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SD Legislator Tortures an Analogy

Good analogies are something of an art form. They don’t have to be accurate in every detail, of course, only in the relevant ones. But they can’t be the exact opposite, as is the case with the analogy used by South Dakota state Rep. Steve Hickey, sponsor of a new bill to exempt businesses from dealing with icky gay people.

Rep. Steve Hickey, R-Sioux Falls, the lead House sponsor of the measures, said the bills are tolerant of gay people and those who oppose same-sex marriage. Gay people can find someone to marry them and provide wedding services, but they shouldn’t be able to force pastors or businesses to take part.

Hickey, pastor of a Sioux Falls church, said a court ruling legalizing gay marriage in South Dakota might expose him to lawsuits or prosecution because he believes in traditional marriage between a man and a woman.

“Religious rights need to continue to trump gay rights. Otherwise, we’re heading down the road of Iran, where it’s convert or die, be quiet or die,” Hickey said. “If we want to talk about church and state, this is a bill that keeps the state out of my church.”

Um. Iran is a perfect example of “religious rights” trumping gay rights. In Iran, gay people can be put to death because religious bigots demand it.

Comments

  1. Alverant says

    Hickey does know that a business is not a church right? And that the equal marriage ruling doesn’t require churches to perform any ceremonies they don’t want to perform? And no one is threatening his life if he doesn’t “convert” (to what?) or be quiet?

  2. cottonnero says

    Gays are bad.
    Muslims are bad.
    Therefore, Gays are Muslims.

    (You can sub out ‘Gays’ for ‘Atheists’ and get an even more on-the-nose wingnut syllogism.)

  3. scienceavenger says

    I wonder if Christians acted like this when it was determined that mental illness was not caused by the devil.

    @2, thanks, now I have to explain to my coworkers what I’m snorting about

  4. Captain Mike says

    “Good analogies can help explain things. Bad analogies are like the holocaust.” – Marcus Ranum.

    I’m stealing that bit.

  5. raven says

    I wonder if Christians acted like this when it was determined that mental illness was not caused by the devil.

    I don’t see why.

    A lot of fundies haven’t figured that out yet. Demons are very in these days as the all purpose explanation for everything.

  6. Numenaster says

    I’ll be happy to keep my state out of his church if he’ll just keep his church out of my state.

  7. Michael Heath says

    I’ve pretty much discarded with analogies a couple of years ago. I found I was typically using them as a lazy method to make an argument, rather than merely illustrating an argument.

    The argument for the utility of analogy, that it’s helpful in explaining an argument, can obviously be true. But I’ve found that far too often analogies are used in lieu of a good argument. One of the most frustrating examples is when someone is misinformed or uninformed on a topic, and uses an analogy on a topic they know, where the analogy not only fails miserably because it’s not analogous, but the advocate doesn’t even know that since they never made the effort to become informed on the subject topic.

    And for myself, mostly discarding with analogies has forced me to spend more energy making a better argument. That in turn has sometimes had me discovering my own position is far weaker than I previously thought. So now I find myself far more open to considering other arguments contra the poor position I currently held; that rather than expounding on a topic where I’m ready for prime-time. Pointing these failures out to some people when you do the know the topic at hand can be dicey given so many people’s inability to be corrected on the types of issues we argue here and in similar forums (politics and religion).

    Another benefit I’ve enjoyed is that by working through all this the past couple of years, I’m now far better equipped to critique the cogency of others’ arguments.

    So, “just say no to analogies”. Instead strive to achieve the false attribution to Albert Einstein; understand an issue well enough that you can explain it your grandparents.

  8. peterh says

    Funny how “traditional marriage” is for these nutters only one of the many traditions that might be called upon. I wonder if Hickey, pursuing the woman of his dreams, would agree to marrying her sister first, entering seven years indentured servitude to her father, and then committing bigamy with the primary choice. Quite sure I saw that scenario in the book I’m quite sure he’s desperate to use in support of his special pleading.

  9. mjmiller says

    @Marcos #2 , Captain #6
    Me too! With your permission (and attribution) that is so going on my office wall.

  10. comfychair says

    Mr Ed @ #8:
    “Would it be OK for me not to serve Republican house members if it was for religious reasons?”

    No, of course not. Religious freedom only applies to religions that have been proven to be true like their own particular flavor of Christianity, not any of those other obviously false religions.

  11. eric says

    “If we want to talk about church and state, this is a bill that keeps the state out of my church.”

    Stop using your church as a place of business and you won’t be bound by business anti-discrimination laws. If you’re going to rent out your church space to people to get married, then you’re a business as well as a church, and you have to obey the law.

  12. leonardschneider says

    Yeah Hickey, in practicality I doubt you have much to worry about. I question whether there are gay and lesbian couples all over South Dakota saying, “So we’ve picked out the invitations, the caterer is all lined up, but we still need an officiant.”
    “Hey, I’ve got a great idea!”
    “What’s that, hon?”
    “For our minister, let’s get a noisy bigoted fuckbag who hates us!”
    “Darling, you’re brilliant. It’ll give the ceremony a certain…. edginess we wouldn’t have otherwise.”
    “I wonder if we could hire Westboro Baptist to picket the reception?”
    “Check their website; I think they have a price list… Yeah, here it is. Oooh, for an extra $200 they’ll valet cars.”

  13. Thumper: Token Breeder says

    “Religious rights need to continue to trump gay rights. Otherwise, we’re heading down the road of Iran, where it’s convert or die, be quiet or die,”

    Wait… so religious rights trumping all other rights leads to a situation where it’s convert or die… no, that’s not what he’s saying. Religious rights trumping all other rights leads to a situation where it is not convert or die… er. *headsplosion*

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