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Farah vs NRA

This could make another good wingnut on wingnut crime report, but there’s more to it than that. Worldnutdaily founder Joseph Farah disagrees with his good friends at the NRA. He thinks putting an armed guard in every school leads to a “police state,” so better to arm union thugs, I mean, teachers and administrators.

America doesn’t need more police.

America doesn’t need a “civilian national security force,” as Barack Obama has suggested.

And America certainly doesn’t need more firearms in the hands of the government – local, state or federal.

What America needs to avert future Sandy Hook Elementary School disasters is the following…Armed and trained teachers and administrators in schools – not armed police and security guards.

How odd. Hiring police officers to guard the schools creates a “police state,” but arming teachers and administrators — you know, the ones he’s usually calling union thugs who hate America and are trying to destroy Christianity by teaching evolution and such — does not. Funny, that.

Most of all what America needs is a genuine return to God in which, at the very least, those who profess belief in Him follow the prescription of 2 Chronicles 7:14: “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Aren’t there millions of people doing that every day? What’s the magic number required?

Comments

  1. says

    And America certainly doesn’t need more firearms in the hands of the government – local, state or federal.
    What America needs to avert future Sandy Hook Elementary School disasters is the following…Armed and trained teachers and administrators in schools – not armed police and security guards.

    Interesting. Does he know that union thugsteachers and administrators are employees of local governments?

  2. imrryr says

    One armed guard per school = police state
    Dozens of armed teachers and administrators per school = not a police state

    Nope. I don’t get it either.

  3. bobafuct says

    My mom is a teacher and I wouldn’t trust her with a gun to save my life, regardless of whatever “training” she were to get.

  4. dingojack says

    Oh yes, a running gun battle in a school’s grounds or buildings, conducted by two or more persons with guns, will make the chances of some kid getting killed or injured by a stray bullet just so much less likely.
    @@
    Dingo

  5. says

    I have to hand it to the gun-nut lobby. They’ve successfully turned the conversation into which people should be carrying the greater number of guns we need.

  6. ibbica says

    Aren’t there millions of people doing that every day? What’s the magic number required?

    As good a guess as any: “2 or 3″ (i.e. Matthew 18:20)

    Er… wait, what?

  7. glodson says

    As a teacher to be, I have a burning question. Actually, a few. Am I going to get hazard pay? I am going to be given the duty to put myself in harm’s way as an armed guard. Who is providing the weapons? Am I getting paid for my extra training?

    The plan to arm teachers seems really dumb, and I don’t want a fucking gun. As I understand it, it takes, training beyond marksmenship to handle a crisis as an armed guard. I doubt that more guns in schools is the solution.

  8. coragyps says

    “If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and shoot the fuck out of the Bad Guys, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.”

    – fixed.

  9. yoav says

    Of course arming teachers is not the answer. The only solution is to equip all schools with the Temple of Doom™ security system (patent pending) placing randomly spaced pressure plates around the schools so anyone who doesn’t know the key will trigger a barrage of poison darts, swinging axe blades and a huge boulder. However, as we learned from the Indiana Jones documentaries, this kind of security system can be breached, and I’m working of the assumption that the NRA will not support regulating bullwhips, a backup must be provided I suggest we bury a small nuclear bomb (10 Megaton or so) under every school and implant a comic-book villain class deadman switch next to the heart of every student and staff member that will trigger the bomb as soon as the heart stop, this way only a single death could be attributed to gun violence.

  10. John Hinkle says

    I’d be as nervous as a long tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs if I was in a school where essentially all the adults were packing.

  11. Reginald Selkirk says

    glodson #9″: As a teacher to be, I have a burning question….

    But just think how much this is going to improve your negotiating firepower during teacher union negotiations.

  12. Reginald Selkirk says

    In today’s news: Three cops in a New Jersey police station were shot when a suspect grabbed a gun. Once the schools are taken care of, we need to assign armed guards to every police station in the country.

  13. glodson says

    @15 I guess I could also prevent cheating. “Now you gotta ask yourself ‘do I feel prepared for this pop quiz?’ Well, do ya, punk?!”

    Hmmm, I am starting to figure out how some people view reality in which everything is improved with guns.

  14. sc_770d159609e0f8deaa72849e3731a29d says

    In fact, surely every school would lead at least three armed guards.
    If there was only one armed guard they might start unexpectedly shooting the students.
    If there were two armed guards one might unexpectedly shoot the other and then start shooting the students.
    If there were three armed guards then one might unexpectedly shoot another guard but the third guard would- with luck- shoot the homicidal guard before they start shooting the students. However, while it seems both guards would be on equal terms, the murderous guard would still have the advantage of surprise over their colleague.
    To be fairly sure a guard would be alive to deal with their potentially homicidal colleague before they start shooting the students every school would need at least four- possibly more- armed guards.
    Or it might be more sensible to restrict access to weapons.

  15. says

    You’ve got to admit, Christianist Republicans have marketing down to a science. Who needs thoughtful debate and a thorough examination of issues when you can just make a bumper sticker that says: “Less taxes, more guns” with an image of Clint Eastwood holding a .44 Magnum with smoke coming out of the barrel?
    Thinking and logic are for sissies!

  16. harold says

    There are two kinds of gun violence in the US. The more common kind, where, due to harsh but useless drug prohibition and deeply ingrained social inequality, young male members of an underclass with few other opportunities kill each other for drug-dealing turf. And the rarer kind, in which deranged individuals, predominantly white males, heavily arm themselves and go on sprees, killing the defenseless innocent. The more common kind is, admittedly, more common. Countries other than the US sometimes have problems with the less common type, for example, recently, Norway.

    The only “second amendment” debate is what the limitations should be. Virtually no-one says private individuals should be allowed to buy rocket launchers.

    In my opionion, absolutely the only way progressives can effectively push for regulations is by buying guns themselves and letting right wingers know it. Owning guns comes with some risk, but this is the only way it will happen.

    There is a widespread and largely correct idea on the right, that only right wingers have guns. Needless to say, they love this situation, and if you make the mistake of looking under the rock, in addition to the racist vigilante fantasies, you will find that fantasies of gunning down unarmed “liberals” are not terribly rare.

    However, the country is ultimately ruled, not so much by the extreme right directly, but by ignorant “undecided” morons, who haven’t got a clue. The fantasy of being protected from bad sadistic sociopaths by another sadistic sociopath is deepling ingrained in the minds of dullwit “swing voters”. They responded to a terrorist attack by supporting sociopaths who started useless wars, and they respond to killing sprees by groveling to sociopaths similar to the spree killers, in the vain hope that they will be “protected”.

    However, if progressives were to start owning guns, the right wing taste for gun ownership would be less enthusiastic. And no, I don’t have one yet.

    Unfortunately, logic isn’t working. The pattern has been the same for several decades now. Whenever the right wing gets a chance to do macho posturing, they dominate. The best thing is sane gun regulation, but the second best thing is ending the deranged wingnut monopoly on guns.

  17. says

    harold “However, if progressives were to start owning guns, the right wing taste for gun ownership would be less enthusiastic.”
    Won’t work. Much as liberal Christians aren’t Real True Christians (necessitating the push for more Real True Christian Laws), they won’t be True American Gun Owners, instead being “hippies ‘defending’ their marihuana and unwed coitus” or somesuch, (and the Right’s solution, of course, will be More Bigger Guns).

  18. dingojack says

    If 10Mt are for ‘weinees'; then, i assume, 15Mt are for ‘weinors’
    Is that an admission? :)
    ;Dingo

  19. says

    “I doubt that more guns in schools is the solution.”

    VIewing all problems as nails depends upon you’re being a salesman for the hammer manufacturers? I’m sure that S&W, Glock, Colt and the thousands of people who manufacture and deal in arms are thrilled at the prospect.

    “ibbica – Yes but – what heat would Jesus pack? Dingo”

    This, maybe?

    http://media.beta.photobucket.com/user/redsyndicate/media/jesus-machine-gun.jpg.html?filtersterm=jesus%20with%20a%20gun&filtersprimary=images&filterssecondary=videos&sort=1&o=2#/user/redsyndicate/media/jesus-machine-gun.jpg.html?filters%5Bterm%5D=jesus%20with%20a%20gun&filters%5Bprimary%5D=images&filters%5Bsecondary%5D=videos&sort=1&o=2&_suid=135678216716007797904287199928

    Harold:

    I think your logic is deeply flawed.

    This:

    “There are two kinds of gun violence in the US. The more common kind, where, due to harsh but useless drug prohibition and deeply ingrained social inequality, young male members of an underclass with few other opportunities kill each other for drug-dealing turf. And the rarer kind, in which deranged individuals, predominantly white males, heavily arm themselves and go on sprees, killing the defenseless innocent.”

    is untrue.

    There are many people killed for all sorts of different reasons. This table from the FBI’s Uniform Crime Report of 2011:

    http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-10

    Goes into some detail.

    Arming more people will mean, if history is a guide; more people will be shot with their own guns, more guns will be stolen during burglaries and robberies,. more people will commit suicide.

    Arming people so that other armed people will think twice about attacking them is what got the U.S. to this pass.

    Bircher and other anti-communist conspiracy theorists allied themselves with the NRA’s hardliners and every whackjob delusional faux patriot is arming up for Gummintageddon.

    All of the guys in the U.S. with guns that think they’re the bulwark against which an armed takeover of the U.S. by the U.S. will break itself upon? They’re lunatics, gunzloonz. If push came to shove the U.S. military would be turned loose on the likes of the Hutaree Militia and all of those Neonazi wannabes up in the Pacific Northwest and other locales–some of them WANT that to happen. The U.S. military would do the same thing that they’ve done in every foreign war (or the U.S. Civil Wars–both of them). They would send out heavily armed units and, when they inevitably drew fire, they would kill everything in front of their guns. That’s the way they work. Kill everybody and let a LOVING GOD sort it out.

    No, more guns is a VERY, VERY, REALLY FUCKING BAD IDEA.

    This is hardly an authoritative source but

  20. harold says

    Democommie –

    My apologies for provoking that

    spittleflecking rage

    In fact I more or less agree with your points. To some degree, you are arguing “against” the same points you are making.

    This:

    “There are two kinds of gun violence in the US. The more common kind, where, due to harsh but useless drug prohibition and deeply ingrained social inequality, young male members of an underclass with few other opportunities kill each other for drug-dealing turf. And the rarer kind, in which deranged individuals, predominantly white males, heavily arm themselves and go on sprees, killing the defenseless innocent.”

    is untrue.

    Of course it’s not literally true that there are exactly two kinds of gun violence. I anticipated that the reader would understand that this was not my meaning, and that I was generalizing in a dramatic way for effect.

    (However, the type of gun violence which I correctly describe as the more common kind is, in fact, far more common in the US than in most other rich countries, and the factors I cite are the main reasons. You argue against that point by providing a link to a reference that makes that point.)

    No, more guns is a VERY, VERY, REALLY FUCKING BAD IDEA.

    I am not disputing that, relative to less guns, more guns is a bad idea.

    However, your underlying assumption seems to be that arguing rationally for reasonable gun control, from a liberal perspective, will increase the chances of achieving reasonable gun control.

    I wish that were true, but I increasingly believe that it isn’t.

    In frustration, I ask myself what would work.

    If white male conservative support for the NRA dropped, then there would be reasonable gun control.

    It will never drop as long as gun ownership is seen as something that makes white male conservatives superior to others.

    I concede that this is a highly controversial and inflammatory suggestion, but hey, this is FTB, so yes, I am suggesting that maybe if “feminazis”, “gay agenda activists”, and even “Marxists” like Barrack Obama suddenly started buying guns, wingnuts might start supporting gun control. And then the rest of us could agree with them.

  21. says

    If we atheists start going to church and announcing that religion is fucked I don’t think it will make the fundies less fundy.

    I don’t know if you’re aware of this:

    http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/newspaper-publishes-gun-owners-names-addresses-215214269–abc-news-topstories.html

    but the comments (of which there were over 20K a few days ago) that I read were very critical of the newspaper for publishing the list.

    It seems that they want everyone to have guns but they don’t want anybody to know who has them. I can think of one reason that a lot of gunzloonz want to do such a thing. They want to be able to kill people that they find scary AND not have to worry about the consequences.

    I will posit that if there were a number of high profile white gun advocates murdered by blacks toting guns and the blacks claimed, “Stand your ground” and “Castle law” defenses that the situation would change. Is that what we want? I sure don’t.

    Liberals/progressives can’t, in any case, “arm up” and continue being progressives. In the event, if they did, the gunzloonz would just get more and more powerful weapons.

    What was a bit humorous about the article I linked to was listening to the badass gunzloonz whining. They seemed to have missed the fact that it the criminulz were told who had pistol permits they were told, as well, who didn’t.

    If you go to my blog (polrant.blogspot.com) you will see that I have been writing extremely over the top posts about gunz for some time now. The average KKKristian fundy annoys the shit out of me. The gunzloonz are a source of some concern. Fundamentalist gunzloonz are usually delusional and scary. I do not see that increasing the number of firearms available will work on making these people let go of their gunz and biblez.

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