Pastor — and deranged lunatic — John Hagee has a book out explaining why America is “under judgment” by God for our terribly sinful ways. He presents a number of “proofs” of this by citing mundane and routine facts that have existed in every society at different times.
Some of those “proofs” are in pretty obvious conflict. For example, he claims that the economic problems we’re experiencing are evidence of God’s judgment, but then he also cites America’s losses in the Vietnam and Korean wars as evidence of God’s judgment. But since those two wars, we’ve had many cycles of raging economic growth and many wars that resulted in quick victory (to whatever extent any war can be called victory). So apparently God’s judgment waxes and wanes and, naturally, works in mysterious ways.
But then when he’s talking about the Vietnam and Korean wars, he says that it was the fault of Congress for not going for “all out victory.” So which is it, did we lose because of bad political decisions or did we lose because of God’s judgment? He also cites the divorce rate, which has actually been going down for years. Does that mean we’re not under God’s judgment quite as much as we were before? How do we measure this?
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democommie
June 3, 2012 at 9:40 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
If there was a punishing GOD who was going to smite the wrongdoers, Hagee would have disappeared in a blinding flash, years ago, leaving nothing but a greasy stain on the spot where he had been standing. KKKristianity is fucking poison.
tommykey
June 3, 2012 at 9:51 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
So, some powerful entity created a universe filled with billions of galaxies each containing billions of planets, but its primary concern is paying an inordinate interest in the habits and activities of the people of the United States.
Jeremy Shaffer
June 3, 2012 at 10:19 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
tommykey- That’s pretty much right, which anyone with the modesty and humility that comes so easy to many Christians would see that.
/sarcasm
John Phillips, FCD
June 3, 2012 at 10:35 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Yeah but, USA, USA, oh look, over there, a squirrel…
Larry
June 3, 2012 at 10:48 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
When you have super, magic-licious powers, being an über-multitasker really isn’t that hard.
dingojack
June 3, 2012 at 11:18 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
aren’t divorce rates the highest amonst the highly religious areas of the US? Or are they the ‘wrong kind’ of religious belief?
Dingo
reverendrodney
June 3, 2012 at 11:31 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
The reason Hagee and others of his ilk spew such bullshit is because they know that regardless what they say, their flocks remain in thrall, following wherever they are lead.
It is the need for a leader that totally mystifies me. Maybe I am too independent. Maybe I possess that quality of the mind that preachers abhor… critical thinking.
raven
June 3, 2012 at 11:35 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Sure.
But not all habits and activities of the people of the United States.
It’s known that god created the universe so that he could mostly and deeply care about the sex lives of Americans.
laurentweppe
June 3, 2012 at 11:39 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
He’s right: America’s struggling economy is God punishment for spending 30 years indulging in the Sin of Reaganomics. So sayeth the Prophet Krugman
raven
June 3, 2012 at 11:44 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
It’s simpler than that.
MONEY!!! Follow the money.
Hagee and the rest of the vaguely humanoid toad fundie leaders get paid millions of dollars, tens of millions, and more to babble like idiots. Pat Robertson is a billionaire.
Can’t forget the sex either. Some of these guys turn out to be pedophiles or end up with lots of girl and boy friends.
Hagee is one of the more obvious liars. He once claimed that on Halloween night, the US satanists sacrifice a million human children, according to a commenter on FTB’s. That would be 1/4 of all US children born each year.
timgueguen
June 3, 2012 at 11:51 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I get the impression he must not know much about the Korean War if he thinks it was a defeat. It was a stalemate. But that’s probably a better thing than the all out war that might have resulted between East and West if they’d done stupid things like used nukes, which is what MacArthur wanted to do.
criticaldragon1177
June 3, 2012 at 12:54 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Ed Brayton
Someone should ask Hagee about the black death and not to mention other pandemics that happened, much worse than anything going on today in America that happened when people actually behave much more like “good” Christians as he would see it. Things like gay marriage weren’t even accepted until very recently and yet in the past there were far worse epidemics even here.
1918 flu pandemic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flu_epidemic_of_1918
JoeBuddha
June 3, 2012 at 1:53 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
One of the proofs that America is cursed has to be the proliferation of people like Hagee polluting our national discourse.
raven
June 3, 2012 at 2:07 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
LOL. I’ve always thought the evidence for the existence of satan was far greater than that for the xian god. Hagee would be one of many data points.
NH
June 3, 2012 at 2:21 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
The man is a genius: he makes money out of peddling rubbish. If something goes wrong it is our fault – if goes well it is down to god. You cant win. But the central belief, that those who abide by god’s law prosper, is an emprical claim that can be tested; as it happens the secular democracies are the most successful counties on the planet and the theocracies? Well they are failed states. So we have god to thank for that (irony).
bobaho
June 3, 2012 at 3:09 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I dunno, the choice between Willard and Barack to lead the country is a “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” scenario. Is that punishment or a cruel joke?
fifthdentist
June 3, 2012 at 4:01 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
“… and the theocracies? Well they are failed states.”
That’s beause the theoracies like Iran are ruled by godless Muslimofasists. A Jeebub-based theoracy would be totally different.
Midnight Rambler
June 3, 2012 at 4:13 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
We lost because God softened Congress’ heart. Like Pharaoh, but in reverse.
Also, I’m pretty sure the stalemate in Korea was the result of going for total victory, which brought in the Chinese.
robertfaber
June 3, 2012 at 4:21 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
We lost due to our refusal to commit genocide, or at least, to the scale required for victory. That’s what it would have taken to “win” in both Korea and Vietnam, tens of millions of dead civilians.
dan4
June 3, 2012 at 5:32 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
“So which is it, did we lose because of bad political decisions or did we lose because of God’s judgement?”
Ed, I’m wondering if Hagee just expressed himself poorly, and what he actually meant was that one of the reasons America is (in his warped mind) “under judgement” from God is BECAUSE OF these “bad political decisions” (yes, that viewpoint still nutty and offensive, but it’s not one that involves the contradiction you mention here).
WMDKitty
June 3, 2012 at 7:37 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
“Pastor — and deranged lunatic”
I thought being a deranged lunatic was one of the requirements for being a pastor…
dingojack
June 3, 2012 at 9:47 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
can one be a ‘ranged lunatic’?
Dingo
—–
PS: A least I get to use one of my favourite John Cooper Clarke lines:
“Leeds leather lovelies, deliciously, deliciously deranged”.
:)
jayarrrr
June 4, 2012 at 10:04 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
“One of the proofs that America is cursed has to be the proliferation of people like Hagee polluting our national discourse.”
And JoeBuddha wins The Internets for today.