Debating and rallying and reasoning, oh my!


Some quick updates on what some of us in the AXP camp are up to. Matt is, as you read this, getting ready to take the stage at West Texas A&M University in Amarillo for another debate. Here’s the flyer thingamajig.

Debate flyer

No, we don’t have any idea about their plans to record the debate, or post it online. Yes, we’ll embed it here the instant we find out such a thing exists.

In other news, yours truly (that would be me) just bought his plane ticket to Washington, so expect to see me at the Reason Rally in a month. I’ll be easy to spot, in that of all the godless hordes attending, I’ll be the only one who’s Martin Wagner. I don’t know about any plans from anyone else yet. As we get closer to the day, I’ll work out arrangements for an Atheist Experience meet up, perhaps the Friday night before. Maybe some of you who are attending and know DC a bit better than I do can think of some worthwhile places to hold one. Part of me is hoping that I step off the plane into the devastation of the Capital Wasteland, dodging super-mutants while Galaxy News Radio spins oldies over my ear buds. But I suspect the worst I’ll run into will be some dippy sidewalk evangelists.

Comments

  1. says

    That’s silly. The Declaration of Independence could say that our rights come from Batman – it doesn’t matter.

    The whole point is that a group of people got together and decided what rights we’d have. We still do it to this day.

    Our rights come from us. No technicality in something someone wrote down somewhere is going to change that.

    Isn’t it odd that most of the rights that are declared in the U.S. constitution are not rights from most religions? Christianity is not a democracy, after all. You do what God says, or else. The U.S. constitution spits in his face and says, “No, we’re doing things our way”.

  2. says

    There’s also the little matter that the Declaration of Independence is not the document on which our laws and very system of government are founded. That would be the thoroughly secular, doesn’t-mention-the-Bible-or-divine-authority-at-all, science-promotion, religious-test-for-public-office denying Constitution.

    Before the Enlightenment, I don’t think the Church was all that concerned with the “rights” of the people they were hanging, burning, breaking on the rack, or otherwise torturing and murdering in various imaginative ways.

    Let’s look at the things atheists support: quality education, free thought, health care, women’s rights, marriage equality, economic opportunity, peace — yep, regular fascists we.

    As usual, religiotards like Dan mistake “not getting what we want and being granted superiority and privilege all the time” for “you’re denying our rights!”

  3. says

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t know that slavery was wrong.

    Oh, wait…

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t know to grant women rights and equal standing in society.

    Oh, wait…

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t know that we could self-govern and elect our own leaders instead of being ruled by authoritarian structures.

    Oh, wait…

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t have the concept of the right to free speech.

    Oh, wait…

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t have the concept of the right to one’s personal choice in religion.

    Oh, wait…

    If it wasn’t for the Bible, we wouldn’t know to not have cruel or unusual punishments.

    Oh, wait…

    Well, there appears that there’s a bunch of rights that, while not explicitly given in the Bible, at least aren’t direct heresy to Christian doctrine.

  4. 'Tis Himself, OM says

    The Declaration of Independence is a political and propaganda document. The Constitution is a legal document. Some people are confusing politics for legality.

  5. Kazim says

    Dan, you were already banned from the old blog for trolling just like this — just posting self-serving links without contributing to discussions. You’re headed in that direction now. I’m rejecting your second comment and giving you one more chance before the same thing happens here.

  6. says

    I’m not sure it’d matter anyway, though.

    Let’s say it was in the constitution. If it turns out there is no God, who exactly would enforce it? Without a god to nullify the constitution, it’s still up to us to implement, and if we want to ignore that bit of it, we’re fully capable by mere power of us deciding to do so.

    There is no greater power, external and controlling, running it. It’s not being ran by a greater computer, and if there’s a bug in the code the program crashes.

    I have no idea why he thinks the argument is even remotely germane.

  7. John Kruger says

    Funny thing, the Bible was around way before the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution. Why did it take so long to get the “rights” figured out correctly?

    And then there is that pesky first amendment, which expressly separates religion from the affairs of state. I guess the framers were “jackasses” as well.

    But with the condescending tone and goofy music, how could he be wrong?

  8. says

    Part of me is hoping that I step off the plane into the devastation of the Capital Wasteland, dodging super-mutants while Galaxy News Radio spins oldies over my ear buds.

    Thanks to FO3 you should know DC like the back of your hand! Have fun :)

  9. Stephan says

    The sheer fact that you may be having a meet up the night before makes me sad that I’m only going to be in town for the Rally.

    Hope to meet as many of the Atheist Experience crew as I can. You all are how I realized I was an atheist and why I became outspoken about it.

  10. says

    Sorry Stephan. Of course, nothing is finalized in that regard yet. My thinking is that the night before might be easier for most people, as after the rally they may have other plans or be hitting the road to go home. But if that proves not to be the case as we get closer to the day, meet up arrangements can always be altered.

  11. says

    Wow – that was so enlightening (sarcasm). I especially like the part where self-proclaimed Christians called people idiots and jack asses for not agreeing with them or, well, not reducing history and decades of constitutional legal precedent to chipper sound-bites. The implied Democrat-bashing, gross lack of compassion for those who cannot afford health care, and the treatment of pregnant girls and woman as non-people was just frosting. The real travesty was the clear and repeated support for theocracy – something that both Jesus and the founding fathers radically opposed.

    I would attempt to make a satire of this video at some point, but the “church + state = America” title is so over-the-top I have no idea where I would go from there.

  12. ryanvanek says

    It’s ironic that religious people will happily stomp all over the rights of anyone who doesn’t belong to or follow the rules of their cult; and yet when we simply say, “You don’t have the right to take away the rights of these people,” suddenly they’re being persecuted. Fuck off.

  13. Zachariah says

    Perhaps you meant that there is none more athier, or perhaps none more atheist.

    BTW, our atheism goes to 11.

  14. says

    You’re a coward for not letting me comment and counter your dogma, Martin. Censor away! You must hate the constitution.

  15. says

    Dan, I see you’re no less unintelligent than when you used to troll us over at blogspot. Honestly, how do you make it through a day, simply by functioning as a normal adult?

    For the record, the Constitution only says that the government cannot restrict speech. By banning you on a private blog, you have not had your free speech restricted in any way. You can continue to parade your arrested development and lack of intelligence on your own blog, your Facebook page, anywhere else.

    In the past, Russell and I blocked you because you had nothing to contribute beyond juvenile, petulant name calling, anger, bewilderment and P.R.A.T.T. (previously refuted a thousand times) arguments. If you think you’re better equipped to hold discussions here now, feel free to give it a try. But given that you’ve more than demonstrated you’re mentally stuck at about the age of 11, I doubt we’ll see this.

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