There’s an interesting lawsuit going on in Massachusetts, where a family is challenging a school for having students recite the Pledge of Allegiance every morning. But the case is in state court rather than federal court and is based on the equal protection guarantees in that state’s constitution rather than on the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
Reciting the words “under God” during the Pledge of Allegiance discriminates and marginalizes the children of atheists, a Middlesex Superior Court was told on Monday.
“This is a daily exercise that favors a particular religious view and defines patriotism according to a particular religious belief,” said David Niosie, an attorney representing an Acton-Boxborough family, which has refused to identify itself.
“By conducting a daily exercise that says the nation is in fact under God in a patriotic context, which really suggests that non-believers are less patriotic that everyone else,” said Niosie, who would not say who was paying his legal fees.
Very well stated. The school doesn’t seem to care:
“This business that we’re marginalizing students,” said Dr. Stephen Mills, superintendent of the Acton-Boxborough school district. “There’s absolutely no recrimination, no negative consequences ever against a child who chooses not to say the pledge, or in this particular case, simply say the pledge and not say the words under God.”
Not by the school, perhaps, but there’s almost certainly recrimination by other students and by the larger community. That’s why the family has filed anonymously, as Does, because they fear — quite rightly — such recrimination. Just take a look at what is happening right now to Jessica Ahlquist for challenging Christian hegemony. This isn’t some crazy hypothetical; more than one family has had its house firebombed over this kind of thing, and nearly every family who has ever challenged such activities has been the victim of, at the very least, harassment and intimidation.
The very fact that these kids are saying the pledge but omitting the words ‘under God’ rather than just refusing to say it and therefore being set apart from everyone else in that way speaks to the entirely legitimate fear of retaliation that they face every day. That the school superintendent cares so little about that is really appalling.
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Kevin nyc
February 16, 2012 at 1:12 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I am on the board of directors for my small community. When we have an open meeting (3x a year) we start by saying the Pledge of Allegiance
I stand and say it but leave out the words “under god”. If I had to do it every weekday it would start to get annoying…
esp. since they added it in there afterwards…
Sqrat
February 16, 2012 at 1:25 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Or perhaps the child could simply insert “no” between “under” and “God”.
Since the wording of the Pledge of Allegiance is defined by law, if you change the wording, are you saying the Pledge of Allegiance, or are you saying something else?
matty1
February 16, 2012 at 1:25 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Do you think they should be told the pledge was written by a socialist?
cag
February 16, 2012 at 1:45 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
It is interesting that the so called (religious) adults commenting at thebostonchannel have forgotten how as children they strove to be a part of the “in” group. How many children have the ability to go against the crowd? How many children would be comfortable being “them” instead of “us”? Hypocrites with poor memories are sad indeed.
Jafafa Hots
February 16, 2012 at 1:51 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
With or without God, a pledge of allegiance is immoral.
timberwoof
February 16, 2012 at 2:13 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
In high school I refused to say the pledge at all. I told the teacher that I had sworn fealty to King Arthur and thus could not pledge allegiance to a flag until he returned to release me from his service. Teacher wrote me off as a weirdo and didn’t bother me again.
Courage Wolf says, “Found permanent record. At it for breakfast.”
The Lorax
February 16, 2012 at 2:20 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I live in Massachusetts, and in high school, I personally omitted the phrase “under God” during the pledge. I didn’t catch any flak for it, though of course, no one saw me; everyone being pointed at the flag at the time, nor heard me; everyone speaking at the time. I’m sure no other student would have caught flak for it either, given the inevitable lawsuits that would spring up if she or he did. But maybe Massachusetts is different from other places… or maybe just the area I grew up in.
However, even if there is no punishment (either from the school or from other students) for failing to say the pledge properly, it does NOT change the fact that the school promotes this as an activity. It IS a textbook violation of the First Amendment.
When I heard about Massachusetts legalizing same sex marriage, I admit I was moved by a little state pride. I’d love to see this go through; getting rid of those two words in the pledge would be magnificent. Finally, the McCarthy era is becoming the ugly stain in history that it should be, and nothing more.
Hercules Grytpype-Thynne
February 16, 2012 at 2:43 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
For what it’s worth, I have a child in the school district in question and I believe Mills may be correct when he says that there are no recriminations for not saying the pledge or for omitting “under God”. My child makes no secret of being an atheist, and omits “under God” when the pledge is said, and as far as I know has suffered no adverse social consequences for the omission (or the atheism). This is, overall, a fairly liberal and tolerant community. On the other hand, I entirely understand the family’s desire for anonymity – it’s one thing to silently abstain from the pledge or a portion of it, and another to very publicly rock the boat by mounting a legal challenge.
The first I’d ever heard of this case was in this week’s local paper. I’ll be interested in watching this firsthand as it develops. My (perhaps pollyannaish) guess is that there will be some backlash, but nothing nearly as vehement as what happened in, say, the Ahlquist case. But I’m prepared to be wrong.
jufulu
February 16, 2012 at 2:49 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I found out not too long ago that my son has been standing but remaining silent during the Pledge since Junior High (he is now a Junior in HS). He was doing this all on his own. The things you find out about your kids when you talk to them.
khms
February 16, 2012 at 3:13 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I cannot help but think that having any version of the Pledge is an obscenity in a modern democracy. This kind of thing is typical for authoritarian states.
fastlane
February 16, 2012 at 3:14 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Hercules Grytpype-Thynne, does your child know that the right to not say the pledge at all is constitutionally guaranteed? Do you think your child (or you) would be willing to simply sit quietly through it and see what happens?
There may be no recriminations because, as the Lorax notes, probably no one notices.
duck1887
February 16, 2012 at 3:27 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I never said “under God,” but nobody ever noticed, let alone cared. (We also had a “moment of silence,” which never bothered me, as it gave me a head start on the day’s crossword puzzle – they can get pretty tough by Friday!) What bothers me about the Pledge is less that it “defines patriotism according to a particular religious belief” than that it defines it according to a particular ritual, and a meaningless one at that. The flag is an inanimate object, to which it makes no sense to “pledge allegiance.” As for the “republic” it denotes, I already have the rights and duties of my American citizenship; for example, treason is already illegal, no matter what words I may recite on the morning of the day I commit it. And even if the pledge did add anything new, it is rendered entirely meaningless by a) being coerced; and b) (especially) being repeated daily, until it is merely a rhythmic mass of phonemes with no particular semantic significance (just ask Richard Stans).
Sorry, this thing always bugged me, ever since wingnuts had a freakout over it in the Bush I vs. Dukakis election. Question: if the pledge passes the Lemon test, does that make it Lemon Pledge?
Hercules Grytpype-Thynne
February 16, 2012 at 3:32 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
@11: I personally would happily sit silently during the pledge. If you’re asking me to speculate about what my child would be comfortable doing, I don’t know. I might ask. If you’re asking me if I would be comfortable suggesting that she make herself a guinea pig, no, I wouldn’t, but I would unconditionally support such an undertaking if she were to arrive at the idea independently.
As I said, she makes no secret of not believing in God. I rather doubt no one notices this.
eric
February 16, 2012 at 4:13 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Hercules @8, it is very good to hear that there is no overt problems for your kid.
However, I think the pledge defenders are just lying and that it would be trivial to show it. Have the school change the pledge for just one week. For a mere five school days, have the students say “under no God” instead. See if the community thinks “just don’t say the words” is an acceptable compromise when it is their beliefs left out in the cold.
I will bet they won’t. I will bet that they only see this as a viable compromise when it is other people’s beliefs being marginalized. I bet that having students say “under no God” will be seen as completely unacceptable, an affront to their religious beliefs, etc… Anyone want to bet against me?
Beuller?
Crochety Scientismist
February 16, 2012 at 4:29 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Somebody mentioned Richard Stans; but I always wondered why I “led the pigeons to the flag…”
Seriously, The “God” phrase in the pledge, and the one on the money, serve an essential purpose as a reminder to Americans that government is not ordained by “We the People”, like it says on that scrap of parchment, but by God. As a Holy institution, government wields the “sword of God’s justice” and may not be judged by mere human standards. That’s not my assessment, but that of U.S. Supreme Court justice Antonin Scalia. Such reminders serve to save the US from falling into the excesses of democracy such as those found in “post-Christian” Europe. It’s just unfortunate that we have courts and elections instead of trial by combat, where the will of God becomes much more evident.
No, seriously. Read it yourself. Search for “God’s Justice and Ours” by Scalia, on the website of the religious journal “First Things.” You need to understand why secular democracy is the enemy of America.
dog healed my dyslexia
February 16, 2012 at 4:30 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I’m curious to know if there have been any challenges by non-theist or other teachers who object to having to lead the pledge in their classrooms. Anyone know of any such cases or what teachers’ rights are in this regard?
Doubting Thomas
February 16, 2012 at 4:37 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
So there is this cartoon wherein a teacher stands in front of a class alongside a presumably wounded wheelchair bound vet, and she addresses little Johnny telling him how this brave warrior was wounded so he could have the right not to say the pledge or salute the flag or something. I find it highly annoying. A bit more than peer pressure, more like psychological warfare on a kid.
busterggi
February 16, 2012 at 5:16 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Just bring back the original Bellamy salute and let’s see what the conservatives say.
They claim to be originalists.
Hercules Grytpype-Thynne
February 16, 2012 at 5:38 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
One correction: I’ve learned that High School students in the A-B system don’t say the Pledge. The issue is with the lower grades. This lets my daughter out as a potential guinea pig for just sitting it out.
otrame
February 16, 2012 at 6:46 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
When my son was in middle school a substitute noted that when they said the pledge he stood with the others and but said nothing. She asked him (in front of the whole class) why and he said that, aside from the fact that he did not wish to pledge allegiance to a piece of cloth, he would not use the phrase “underGod” because he was an atheist. She berated him for a while, ending up with “why don’t you just move to Russia, then?” He replied, “In Russia, they would force me to do it.” She sent him to the principal.
I will say this. This was here in Texas. Even so the principal called me and told me all about it and apologized profusely, insisting that such treatment was very much against policy and that the teacher in question would be reprimanded and sent to training. I could just hear the subtext: Please don’t sue, please don’t sue, please don’t sue.
I was proud of my kid. According to the teacher and the other kids that the principal spoke to, he had never made a big deal out of it in the past, and when confronted he was not disrespectful in any way (even though she was) but remained firm that he was not going to say the pledge.
Chiroptera
February 16, 2012 at 7:12 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
otrame, #20: This was here in Texas. Even so the principal called me and told me all about it and apologized profusely, insisting that such treatment was very much against policy and that the teacher in question would be reprimanded and sent to training. I could just hear the subtext: Please don’t sue, please don’t sue, please don’t sue.
Holy cow! A school official who actually understands that this is settled law? In the US?
-
…he was not disrespectful in any way (even though she was)….
Well, I can’t say anything about this particular teacher, but there is a political faction in the US (I won’t name it, but it rhymes with dumb-servative) that calls any disagreement “disrespect.” They are also the ones who think they are being too “civil.”
Oops — I think I just gave it away!
David D.G.
February 16, 2012 at 8:19 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
@ otrame, #20:
I live in Texas, too, and grew up going to public schools in Dallas. I consider your kid a hero, as well as a real patriot. Please tell him that I said so!
~David D.G.
Subtract Hominem
February 16, 2012 at 8:44 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Hercules @19
I myself am a graduate of the A-B school system. I graduated from the high school in 2006, and from the junior high 4 years prior. As I recall, the Pledge was never said in ABRHS, and at RJGJHS only once a week.
Back in my junior high days, I was a deistic, secular Jew (although I didn’t have the vocabulary to express my beliefs quite so specifically), and I omitted “under God” from the Pledge. Neither my classmates nor teachers said a word to me about it. Indeed, enough were atheist, agnostic, or otherwise irreligious that they did the same.
Although I could easily be wrong, I would speculate that the children of the plaintiffs in this case do not have to fear much in terms of harassment or bullying from their peers; Acton-Boxborough is not a district I think of as prone to much ignorance or superstition. For instance, I took biology with one of the worst teachers in the school’s science department, and even she was certain to make sure we understood why creationism and ID aren’t science (and by extension, what science is and how it works). Absolutely nobody in the class took offense to this lesson.
macallan
February 16, 2012 at 9:18 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
This sort of crap still creeps me out. All these ‘patriotic’ and flag-waving rituals remind me too much of growing up in eastern Germany in the early 1980s.
On that note, when I visited the US the first time in 2003, the massive display of security theatre made me check my ticket, to make sure it didn’t say ‘Tardis Air, destination: 1980s Soviet Union’.
monimonika
February 16, 2012 at 9:49 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I remember back in early grade school that I recited the pledge without a thought, but midway thru grade school I stopped because I realized the “under God” part of it was there. By that time, I had learned to associate “God” with the Christian God. And I despised what little I knew of the Christian God (the nasty jerk). So, I stopped reciting, but still stood up because I still wanted to show respect to the US (not the flag, but I hadn’t realized that part yet).
My younger sister was braver than me. She actually quietly sat thru the pledge in middle school. By herself. Other than an initial puzzled look from the teacher, no one really bothered her about it. That is, until several other students sitting behind her also began doing the same thing later in the year. To my sister’s shock, the teacher asked her whether she was “starting a movement”. My sister had never socially interacted with the students behind her, much less persuaded them to join her so-called “movement”.
Rip Steakface
February 16, 2012 at 11:53 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I’ve been intermittent with the pledge. In early grade school, I recited it normally, being a little kid. However, I’ve also been raised without any religion (not that my parents specifically raised me to be atheist – they simply never mentioned religion and let me come to my own conclusions, which happened around 3rd grade). Starting in about third grade and continuing til my sophomore year of high school, I left out the “under god” phrase.
Since then, I’ve been in Washington state’s Running Start program and so I’m not actually at my high school when the pledge is recited, so I haven’t said it for about a year.
Childermass
February 17, 2012 at 1:52 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I am actually surprised no one has said that the majority of students were not even as much as paying attention during the pledge. At least that was my experience. My family moved to Oklahoma for my senior year and for the life of me I can’t recall saying the pledge there though I suspect they did.
Moon Jaguar
February 17, 2012 at 7:15 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I started inserting “under scrod” into the Pledge when I was in high school in the early 70s. It was good for a cheap laugh. The anti-war movement was in full swing so few students (or teachers) respected the phony patriotism of the Pledge.
OTOH scrod save the brave families who stand up to this empty patriotic ritual that has become an empty religious ritual.
And Scalia can take a flying fuck.
eric
February 17, 2012 at 8:37 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
I started inserting “under scrod” into the Pledge when I was in high school in the early 70s.
I thought “underpants” was the preferred adolescent substitution. But hey, scrod works too.
dono
February 17, 2012 at 9:02 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
How long does it take to say the pledge? A minute? How many days in a school year? Usually about 180, right?
That’s three hours of time that could have been spent on something useful. Something, say, educational.
I propose eliminating the meaningless pledge and replacing it with something called the Constitutional Minute: facts about the US Constitution and your rights and responsibilities as citizens. We’d have a much more informed electorate, and most likely fewer Young Republicans.
The Lorax
February 17, 2012 at 10:16 am (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Nice idea, Dono. Perhaps we can have the students recite the Bill of Rights on a rotating schedule; 5 school days per week, two weeks to get through the 10 of them, then start over and continue.
Frankly, knowing about what you’re pledging yourself to is more important than pledging to it. And there are too many people who don’t even know what the First Amendment means, or even is. If we’re going to be demanding students sacrifice a bit of time each school day to become more in touch with their country, what better way to do it than for them to learn about what their rights as citizens are?
Jafafa Hots
February 17, 2012 at 10:26 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Anyone still reading this thread? Just found this elsewhere, perfectly encapsulates my thoughts on the pledge:
Chris from Europe
February 17, 2012 at 11:13 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
It’s a great video, especially the repeated lines denying the brainwashing.
Subtract Hominem
July 18, 2012 at 3:31 pm (UTC -4) Link to this comment
Anybody interested in what happened with this suit? “Under God” is here to stay, but it looks like there’s an appeal in the works.