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May 21 2013

Now I’m a Nazi Sniper

Here’s an adorable little bit of propaganda that’s being passed around on one of the harasser hashtags.

 

(Link to Storify for browsers where the embedding doesn’t work.)

Sweet, huh?

Notice how it never comes out and says that Greg, I, or Amanda are incorrect about any of the things we said. Notice how it doesn’t actually make the argument out loud that the leaders of organizations that claim to represent us, to which we donate our time and our money, should be allowed to run those organizations with no accountability. Note how it never explicitly says that we’re a political coalition with state power engaging in serial genocide. Note how it never puts in words the idea that we’re hiding in some safe place at some safe distance in order to take out our targets.

That’s because those ideas are stupid.

That’s because those arguments are grossly inflammatory in an atmosphere that already includes harassment and threats.

Damion Reinhardt doesn’t say any of those things because then people would be able to quote him on them. He just puts them in pictures and whistles at the ceiling.

Damion, we’re not stupid. We know, however, that your target audience is all too ready to buy the crap arguments you won’t even put into bald words. They’re already calling themselves “brave heroes” for opposing us. We will hold you responsible for what they do with those arguments.

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  1. 1
    StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    Um, I’m not seeing it on my screen,sorry.

    Could be an issue on my end. using Chrome if that helps any.

    “Nazi sniper” sounds almost cool in an evil way. Could also be taken as sniping and taking out Nazis which would, yknow, kinda be good. Metaphorically and in the actual historical sense. Inglorious blighters’ springs to mind here.

  2. 2
    StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    “it” being, I gather some picture that automatically loses the argument for him by Godwin, yes?

    (We still have Godwin’ s Law right?)

  3. 3
    Stephanie Zvan

    I just added a link to the Storify for anyone whose browser won’t embed the story. That should work for you on most browsers.

  4. 4
    StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    Yes that works for me. Thanks Stephanie Zvan.

  5. 5
    Scr... Archivist

    A better and real example of a sniper who fought the Nazi war machine was Lyudmila Pavlichenko. According to Wikipedia, “Credited with 309 kills, she is regarded as the most successful female sniper in history.”

    After being wounded by a mortar, she was removed from active service. In 1942, she traveled in Canada, the U.S., and the U.K. The Wikipedia article notes that, “While meeting with reporters in Washington, D.C. she was dumbfounded about the kind of questions put to her. ‘One reporter even criticized the length of the skirt of my uniform, saying that in America women wear shorter skirts and besides my uniform made me look fat’.”

    That was more than 70 years ago.

    And no, I can’t see the Twitter image either.

  6. 6
    Scr... Archivist

    Ah, now I can see it. Thanks, Stephanie.

    I also find it odd how Reinhardt is saying that criticism of the comments and attitudes of a few individuals is the same as targeting secular groups. If anything, the criticism is made to (among other things) alert those groups to flaws in their leadership, and thus to help those groups succeed.

  7. 7
    sezit

    I don’t see any refernce in the picture to nazis. Am i missing something? Sniper is bad enough, no need to refer to nazis if not actually there.

  8. 8
  9. 9
    Jackie the wacky

    My answer to his question is :Yes. If your org. supports bigots, harassers, liars and other assorted cretins, they should be named, shamed and then promptly abandoned by decent people.

    What an utter tool that guy is. I guess bus boycotts in the 60′s were just like Nazis coming for the unions too. I guess boycotting BP over their support of apartheid was just like the Nazis murdering socialists.

    Christ on a cracker Stephanie, you have horrible opponents.

  10. 10
    Jackie the wacky

    I keep getting the urge to rub my hands together and misquote Night of the Living Dead.
    “We’re coming to get you barbarians.”
    Muha….muhahahaha!

  11. 11
    A Hermit

    I love the way the targets of all those rape jokes and sexist photoshops and personal insults are just supposed to get thick skins and deal with it as “criticism” or “skepticism” and shut up about it, but not being sufficiently deferential to the CEO of CFI is “coming after him” and a “targeted attack” like the NaZI’s !!!!1111!! used to do…

  12. 12
    smhll

    Considering you stood up right out in the open and participated in Nugent’s lenghthy peace and reconciliation process, describing you as an aggressor who is hiding is very fucking inappropriate.

  13. 13
    Improbable Joe, bearer of the Official SpokesGuitar

    I’m with A Hermit on this one. Those people are obsessed with “criticism” and “discussion” which always boils down to them name-calling and trying to silence people, but if anyone dares criticize one of their anointed “leaders” they go into a blind rage and make ridiculous comparisons to Hitler.

  14. 14
    hyperdeath

    According to his Twitter Biography, Damion Reinhardt used to be a fundamentalist Christian.

    Old habits die hard…

  15. 15
    Eristae

    What A Hermit said. When women are getting rape threats and death threats, we’re/they’re not supposed to engage, not supposed to feed the trolls, not supposed to react at all, but when the CEO of CFI gets criticized, then This Can’t Be Allowed To Stand. We’re getting called cunts and bitches who should go off ourselves? Eh, nothing to be done, that’s what comes from being publicly visible, and we’d better just toughen up. Lindsay gets called on his behavior? OMFG HOW DARE THEY?

  16. 16
    amandamarcotte

    At this point, their complete and total refusal to actually describe what their arguments are, or where the points of disagreement with feminism are is more maddening than anything else. A bunch of women spoke at the conference! Surely they have arguments that could be argued against, but instead there’s a bunch of whining about “silencing” of arguments they refuse to make.

  17. 17
    Stephanie Zvan

    Amanda, it’s even more fun than that. On a few of those rare occasions when they’ve made an argument and I’ve answered it, they just stop engaging for a little bit. “Thanks for your response” then *poof*. No attempt to argue back. Nothing saying I’m wrong, much less how. Then they swim around the tank once* and repeat the same damn thing they said the first time while shouting that I don’t respond to criticism.

    *Yes, I know goldfish demonstrate that they have memories. I’m saying these people are worse than goldfish.

  18. 18
    oolon

    Damion self described as “Former fundie” … I dunno seems he’s replaced one set of authority figures to get this “free thought” from with another set.

    Desperate to protect his leaders from the awful #FTBullies for some reason. Can they not defend themselves? Unlike his hyperbole implies no one is out to get anyone with guns, words and ideas are the battleground. I see Damion and his pals with childish stunts such as sending the Vac to WIS2 and sound bite advertising like his storify. Where is the thought leadership? Who is setting an agenda, they are all “experts” on what’s wrong with feminism and Ryan Grant Long’s women’s studies certificate is all the “expertise” they can call on. They have nothing to replace it with if they actually managed to tear down feminism other than a meh, laws, reasons, women are already ok so why bother.

    You need better opponents.

    [BTW so does Amanda Marcotte, her Lindsay post trawled up a bunch of antis, Damion and Ryan included, who provided zero substantive argument!]

  19. 19
    oolon

    @hyperdeath, hehe, great minds….

  20. 20
    Glendon Mellow

    Incredible. As rational, skeptical, questioning, reasoning and caring members and supporters of free thought and atheist groups, we should hold leaders to high standards. Asking Lindsay to take a step back and reconsider his words is not crazy. This Storify by Reinhardt in response is nuts.

  21. 21
    Illuminata, Genie in the Beer Bottle

    Damion Reinhardt is the biggest fucking coward in the bigot pit. he can’t answers straight forward questions about what his problem with feminism, etc. is, but he can blast out lies and libel at the speed of light. What a worthless pissant.

    Marcotte is right – they don’t have ANY actual arguments to make. They think “shut up, bitch” is all they need.

  22. 22
    Stephanie Zvan

    Hmm. I don’t know that Reinhardt supported CFI before Women in Secularism. On the other hand, I have plenty of data that he didn’t like us uppity feminists.

  23. 23
    amandamarcotte

    I get that whatever their actual arguments are, they know they are clearly too silly to be exposed to the open air. But because they fear sharing their thoughts doesn’t make us the thought police. I’m sick of being targeted by people who confuse their own unwillingness to say stupid things with feminists using magical powers to stop them from saying it.

  24. 24
    Stephanie Zvan

    “Ooh, ooh, you silenced me! By…um. By…er. By being right.”

  25. 25
    SallyStrange

    Yeah, convincing a person to stop saying X because X is clearly wrong is not silencing either.

  26. 26
    Eneraldo Carneiro

    As to say that somebody said some stupid bullshit, when such somebody actually said some stupid bullshit doesn’t configure a witch hunt.

  27. 27
    smhll

    …not supposed to react at all, but when the CEO of CFI gets criticized, then This Can’t Be Allowed To Stand.

    Yeah, the notion of patiently listening to anyone who ever wants to criticize you because they might have a valid point evaporated pretty fast… (Gee maybe it was never supposed to apply to him.) (I’m fine with him talking back and stating what he thought the crux of his speech was, but I’m shaking my head at the North Korea comparison. OMGosh.)

    (On the other hand “that dude is white” (paraphrased) isn’t a complete point.)

  28. 28
    throwaway

    (On the other hand “that dude is white” (paraphrased) isn’t a complete point.)

    Having trouble parsing the meaning here. Where was it offered as a complete point and by whom?

  29. 29
    Stephanie Zvan

    I assume it’s a reference to Lindsay’s fear that Rebecca was going to start yelling “White man on stage!” or something like that.

  30. 30
    Xaivius (Formerly Robpowell, Acolyte of His Majesty Lord Niel DeGrasse Tyson I)

    Stephanie Zvan @ 29

    From watching the video, I’m suprised someone didn’t yell “Get that asshole off the stage!”

    Because at about 20 minutes in, that’s what I would’ve been doing. Being tone trolled by a privileged, upper-middle class CEO would have brought out my argumentative side. Fuck this asshole, and all the tawdry little trolls like him, that seem to think they’re feelings are more important than campaigning against the dehumanization of women.

  31. 31
    Xaivius (Formerly Robpowell, Acolyte of His Majesty Lord Niel DeGrasse Tyson I)

    Annnnnnnnnnnnnd I just trolled myself on They’re-Their-There

  32. 32
    Hank_Says

    Ugh, Reinhardt.

    I see leaving fundie-land didn’t harm or even moderate the sense of entitlement, the paper-thin skin and the persecution complex those people cling to like rats to flotsam. I’d pity him if he didn’t so conceitedly (if ham-fucking-fistedly) present himself as A Voice for Reason™ while proudly & cluelessly cosying up to fucking incompetent stooges like Vacula, Paden and Bat-mouse.

    The irony would appear that Reinhardt’s pals & associates are more like the snipers: hiding behind pseudonyms and firing their barbs from the parapets of internet anonymity; Vacula passive-aggressively snickering on twitter from the corners of CFI conference rooms instead of confronting his foes directly; Reinhardt himself alluding to things and making implications and invoking the fucking Nazis yet again (I’m surprised he didn’t invoke McCarthyism and social Darwinism as well), instead of coming out and saying what he fucking means and what his fucking problem is. Clusterfuck though it was, at least Lindsay had the vertebrae to just say, in public, what he thought was the problem.

    From Reinhardt:

    I believe you are all profoundly incorrect on some fairly basic points in play here, but now is not a particularly opportune time to rehash your attacks on Vacula or the various attacks on Grothe, some of which were downright slanderous. As to Marcotte’s ongoing attempts to get Lindsay sacked, I have to admit that I could do more on that front, and I shall do so as soon as possible. Thank you for your concern and for giving me that extra push to get more involved.

    Well, good. If it’s disagreement on “fairly basic points”, it shouldn’t take you too long to actually make your argument. And when you finally get around to doing so, that means you could probably express your point without hyperbolic stock images or allusions to the fucking Nazis. Because you know who else always compares their opponents to Nazis? Fundie Christians. If you’ve really left the fundie mode of thinking behind you’ll be able to make a cogent argument without playing the Hitler card.

  33. 33
    Martha

    So, does “adorable” have a different meaning in Minnesota, too? Kind of like “interesting” does?

    Seriously, what a complete waste of time this guy is. :-(

  34. 34
    Stephanie Zvan

    We speak high sarcasm.

  35. 35
    August Berkshire

    Wow, here I thought we had elected you “Associate President” of Minnesota Atheists when in reality you are “Assassinate President.” Cool! We may make use of that. ;-)

  36. 36
    Anthony K

    Anyone know how to crowd-fund a board game? Think ‘Trivial Pursuit’, only all the clues are quotes likening various people to Nazis, Stalinists, etc, and the players have to guess whether the quote is from a Prominent Skeptic Leader or Glenn Beck. The object of the game is to be the first player to collect 100 units of wealth (a gold bar for every correctly identified Beck quote; a Bitcoin for every correctly identified Prominent Skeptic Leader quote) and retire to a island where the only function of government is to providing coercive force to protect your winnings from parasites. To add to the excitement and danger of the game, players will have to avoid the dreaded “Silenced by Feminazis” squares, although there is absolutely no actual game penalty whatsoever for landing on them.

    I’m thinking of calling it “Paranoid Ranting Godwinning Libertarian Dolt or Paranoid Ranting Godwinning Libertarian Mormon Dolt?” but a title containing more than one concept might exclude the Glenn Beck/ Prominent Skeptic Leader fans as a potential market.

  37. 37
    Feline

    I’m thinking of calling it “Paranoid Ranting Godwinning Libertarian Dolt or Paranoid Ranting Godwinning Libertarian Mormon Dolt?” but a title containing more than one concept might exclude the Glenn Beck/ Prominent Skeptic Leader fans as a potential market.

    Well, if the whole market is a subset of “people who can read dice” I doubt that it would be a problem.

  38. 38
    Tom Foss

    Strange that you never see them pull out the “witch of the week” meme when it’s a bunch of skeptics dogpiling on the newest bullshit from some bullshit-peddler. When the skeptosphere dogpiled on Sylvia Browne a week or so ago over that prediction about the abducted women, did the Hashtag Brave Heroes of the Slymepit issue a post comparing James Randi to a Nazi? Where’s “First they came for Joseph Mercola, then they came for Dr. Oz, then they came for Stanislaw Burzynski”?

    If they thought the statements and ideas being attacked were defensible, then why leap to the irrelevant character defense posture? Why not provide arguments and rebuttals instead of jumping to the claim of “character assassination”? It speaks to an unwillingness or inability to do the more difficult work of actually arguing. It’s also the same tactic that the bullshit-peddlers and their supporters trot out in response to skeptics. It’s a dodge, a red herring, an attempt to deflect substantial criticisms by dishonestly framing them as ad hominem attacks.

    You’d think skeptics would be able to see that.

  39. 39
    Aratina Cage

    @Oolon

    @hyperdeath, hehe, great minds….

    Or the same mind… ! o.O

  40. 40
    StevoR : Free West Papua, free Tibet, let the Chagossians return!

    @5. Scr… Archivist

    A better and real example of a sniper who fought the Nazi war machine was Lyudmila Pavlichenko. According to Wikipedia, “Credited with 309 kills, she is regarded as the most successful female sniper in history.”

    Okay, first time I’ve heard of her – thanks for that Scr … Archivist. :-)

  41. 41
    sciliz

    OH. I thought you meant a sniper that snipes Nazis. Cause that would be kinda fun, as sniper gigs go.

    If you ever start, I want in!

  42. 42
    Stephanie Zvan

    10-4. :)

  43. 43
    Ichthyic

    there’s something ironic in Rheinhardt using “Storify”.

    just can’t quite put my finger on it…

    :P

  44. 44
    Ichthyic

    I believe you are all profoundly incorrect on some fairly basic points in play here, but now is not a particularly opportune time to rehash your attacks

    Translation:

    “Look, you, I have an agenda here; a story to fabricate, and it would be seriously hampered by actually addressing real concerns.:”

  1. 45
    Quote of the morning » Butterflies and Wheels

    [...] Amanda Marcotte on a post of Stephanie’s: [...]

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