Glenn Beck has a very silly poll


His site, The Blaze, has an article about these crazy conservative Christians who disagree with the mainstream view that there were precisely two people, Adam and Eve, who founded the whole human race. And it has a poll which is going in a predictable direction for wacky Beck.

How did mankind come about?

God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story 75.16%

God created man and the universe, but scientific evolution occurred 17.52%

Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention 4.88%

I’m unsure 2.44%

Maybe we can change some of those numbers around.

Comments

  1. Tualha says

    At this time, it’s 1557-359-143-50. Let’s see if any of those numbers go down. Of course, they don’t have to mess with it in such an obvious way; they could just put in a lot of fake votes in the box they want. No way to catch that unless someone hacks their server and reveals the code, and then how do they prove that it really is the code?

  2. Ulgaa says

    Made the mistake of reading some of the comments. I now feel as if I was struck hard in the head with a club of stupid.

  3. IslandBrewer says

    You know, I thought some of the idiotic trolling I’ve seen on this site was stupid. Then, as Ulgaa experienced, the degree of stupid comments on that site make me weep.

    Really, on the first page is the “If we evolved from apes how come there’s still apes? Huh, Mr. Scientisty guy?” question.

    I didn’t realize that was still used in a non-ironic or satirical manner.

  4. says

    Well I just put my vote in and the vote count is now 1563-362-161-50 so the ‘Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention’ is now out voting the the other categories 2-1 over that small sample but that is a big hole to dig out of for sure.

    But even amongst the Beck faithful I’m still shocked that %73 believe ‘God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story.’ That is just flat out astounding.

  5. RedGreenInBlue says

    …man…
    …man and the universe…

    Remember, folks: women were just an afterthought – the bible tells me so!

    …man evolved…

    Oh, and anyway, men and women couldn’t have evolved at the same time. Therefore women must have appeared later. Therefore they were an afterthought. … Which just proves that goddidit. Because he loves you. (If you’re a man.)

    /snark

  6. Loqi says

    I didn’t think my blood pressure was high enough today, so I read some of the comments.

  7. Levi in NY says

    Looks like the Beck-heads are racking up the votes faster than we are. Come on guys!

  8. says

    I see all of you did the mistake of reading the comments of that site just like I did. I can already smell the cinders from my brain.

  9. says

    BTW, I always right-click on the poll links, copy the URL, open a new blank tab, and paste the URL in the address bar and hit “Enter” when I follow a link to polls like this.

    Why? Because when you click through on a link, the site you’re going to can detect the link origin. And if the poll-takers ever get smart enough, they may start filtering people who came from sites like this.

    Just saying.

  10. says

    This is a though one guys! 1737 – 733 – 412 -53.
    But we are now at 25%!
    I have faith we can make it! (pun heavily intended!)

    The hippo

  11. theBurningStupid says

    I thought the linked article was unusually clear and balanced for Beck, then I realized it is actually a summary and light rewrite of the NPR story to which it links (http://www.npr.org/2011/08/09/138957812/evangelicals-question-the-existence-of-adam-and-eve).

    That NPR story by Barbara Hagerty is dy-no-mite. P.Z., you buried the lead — this was your blog post. Hagerty describes several instances where scholars lost their jobs for questioning biblical literacy. Given Expelled, the irony is thick and yummy.

    And she found a theologian who would admit the awful truth, “”Without Adam, the work of Christ makes no sense whatsoever…” The end goal of Christ’s career was The Atonement; without Original Sin, there is no Atonement, which drains all meaning from the crucifixion. Christianity falls apart on that one point. This is why people cling to biblical literacy: if they let it be poetry, they have no useful theology left!

  12. triskelethecat says

    Up to 34%. I voted early and often, and posted it on the chat for PET. Rarely vote multiple times but I really dislike Glenn Beck..

  13. lordshipmayhem says

    Reality currently biting at 34%, 1,292 votes. Total votes 3,663

    Fantasy the choice of 51% or 1,865 voters.

  14. says

    If man evolved from apes, why do we still have apes? Evolution is supposed to replace the previous model, because the newer smarter one would breed and the other wouldn’t. And where are all the missing links that prove the statement From goo to the zoo via you?

    Gotta love the mentality of Glenn Beck’s readership. I’m surprised the drool running down their chins doesn’t short out their keyboards.

  15. says

    I don’t know, I’m a thinker, and I think that if evolution DID occur, it would STILL be occurring, and we would see some of that “IN-BETWEEN” stuff going on, but alas, we don’t.

    That theory is soooo dumb! Evolution, what a crock.

    Another gem from Beck’s fan base. No crocoduck = no evolution = Jesus.

  16. Phalacrocorax, not a particularly smart avian says

    I think that if evolution DID occur, it would STILL be occurring, and we would see some of that “IN-BETWEEN” stuff going on, but alas, we don’t.

    In between stuff? Sometimes I wonder if these people are confusing theory of evolution with pokemon evolution.

  17. says

    Nice progress on the poll, we’re only about 300 votes down at the moment.

    Like so many others in here, I made the mistake of glancing down into the comments section. I even made it through a couple of pages before I reached my inner intellectual masochist’s limits. It’s always a bit of a struggle not to take the bait and just strike up an argument when you see people so vehemently defending such ignorant positions.

  18. Phalacrocorax, not a particularly smart avian says

    At last, a compelling argument in the comments. I call it the Etymological Proof of Creation:

    “uni-verse” means “single spoken sentence.” A single sentence like idk…”Let there be light.”

    You can’t argue with that.

  19. lorax says

    Seems we’re in the lead! Should give those folks something to chew on.

    I didn’t bother reading the comments.. I scanned a few, but when 90% were “You can’t prove evolution” and “but why are there still monkeys?” I decided it would be more enjoyable to swallow a fishing line and proceed to disembowel myself through my mouth.

  20. Quodlibet says

    As of 9:58 p.m. EST:

    Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention 44.96% (2,120 votes)

    God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story 43.39% (2,046 votes)

    God created man and the universe, but scientific evolution occurred 10.27% (484 votes)

    I’m unsure 1.38% (65 votes)

    Total Votes: 4,715

  21. says

    It’s always a bit of a struggle not to take the bait and just strike up an argument when you see people so vehemently defending such ignorant positions.

    Oh, don’t I know it. I did it for a couple of years before I finally gave up on these gomers. It’s a no win. Getting through those stone walls of intentionally self-reinforced ignorance and fear of their god is like trying to blast one’s way through the Great Wall of China with a BB gun, so debating them is pretty much useless. And refusing to debate these clowns just gives them a chance to dishonestly say that evolutionists are afraid to debate creationists because “they know they’re wrong”. It gets boring watching them play their dishonest games. Debate is useless when only one side has to play fair.

  22. Quodlibet says

    Lovely irony…when the banner ad on this page when I loaded it a few minutes ago was an ad disguised as a poll, asking “Is Glen Beck doing a good job?”

    ——–

    Speaking of irony — here’s a silly joke I read the other day. Really bad.

    What’s the opposite of irony? …. Wrinkly.

    *ducks and runs away*

  23. Slammo says

    Anybody got a votebot for pharyngulation? I’ve been scowering for one, but am coming up with nothing….

    I’m just too damn lazy to keep refreshing…

  24. mikmik says

    Yeah! 36%-16%-46%-1%

    Phalacrocerax, I followed your link. Thanks! There are rational, knowledgeable people commenting at that page. Luckily, I can still tell the difference(I think!) after spending several tens of seconds at Glenn Beck’s sanctuary of stupidity.

  25. mikmik says

    I wish the nimrods would quit saying Darwinism = evolution.
    Evolution was already apparent, Darwin merely discovered the mechanism by which it works.

  26. Charlie Foxtrot says

    OK… ~62% for evolution, but still mentioning a capital ‘g’ god in there somewhere. I guess ya gotta make do with what you’re given in these cases.

    But – ouch- some of those comments! They give blinkered idiots a bad name!

    They’ve got it all! “Prove God doesn’t exist”, “Why are there monkeys”, godbotting, screaming “FACT”s (a personal favourite), the bible is right coz the bible says its right… oh and it goes on…

    OK – that’s enough time hovering on the event horizon of that pit of madness.

  27. Hexahelicene says

    Doing better now.

    At about 9:30 pm MST, the poll says
    63% for Man evolved w/o god. 5897 votes.

    I looked at comments only to see if somebody has noticed the ‘drift’ in the poll. Never found anybody commenting on it.

  28. Tigger_the_Wing says

    After I voted:

    Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention 64.9% (6,718 votes)

    God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story 24.04% (2,488 votes)

    God created man and the universe, but scientific evolution occurred 10.29% (1,065 votes)

    I’m unsure 0.77% (80 votes)

    A win for rationality. Or Pharyngulation. Or both. =^_^=

  29. Francisco Bacopa says

    Voted four times with relaods for godless evolution. Percentages seem lower than some of the earlier comments. Are creationists voting multiple times? I may go back and vote another 22 times. If I get cut off I will do the DSL modem plug trick. And if I really wanted to stay up all night voting I could use my https proxy my brother’s server farm gave me.

  30. Crudely Wrott says

    Just now it was a bit over 66% for evolution.

    Hey. Two out of three ain’t bad.

  31. Crudely Wrott says

    Moment of disconnect:

    I’m watching an episode of Wild Russia on the Animal Planet channel. Fantastic footage of Siberian forests and the flora and fauna that live there. Very enjoyable, especially the brown bears’ foreplay!

    Maddeningly, though, they keep showing what are plainly moose and repeatedly calling them elk. Dammit, one look at the legs and you know it ain’t no elk!

    End moment of disconnect; there is probably a perfectly good explanation . . . but I’ll be damned if I can figure it out.

  32. Trebuchet says

    CW: What we ‘Murricans call a “moose” is what Europeans have for centuries called “elk”. Our “elk”, which is more properly a wapiti, is a separate type of large deer-critter. When the first Europeans came here they saw wapiti and called them “elk” because they were the only large deer-critters they knew of.

    Good Pharyngulation, by the way. Has the poll been taken down yet?

  33. Crudely Wrott says

    Thanks, Trebuchet. I guess.
    Now that you have helped me figure it out, I’m damned.

    Darn.

  34. Andromeda says

    First Pharyngulation on FtB? Glad I checked this site or I would’ve missed this. The poll’s still up.

  35. Niftypifty says

    Jebus I love Pharyngulating polls. The change we brought to this one is hilariously staggering.

  36. Chris says

    Evolution’s now winning by a sound margin.

    Poll effectively trolled.

    One small victory for reality, I suppose. Though the fundies won’t even pay attention. And it’s not like we think reality is decided by democracy anyway.

  37. Crudely Wrott says

    We all agree that internet polls are silly. That’s why they get Pharyngulated. However, because they are silly, so is the Pharyngulation.

    Still, unexpected poll results might speak to some and get them to thinking sideways. In that case the poll has proved useful.

    When I was a kid I would carry a stick when I walked in the woods. So equipped I could poke at and provoke unknown things I came upon and, observing the effect of the stick on X, could learn a lot in a short time.

    I suppose that sometimes people use polls to poke and prod at society at large.
    I suppose that it is equally possible to diddle a poll and poke back in the other direction.

    In the former, one must always allow for the Oops Factor, which only leads to confusion, simple and innocent as it might first appear. In the later, one must allow for the Fun Factor, and share the laughs while wondering who just got offended.

    While it’s a bit of a chore some days, I do love a participatory universe.

  38. nene says

    Okay this is not looking so good at the moment:
    20397 – 2782 – 1175 – 106, reality at only 4.8%

  39. nene says

    I just can’t stop reading the comments to the article accompanying the poll. It hurts, too many lies, wrongs and straw men.

  40. nene says

    Just saw that they are listing the results by the percentage and not as positioned in the original post. Yeah, we are way in the lead.

  41. davem says

    Completely pharngulated. 85% for reason. But, oh no, the ‘why are there still monkeys?’ thingy came up in the comments. That site is a black hole of stupid.

  42. nemo the derv says

    I’m tempted to do a blitz on the comment section.

    Here’s a comment from “Bikerr”

    @CommonSenseis Missing—-To what facts are you referring?
    Fact one for me is that I am here.
    Fact two is there is a God.
    Fact three you are not him.
    Fact four All who believe in God have no problem humbling themselves before Him and acknowledging that He is in control.

    I can’t put enough quotes around the word facts so I won’t try.

  43. Cosmic Teapot says

    Now 85.43% in favour of no godly intervention.

    But those comments. I want to not read them, but can not resist the urge.

  44. Spiro Keat says

    I hesitated to vote because it allows for the existence of god; she just didn’t do this bit.

  45. Joe Smith says

    /r/atheism defeats another creationist bullshit poll.

    Maybe one day we can do something other than click our mouse.

  46. says

    @Spiro Keat:

    The point isn’t the language of the poll, it’s to absolutely destroy the “answer” that the poll writers want.

    Heck, I’d love to see a reverse-Pharyngulization from PZ one day. Where he finds a wingnut poll like this and tells us to vote for the “wrong” answer.

  47. Freerefill says

    Maybe we should dig up all the links of the polls that have been Pharyngulated and store them until we get, like, 100 or so.

    Then, we can find a religious wing-nut pole and -reverse- Pharyngulate it.

    Then we can troll the comments (“I mean, it’s very clear.. numbers don’t lie… people just don’t believe in God.”), baiting someone to say “But look at the poll numbers!”

    At which point, 100 different people under 100 different names all post one link to one of the polls we Pharyngulated.

  48. says

    Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention 87.23% (29,832 votes)

    God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story 8.78% (3,002 votes)

    God created man and the universe, but scientific evolution occurred 3.63% (1,242 votes)

    I’m unsure 0.36% (122 votes)

    Total Votes: 34,198

  49. says

    Anyone else notice how the results are displayed in a different order to the questions? I thought for a minute that god did it was the big winner. I wonder if that was intentional?

  50. serendipitydawg (one headed, mutant spawn of Echidna) says

    Never too busy to Pharyngulate a poll:

    Man evolved without God’s creation or intervention 87.27% (30,517 votes)

    God created man in present form, as per the Genesis story 8.76% (3,063 votes)

    God created man and the universe, but scientific evolution occurred 3.61% (1,263 votes)

    I’m unsure 0.36% (125 votes)

    Total Votes: 34,968

  51. greame says

    Best comment from the poll:

    God – 10 hours ago

    No, no.. they’re right.. I didn’t do that.

  52. Doc says

    The comments on that page really are the standard brush-offs spouted by those who don’t understand (or don’t want to understand) the scientific method and the process of natural selection.

    There was one comment to the effect that you’d have to be stupid to believe that man evolved from a rock, and why don’t dogs randomly sprout gills, and I’ll take god thanks.

    I don’t think you can force people to learn.

  53. says

    (Note: We will have an update with results later today, as they have been removed for the time being to verify their accuracy)

    Hah! I got in just under the wire. When I voted I saw results, but when I returned to the page to check the totals again I see this message displayed. “Verify their accuracy”… uh-huh. I’m sure that’s what they’re doing.

  54. And now the recount begins says

    (Note: We will have an update with results later today, as they have been removed for the time being to verify their accuracy):

  55. says

    All of those leftist Christian-haters were out in force today.

    /me shakes head

    I mean, there were a lot of folks there voting the good vote. It was well in favor of reality when I voted.

    Man, I gotta stop reading those comments. Fuck me, but they are gale-force stupid.

  56. Jim Atkins says

    Take our poll and tell us how you think mankind came about (Note: We will have an update with results later today, as they have been removed for the time being to verify their accuracy):

    This is what the poll says now when you vote- no results show up. I guess when things don’t go well or as expected, you just shove it under the rug, cry humanist conspiracy, and continue to ignore reality.

  57. Zios5 says

    Hey look! They’ve pulled the poll! Oh, Glenn Beck, you sad, sad little man.

    Take our poll and tell us how you think mankind came about (Note: We will have an update with results later today, as they have been removed for the time being to verify their accuracy):

    If anyone does a comedy bit with actual fundie quotes, maybe we should send them there. They seem to have congregated in the comments.

  58. Doug Little says

    The comments are hmmmm… predictable. The same old canards popping up, fuck these idiots need to get some new arguments, badly.

    They are checking the results for accuracy. That blew apart my irony meter, I seem to be going through those at an increasing rate these days, and that is fucking depressing.

  59. Random_Lurker says

    LOL some of the comments were incredible. I especially enjoyed the canned “gotcha” comments.

    If we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?

    What now atheists????

  60. Gliewmeden says

    Gaaah… I have to agree that there is selective posting. Posted this morning and have checked all day. Nadda.

    My comments were, and apologies to all my sentient American buddies, this is obviously why the international community consider the U.S. the brunt of our jokes.

    Please, all you brilliant, sentient, critical thinkers in America, it is now time to get cranky and speak up vociferously! Please!

  61. says

    So you had to rally to achieve the mainstream view on a poll? You people are really some of the biggest dimwits in academia, you prove what every conservative says about you it’s shameful.

  62. Dave says

    Over a poll? Brilliant! Like a 4 year old having a fit. Child like behavior over turns adults integrity. You are absolutely brilliant!

  63. Dan Nunley says

    Thank you atheists for making me laugh today! With all of the bad news in the world, from the economy to the riots to the famines, etc., I needed a good chuckle. I find that my frown always turns into a smile when I hear an atheist proclaim how reasoned and intelligent he or she is because in reality an atheist is nothing but a narcissistic fool. So please don’t change a thing. Keep on extolling your mental virtues because I really, really do enjoy the show.

  64. Mary Lawrence says

    I’m not sure what to believe.

    On the one hand, Christians tell me that God created (fill in the blank with everything and anything you can think of). If I don’t believe in God/Jesus then I will burn in the fires of hell. So much for a loving God.

    On the other hand, science tells me that we evolved from apes and that the entire universe was created by a big bang. Fine. But where did the gases/chemicals come from to create that big bang? The whole “which came first” theory comes into play and can never be proven IMO.

    I don’t like to be a fence rider, but I don’t know what to believe.

    I do know that making fun of people or hijacking a poll because you disagree with Glenn Beck, Christians, or a group of people for what they believe says a lot about the people participating.

  65. Anteprepro says

    Attention all fuckwits lambasting us for answering an internet poll: The entire point of this practice, which is common on this blog, is to show exactly how useless internet polls are and how easily they can be skewed. They are not reliable indicators of public opinion and can easily be swayed depending on whatever sites happens to take notice of it. It’s great that you guys feel warranted in taking on airs of superiority due to the fact that you find breaking these polls “childish” but there are plenty of dumbfucks with agendas out there who still think internet polls slapped on a webpage without any real controls on sampling can tell us something of profound significance. How is it particularly childish of us to participate in said polls, taking literally seconds of our lives, in order to show quite clearly how that isn’t the case?

  66. fred says

    you atheist are pathetic!!! for claiming to believe that there is NO GOD..you sure do worry about and fight against that’imaginary’ diety alot! this latest campaign of trying to sway a poll is proof of your madness. i ask you atheist for PROOF that atheism/no GOD exsist. proofr..not your belief ..as you say to the christians..proof..not belief. you cant stop people from believing in GOD just becuz you believe in NOTHING. but you guy do have your religion…little moronic babies is what your guys are.

  67. Tom says

    So you think we were created out of the “big bang” theory; every see the aftermath of an explosion it’s nothing more than chaos. CHAOS not planets, moons and stars in orbit that has been fairly stable since the beginning of know time. Take a bunch of auto parts blow it up with some TNT and see if a car is created. I bet not.

    You think we evolved from some primordial ooze to eventually form humans. Humans, with a DNA so complex that the greatest scientific brains using powerful supercomputers barely understand it.

    How about intelligent design? Could the reason we have a universe that supports life be intelligent design? Could the reason that humans are the way we are be intelligent design? I THINK SO. And I call this Intelligent Designer; GOD.

    The reason that many of you do not believe or want to believe in God is the concept of SIN. Sin equates to responsibility, personal responsibility. No god, no sin, no responsibility.
    Believing in God takes faith in something we cannot see, but you can feel it, if you let it. The feeling is the spirit of God and it is a great feeling. Try it you may come to like it. Life is better with faith.

  68. says

    @Tom:

    Hey Tom, can I call you Tom?

    Lemme grab this last point of yours really quick and demolish it:

    Life is better with faith.

    Life was better when I was closeted, living a lie, uncomfortable with myself, scared that I would get caught in women’s clothing by a family that might not accept me, scared to admit I had an attraction for men, ignorant of science, not nearly as excited about seeing stars and rocks and dinosaur bones, not confident in myself, single and depressed, scared that each day I would die and be dragged to Hell because god decided I wasn’t good enough.

    Yea, fuck that. Life has been so much better since I dropped the pretense of belief since I’m now me.

  69. teawithbertrand says

    Mary Lawrence,

    My advice is to consider the sources of the information presented to you. Things like evolution and the big bang are scientific theories. They are based on observations of empirical evidence and are subject to rigorous peer review. They make claims and predictions that are testable and verifiable. When a theory does not fit with scientific observation of reality, it is either modified or discarded in favor of a new theory that makes more sense.

    Contrast this with religious dogma like creationism or geocentrism. Dogmatic explanations are meant to be accepted on faith alone even when all observation and evidence contradicts them. They can never be modified or discarded no matter how wrong they are, and there is no objective way to validate one dogmatic idea over another. This is how people thought about the world before science existed.

    You make a good point about Christianity. Most of it does not make sense at all. Would any god worth worshipping give you the intelligence to be skeptical and then torture you forever for it?

    To your specific big bang question – it’s a little more complicated than that. Parts of quantum mechanics describe how subatomic particles (like the one from which the universe expanded) can in fact just “pop into existence” without breaking any of the laws of physics. Other regular posters here are more knowledgable than I am in this field. Perhaps one of them could clarify further(?)

    In any event, welcome. Keep thinking for yourself and keep asking questions. I think you’re on the right track.

  70. chigau () says

    Katherine Lorraine
    Me, too.
    Do you think that Barbara is the same as the Barb in the old dungeon?

  71. Mary Lawrence says

    Thank you very much, teawithbertrand, for your kind words and for taking the time to explain some basic scientific theory to me.

    I will continue to think for myself and observe both sides from my vantage point on the fence while occasionally adding my perspective to the conversation.

    Thanks again!

  72. GalapagosPete says

    fred asks, “i ask you atheist for PROOF that atheism/no GOD exsist.”

    Well, I can prove atheists exist because I am one and know of more.

    As for “PROOF” that “no GOD exsist”…

    The burden of proof isn’t on atheists because we aren’t making a claim, we’re saying that we don’t accept your claim. It’s up to you to provide evidence to support your claim.

  73. teawithbertrand says

    Mary Lawrence

    My pleasure. Hope to hear more from you. For exmaples of folks clearly on the WRONG track, see “Tom” and “Fred” in previous comments.

  74. Barbara says

    Katherine, sorry you have so little self esteem about your self. I don’t know how or what the reasons for it but don’t blame God. Be responsible and look to your self for happiness.

  75. says

    @Barbara:

    Tch, please. I have so much more self-esteem about myself now that I’m an atheist that I ever had as a Christian. When you’re surrounded by people who would condemn and kick you out of their church for daring to admit you’re bisexual or transgender, it’s scary to admit such things.

    And I did look to myself for happiness. I dropped the need to believe and love what I am now more than ever.

  76. Barbara says

    No, not the same Barbara.
    Any one that can’t recognize intelligent design for what it is, a blueprint for life has a whole lot of thinking to do.
    Where is the design for evolution? Come on guys ask the questions. Don’t just follow the crowd and be a sheeple marching over the cliff.
    Think.
    God Bless you, Barb

  77. Barbara says

    Katherine, sorry you had a hard time in a So called Christian atmosphere. But I hope you realize we are not all like that. I’m glad you’re happy now, however. But I don’t think Christianity had any thing to do with it. There are good and bad people every where of every faith. It’s up to us who we hang with.
    Anyway, I wish you the best.
    Barb

  78. Barbara says

    These atheist sites intrigue me. Most of you posting have so much vitriol in your words. Is that what atheism does to you.
    I am serious and not mocking. It’s just an observation.

  79. Barbara says

    Katherine, One more thing. You say you dropped the need to believe and love what you are now?

    What exactly are you now that you love so much? A belief in nothing? hmmmm.

  80. says

    Barb:

    Many people here have had severe emotional damage done to them by both religious doctrine and religious people. As a result, we’re not exactly happy about the whole set-up and can see absolutely no evidence whatsoever that any of the supernatural claims that religions make are grounded in reality. Instead of making your cutesy little “observations”, would you care to present some evidence that your beliefs are true?

  81. Barbara says

    Josh, Not trying to be sanctimonious. Just curious.
    I guess I’m trying to understand the need to bash believers. Can’t you be content to be non believing. Just asking.

  82. Tom says

    After a lifetime of feeling alone, confused, scared even though I always had family, friends and coworkers around I was moved by the sprit to go to church for myself, not family or a wedding or funeral but for me. After accepting Christ as my savoir my life has been better, those feeling are gone.

    You can manipulate numbers and formulas to make the theories work. And remember theories are just theories until they are proven. Faith is just faith until it is proven. Religion can also be manipulated. With both theory and religion don’t take anyone’s word for granted do your own research, look at opposing views as well, be open minded and choose what is right for you.
    For me God make sense. What have you got to loose, but think of what you have to gain?

  83. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Barbara, you believers get a free pass on your nonsense almost everywhere else. You don’t get one here. All of us have been through this tedious Christian question-asking and special pleading and absurd claims for years. We’re not going to bore ourselves to death doing it over with you. If you don’t understand why secular people are fed up to their necks with you Christians and your increasing affect on every bit of public policy in this country then get your ass out of the pews and start paying attention to the real world.

  84. jeremiah says

    Any one that can’t recognize intelligent design for what it is, a blueprint for life has a whole lot of thinking to do.
    Where is the design for evolution? Come on guys ask the questions. Don’t just follow the crowd and be a sheeple marching over the cliff.
    Think.
    God Bless you, Barb

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha yeah lets not be sheep…lets take our cue from the christians. They would never want to be associated with sheep.

  85. says

    Tom:

    What you believe isn’t a matter of choice; it’s a question of plausibility and evidence. We’ve looked for evidence of the supernatural and have found. Many of us have come from Christian and other religious households, have prayed for signs and helped and have received nothing. We came to atheism through analysing the actual evidence, based on reality; if that’s not being open-minded, I don’t know what is.

    What have you got to loose, but think of what you have to gain?

    A life free from religious dogma: that’s what we have to gain.

  86. Barbara says

    Okay, I can understand that. People having been hurt and the need to take it out somewhere. Why not God. Like when we are kids and mad as hell for something and we take it out on Mom. The one who is safe and you know will forgive you. Same difference.
    I went through a period of questioning too. I think everyone does at some point. It’s good to question and look for answers.

  87. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    That, Barbara, is classic sanctimony. That’s why we don’t like people like you. Smug, condescending, and wrong. Go away.

  88. Barbara says

    Okay Josh, the reason I am even here right now is you guys need to mock Beck’s poll. Sooooo, there you have it. Thought I would stop in and see just what kind of people you all are.

  89. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    You know fuck-all about what kind of people we are, Barbara. And you don’t care. You came here to confirm your Christian prejudices and affect getting wounded feelings because your (literally insane) Mormon talk show host had a stupid poll that got crapped on.

  90. andyo says

    Mary Lawrence, you appear not to be a fundamentalist like the others, but

    On the other hand, science tells me that we evolved from apes and that the entire universe was created by a big bang. Fine.

    This is a false dichotomy.

    But where did the gases/chemicals come from to create that big bang? The whole “which came first” theory comes into play and can never be proven IMO.

    You say “on the other hand” but why is the “other side” the christian god? How does “Jesus is (son of) God” and all other christian dogma follow from “we don’t know what set off the big bang”? At the most, according to your argument, the “other side” from science is a god that set off the BB and doesn’t intervene.

    I don’t like to be a fence rider, but I don’t know what to believe.

    You don’t have to believe anything blindly. Science works. If relativity, quantum mechanics, evolution, etc weren’t true, you wouldn’t have a computer to type on, an internet for it to go through, a GPS device, modern medicine, etc. IT JUST WORKS!

    I do know that making fun of people or hijacking a poll because you disagree with Glenn Beck, Christians, or a group of people for what they believe says a lot about the people participating.

    Sometimes some things are so ridiculous that ridicule is the only possible answer.

  91. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Barbara #104

    Where is the design for evolution?

    Douglas Futuyma in his book Evolutionary Biology,. defines evolution:

    [E]volution is merely change, and so is all-pervasive; galaxies, languages, and political systems all evolve. Biological evolution … is change in the properties of populations of organisms that transcend the lifetime of a single individual. The ontogeny of an individual is not considered evolution; individual organisms do not evolve. The changes in populations that are considered evolutionary are those that are inheritable via the genetic material from one generation to the next. Biological evolution may be slight or substantial; it embraces everything from slight changes in the proportion of different alleles within a population (such as those determining blood types) to the successive alterations that led from the earliest protoorganism to snails, bees, giraffes, and dandelions.”

    Your religious masters have told you that evolution is random. This is incorrect. Evolution is not a random process. The genetic variation on which natural selection acts may occur randomly, but natural selection itself is not random at all. The survival and reproductive success of an individual is directly related to the ways its inherited traits function in its local environment. Whether or not an individual survives and reproduces depends on whether it has genes that produce traits that are well adapted to its environment.

    Come on guys ask the questions.

    We have been asking questions. We like the answers that the Theory of Evolution gives to these questions. They make sense. The problem with intelligent design is it doesn’t answer questions. “And then a miracle happened” or “God made it that way” does not answer questions, because they can be made to fit anything. “Why is the sky blue?” “Because God made it that way.” “Why is the sky orange?” “Because God made it that way.” Science tells us why the sky is blue and not orange.* “Because God made it that way” doesn’t explain anything.

    Don’t just follow the crowd and be a sheeple marching over the cliff.

    Do you honestly think we accept evolution because we were told to accept it? You’ve got it wrong. Creationists (and don’t lie to yourself, intelligent design is a form of creationism) believe in creationism because they are told to believe in it by their religious masters. We accept evolution because that’s what the evidence shows us.

    What’s the evidence for creationism? A 2,500 year old creation myth some Hebrew priests stole from the Babylonians. What’s the evidence for evolution? Literally tons of fossils, the discovery of DNA and the process of genetic replication, an understanding of radioactive decay, observations of natural selection in the wild and in laboratories, and evidence in the genomes of many different organisms, including humans, are all evidence of evolution.

    *The sky is blue because of a phenomenon called “Rayleigh Scattering,” which has to do with the size of dust particles and molecules in the atmosphere compared to the wavelengths of various colors of light.**

    **Actually a much more interesting question is “why is the night sky black?” The answers to that question tell us fundamental things about the universe.

  92. Tom says

    The Christian church I was led to is non-denominational, non-condemning and nonjudgmental; it’s a relaxed environment to be in. We believe in the word God. Many churches believe in the ritual of religion and do a poor job of perching the word of God. Many preachers preach their own agenda just as many college professors do.

    I still have questions, but for me faith in God and the way my life has changed for the better is proof enough.

  93. Barbara says

    You guys sound like you have it all figured out. Just never stop searching and learning. we think we know all there is to know and then find out we were wrong.
    There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle.
    – Albert Einstein

  94. says

    I still have questions, but for me faith in God and the way my life has changed for the better is proof enough

    Then clearly the concept of “proof” is alien to you.

    To quote George Bernard Shaw:

    The fact that a believer is happier than a sceptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one

  95. Dhorvath, OM says

    Tom, how would you tell the difference between the word of your deity and the word of your preacher? What criteria distinguishes the one from the other?

  96. Tom says

    Despite his parents’ secularism, or perhaps because of it, Einstein rather suddenly developed a passionate zeal for Judaism. “He was so fervent in his feelings that, on his own, he observed Jewish religious strictures in every detail,” his sister recalled. He ate no pork, kept kosher and obeyed the strictures of the Sabbath. He even composed his own hymns, which he sang to himself as he walked home from school.

    Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1607298,00.html#ixzz1UklS4Ofd

  97. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Tom #111

    You can manipulate numbers and formulas to make the theories work. And remember theories are just theories until they are proven.

    When a scientist uses the word “theory” they do not mean “a guess.” A scientific theory is a explanation. The Germ Theory of Disease is not a guess that itty-bitty critters cause certain diseases.

  98. says

    Any one that can’t recognize intelligent design for what it is,

    We can. Human-made artifacts are quite easy to pick out from, say, the remains of life.

    a blueprint for life has a whole lot of thinking to do.

    How come we don’t mistake life for design, then? Ask the questions, lazy “thinker.”

    Where is the design for evolution?

    We do ask where is the design for evolution. We find none, as there is none to find. No rationality, no forethought, no engineering solutions.

    Come on guys ask the questions.

    Why don’t you ask why life diverges so far from known design? This is the typical, someone who credulously parrots idiocies tells those of us who do think that we need to ask the inane “questions” fed to you by the ignorant.

    Glen Davidson

  99. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Tom, who cares whether or not Einstein was a goddist or not? What does it show?

    Besides being a physicist and mathematician, Isaac Newton was an alchemist. Since the most notable physicist before Einstein believed in alchemy, does that make it true? Also you might want to find out what type of goddist Newton was. Almost all Christians would reject Newton’s ideas about God.

  100. says

    Tom:

    Many churches believe in the ritual of religion and do a poor job of perching the word of God.

    Why don’t you run off and try to catch perch elsewhere, Cupcake? Your faith is not proof, it’s certainly not evidence and that’s all many of us care about. If you have actual evidence for that lovin’ Poofdaddy of yours, by all means, lay it on the table.

    If not…stop perching preaching. It isn’t welcome here, it can get you banned and worst of all, it’s bloody boring.

  101. Barbara says

    To Tis himself, I agree with much of what you posted. There is much in evolution that is true. Evolution and Intelligent design can go hand in hand.
    You didn’t give your explanation about the blue print however. Who is the creator of this blueprint? Any ideas on that?

  102. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Exactly, ‘Tis. I just keep hoping, though, that one “Tom” will actually discover that he’s been lied to about lots of things and he’ll actually start questioning. You know that anyone who thinks Einstein believed in a personal god (he didn’t, this isn’t opinion, it’s easily verifiable on teh googlez) is suffering under an enormous bunch of misconceptions and outright lies fed to them.

  103. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Evolution and Intelligent design can go hand in hand.

    No. They are opposites. This shows you don’t understand evolution.

    You didn’t give your explanation about the blue print however. Who is the creator of this blueprint? Any ideas on that?

    Stop trying to play coy; you’re transparent. What is it with you theists that you have to imagine there was a Somebody who created the universe? Why is it so difficult for you to imagine that’s not the case?

  104. says

    Einstein grew up, eventually:

    “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish.

    “No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this,” he wrote in the letter written on January 3, 1954 to the philosopher Eric Gutkind, cited by The Guardian newspaper.

    From Breitbart

    “To assume the existence of an unperceivable being … does not facilitate understanding the orderliness we find in the perceivable world.” – Albert Einstein, responding to an Iowa student who asked, “What is God?” July 1953; Einstein Archive 59-085

    Glen Davidson

  105. Dhorvath, OM says

    Barbara,
    Life is an accidental artifact of the information in DNA, not something recorded there. There is no blueprint.

  106. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Oooooh. . . Barbara wants her own crucifixion! Low on Christian Persecution points this week?

  107. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    This caught my eye:
    Barbara (to Katherine)

    A belief in nothing?

    We aren’t nihilists, dumbass.

  108. Tom says

    Dhorvath, OM
    The way I tell the difference is as stated in my previous post I DO MY OWN RESERCH. I read different interpretation of the bible and read opinions from different bible scholars then I make an informed decision.

    Do you belive everything a college professors tells you or a single textbook says, without question or do you own research.

  109. says

    You didn’t give your explanation about the blue print however.

    You found a blueprint for life? Then present it.

    Oh yes, I know what you’re blathering about, you’re calling functional hereditary information a “blueprint,” playing stupid word games instead of asking meaningful questions.

    Who is the creator of this blueprint?

    The “creator” of information that is slavishly adapted from inherited information, just as non-teleological evolution predicts?

    There is none. Quit fapping away with your unquestioned and unwarranted presuppositions.

    Glen Davidson

  110. andyo says

    Tom #127 (and Barbara #123)

    As we have come to expect, dishonest quote mining and argument from authority. What you quoted is from his school age. From the same link you provided (emphasis mine):

    The rebellion part comes in at the beginning of his life: he rejected at first his parents’ secularism and later the concepts of religious ritual and of a personal God who intercedes in the daily workings of the world. But the awe part comes in his 50s when he settled into a deism based on what he called the “spirit manifest in the laws of the universe” and a sincere belief in a “God who reveals Himself in the harmony of all that exists.”

    You know what deism is?

    But anyway, it doesn’t matter what Einstein or anyone says if they’re wrong:

    “Not everything that comes out of my mouth is the theory of relativity” —Albert Einstein

    Also, Barbara, that quote you made from “Einstein” is of questionable authorship.

  111. Rey Fox says

    What exactly are you now that you love so much? A belief in nothing? hmmmm.

    I won’t get into Katherine’s personal details (suffice it to say she has a story that you would probably do well to hear), but I think in a general sense, she is now her own being, and is determining her own purpose and journey in life, rather than being whatever the church wants of her. She is no longer diminished for being something that she is not, she is no longer condemned for being who she is.

    That you choose to diminish all that because she doesn’t grovel before your absent cosmic puppetmaster shows that you’re not really as gracious and good a person as you seem to think you are.

  112. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Barbara #132

    Evolution and Intelligent design can go hand in hand.

    No they don’t. Evolution says how life has changed over billions of years due to mutation and natural selection (and a few other things, but I don’t feel like explaining things like gene transfer and duplication right now). Intelligent design can be summed up in three words: God did it.

    You didn’t give your explanation about the blue print however. Who is the creator of this blueprint?

    There is no blueprint. Why does there have to be one? And since there isn’t a blueprint, this non-existent blueprint doesn’t require a creator.

  113. says

    Barbara:

    Caine, so ban me. Does my (perching)make you think? If so, good.

    I can’t ban anyone, Cupcake. I was just letting you know it’s a bannable offense. Are you capable of comprehending that? You can read it for yourself: http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/plonk.php

    No, your perching doesn’t make me think. Religion and faith are not structured for thinking. The whole point is stomp on actual thought every moment of every day – you aren’t supposed to think or question anything, just keep pickling your brain in Jesus juice so you’ll be a good little parrot.

    I did my time with religion, with faith. I studied the bible intensively for 10 years. There’s nothing you can say to me that would make me think. I did my thinking. Still do. I would not ever go back to being such a complete and utter idiot, content with not using my brain at all except to parrot the faith party line.

    All you elicit in me, besides boredom, is pity.

  114. Nerd of Redhead says

    Evolution and Intelligent design can go hand in hand.

    Only in the mind of a delusional fool. Show my conclusive physical evidence for the creator. Evidence that will pass muster with scientists, magicians, and profession debunkers, as being of divine, and not natural (scientifically explained), origin. Or, you have nothing to discuss as far as a designer goes, as you must explain how the designer came about, and who designed it. Ad infinitium.

    I DO MY OWN RESERCH.

    Nope, you accept authority. There is conclusive physical evidence for your imaginary deity, ergo your babble is book of mythology/fiction, which even a casual reading shows to be true. And I’ve read it twice. And that is why I’m an atheist.

  115. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Barb:

    Audley, Can you have a civil debate without the snide remarks?

    Oh, honey. You haven’t seen snide.

    As soon as you present some sort of reasonable arguments, sure, we can be “civil”. So far, all I’ve seen is the same kind of wankery that we get from every other smug believer.

    And my point still stands: we aren’t nihilists. My guess is that you don’t know the difference between atheism and nihilism, do you?

    Shorter: You bore me. But go on thinking that you’re just oh-so clever.

  116. Barbara says

    Hey guys enjoyed the back and forth, except for the few that have to do the name calling.
    Later, God Bless

  117. Nerd of Redhead says

    Dang #151, second response, second sentence, should read “There is no conclusive…”

  118. Tom says

    andyo,

    Yes I know what deism is it is the belief that God exists based on reason and nature rejecting the supernatural.

    The reason I mention Einstein’s belief is due to a previous post about he being atheists

  119. Dhorvath, OM says

    Tom,
    I just reread your comments at 91 and 111. You aren’t talking about making an informed decision, you are talking about making an uninformed decision. Your understanding of cosmology and evolution isn’t even primitive and yet you feel comfortable dismissing them as only theories, a word you manifestly don’t understand. In the place of information you substitute personal reaction. We don’t much care what feels correct, we care what there is evidence for.
    I will alter my question and ask again, what criteria do you use to determine what is the word of your deity and what is not?

  120. says

    Audley:

    Oh, honey. You haven’t seen snide.

    I don’t know what you were thinking, Audley, there wasn’t a single fuck in your post and nary a mention of decaying porcupines. We have standards, you know!

  121. Sastra says

    Tom #122 wrote:

    I still have questions, but for me faith in God and the way my life has changed for the better is proof enough.

    A serious question: if God doesn’t actually exist, would you still want to go on believing that it did anyway — because ‘faith in God’ comes with so many benefits?

    If so, then leave off the whole “think things through for yourself” routine. You’re not pursuing truth for its own sake, but making a journey of self-discovery and fulfillment. Religion as a form of therapy, a matter of taste. Your questions are all going to be self-referential.

    If not, then drop all the assurances and reassurances that people can and will find peace and happiness with God. It’s not about that. The question — the only relevant question — is whether God exists.

    People all over the spectrum find that their lives “change for the better” when they leave Belief System A for Belief System B. And vice versa and counterwise. That can’t be proof of the truth of what is believed; it only demonstrates that belief systems, whatever they are, all have benefits and drawbacks.

  122. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    Mary Lawrence,

    There’s no need to ride the fence. Science has provided the answers to your questions. In the past, humans had to guess and make up stories to explain how things worked. Now we understand gravity and light and electricity. We understand how life has evolved into its current diversity. We have plausible ideas (based on evidence) about how life came from non-life and how the universe came to be. We don’t know *everything* but we know far, far more than the mythmakers of the near east 8000 years ago. I’m not sure if you’re a reader, but try reading about what scientists have figured out about the universe. A Short History of Nearly Everything by Bill Bryson is a good place to start. It’s informative and very funny. If you’re more of a video-watching person, I’d suggest watching Cosmos by Carl Sagan. Or for something shorter, the YouTube series The Universe Made Easy by Potholer54 (a science journalist in real life) http://www.youtube.com/user/madeeasyseries .

  123. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Caine:

    I don’t know what you were thinking, Audley, there wasn’t a single fuck in your post and nary a mention of decaying porcupines.

    *sigh* I know, it’s so not like me.

    I must be getting soft in my old age.

    Barb:
    Don’t forget to stick the flounce, now!

  124. andyo says

    Tom #155

    The reason I mention Einstein’s belief is due to a previous post about he being atheists

    Yet you quoted what makes him appear to be devoutly religious, instead of quoting the part that says he’s NOT AT ALL. In any case, deism is much closer to atheism than to any form of theism. In fact in practice it’s indistinguishable from atheism.

  125. 'smee says

    Barbara & Tom – The stupid is strong in these ones!!!!

    Tom: Personal revelation is not proof. I’m happy for you that you fell better in yourself. But, honestly, without a true and honest life of the mind you are no better than a hamster in a cage — running along happily with no real sense of direction or ability to influence that direction.

    Barbara: sheesh, where do I start? How about this: you are a condescending, passive-aggressive, creobot whose idea of thinking would fail elementary cognition in any rational world, and whose understanding of reality is so blinkered you can’t even understand the basic concepts of proof, evidence, or cause.

  126. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Tom #142

    I DO MY OWN RESERCH. I read different interpretation of the bible and read opinions from different bible scholars then I make an informed decision.

    In other words, you read various peoples’ opinions and guesses about an imaginary being and decide which one you like best.

    PZ Myers formulated what’s called The Courtier’s Reply. You know the story of “The Emperor’s New Clothes”? The Courtier’s Reply describes the various non-existent garments the emperor is (not) wearing. In a similar way, theology is guesses and opinions and “well, I think this” about a mythological being.

    You can enjoy reading about peoples’ delusions concerning a fictitious being. After all, everyone needs a hobby. It’s when these delusions are used to justify political and sociological ideas that we atheists get concerned.

    Several of you goddists have asked why atheists are so concerned with god and religion. There’s only one aspect that troubles us. That’s the use of religion to legitimize a particular social stance. “Gays shouldn’t get married because God thinks what they do in bed is icky.” “We should teach children a particular religious creation myth instead of science.” “Fly an airplane into a building because that’s what Allah wants.” If you guys kept your religion at home or in your church then we could care less. It’s when you want to inflict your religious beliefs on the rest of us that we get anxious.

  127. Vicki says

    That someone else finds it comforting to believe in God is not evidence for God’s existence. If it was, then the fact that I find it comforting not to believe is evidence that there are no gods. (I know, we don’t need to prove the null hypothesis.) Yes, it is comforting: bad things happen, but not because I deserve them. Small children die in pain from hereditary diseases, but this is not the act of an omnipotent and allegedly benevolent being.

  128. says

    @Barbara:

    Who the fuck are you to determine who is or is not a Christian. My family’s church damn well believes in the tenets of Christ – which is the only criteria for Christianity.

    As for who I am now? I’m me. I’m the me I always was and was always afraid of being. I’m free of dogma, I’m free of my own fear. I’m free to explore nature and science and free to understand (or not understand) things like biology and astronomy.

    I would go into my history, as Rey Fox alluded to, but that would take away too much time and I really don’t feel like doing that since I’m about to play Starcraft 2 with some friends.

    @Tom:

    Wrong!

    Yes I know what deism is it is the belief that God exists based on reason and nature rejecting the supernatural.

    Deism is the belief that a god exists. Not God. A god. God is your Christian god, the maniacal, genocidal cretin in your Bible. A god can be any deity, not necessarily Yahweh.

  129. 'smee says

    KL@167

    Go you! Yay!

    I am always happy when people realize who they are, and start living as themselves! We need more real people, rather than cardboard cutouts vying to be whatever they are told will make them popular, liked, loved, whatever.

    Regarding Deism… a minor correction.

    The biggest difference between Deists and other goddists, is that deists generally do not believe in an interventionist god.

    @Barbara, Tom, (FRED from long ago upthread)

    For you religionists of the world – that means prayer don’t work.

    For my part, I wonder what the fuck would be the point in worshiping or revering a God that does fuck-all – even more than worshiping an evil, smiteful bastard like the Lord God Jehovah of the Old & Jeshua of the New testaments.

    Allah, Ganesh, YHWH, Odin, Coyote, Monkey, Enki – I really don’t give a fuck. It’s all made up shit anyway.

    But – if it makes you happy to believe it, go right ahead. Just don’t expect me (or many other rational people) to follow you in that.

  130. Bill O'Reilly says

    Just wish that Beck would do a poll asking.

    “Are Mormon’s Christians?”

    I think he’d learn something.

    BTW: It has been sooo much quieter around the newsroom since he left.

  131. chigau () says

    When someone says “God Bless” does that mean that they are ordering god to bless you?

  132. says

    Chigau:

    When someone says “God Bless” does that mean that they are ordering god to bless you?

    It’s xian nastiness, a reminder you’re gonna go to hell, you nasty heathen!

  133. 'smee says

    @170 to 174: ROFL. My wife just came by to see what made me bark out loud with laughter!

  134. SteveM says

    re 91: Tom

    So you think we were created out of the “big bang” theory; every see the aftermath of an explosion it’s nothing more than chaos. CHAOS not planets, moons and stars in orbit that has been fairly stable since the beginning of know time. Take a bunch of auto parts blow it up with some TNT and see if a car is created. I bet not.

    The problem is taking the facetious name “big bang” too literally. It is NOT an explosion of matter like TNT in autoparts. “Big Bang” was Hoyle’s description of the proposed singularity from reversing the current expansion of the universe. But the singularity was the creation of space itself, not just debris being propelled into existing space. And it is gravity that forms the dust into star sized clumps forming stars and planets and holding them in galaxy shapes. There is far more going on during and after the BigBang than a simple explosion of TNT. The latter provides no education (or models) the former in any way.

  135. says

    Chigau:

    What about “Bless your heart! (cupcake)”

    Oh, that means “I hope you drop dead and burn in hell!” Sometimes, it’s just a garden variety “I hate you!”

  136. says

    Don’t just follow the crowd and be a sheeple marching over the cliff.

    I love the smell of irony in the morning.

    *sniffs* Smells kinda like bacon and eggs being served to a professed vegan.

  137. Tom says

    So tis himself,

    What you are saying is that theology is kind of like scientific theory something that is an opinion full of conjecture and is not scientific law. Sought of like the theory of evolution, ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

  138. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

    Awe, how cute! Someone doesn’t know what a scientific theory is!

    Here’s a hint: it’s not a guess. Can you use the amazing powers of the intertubes and figure the rest out for yourself?

  139. says

    What you are saying is that theology is kind of like scientific theory something that is an opinion full of conjecture and is not scientific law. Sought of like the theory of evolution, ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

    *headdesk*

    What exactly are your views on gravity then? Last time I checked, that was a scientific theory as well. Please understand what the word actually means before tossing it around willy nilly.

  140. says

    What you are saying is that theology is kind of like scientific theory something that is an opinion full of conjecture and is not scientific law. Sought of like the theory of evolution, ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

    ::HEAD DESK:: Oh no, please, not this misconception again.

    Tom, before you go any further, could you please familiarize yourself about what the actual definition of a scientific theory is?

    A scientific law explains what should happen but not why. A scientific theory explains why an action or observation is caused. For example, Newton’s Law of Gravity will predict the action of a dropped object but not WHY the object acted that way. The Theory of Gravity will explain WHY the dropped object behaved the way it did.

    A scientific theory is not merely guesses or conjectures, it is an explanation or summary for a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been verified through repeated testing and observation. What you seem to think of as “scientific theory” is not theory, but rather scientific hypotheses, which are guesses until otherwise confirmed or debunked by repeated testing and observation.

  141. says

    @Audley #183 – Sheesh, we’re this far in and yet not a single cuss word or pearl-clutching inducing string of swears? What is wrong with you? I’m so disappointed.

  142. says

    Audley:

    Can you use the amazing powers of the intertubes and figure the rest out for yourself?

    Please. Everyone knows the internet is just a theory and we’re all uploaded digital lobsters.

    “Can you help us?” ask the lobsters.

    “Let me think about it,” says Manfred. He closes the dialogue window, opens his eyes again, and shakes his head. Some day he too is going to be a lobster, swimming around and waving his pincers in a cyberspace so confusingly elaborate that his uploaded identity is cryptozoic: a living fossil from the depths of geological time, when mass was dumb and space was unstructured. He has to help them, he realizes–the golden rule demands it, and as a player in the agalmic economy he thrives or fails by the golden rule.

  143. Nerd of Redhead says

    What you are saying is that theology is kind of like scientific theory

    No fuckwit. Theology is mental masturbation, based on an imaginary deity and mythical/fictional holy book, full of sound and fury, meaning nothing. Because is it based on lies.

    A Scientific Theory is based on solid physical evidence, and ties the evidence together, and in the case of evolution, has a million or so scientific paper backing it up, both directly and indirectly. Learn reality. Delusion fools like yourself don’t do well here.

    ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

    A scientific theory is better than a scientific law, which is usually only one equation out of many to describe a particular phenomenon. Get with reality. You won’t look so stupid and delusional.

  144. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    You know what Tom? I kind of pity your ignorance, so here are some explanations of scientific theory:

    From United States National Academy of Sciences:

    Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature supported by facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena

    and

    American Association for the Advancement of Science:

    A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment. Such fact-supported theories are not “guesses” but reliable accounts of the real world. The theory of biological evolution is more than “just a theory.” It is as factual an explanation of the universe as the atomic theory of matter or the germ theory of disease. Our understanding of gravity is still a work in progress. But the phenomenon of gravity, like evolution, is an accepted fact.

    (Both quotes taken from the Wikipedia.)

    So, uh, where does that leave you?

    What you are saying is that theology is kind of like scientific theory something that is an opinion full of conjecture and is not scientific law. Sought of like the theory of evolution, ONLY A THEORY NOT LAW.

    Oh right. It leaves you looking like an ass. Next time, you might want to familiarize yourself with common terminology before you decide to debate.

  145. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    The Pint:

    Sheesh, we’re this far in and yet not a single cuss word or pearl-clutching inducing string of swears? What is wrong with you? I’m so disappointed.

    *hangs head in shame!* I just don’t know what’s wrong with me today. I’ll try a little fucking harder, okay?

    ;)

  146. says

    The biggest difference between Deists and other goddists, is that deists generally do not believe in an interventionist god.

    In which case, deists are almost like functional atheists since they tend not to care about the trappings of formal religion. I don’t quite get deism as anything other than the desire to hold onto a security blanket, even though you know you don’t need it, because it’s not that far of a jump between not believing in a god and believing in a god that doesn’t give a crap if you believe in it or not since it may have gotten the ball rolling, so to speak, but apparently hasn’t cared a whit about where it’s gone since. If the deist god exists but hasn’t left any evidence of its existence or any evidence that it cares what happens to us or if we even believe in it or not, what’s the point of holding onto or professing that belief?

  147. says

    *hangs head in shame!* I just don’t know what’s wrong with me today. I’ll try a little fucking harder, okay?

    That’s better. Must remember that while there might not be any god watching you, we are and we have serious expectations of you, missy. ;)

  148. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    The Pint:
    I did get tone trolled by Barb for calling her a “dumbass”. That’s gotta count for something, right?

    Tom:
    I’ve only breezed over your posts* (they seem to be the same sort of silly shit that I’ve seen before from believers), so excuse me if this has been covered, but what would be the harm in just letting go of your faith? You don’t need the concept of “sin” to be a good and responsible person– you just need some imagination and empathy.

    You’re missing out on the true wonders of the universe. Not some stupid (poorly translated) collection of fables that is hardly applicable to the modern world, but the joy of learning and discovery.

    And that, in short, is why I kind of pity you.

    *I’m also reading a book at the moment. Priorities and whatnot.

  149. Tom says

    A scientific law is something that was been proven time and time again and in no instance has it ever been proven wrong. And gravity acts on everything in the universe in the same way and has never been proven wrong therefore it is a scientific law.

    I have seen articles on the internet that says gravity is a law and articles that say it’s a theory.

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both? What about Newton’s law of universal gravitation. Don’t know for sure but I do know what goes up does come down and if it hits you on the head it might hurt.

  150. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    God -fucking- dammit! Sorry, The Pint!

    I am all sorts of cussin’ deficient today.

  151. Ing says

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both?

    Oh my god *facepalm*

    FUCKING MAGNETS HOW DO THEY WORK!?

    Theory of gravity: all objects with mass are attracted to each other (amended by relativity to explain that this is because mass bends space)

    Law of Gravity: Force of gravity is equally to the Gravitational Constant Times the product of the two masses being considered over the square of their distance apart

    One is the observation and model explaining the phenomena. the other is the math to quantify the observation.

    The law is PART of the theory.

    Also Magnets are not fucking involved in gravity…that’s why it’s considered a separate force. (fucking idiot). If you don’t know grade school science who are you to claim how viable evolution is?

  152. Dhorvath, OM says

    Tom,
    Gravity is caused by spacetime curvature with objects tending to minimize their energy by trying to approach the centre of any gravity well in their area. It’s not caused by magnetic force, it is gravitational force. Magnetism is carried by photons, gravity by gravitons, centrifugal force is really just inertia and isn’t carried by anything.
    The general theory of relativity, our best explanation of gravity is one of the two best tested realms of human understanding with accuracy of measurement in the ninth significant digit for many tests of it’s validity. In other words, our ability to test limits our ability to confirm it better, but it is a fact as much as anything we currently know. It’s also the driving force behind inflationary cosmology which is the current best theory on how the big bang started and evolved into the universe we know today.

  153. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Tom:

    A scientific law is something that was been proven time and time again and in no instance has it ever been proven wrong. And gravity acts on everything in the universe in the same way and has never been proven wrong therefore it is a scientific law.

    [citation needed]

    Come on. I showed you my cites, now you show me yours.

    (And, no, gravity doesn’t act the same way on all things in all circumstances. Try again.)

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both?

    OH MY GAWD. I actually loled!

    Seriously, Tom, you’re on the internet. Look this shit up for yourself. You’re just embarrassing yourself at this point.

  154. says

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both?

    Oh.Your.God. Magnets? Magnets?

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
    :gasp: Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha :thud:

    Jesus Fuck, dude – go get a 5th grade education. You’re in desperate need.

  155. Tom says

    I doubted the magnetic connection with gravity but it was mentioned in one article i read on the “theory of gavity” but did not see it in anyone on the law of gravity. so blame the f–king idot that wrote the article.

  156. Nerd of Redhead says

    A scientific law is something that was been proven time and time again and in no instance has it ever been proven wrong.

    No idjit fuckwit, it means an equation. We know that. Try Charles’ Law, Boyle’s law. Both fall under the Kinetic Theory of Gases, and explain pieces of the theory.

    Here’s some advice for your Tom. Don’t try to pretend you are smart here. Some of us teach/taught this for a living. You just lie and lie and lie. That’s all godbots can do. They can’t prove that their imaginary deity exists with solid physical evidence like an eternally burning bush, or that the babble is inerrant by showing conclusive physical evidence for the flud, exodus, or even jebus really existing. Pathetic Tom, pathetic.

  157. says

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both? What about Newton’s law of universal gravitation.

    Gravitons, according to the standard model.

    Like other virtual particles, they operate via momentum transfers.

    Glen Davidson

  158. says

    A scientific law is something that was been proven time and time again and in no instance has it ever been proven wrong. And gravity acts on everything in the universe in the same way and has never been proven wrong therefore it is a scientific law.

    Maybe I should say this slowly so you get it: A scientific law tells you WHAT will happen. A scientific theory tells you WHY what happened, happened. To use gravity as an example again:

    “When you hold toss a ball in the air, it will come back down again” = Law of Gravity.

    “A ball tossed in the air always comes back down again because any two particles of matter attract one another with a force directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them” = Theory of Gravitation

    Scientific theories are used to explain why scientific laws happen. It is not called a scientific theory until it has been repeatedly tested, observed and verified to the point where its veracity is confirmed by the best evidence available.

    Mankind exists. The theory of evolution is the best possible explanation for the existence of mankind, based on the available testable, verifiable evidence. The details of the theory of evolution are always being tweaked because we are constantly acquiring new evidence, but no empirical scientifically testable evidence has yet come to light that negates the overall framework of the theory of evolution.

    This is what differentiates scientific theory from philosophical theories – philosophical theories are based on ideas that cannot be quantified or empirically tested. You are continuing to equate scientific theory with scientific hypotheses and the scientific method with philosophical musing. Please stop.

  159. Dhorvath, OM says

    No, you accepted a single authority as being correct and quoted it to us. That is just the very thing that you were blasting us about up thread. You can’t shrug that off so cavalierly.

  160. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Sorry, I have to post this again:

    Is gravity caused by magnetic force centrifugal force or a combination of both?

    ♥ ♥ ♥!
    This is my new favorite thing. A while ago on the Bad Science forum, there was someone who claimed that the gas giants are “all rocks”*, but this… this is way more absurd.

    *Which quickly replaced herp a derp! between Mr Darkheart and I.

  161. Ing says

    I doubted the magnetic connection with gravity but it was mentioned in one article i read on the “theory of gavity” but did not see it in anyone on the law of gravity. so blame the f–king idot that wrote the article.

    No I blame the fucking idiot who can’t source worth a damn, and still thought it was centrifugal force.

    Of course you didn’t see it on the law because the law is just a fucking equation. The law is part of the theory.

  162. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Tom:

    so blame the f–king idot that wrote the article.

    Or the fucking idiot that took it for truth without researching further.

    Oh, that fucking idiot would be you, wouldn’t it, Tom?

  163. Ing says

    @Audley

    I suggest we summarize/paraphrase the “herpaderp” version into “GRAVITYMAGNETS!”

  164. says

    God -fucking- dammit! Sorry, The Pint!

    I am all sorts of cussin’ deficient today.

    Don’t make me break into the Jay and Silent Bob song. That will induce all sorts of brain bleed inducing pointless cussing. :)

    Jebus. I’m not even a trained scientist – I’m an ENGLISH MAJOR for Cthulhu’s sake! – and even I get the difference between general theory/scientific theory/scientific hypotheses/scientific law.

  165. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Ing:

    I suggest we summarize/paraphrase the “herpaderp” version into “GRAVITYMAGNETS!”

    I am so on board with this. To the meme machine!

    The Pint:

    I’m an ENGLISH MAJOR for Cthulhu’s sake! – and even I get the difference between general theory/scientific theory/scientific hypotheses/scientific law.

    Heh. College dropout, here, and I fucking get it.

  166. says

    Tom:

    I doubted the magnetic connection with gravity but it was mentioned in one article i read on the “theory of gavity” but did not see it in anyone on the law of gravity. so blame the f–king idot that wrote the article.

    Because there’s only one single article ever written on the theory of gravity available ever?!? Who was it again who was sanctimoniously asking if we ever questioned what we were told in class instead of going out and checking other sources?

    Audley:

    Or the fucking idiot that took it for truth without researching further.

    Oh, that fucking idiot would be you, wouldn’t it, Tom?

    There we go. That wasn’t so hard, now, was it? ;)

  167. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Tom,
    Once time, I read an article on the internet that claimed that the world was actually ruled by an ancient race of lizard people.

    Does that mean it’s true?

  168. says

    Audley:

    Oh, that fucking idiot would be you, wouldn’t it, Tom?

    Oy, I must stop laughing…hahahahahahahahaha.

    Poor Tom, can’t even lay the blame on the right idiot.

  169. Ing says

    Tom I don’t think you grasp the gravity of your mistake B)

    YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

  170. Tethys says

    I tried to wrap my brain around the gravity being caused by magnetic force or centrifugal force statement.

    But I just got flung out into space.

    Why do people think magnets cause gravity? Why?

  171. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Tethys:

    Why do people think magnets cause gravity? Why?

    Well, we know that at comment 140 Tom said:

    I DO MY OWN RESERCH

    So it seems that Tom isn’t very good at this RESERCHing business.

    (I’m sorry, in light of his last couple of posts, “I DO MY OWN RESERCH” is a lulz factory.)

  172. Owlmirror says

    Poor Tom.

    It kinda hurts when you’re attacked by the intelligent, educated segment of the culture.

    Y’know, I kinda suspect that the article did not actually say that gravity is caused by the magnetic force. It might have said that gravity is one of the fundamental physical forces — along with the electromagnetic force, the weak force, and the strong force.

    I could be wrong about that, of course. But until I see an actual link or citation from the page, I’m going to go with my hunch.

    See, the problem, I suspect, is not just that you don’t know science, but that you have trouble reading. I mean, when there’s a lot of complicated technical terms on a page, you might not understand exactly what all those words are saying. Sure, it can be tricky to read it. You might even give up and say “Well, the page I read said something like this,” and get the whole thing wrong. Reading carefully takes time, especially with a complex technical subject.

    Anyway, you might want to be more careful in how you read. And in what you write.

  173. Tethys says

    Barbs perching was a fun typo too.

    A few good laughs between the facepalms is always nice.

    But I have heard the gravity caused by magnets thing before.
    Gobsmacking amounts of ignorance.

  174. Owlmirror says

    Actually, Tom wrote “perching” first.

    I think Barbara realized it was misspelled, and was being facetious, hence the parentheses.

    I could be wrong about that, too.

  175. Tethys says

    Owlmirror

    After re-reading I realized my mistake. You are correct.

    I was going to answer Barb on why I hate Glenn Beck, but it seems rather pointless.

    He and Limbaugh always remind me of the pigs in Animal Farm.

  176. IslandBrewer says

    Well, if you put magnets in a centrifuge and turn it on, the gravity of the situation should become apparent.

  177. Carbon Based Life Form says

    Any one that can’t recognize intelligent design for what it is

    We know what intelligent design is. It arose after the U.S. Supreme Court ruled, in the case of Edwards v. Aguillard, 482 U.S. 578 (1987) that the teaching of creationism in American public schools is impermissible on First Amendment grounds. Specifically, it advanced the views of Evangelical Protestantism.

    So in order to get creationism into public school biology classes, the creationists stripped out all overt references to the Christian God, and substituted an otherwise unnamed “Intelligent Designer”. However, everyone knows exactly who this “Designer” is, and don’t expect us to believe for an instant that it isn’t.

    Thus, the proponents of intelligent design are falsely claiming that what they are touting is not creationism. In other words, there is a lie at the base of intelligent design. Why should we believe them when they are shown to be lying?

  178. Nerd of Redhead says

    So in order to get creationism into public school biology classes, the creationists stripped out all overt references to the Christian God, and substituted an otherwise unnamed “Intelligent Designer”. However, everyone knows exactly who this “Designer” is, and don’t expect us to believe for an instant that it isn’t.

    The court decision Kitzmiller v. Dover and the evidence presented during the trial proved this the world. ID is son of creationism, both intellectually and legally. Only a delusional fool would say otherwise.

  179. Carbon Based Life Form says

    Once time, I read an article on the internet that claimed that the world was actually ruled by an ancient race of lizard people.

    That claim is made by the Englishman David Icke, who says that the reptilian rulers of the Earth include George H. W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II and Boxcar Willie.

  180. SallyStrange, Spawn of Cthulhu says

    GRAVITYMAGNETS

    I DO MY OWN RESERCH

    Thanks, Glenn Beck, for sending your minions bearing these fantastical gems of humor for our pleasure. Perhaps you aren’t completely useless after all.

  181. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    CBLF:

    That claim is made by the Englishman David Icke, who says that the reptilian rulers of the Earth include George H. W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II and Boxcar Willie.

    Ha! I knew that I had seen that claim floating around somewhere. Thanks for the link. :)

  182. Quodlibet says

    So sorry I missed this thread last night… Hilarious! The tears were running down my face I was laughing so hard. But ultimately it’s so sad, so pathetic, and a more than a little frightening. These people are so hopelessly and willfully ignorant and don’t want to be enlightened. These are the sorts of people who will flock to the U.S. polls to elect ignorant, bigoted, religious zealots who will shape America’s public policy and represent us to the world.

    Still…so, so, funny!!

    I have to say, that exchange on GRAVITYMAGNETS reminded me of Mesmer and Mesmerism…makes just about as much sense!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franz_Mesmer

    Is there a Pharyngula Hall of Fame for Best Threads Evar? I nominate this one!

  183. heliobates says

    Fact one for me is that I am here.
    Fact two is there is a God.
    Fact three you are not him.
    Fact four All who believe in God have no problem humbling themselves before Him and acknowledging that He is in control.

    “I am Pettitio Principii. Hear me roar!”

  184. Little Pemo says

    Something clicked for me when I read about this whole gravity/magnets thing. I used to browse RationalWiki, and they recorded how Conservapedia had a sort of jihad against general relativity. Really. The only conceivable reason why they hate it is because they are confusing it with relativism in a philosophical sense, which is pretty fucking stupid. Anyway, they are convinced it’s wrong as they are about evolution. Of course, since general relativity serves as the modern explanation for gravity, there’s a vacuum left in conservative physics that has to be filled with something, anything. Since the Bible doesn’t have an answer, people like our friend here must have stumbled upon that most effective tool for bewildering the simple-minded: the magnet.

  185. IndyM says

    This was a brilliantly funny thread. But Pharyngulites, you use WAY too many Big Words for the Cre(a)ti(o)n(ist)s! As evidenced by Tom et al., I suspect that the Beckwits don’t have much more than a 5th grade understanding of science (if even that)–how are they going to understand your beautiful explanations and ripostes?

    And why is it that none of the Beckwits can manage proper spelling, punctuation, and grammar…? Then again, I would not give back the gifts of “I DO MY OWN RESERCH” and “perching.”

  186. Amvik says

    I also liked this little gem from Tom @140:

    I read different interpretation of the bible and read opinions from different bible scholars then I make an informed decision.

    Top. Men.

  187. chigau says

    Why do people think magnets cause gravity? Why?

    Because the earth has a magnetic field.
    And we stick to the earth because we have iron in our blood.
    Do I get a cookie?

  188. IndyM says

    Chigau:

    You get the whole fucking cookie jar (homemade) plus the Internetz. Where would you like these delivered?

  189. IndyM says

    Katherine: Yay for Gravatar kitties!

    Another OT question (I’m relatively new to Pharyngula): I’ve noticed that a number of the commentariat have a French phrase after their nym. I think it’s awesome, but I was wondering why this tradition exists–was it the result of some memorable event/thread on the blog?

  190. says

    @IndyM:

    There was a series of MRA rantings in one of the threads on the Sciblogs and some of his misogynist insults were turned into badges of honor and translated into French.

    Mine is because I wanted to add “Pet Kitty of Death” to the end of my nym, but thought it would sounds more awesome in French.

  191. IndyM says

    Katherine: That’s all very cool: the MRA smackdown, the French, and your nym (as well as your picture). Thanks for the explanation–I’m sorry I missed that thread! :)

  192. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Amvik:

    Top. Men.

    *snerk!*

    Tommy claims he can make an “informed decision” when it comes to different interpretations of made up shit. Should we trust his RESERCH or should we assume that he’s just looking at different versions of My First Illustrated Bible™?

  193. says

    @IndyM:

    You probably aren’t sorry you missed that thread, so far that most MRA threads tend to be a thousand posts of banging your head on a brick wall XD

    But thank you thank you :) I am quite happy about the picture, it totally makes me feel and look girly, ehe.

  194. Dan Nunley says

    A group of atheists have filed a lawsuit to prevent the inclusion of the historic Ground Zero Cross at the 9/11 Memorial & Museum. We have learned from their lawsuit that they, “have suffered, are suffering, and will continue to suffer damages, both physical and emotional, from the existence of the challenged cross.” Atheists have reportedly endured cross-induced, “dyspepsia [upset stomach], symptoms of depression, headaches, anxiety, and mental pain and anguish.”

    In order to ensure that atheists in America never again experience any of the aforementioned ailments, I need your assistance in writing “The Complete Idiot’s Guide to Protecting American Atheists.”

    To help you get started, I’ve identified things that must be removed or altered immediately to rectify the government’s continued disregard for the hurt feelings of godless Americans.

    -The new Martin Luther King Jr. National Memorial includes much of “Dr. King’s Spiritual Presence” by permanently inscribing portions of his sermons on the memorial inscription wall

    -The Ground Zero Cross at the 9/11 Memorial and Museum.

    -The National Motto: “In God We Trust”

    -“Under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance

    -The National Day of Prayer

    -“Seven in Heaven Way” street sign honoring seven firefighters who made the ultimate sacrifice on 9/11

    -Original copies of the Declaration of Independence in the National Archives, which reference “our Creator” and “Nature’s God”

    -The Chaplains Corps of each branch of the U.S. Military

    -All “Religious” Artwork in the National Gallery of Art

    -The Latin phrase “Laus Deo [Praise be to God]” on the cap of the Washington Monument

    -Surviving copies of The National Anthem, which includes the phrase “In God is our trust”

    -On the Lincoln Memorial are etched the word of the Gettysburg Address (“this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom”) and his Second Inaugural Address (“with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right,”) which are replete with references to God

    -The Jefferson Memorial’s dome includes this inscription about God, “I have sworn upon the altar of god eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.” There are other references to God in the memorial

    -On the Tomb of the Unknowns at Arlington National Cemetery is inscribed, “Here rests in honored glory an American soldier known but to God”

    -The federal courthouse containing the Court of Appeals and the Federal District Court for the District of Columbia contains a sculpture, which includes a cross and the Ten Commandments

    -The south frieze of the U.S. Supreme Court Courtroom depicts Moses holding the Ten Commandments

    -The metal gates on the north and south sides of the U.S. Supreme Court Courtroom contain the Ten Commandments, as well as the doors leading to the courtroom

    -The east facade of the outside of the Supreme Court shows Moses holding the Ten Commandments

    -The Library of Congress Jefferson Building contains a large statue of Moses holding the Ten Commandments and the Apostle Paul over looking the rotunda

    -Inscribed on the wall of the Cox Corridors of the U.S. Capitol is the phrase “America! God shed his grace on Thee”

    -The chamber of the U.S. House of Representatives features Moses.

    -The Prayer Room of the U.S. Capitol contains the phrase “Annuit coeptis” (translated “God has favored our undertakings”) and the words of Psalm 16:1

    -The House Chamber of the U.S. Capitol contains the National Motto “In God we trust”

    -Inscribed in the Senate Chamber of the U.S. Capitol are the phrase “Annuit coeptis” (translated “God has favored our undertakings”) and the National Motto “In God we trust”

    -The Emancipation Proclamation featured in the National Archives invoking “gracious favor of Almighty God”

    -The United States Department of Veterans Affairs chaplains program

    -“Christmas” and “Thanksgiving” are official federal government holidays

    -The U.S. Constitution itself references “Year of our Lord”

    -Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States, 143 U.S. 457 (1892), where the Supreme Court declared that “this is a Christian nation”

    -Zorach v. Clauson, 343 U.S. 306 (1952), where the Supreme Court declared, “We are a religious people whose institutions presuppose a Supreme Being”

    -The Normandy American Cemetery and Memorial with thousands of white crosses over each of the graves represented at that cemetery

    -Arlington National Cemetery is replete with religious symbolism complete with a list of authorized religious emblems

    Please leave your additions to “The Complete Idiot’s Guide to Protecting American Atheists” in the comments section below.

    Together, we can protect atheists from references to American history.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/religious-right-now/post/the-complete-idiots-guide-to-protecting-american-atheists/2011/08/12/gIQA8Fd5AJ_blog.html

  195. IndyM says

    Katherine:

    I hear you–I slogged through the whole Rebecca Watson debacle. Despite having to endure the utter idiocy of the MRA contributions to those threads, I was so in awe of the Pharyngulite response (I had just started following Pharyngula at that time). The commentariat is amazing here.

    Btw, I took a quick peek at your blog, and I think you have perfectly lovely shoulders. Just flaunt it all, girl! Enjoy yourself! :)

  196. says

    Dan Nunley,

    We’ll do one better! We’ll expose Christians to Native American religions since that is important in American History too! If you’re going to advocate religion, you need to advocate all of them.

    (Copy-Paste trolls are so stupid.)

  197. says

    Kitty,

    I hope you’re merely reprinting, and not in support of that blog, Dan.

    I’m a bit more cynical. I just assume it was a smug troll.

    Dan, you should also have no objects to atheist billboards, but I bet you do.

  198. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Katherine Lorraine

    I always translate your title as “deaths kitten”. Which makes me snortle because I love Terry Pratchett and I have an overactive imagination.

  199. 'smee says

    Dear Kitty of Death@260

    If you ever find out how to keep your stubble away for more than a few hours…. PATENT then PUBLISH!

    You will make a MINT! (which you can then use to found the Maison au Chatons de la Mort)

  200. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Dan,
    TL;DR. You mind condensing that wall o’ text down a little bit? I’m on break and can’t waste my precious time on a (n obvious) copy-pasta screed.

    Oh and PS: we already had a thread about that lawsuit. Try to stay on topic and do try to keep up, dumpling.

  201. IndyM says

    Katherine: What ‘smee said. You’re not the only one fighting stubble… :) And don’t be so hard on yourself: go forth and be gorgeous!

    Tethys: I so wish I had discovered Pharyngula earlier. (And your nym is great, too.)

  202. Dan Nunley says

    Gyeong,

    You would be wrong then because I fully support freedom of speech for all. The public forum should be a free marketplace of ideas. If atheists want to put up billboards saying there is no God, I say go for it because I’m not the least bit threatened by those billboards. But just remember, free speech and tolerance applies to all, even to those with whom you disagree.

  203. IndyM says

    Dan

    I don’t think Gyeong needed to be reminded that “free speech and tolerance applies to all, even to those with whom you disagree.” Dingleberry.

  204. says

    @Dan:

    Lots of us agree, and a lot of us are in disagreement with Dan Silverman over this (and other) lawsuits.

    What Christians think atheists want is all Christianity destroyed, but what we want is for government not to seem to be preferential towards a religion. So yes, government mandated day of prayer, “In God We Trust” on our money – get rid of those. A Christian cross on a church, a Muslim prayer room in a community center – couldn’t give a damn.

  205. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    I see no reason to tolerate hypocrisy. Mocking hypocrites who are doing their best to turn my country into a parody of its supposed ideals is self-defense, and righteous.

  206. chigau () says

    IndyM
    My ‘nym means “different” in Japanese.
    Sometimes it can also mean “wrong”.

  207. Dan Nunley says

    So free speech only for those who agree with you? No toleration of dissenting opinions or beliefs? That’s diametrically opposed to your country’s “supposed ideals.” Sounds more like what you’d expect in a repressive dictatorship.

  208. Patricia, OM says

    Reminding us just how gawd soaked America is won’t win you any friends here fuckwit.

  209. says

    Dan,

    But just remember, free speech and tolerance applies to all, even to those with whom you disagree.

    I am the last person you should be lecturing about that, surgarpie. But you should know that many of the people who think that Christian iconography should stay also believe any other sort of religious/non-religious expression should be banned.
    I’m sorry I mistook you for such a person, but this hypocritical sentiment by many Christian is common enough to where my trigger-finger fire was justifiable.

  210. Aquaria says

    You make comments here everyone gets to comment on them, fuckface.

    Don’t like it? Fuck off back to your brainless Jeebusland.

  211. IndyM says

    Caine: Thank you! I will check out that thread (and join the TET). (I’m at the office and have gotten no work done; I’ve been reading Pharyngula all day…)

    Chigau: That’s exactly what I thought–I lived in Tokyo for a few years, and “chigau” was a handy phrase.

  212. Doug Little says

    Dan the Man sez,

    So free speech only for those who agree with you? No toleration of dissenting opinions or beliefs?

    Who the fuck said that. You are free to say silly things and we are free to smack you down for it. The first amendment does not guarantee freedom from hurt feelings when we call you on your bullshit.

  213. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Dan

    Free speech was not mentioned in my post. The hypocrisy part is “christians” who supposedly worship a god of love but are completely fine with marginalizing gays because the bible tells them so.

    Or where IDiots try to get nonsense taught in schools instead of actual science or history.

    Or when “christians” espouse tolerance….but only for their viewpoint.

    and so on.

  214. Dan Nunley says

    What’s with the rudeness and profane language in the comments from Patricia, OM (“fuckwit”) and Aquaria (“fuckface”)? Is that a typical reaction of atheists’ to something with which they disagree?

  215. says

    You would be wrong then because I fully support freedom of speech for all. The public forum should be a free marketplace of ideas.

    you better not be one of those hypocrites who says that, but would freak out if people demanded teaching Hindu creationism instead of science, would never support currency having anything other than “God” (rather than “Allah”, “Buddha”, “Tawa”, etc.), and has been whining about “creeping Sharia”…

  216. says

    He tone trolls as well – bless his cotton socks. I can make it a trinity of profanity and call you a fucktard if you like?

    And no, it’s a reaction to people being condescending morons: people disagree with each other on Pharyngula all the time.

  217. Amvik says

    What’s with the rudeness and profane language in the comments from Patricia, OM (“fuckwit”) and Aquaria (“fuckface”)?

    We need a fainting couch! STAT!

  218. says

    GASP! Rudeness and profanity! *clutches her pearls and faints on the fainting couch!*

    Fuck off if you can’t handle language. Don’t let the use of such language, however, make you miss the meaning behind the posts.

    At this point you’re sounding like a troll, and should probably make a good point or understand what points have been presented to you.

  219. Patricia, OM says

    You really don’t want to bait Tethys, moron. But, just in case you are actually that stoopid, I’ll make some popcorn.

  220. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    @Dan: You do realise that free speech is not an absolute right? All kinds of restrictions are placed upon it. For example (in case you can’t think of one yourself): it is illegal to perjure yourself in court. Your government also has restrictions on its freedom of expression. One of them is that it is not allowed by law to endorse a specific religion. Governments are not infallible. In the past, the line may have been crossed, but that doesn’t mean that the government now should not strive to follow the law.

    p.s. In case you’re wondering, I think that neither the Seven of Heaven Way or the 9/11 cross in the memorial museum are violations of Church/State separation.

  221. Amvik says

    You would be wrong then because I fully support freedom of speech for all.

    So, you support the Ground Zero mosque?

  222. Dan Nunley says

    Hey Doug,

    You and I agree on something because I find myself often telling my whiny liberal friends that there’s no constitutional guarantee of freedom from offense. And thanks to my thick skin, my feelings rarely get hurt.

  223. Patricia, OM says

    Dan – yes, it’s typical for me to call christians, child molesters, and mormons fuckwits. Truth hurt?

  224. Nerd of Redhead says

    No toleration of dissenting opinions or beliefs?

    No toleration of unevidenced opinions or beliefs. Keep in mind a working definition of delusional thinking is belief without evidence. Like with your imaginary deity and mythical/fictional holy books. Care to show any solid and conclusive physical evidence to back up your statements? Or, are they delusional lack of thinking?

  225. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    @patricia

    Well, it is getting close to the full moon. The weresquid is hungry for some christian hypocrite.

  226. says

    Dan,

    What’s with the rudeness and profane language in the comments from Patricia, OM (“fuckwit”) and Aquaria (“fuckface”)? Is that a typical reaction of atheists’ to something with which they disagree?

    Rudeness has no baring on whether a person is wrong or right. (Also atheist/agnostics/irreligious disagree with each other all the time.)

    But if it helps just replace every swear word you see with kitten and puppies. You will see that it still doesn’t change the meaning of the statement.

    To Patricia and Aquaria: Ladies, your vulgarity gives people teh sads. ;)

  227. strange gods before me says

    -The new Martin Luther King Jr. National Memorial includes much of “Dr. King’s Spiritual Presence” by permanently inscribing portions of his sermons on the memorial inscription wall

    Dan, I’d like to introduce you to the Lemon test. Study it and relevant case law; you’ll find that several of your examples would pass the test, while several others would not. It’s complicated, but you’ll learn something.

  228. strange gods before me says

    Also atheist/agnostics/irreligious disagree with each other all the time.)

    Nuh uh.

  229. Amvik says

    And thanks to my thick skin, my feelings rarely get hurt.

    Comment 286 notwithstanding.

  230. says

    You and I agree on something because I find myself often telling my whiny liberal friends that there’s no constitutional guarantee of freedom from offense

    You realize that we are all aware of that don’t you. Using a straw man liberal isn’t going to work here.

  231. Patricia, OM says

    I’m disappointed, not one Poofdamned bible quote in the whole thread. Becks trolls really suck.

  232. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    Oh, and here are some pearls to clutch in case you’re feeling faint.

    [aside] My gravitymagnets are getting all out of whack being exposed to all the irony of someone complaining that atheists want to restrict free speech while getting all flustered at the use of the word ‘fuck’. Fuck. [/aside]

  233. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Dan,

    What’s with the rudeness and profane language in the comments from Patricia, OM (“fuckwit”) and Aquaria (“fuckface”)?

    Awe, somebody’s widdle fewwing got hurt. Uno momento, I’m calling the WAAAAAAAAAAH-mbulance just for you!

    (Tone trolling, the sure sign that you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.)

  234. Dan Nunley says

    Amvik, I wouldn’t say that I “support” the Ground Zero mosque because I’m not Muslim. However, I don’t oppose the building of the Ground Zero mosque because the U.S. Constitution extends the freedom of religion to all faiths. I think it would be a gracious display of sensitivity for the Muslims to build the mosque a little farther away from Ground Zero out of respect for the families of those killed there, but that’s not my decision to make.

  235. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    @Dan But what about the Muslims who were killed there and their families. Isn’t insensitive to them to call building the mosque there disrespectful? Oh, and building a community centre *outside the community* would be eminently practical, don’t you think? I guess you also believe it’s insensitive to have any Christian churches anywhere near the Oklahoma City bomb site?

  236. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Uh huh + infinity! You can’t beat that!

    Deep rifts!

  237. Sili says

    I’m disappointed, not one Poofdamned bible quote in the whole thread. Becks trolls really suck.

    Why would Becktrolls look to the Bible? Last I checked, the Bible didn’t say anything about Jesus hanging around the Americas before going on his space trip to Colob.

    It does have something to say about false prophets, though.

  238. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Dan

    Still waiting to see if you understand the hypocrisy issue?

    Are you operating under the assumption that the USA is founded on “Christian” ideals?

  239. IndyM says

    Dan

    What Ibis3 said exactly.

    And why are you painting all Muslims with the same brush? It was a terrorist group from an extremist sect that was responsible for 9/11.

  240. SteveM says

    re 252:

    -“Christmas” and “Thanksgiving” are official federal government holidays

    Thanksgiving is not a religious holiday, even though many religions celebrate it. It is purely AMERICAN and deserves to be a federal holiday. It is not just “Thanks to God” but “Thanks to Nature (and each other)” for producing a bountiful harvest.

  241. Patricia, OM says

    Sili – What? You mean Beck’s trolls are magical underpants consumers? *gasp*

  242. Dan Nunley says

    Strange gods,

    Yes, I’m familiar with Lemon v. Kurtzman from my con law class during my first year of law school. Not one of the Supreme’s most well reasoned holdings in my opinion. Internally inconsistent.

    I have to get some work done now but I’ve really enjoyed the give and take. I’ll be back.

  243. IslandBrewer says

    Shit! Activity!

    Ok, for Dan I got a Strawman, Tone trolling, Copy/paste arguments. Two more for bingo. Did I miss any?

  244. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Chigau,

    The poll was made to sow discord amongst the atheists!

    I think you’re giving The Blaze’s writers faaaaaaaaaaar too much credit.

    :P

  245. 'smee says

    Tone-troll fucks off in search of safe ground.

    buh-bye, Dan. Don’t let the fucking door hurt your poor benighted ass on your way out.

    On topic – where *are* all the Christians? I needs me some munchies! (Even Mmmmormon-Mmmmunchies™ … less filling! even more crunch!)

  246. Sili says

    Are you operating under the assumption that the USA is founded on “Christian” ideals?

    Well, you did get a good headstart due to the slavery, so I think it’s fair cop to say that the US was founded on Christian ideas.

  247. Sili says

    Sili – What? You mean Beck’s trolls are magical underpants consumers? *gasp*

    Would a good Christian mindlessly follow a heretic? Doesn’t the Bible have something to say about people who follow false gods?

  248. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Dan

    If you actually are attempting to understand rather than just being a troll, I suggest the documentary “Lord Save Us From Your Followers”. The game show sequence is particularly enlightening.

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1237900/

  249. Wylann says

    The court decision Kitzmiller v. Dover and the evidence presented during the trial proved this the world. ID is son of creationism, both intellectually and legally. Only a delusional fool would say otherwise.

    You might even say that evolved from creationism.

    Amvik:

    It’s because of the tides, isn’t it?

    Holy shit. I’m glad I wasn’t drinking anything when I read that.

    This thread has provided some great comedy. Someone see if you can lure some more stoopid into the other one.
    strange gods:

    It’s complicated, but you’ll learn something.

    I’ll take that bet. What odds would you like?

  250. 'smee says

    I just had a thought?

    Are GRAVITYMAGNETS responsible for the fact that most trolls don’t come back? Initially they are ATTRACTED by our dazzling repartee, then their unwavering FIELD of FUTILITY is REPULSED by our ATHEISTIC FANATICISM?

    Or some kinda shit like that?

    Trolls always fuck with my IQ.

    Don’t worry, tho’. My IQ will come back (unlike the troll).

  251. Patricia, OM says

    ‘smee – plain christians are just like eating plain babies. Bland and boring, what you really want is either a Good Christian or a True Christian. Nothing beats a butter basted True Christain roasted in hell-fire.

  252. McWaffle says

    Although, for a troll that lead with a huge copy-pasted list, he certainly had a pretty reasonable opinion on the “Ground Zero” “Mosque”(though still some fauxtrage, but that’s the same fauxtrage I had to fight against at the Daily Kos).

  253. Patricia, OM says

    Would a Good Christian mindlessly follow a heretic?

    Damn it Sili, you made me laugh so hard the dog started barking.

  254. 'smee says

    Isn’t that a CHRISTMAS song???

    Christians roasting on an open fire,
    their jack boots kicking on the floor,
    Yuletide choirs being strung up from a wire
    and folks dressed up like gangsta hoes

    At least I think those are the words….

  255. AmVik says

    Amvik, I wouldn’t say that I “support” the Ground Zero mosque because I’m not Muslim.

    That’s bullshit. I’m not Muslim either, yet I support their right to build a mosque wherever the local zoning laws will permit. What does being Muslim have to do with it? I’m not gay, yet fully support gay marriage rights. I’m not a woman, but support their rights to abort unwanted pregnancies. There are many examples.

    You don’t have to be a member of a group to support the rights of that group.

  256. Mak says

    AmVik:

    That’s bullshit. … You don’t have to be a member of a group to support the rights of that group.

    Maybe it’s a fear of associating with icky sticky muslims who insult people just by existing, or something.

    The good Judeo-Christian (lol) families get respect, but the muslim families get shunned and kicked the fuck out of their own community. That’s some great “respect” and “sensitivity” ya got there, Dan.

  257. says

    You and I agree on something because I find myself often telling my whiny liberal friends that there’s no constitutional guarantee of freedom from offense

    You realize that we are all aware of that don’t you. Using a straw man liberal isn’t going to work here.

    five bucks says he’s referring to things like slurs and verbal bullying/harassment, as well as things such as “under god” in the Pledge of Allegiance.

    I think it would be a gracious display of sensitivity for the Muslims to build the mosque a little farther away from Ground Zero out of respect for the families of those killed there

    ROTFLMAO

  258. IslandBrewer says

    Dear Dan,

    Your smug little remarks and self-satisfied cleverness have nearly persuaded me.

    I am on the verge of turning away from this aweful, aweful, smutty, lesbian-porn-ridden, bacon wrapped atheism to True Christianity (TM) … or Mormonism … or whatever the hell you’re peddling. (You’ve never explicitly stated your presumed religious beliefs.)

    All you need to do is come back and post more witty repartee and show these horrible atheists just how clever you really are!!!

    Please!

    No really! I’m not saying this just because I’m bored and want entertainment. I really really do think you’re every bit as clever as your are in your own mind, sincerely I do.

    Your friend in (Jesus/Jeebus/GAWD/GWAR/Ahuru Mazda/Ahurua Nissan/Odin/Vishnu/Cthulhu/Hastur/FSM/Zeus/Jupiter/Set/Bast/Kali/Tezcatlipoca/Moroni),
    IslandBrewer

    P.S. Yay, Gravitars work!

  259. Brownian says

    I think it would be a gracious display of sensitivity for the Muslims to build the mosque a little farther away from Ground Zero out of respect for the families of those killed there.

    If Christians were equally sensitive to the families and descendants of those killed by Christians, there’d be no churches anywhere.

    Great idea, Dan!

  260. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    build the mosque a little farther away from Ground Zero

    Saudi Arabia is probably far enough away for Dan.

  261. Sili says

    The religious tradition that I grew up in actually worked hard to end slavery.

    1) Quakers are hardly Christians.

    2) Abolitionism is anti-Biblical.

  262. Sili says

    Ooops. Sorry. I seem to have misfiled The Religious Society of Friends in my little brain.

    Still. The Bible advocates slavery.

  263. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Sili

    Yes, the bible does advocate slavery.

    “The Friends” do not accept the bible as dogma. Its a rather unusual religious tradition. Very skeptical and very anti-hierarchy.

    Now if they would just eject the rest of the superstitious nonsense.

  264. Dan Nunley says

    Oh ‘smee. Sorry to disappoint you but I didn’t “fuck off in search of safe ground.” I left for awhile because I actually work for a living. And now that I’m all finished with my day’s work, I’m back just like I said I would be. No flouncing here Le Havre en Chêne.

    Hey AmVik, just like many of your fellow atheists got all bent out of shape earlier today when they accused me of misreading, you need to go back and read what I said which is that I don’t oppose the building of the mosque at Ground Zero. The Constitution gives Muslims the right to build a mosque. As long as they comply with local zoning and regulations, build away because I’m not standing in their way. Capish? However, that doesn’t mean that I have to support the building of the mosque which I don’t because I don’t believe in the teachings of Islam. I also wouldn’t support the building of a synagogue because I’m not Jewish, but I wouldn’t oppose the building of they synagogue. The word “support” as I was using it indicates active encouragement in order to further the beliefs or activities of the organization. Support and non-opposition are two completely different things. Surely that’s not too difficult a concept for you to understand.

    Brownian, no, Saudi Arabia wasn’t the locale of which I was thinking. A couple of miles is more along the lines of what I had in mind. It’s not like this is the only mosque in New York, you know. Recent reports say there’s over 100 mosques in New York City with 17 alone in Manhattan.

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic. I thought you hated organized religion and anything to do with God. Doesn’t your hate extend to Allah and Mohammad? If I were a betting man, I’d bet that what’s happening here is just all a part of your favorite game which is to attack Christianity whenever possible. So I come along and you think I’m a Christian so you sprint to your old, tired, predictable bag of tricks and proceed to malign Christianity even if that means appearing to support another religion. Yessiree IslandBrewer, I do think that I’m rather clever for having figured that out!

    Don’t think that I’ve overlooked Patricia, OM. I haven’t. It’s just that I’ve decided that she and her childish blather are best ignored.

    Lastly, why is it that all of you atheists hide behind pseudonyms and gravatars instead of using your real identities? What are you hiding? Are you ashamed of having the things you say here linked up to your real identity? You talk real tough from behind the curtain, I’ll give you that. But really all I’ve seen so far is just a bunch of sad, pathetic, cowardly, narcissistic fools.

    Now I’m going to leave again and take my lovely family out to dinner and a movie. Ciao losers.

  265. Nerd of Redhead says

    Ciao losers.

    The only loser here is you. But then, we aren’t different from any other blog you infest with your idiocy and pathetic logic….

  266. Dhorvath, GravityMagnet says

    Hey Dan,
    Fear of repercussions is not the same as shame. Hiding is sometimes a good idea from a professional or meat space social standpoint. Not all of us can afford for a boss or family member to know how we feel about things as it may result in loss of employment or living support. If you have never thought of this idea before welcome to the club, I just use a nym because I like the idea of choosing an evocative and cumbersome title while online, and didn’t realize until I started posting here how serious other people can take personal web interactions.

  267. amphiox says

    Oh ‘smee. Sorry to disappoint you but I didn’t “fuck off in search of safe ground.” I left for awhile because I actually work for a living. And now that I’m all finished with my day’s work, I’m back just like I said I would be. No flouncing here Le Havre en Chêne.

    The act of “flouncing” is the act of announcing you are leaving in a manner as if the act of leaving itself was somehow making some sort of point.

    The claimed reason for leaving is totally irrelevant.

    It’s the act of pathetic, attention-craving, immature, narcissitic fools, who can’t resist crying “look at me! look at me! pay attention to me, even though i have to leave! i have to get the last word in even when i’m leaving! i’m so important that everyone has to know that i’m going away!”

    Now I’m going to leave again and take my lovely family out to dinner and a movie. Ciao losers.

    Exactly like this.

    Normal commenters, with healthy degrees of self-esteem, don’t make flounce announcements like that. We just go away without comment when we need to, and come back and comment again when we wish. The time stamps on our comments give all the information concerning this that anyone else will ever need.

    But really all I’ve seen so far is just a bunch of sad, pathetic, cowardly, narcissistic fools.

    You’ve been looking into the mirror a lot, haven’t you? I congratulate you on the level of self-awareness you demonstrate.

    The first step in self-improvement is admitting that you have a problem.

    Bravo!

  268. IslandBrewer says

    What? Who supported Islam, here? Does religion always dull reading comprehension?

    And Ulgaa, that Dan Nunley couldn’t possibly be the the same, as the Okie attorney is obviously a xian, while this one is chastising us for assuming he’s a xian, implying he isn’t. Unless he’s being a dishonest sack of shit. And True Xians don’t ever lie, EVAR!

  269. amphiox says

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic.

    Because in addition to being atheists, most of us here are humanists. Indeed most of us are humanists first, and atheists second. Which means we support the right of everyone to worship as they please, so long as (and this is the key point which you from your comments seem not to have gotten) in doing so they do not infringe on anyone else’s rights.

    I thought you hated organized religion and anything to do with God. Doesn’t your hate extend to Allah and Mohammad?

    Allah and God don’t exist. Why would we hate a figment of the imagination?

    What we hate are people who do evil things and excuse themselves using the imaginary figments of God/Allah/etc. People like Glen Beck. People sort of like you.

    Neither do we hate organized religion. We just think it’s silly.

    What we do hate is organized religion that uses its power to hide child rapists from justice, encourage suicide bombers, subvert and weaken the science teaching of our children, oppress minorities, restrict access to proper health care for women. In other words, we hate organized religion that does EVIL in the name of its gods.

  270. AmVik says

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic.

    It’s just an effective method of exposing your hypocrisy.

  271. Mak says

    Capish?

    http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/capiche

    The word “support” as I was using it indicates active encouragement in order to further the beliefs or activities of the organization.

    That you chose to use a different, very specific usage of “support” than the rest of us isn’t our fault.

    A couple of miles is more along the lines of what I had in mind.

    How did you come to that distance? Why don’t the muslim families get the same respect as the rest of the families who lost loved ones? Are you saying all muslims are accountable for what happened? Does it only apply to buying real estate or should they hide themselves entirely so as not to offend people with their presence? Does this apply to Christians who commit atrocities in the name of their religion, too? Doesn’t this mean that your talk of respect and sensitivity is just a disingenuous attempt to justify your bigotry?

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic. I thought you hated organized religion and anything to do with God.

    Yes, we totally support anything Islamic (because only muslims have community centers), including the shit we find detestable and fight against oh wait what?

    I’m not sure why you’re conflating people with a belief system, though, or why it’s such a shock that we see muslims as human beings, too.

    I’d bet that what’s happening here is just all a part of your favorite game which is to attack Christianity whenever possible.

    Yes, Dan, treating muslims as human beings with the same rights as everyone else is attacking Christianity. Why do you think that letting muslims own a community center in New York is an attack on Christianity, Dan?

    Lastly, why is it that all of you atheists hide behind pseudonyms and gravatars instead of using your real identities?

    ARTISTIC EXPRESSION IS FOR COWARDLY LOSERS!

    I’m so glad that you don’t have to worry about being shat on by everyone in your community because of your religious beliefs, or lack thereof. Thanks for shoving your privilege around like a giant asshole, though.

  272. 'smee says

    Dapper Dan, the concerned man, lives under a misapprehension. He thinks we hate[d] organized religion and anything to do with God. Doesn’t your hate extend to Allah and Mohammad?

    Actually we hate the establishment of religion. We hate the assumed privilege of religion. We hate the assumed superiority of the religious. We hate the attempts by the religious to impose their barbaric bronze-age behaviors upon the rest of us.

    But we don’t hate religious people, as a whole. Only individually. Such as, when they demonstrate hateful behaviors.

    You are not hated. I find you quite funny (in a despairingly sad way), to be honest. Funny, that is, except for your condescending attitude, your hair splitting re support for, and how far away you want, the GZ mosque to be before you’ll consider it OK. That you want it to move AT ALL tells me how committed you are to equality and free speech!

    So, enjoy your family dinner and a movie. I take it you are not going to see the Smurfs. I hear there is a Wizard, and talk of SPELLS. You might be drawn to the dark side!

  273. says

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic. I thought you hated organized religion and anything to do with God. Doesn’t your hate extend to Allah and Mohammad? If I were a betting man, I’d bet that what’s happening here is just all a part of your favorite game which is to attack Christianity whenever possible. So I come along and you think I’m a Christian so you sprint to your old, tired, predictable bag of tricks and proceed to malign Christianity even if that means appearing to support another religion. Yessiree IslandBrewer, I do think that I’m rather clever for having figured that out!

    Are you kidding? We attack Islam all the time. Learn a little history about the blog before you make generalization.

    Don’t think that I’ve overlooked Patricia, OM. I haven’t. It’s just that I’ve decided that she and her childish blather are best ignored.

    I will keep this in mind for. . .

    Lastly, why is it that all of you atheists hide behind pseudonyms and gravatars instead of using your real identities? What are you hiding? Are you ashamed of having the things you say here linked up to your real identity? You talk real tough from behind the curtain, I’ll give you that.

    A “real name” could be fabricated easily. And those who have posted under real names have been sent death threats.

    But really all I’ve seen so far is just a bunch of sad, pathetic, cowardly, narcissistic fools.

    . . .Yup I was right. You’re projecting.

    Now I’m going to leave again and take my lovely family out to dinner and a movie. Ciao losers.

    Ohh you are so cool. (I’m being sarcastic.)
    By show of hand, how many Pharyngulistas are married and have families? Wait, what is that? A significant number of you?
    I find it telling that you have lost an argument and resorted into a childish “I’m better than you” stance, after you complained about people being vulgar. I feel bad for your kids.

  274. says

    Lastly, why is it that all of you atheists hide behind pseudonyms and gravatars instead of using your real identities?

    You’re quite the idiot, aren’t you? One of those extra spayshul dense ones, who gets stupider every time you attempt to score a point.

    Here’s a bit of news for you, Cupcake: for many people, it’s basic safety to use a nym on the net. Back in my usenet days, when I used my real name, I had the joy of dealing with a stalker who showed up in my every day life, rather than just stalking me on the net.

    Now, as I do business on the net, my identity is not exactly difficult to find, it’s a mere mouse click away, actually, which you’d know about me and a lot of other people here if you weren’t such a remarkably stupid cupcake.

    Here’s a decaying porcupine with an unripe pineapple in its mouth – do you need instructions on what to do with it, sugar?

  275. Nerd of Redhead says

    I pity poor Dan when he gets back from din din.

    *Keeps sharpening titanium fang*

  276. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Dan Nunley #353

    And why are you atheists in such a rush to throw your support behind anything Islamic.

    We’re not throwing support “behind anything Islamic.” We were wondering if your support of religion extended beyond Christianity. Apparently it doesn’t, although you’re not going to actively work against Muslims, Jews, or any other non-Christians, as long as they’re believers of some flavor.

    I thought you hated organized religion and anything to do with God.

    You thought wrong. We don’t hate your god or any other god. It’s like saying “you hate Sauron and Valdemort.” It’s silly to hate a fictitious character.

    Nor do we hate organized religion. Most of it is extremely foolish and a lot of it is dangerous, but we don’t hate it. Contempt and antipathy are not hate. What we do hate is people using their religion to push a socio-political agenda. I discussed this in the past paragraph of my post #165.

    Doesn’t your hate extend to Allah and Mohammad?

    We hold all religions in scorn. Some of them, like evangelical Christianity and fundamentalist Islam, are disliked more than, say, Zen Buddhism, but that’s because these religions are more dangerous and more insane.

    If I were a betting man, I’d bet that what’s happening here is just all a part of your favorite game which is to attack Christianity whenever possible.

    Lucky for you that you didn’t put a bet down because you would lose. We don’t attack Christianity. We attack the dangerous parts of Christianity, like the people who kill abortion doctors “because God hates them.” We have no problem with Mrs. Johnson in Des Moines who goes to church every Sunday, says grace before meals, believes in Jesus with fervor, and otherwise doesn’t bother anyone with her religion. We attack folks like Fred Phelps who uses religion to justify his homophobia or Pope Benedict who lies about condoms and AIDS because he’s convinced God is anti-condom.

    So I come along and you think I’m a Christian so you sprint to your old, tired, predictable bag of tricks and proceed to malign Christianity even if that means appearing to support another religion.

    The chances of someone named Dan Nunley being a Muslim are slim to none. Coupled with your post #252 which pushes a Judeo-Christian agenda, it was more than reasonable you were a Christian. In fact, the odds of you being an evangelical were approaching unity. As for supporting another religion, I’ve already covered that point.

    Yessiree IslandBrewer, I do think that I’m rather clever for having figured that out!

    Considering you made several wrong conclusions, you’re not quite as clever as you think you are. You weren’t figuring things out, you were expressing your prejudices, which isn’t clever at all.

    Lastly, why is it that all of you atheists hide behind pseudonyms and gravatars instead of using your real identities?

    This has been covered by Dhorvath in post #357. However there’s another point: Pseudonyms are extremely common on the internet. If you were to spend some time browsing different blogs, including some conservative and Christian blogs, you’d find this to be true.

    Dan, your patronizing condescension is misplaced. You’re nowhere as clever as you imagine and we’re not as inane and irrational as you think we are.

  277. AmVik says

    Actually, I kind of like Dan. He’s literate, and at least tries to respond to what’s been written to him. That makes it kind of hard to throw him in the “standard creobot” category. Dan is a much better chew toy.
    Anyone else think it will be funny if he’s gone to see “Planet of the Apes”?

  278. Patricia, OM says

    Crap it just occured to me I now have an extra blather. Sorry it was delivered to late to help you Cain.

  279. UpAgainstTheRopes says

    A 352 comment thread with Beckians and there was no Godwinning or bible quotes?

    I don’t know about this new Pharyngula…

    …and for once just once I’d like to see someone quote the book of mormon or rigveda or some other supposedly inspired text in defense of their preferred deity of choice. I’m so sick of the bible.

    Thanks to this thread I will be investing all my money into a new product based on ancient knowledge guaranteed to align your qi, improve your love life, shock your chakras and increase your wellness…

    GRAVITY MAGNETS!

  280. 'smee says

    375@ Pat.

    I’m sure Cain was Able, regardless of any presumed blather deficit.

    The best thing about prime blather is that although it is always growing, it grows best and fastest when released every now and then.

  281. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Danny boy:

    Capish?

    AH HA HA HAHAHAHAHA! *snort!* *wipes tear!*

    Oh Dan, Dan, Dan. You tried to be cool, but it didn’t quite work out.

    A couple of miles is more along the lines of what I had in mind.

    Based on what?

    The Muslims that wanted to build the “Ground Zero Mosque”* had absolutely fuck all to do with 9/11. Comparing them to the terrorists, as you are doing (whether you’ll admit it or not) shows us exactly what kind of bigoted jackass you are.

    *Note: Not actually at ground zero, but who are you to let facts get in the way of a great TL;DR tirade?

    You talk real tough from behind the curtain, I’ll give you that.

    Then you’ll be totes comfortable giving us your address, telephone number, work address, work phone number, cell phone number, SS number, banking information, wife/kids names, and email address, right?

    No?

    Yes, we get it. You’re tougher and more honest than we are. Trust me, that schtick** never gets old.

    **Note: Not English, but spelled correctly.

    Now I’m going to leave again and take my lovely family out to dinner and a movie.

    Awe, aren’t you special! Congratulations on being dead common.

    I can’t complain though, my lovely husband is making me a pizza as we speak. Extra cheese, just the way I like.

    After dinner, I’m going to take my turtle out of her tank and snuggle with her a bit. Later, maybe I’ll watch some of the BBC miniseries of Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy.

    Oh? We weren’t sharing our Friday night plans, you say? You were just trying to be a smug jackass? My bad.

    Ciao losers.

    Hey, you got one right! Your momma must be damn proud of you.

  282. Nerd of Redhead says

    Sweet suffering Jesus Christ on a stick, you are stupid.

    Doesn’t sound good for you, intellectual loser…

  283. Josh, Official SpokesGay says

    Congratulations on being dead common.

    Audley, you are so wickedly funny and dead on!

  284. says

    ‘smee, you don’t understand, it’s an in-joke, sorry. I recently had my gallbladder out. Thanks to a happy typo, gallbladder turned into gallblather, then morphed into gallbother. :D

  285. 'smee says

    Gravitymagnets.com is available (but I don’t think it has long term potential, otherwise I’d buy it for shitz & giggles)

  286. Mak says

    ‘Tis Himself:

    However there’s another point: Pseudonyms are extremely common on the internet.

    That’s an excellent point. Most times using a ‘nym isn’t just acceptable, but expected and the norm. Not for us, though; Dan’s decided it’s cowardly and wrong when we do it. *pout*

  287. Quodlibet says

    Capish?

    Actually, there’s a discussion about capes on TET right about now.

    *snicker*

  288. 'smee says

    Ah!

    My bad!

    ‘s_ok…

    [slinks quietly out of the room, while whistling* a merry shanty, out of tune and out of time**]

    * some of you may be wondering how ‘smee can be quiet while whistling. That’s my little secret, now, isn’t it, dearies!

    **quite a trick for the musically gifted***

    *** lucky I’m not musically gifted

  289. says

    Actually, funny enough. This is the only media I feel comfortable using what I feel is my real name. Otherwise I’d go by the name assigned to me at birth – but wait, that name is a guy’s name, and I’m a woman.

    So yea, Katherine Lorraine IS my real name – and that Gravatar IS my real body image.

    I’m actually happy I can be Katherine Lorraine on Pharyngula, and I’m not hated and maligned for wanting my gender to match that which is in my mind :)

  290. says

    Dan,

    So much to say, yet so little substance. Anyway, if you follow that link where my pseudonym is, you’ll find my personal site. If you look at the about page, you’ll even find my real name. I’m not hiding behind anything. It only takes one example to disprove your blanket statement.

    Awful jackass.

  291. says

    Audley:

    After dinner, I’m going to take my turtle out of her tank and snuggle with her a bit.

    I wish we lived closer! My good friends (who moved to Fargo, damn it) have iguanas, an African frog with teeth (you gotta see that thing) and a lovely tortoise, Sebastian.

    All the rats have always gotten along with the tortoise, they had such fun together, but Chas & Alfie have never been around a tortoise or turtle. :(

  292. Mak says

    I’m actually happy I can be Katherine Lorraine on Pharyngula, and I’m not hated and maligned for wanting my gender to match that which is in my mind :)

    Ain’t it grand? :) I’ve yet to find a safer place than Pharyngula. Sadly, that goes for a lot of the LGBT places, too. It’s sad how quickly people frequently harmed by straight/cis privilege will turn around and dump religious privilege all over you.

  293. Patricia, OM says

    smee, don’t worry about it, it’s all blather anyway. *snort*

    He was trying hard to prove he’s a True Christian by being a condescending sexist jerk. Somebody must be about two places from a bingo on him.

  294. says

    Katherine Lorraine:

    I’m actually happy I can be Katherine Lorraine on Pharyngula, and I’m not hated and maligned for wanting my gender to match that which is in my mind :)

    You’re loved and nurtured here, as the beautiful person you are. You’ve always been beautiful, just took you a while to fine your horde. :)

  295. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Tomorrow night the wife, daughter and I will watch A Comedy of Errors on the Customhouse Dock in New London. There’ll be a catered supper as well. We’ll be having the Caribbean shrimp. I apologize for not doing a movie tonight, but the wife wants to conserve herself for tomorrow night.

  296. 'smee says

    My wife is taking me out for dinner and a movie* tomorrow night (teenage son & girlfriend will babysit darling daughter)

    Probably something smooshie – but that’s ok (let’s me be in touch with my feminine side — no-one notices me crying in a theater full of crying women!)

    And dinner will be a surprise (she won’t tell me where or what – probably something experimental!)

    * Our last movie-date was Horrible Bosses – the first laugh-out-loud movie we’d been to in quite a while! Go see it if you haven’t already. Yes it is horribly misogynistic. and yes it is horribly funny.

  297. 'smee says

    #Tis: Last time I saw A Comedy of Errors was an ‘alternative production’ at the Fringe (long. long. time. [aeons]. ago)

    That & “Shrew” are my favs, I think. (I much prefer the comedies to the tragedies.)

  298. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    It’s okay, everyone. Dan must have been talking to me. I ate dinner alone, have no one to go to the movies with tonight, and am sitting here responding to an old Pharyngula thread. I’m the loser. You can all go about your business being as cool as you always are. :P

  299. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Josh:

    Audley, you are so wickedly funny and dead on!

    Oh, thank you! ♥!

    Caine:

    All the rats have always gotten along with the tortoise, they had such fun together, but Chas & Alfie have never been around a tortoise or turtle. :(

    And I would love to have you over to play with the rats!

    To be honest, Emery would prolly either ignore them or try to chase them.

    Kat:

    This is the only media I feel comfortable using what I feel is my real name.

    On one hand, I’m sad that you can’t be you everywhere, but on the other hand, I’m happy that you are comfortable and safe here.

  300. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    I’m actually happy I can be Katherine Lorraine on Pharyngula, and I’m not hated and maligned for wanting my gender to match that which is in my mind :)

    No worries, Katherine Lorraine. We hate and malign you for other reasons. þ

  301. 'smee says

    Patrica & Cain – as a man approaching “that age” blather is becoming a challenge for me. *LOL*

  302. chigau () says

    Nerd #381 !!!

    Sweet suffering Jesus Christ on a stick, you are stupid.

    Doesn’t sound good for you, intellectual loser…

    “loser”
    You talkin’ ta me?

  303. Mak says

    No worries, Ibis3, I’m sitting around watching TV and working on my cartooning tonight, so we can be losers together. ;)

  304. Slammo says

    I don’t post here (or scienceblogs) often, but read everyday and follow most all of you.

    I want to thank Katherine for being who she is.

    Patricia and Nerd, you guys crack me up. Keep it coming.

    I don’t get a lot of spare time to contribute for various reasons and you guys usually about got the topic licked by the time I get around to logging on to the interwebs. SO I’ll continue to follow PZ and the rest of the horde when I can.

    It is refreshing to know there are others like me out there.

  305. Patricia, OM says

    Ibis3 – Come sit by me, I have no date either, but I have extra Walnetto’s.

  306. amphiox says

    That’s an excellent point. Most times using a ‘nym isn’t just acceptable, but expected and the norm. Not for us, though; Dan’s decided it’s cowardly and wrong when we do it. *pout*

    Dan’s just lashing out because he doesn’t possess sufficient imagination or creativity to think up a good ‘nym, and he is all bitter about it.

    Raging at the heavens, and all that.

  307. says

    Ibis3:

    It’s okay, everyone. Dan must have been talking to me. I ate dinner alone, have no one to go to the movies with tonight, and am sitting here responding to an old Pharyngula thread. I’m the loser. You can all go about your business being as cool as you always are. :P

    Oh, if we’re going to do the loser sweepstakes, I’ll betcha I win!

    Let’s see, it’s Friday and I have been…cleaning my kitchen! :shock horror gasp: Scrubbing floors, cleaning out cupboards, the whole nine yards. I’m nowhere near done, either. I have a *big* kitchen, which I love, until it comes to cleaning.

    Mister is in Gladstone, because he’s working and won’t be home until Sunday night. So, I’m no done with kitchen crap for the night, finishing up laundry and waiting for Deadly Women to come on, so I can sit and relax for a bit.

    Oh and dinner? What’s that?

    Audley:

    To be honest, Emery would prolly either ignore them or try to chase them.

    The boys would do the same. :D Ash used to ride on Sebastian’s back.

  308. Patricia, OM says

    Slammo – Oh dear, you are amused by an Ignorant Slut blathering verses from the Holy Babble? Maybe you should get that checked. *le grin*

  309. UpAgainstTheRopes says

    As long as we’re sharing…

    I’m gonna rage and get FUBAR, burn a koran, punch a rabbi in the dick, break into a cemetery and desecrate a tomb, then jump into my car pass out over the steering wheel going 100mph right into a xtian family of four going out for a nice night of dinner and a movie, then wake up in jail with a condom in my butt… again.

    TGIF.

    Off to have my typical atheist night…

  310. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    I hate and malign you too!! ♥

    That’s the nicest thing anyone’s said to me all day.

    <sniff>

    Hate and malice to everybody!

    Let’s all have a hate and malice time together. It’ll be a nice break from the orgies and baby-eating.

  311. Patricia, OM says

    So little miss Katherine Lorraine is going to pitch a hissy right here in front of everyone, eh?

    Pick up your feet all.

    OK – go for it!

  312. Patricia, OM says

    …punch a rabbi in the dick…

    Oh sweet mystery of life, but that’s the funniest thang I’ve heard all day. Stop it the cackling hurts.

  313. Patricia, OM says

    No hissy fit?
    You realize that means you don’t get to stand in the corner with a sugar-tit. And certainly no spanking.

  314. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    “Capish?”

    Oh my dog. Danny boy is trying to sound like a mafioso, but can’t quite pull it off.

    Dude, I am sorry, but you are just sad. You make Archie Bunker look cool by comparison.

  315. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    I’ll sidle up to you any day, Patricia, though I’ve never tried a Walnetto before.

    Caine: Okay, you win the Friday night loser sweeps. Anyone stuck doing housework is a shoo-in. I guess that makes Dan vindicated. Losers all.

    Oh, and on the nym thing… I do it not because I’m afraid, but because I don’t think my clients and colleagues, and exes, and estranged family members, and former or casual acquaintances don’t need to know everything about me. I have a very robust online life, but it’s a personal life. I don’t talk politics or religion with people I’m dealing with professionally, for example. That would be considered extremely rude where I come from. If I share personal stuff with a real life someone, I want that to be under my control. It wouldn’t be difficult for a person with a bit of intelligence to figure out the connection if they were at all savvy and had a bit of determination though.

  316. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Caine:

    I’ve been using Caine as my nym on the net for over 18 years now. It might as well be my real name, I’ll answer to it.

    You know what’s weird? I’ve only used Audley for a few months now, but it’s the first ‘nym that I’ve felt was a real identity (if that makes any sense). :)

    So, thanks for the ‘nym! This one’s definitely a keeper.

  317. Quodlibet says

    Let’s all have a hate and malice time together.

    I used to enjoy playing a card game called “Spite and Malice” with my grandmother. Every afternoon I would play two games of canasta and a game of spite and malice with her before dinner. (I was too nerdy to have friends my own age.)

    *remembering….My grandmother was a very early feminist (b.1916) – nowadays she’d be called bad-ass. She was very cool. Atheist, artist, rejected traditional feminine roles. My grandfather adored her.*

  318. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    Over the years I’ve given enough information about me that a couple of months ago someone came to my place of business and asked for me by name. It was a Pharyngula lurker. We had lunch together and discussed naval history.

  319. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Ooh! I know, Danny Boy was Archie Bunker doing a Tony Soprano immitation.

    Wonder where he went. Probably out scoring some more meth.

  320. says

    Audley:

    You know what’s weird? I’ve only used Audley for a few months now, but it’s the first ‘nym that I’ve felt was a real identity (if that makes any sense). :)

    So, thanks for the ‘nym! This one’s definitely a keeper.

    :D :D :D It felt that way to me, too. It was my earliest nym. It’s interesting, if you search Audley, it has one hell of a history, as a surname among the British peerage. I had no idea when I came up with it, but it’s pretty cool.

    I can’t tell you how happy I am that it suits you so well, I was always upset about losing that one.

  321. Ibis3, féministe avec un titre française de fantaisie says

    ‘Smee: Yes, yesss, I was talking about you. *points and laughs behind your back* [after all, hate & malice is now on the menu]

    Mak: Hope the cartooning is going fine. I’m off to watch tv myself.

  322. Mak says

    Hope the cartooning is going fine. I’m off to watch tv myself.

    Thanks, it’s as well as it ever is. Have fun. :)

  323. 'smee says

    My wife learned “spite malice” from a warped and deranged friend… and it has been our companion on many trips (our children love the game too – perhaps that explains some things about our small but opinionated brood)

  324. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Am I too late too share the hate and malice?

    The cackling did start to hurt, but I don’t mind at all.

    I had a lovely long sunset walk, and a salad from the garden. Then I checked back to see if the precious returned, and enjoyed the apparent brilliance of the horde.
    *observes teh cat fur gently wafting around on the hardwood floors*

    Yep, every symptom of loserhood here.

  325. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Oh sweet FSM. I had to read the comments from blather on again and its even better because I missed this detail:

    “crash my car into a christian family of four out to dinner”

    hate, malice, and smooshy hugs to all
    per your preference

  326. Dan Nunley says

    Any of you degenerates and reprobates still awake?

    I must say that after quickly perusing your comments and following the high-fives and congratulations being passed back and forth between you earlier this evening over your perceived individual and collective wit and intelligence, I’m very disappointed that you couldn’t do better with the insults and invectives you launched my way. I mean really, they were so mundane and unexceptional and even predictable. I expected so much more from each of you.

    AmVik, I’m sorry to disappoint you but Planet of the Apes wasn’t on my agenda for tonight. After enjoying a delicious steak dinner at Nick & Sam’s, we saw Captain America.

    I will admit that I’m surprised at the number of denials regarding my assumption that you all hate religion and God. ‘Tis Himself, OM tells me that “[w]e don’t hate your god or any other god … nor do we hate organized religion. Most of it is extremely foolish and a lot of it is dangerous, but we do not hate it.” OK, then explain to me why Patricia, OM’s avatar says “I hate religion, god and child molesters.” Or is she just blathering again and not representative of the rest of you atheists?

    And oh my how you all love to cast aspersions about others being hypocritical when it’s you who are the biggest hypocrites of all by living these Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde lives of yours. In this online community you hold nothing back as you play hardball with your atheism, debauchery and perversions but in real life you hide behind some disingenuous persona and do everything you can to prevent your employers and neighbors from knowing the real you because as several of you have said, if they knew the real you, they might be disgusted and fire your ass or shun you. What a bunch of cowards you are! If you really, really believe in what you say you believe, then man up or woman up and take a stand for what you believe based on principal. Otherwise shut the hell up (oh sorry, you don’t believe in hell do you?) and stay in the closet because you’re pathetic and aren’t deserving of anyone’s respect.

    So goodbye. It’s been real. I don’t plan on coming back because for the short time I’ve been in your presence, even though it’s only your online presence, I feel like I need to go through a decontamination process to rid myself of the stench and filth that you give off. Blech!

  327. says

    If you really, really believe in what you say you believe, then man up or woman up and take a stand for what you believe based on principal.

    We do, Cupcake. That’s what you’re all upsetty about, remember? You might want to get that memory problem checked out.

    Otherwise shut the hell up (oh sorry, you don’t believe in hell do you?) and stay in the closet because you’re pathetic and aren’t deserving of anyone’s respect.

    Sugarbrain, we aren’t in the closet. This is one of the reasons you’re so upsetty, remember? Really, get that memory problem checked out. You may have a serious problem.

    So goodbye.

    Bye bye, Cupcake. Be sure to stick the flounce, now. I’m ever so sorry you couldn’t cope with intelligent, educated peoples. That happens when you pickle your brain, and are too stupid to breathe. Good for you breathing is involuntary, eh?

    Don’t let the door hit you, Cupcake. We don’t care for assprints on our door.

  328. Mak says

    Or is she just blathering again and not representative of the rest of you atheists?

    Oh, so you think atheism is a big monolithic group, do you? Does this apply to Christians, too, or just the nonbelievers and the muslims? Is that some projection?

    Do you take everything so seriously?

    In this online community you hold nothing back as you play hardball with your atheism

    Say what? What the fuck does that even mean?

    debauchery and perversions

    Oh fuck, you’ve been looking in my journal! I’m sorry, I’m sorry! That tube of whipped cream said that it was fat free, I swear! D8

    Otherwise shut the hell up (oh sorry, you don’t believe in hell do you?) and stay in the closet because you’re pathetic and aren’t deserving of anyone’s respect.

    Hey, you haven’t given out your personal information, even though it was asked for. Why don’t you put your money where your mouth is?

    No, I get it. Our very presence offends you ever so much, as does the fact that we unearthed what a loathsome little toadshit you are, which is why you’re throwing such a fit now.

  329. Janine, The Little Top Of Venom, OM says

    Any of you degenerates and reprobates still awake?

    Fuckface, here is some fucking news for you; this blog has readers all around the world. There is always people on this blog.

    I must say that after quickly perusing your comments and following the high-fives and congratulations being passed back and forth between you earlier this evening over your perceived individual and collective wit and intelligence, I’m very disappointed that you couldn’t do better with the insults and invectives you launched my way. I mean really, they were so mundane and unexceptional and even predictable. I expected so much more from each of you.

    Because you have shown yourself to be a regular Oscar Wilde.

    AmVik, I’m sorry to disappoint you but Planet of the Apes wasn’t on my agenda for tonight. After enjoying a delicious steak dinner at Nick & Sam’s, we saw Captain America.

    Great. Want to know what I intend to watch? No? I will say so anyways. I just borrowed the Up Series from a friend.

    I will admit that I’m surprised at the number of denials regarding my assumption that you all hate religion and God. ‘Tis Himself, OM tells me that “[w]e don’t hate your god or any other god … nor do we hate organized religion. Most of it is extremely foolish and a lot of it is dangerous, but we do not hate it.” OK, then explain to me why Patricia, OM’s avatar says “I hate religion, god and child molesters.” Or is she just blathering again and not representative of the rest of you atheists?

    You got us in your logical trap, bud. Because all atheists are all the same. Just like all women are really just one woman. Patricia speaks for herself. ‘Tis speaks for himself. And I fucking speak for myself. And for the record, I do not hate God; I cannot hate what is not real. But I sure as shit hate any religion that tries to curtail my freedom of action.

    And oh my how you all love to cast aspersions about others being hypocritical when it’s you who are the biggest hypocrites of all by living these Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde lives of yours. In this online community you hold nothing back as you play hardball with your atheism, debauchery and perversions but in real life you hide behind some disingenuous persona and do everything you can to prevent your employers and neighbors from knowing the real you because as several of you have said, if they knew the real you, they might be disgusted and fire your ass or shun you. What a bunch of cowards you are! If you really, really believe in what you say you believe, then man up or woman up and take a stand for what you believe based on principal. Otherwise shut the hell up (oh sorry, you don’t believe in hell do you?) and stay in the closet because you’re pathetic and aren’t deserving of anyone’s respect.

    Where can I find these eyes that you have that allows you to see who and what we really are. Oh. Wait. This is the ravings of an internet tough guy.

    So goodbye. It’s been real. I don’t plan on coming back because for the short time I’ve been in your presence, even though it’s only your online presence, I feel like I need to go through a decontamination process to rid myself of the stench and filth that you give off. Blech!

    You said you were leaving earlier but you came back. Know what this makes you? A perverted liar.

    Why should any one trust that you will not curse us with your stupidity again? You have already shown that your words means nothing. As for that filth, it is never coming off. You are generating it.

  330. Moonkitty says

    Sugarbrain, we aren’t in the closet.

    No, Caine, he’s acting all superior because some atheists here, particularly those who are gay or transgendered, live in parts of the country where they’d “be disgusted and fire your ass or shun you.”

    Stoopy cowards! Tryin’ to make a living and stuff amongst bigots.

    What do you want to bet big brave Dan is one of those who is disgusted and would fire or shun us?

    –Stacy Kennedy (I’m lucky; I live in Los Angeles.)

  331. Rey Fox says

    Also, I’m a little confused on one point. Are we losers with no lives or are we debauched perverts?

  332. chigau says

    Nunley
    You are ridiculous.
    There is no atheist community that is equivalent to your brain-dead god-bothering community.
    Nobody speaks for me.
    and stop beating your “wives”

  333. Mak says

    Stoopy cowards! Tryin’ to make a living and stuff amongst bigots.

    Why, if Dan Nunley can do it, so can we! ‘Cause no one’s persecuted like the poor Christians. :c

  334. AmVik says

    OK, I take it back. I don’t like Dan anymore. He’s a typical hypocritical lying douchebag creobot after all. One of his early comments:

    What’s with the rudeness and profane language in the comments from Patricia, OM (“fuckwit”) and Aquaria (“fuckface”)? Is that a typical reaction of atheists’ to something with which they disagree?

    And then, after failing to make a valid point anywhere, flounces with this:

    I’m very disappointed that you couldn’t do better with the insults and invectives you launched my way. I mean really, they were so mundane and unexceptional and even predictable. I expected so much more from each of you.

    What a douchebag.

  335. Mak says

    I wonder what kind of perversions he’s talking about. Is swearing on the internet a perversion now?

  336. says

    What do you want to bet big brave Dan is one of those who is disgusted and would fire or shun us?

    Oh, no bet, Moonkitty. Danny’s one of those sweethearts who would happily wipe us from the face of planet, what with us all being debauched perverts and all. I mean, we shouldn’t be allowed to live, right? It’s just terrible we’re breathing and actually talking about ourselves. I mean, really. Danny could be infected*!

    *With a brain he actually used to…think! :gasp:

  337. Moonkitty says

    Also, I’m a little confused on one point. Are we losers with no lives or are we debauched perverts?

    tee hee. Well, for me it varies. Lately I’m a loser with no life, but I’ve enjoyed my share of debauchery. How perverted it was I dunno; I’m guessing Danno would blush. YMMV

  338. Makyui says

    Both. We’re fabulous enough to carry that off, Darling!

    Well, we hate religion and support all things Islam at the same time, so why not!

  339. Tethys-zombi feministe calmar-garou says

    Oh Dan

    You failed to address any of my examples of hypocrisy and your biggest complaint is we use nyms?

    Why would any of us wish to have bigots like you know our true names? Would that magically turn your brain on so it can comprehend that tolerance applies equally to all groups?

    Your version seems to be that you can come here and spout nonsense but we can’t mock you for it cuz its god nonsense.
    And all good people know that god nonsense is true and worthy of respect no matter what.

    A child has better reasoning abilities you blathering fuckwit.

  340. AmVik says

    What a bunch of cowards you are! If you really, really believe in what you say you believe, then man up or woman up and take a stand for what you believe based on principal.

    I think Captain America went to his head.

  341. consciousness razor says

    Any of you degenerates and reprobates still awake?

    *puts down espresso*

    Yes, is there something you need?

    *reads rest of comment*

    The answer is: seek professional help.

  342. Rey Fox says

    I wonder what kind of perversions he’s talking about.

    I wish they’d say. I have a feeling it would be disappointing.

  343. Makyui says

    Hey Caine. :) Sorry about the ‘nym thing. I shouldn’t have transitioned it so quickly.

    Can’t complain! How’re you recovering?

  344. says

    Makyui, no problem with the nym, I should be paying attention! Glad things are going well with you, although there’s always stuff to complain about. :D

    My recovery is going well, thanks.

  345. says

    Rey:

    I wish they’d say. I have a feeling it would be disappointing.

    You should be obeying an authority for which there is no evidence, and only sex inside marriage for the purpose of procreation!, you pervert.

  346. Makyui says

    although there’s always stuff to complain about. :D

    Ahaha, true, true! Like this weather, jeeezus it’s hot right now.

    Glad to hear you’re going okay.

  347. says

    but in real life you hide behind some disingenuous persona and do everything you can to prevent your employers and neighbors from knowing the real you because as several of you have said, if they knew the real you, they might be disgusted and fire your ass or shun you.

    Taken from his speech to the IDiots who dissemble their belief in magic in order to escape “persecution” (that is, having to defend the indefensible).

    Nah, Danny boy wouldn’t dream of turning his two faces against the hypocrisy that truly matters (not internet forums, where pseudonyms are the norm).

    Glen Davidson

  348. says

    Makyui:

    Like this weather, jeeezus it’s hot right now.

    My sympathies. It hasn’t been overwhelmingly hot here, but that’s because it hasn’t stopped bloody raining for 4 months. Can’t even go outside without having a massive swarm of mosquitoes land. Ugh.

  349. Makyui says

    Oh gross. I’d take the heat over the mosquitoes any day, thankyouverymuch. The humidity’s probably through the roof, too, no?

  350. says

    Makyui:

    The humidity’s probably through the roof, too, no?

    Yeah, it’s been high. I’m just seriously pissy about not being able to get out and about much this year, photography wise. The mosquitoes are insane, as are the ticks.

    Temps I can deal with, but I don’t like things trying to eat me alive the second I get out the door.

  351. Makyui says

    Oh jeez, poor Caine. It’s such a pain wanting to create and being unable to. I hope it clears up soon and you can get back to work. I take it bug spray is out of the question?

  352. says

    Makyui:

    I take it bug spray is out of the question?

    Oh, we’ve sprayed ourselves like crazy! Doesn’t help much, there are so many. The bats and dragonflies have been munching like crazy, and still, thousands upon thousands of them. Damn things, I hate ’em.

  353. Makyui says

    Oh god that’s a friggin’ nightmare, I can’t even imagine. D8 Here’s hoping they clear up soon.

  354. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Rey Fox:

    Also, I’m a little confused on one point. Are we losers with no lives or are we debauched perverts?

    Well, I had a couple of beers tonight (instead of watching tv, I hung out with my sister and my husband). So, I guess I’m straddling the line between being a loser and a debauched pervert.

    Caine:

    I can’t tell you how happy I am that it suits you so well, I was always upset about losing that one.

    I will use it in good faith. Or for teething on dumbasses.

    Same thing, really. :P

    Dan:

    I must say that after quickly perusing your comments and following the high-fives and congratulations being passed back and forth between you earlier this evening over your perceived individual and collective wit and intelligence…

    Many of us here are friends– some IRL, but mostly though this blog. I’m sorry if it pains you to see us nasty atheists support and encourage and enjoy each other.

    You must lead a sad and empty life if you can’t appreciate that.

    … I’m very disappointed that you couldn’t do better with the insults and invectives you launched my way.

    1) I’ve been off my game lately– the swears just aren’t flowing like usual. Maybe I should have my cuss gland checked out.

    2) I’m in this for the lulz, sweetheart. I’m not going to waste some genuinely witty and inventive (if I do say so myself) insults on a crusty clown fucker like you. Sorry.

    3) The disappointed dad act doesn’t really achieve anything, you know. We’re all adults here. But if that incredibly sad attempt at belittling us helps you feel like the big man that you always wanted to be, then who am I to stop you? I suppose it would be cruel to take away the one thing that makes you feel important.

    After enjoying a delicious steak dinner at Nick & Sam’s, we saw Captain America.

    Well, now we know that currently you’re in/around Dallas, TX. Any other personal information you’re willing to share? I did ask for a bunch of stuff and since you’re an internet tough guy and all, I didn’t think you’d mind sharing.

    Tis Himself, OM tells me that “[w]e don’t hate your god or any other god … nor do we hate organized religion. Most of it is extremely foolish and a lot of it is dangerous, but we do not hate it.” OK, then explain to me why Patricia, OM’s avatar says “I hate religion, god and child molesters.”

    Are all Christians the same? Are all men the same? Are all straight people the same?

    No?

    Then why would you assume all atheists are the same? Oh right, it’s that particular authoritarian way of thinking that the religious have.

    In other words, you seriously lack the imagination and intelligence to make an argument that would cause us to stop and think. Your position is every bit as shallow as the uneducated creationists that show up here. It’s a pity that you probably spent tens of thousands (if not more) on higher education* and yet you still can’t come up with anything new to taunt us with. I think you should ask for your money back.

    *This is assuming, of course, that you are actually a lawyer. Since you alluded to a Constitutional law class upthread, I think this is a valid assumption on my part.

    And oh my how you all love to cast aspersions about others being hypocritical when it’s you who are the biggest hypocrites of all by living these Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde lives of yours.

    Put your money where your mouth is, tough guy. All I’m asking for is your address, phone number, place of employment, children’s names, banking info, SS number, and credit card numbers.

    Otherwise all you have is a name which could have come from anywhere.

    In this online community you hold nothing back as you play hardball with your atheism, debauchery and perversions but in real life you hide behind some disingenuous persona and do everything you can to prevent your employers and neighbors from knowing the real you…

    Oh hey, there’s that broad brush again. It really must be confusing for a pea brain such as yourself to learn that not all of us are the same!

    Tell me, Dan, since you know oh-so much about my personal life: What am I hiding and from whom?

    … because as several of you have said, if they knew the real you, they might be disgusted and fire your ass or shun you.

    Right. Because no one, anywhere has ever been fired from their job on grounds that are completely unrelated to their performance.

    Sure, it’s illegal to fire someone for their religious beliefs (or lack thereof), so that means it never ever ever EVER happens, right?

    What a bunch of cowards you are!

    Impotent RAAAAAAGE!

    Also, I’ve got a hunch there’s a fair bit of projection, here.

    If you really, really believe in what you say you believe, then man up or woman up and take a stand for what you believe based on principal.

    Have you ever been in a situation where if you “manned up”, you very well may lose all of you friends and family, be ostracized from your community, and possibly lose your job?

    I’m guessing no. It’s easy to advise someone to “man up” if you’ve never known their hardships. And, contrary to Fox News and Glenn Beck, being a middle-class, straight, Christian male comes with a lot of privilege in this country. Unless you honestly listen to us, you will never know what we face on a daily basis.

    I would like to add that using pseudonym here has no bearing on my private life. My friends, family, and coworkers know that I’m a liberal atheist. But I am one of the lucky ones and I would never presume to tell someone else that they are less of a person because they don’t have the same luxuries that I do.

    Otherwise shut the hell up (oh sorry, you don’t believe in hell do you?) …

    I’m confused. Did Dan just attempt to be clever?

    … and stay in the closet because you’re pathetic and aren’t deserving of anyone’s respect.

    Go ahead, teach your children that the need for safety and privacy is a bad thing. Trust me, they’ll thank you for it later.

    I don’t plan on coming back because for the short time I’ve been in your presence, even though it’s only your online presence, I feel like I need to go through a decontamination process to rid myself of the stench and filth that you give off.

    Well, hey. Thanks, Dan. My day at work was totally fucked (and to be honest, I was feeling a little bummed about it), but knowing that we skeeved you out fills me with a sense of accomplishment.

    (All this time I’ve been wracking my brainz for the word “pompous”, but it didn’t come to me until just before I hit submit. Oh well. Dan’s still a pompous douchecanoe.)

  355. UpAgainstTheRoeps says

    …aaahhh

    thanks dan

    will see you on the news after you get caught for cutting up hookers or smashing your private plane into a building… for as you’d say ‘doing god’s work’

  356. amphiox says

    I feel like I need to go through a decontamination process to rid myself of the stench and filth that you give off.

    Hate to break this to you, Dan old boy, but no amount of decontamination is going to get rid of that pervading stench of filth and corruption you smell.

    Because, you see, the source is you.

  357. Owlmirror says

    “Debauchery” — would that be the Walnettos? Or the homemade pizza?

    For shame, y’all.

    take a stand for what you believe based on principal.

    Which principal? There are several elementary, middle, and high schools near where I live. Or do you mean a principal near you? How are we supposed to know who you mean?

    Really, on top of being self-righteous and hypocritical, do you also have to be so vague?

    Sheesh.

  358. The Lone Coyote says

    Damn, I only now realized there was a pharyngula wiki. Is it arrogant that I wish I was well known enough to have a page on there? It is, isn’t it?

    Dan, thank you for reminding me of why I reject christianity. Your arrogant condescending attitude is a large part of what started my journey towards enlightenment (not yours specifically mind you, I don’t think you knew me back then, but your smugness is nothing new to me. This is such an old tune for me I can practically sing along!).

    Christians just love their comfortable delusion that atheists are just people angry at God for whatever reason. No, I am angry at every smug, misty eyed churchey who made me feel like there was something intrinsically wrong with me because I didn’t feel the ‘power of the holy spirit’ like every other teenager at that ridiculous and kind of scary youth group seemed to (the possibility they were faking it, even to themselves, for social acceptance didn’t occur to teenage me back then). I know that admitting a ‘sore spot’ like that infront of a smug sock-sniffing god botherer is practically ‘asking for it’ in their eyes, and I don’t expect you (Dan) to pull any punches. Rubbing salt into wounds is part of the ‘grooming process’ for a lot of evangelists.

    I remember my first breakup. Yes, I was overdramatic about it. Teenagers often are about their first breakup. But I’ll never forgive that smug church lady who sniffed church lady fashion and went ‘Teehee, maybe it was a good thing!” with that merry “My life is great, I don’t know what went wrong with yours!” sparkle in her eyes. Maybe she thought the girl was ‘leading me into sin’, that was certainly the implication (that group was VERY anti-dating).

    I’m used to it, so fire away Danny.

  359. Ragutis says

    Magnets? They’ve got pieces of gravity in them.

    So goodbye. It’s been real. I don’t plan on coming back because for the short time I’ve been in your presence, even though it’s only your online presence, I feel like I need to go through a decontamination process to rid myself of the stench and filth that you give off. Blech!

    Oh. Gee. Darn. You’re so cruel to withold your scintillating sanctimoniousness from us desperate degenerates. Although, I must say I don’t believe you’ll stick to this promise. It’s clear self-righteousness gives you a boner. You’ll be back the next time the Mrs. goes to bed early. Do us all a favor and just grab some lotion and google “boobs” or “Bieber” or “Baby Jesus buttplug” instead.

  360. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    I wrote a fairly long response to Ol’ Dan and he quoted just a couple of sentences to show that Patricia and I hold differing views (which apparently is wrong in Dan’s deluded mind). Dan wasn’t here to have a discussion, he just wanted to show off his smug superiority and berate the atheist untermenschen for using pseudonyms. I suspect he was annoyed when we didn’t tug our forelocks and renounce our debauched perversions after he denounced us.

  361. Nerd of Redhead says

    Missed the flounce. I give it an 8 out of 10, as it needed a bit more overweening snobbishness, overly pretentious analysis, and fake superiority (the only kind Dan has).

  362. Spunmunkey says

    Late to the party – again…

    Dan – you may stick the flounce, but I bet you’ll lurk to feel smug. So in that case, stop being an egregious asshat.

    That is all.

    :)

  363. a_ray_in_dilbert_space says

    Nerd of Redhead,
    You are entirely too generous. First, Danny boy did not stick the first flounce. Do-overs should be costly.

    Second, there was nothing creative in there, just more moaning about what meanies atheists are and some irrelevant revelations about being a carnivore in Dallas (redundant info to be sure). I’m afraid I have to be East German judge and give him a 3. But then I’m a mean atheist.

  364. Quodlibet says

    The fun never stops. While I was sleeping:

    Dan Manley @ #442:

    So goodbye. It’s been real. I don’t plan on coming back …

    You can bet he’s hanging around, though, keeping an eye on the discussion about HIMSELF. (Sorry, ‘Tis.)

    Moonkitty @ #449:

    What do you want to bet big brave Dan is one of those who is disgusted and would fire or shun us?

    Fire us? He wouldn’t HIRE us. And he wouldn’t even provide professional services to us. His website is very easy to find….Note that he only includes Christians in his bankruptcy clientele. (Is that legal?)

    ReyFox @ #451:

    Also, I’m a little confused on one point. Are we losers with no lives or are we debauched perverts?

    HAH!

    Mak @ #455:

    I wonder what kind of perversions he’s talking about.

    Isn’t it interesting that they always seem to focus on “perversions?” I thought we were talking about atheism vs. religion, and all of a sudden he’s onto perversions? My sense is that so many of the ultra-Christians have so many hang-ups about sex and their own sexuality that they have to enter the pod of Christianity where they are only allowed to be straight and narrow(-minded), so they don’t have to deal openly with their “perversions.” But they never stop thinking about it, do they? And of course, many of them give in to their natural selves and desires and then we all laugh at them for their hypocrisy.

    AmVik @ #462

    I think Captain America went to his head.

    LOL

    Audley @ #480

    In other words, you seriously lack the imagination and intelligence to make an argument that would cause us to stop and think. Your position is every bit as shallow as the uneducated creationists that show up here.

    Except he has better grammar and spelling than most of religious nuts who show up here (“principal” notwithstanding, and Owlmirror @ 486, that was hilarious!)

    chigau @ #483

    Audley
    so that’s what the OM is for

    Hear, hear!

  365. says

    Bye Dan, stick the flounce. Come out from behind your white, Christian, straight, cisgendered male privilege for once and learn what it means to have to worry about whether you’ll have a job or not if someone finds out about your gender issues.

  366. Carlie says

    Oh Dan,
    Partly, pseudonymity is specifically for the internet. Many of us are just as out atheists IRL, but that’s to people we actually know. On the internet, there are crackpots like Dennis Marzuke and the 8000 Fox viewers profiled earlier who like to send death threats to atheists. Nobody wants to attract that.
    Partly, pseudonymity has to do with our jobs. Many of us are educators. And parents have a funny way of being real sticklers about wanting all teachers to be just exactly like them when it comes to religion. It would be just as risky to use our legal names in places like WorldNetDaily or any other religious site as it is to use them on atheist sites. Even those of us who teach adults have to be wary, lest students find our comments and then claim made-up discrimination based on our outside of class beliefs.
    And partly, pseudonymity is to help keep the spheres of our lives separate, the way that EVERYONE does IRL anyway. You don’t say the exact same things to your parents that you do to your officemates around the water cooler that you do to your friends at your weekly poker game that you do to your kids. It’s not hiding parts of your personality, it’s social consciousness of what kinds of topics are appropriate to discuss in what arenas. Since anyone can access everywhere on the internet, the only way to maintain the separateness of those spheres is to use a different name for each.
    And finally, there are people who simply can’t be found by certain others in the first place. It’s the kind of thing people like you like to pretend doesn’t happen, but there are people who have been victims of abusers who would happily hunt them down and go at it again. Those people can’t risk their real names being out where other people could track them down. One of the biggest bits of news when Google Buzz did their clusterfuckastrophe of social networking was that one woman’s abusive ex-husband immediately found her via the email address contacts Buzz made public, after she had spent a couple of years rebuilding her life in a safe place away from him.

    So you can take your superiority complex over what name people use as their handle and shove it up your ass. Besides, there’s nothing to say that the things that look like “real” names are. It’s just as easy to choose a name like Carlie or Dan that has nothing to do with your given name as it does to choose something like unicorngrl or superlovr or Twiddly McEstonshire the Fourth.

  367. Dhorvath, GravityMagnet says

    Dan,
    Not much I can add, but you really dropped the ball on the pseudonym front. People here give as they are able, we don’t shame anyone into doing more than they find comfortable. In fact shame is a social tool that you will find most people here actually abhor vehemently. When you try to use it to elicit a response the effect is for us to look down on you as a sanctimonious manipulative ass. Our atmosphere here is contentious, it’s unruly, and it’s welcoming so long as people are here to learn as opposed to preaching. I doubt you would understand the attraction which makes me a little sad.

  368. Audley Z. Darkheart OM, purveyor of candy and lies says

    Quodlibet:

    Except he has better grammar and spelling than most of religious nuts who show up here (“principal” notwithstanding, and Owlmirror @ 486, that was hilarious!)

    Most, yeah. But it seems like the ones who can (for the most part) spell and construct a sentence are always smug about it– as if they expect that we are a bunch of ignoramuses who will be wowed by their command of the written word.

    It’s all the same thing. It’s just “Im beter then u cuz i no Jeezuz” with an added layer of pomposity.

    (To be honest, I didn’t even catch the “principal” mistake until Owlmirror pointed it out. I won’t hold that against Dan. I’ve a wicked headache this morning, so maybe that’s making me a little more charitable than usual. *shrugs*)

  369. Barbara says

    Hi all, I’ve come back to visit to give you all some more fodder to feed your poor little minds. Yep, you all are in competition with each other to see who is the baddest bser. Guess who wins? All of you. You all hate. You hate everything and pretend with each other that you support each other. No you have no idea what it is to have a real friend. You all have no values. You value nothing except each others badness.
    You think that is living? I guess it’s the only way you know. Keep up the wall you surround your self with because no one wants to identify with your self proclaimed inner evilness. I know that makes you feel good. If I called you scum like you think of your self then I would be just like you. No thanks. I will be the scantimounious one that you call me because you reject anything that might be good about you or any one else. You have lost the ability to distinguish what is good in this world and you embrace what you feel is bad.
    Thats your choice and thats why you all feel the need to destroy others.
    Some of you may grow up and get some smarts who knows. But most of you will wallow in misery forever.
    I really feel for you. Have fun disecting this post as its what you are really good at.

  370. Makyui says

    No you have no idea what it is to have a real friend.

    Thanks for telling us how we totally really are. You sure do have everything figured out.

    Sounds more like you just want to have a reason to scorn us and feel superior to us, because feeling disgusted towards atheists and thinking we’re just sad, angry people is what you’re supposed to do as a Good Christian™.

    In other words: you’re projecting.