp. beef and pork — I fear you may have missed the very best of it. Ah, tacos al carbon at the original Ninfa’s in Houston… sorry; drifted off there for a sec!

    ***
    Markita, Ogvorbis, and PTI:

    Re the new Sherlock Holmes movies… “Ah, they’ve made Holmes a steampunk James Bond” was my immediate reaction to the first one, and the new one does nothing to change my mind. Although, my daughter sees him as more of a steampunk House, esp. WRT the relationship with Watson (i.e., Holmes+Watson=House+Wilson).

  335. 335
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Bill D:

    I haven’t seen either of the new Sherlock Holmes films. I just approach the ‘technology’ of the movies (what I have seen of it (which is alot (intentional) as both Kids are into it)) just strikes me as exceedingly unrealistic based on my study of, and experience with, the real stuff.

  336. 336
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Hmmm… at this very moment, my wife and daughter are watching When Harry Met Sally downstairs. The “I’ll have what she’s having” scene is… interesting… when it interrupts your train of thought as a distant sound from another part of the house. Jus’ sayin’….

  337. 337
    Cipher

    Also, I went in the bathroom at the theater and all my hair stood up and stuck to the walls and ever since then I’ve been really staticky.

  338. 338
    Part-Time Insomniac

    I can see where your daughter would draw that comparison, Bill. Aside from their relationships with their respective partners (assistants? Not sure which is better-fitting), Holmes and House do share some traits. Both are highly intelligent and get a huge rush out of figuring out problems, although I think House doesn’t have quite as much charm. He also strikes me as somewhat more abrupt and coarse then Holmes, but that may be just because I haven’t watched very many episodes of the show.

  339. 339
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    The Brother Formerly Known as Father Ogvorbis:

    …the ‘technology’ of the [Holmes] movies … just strikes me as exceedingly unrealistic…

    Oh, exceedingly; quite so! Hence my immediate association with the Bond films. Though as soon as my daughter mentioned House, I could see that comparison, too, in the weird, codependent, quasi-abusive relationship with Watson.

  340. 340
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Kittehs are in their glory running all over the house and rubbing up on me now that Visiting Doggie Guest For 5 Days has finally gone back home. These felines have made it clear they intend to extract their pound of flesh from me.

  341. 341
    Cipher

    The character House was inspired by Holmes :)

  342. 342
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    And to tie the Holmes movies back to PZ’s comment in the OP about casual nudity, how ’bout that Stephen Fry scene, eh?

    ;^)

  343. 343
    carlie

    I am upset that we here in the States do not get the BBC Sherlock that everyone across the pond got to watch today. :( BBCA doesn’t even have any information on when it might be available in the future on their site. I has a HUGE sad at the unavailability of Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman on my tv.

  344. 344
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    These felines have made it clear they intend to extract their pound of flesh from me.

    Hopefully, that pound of flesh is tuna and/or catnip.

  345. 345
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Markita:
    Sherlock Homes was meh. If you’re expecting a Guy Richie film, you won’t be disappointed. I do think that Jude Law as Watson was inspired casting, however.

    As for the cake, I’ll post the recipe here after I get home later tonight. It is so good.

  346. 346
    John Morales

    ॐ, I suppose this is as good a time as any for thanking you for making me try to be less tenaciously disputatious, thanks to your example.

    So, thanks.

  347. 347
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    I kinda give Audley the stink-eye since she’s a sweets person and I’m a savory person (I find this quite suspect), but you can bet any cake she makes is rockin’. Definitely grab her recipes!

  348. 348
    strange gods before me ॐ

    You’re welcome.

  349. 349
    John Morales

    Walton,

    … I like many things which others dislike. Garfield, for instance.

    You have no idea of how very tempted I was to respond to your FB post with Ren & Stimpy.

    (No need to thank me)

  350. 350
    SallyStrange

    I has a HUGE sad at the unavailability of Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman on my tv.

    No kidding! I am on tenterhooks after the first season!

  351. 351
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Nerd – the pound will be seafood-flavor treats that the doggie owners brought back as a gift for dog sitting.

    The most amusing thing about having the dog for five days was that Mink and Sophie were all about solidarity (clench-pawed salute). On the best days they’re little better than frenemies. . . swatting each other if one gets too close. But they were a united front these past five days. I moved their food, water, and litter upstairs to the guest room to give them a retreat away from the canine. Every time I went upstairs there they would be, cuddled up next to each other in the folds of the comforter on the bed. When one came down the staircase to peek out, the other would be right behind her taking advantage of the protection of the other’s tail.

  352. 352
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Carlie, BBCA has a shit load of twenty year old ST:TNG episodes and US movies starring Brits to show series that are made by the BBC.

    (Speaking as someone who is tired of their policy of not replaying old series unless it is Doctor Who, Top Gear or all of those fucking Gordon Ramsey shows.)

  353. 353
  354. 354
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Lucky day for the Episcopalian and Anglican in the USA who bemoan the ordination of women or gays to the priesthood in modern Churches: Pope Palpatine has announced a special body to help them convert to good ol’ strait-laced Catholicism!

  355. 355
    Inaji

    citing his expertise as “an amateur paleontologist”

    :double facepalm:

  356. 356
    Ingdigo Jump

    @Irene Delse

    It’s like PCR, but for ethics and morality!

    As they take in more and more converts from progressive heresy they become more and more dogmatically pure and the few outliers quickly become irrelevant!

  357. 357
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Caine:

    citing his expertise as “an amateur paleontologist”

    :double facepalm:

    I know, right? This was yet another check carefully to make sure it’s not an Onion story moment for me!

  358. 358
    carlie

    janine – absolutely. Not only can we not use their iplayer, the beeb won’t even sell it to me on itunes! Hello, BBC, I would like to give you money to see a show that you’ve already produced and would be free to you to provide to me. And yet, you won’t take my money! Whyyyyyyy???

  359. 359
    carlie

    Also, BBC and every other movie producer, we have to have a talk about region-specific DVDs.

  360. 360
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    region-specific DVDs.

    The most obnoxious and commercially self-defeating idea ever. Dude – why?

  361. 361
    Inaji

    Bill:

    I know, right?

    It was a barrel of blazing stupid in a few short lines. When he said he looks at the earth’s temperature all the time, I had an image of him running out to his backyard and sticking a thermometer in the dirt.

  362. 362
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ janine:

    Hello, BBC, I would like to give you money to see a show that you’ve already produced and would be free to you to provide to me. And yet, you won’t take my money! Whyyyyyyy???

    Have you tried the website for the emission? I don’t know about BBC TV, but BBC Radio make their shows commercially available through Audible.co.uk and AudioGO.

  363. 363
    carlie

    The most obnoxious and commercially self-defeating idea ever. Dude – why?

    I still covet us versions of Blackpool and Cassanova.

  364. 364
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh:

    I kinda give Audley the stink-eye since she’s a sweets person and I’m a savory person (I find this quite suspect), but you can bet any cake she makes is rockin’. Definitely grab her recipes!

    Awe, thanks! :)

    Since you’re savory and I’m sweet, that makes us an unstoppable duo! We could be super-heroes or something.

    (I am not going to be the side-kick.)

    Orange-Ricotta Pound Cake with Marmalade Glaze

    For the cake:
    3 cups unbleached all-purpose flour
    1 1/2 tsp baking powder
    1/2 tsp baking soda
    1 tsp salt
    3/4 cup (1 1/2 sticks) unsalted butter, softened
    1 1/2 cups sugar
    1 1/2 cups whole milk ricotta cheese
    3 large eggs
    1/4 cup orange juice
    1 1/2 tsp vanilla extract
    1 1/2 tsp orange zest

    1) Preheat the oven to 325°F. Grease a 12 cup Bundt pan and dust with flour. Combine the flour, baking powder, baking soda, and salt in a mixing bowl.

    2) Combine the butter and sugar in a large mixing bowl and cream with an electric mixer on medium-high speed until fluffy (about 3 minutes), scraping down the sides of the bowl as necessary. Add ricotta cheese and beat until smooth.

    3) With the mixer on medium speed, add the eggs one at a time, scraping down the bowl after each addition. Beat in orange juice, vanilla, and zest.

    4) Turn the mixer on low speed and add the flour mixture 1/2 cup at a time, scraping down the sides of the bowl after each addition. After the last addition, mix for 30 seconds on medium speed.

    5) Scrape the batter into the Bundt pan. Bake until the cake is golden brown and a toothpick inserted in the center comes out clean, about 1 hour 10 minutes.

    6) Cool the cake in the pan on a wire rack for 15 minutes, then invert it onto the rack to cool completely.

    For the glaze:
    1/2 cup marmalade
    2 tsp water

    1) Stir the marmalade and the water together in a small saucepan over medium heat until the marmalade liquifies. Brush the hot mixture over the cooled cake. Let the glaze cool before slicing and serving.

    A couple of notes/observations:
    The recipe says that you can substitute grapefruit marmalade and grapefruit zest instead of the orange. I had a hell of a time just finding regular marmalade, so I didn’t get to try it that way. Next time!

    On that note, I could find “sweet” marmalade, but after eating the cake, I wouldn’t advise using it. The cake itself isn’t very sweet and I think having a sweet glaze would ruin it.

    The batter will be incredibly thick– mine was almost the consistency of bread dough. That’s okay, just bear in mind that there’s nearly a pound and a half of cheese and no liquid dairy in the batter.

    And now I think I’m going to make a batch of peanut butter cookies. :)

  365. 365
    carlie

    Oooo, I CAN has Cassanova! Now to wait for the next payday that has extra money…

  366. 366
    cicely

    Fennel is terrible. Terrible.
    It would go well with peas.
    -
    If heels are unsafe in event of fire when boys wear them, then they are equally unsafe when girls wear them, and reverse-wise. Unless the claim is that girls are somehow less flammable than boys. Or…no…wait; it couldn’t possibly be that a few girls lost to fire is a small price to pay for the *ahem* aesthetic effect, but boys are too precious to risk.
    -

  367. 367
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Fennel is terrible. Terrible.

    You, my friend, are so terribly wrong.

  368. 368
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Thoughts on this?

    I know what mine are.

  369. 369
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Mmm, good cake recipe, Girl Wonder (ducks).

    I think I’ll substitute lemon for the orange. Think that would work? I don’t care for orange in sweets, but I do like lemon in baked goods.

  370. 370
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    FYI Mrs. BigDumbChimp was blasting the Bee Gees in our hotel room this morning at 10:00 am after us being out to 7:00 am.

    If this is how 2012 is going to be, the end of the world cannot come soon enough.

  371. 371
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh,

    Girl Wonder

    *shakes fist!*

    I don’t see why you couldn’t use lemon instead of orange. If you’re going whole-hog and substitute the juice as well as the zest/marmalade, I would sweeten the juice up just a tad first.

    But, yeah, now that I think about it, lemon sounds fucking divine. (And who doesn’t like lemon pound cake?)

  372. 372
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Exactly, Audley. One would need to cut the amount of lemon juice and increase the amount of sugar, cuts that’s just how this particular citrus rolls.

    You know it also occurs to me that with so much whole milk ricotta you may not need so much butter, either, since a lot of the fat content in the recipe is taken care of in the cheese.

    This concludes Josh’s rationalization of a marginally lower-saturated-fat alternative. If this had been an actual recipe, this message would have been followed by official apologies.

  373. 373
    firstapproximation

    When does Gingrich show us a jpg of his Mensa Card?

    Bwahahahahahahahaha!

    “I’m an amateur paleontologist,” Gingrich said. “I spend a lot of time looking at the Earth’s temperature for a very long time. I’m a lot harder to convince than just looking at a computer model.”

  374. 374
    firstapproximation

    BTW, it’s a jpg of his expired Mensa Card.

  375. 375
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    BTW, it’s a jpg of his expired Mensa Card.

    Ah yes, I forgot that very important detail

  376. 376
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    “I spend a lot of time looking at the Earth’s temperature for a very long time. I’m a lot harder to convince than just looking at a computer model.”

    … I think maybe somebody does not know how computer models work.

  377. 377
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Josh:

    Exactly, Audley. One would need to cut the amount of lemon juice and increase the amount of sugar, cuts that’s just how this particular citrus rolls.

    Right. But the additional sugar should mixed in with the juice and not with the butter.

    You know it also occurs to me that with so much whole milk ricotta you may not need so much butter, either, since a lot of the fat content in the recipe is taken care of in the cheese.

    Um… I know that this cake isn’t the healthiest thing out there, but I’d be hesitant to cut the butter. Part of what gives you a nice, fluffy cake is creaming the proper amount of butter and sugar together. Cutting the amount of butter will lead to less air in the batter and this cake doesn’t really need to be any denser than it already is.

  378. 378
    cicely

    Thoughts on this?
    I know what mine are.

    Unless I’m reading something wrong, “the” Veronica is claimed at “less than 1% Cherokee”(determined how? Isn’t that usually reckoned in fractions?)…and yet her father is apparently Cherokee enough that the tribe feels it has a claim? To me, this quacks like a scam of some sort.

    And you are welcome to my share of the world’s fennel supply. I had to burp that crap up all night long.
    -

  379. 379
    chigau (違う)

    Fennel is terrible. Terrible.

    We could not make our chorizo without fennel, so I cannot agree.

  380. 380
    firstapproximation

    Gingrich,

    “I spend a lot of time looking at the Earth’s temperature for a very long time. I’m a lot harder to convince than just looking at a computer model.”

    Reminds me of Herman Cain boasting that he had been studying foreign policy for “months”.

  381. 381
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Excellent points, Audley. You’re right – this is not the sort of recipe that would take well to a lower butter content. So it goes on the list of “sometimes/occasional foods” in its pure form:)

  382. 382
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Wait, when did the idea of region-specific DVDs come about, and yes, WHY? Is it one of those covert ways they try to make people feel good about buying a product, like they’ve joined a special club or something? “Oooo, I can play this because my DVD player is also Region 2. Oh you can’t? LOL loser!”

  383. 383
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    there’s not much better than an orange, fennel, feta, beet and pisachio salad in the summer

  384. 384
    'Tis Himself

    “I’m an amateur paleontologist,” Gingrich said. “I spend a lot of time looking at the Earth’s temperature for a very long time. I’m a lot harder to convince than just looking at a computer model.”

    Paleontologists study fossils, climatologists study climate. But Gingrich is half-right. He’s an amateur.

  385. 385
    John Morales

    Rev. BDC:

    there’s not much better than an orange, fennel, feta, beet and pisachio salad in the summer

    Gazpacho.

  386. 386
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    A savory recipe (which I’m addicted to and must only have once a week): Deep-fried tofu. Even if you’re a carnivore and think tofu is meh, this is delicious.

    Ingredients:

    8 ounces super firm tofu, pressed to get the water out

    1/2 cup flour (white flour is very fine, but I use whole grain spelt which is also tasty and better for you)

    1/4 cup nutritional yeast

    1 tbsp. powdered garlic

    1 tsp. powdered ginger

    1 tsp. onion powder

    1/2 tsp. hot cayenne pepper

    Instructions:

    Combine dry ingredients. Cut tofu into small, bite-sized cubes. Moisten in water, buttermilk, soy milk, or whatever you like. Roll in flour mixture. Set aside for 15 minutes to dry. Briefly dip in liquid and roll in dry mixture again. Set aside to dry.

    Meanwhile, heat an inch of oil to frying temperature (at least 365F) in a saucepan. Fry small batches of tofu until golden and crisp. Dry on paper towels.

    Serve with a sauce of shoyu combined with a bit of vinegar and hoisin sauce. Add garlic and spring onions if you like.

  387. 387
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    I loathe stainless steel appliances.

    meh, having cooked professionally for about 10 years I like the look of stainless everywhere in a kitchen. It “feels” cleaner to me and stainless is very neutral in color so it can go with pretty much anything.

  388. 388
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Mmmmmm tofu. That reminds me, can you freeze it? Without cooking it beforehand, that is.

  389. 389
    chigau (違う)

    re fennel
    Are we talking the seed or the bulb?

  390. 390
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Gazpacho.

    Yeah that’s a contender for sure.

  391. 391
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Insomniac – you can freeze tofu, but it does weird things to the texture. It makes it very spongy and dry with large, open holes. You may like it, but you may not. It’s worth an experiment.

  392. 392
    Rev. BigDumbChimp

    Are we talking the seed or the bulb

    either as far as I’m concerned. They’re both multi-useful and fantastic.

  393. 393
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    John Morales:

    Gazpacho.

    Served with fresh shrimp.

    *Homer drool!*

  394. 394
    chigau (違う)

    PTI
    Frozen and thawed uncooked tofu has the texture of a sponge.
    It’s not inedible but it is very much not like tofu.

  395. 395
    madarab

    I have found the most awesome thing ever. http://www.skilletstreetfood.com/shop.php

  396. 396
    Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle

    Is she the one who wrote that bizarre article claiming that men who don’t want to have penetrative sex with women who are menstruating are misogynists? Or am I thinking of someone else? :-/

    I have little interest in defending Feministe, but . . . that’s not what that article says. there’s a very important distinction very clearly stated in the piece between distaste for blood and what constitutes misogyny in this context.

  397. 397
    Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle

    I just have to brag for a moment. I FINALLY got my run time for the mile under 7 minutes. This is especially cool since, a mere few months ago, I could barely manage a 20 minute mile. And about 2.5 years ago, i was morbidly obese and incredibly unhealthy (note: these are not absolutely tied together. HAES.), and couldn’t run at all.

    I am proud of me today.

  398. 398
    John Morales

    Illuminata, grats.

    (You have very good reason to be proud)

  399. 399
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Josh and chigau: Er, ew. I do not want sponge on my plate. Two more questions: Will cooking before freezing help in any way? If yes, I imagine deep-frying could be the best way to, but is it?

  400. 400
    The Sailor

    I just found out tonight that a friend of a sailing friend of mine who I’ve hung out with is a non-fiction Pulitzer Prize winner. And his Dad won a Nobel.

  401. 401
    Walton

    I have little interest in defending Feministe, but . . . that’s not what that article says. there’s a very important distinction very clearly stated in the piece between distaste for blood and what constitutes misogyny in this context.

    That’s precisely where the article sets up a false dichotomy. It says…

    Do you have a right to refuse to have period sex because you think bleeding vaginas be nasty? Of course. And do I have a right to leave your ass and think less of you because of that? You betcha. Because it does come down to misogyny, basically — most pre-menopausal people with uteruses and vaginas who are old enough to consent to sex bleed once a month. Vaginas do not exist as sterile, liquid-free penis receptacles (although I hear there’s a toy for that). Lots of healthy vaginas expel blood. And if you think that’s gross, well, maybe spend your naked extracurricular time with someone who is vagina-free (exception to the “you’re kind of a dick if you think periods are disgusting” rule: People who are universally freaked out by any kind of blood and just can’t handle the sight of it).

    Basically, dudes who have sex with women and think period sex is disgusting are the brothers-in-badnews-sexytime with people who think oral sex is gross. Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.

    There is a difference between someone saying “menstruation is gross” – which it isn’t; it’s a normal and healthy bodily function – and someone saying “I don’t like the idea of having penetrative sex with someone who is menstruating”. I entirely agree that the former is misogynistic. But the latter is not, any more than it’s misogynistic to dislike any other particular sexual practice or technique. For that matter, I think her throwaway dig at “people who think oral sex is gross” is equally judgmental and idiotic. It is extremely unfair to “think less” of someone, or to label hir a misogynist, for disliking a particular type of sex. People’s tastes in sexuality are deeply individual and personal, just as people’s tastes in food, music, and other things are deeply individual and personal. Disliking “period sex” does not make someone a misogynist. For that matter, disliking P-I-V penetrative sex altogether (as plenty of men and women do) does not make someone a misogynist.

    What Filipovic seems to be saying, effectively, is that bi and straight men who don’t fit into her personal view of what heterosexual sexual activity should be like, or who don’t like the sexual activities she likes, are misogynists and should not be having sex with women at all. That’s hurtful and judgmental. If she’d just said “I like period sex, and I don’t want to have relationships with men who aren’t into it”, there would have been no reason to argue with her. But that isn’t what she said.

  402. 402
    SallyStrange

    Nice job Illuminata!

    Tonight I almost forgot about my copyediting thing. So, after a beer and a half, I’m sitting here with my eyes glued to the computer screen.

    Good thing I remembered though. (The client usually gives me the work the day before; this week, it being New Year’s, he gave it 3 days in advance.)

  403. 403
    chigau (違う)

    PTI
    The sponge-tofu can be cut into shapes that are not possible for softer tofu. If you’re making a long-simmered dish, works better.
    I have no experience with freezing after cooking of tofu.
    I have my doubts.
    I bet Josh knows.

  404. 404
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Insomniac -

    No, cooking the tofu before freezing won’t change anything or make it not become spongy. One proviso. . .If you’ve incorporated it into a cooked dish with sauce–such as a curry, or a tomato sauce, etc.—it will freeze and thaw much better.

    But freezing tofu outside of a sauce, whether cooked or not, will result in sponge.

  405. 405
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Mind, deep-frying the tofu after it’s been frozen can be tasty. The drier, lighter texture takes nicely to a crispy coating.

  406. 406
    The Sailor

    Conga rats, Illuminata!

  407. 407
    Tethys

    Mmmmm…lemon pound cake sounds scrumptious.

  408. 408
    kristinc, now with added ventilation

    One thing (I think) frozen tofu is nice for is in tiny bits in soup. Yummy broth-sponges.

  409. 409
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Quite right, Kristin.

  410. 410
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Illuminata – pat yourself on the back. That’s a hell of an accomplishment! Congratulations.

  411. 411
    SallyStrange

    Lemon blueberry poundcake is my mom’s favorite birthday cake.

    It’s just lemon poundcake with blueberries thrown in right before baking. They sink to the bottom and form a layer of tasty juicy blueberry yumminess.

  412. 412
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Poundcake. Tofu. Shrimp. Gazpacho. I REALLY need to stop talking about food this late at night. OTOH, I kind of hope to dream about a tasty meal that includes poundcake for dessert tonight.

  413. 413
    Inaji

    Illuminata, congratulations! That’s a great accomplishment!

    Walton:

    Disliking “period sex” does not make someone a misogynist.

    I agree. I know quite a few women who don’t care for sex when they’re on their period. *shrug*

    Never had a problem with it myself, but it is a matter of preference for most people. If someone freaks over the idea or considers the person menstruating (at that time) to be disgusting, then yeah, there’s a problem.

  414. 414
    Walton

    Never had a problem with it myself, but it is a matter of preference for most people. If someone freaks over the idea or considers the person menstruating (at that time) to be disgusting, then yeah, there’s a problem.

    Yep, exactly. That’s the distinction I was getting at, and the one Filipovic seems to be missing. There should be no stigma attached to menstruation (or to any other bodily function); but that’s a very different proposition from asserting that men who don’t like to have sex at that time are ipso facto misogynists.

  415. 415
    chigau (違う)

    The deer tenderloins weren’t tender so the end product was basically stew.
    Delicious but rather plain.
    (and I forgot about the daikon)
    oh well
    To bed with the ebook and a choice of 85 books.

  416. 416
    Tethys

    Adding blueberries to the pound cake sounds like an excellent idea.

    I now crave lemon anything, but the cupboards contain only lemon tea. It’s good, but not very filling.

    Last squidmas I received a tub of Watkins brand Lemon Cream Shea Butter. It smells exactly like lemon shortbread cookies, and feels fabulous on the skin.

  417. 417
    Cyranothe2nd, there's no such thing as a moderate ally

    I has a HUGE sad at the unavailability of Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman on my tv.

    No kidding! I am on tenterhooks after the first season!

    First episode debuted today. Is already on some tenuously legal sites. I just downloaded but haven’t watched yet. NOT excited about Irene Adler, as it ruins my John/Sherlock shipping…

  418. 418
    Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle

    That’s the distinction I was getting at, and the one Filipovic seems to be missing.

    She’s not missing anything. She’s saying exactly what you’re saying. Exactly what Caine said.

    I’m genuinely not seeing what the difference is.

  419. 419
    SallyStrange

    I just discovered that I really like the Killers! Thanks Pandora! Actually, I’m still liking Pandora better than Spotify. Spotify seems to have a LOT of ads. I started a new Pandora station with Mumford & Sons, the Kinks, Wilco, and Fischerspooner. It’s nice.

    As to the new episodes of Sherlock, I imagine I’ll end up watching them illegally just as I did the previous ones. Would be happy to pay, but not willing to wait when it’s just out there, begging for me to watch it…

  420. 420
    Cipher

    I’m genuinely not seeing what the difference is.

    My reading is that it says that of course men are allowed to dislike PIV sex during menstruation, but she will call them misogynists for it. I’m not sure where the other reading would come from :( Is there a particular line or phrase or something you’re seeing that makes that interpretation not make sense?

  421. 421
    Cipher

    Oh, I see. I’m reading badly and my brain is not working. Sorry, Illuminata. I think I get it now.

  422. 422
    Walton

    She’s not missing anything. She’s saying exactly what you’re saying. Exactly what Caine said.

    I’m genuinely not seeing what the difference is.

    No, she’s not saying exactly what I’m saying. She said:

    Do you have a right to refuse to have period sex because you think bleeding vaginas be nasty? Of course. And do I have a right to leave your ass and think less of you because of that? You betcha. Because it does come down to misogyny, basically — most pre-menopausal people with uteruses and vaginas who are old enough to consent to sex bleed once a month…

    Basically, dudes who have sex with women and think period sex is disgusting are the brothers-in-badnews-sexytime with people who think oral sex is gross. Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.

    She does not acknowledge that there is a difference between saying “ewwww, menstruating women are gross” and saying “the idea of having penetrative sex with someone during menstruation is gross to me”. The former labels the person as gross, and is thus obviously misogynistic and stigmatizing. The latter simply expresses a personal distaste for the sexual practice. There’s a difference. (And no, her exception for people who are squicked by the sight of blood doesn’t cover it. It is perfectly possible to be entirely comfortable with the sight of blood, but uncomfortable with the idea of having sex during menstruation. There are plenty of men and women both who feel this way.)

    Similarly, there’s her throwaway comment about oral sex. She is basically saying that men who do not like the kinds of sex that she likes are misogynists, and that they should not be having sex with women at all. That is unfair, judgmental, and a misuse of the term. There are people (men and women both) who don’t like oral sex, or who don’t like particular kinds of oral sex. For that matter, there are people who don’t like penetrative sex of any kind. There are people who are passionate about various sexual fetishes, and people who find those same fetishes disgusting or offputting. In all cases, disliking a particular sexual practice doesn’t mean they are misogynists, or that they can’t have healthy, happy, fulfilling and loving sexual relationships. She seems to be projecting her own personal feelings about relationships onto the entire world.

  423. 423
    Amblebury

    Illuminata, congratulations, that’s a stunning achievement.

    Ironically, I just popped over here after discovering such a thing as deep-fried butter exists, on the New Year’s Resolution thread.

    Also, let it be known, I have a swooning crush on Benedict Cumberbatch.

  424. 424
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    The Sailor, Classical Cipher, and anyone else who wondered where I was:

    Just off doing holiday stuff. Christmas was great! Got some awesome toys. The kid loved the toy piano I got her.

    I’m still recovering from new years. Best new years ever. When I was a little kid, the grandparent’s house was THE family gathering place. The places where my uncles and aunts grew up. THE family home. My aunt and uncle were married in that house. The grandparents moved into an old folk’s place and died when I was 14.

    Now 13 years later and my cousin Brady is renting the place with his family, and it is the exact same place. So much of my grandparents is still there. On the doorway to the kitchen are still the names of my uncles and aunt where they marked their heights. An attempt was made to rub them out but they were still readable. The cabinets, the walls, the rooms, all still the same.

    What a night. I could think of no better place to ring in the Mayan Apocalypse. Time doubled back on itself and it was like they were there again for a while.

  425. 425
    birgerjohansson

    Rey Fox: “They should also stop playing on your lawn, right?”

    I am just weary of how crap films use special effects to distract from the lack of good scripts or good acting.
    I often notice enormous gaps in plot logic that could have been avoided by five minutes of intense thinking.
    Not bothering to get the details right is an insult to the paying audience.

    If I had a lawn, the $¤@*rds could play there if they just make an effort to make good films.

  426. 426
    opposablethumbs

    Yay for the run time, Illuminata – that’s impressive progress!

  427. 427
    'Tis Himself

    Hooray for you, Illuminata. You have good reason to be proud.

  428. 428
    'Tis Himself

    The Sailor

    I just found out tonight that a friend of a sailing friend of mine who I’ve hung out with is a non-fiction Pulitzer Prize winner. And his Dad won a Nobel.

    That’s nothing. You know me from this blog and I’m a sailor.

  429. 429
    The Sailor

    Good point ‘Tis!

  430. 430
    Serendipitydawg(rebel without paws)

    Re: the latest Sherlock

    As devious and convoluted as ever.

    Notable for Watson’s blog posts titled The Geek Interpreter and The Speckled Blonde, just to appeal to the total Holmes afficionado.

  431. 431
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Good morning Thread! Prepare yourselves for some “Audley’s not yet caffeinated” ramblings!

    Never got around to making cookies last night, so I think I’m going to make them this morning. Mmmm mmmm MMMMM! Peanut butter cookies!

    The last of the pound cake is staring at me as we speak. I am seriously considering finishing it off for breakfast, with a side of pink grapefruit. (I love citrus fruits.)

    My turtle has figured out our kitty feeding routine and now she begs for food when we feed the cats. It can’t be healthy to feed a turtle twice a day, can it?

    ‘Tis:

    That’s nothing. You know me from this blog and I’m a sailor.

    You have a Pulitzer &/or Nobel? O.o

  432. 432
    rorschach

    And also arguing at Camels With Hammers that, no, it’s not logically possible to be “an atheist who believes in God.” Yes, this is apparently contentious.

    Hm, I wrote a post about that the other day. A Pew forum survey from 2007 found that in the US, 21% of atheists (and >50% of agnostics) believe in god, IIRC. I put it down to lack in understanding of the terms.

    “I spend a lot of time looking at the Earth’s temperature for a very long time. I’m a lot harder to convince than just looking at a computer model.”

    Maybe he could explain why we have 32C/90F at fucking midnight here tonight…

  433. 433
    a_ray_in_dilbert_space

    Markita Lynda,
    There are a couple of problems with using a food processor to grind flour. It takes a long time to grind the grain finely enough for bread, and because the “grinding” is by impact,both the processor and the grain get quite hot, diminishing both nutrition and taste. We found what looks to be a good one. I will report back when we get the mill.

  434. 434
    Walton

    Caine, sorry, I missed this earlier:

    It’s good to hear you talk about eating. How is Algernon?

    We had a good holiday. I’m back in Boston now, since my classes start tomorrow, though I wish I could have stayed in TX a while longer.

    Unfortunately Algernon has recently become ill with bronchitis. :-( Though she’s taking antibiotics and recovering, thankfully.

  435. 435
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Illuminata:

    That is fandamntastic! The last time I ran a mile in 7 minutes was when I was in the Army. 20 years ago. And had two working knees. Anyway, good job!

    ——

    I am going to see Tintin this morning. Wife and I grew up reading Tintin and have most of the books. I will dump my useless opinion on the Thread this evening while watching football.

  436. 436
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Maybe he could explain why we have 32C/90F at fucking midnight here tonight…

    No, no, no! We are only allowed to refer to the weather and global warming in the same sentence when it is cold enough to freeze the tail off a brass monkey. And then, only with extreme sarcasm. Referring to AGW when sitting on the sofa will work up a really good sweat is letting the evil lib’rul commie nazi atheist muslims win! Didn’t you get the memo?

  437. 437
    rorschach

    Jebus, but that C with H post is some confused garblewarble clothed in important words. Is the guy a philosopher or something.

  438. 438
    The Sailor

    Hi TLC, glad the Hollow Days treated you well!
    +++++++++++++++

  439. 439
    birgerjohansson

    Are boobs portals to a parallel universe? http://freethoughtblogs.com/lousycanuck/files/2011/12/boobsdontworkthatway.gif
    (found at “Teaching girls that pretty isn’t pretty enough”)
    http://freethoughtblogs.com/lousycanuck/2011/12/31/teaching-girls-that-pretty-isnt-pretty-enough/

    I suppose she could be a mutant…or a Cyberdyne Systems T-X.

  440. 440
    Walton

    Jebus, but that C with H post is some confused garblewarble clothed in important words. Is the guy a philosopher or something.

    Oh, is this the Eric Steinhart post about the definition of atheism? I just looked at it.

    As I understand it, all he’s saying is that it is logically possible for a person X to believe in God and not believe in God at the same time, unless you add the additional premise that X believes that it is ethically wrong to deceive oneself. So, in other words, he’s simply observing that it is not logically impossible that X holds two mutually-contradictory ideas in hir head at the same time. Obviously he’s right about that – it’s not logically impossible to posit a person who believes two things which are incompatible with one another – but I don’t see how it’s interesting, useful or important to point out that people are capable of holding incoherent opinions. Nor does it have anything much to do with the definition of atheism; he could equally have used any other example. (X could equally believe simultaneously, say, that the sky is blue and that the sky is green, or that fairies exist and that fairies do not exist.) So I didn’t really get the point of the post. :-/

  441. 441
    Mr. Fire

    Dear Horde,

    I’m an absentee commenter just popping in to wish everyone a Happy New Year.

    Or rather, a Happy Last Eleven Months Before The Mayans Return In Gay Black Helicopters To Abort Us To Death At Infinite Dilution.

  442. 442
    Ingdigo Jump

    I am just weary of how crap films use special effects to distract from the lack of good scripts or good acting.

    Bah if they didn’t have that they’d go back to the old stand by distraction.

    Boobies

  443. 443
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Argh, fuck the Paul Deen thread. I’m going to bake some goddamned cookies.

  444. 444
    The Sailor

    Bah if they didn’t have that they’d go back to the old stand by distraction.

    Boobies

    Wait, can’t we have all 3?

  445. 445
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Birger:

    I am just weary of how crap films use special effects to distract from the lack of good scripts or good acting.

    Oh, I agree with that 100%… but I think you’ve got to lay it at the feet of the bad acting and scripts (and direction and casting and costuming and set design and… and… and…), rather than the SFX used to hide them. IMHO, you’re blaming the bandage for the wound. If the SFX are poorly crafted in and of themselves, that’s different, but if your complaint is just that they’re being employed to distract from bad moviemaking, I think the fix must be better moviemaking, rather than attacking SFX.

    And either way, the complaint is just as applicable to old-school SFX as it is to CGI.

    Not bothering to get the details right is an insult to the paying audience.

    Perhaps it’s important to make the distinction between live-action movies that use CGI effects, on the one hand, and all-CGI motion capture/animation films, on the other, but in the latter case, it seems to me that “not bothering to get the details right” is not the problem: By the very nature of the process, every detail has to be consciously crafted. The face in the back of the crowd is not just somebody hired off the street for $10, as it might be in a live-action film; it’s been deliberately designed by some member of the artistic team. In a film like Tintin (or any of the Toy Story movies, or any of the Shrek films, etc., etc.), every reflection, surface texture, wisp of hair, ray of light, and on and on, is an artistic choice.

    They may still not get the details right, of course, because not all artistic choices are good ones… but I doubt “not bothering” would be the reason.

    I’ve also been thinking about the “uncanny valley” issue Irene mentioned yesterday. This was a distinct problem for me (and, apparently, for everyone) with Polar Express a few years back, but I (unlike Irene) didn’t get even a tinge of it with Tintin; I’ve been wondering why.

    Part of it, I think, is that the rendering technology has gotten that much better, even in just a few years. But I think a bigger factor is that the Polar Express characters were supposed to be real, while the Tintin characters remain comic book figures, no matter how realistically they are rendered. In fact, one of the things I loved about the movie was the way the film makers attained a high level of realism — in terms of textures, materials, movements, etc. — without losing losing the essential comic-book nature of the characters, types of action, points of view.

    In Polar Express, the close proximity of realism and unreality was dissonant; in Tintin, it was delightful (IMHO, of course), a Feature, Not a Bug™!

  446. 446
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Dr Darkheart:

    I’m going to bake some goddamned cookies.

    With figs? ;^)

  447. 447
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Bill:
    Lotsa peanut butter.

    (The figs reference just whooshed! right over my head.)

  448. 448
    Bill Dauphin, avec fromage

    Didn’t Jesus damn fig trees? What better fruit with which to make damned cookies? ;^)

  449. 449
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Bill:
    :D

  450. 450
    StarStuff, a soulless cunt

    Woo! I just found out that I got into the Animal Development class and lab! Awww yeah.

  451. 451
    carlie

    Damn, that Paula Deen thread has me so mad I’m shaking. You’d think I’d be more used to this discussion by now, as many times as it’s happened. Argh. I’m going to go clean the kitchen or something.

  452. 452
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    Good evening!
    I’m really only skimming through, didn’t have much time during the last days.

    But I promised the recipe for the figue tart:

    For a 12″ pie:
    300g flour
    150g butter
    pinch of salt
    2 tbsp vanilla sugar
    1-2 eggs
    Make a dough, roll out, put into your pie form, blind-bake for 15-20 min at 190°C

    mix:
    200ml milk
    70 g sugar
    1 vanilla pod
    2 heaped tbsp starch

    bring 400ml cream to boil, add milk-mixture, bring back to boil. Remove from heat and let cool, stirring frequently

    pour into the pie
    wash 10 fresh figs, cut into slices and place on top

    bake for further 30-40 min
    I served it warm with a bit of honey on top.

  453. 453
    Nick Gotts

    Notable for Watson’s blog posts titled The Geek Interpreter and The Speckled Blonde, just to appeal to the total Holmes afficionado. – Serendipitydawg

    There was also a reference (from Lestrade I think) to a blog post about “the aluminium crutch”. “The singular affair of the aluminium crutch” is one of the Holmes stories Conan Doyle never wrote: Holmes refers to it in “The Musgrave Ritual”, as one of his cases “done prematurely before my biographer had come to glorify me”.

  454. 454
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Carlie, if you ever buy another DVD player, you can find some on the internet which play all region codes.

    +++++

    Wait, when did the idea of region-specific DVDs come about

    I thought they always were?

    +++++
    Set: 2 Mins, 31 Secs

    +++++
    There is no particular sexist meme against mutual masturbation, that I know of.

    There is a sexist meme about sex during menstruation being gross.

    Therefore, if someone doesn’t want to practice mutual masturbation, there is no reason to suspect that this is partially due to learning sexist ideas.

    But if someone doesn’t want to have sex during menstruation there is reason to suspect this is partially due to learning sexist ideas.

    Can we say that 100% of people who have no aversion to blood per se, no aversion to vaginal sex per se, but an aversion to sex during menstruation, have this aversion in part due to having sexist ideas? No.

    But it’s a pretty good guess. And if a woman doesn’t want to be with a partner because she suspects their aversion to sex during menstruation is indicative of sexism, that’s justifiable.

    And if she wants to remind other women that aversion to sex during menstruation is a reasonable basis for suspecting sexism, that’s justifiable.

  455. 455
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Wikipedia claims (uncited)

    Region coding has several purposes, but the primary one is price discrimination, i.e., allowing the manufacturer to charge different prices in different regions: there is great disparity among the regions of the world in how much a person is willing to pay for a DVD. Price discrimination is especially relevant to DVDs as their marginal cost is relatively small, allowing the distributor a great deal of flexibility in pricing.

    Another purpose is controlling release dates. A practice of movie marketing threatened by the advent of home video is to release a movie to theaters, and for general sale, later in some countries than in others. Videotapes were inherently regional since formats had to match those of the encoding system used by television stations in that particular region, such as NTSC and PAL, although from early 1990s PAL machines increasingly offered NTSC playback. DVDs are less restricted in this sense, and region coding allows movie studios to better control the global release dates of DVDs.

    Thirdly, the copyright in some titles has different owners in different territories. Region coding allows copyright holders to prevent a DVD from being purchased from a region from which they do not derive royalties.

  456. 456
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Wife and I just got back from Tintin and dinner (enchiladas at a really good (and reasonably traditional) Mexican restaurant). Wife and I are both Tintin fans from when we were young. And we loved the movie. No, it did not stick exactly to the books. Yes, the action sequences were almost too busy. However, the characters rang true. The dialogue was a mix of Herge’s and new, but the new dialogue sounded ‘right’. Thompson & Thomson were perfect. Captain Haddock was perfect. Tintin seemed less absent-minded than in the books and not quite as phlegmatic. The music complemented the action without distracting (and the opera was beautifully sung). The CGI animation was excellent, though I feel that I need to watch it two or three more times (this one is on the ‘get the DVD’ list) to catch all the references to other Tintin books. I see very few movies (two or three a year), so this may be damning with faint praise, but it was one of the best movies I’ve seen in the last few years. I would give it an 8 out of 10. And no, I have not been compensated for this rather glowing review.

  457. 457
    Giliell, professional cynic -Ilk-

    There is no particular sexist meme against mutual masturbation, that I know of.

    You mean apart from the big fat meme that all women need is a big fat dick in their vagina so it doesn’t matter if he isn’t able to find a clitoris with a map?
    The big fat meme that sex is more important for men than for women so that her pleasure and orgasm aren’t important?
    The big fat meme that sex is something that women give to men?
    There are a lot of sexist memes against women being sexual subjects and equally deserving of fun and pleasure in bed as men.

    And if a woman doesn’t want to be with a partner because she suspects their aversion to sex during menstruation is indicative of sexism, that’s justifiable.

    I’d say it’s a self-righteous excuse.
    If she’s so much into period sex that it’s a deal-breaker, so be it.
    But just because she suspects some ominous things based on this one detail, I don’t call that justifiable.
    If all you have is the fact “don’t like period sex”, it’s a far leap.

  458. 458
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    Heylo dearies!

    Mr Darkheart decided against getting a chameleon. We were lulled into thinking that reptile care is easier than it is ‘cos of the damned turtle. (According to the reptile guides we were looking at, aquatic turtles are supposed to be totes difficult, which hasn’t been my experience at all. We just feed Emery, let her out when she bangs around her tank, and clean everything when it starts to smell like a swamp. Easy peasy.)

    Anyway, he decided that he wanted rodents instead*, so we bought two gerbils today– a black one (with a little white goatee!) named Sydney and a gold one named Charles.

    That cats are cycling between acting offended that there’s more pets in the house and thinking that the gerbils will be fun to play with. We have the cage secured down where they can’t reach, so I think the kittehs will get bored with the gerbils soon enough.

    *We’re rodent people. Between the two of us we’ve had 4 rats and 3 hamsters.

  459. 459
    strange gods before me ॐ

    There is no particular sexist meme against mutual masturbation, that I know of.

    You mean apart from the big fat meme that all women need is a big fat dick in their vagina so it doesn’t matter if he isn’t able to find a clitoris with a map?

    Yes, I do mean apart from that meme and the others you list, which is why I said “there is no particular sexist meme against mutual masturbation”.

    There are more general memes which function against the likelihood of mutual masturbation occurring, but I’m not aware of one which explicitly says “mutual masturbation is for sissies” or something like that; mutual masturbation is so far off that radar that it’s not even imagined as something to be singled out.

    And if a woman doesn’t want to be with a partner because she suspects their aversion to sex during menstruation is indicative of sexism, that’s justifiable.

    I’d say it’s a self-righteous excuse.

    It could indeed be that in some cases. People sometimes use rational arguments in self-righteous ways.

    If she’s so much into period sex that it’s a deal-breaker, so be it.

    More than that, she might not be into period sex at all — perhaps it doesn’t feel good, perhaps she has also internalized sexism — but still be justified in suspecting that the other person’s aversion is due to sexism.

    But just because she suspects some ominous things based on this one detail, I don’t call that justifiable.

    It is justifiable because the sexist memes against sex during mensturation, specifically, are quite widespread. Therefore, it is likely that any particular person’s aversion is due to these sexist memes. There will be some false positives, but there are always false positives with any heuristic; heuristics are nevertheless still justifiable.

  460. 460
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Pharyngula the Opera, intermezzo

    A lot is going on at the Pharyngula Saloon and Spanking Parlor™, Patricia, Princess of Pullets, Proprietor. The screens show the countdown to/from the new year in various spots of the world. A couple of screens show a diagram for something enigmatic.

    The Pullet Patrol™ is conspicuous by their absence. A dozen or so people of various colors and genders are calmly, but madly making final preparations, like NASA for a shuttle launch, checking their computers against the plans. The big trebuchet out back appears to have sprouted little catapults, cocked and waiting. A few people are working around the catapults, but begin leaving the area as after receiving final checks from the saloon. A sign says fireworks (burning exploding of used grog barrels) at midnight, but doesn’t say which midnight, but on clock says F-15, which would be appropriate for midnight PZ time. Rossini is playing in the background. A group of knitters are over on one side, needles flashing, and rest of the uninvolved patrons are scattered throughout the saloon. The preparation appear complete when all those around the catapults start returning, and the scene is reminiscent of the T-9 minute hold for the shuttle.

    Drinks are distributed, and the traffic count increases enormously, as those from outlying locations check in. Webcams are on the trebuchet and catapults, but also on the middle of the saloon and the entrance to the Pullet Palace™, along with an overhead cam. At F-9, a cue is given and a woman of indetermanent age steps to the center of the saloon, and announces, “In honor of the New Year, the Pullet Bowl Parade”.

    From the tunnel to the Pullet Palace a contingent of the Lilac Berets emerges, carrying the Pharyngula banner, Cuttlefish and Cross Bones on Black, along with the lesser national flags (lower of course) of those who post at Pharyngula. Everybody stands and give the Pharyngula salute, a middle finger extended from a clenched fist. This is followed by a caisson containing a KFC box and an honor guard with the Pullet Patrol flag (shows chicken chasing a fox) at half mast. The one-finger salute become hands over the hearts (with some drooling), with a chorus of remembrance for the previous patrol.

    Then a float appears that encourages vegans to eat eggs, and carnivore/omnivore not to eat chick at the same time. Everybody gets a good laugh, and the clock ticks down to F-5, as the Pullets disperse into the crowd.

    Suddenly, man looking like Christopher Lloyd after a 10 day bender appears and starts singing complaints about those on public assistance. Those present respond in vigorous choruses refuting the ravings. Meanwhile the fat bald-headed man organizes those helping the fireworks, but also talks to the Lilac Berets and the Kninja Knitters (dodging pokes by a Redheaded knitter).

    At F-2, the fat man nods to the Kninja Knitters, the Lilac Berets, and the crew. All nod back, and the deranged man continues his peroration sounding like a liberturd and not noticing what is going on. The Lilac Berets move out an old-fashioned cartoon explosion initiator about three feet from the interloper unseen by the interloper. The Kninja Knitters look innocent. The crew looks intent.

    At F-10 seconds, the Kninja Knitter make the interloper a porcupine with well place needles. Amazement appears upon its face, as it realizes it is no longer a man. It turns towards the knitters. At F-5 seconds, the Lilac Berets fire their cyber pistols, with direct hits on the interloper. He clutches himself, and slowly falls forward onto the initiating device at exactly F-1 seconds.

    The catapults and trebuchet are released in a split second manner upwards. At F-0, a lights appear and appear to spell “HAPPY”, followed by a few seconds later by a big boom as the used grog barrels explode with colorful lights. Then “New” is seen, followed a few seconds later by a big boom as more grog barrels meet their colorful fate. Then “Year” is seen, followed by a colorfl big boom a few seconds later the last of the barrels are destroyed. Much cheering occurs, both in the Saloon and by those viewing.

    The deranged but now dead visitor is load onto a cart, transported to the trebuchet, and the body flung somewhere into the Bearing Sea to feed the crabs. Handfuls of grog soaked corn are thrown by those present at the Pullets (including the Lilac Berets), who down said corn and disappear to the Pullet Palace™. More drinks are served, and the curtain falls to protect the innocent.

  461. 461
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    Oh, and those of you who need real fireworks: here. Enjoy.

  462. 462
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    Is anyone brave enough to stage Nerd’s ongoing opera?

  463. 463
    Alexandra (née Audley)

    janine:
    If I can get funding for it, sure.

    Broadway opening in 2013! We’ll be a smashing success!

  464. 464
    Goodbye Enemy Janine

    I found this to be funny in a very sick way. Pedobear was at the Houston-Penn State game. Pedobear was shown on the JumboTron with a sign that said: Keep Quiet And Don’t Tell Anyone.

    Wow!

  465. 465
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Is anyone brave enough to stage Nerd’s ongoing opera?

    Depends.

  466. 466
    Nerd of Redhead, Dances OM Trolls

    I give full permission for rewrites of the opera, along with full compensation for the rewriter. (hic)

  467. 467
    Walton

    But if someone doesn’t want to have sex during menstruation there is reason to suspect this is partially due to learning sexist ideas.

    Can we say that 100% of people who have no aversion to blood per se, no aversion to vaginal sex per se, but an aversion to sex during menstruation, have this aversion in part due to having sexist ideas? No.

    But it’s a pretty good guess. And if a woman doesn’t want to be with a partner because she suspects their aversion to sex during menstruation is indicative of sexism, that’s justifiable.

    And if she wants to remind other women that aversion to sex during menstruation is a reasonable basis for suspecting sexism, that’s justifiable.

    No, it’s not justifiable. Nor is it “a pretty good guess”.

    People can have strong aversions to completely arbitrary things, for a whole host of reasons. This applies to sexual techniques just as to foods, drinks, smells, sounds, textures, etc. (As a sufferer from severe OCD, I have more and stronger aversions than most people – mostly in relation to food, but I have some hangups of a sexual nature too – which is one of the reasons I take this whole issue personally.) Such aversions do not necessarily have anything whatsoever to do with sexism, either conscious or internalized. Nor do they indicate that one has any less respect for one’s partner, male or female, as a human being.

    It is wrong, stupid and hurtful for Filipovic to suggest that having a particular aversion or dislike of a particular sexual technique is indicative of being a misogynist, and for her to tell men that they should not be having sex with women at all if they don’t like said sexual technique. The fact that there is a sexist cultural meme about that particular technique (something I don’t deny) is not relevant. Yes, some people may dislike it because of internalized sexism; but others may dislike it for entirely different reasons, and to make the “guess” that men who dislike period sex are likely to be misogynists is simply offensive. (What about men who dislike vaginal penetrative sex altogether – as some do – but are still attracted to women?)

    Filipovic is perfectly entitled to date or not date whoever she wants, for whatever reason she sees fit; it’s her body, and none of my or anyone else’s concern. But she is not justified in accusing men who dislike period sex of being misogynists, or of encouraging other women to break off relationships with men who dislike period sex. It’s deeply offensive and judgmental to say that disliking a particular sexual technique means that someone should be automatically regarded as a sexist.

  468. 468
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    Grrr! Let the laudatory voices beware: I’m still pissed off by that bloody awful Tintin movie, its creepy CGI and its absurd patchwork of a scenario! Yes, that’s subjective, and no, I don’t give a damn!

    Because “It’s not a bug, it’s a Feature TM” didn’t even work for Microsoft.

    Because I’ll never forgive Spielberg et al. for pushing in it a new back-story. Especially the whole hackneyed “Character A and Character B are enemies because their ancestors were enemies, yada yada”.

    Because what’s the point of merging three different stories in one while leaving away the bulk of the first adventure? The whole part about the underground treasure hunt, the friendly mad scientist and the shark-like submarine? Why’s Professor Calculus *absent* from a story where his role was prominent in the original book?

    Makes no sense, except as a display of the film-makers’ bloody egos! Why, of course they are going to change stuff, either they wouldn’t be creators! Blech!

    /end rant

    Ergh. All right, it feels better, now.

  469. 469
    The Sailor

    I’m, I’m, speechless. And writeless.

  470. 470
    The Sailor

    Of course my comment at 469 was for Nerd.

    Oggie, I see what you did there. But I won’t tell anyone else.

  471. 471
    Ogvorbis: Still failing at being human.

    Irene:

    Thank you. I would never have guessed that you didn’t like the movie from your previous comments at 252, 281 and 304. Oddly, the only reference to the movie appears to have been mine in which I said that I, and my wife, enjoyed the movie. Did my contrary review really mean that you had to rant, again, how much you hated the movie? Excuse the fuck out of me that I am shallow, ignorant, and pathetic enough to both enjoy the original books and the movie.

  472. 472
    strange gods before me ॐ

    People can have strong aversions to completely arbitrary things, for a whole host of reasons.

    They can — this is what the comparison to mutual masturbation is intended to address — but certain reasons become relatively more likely in certain social environments.

    Most actually-existing aversions to mutual masturbation would be arbitrary. Actually-existing aversions to sex during menstruation are less likely to be arbitrary, because of the existence of specific and widespread sexist memes against it.

    I have some hangups of a sexual nature too – which is one of the reasons I take this whole issue personally.

    I don’t doubt it, but it’s unlikely that you have no hangups about blood per se, and no hangups about vaginal sex per se, yet a hangup about sex during menstruation, unless this is partially due to learned sexism.

    Such aversions do not necessarily have anything whatsoever to do with sexism, either conscious or internalized.

    Which is why I said we can’t be sure of it in 100% of cases. It’s only a pretty good guess.

    It is wrong, stupid and hurtful for Filipovic to suggest that having a particular aversion or dislike of a particular sexual technique is indicative of being a misogynist,

    It could be hurtful (I doubt it), but it’s not wrong or stupid. It’s a reasonable attempt at self-defense by identifying one red flag.

    and for her to tell men that they should not be having sex with women at all if they don’t like said sexual technique.

    What are the likely consequences of this? Most men who have this aversion as an instance of sexism will ignore her. Most men who have this aversion as an instance of something other than sexism will ignore her. Some men who have this aversion as an instance of sexism will try to work on themselves and get over their aversion. How about the men who have this aversion as an instance of something other than sexism and who take her seriously? I think it’s reasonable to expect that they will convince themselves that their aversion is not due to sexism, and proceed to excuse themselves from following her prescription; most people are excellent at rationalizing what they want. If, due to Jill’s prescription, only a rare few men who have this aversion due to something other than sexism become paralyzed with fear that they’re actually acting due to sexism, and more women manage to get themselves out of relationships that involve more sexism than they want to handle, it’s a net good.

    Yes, some people may dislike it because of internalized sexism; but others may dislike it for entirely different reasons, and to make the “guess” that men who dislike period sex are likely to be misogynists is simply offensive.

    I really don’t care if it’s offensive; I care whether it’s likely; and I don’t think we should be insisting that women — as they are currently the less privileged group regarding sex — ought to concern themselves much about being offensive.

    (What about men who dislike vaginal penetrative sex altogether – as some do – but are still attracted to women?)

    In my first comment, I made consideration for them, since I was clearly talking about “people who have no aversion to blood per se, no aversion to vaginal sex per se, but an aversion to sex during menstruation”.

    So, what about them? I’m explicitly not talking about them. If Jill overlooked them out then that’s a fair criticism of her argument.

    But she is not justified in accusing men who dislike period sex of being misogynists, or of encouraging other women to break off relationships with men who dislike period sex.

    Rationally speaking, it is justified. And I’m not willing to insist that women should worry about being offensive when they notice red flags.

  473. 473
    strange gods before me ॐ

    If Jill overlooked them then that’s a fair criticism of her argument

    And it appears she did not: “Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.”

  474. 474
    Ingdigo Jump

    People can have strong aversions to completely arbitrary things, for a whole host of reasons. This applies to sexual techniques just as to foods, drinks, smells, sounds, textures, etc.

    For example I’m in the bugs and critters field and though I like spiders am arachnophobia.

  475. 475
    Ingdigo Jump

    Damn, that Paula Deen thread has me so mad I’m shaking. You’d think I’d be more used to this discussion by now, as many times as it’s happened. Argh. I’m going to go clean the kitchen or something.

    I probably was a far bigger anus than I should have been to Mike there, but a) damn if he wasn’t an asshole and b) cranky due to being cut off from coffee by doctor.

  476. 476
    The Sailor

    Seriously folks, it’s hard to have fun in the lounge when SGBM keeps just trolling along. FFS, I try to keep up on Da Tread, but how many teal deers can one person take?

    One of the reasons former regulars don’t come by is every time they stick there head in here it’s yet another goddam fight that SGBM has picked.

  477. 477
    Ingdigo Jump

    @Sailor

    Killfile? It’s possible to just blot out all of SG from this thread.

  478. 478
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Killfile indeed.

    This is a conversation that five other people were having before I chimed in.

  479. 479
    andyo

    Hey guys

    Just saw some more Maher making fun of that Something Tebow person.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/gossip/bill-maher-posts-tebow-photos-twitter-vacation-hawaii-article-1.1000003

    Now, what makes this admirable to me is not so much the ridiculing, but the fact that a 56-year-old guy is climbing up a tree just to get in a so-so joke. That’s dedication.

  480. 480
    Walton

    I don’t doubt it, but it’s unlikely that you have no hangups about blood per se, and no hangups about vaginal sex per se, yet a hangup about sex during menstruation, unless this is partially due to learned sexism.

    I don’t know that this is true. Of course it’s near-impossible to measure empirically, but it’s perfectly conceivable that someone could find the idea of period sex, specifically, squicky (while liking vaginal sex in general) without this being ascribable primarily to internalized sexism. And even if it is due to internalized sexism (as many things are, in our patriarchal culture), it does not follow that the person in question is generally sexist or misogynistic in other areas of life.

    Like I said, OCD-caused hangups can be extremely arbitrary. Most of mine relate to food rather than sex, but I have lots of examples: particular combinations of foods that I can eat separately but not on their own, foods that I can’t eat because of the way they look even though I like the taste, food containers that squick me out even though I have no problem with the food itself (yoghurt pots and sliced cheese containers, for instance). I know this is anecdote, but it makes me think that it’s perfectly possible that someone could have an OCD-based aversion to periods without there being anything particularly sexist about it.

    And it appears she did not: “Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.”

    That’s exactly the problem. Look at what she said later at comment #134:

    Look. I meant exactly what I said: If you’re grossed out by periods, you should not have sex with people who have vaginas.

    (Leaving aside her ignoring of transwomen for now, which was extensively discussed in the comment thread there. It’s just another layer of toxicity in the article.)

    What she is saying, effectively, is that if you are a straight or bi man who does not want to have vaginal penetrative sex with a woman who is menstruating – or, by extension, if you are a straight or bi man who doesn’t like vaginal sex at all – you are, at best, unworthy of having a sexual relationship with a woman, and at worst a misogynist. She makes a similarly nasty and dismissive comment about men who “think oral sex is gross”. The implication is that there is something wrong with people who don’t like the kinds of sex that she likes.

    I really don’t care if it’s offensive; I care whether it’s likely; and I don’t think we should be insisting that women — as they are currently the less privileged group regarding sex — ought to concern themselves much about being offensive.

    Ok, I understated the case when I said it was merely offensive. It is actually, I think, socially harmful. She is misapplying the label “misogynist”; and she is stigmatizing a subset of people who have non-typical sexualities, and telling them that if they are unwilling to have types of sex that they find unpleasant and uncomfortable, they are unworthy of having sexual relationships with people of their preferred gender. It’s actually extremely detrimental to the goal of an enthusiastic-consent-based model, too; to suggest that one can be a misogynist for not wanting to have sex at a particular time runs against the whole goal of ensuring that sex is about the enthusiastic participation of both parties for mutual benefit. It’s toxic, and she is in danger of harming people’s relationships and emotional health – men and women both – by promoting this kind of exclusionary attitude.

  481. 481
    Walton

    (Leaving aside her ignoring of transwomen for now, which was extensively discussed in the comment thread there. It’s just another layer of toxicity in the article.)

    To clarify: Filipovic was also rightly criticized by a number of people for saying that menstruation is a feature of “normally functioning vaginas”, and for completely ignoring the existence of transwomen. That’s another thing that was toxic about the post; it’s separate from my criticism.

  482. 482
    Walton

    One of the reasons former regulars don’t come by is every time they stick there head in here it’s yet another goddam fight that SGBM has picked.

    Let’s be fair: I take responsibility for starting this argument, by bringing up the Filipovic article in the first place. I did so because I think it’s a very bad article that expresses some toxic and socially-harmful ideas. I don’t blame SGBM for expressing disagreement (although I do think he’s wrong, and have explained why at length).

  483. 483
    strange gods before me ॐ

    it’s perfectly conceivable that someone could find the idea of period sex, specifically, squicky (while liking vaginal sex in general) without this being ascribable primarily to internalized sexism.

    Nicely done. But I already granted this much: “Can we say that 100% of people who have no aversion to blood per se, no aversion to vaginal sex per se, but an aversion to sex during menstruation, have this aversion in part due to having sexist ideas? No.”

    Taking the whole set of people who have this aversion, and selecting at random any one person who has this aversion, it is unlikely that this person has an actually-arbitrary aversion which is not primarily attributable to sexism, and still less likely that the few with an actually-arbitrary aversion have not absorbed any sexist memes which further self-justify their aversion.

    And even if it is due to internalized sexism (as many things are, in our patriarchal culture), it does not follow that the person in question is generally sexist or misogynistic in other areas of life.

    Agreed. What follows is that if they grew up in this culture, whether they do or do not have this particular aversion, they are almost certainly sexist in other areas of life. Doesn’t mean this instance isn’t worth talking about.

    Like I said, OCD-caused hangups can be extremely arbitrary.

    Yes, and any particular person’s aversion to sex during menstruation, not accompanied by other aversions to blood or vaginal sex, is most likely not arbitrary in our culture.

    I know this is anecdote, but it makes me think that it’s perfectly possible that someone could have an OCD-based aversion to periods without there being anything particularly sexist about it.

    It is possible. But most aversions won’t be that.

    (I think it’s also reasonable to expect that a woman evaluating her partners will tend to consider OCD if she’s noticed it manifest in other ways, which she’s likely to notice if her partner doesn’t successfully hide every other symptom of OCD except this one.

    But, considering what you’ve said, when I advise a friend to consider sexism as

    Leaving aside her ignoring of transwomen for now

    I suppose we should leave aside your ignoring of trans folks up until this point as well; you’ve been talking about “bi and straight men” in #401, so your comments have been just as toxic.

    What she is saying, effectively, is that if you are a straight or bi man who does not want to have vaginal penetrative sex with a woman who is menstruating

    Yeah.

    – or, by extension, if you are a straight or bi man who doesn’t like vaginal sex at all –

    No, absolutely not by extension. You’ve got this latter clause way wrong, and you need to notice that you’re making this extension, unfairly. She says “Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.”

    She does not prescribe any change for people who do not like vaginal sex at all.

    you are, at best, unworthy of having a sexual relationship with a woman, and at worst a misogynist. She makes a similarly nasty and dismissive comment about men who “think oral sex is gross”. The implication is that there is something wrong with people who don’t like the kinds of sex that she likes.

    And there probably is, and that something is sexism.

    My heuristic, based on how often I recall encountering the various sexist memes, is that it’s even more likely that someone who’s sexually attracted to women, but has an aversion to cunnilingus, has this aversion due to some sexism.

    She is misapplying the label “misogynist”;

    In most cases, she is applying it accurately. Again, I agree there will be some false positives.

    and she is stigmatizing a subset of people who have non-typical sexualities, and telling them that if they are unwilling to have types of sex that they find unpleasant and uncomfortable, they are unworthy of having sexual relationships with people of their preferred gender.

    Not all the non-typical sexualities you claim, though. I do not believe she’s stigmatizing those who do not want to have vaginal sex at all. She leaves them out when she says “Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.”

    She may be stigmatizing the few who have an actually-arbitrary, wholly non-sexist aversion to sex during menstruation. But again, I think this advice is more likely to get more women out of relationships containing more sexism than they’re willing to tolerate. I see it as a probable net good. There is no way for everyone to win in this case. If nobody points out that aversion to sex during menstruation often is due to sexism, then that’s bad too; it doesn’t get addressed, and some more women who notice when this is a red flag for sexism end up talking themselves out of taking notice of this, since no one else is validating their experience.

    It’s actually extremely detrimental to the goal of an enthusiastic-consent-based model, too; to suggest that one can be a misogynist for not wanting to have sex at a particular time runs against the whole goal of ensuring that sex is about the enthusiastic participation of both parties for mutual benefit.

    Well, I suppose she hoped that you would also click on the link about oral sex, where she addresses this:

    «I’m mostly in the Jaclyn Friedman camp of sexual ethics: Everyone is fully entitled to boundaries, and sex acts should be consented to enthusiastically, not agreed to grudgingly. But I’m also a Dan Savage sympathizer, insofar as he argues we’re also entitled to sexual pleasure and when in relationships we should try to sexually please our partner — we should (safely) try new things, and be giving and generous in bed (and expect the same in return).

    So of course you should never coerce or pressure anyone into a sexual act he or she isn’t comfortable with. But at the same time, I think it’s important to interrogate the aversion to certain sexual acts — especially those that come with misogynist or homophobic baggage. There are important cultural and historical reasons why “I won’t go down on women” is slightly different from “I won’t let a dude come on my face.”»

    Perhaps an expectation of click-through is too much to ask. I’d agree it would have been better if she’d quoted her older post at the end of the newer one, rather than just linking to it.

  484. 484
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    To wash away the bad taste left by the Cee-Lo debacle in our ears: Weird Al Yankovic, Alice Cooper and Steven Tyler sing The Beatles’ “Come Together”.

    Posted by Kylie a.k.a. the Token Skeptic. 8)

  485. 485
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    Haven’t we done the period sex thing a few times by now?

    I happen to like period sex (along with many things), and for me I’ve noticed when I mention that to other guys, the reactions are either “Eh, whatever floats your boat,” or “EW, YOU SICK FUCK!”

    I wonder if that has anything to do with the distinction being discussed here? One thinks its weird and yicky but totally acceptable for people who happen to enjoy it, the other thinks I’m some kind of weird sick fucker for being willing to have period sex.

    I also get to thinking about beards. Seems some women love them, others hate them. Facial hair is a natural and healthy ongoing process in a functioning male face.

    Also, some people are just disgusted by blood in general.

    Now, without analyzing the post too hard, what I took from it was that it was kind of implied that she was referring to as ‘Misogyny’ was the aforementioned ‘judgemental’ reaction. I figured it was one of those ‘if you’ve seen it I know what I’m talking about things.”

    I also read it as extremely hyperbolic, perhaps because I have that tendency myself.

    All I’m really doing is thinking out loud and transcribing it to text here. Me personally, I hate the stigma against period sex too. It’s pathetic and ridiculous. When I press people for reasons WHY period sex is so bad, they always mumble some crap about diseases. Diseases. Christ, I mean safe sex is important and all that, but do I even need to explain why that’s so stupid?

  486. 486
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Unfinished sentence should be:

    But, considering what you’ve said, when I advise a friend to consider sexism as an influence on aversion to period sex, I’ll advise her to think about OCD as well.

  487. 487
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    @ andyo:

    Oooh, thanks for the link. And, folks, it’s a poll! Pharyingulate? ;)

  488. 488
    cm's changeable moniker (quaint, if not charming)

    I’m going to beg your indulgence and just post this.

    GRRRRR!

    Thanks.

    (Context to follow when the hulk smash has died down.)

  489. 489
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    Today’s consequence of having my consciousness raised about endemic, background transphobia: outrage and high blood pressure. From a story in a recent issue of Newsweek. About the heir to the Fiat car company throne. In an article titled “Italian Stallion,” illustrated with photos of the handsome prince looking rakish and ravishing. Referring to an incident in which he overdosed on drugs and was rescued by a prostitute who called 911:

    The incident involved a slew of unseemly characters—including a 54-year-old transvestite prostitute who ultimately saved Elkann’s life by calling an ambulance. Elkann left Italy and cleaned himself up.

    I cannot express how enraged this makes me.

  490. 490
    Ingdigo Jump

    Taking the whole set of people who have this aversion, and selecting at random any one person who has this aversion, it is unlikely that this person has an actually-arbitrary aversion which is not primarily attributable to sexism, and still less likely that the few with an actually-arbitrary aversion have not absorbed any sexist memes which further self-justify their aversion.

    Based on what exactly? How you think things should work?

  491. 491
    The Laughing Coyote (Canis Sativa)

    I’m catching up on the New Years Resolution thread, which is sadly no longer about Paula Deen.

    Because YOU say so.

    You sir are a fucking monster. You care more about how the most poor and destitute or struggling arne’t playing by YOUR conception of the rules and not conforming to YOUR conceptions of what THEY deserve than about the fact that they are poor or struggling.

    You live in a country and a state where we are so collectively well off the poor have a chance to get lobsters! And rather than see that as a source of pride, you grouse and complain about it. Why oh WHY can’t they be MORE poor!? Like India! They don’t have that problem there!? Why can’t we be more like the 3rd world where the poor are grateful for any scrap and make ACTUAL sacrifices! That’s what real manly poverty is! I want to see them sacrifice children’s birthday parties, give away beloved pets, buy fruit as Christmas presents and work all day and then go to sleep with absolutely no luxury or non necessity! You fucking dream of a WORSE America you piece of shit.

    Hearing it put like this made me happy, Ing.

  492. 492
    andyo

    Irene

    Oooh, thanks for the link. And, folks, it’s a poll! Pharyingulate? ;)

    No prob… I didn’t even notice the poll. I just finished watching that video with the two lucky guys singing with Weird Al, so thanks too!

  493. 493
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Based on what exactly?

    Based on the fact that it’s not an arbitrary aversion at all; it’s culturally an extremely successful meme, and has been for at least as long as there have been recorded prescriptions against contact with menstruating women, which we know must have existed already when the Torah and Vedas were written.

    (Neither is your arachnophobia arbitrary, although it’s likely to be somewhat more attributable to an inherited overactive system that is adaptive at lower activity.)

  494. 494
    Josh, Official SpokesGay

    I’m also fed up beyond nausea with Jason Thibeault, which is too bad as he’s usually quite good.

  495. 495
    strange gods before me ॐ

    Walton’s thing about sliced cheese wrappers, for instance, appears to be arbitrary, since there appears to be no other explanation.

  496. 496
    Irène Delse, on dry land among seabirds

    The Laughing Coyote:

    Haven’t we done the period sex thing a few times by now?

    In the same vein(*), we could explore the weird and wonderful world of vampire erotica. Blood and sex at the same time? Heaven for the fanged crew!

    (*) Pun non intended. At least initially ;)

  497. 497
    strange gods before me ॐ

    In the same vein(*), we could explore the weird and wonderful world of vampire erotica. Blood and sex at the same time? Heaven for the fanged crew!

    Heh. Werewolves too: http://www.songmeanings.net/songs/view/65833/

  498. 498
    Walton

    No, absolutely not by extension. You’ve got this latter clause way wrong, and you need to notice that you’re making this extension, unfairly. She says “Don’t like normally-functioning vaginas? Then you should be disallowed from fucking them.”

    She does not prescribe any change for people who do not like vaginal sex at all.

    I disagree. Your reading is compatible with what she says in the original post, but look at what she said in comment 134 of the comment thread, which I quoted above:

    Look. I meant exactly what I said: If you’re grossed out by periods, you should not have sex with people who have vaginas.

    [my emphasis] She seems to be going further on this subject than you are.

    My heuristic, based on how often I recall encountering the various sexist memes, is that it’s even more likely that someone who’s sexually attracted to women, but has an aversion to cunnilingus, has this aversion due to some sexism.

    Eh, what? I wasn’t even aware that there was a sexist cultural meme that promoted an aversion to cunnilingus. I literally cannot remember ever having read, heard or seen anyone expressing a negative view of cunnilingus or portraying it as unmanly. (Quite the opposite, in fact: I remember 50 Cent’s vile homophobic outburst in which he said that men who don’t “lick pussy” should kill themselves.) Perhaps this is to do with generation and/or location, but I’ve never encountered such a meme anywhere I’ve lived or among any of the people with whom I’ve socialized. I am therefore as certain as I can be that, in my own culture and generation, a dislike of cunnilingus has nothing whatsoever to do with sexist social conditioning. If anything, not being into it runs against the prevailing programming of heterosexual men in our culture. I know this is anecdote, but you’re relying exclusively on anecdote too, and I find your assertion very strange and surprising.

    (This is in contrast to the issue of period sex, as regards which you’re obviously right that a sexist cultural meme exists.)

  499. 499
    Part-Time Insomniac

    Period sex – You like it, fine. Don’t like it? Don’t do it, and leave the ones who do like it alone.

    Personally, my drive tend to take a dip (sometimes a dive) around that time, on top of which my period usually leaves me feeling drained and not quite myself. Or at least with a case of, “Oh fuck off and leave me be, I don’t care about this dumb shit, whatever it is” which lasts almost a week. How can my me or my partner enjoy sex under these conditions? No thank you. I see it as sparing him from a sure case of misery.

  500. 500
    Walton

    TLC: I’m certainly not opposed to period sex. And I agree with you that the guys who react to discussion of it with “Ewwww, that’s gross!” are doing so because of internalized misogyny.

    My point is that it’s uncool to call someone a misogynist because they don’t like a particular sexual technique. I might not have that specific hangup, but I have enough strong aversions to things, including to some sexual practices that many other people like, that I dislike the idea of one’s inbuilt sexual predilections being judged and condemned like this, or of people being told they have something wrong with them because they don’t have “normal” sexual inclinations.

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