Papal Morality

Mugabe in Rome for Beatification of Pope John Paul II

As Amnesty International state, the man is quite the tin pot dictator. He has jailed and tortured various leaders of the opposition. He has mishandled his nation’s economy. He has encouraged a mob mentality in his followers towards political opposition. He has scapegoated white land owners for his own incompetence and run the farms seized into the ground.

When your nation has a life expectancy of 40 and an infant mortality rate of close to 100 per 1000 live births (10%) then alarm bells must ring. Mugabe’s encouragement of catholic doctrine has encouraged the spread of “rice missionary” work in the region with all that entails.

He has targeted free speech and has tortured hundreds of people who have campaigned for human rights.

And this is a man who the Vatican has gotten special permission to attend the beatification of the previous pope (Pope John Paul II).

Catholics? Ignore the fact that I am an atheist. This is sensible advice. When your hierarchy claim to be the harbingers of all that is good and holy, please do not allow them to associate with evil men. Mugabe is not a benevolent misunderstood dictator. He is a horrible man whose actions are simply anti human. It does not matter what faith he belongs to (because frankly IMHO which magic bogeyman you kowtow to does not excuse your actions as a human being) but it matters what he does as a man.

And what he has done is raped a nation. 

Anthony Stephano is Wrong!

Hint… You are wrong

Easter Lesson For Atheists

In a stunning move the christian’s have begun the annual battle for Christmas with a sneak attack in April.

This Easter it seems that atheists have a lot to rejoice about. According to the latest poll released by the U.S. Census Bureau in its American Religious Identification Survey, the number of self-proclaimed atheists in America has nearly doubled since 2001 — from 900,000 to 1.6 million.

In a nation that once prided itself on its Judeo-Christian heritage, one out of every five Americans now claims no religious identity whatsoever; and the number of self-proclaimed Christians has declined by a whopping 15%.

I thought as a nation the USA prided itself on being secular and being borne out of a need to avoid religious persecution and the idea that a man’s god or lack there off is a personal belief. And I am pretty sure the doubling of atheist numbers does not mean that 1 in 5 people have no religious identity. Unless the USA has only 8 million people in it.

We can’t reduce the whole of reality to what our senses tell us for the simple reason that our senses are notorious for lying to us. Our senses tell us that the world is flat, and yet it’s not. Our senses tell us that the world is chaotic, and yet we know that on both a micro and a macro level, it’s incredibly organized. Our senses tell us that we’re stationary, and yet we’re really moving at incredible speeds. We just can’t see it.

We cannot. Which is why we have experimentation. We thought the world was flat millennia ago. Seriously we knew the world was a sphere due to some very very elegant mathematics and observations.

We build tools to analyse at a micro and a macro level. What Stephano is trying to pull is a “god of the gaps” argument. It is at it’s heart a request to “Beware, you who seek first and final principles, for you are trampling the garden of an angry God and he awaits you just beyond the last theorem.”


And if you cannot understand relative velocity then you are completely lost. All of us are on the planet earth which is moving at X velocity. However we too are moving at X velocity held on by the gravity of the earth which is caused by “fancy physics” that I will not explain for fear of getting it wrong as I am a biologist and medic at heart rather than a man of mathematics and mechanics. Since both of us are moving at the same speed,  the relative velocity is “Zero”. However if we compared our velocity to the Sun, we are whipping around at a fairly sprightly pace. 


But the most important things in life can’t be seen with the eyes. Ideas can’t be seen. Love can’t be seen. Honor can’t be seen. This isn’t a new concept. Judaism and Christianity and Islam and Buddhism have all taught for thousands of years that the highest forms of reality are invisible and mysterious. And these realities will never be reducible to clear-cut scientific formulae for the simple reason that they will never be fully comprehensible to the human mind. God didn’t mean them to be.

Buddhism has not taught that. Buddhism has taught that the greatest principles of creation are available to a man willing to diligently pursue the truth. The buddha himself (Siddartha Gauthama) was an atheist/deist and would have laughed at your ideas.

Ideas can be seen. Love can be seen. You can literally take an MRI of people using their brains to solve puzzles and chart ideas. You can take MRIs of people in love and see how their brain works. It is chemical, but that does not make it less amazing. Would you rather think that love is driven by the arrows fired by some fat baby or by awesome biology? What a boring idea! That Ideas and Love cannot be seen.

Honour is a product of society, not that of religion. It is the expected protocol of people. There is no difference from the twisted sense of honour possessed by the Empire of Japan during WW2 which caused them to butcher and enslave millions than the one you claim. Both are constructs, we are better to base our “honour” on principles of logic and reason and humanity than that of religion.

Too many people go through life today with their eyes closed. They miss out on the mysterious because they’re so fixated on what they can see and smell and touch and taste and hear. They’re so steeped in the “superstition of materialism” that they’re totally blind to the existence of another world — a radically different world than the one they’re familiar with, but a world nonetheless: a world of miracles, a world of grace, a world of angels, a world of diabolical warfare, a world where the highest values are completely opposite from those of our secular society — where weakness equals strength, sacrifice equals salvation, and suffering equals unlimited power.

It is we who go through the world with our eyes open. We don’t require a fantasy world to exist in to bring us happiness. It’s highly delusional and highly childish. If a child believed in Narnia we would quietly nod our heads and slowly encourage him to live in the real world. Why should we treat heaven differently. There is no grace in Stephano’s world view, only that of a parasite who leeches of the achievements of the rest of humanity in order to live in a private fantasy. If he stated that he lived in the world of Conan the Barbarian and sought the answer to the Riddle of Steel we would try to get him committed to an asylum. Because he believes in an culturally appropriate delusion (AKA Christianity) he is allowed to write for USA Today, while I am forced to write for a tiny blog in the middle of nowhere. The roles should be reversed

But is it wishful thinking to believe in hell, the devil and demons? Is it wishful thinking to believe we’re going to be judged and held accountable for every sin we’ve ever committed? Is it wishful thinking to believe the best way to live our life is to sacrifice our own desires for the sake of others? Is it wishful thinking to believe that we should discipline our natural bodily urges for the sake of some unseen “kingdom”? 

Yes it is. If you really truly believed in “sacrificing your life” you wouldn’t be an author of spiritual books living a comfortable lifestyle. You would give it all away to charity and go serve the people of this world.

Your natural bodily urges? Such as what? Those aren’t natural urges in human society. Our rules stem from our society rather than from our faith. Rules came first, religion second. Rules in a society make society run smoothly and smooth running non fractitious society is stronger. 10 men with the same idea in mind can defeat 10 men who are constantly squabbling. Rules are made to stop the 10 men from squabbling with each other.

If human beings were going to invent a religion based on wishful thinking, they could come up with something a lot “easier” than Christianity. After all, why not wish for a religion that promised eternal life in heaven, but at the same time allowed promiscuous sex, encouraged gluttony, did away with all the commandments, and forbade anyone to ever mention the idea of judgment and punishment?

Because religion is a whip. It needs to have punishment so that people follow it. It thrives on misery and the best way to generate misery is to make the normal behaviour of humans not permissible. You cannot control human beings without the threat of punishment.

Why is promiscuous sex wrong? Because it’s fun? Because God says so? Why?
Gluttony is wrong because you will get fat and indeed gluttony is only mentioned in one paragraph as a warning that if you live solely for consumption then you may end up without one day.

Wouldn’t that make a lot more sense? And yet, atheists persist in this ridiculous notion that human beings “invented” God merely because we’re afraid of death and want to see our dead relatives again. Amazing.

My old faith is Hinduism. One of the most surprising things about it is it’s age.

The civilisation dates back to 3000 BC. That seal is an image of Shiva. Hinduism is nearly 5000 years old. A full 3000 years older than Christianity. Why should we assume Christianity is the true faith? Why not follow Hinduism? It’s a large religion and an older one than even Judaism. It thinks Christianity is a load of horse manure.

We invented gods and spirits to explain that which could not be explained. In the darkest of nights when we first made our steps out towards the lofty height we have reached now the dark held real and unreal terrors for us. We were scared. We made up stories of the dark and of the forces which we could not control. Thor is now nothing more than lightning. The very principle of lightning boggles the reality of Thor. As we speak I am posting using tamed lightning

Your god is a small god. A tiny one. The universe is far more impressive than your imagination. A single bacteria has more complexity than your entire philosophy. And we should not hold to such a security blanket.

Jesus didn’t rise. Shiva will not dance. Moses did not cast down stone tablets. These are stories and fables. Hinduism, Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Sikhism, Buddhism, Jainism and every religion out there are just that. Not real.

Although one good thing that comes out of Easter….

The Hunky Jesus Contest

Rise of the Neo Luddite – The Best Laid Plans of Mice and Men

 We have failed in the education of my generation. We are failing in the education of the next generation. Our parents have an excuse. They grew up in a period where science was by rote, where it was treated as canon and religion. The bible of education, questioning was not encouraged as much as rote memory. That was the old way and this is the new. The ultimate irony of the age of information is that it is also the age of misinformation. Even the greatest invention of mankind (In My Humble Opinion), the internet has been subverted for this. I think we live in such an age of wonder that we have forgotten what the internet is. It is the largest source of information that exists in the universe to our knowledge.  It has seen rise to great sources of information such as Wikipedia and great sources of misinformation such as Natural News or Mercola. It has fought great injustice by forming groups such as Anonymous who have taken on Scientology. It has brought light to the dark.
But it has also let darkness fester where we can see it. And nowhere is it more seen in the Technophile Luddite. Admittedly an oxymoron but this is a real market of individuals. Apple used to sell technology based on how intuitive for new users and how simple it was taking out of the consumer the idea of customisation and the use of the product as a lifestyle choice rather than a competitor (face it Apple fans, it isn’t doing anything a much cheaper Windows/Linux powered PC cannot bar looking pretty). Science has exceeded the average man’s grasp because we have been slack at teaching in schools. It is filled with stereotypes such as the uncool science geek rather than the reality that most people need to be well adjusted to work in science.
No more is this more evident with the rise of the Animal Liberation movement and the whole Vegan Culture. It encompasses a varying mix of three different entities. Animal Rights (AKA PETA and the ALF), Nutritionists (As opposed to the dietician) and Alternative Medicine (Well known purveyors of woo). 

Not to be confused with this man who is a well known purveyor of bullet based ballet

Recently Camille Marino had a discussion with other Animal Lib/Rights members a transcript of which can be seen on her lovely and charming website which is filled with interesting ideas that can lead to a productive and well functioning society where the best laid plans of Mice and Men come to fruition. And the best way to deal with her plans is to dissect her arguments. Rhetoric aside, I think the best way to deal with her movement is to locate the weak points of her argument and shred them mercilessly. We should not take such a threat to our students lying down. It is only a matter of time before one of them (and indeed myself as a member of the medical student community) are targeted by them for personal attacks and it is only a matter of time before they go too far and one of us ends up like Dr. George Tiller (who was murdered after years of threats on doctors who provided late term abortions). Camille has called for deaths and has made threats. We should not ignore them. 

If we had Prep Schools for Pedophiles where students learned the proper art of grooming children in order to successfully kidnap, molest, rape, and murder them, who thinks that mainstream society would allow this “academic curriculum” to continue unimpeded?

No one would allow this curriculum to exist. This is a straw man argument of the most ludicrous calibre because it assumes that there is a benefit to molesting and killing children. There isn’t one. It merely produces very unhappy children as we have seen across the globe. Comparing Animal Experimentation to the Molesting of Children is an insult to the children who have suffered under the hands of paedophiles and to the memories of children murdered. 

In actuality, we have Prep Schools for Industrial Animal Abusers – they’re called universities. And, thus far, we’ve allowed their production lines to churn out sadistic animal tormentors and sociopathic serial killers with reckless abandon! 

We allow the enemy to recruit young people, strip them of their morality, compassion, and integrity and indoctrinate them into their industrial horror show. We only turn our attention to them after they are fully-entrenched professional murderers who are protected in the enemies’ fortified compounds. This is a losing proposition! 

It’s time to start eliminating the students while they are vulnerable. THIS is where every single one of us can start realizing quantifiable gains and victories… each success creates the momentum we need to propel us toward our greatest victory yet – the complete obliteration of the vivisection complex! 

Personally, I want to see the terrorists in bloody white coats buried alive in their dungeons. Is there anybody else here who wants to see the torture industry implode on itself in our lifetimes?

We are portrayed as immoral monsters if we experiment on animals. Our teachers are portrayed as sinister Machiavellian doom lords who enslave animals to produce monsters to do our bidding. (Maybe just Dr. P. Z. Myers. I am sure he has a cyborg giant squid army somewhere…) 

As  drawn by Ethically Challenged

That may be the case or it may not be. I can only speak for myself on this matter. I am sure that there are biologists who gain a pleasure out of experimentation. But I am sure I am the norm and felt deep discomfort with experimentation but realised what I had to do and why
I had to do it.
Camille is calling for us to be targeted and indeed we will be. The next year’s intake of students will be faced by down by her followers. We need to protect them. I would advocate for them to be taught some Facebook safety (Camille has recommended and indeed boasted about tracking us down via the methodology of the internet). Harassment should not be tolerated and should be persecuted to the full extent of the law. In addition we must educate animal handling from an earlier age. We should teach our children where our food comes from and what it looks like.

Okay, the first thing we need to come to terms with is that, with very few exceptions, activists are NOT scientists.  We can mimic some facts here and there and impress each other, perhaps, but the enemy is laughing at us.  THIS is their territory. These are their rules. There is nothing left for us to discuss, debate, or negotiate. 

It is self evident that the atrocities committed against animals in laboratories must end. It is our job to stop it, not debate it with the enemy.  The time for civil discourse has expired!

If students stand up and begin to say “NO! We will not torture animals in the name of science anymore!,” science curriculums will adapt. Academia and the sciences will be forced to evolve. This is the 21st century. If they won’t evolve of their own accord, then we must leave them no choice in the matter.

Of course they are not scientists bar a few. And they know it. Possibly because I have been bugging her about what alternatives she suggest we use and the best she could come up with was a blasé remark about experimenting on the dregs of society (I had to quietly point out that she insulted Jews and Romani and the various Slavs and Black people and the mentally retarded who were used in human experiments particularly during the 1920s to 1950s.) And that we do experiment on humans. It’s part of drug testing and ironically the people who often agree to be tested on are the poor and the desperate.
If students said “that they wouldn’t torture animals anymore” the teachers and indeed their curriculum won’t adapt. I hope it won’t adapt. Ideology must not dictate what science does or else we are not teaching science but applied politics/theology. We would live in a world of Communist Russia where Lysenkoism was taught rather than the bourgeoisie evolution.
The curriculum will grind on with the student not learning the importance of a lesson. In the end it will harm the student’s future career. I know, I have a fear of cockroaches and refused to dissect one in high school and when exams came around I had no clue and didn’t score so well. I will fully admit that I suffered due to my fear. If I had sucked it up and done the damn dissection I would be better off as I would have had a better score and maybe (just maybe) enough to have gotten into a uni back home and not have to study 6 days a week and spend 12 hours a day at uni. The punishment is not to the system but to me.
Academia and Science won’t evolve if you halt experimentation. They will stagnate as the experimentation on animals is the way that we have understood how living systems function. Without that only botany will improve while our understanding of zoology and human biology will stagnate. We have improved experimentation to the point where we are using fewer animals not due to threats from animal liberation but because we are devising clever systems that require fewer animals to produce a quantifiable result. Without experimentation the clever systems will not be incomplete. Incomplete experimentation is dangerous particularly in terms of the production of medication.

Much to my surprise, several vivisectors were compelled to confess their crimes on NIO and two initiated email dialogues with me this past week. While animal abusers will get no absolution from me, there was one glaring common denominator in each of their diatribes and it is hugely important for us to understand this: 

Student vivisectors are plagued with guilt! They are at the crossroads between choosing compassion or sadism. They know that they are torturing an innocent animal but their sociopathic professors encourage them to do so. 

And most naïve young adults do not have the courage to take a stand – not against their professors and not against us!Psychological warfare deployed on the most vulnerable students in the most vulnerable vivisection demographic may hold the master key to our success.

I have no guilt that I have experimented and witnessed experiments on animals. I sleep quite soundly with meat in my stomach.
Compassion for animals is fine, but not at the cost of compassion to humans. The animal liberation movement see the cruelty but not the effect. They don’t see the lives improved by the experiments.
If you are receiving emails from students confessing crimes, then I will ask that these students realise why they learn on animals. Because it’s practical and logical. You can look at a million models and billion diagrams and not one will compare  to the real thing. I have beautiful textbooks on anatomy and not one has compared to physically seeing the organs being pulled from a cadaver and later from a body. The texture tells you a lot. The grainy feel of a smoker’s lung or the hardness of liver cirrhosis cannot be taught by a model. So we dissect humans. Likewise biologists dissect animals. A vet cannot learn his trade without animals. He would not be a very good vet. 

Once we isolate matriculated biology students – and I am encouraging everyone to intercede no later than their junior year – we can have a profound effect on their futures. First, we need to empower them – inform them that they have the ability to make the right choice. A
ppeal to their consciences and emotions. Appeal to their intellect. If a student still aspires to become a professional animal abuser, then s/he should be deemed an enemy combatant and, thereby, forfeits all rights.

 This is an abject threat. It’s no different from saying recant or suffer. And we remember those words to this very day. The day we recant is the day everyone else suffers. The right choice is the stagnation of science, the wrong choice is the productivity of biology saving lives. They aren’t appealing to our intellect, they are trying to scare us into submission. Make us fear for our lives so that we abandon the pursuit of knowledge.

But it does move.

  • We don’t need large groups or elaborate campaigns to achieve our ends – only individual initiative and determination.
  • Enemy students should begin to receive their own home demos.
  • Their neighbors, friends, and communities should be leafleted and warned about their sadistic inclinations.
  • Many students still live at home which makes their parents fully complicit. They should receive demos and visits at their place of employement.
  • The internet is a weapon in the right hands. Email, telephone, fax campaigns can be highly effective at the enemy’s parents’ offices.
  • All public domain information may legally be republished online and in your communities.
Camille lays down the tactics she intends. It’s similar to such groups as Al-Qaeda. Small individual groups operating under a greater banner. A franchise of terror (as opposed to fried chicken). If one group does something insane and fails they can be denounced while if one succeeds they will be lauded as a success for the whole entity. She aims to hit students in their own societies terrorising their families and neighbours an alienating them. Knowing they cannot terrorise a biology lab (So wait, if we hire Sally the Vivisectionist you will protest at a higher rate than before?) beyond what they already do without breaking the law they are forced to move the harassment tactics to friends and family.
This is similar to the Westboro Baptist Church. And using tactics similar to scientologist’s “fair game”. And the problem is public domain. We need to protect our information. Facebook once upon a time was a student driven system for networking of students. Now it’s a place for us to post funny captions of cats. We forget that we give out a lot of information on it. We should encourage students to move their profiles out of public domain and into private.

We are going to Save the Students and stop them from becoming Vivisectors. We know we are going to be most effective in determining the demographic that is the least mind screwed by the enemy, that is they have not picked up a knife yet. We believe juniors fit this description, with a short visit to the youngest students to let them know they can opt out of all dissection even though no one tells them this. If no one obeys, no one’s in charge!Subversion, Subversion, Subversion:

  • To make the students question their loyalty to the professors who are teaching them.
  • To let them know they have power to refuse to cut.
  • To show them their teachers are lying about how they can fill their dreams with out animal experimentation.
  • To expose the sickness and evil that their teachers are masking behind science.
 Since when has scientific curriculum been decided by the students? That would be like me standing up and declaring that I don’t wish to learn Gynaecology because being a vagina doctor is a woman’s job. I would get laughed at. Or worse… Failed if I refused to attend those lessons.
1.      Professors aren’t loyal to you. They are there to teach. If you do not want to be taught then they won’t teach you. However if what you don’t know is important then it will come back to haunt you.
2.      You can refuse to cut. I have refused to dissect a cockroach because I am scared of roaches (yeah… I sat through an autopsy of a decomposing guy and then went out to eat a sandwich while my peers retched and I think roaches are gross). It’s just that you will either lose marks of your final grade either by omission of practical credit or by not learning something

April: How do you determine weak ones

Camille: The weak ones are the isolated alienated science bookworms, Who’s never been out from under their mother’s skirt. You can see them a mile away. 

Gingie: something like, how can we tell who the weak ones are? 

April: right, that’s what i meant 

Sia: I have found weak ones abuse animals

Psst… That’s a movie stereotype. Most biologists are pretty healthy and have to be well balanced. It’s hard to give a lecture if you are isolated and it’s hard to do research if you don’t work well in groups.

Amongst all the scientists, biologists would be the most outdoorsy type (since biologists often have to work outdoors).

Agatha: WE cannot debate science- but maybe have a call for debates? have knowledgeable students debates. other- anything to establish a line and make students choose a side? 

Camille: Absolutely, Aggie 

April: Science is actually debatable, lets not treat it with irrefutable

So let’s debate. We are willing to talk and to explain why we do things this way. However we do know that it’s not us who is making the threats.

I am willing to talk and indeed explain how things work within reason. Camille is not. Camille does not have the solution and is infact part of the problem of animal research. That people born of privilege and no perspective will think that the value of a human being is the same of a lab rat. Knowledge is important and knowing what our juniors and indeed future is in for is vital. 

A Strange Fascination

India has a strange fascination with all things written. From projects to lab reports all must be handwritten.

This is a tad bizzare for me. Surely we live in an age of technology where printing is cheap. I feel that I waste hours of my life writing something that can be hammered out on a laptop in an hour.

Another fascination is cursive handwriting. All the kids in schools are educated in this with the assumption that it makes your handwriting legible. I beg to differ, a lot of people I study with show up with handwriting that looks like (and I mean this in the kindest way possible) it was written by a dog. And these are the people who write your prescriptions.

People argue about how it is a way to not be too reliant on computers. One may as well argue about equipping students with harpoons for Mammoth Hunting. 

Rights of the Silent Majority – The Peacock and the Strawman

 On an evening last year in February, Neetu Solanki was travelling home in a conservative west Delhi neighbourhood via auto-rickshaw (a three wheeled equivalent of a taxi in India) when she was harassed by some young men. Her response was to stop the rickshaw and grabbed one of the young men’s collars in order to yell at him. She was picked out because she was wearing western clothes, a top and a pair of hipster jeans revealing a peacock tattoo on her lower back rather than a more traditional salwaar kameez.
In India there is an amusingly named crime called Eve Teasing, named after the biblical idea that women cause men to sin by their lack of modesty. It involves men usually in groups harassing women with inappropriate comments and often very inappropriate groping. A crime born out of gender bias, a lack of sexual equivalence and the objectification of women. Yesterday a woman leapt from a moving train to avoid “eve teasing” losing her leg under the wheels of the train. 
Neetu Solanki was found dead on the 11th of February with her throat slit and dumped into a suitcase which was left at New Delhi’s railway station. The tattoo became a talking point around which a string of tales about her love life, her dress sense, her habit of returning home late from her job at a call centre. The man she was allegedly cohabiting was missing and believed to be the suspect. India is a large nation and chances are he has gotten away with it.
Neetu Solanki is what a lot of Indians regard as wrong with today’s generation. The fear is that women are becoming like “Western Women”. To the conservative older generation of the middle classes it is a shot across the bows. Women prefer jeans and tops to their traditional outfits and even their traditional outfits bare a lot more skin than they used to as fashion marches on. India is seeing the beginnings of a sexual revolution with couples beginning to cohabit more. Arranged marriages are dying in number and even now the modern arranged marriage is akin to the Jewish Match Maker where the boy and girl meet for dates rather than the traditional idea of the event. Some Indians even have sex outside marriage. Indian women even have come to understand that sex can be fun.
One of the biggest Indian authors in India is someone I would consider a feminist. Shoba De, writes trashy chick lit, a world of crummy plots, gaping plot holes and a lot of sex. This is not a bad thing, it is the Indian equivalent of a harlequin novel. And it is a kind of revolution. Indian women who traditionally married out of compulsion (it was the done thing to do)often to men who had no clue and indeed no attraction to them were learning about love and more importantly lust. Like Anais Nin’s work for feminism in the west, Shoba De raised the important idea in women’s subconscious. That it is possible to have an orgasm and to explore sexuality beyond the concept of birthing children if you are an indian.
The sexual revolution in the west marks a point where feminism began in earnest. Across the western world women realised that they are just as important as men and can demand the same rights, building on the work of the suffragettes. In addition their cohesiveness was supported by men who didn’t really believe in the ideology of their parents and the conservative ideas of the period.
These developments are not seen as progress in India. These are seen as something terrifying, of an assault on traditional mores that have kept women under control for millennia. To the conservative, the blame firmly rests in a straw man called the Western Woman.

“The western (usually Americans/british) woman is not like Indian women. Indian women are chaste and well behaved. Western women often are rude, badly behaved and are half naked. They have affairs and divorces and sleep with many men. Indian women are too chaste for that and should not become like that.”

The ideas is that back home in the UK (for me) and indeed across Europe and America women have all the freedoms imaginable, they are free to associate with who they like, set their own goals and to live an independent life away from male influence either parental or spousal. And that in order to do so the woman has to be a slut, that women’s freedom comes at the price of clothes, morality and tradition.
However the issue is what is immoral rather than the immorality of western women. The straw man is built over what people find immoral and shocking, which is the lifestyle of the west because they assume that giving freedom to women results in orgies and women dressing like prostitutes. The Victorian standard applies, an indian movie is a charged affair with dance sequences replacing the sex scenes. Women prance around in skimpy outfits that no one in their right minds would wear in the UK unless participating in a rap video.
The attitude is that it is better to protect a woman’s honour than for her to lose it through equality. That men will always be fools and that it is upto women to dress sensibly so as to not encourage men. That if allowed to do what she wants like the western woman, she will be seduced by nefarious men. And thus she must be kept under supervision, she is free to do as she wants but without affecting her modesty.
The western woman is used as a method of scaring men and women into following the old ways. The Men are scared of the western woman because she has the choice and the independence both mentally and financially and that most Indian men know that they may not measure upto her demanding standards. The women are scared of her comparatively raw sexuality which is regarded as vulgar. They portray her life as empty and pointless, with no greater purpose but sexual gratification. They see the western woman as prostituting herself for her freedom which they are quite rightly not willing to do.
Remember, the freedom comes first, then the sex. 

Are we not the strongest link?

How to target students.

Here’s what gets me. I would think that students were the strongest link in the organisation. It’s easy to target some old “scientist” in his “lair” making “huge money” but when you target some kid working on his degree, well you kind of are treading a thin moral line.

Continuing on from issues raised in this thread, we see that the lovely people at NIO have a thread suggesting people to target and more fallacies. I reprint the letters here so that we don’t need to give them more traffic.


Letter 1: “Yes, we need to target students.” (specific information will be published at close of semester)

“Hi Camille, As you probably know, school will be out here in a matter of days. I’ve heard a lot about this campaign against vivisection students but there is no time left this semester. But I say yes,  yes, yes. We need to target students… Many students who are in my class now at __________ will continue at UF in the fall. You need to understand their indoctrination and the disgusting professors that shape these young peoples minds. Everyone in the nursing program here is expected to dissect an animal. HM is my professor for this lab. When some of us objected to dissecting pigs or crows, he offered to bring us in live squirrels from his backyard. As if we were objecting because we wanted “better” victims! He offered to trap them. He offered to gas them for us if we didn’t want to kill them ourselves…. WHAT THE FUCK… What are your ideas about moving forward with this campaign?” 
First, HM is a violent degenerate. Is it any wonder that our universities are churning out empathy-deficient sadists who will spend their professional lives in dungeons tormenting animals for profit? ! I’m wondering if there is some health code or animal protection law that HM the Sociopath has violated. After all, they don’t want their students to contract rabbis, lime disease, etc. while they are being taught the joys of mutilating helpless victims. Try to eliminate him the old-fashioned way: write a letter to your student dean, the Dean of Admissions, the college president, any applicable oversight committees… ah, hell, why stop there? copy the lunch lady and custodian too. Blast this terrorist for endangering the welfare of the student body. They don’t care about animal rights. But they definitely care about lawsuits and bad P.R.!!! 
Second, I would suggest that you hold on to the roster of names in this class so that those who matriculate into biology at UF in the fall can be easily identified.

 You cannot learn what an animal works from a model. You can only see what an animal looks like from it. You cannot understand variations or indeed cope with movement and understand physiological dependences of the various systems on each other. Some other points to make…

Rabies is spread by animal bite. Rodents tend to not transmit rabies. Rabbis are a collection of Jewish Priests.

Lyme’s disease is exclusively spread by deer ticks. You would control the tick population by killing deer. And you get it from walking in the countryside rather than from sheltered animals in labs.

If you wrote a letter as a biologist to the dean arguing about whether you would get Rabies from Rodents or Lyme’s Disease, the dean would personally call you an idiot. Seriously did this person not read the course details? If I were learning biology, I would expect to see some sort of live animal. Just as how in learning medicine I regularly see live humans who tolerate my shoddy treatment as I get better at it.

“Hi Camille, I’m a member of your Facebook page and a college student at a small college ________, which is connected to a large college ________. I am very much for signing petitions and calling officials, but when it comes to bigger displays of activism I don’t know what to do. I know that animals are tested on and cut up at both schools and I’d like to draw attention to it. Unfortunately, the town I’m in is VERY big into hunting and polluting the environment with coal, which means I’d probably have little to back me up here. I have no idea how or where to start. Do you have any suggestions? Maybe there’s an anti-vivsection group at __________ I could look into. I want the anti-vivisection campaign in Florida to spread to all universities. I look forward to hearing from you. Regards” 

95% of my email indicates that we all want to make a difference, but — up until now — we just didn’t know how. We are all conditioned to think that we need groups of activists to be effective but the truth is that effectiveness starts with each one of us as individuals. If we’re going to stand on a corner with a sign and be polite, then, whether we’re alone or 100-strong, all we are is an amusing pest. It’s rare to find of group of aggressive activists in the states. Lisa Grossman and I had a moment of clarity this weekend: in our anti-viv campaign at UF, we would rather be two people with megaphones, anger, and attitude than have to spend another second placating other activists, fraternizing with welfarists, or toning down the rhetoric. And now that we’ve decided to shift some of our attention to the student body, we will explain ourselves to no one. 
But taking on universities is not the best use of our energy or resources. I encourage students to look into your universities and focus on the nexus of the issue — the students: they will either usher in the next generation of laboratory horror or we can all liberate future victims by eliminating the source of the problem now. 
*You need to isolate the biology- and research-science students. 
*They need to be educated and given a chance to make the correct and compassionate decision to denounce animal torture. If they refuse, they become the enemy like any other. 
Many students still live with their parents or they are out on their own for the first time in their young lives. We want to target those who are the weakest links — “science nerds” (i.e., alienated, socially-isolated, bookworms) — and those who are the worst-case abusers (i.e., those who gloat when we educate them and talk about eating cheeseburgers): 
*Enemy students should begin to get their own home demos. 
*If you are only one person or two, then go door-to-door and leaflet their neighborhood. We’ve had great success with this strategy. 
*Get a megaphone and drop by their parents’ place of employment. 
*Any tactic that has been employed thus far against laboratory sadists should now be focused on enemy student vivisectors.

Camille admits that she solely wants to target the students because she perceives biology students to be a weak link in the system. The assumption is that you can threaten them and they will back down. A lot of them won’t. A lot of them will fight back by being determined to finish their courses and prove them wrong.

By compassionate decision she means “give up biology”. On her website she even carries lists of veterinarian students who “experiment on animals”. After all how else are they supposed to treat animals if not for experimentation on animals?

Students tend to live in student neighbourhoods. Students do not like other students being targeted by any group. Your plans to attack them will fail and you will alienated yourself from non science students. You will also rise above the surface of .

Targetting their parents is just “low”. The animal lib movement and particularly the NIO are nothing but bullies who torment those who do science solely for their own pleasure. The idea is that progress will occur if we stop biological and pharmacological experimentation on animals and somehow come up with a brilliant breakthrough in almost every field of biology (sans the methodology for break through) to make vivisection completely pointless (which we would know innately using our science vision rather than our normal process of painstaking experimentation and statistical comparisons)

I think Camille has not understood scientists. I know very well the unsocial scientist is a caricature. Few are unsocial, it’s a death sentence to be unsocial since scientists work in teams. You have to be a team player to do science. Being an alienated socially awkward bookworm is career suicide. You have to be social, you have to be smart enough to dumb down your explanations where necessary. Biologists would probably be the jocks of the science world in any case courtesy of a lot of them having to do field work which can involve walking long distances after rare animals.

“i worked (2009-2010) at the department of anatomy and neurobiology of university of california in irvine (uci) under the mentorship of dr. anne calof. there’s a lot of different projects running in the lab but they are mainly about neurogenesis and development using mice (wt and transgenic) as model system. when i started i was neutral about animal research. if i had to do it, i’ll learned it and did it… just as any other lab technique… 

well, they taught me how “wean and tail” them. the tail part consists in putting the pups in a chamber of analgesic gas, hopefully not too long ’cause they are so small they can die if left too long, taking them out, burning a blade (to sterilize) i will use to cut a small piece of tail to genotype (by pcr) and then, because you know this we do it we hundreds of them, i have to mark them with a number. this number is a hole that i punch out of the ear of the mice. the hole in different part of the ear tells me their number/id. there are other ways, i’m just telling you the way we used to do it. 

after genotyping, then i decide which mice are the ones i want for whatever experiment we would be running. usually, in my case, my boss wanted everything because she was neurotic like that, but normally we would take the wild types of the litter and the knockouts… this experience made me grow from neutral to what the fuck?!?!”

This alone shows that the letter writer didn’t grasp the point of the experiment. Either the teaching was lost on her (AKA this is a way of categorising mice according to genotype).

The author (not Camille but a supporter) is a terrible lab technician, Dr. Calof’s request isn’t neurotic. It’s conscientious, she is a very stringent experimenter attempting to categorise mice as much as possible so that she doesn’t need to use that many mice. The more data you could compile on each mouse used, the more results you get and the less you need to do repeats and the less follow experiments.

The idea that vivisection for medical and biological research will stop if you threaten the medics and the biologists is entirely laughable. We can reduce the numbers, maybe even replace the model animal entirely with a superior synthetic creature some day. However as for now there are no alternatives for testing and that solution is science fiction.

The NIO have a problem. They assume that science works like in a video game. You work on a problem long enough you find a solution. The solution for the reduction of the use of animals and indeed the halt of vivisection, lies in the hands of the people working on animals. Not in the hands of Camille Marino and her cohort of anti-science bullies. Camille would damn millions of humans for hundreds of mice while probably hypocritically owing her daily bread to the death of various animals anyways. She is not the solution to the vivisection problem, she is part of the vivisection problem herself.

People like her and the ALF, the animal rights (Not to be concerned with animal welfare who I appreciate) movement claim to be progressive individuals. But in their idea of life the life of a human being is of the same value as a mouse. And by that logic the life of a tiger is the same value as that of a deer. They don’t love animals or the environment, if they get their way, the depletion of our species would increase rather than decrease.

They have no solutions, only more problems. And the people paying the price are not the scientists or the animals but the people who cannot afford the extra cost of drugs caused by these individual’s actions. 

A Taste of Things to Come – The Rise of the Back-Street Abortionist

“The assault on Planned Parenthood is unjustified. It is penny-wise and pound foolish. The law strictly and clearly prohibits the use of federal funds for abortion services. The Republicans’ elimination of funding for Planned Parenthood, will in the end cost more than it saves by ending the ability of millions of American women to receive family planning services, breast and cervical cancer screenings and preventative healthcare at cost-efficient Planned Parenthood centers. And the denial of simple birth control and family planning services may well increase both the number of unintended pregnancies and abortions in our country.”

-          Bill Clinton
American women have lost a great deal of freedom in the past few weeks. All across the USA various states are planning to either reduce funding to bodies such as Planned Parenthood or to try and make abortions more difficult to perform and obtain. Most recently, South Dakota has passed laws to reduce the period of abortion to just 20 weeks. Women have to undergo a series of unnecessary and traumatic procedures just to decide what to do with their own bodies.

In addition the Republican majority has voted to cease funding Planned Parenthood, a service that is a provider of female health services such as cheap obstetrics and gynaecology programmes, vaccination and child wellness information, contraception and abortion. It also encourages breast examination and scanning for breast cancer. You can claim it is cost cutting but these programs save money in the long run by prevention of disease rather than cures.
The arguments boil down to the presence of a human soul. Some say it’s divinely manifest to human beings at birth. Others specify an arbitrary month from which the baby is considered alive. I say it’s an illusionary concept brought on by the wish that we could live forever. The soul is the idea that our consciousness can transcend death and live forever maintaining our experiences and personalities. However, we know that it’s just an illusion brought on by the complexity of our brain and the fact that we are self aware. Our personalities, our thoughts our experience are all part of the hardware of our brains, consisting of millions of neurons. We know that damage to these neurons changes our personality and our ability to control our body. The human soul is sadly wishful thinking and the desire to preserve our mind beyond death, an extension of the desire to live forever and escape the failure of flesh. 
An abortion is a terrible thing; in an ideal world we wouldn’t need any. No woman WANTS an abortion unless necessary. The people deciding the fate of women’s reproductive health are men who have no idea of the thought that goes into an abortion and the cost of said abortion on the woman’s body and indeed on her own psyche. Not to mention they have no idea of the cost they are now forcing women to pay by forcing them to term and making them jump through the various hoops in a decision that is already difficult. Making it more difficult just hurts women rather than saving the children.  
The men who support this movement do so often out of blind faith or worse without understanding the issues. The women who support the pro-life movement often cannot see a reason why any other woman would choose to end a foetus’s potential life. It’s a movement of privilege and of a lack of perspective in the reality of the world.
However we do have a world where there are some countries where abortion is illegal and sex education are talked of in hushed tones and in the words of abstinence rather than contraception and rhythm methods rather than the oral contraceptive pill. It is from here we can see what a world with no access to tested sex education and contraceptions is really like.
Internationally, the struggle for abortion rights continues. From 1994 onwards the right to abortion has been regarded as part of the Reproductive Health and Rights as laid out at the International Conference on Population and Development. It is estimated that roughly 19 million non-medical abortions a year occur and that roughly 13% of maternal deaths are due to such an abortion. In addition there are huge medical bills generated by treating women who have had complications from such an abortion. Across most of the world little priority is given to reducing unplanned pregnancy and reducing unsafe abortions by increasing contraception and education. In fact in a lot of the world there exist entities that seeks to prevent such information, most famously the Catholic Church.
Specifically in the Philippines, where the catholic church’s campaign to ban contraception and active campaigns to prevent their use also coincide with a massive anti-abortion drive with the provision of medical abortions being illegal. 
·         In the next 30 years, it’s estimated that the population in the Philippines will double to 170 million people. In perspective this is half the population of the USA on an area of land slightly smaller than Italy.
·         It is estimated that 35% live in the slums and below the poverty line. Often living on rubbish dumps and in landfill sites and with little to no hope of a solid income. Starvation is common with many families eating less than 3 meals a day.
·         Close to 40% of the population are under 15 and this demography is rising. Many families have more than two children.
·         A doctor is required to prescribe contraceptives and can chose to not do so. Doctors are often encourage
d to tell their patients to use catholic approved methodology both by their churches and by their superiors and many government clinics ban dispensation of condoms. However many doctors provide such services illegally.
·         The church believes that there is no real problem with this even proudly stating that because of the huge population, the Philippines is a major source of man power the world over. Many politicians in the government believe this and enforce bans to encourage the pro life movement. The Philippines actually has a problem where there are insufficient local jobs forcing the economy to be reliant on overseas investment from it’s own nationals.
·         They are less forthcoming about the treatment of the Philippine people in the Middle-East where they are often treated as little better than slaves or whether a population export business is really sustainable in the long run.
·         For the American Religious Right Wing, it has become a testing ground for their hypothesis on family planning. Many pro-life support groups fund education in “natural” contraception and abstinence education here. Operation Outcry is one such centre which spreads misinformation.
·         Groups such as Likhaan Centre for Women’s Health used to receive aid from the US government. The Rise of the Bush administration caused a cut to the international aid budget to organisations that encouraged contraception over abstinence. 
·         Despite abortion being illegal, there are medical practitioners who provide safe clandestine abortions. Sometimes at cost, sometimes for charities risking their licenses and jail terms to ensure women are safe. The cost of such an abortion is between £40 to £60, which is a large sum of money when you live on a garbage dump.
·         Despite this the vast majority of abortions that occur are performed by local healers and are via abdominal massage which can cause incredibly painful abortions and severe damage to the uterine wall that can cause death. These are done without anaesthesia and any modern medical support. It is the equivalent of being punched in the stomach.
·         Many hospitals do not report abortion attempts to the police. It would scare the few women who do come in and increase the death toll.
Some of the testimonials I have found looking through literature from Likhaan and their involvement with Unreported World are heart breaking, I have reprinted some.

“Remy has had two attempts at abortion, where she tried to induce abortion by massaging her own abdomen, but she gave birth each time to a son. The third time she took bitter herbs and threw herself out of a window. When that didn’t work she continued to massage her abdomen until one day she felt her water break and watched blood flow down. She blacked out from the pain. She bitterly wished she had access to contraceptives earlier in life. In the eyes of the church, she had committed a crime, a mortal sin by killing her own flesh and blood. She couldn’t afford to have this child; she already had two children she could not afford to feed. To bring a third into this world would have been a crime in itself.”

“The abortionist is not medically trained; she says she learnt how to do the procedure when working with another doctor who used to perform back alley abortions. However she can only do abortions upto 8 weeks, beyond that and the procedure becomes dangerous.  The girl she is treating is crying, even though she is under anaesthetic for the loss of her baby. The baby is 11 weeks old, this time she is lucky but other have had to be taken to the hospital”

“Many women are scared of coming to the hospital, many leave it so late that they are on the verge of death. Most are bleeding profusely, have infections or are septic. Often have tried to induce abortion using a sharp bamboo stick or a guava tree branch or consumed cytotan which induces contractions”

It is estimated that nearly 400,000 abortions take place annually here with nearly 80,000 women hospitalised yearly, and that 12% of maternal deaths occur due to unsafe non-medical abortion. (sourced from Juarez, Fatima et al.)
This was in 1994; it is believed that the number has risen every single year. It is impossible to hold any survey without risking the women involved and the abortion providers themselves are operating outside the law. The back street abortionists see themselves as providing a essential service and alleviating suffering by stopping that of the others despite being staunch catholics themselves.
These are not crimes of hatred but the efforts of loving mothers who don’t wish to bring a child into a world where they cannot feed and clothe the child. Each one is wracked by incredible guilt due to the actions of their faith without realising the cause for their suffering is the catholic restriction on contraception, education and aborti
ons. Many of the women believe that the fact they survive the harrowing abortion process is testament to the fact that God forgives them for their sin and that god understands why they did it. To them undergoing their back street abortions is literally putting their lives in God’s hands. 
What would we see in the USA? How many doctors would take to providing abortions in places where it was banned? How many nurses and how many quacks? How many women will have to throw themselves down stairs or from windows?
This may be the future of women in the USA and indeed all over the world if we don’t fight for the right. Take a stand, because the entire world is watching what you do.

If not, stories like this will stop being distant occurences and start being a lot closer to home.

A letter to Men’s Rights Activists

I choose to respond to some points raised by Namakae in the Medicinae et Chirurgiae thread here.

1. The Stern Review you have quoted actually calls for an expansion in rape services because only 1/10 cases are being reported (a lot lower than my figure.) and even though only 1/10 are fake reports they are usually found out pretty quick. It also points out that women who are drunk or are “promiscuous” don’t get justice because juries and judges assume that they were “asking for it”.

2. The Rape statistics quoted indicate rapes positively identified as forcible sex or coerced sex.

3. I didn’t bother looking up the Stern Review, I just quoted from medical jurisprudence. Mine may be out of date. But the Stern Review is actually “pro me” and “anti you” because it makes my stats better by pointing out how few women actually report rape.

4. Or women aren’t reporting rapes as much because they are traumatised. Seriously, I have worked with PTSD suffering women and rape is the usual cause. It’s not a joke.

5. How come none of the stats you provide are from mainstream sources.


“Feminists downplay the violence against men, chivalrous men say they won’t hit a woman because the difference between the genders is too great. Why not tell women to respect men in the first place so that they don’t end up in the hospital when men retaliate? If feminists had any amount of self-deceny and consistency they would have labelled the kicks in groins that men are subjected to on TV, as sexual assaults. “

6. This would only work if women received the same respect and the rate of assualt of men vs. women is incredibly skewed towards women being the losing side. And they respect me, they don’t respect the MRM because you don’t deserve it. You don’t respect women. The entire concept of “game” is treating women as cattle.

7. You aren’t chivalrous. It’s not needed, what you need is respect. Why do I hold a door open for a woman? Because it’s cute. Not because she is incapable of doing so. Why do I get a woman flowers? Because I have a garden and I tend to have pretty flowers in it that women like. Chocolates? You are confusing chivalry with “acting like women are incapable of doing things”. Modern chivalry is just “being genuinely nice” and not acting like a person who thinks women are just vaginas with a puzzle lock.

and so they so they infiltrate men’s institutions and say “make place for us”. Once they have made it “equal” so that men finally become the second sex in it, they declare victory!!

8. No they don’t. They just wish to be treated the same as people with penises and testicles. The only provision for women I have seen in my line of education is different changing rooms. And in surgical wards they change in the same rooms and don’t give a crap. That’s a stupid plan.

They won against patriarchy? Hell no; they basically threw a tantrum against their own fathers, brothers and sons, and got away with it because men are more fair-minded than women ever will be, and their love for women is something that women can’t ever reciprocate.

9. Actually we gave them rights in the west because they had more rights in the Soviet Union upto and including actual frontline soldiers. Forcing our women back into their houses was going to be detrimental to “the next war” because our “enemy” simply could crush us by weight of economy driven by a double sized work force. Women formed a sizeable labour force that if annoyed sufficiently would not work and who were becoming more educated and more understanding of the inherent unfairness of a system where they weren’t allowed to vote and to hold jobs that earned the same wage. We did it out of necessity, they did it out of the fact they want to be equal. In the USA they were given the vote to distance their movement from the black civil rights movement but that didn’t work out so well. Women’s lib were big advocates of black rights.

10. Yes. We are so fair minded that in most of the world women are still regarded as second class citizens and treated like property.

11. The worst whips are the whips in the mind. Women often are the biggest oppressors of women because women assume they have it good. Some women are happy to be housewives. Just like how some men are happy to never read a book or improve themselves.

There is no serious bullshit. Your movement stems from one simple fact. That “I am a man!” doesn’t cut it anymore. Women want more, I have zero issues with the other gender. I don’t have this problem where women play mind games or do any of the things that your movement claims. Game attracts a certain kind of person, the women with low self esteem and the women who are attracted to complete jerks. Whatever floats their boat. The vast majority of women however like people like myself.

I know what it’s like. I was the ugly kid. I didn’t get any dates growing up and still run across the occasional person who judges me by my looks. I am still considered ugly since I went bald aged 20 and am forced to shave my head short or look like I suffer from mange. I am chubby and not particularly tall. My only saving graces are my lovely eyes and a sense of humour. I thought like you did growing up. That women are crazy and don’t know what they want. What they want is genuinely nice men not the “nice guy” or the “complete douchebag” demography that the MRM entails.

Men aren’t fair minded. I have seen women burnt by greedy men. I have seen women with no noses and no ears. I have seen women die because their worth is only as a slave with a dowry. Not all men are arseholes like the Men’s Right Movement and we are sick of you ruining our good names. Your movement speaks of us as some sort of inferior breed primarily because you cannot deal with us. We make up the new middle class of intelligent, well off, well educated and multi-talented men who don’t look at women as personal housekeepers and instead want someone who can hold a conversation about a variety of topics and who is a complete human being.

These women scare you because they are “feminists” since they are independent, smart and don’t fall for your nonsense. The fact that their number is growing and indeed that your normal demographic of “whipped” women are listening to these women and that these women are the role models for a growing population of women is a genuine fear for your movement.