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Jun 07 2014

I Get Mail – MRA and India

India is a deeply conservative country that’s sexually repressive for both sexes. If you took off your sexist gender goggles you might be able to discuss deeper issues than ‘rape’ and ‘rape’ and more ‘rape. There are Cast issues of profound significance. Huge ethnic and religious tensions that spin off into riots. There are Maoist rebels raising up against capitalist interest and you can only focus on RAPE.

I’d much rather here from those in India instead of those in the west who demonize other countries so they can feel superior.

I think you may have bitten off more than you can chew here.

1. While India is a deeply conservative country with sexual repression for both genders, the level aimed at women is much much worse than what men endure.

2. Women have it much much worse in India. It’s quite clear to anyone who isn’t an MRA who has to push the notion that Indian women have it better as if it justifies their lifestyle choice.

3. Another person telling Indians to ignore rapes. Well done. You can sit alongside all the other people who have been ignoring rape in India. Prior to the Delhi rape there was just 1 prosecuted rape in Delhi that year. Now the dialogue is changing as more women come forward.

4. If you are aware of anything about Indian culture or politics or society you would know that there is a major culture of unhealthy male on female harassment that would be considered unwanted sexual harassment in a western nation but in India is often ignored as “boys will be boys” and this includes sexual harassment and molestation.

5. When you travel to India as a woman you are told to not travel alone and that you will get harassed. Harassment, Sexual Assault and Rape are facts of life and a lot of Indians are kind of sick of being portrayed as sexual predators.

6. It’s spelt caste. And caste issues affect women too. There has been more done to alleviate caste issues than to alleviate sexism and the combination between caste and women’s rights is deadly as we saw in last week’s rape in Uttar Pradesh where police refused to help a low caste family’s call for help.

7. In the wake of ethnic and religious tension, rape is weapon.

8. Maoists are a separate issue of poor economic disparity, loss of faith in the economic mobility and political process in addition to a ethos that appeals to the poorest members of society.

9. This entire topic is with regards to the MRA, I have pointed out the actions of the MRA with regards to India have been to try and cover up the abuse of women and a deeply sexist society that devalues women to the point of actually killing them. I have also pointed out the actions of “well known and appreciated” MRA.

You wish to ignore the topic and discuss caste and maoism more than the actual issue of gender discrimination? That’s the argument

Amusing.

Oh and you made one fatal error.

I am living in India. And I am ethnically Indian.

8 comments

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  1. 1
    minxatlarge

    Needs this pic: BEHOLD A MAN HAS ARRIVED TO SHARE HIS MANLY VIEW

    http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/3e/81/51/3e8151c28201a2d8a2cbe735d94c81ef.jpg

    The 2-fer for man-splaining to both the wrong gender and nationality is hysterical. Is anyone taking odds that the email author is a 17 to 20 year old white ‘Merican male virgin? You may as well make some money off this one. ;)

    “Take off your sexist goggles” LOL

  2. 2
    Brucc

    Avi, I think it says a lot about MRAs that this emailer guy feels confident enough to use several words of 3 or more syllables. Yet he is oblivious enough that he missed the distinction between here and hear, which I recall being reviewed at ages 6-8. Clearly he thinks he’s learned all he needs, but never notices that he’s been getting wrong some of the basics for a decade or whatever. That’s the essence of MRA. They think they see all, but have no clue.
    And it was hilarious that he wrote to the author of a blog about being in a land of a million gods, to lecture him about this far-off land called India. Maybe he saw your recent photo postings and thought that the street scenes looked like downtown Seattle to him! Crazy. Thanks again for the laugh.

  3. 3
    Marcus Ranum

    I am living in India. And I am ethnically Indian.

    There, there, he’d rather here from you.

  4. 4
    StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    Classic. Well said.

    Just wondering Avicenna but did you actually send the MRA in question here that or a link here and get any response?

  5. 5
    Holms

    I’d much rather here from those in India instead of those in the west who demonize other countries so they can feel superior.

    Ohhhhhh yeah I see. A very convenient excuse to ignore a blogger talking about India, despite the fact that he is Indian citing Indian sources. But now that Avicenna has cleared up his ethnicity + place of residence, I’m suuuure you’ll come round and take on board what he is saying.

    1. While India is a deeply conservative country with sexual repression for both genders, the level aimed at women is much much worse than what men endure.

    e.g.: a man can have sex with a woman against her will, and she will have very little recourse other than to get over it. But yeah, pooooooooor men :(

    3. Another person telling Indians to ignore rapes. Well done. You can sit alongside all the other people who have been ignoring rape in India. Prior to the Delhi rape there was just 1 prosecuted rape in Delhi that year. Now the dialogue is changing as more women come forward.

    One prosecuted rape. In a city with 22 million residents – Australia’s entire population in once city – and only ONE made it to court. JESUS FUCKING CHRIST HOW IS IT EVEN POSSIBLE TO DISREGARD THE IDEA THAT MAYBE RAPE IS SWEPT UNDER THE CARPET WITH A FIGURE SO LUDICROUSLY LOW. Some people will go to amazing lengths to deny what is plainly evident, but this one is something extra-special, even for a douchebag apologist.

  6. 6
    Ed

    This particular guy sounds like a standard issue creep with a reactionary agenda, but unfortunately one runs into similar logical flaws among smart and well intentioned people. I’ve seen it in social justice workshops and meetings of progressive organizations.

    It’s the desire to reduce all bad things to one cause and think of everything else as a side issue or distraction. For example, someone will argue that the one and only problem is economic inequality. Sexism, racism and other ethnic bigotry, religious conflict, oppression by religious leaders of their own followers, substance abuse and….well, general rudeness, probably …would all evaporate if we all agreed to divide up the money more or less equally.

    So bringing up issues like “women are often in danger of rape and other kinds of abuse because they are in a society where men think this is OK,” “some people honestly hate gays or members of other races, regardless of any class or economic issues involved,” or”there are people who do evil in the name of religion for purely religious reasons like obtaining favor of the gods” gets you called naive and focussing on the symptoms instead of the disease. A nice welfare state or some reformed version of Marxism is all we need.

    Of course they have their competitors. For others, it’s a different all-pervasive single issue but with the same logic. Religious superstition is the cause of everything bad, they say. All oppression would cease if we joined John Lennon and imagined our way out of supernatural dogma. No one would have a reason to do anything wrong once they became atheists and no longer believed in gods commanding them to wage war, hoard wealth or abuse the vulnerable. No consideration of the fact that, some people simply enjoy power over others.

    There are probably infinite variants this type of thing and it appeals to people who want to live in a simple, linear world where one victory will win the whole war. Another analogy would be the health quacks who think that their special diet or handful of herbs cures all diseases.

  7. 7
    F [i'm not here, i'm gone]

    But what about teh Capitalizms!!!1111!!one!

  8. 8
    lorn

    The key issue of rape is failure of someone to exert the uncompromising and unequivocal self-control expected of all adults. I don’t care if you don’t respect or value women or whoever it is you wish to dominate. You are expected to control yourself. Irony is that if you control yourself respect of others is relatively easy.

    And, as for all that other stuff about ethnic, religious, and caste conflict … it all gets a lot easier if everyone maintains self-control. That same self-control that keeps you from raping also keeps you from freaking out or overreacting over tribal and caste differences.

    IMO the main issue is not sexism, or race, or tribalism, or religious differences … it all comes down to allowing yourself to act as a self-indulgent child and acting out based upon your hurt feelings and frustrations. Time to grow up.

    Men learning to maintain self-control under all situations, without resort to self-indulgent acting out or excuse, would go a long way toward eliminating any number of problems. Who knows, this whole self-control thing might catch on.

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