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Evil Enough Already

One of the progressive activists I follow on Twitter posted a link last night.

In a story that is almost too horrific to believe, what looks to be a childrens’ mass burial ground has been discovered around the Mohawk Institute Indian residential school near Brantford, Ontario, Canada.

The International Tribunal into Crimes of Church and State continues:

“According to Rev. Kevin Annett, Secretary of the International Tribunal for Crimes of Church and States (www.itccs.org), the Mohawk Institute was “set up by the Anglican Church of England in 1832 to imprison and destroy generations of Mohawk children. This very first Indian [First Nations] residential school in Canada lasted until 1970, and, like in most residential schools, more than half of the children imprisoned there never returned. Many of them are buried all around the school.”

Preliminary scanning by ground penetrating radar adjacent to the now closed main building Mohawk Institute has revealed that “between 15-20 feet of soil” was brought in and put over the mass graves just before the Mohawk Institute closed in 1970 in order to camouflage the mass graves of Mohawk Children and avoid prosecution for genocide and crimes against humanity under the Geneva Conventions, the International Criminal Court, and cooperating national courts.

International Tribunal for Crimes of Church and States (ITCCS.org) is expected to commence judicial proceedings starting in late October 2011 in Brussels, Belgium and Dublin, Ireland for child genocide crimes against humanity against defendants Elizabeth Windsor, head of state of Canada and head of the Church of England and Pope Joseph Ratzinger, both of whom knowingly participated in the planning and coverup of the child genocide, according to forensic evidence.

It’s a story based entirely on a set of press releases and videos by the ITCCS, which is enough to raise some flags for me. More were raised as the story went on.

The discovery of the mass graves of Mohawk children, uncovered by ground-penetrating radar at the Mohawk Institute comes on the heels of videotaped evidence by eyewitness William Coombes, who in Oct. 1964 witnessed Elizabeth Windsor, as Head of State of Canada and Head of the Church of England, visit an aboriginal school in Kamloops, British Columbia, choose 10 young aboriginal children, made them kiss her feet, and allegedly took them from the school for a picnic at a lake.

The 10 aboriginal children were never seen again. Mr. Coombes, who was to give evidence at the International Tribunal for Crimes of Church and States (ITCCS.org) of Elizabeth Windsor’s child genocide, was murdered in Feb. 2011. Fortunately, Mr. Coombes’ testimony was videotaped before his death and is available for the Tribunal.

Rev. Kevin Annett states that instruments of torture such as a rack for torturing the Mohawk children in ritual torture have been found at the now closed Mohawk Institute. Eyewitnesses from the Mohawk community have stated they witnessed priests in red robes torturing children in ritual torture.

Rev. Annett made these revelations in an exclusive Oct. 7, 2011 interview with Alfred Lambremont Webre. In the interview, Rev. Annett acknowledges the close parallels between the Oct. 1964 personal child genocide and possible ritual killings of 10 aboriginal children by Elizabeth Windsor, Head of State of Canada and Head of the Church of England, and the child genocides occurring during the same period at the Mohawk Institute.

The ritual abuse and murder of children is one of those things that has been alleged so many times and panned out so few that it makes me instantly skeptical. The appropriate response to feeling skeptical, of course, is to keep digging.

I went to Google News to see whether anyone was doing any reporting on this beyond reprinting the press releases. Almost all of the search results were for conspiracy sites. It didn’t take long, looking at the ITCCS website to figure out why. Their official broadcasters run a conspiracy talk radio show.

I did manage to find one Native American news site that contained information I had missed: “Annett said the investigation began September 28 with a psychic he brought from B.C..” Even if none of the national or big regional presses had picked this up, I would have expected the specialty presses to have information from someone other than Annett. So far, not so good.

I checked the individuals and groups mentioned in the press releases and videos. Men’s Fire doesn’t have an official site that I could find. They appear to be an activist group within Six Nations, having gotten the most coverage for protesting land claims by developers. Six Nations doesn’t mention the disinterment or investigation in their news. Nor do any of the Mohawk councils to which they link.

I did find some more information when I looked up Bill Squire, the Mohawk elder quotes as approving Annett’s plan and who has equated the theft of land with genocide. It turns out he represents a local labor group and one of those rather odd groups that pops up now and again around indigenous peoples. Warning, if the blue and red don’t already hurt your eyes, the text will hurt your brain.


The site that links Bill Squire to Sovran has some more information about the group:

The “Sovran” Movement
The proponents of the “Sovran” movement include members of dangerous militias (one of whom worked to overthrow a government), alternative medicine, New Agers, and Quebec separatists. The central idea running through this movement is that a person can supposedly legally declare themselves sovereign, or in the movement’s bizarre misspelling, “Sovran,” and thus be beyond all laws. Sorry, but the real world does not work that way, and the only likely result is that you will go to jail. Judges and prosecutors will just be amused at how little you understand both the law and the real world.

[...]

The Sovran group has “Departments of Technology” and sells “Quantum Healing,” “Orgonite Pendants,” “Healing Machines to cure cancer,” and an “Energy Auto Charging Device to restructure the molecules of the OGM Foods.” For various fees from fifty to 300 dollars, plus annual fees of twelve more dollars, you can get different IDs and license plates. Their store is largely altmedicine, including pyramids and “implant killers.” Someone needs to tell them The Matrix was just a movie.

The Sovran group will also give you advice on the IRS, have a Security Department and another called, “Formation and Guiding Department for all new Ambassadors.” There is also a department called Hemp Industry, and another called Earth Healing.

The Sovran group uses false versions of Native prophecies from a virtual Who’s Who of New Age frauds, including:
Adam DeArmon AKA “Adam Yellowbird of Sedona,” a white New Age healer.

Roy Steevensz AKA “Roy Littlesun,” a Dutch-Indonesian man claiming to be a Hopi elder who is barred from the Hopi Nations for disrupting their ceremonies

Aurelio Diaz AKA Tekpankalli, who claims to be Purapecha, but has an Aztec name.

Perhaps our “psychic” who sent Annett after the bodies of ritually murdered children came out of Sovran. Either way, claiming his approval as a Mohawk elder should not be inferred to signal an endorsement of the ritual killing theory by any of the larger native governments of the area.

This is important because when I started researching Annett himself, I found a history of using native activist organizations for personal fundraising, claiming their support and endorsement, and failing to treat them as partners in his own plan for…whatever his plan is. Annett says it is to uncover the truth. Whatever his purposes, he seems to be repeating part of the pattern here.

There are, of course, other sites that say the reason he’s been discredited is exactly that he is trying to expose the truth. Annett’s own explanations rely on all the official representatives of native Canadians being corrupt and agreeing to keep the deaths of thousands of children secret. Given the requirement for a vast conspiracy in Annett’s account, and the fact that a historian published (under his university press) the harsh documentation of residential schools, A National Crime, the very next year, I’m less inclined to believe Annett than the activists.

In fact, this issue routinely gets press these days, even outside of Canada. Cynically, I find myself wondering whether this is why Annett is no longer going on about genocide but is focusing on ritual abuse and murder by high-ranking government officials. Apparently taking children away from their parents and their communities, sexually and otherwise abusing them, and shoving healthy children into residential schooling with children with tuberculosis isn’t sexy enough. Not if it means the attention is going somewhere else.

In addition to the conspiracy websites, I found the unchecked, unqualified information from the ITCCS on a couple of atheist sites. There are plenty of anti-religious critiques to be made of Canadian residential school history: Churches ran the schools; they provided the personnel that abused these children; they ignored the abuse for decades; getting the money for restitution has not always gone smoothly. It will take some research, but there are lines to be drawn between church authoritarianism, the assumption of God’s will in colonization, and the horrors that have already been well-documented.

Can we please, please, not pass this particular story around with gasps and pointing fingers? Not unless and until it checks out?

Comments

  1. says

    Hi Steph,
    Yes, i did read your post, carefully.
    And I have read “A National Crime”
    And I have read “Hidden No Longer”, which contains many scans from official archives.
    Will you please confirm that you have read both books?
    Thanks,

    Andrew

  2. Etcetera says

    Children dying and being buried at residential schools has been common knowledge for decades. I doubt that these were ritualized murders; the Catholics don’t really have a history of that sort of thing. They prefer to pretend that they’re carrying out “god’s work” by beating them to death in an exorcism attempt. The murder was likely incidental but either way, you end up with dead children and no accountability.

  3. julian says

    Always nice to see someone vetting their sources and trying to look at something from multiple angles.

    Thanks for the read.

  4. says

    Andrew, I’ve been reading it via the free pdf. It’s okay in the reading, but the self-aggrandizement is a bit jarring. I’m still largely waiting for it to stop being a story of Annett fighting the big baddies and to get on with telling the stories of the people it’s supposed to be about. I’m 50 pages in.

  5. says

    Great news, Steph, I look forward to discussing the implications of the scanned documents from various archives along with the eye-witness testimonials. For me, this has little to do with Kevin Annett (the messenger) and everything to do with the people and institutions responsible for Canada’s continuing genocide of indigenous, sovereign people (the message). The current NATO-led destruction of Libya is but one such horrendous example: http://sovcom.net/2011/10/11/the-bearer-of-bad-news-ugly-truths-uncomfortable-realities/

    I hope that you and I are working for a common cause here: the end of violence and conquest.

    Many thanks,

    Andrew

    “Ah yes, truth. Funny how everyone is always asking for it but when they get it they don’t believe it because it’s not the truth they want to hear.” -Helena Cassadine, General Hospital

  6. says

    Here is an update from Vatican Crimes that speaks directly to Kevin Annett’s involvement in the uncovering of mass graves on Mohawk territory:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWyZvzCoKUg

    BRANTFORD, ON – The Mohawk Nation in Grand River in collaboration with the ITCCS (International Tribunal into Crimes of Church and State) and its secretary Kevin Annett bring the latest news on the digging of children mass graves that have begun in Brantford, Ontario to expose the crimes committed by Church and State against thousands of native children.

    This report announces the latest update on these forensic investigations as of October 12, 2011. As secretary of the International Tribunal, Kevin Annett was invited and kindly welcomes by the Mohawk nation for this initiative of looking for justice – that Kevin was even adopted into the nation – and not being intrusive like the rumors that have been circulating in yet another attempt to stop the evidence from coming to light.

    The investigations will continue with the full support of the Mothers as the it is time for the world to know the truth. The evidence obtained will be utilized to take it to the tribunals to take place in London, UK and other countries this fall.

  7. says

    Andrew, are you aware that there are people who specialize in the forensics of genocide instead of just having a little bit of archaeology in their background?

    This “discovery of genocide” thing is pissing me off. Everyone in that community knows that those children didn’t come back and that, for the most part, they didn’t come back because they were horribly maltreated. Everyone knows and has known for decades that genocide occurred. There is no “discovery of genocide” here.

    There may be a discovery of mass graves. Those graves have to be somewhere, and the grounds of the school and the grounds of the local hospital are the two most likely places. It’s slightly less likely that the survivors of the school wouldn’t know about mass graves on the property. There’s a fair chance that everyone has known about the graves all along.

    Still, if they want to dig them up, these are their friends, sisters and brothers, aunts and uncles, etc. It is about damned time they have some say in how their remains are treated. But if they’re looking for answers to how they died, if they have questions that haven’t been answered yet, they might want to get a professional involved. Not someone with some passing knowledge of archaeology.

    Your continual insistence that only by going to Annett can we manage to understand anything about the schools and what happened there is a little weird. I’ve already stipulated the things you want to “discuss” once I’ve read the book, and they have no bearing on whether I consider allegations of ritual abuse and murder to be plausible or hype.

    Also, the name is Stephanie. It’s right there at the top of my post, in the sidebar, and at the top of every comment I make.

  8. says

    Hello Stephanie,

    Thanks for your comments.

    Yes, I am aware that there are specialists in forensic archaeology. (In fact, one of my ancestors wrote a famous textbook on forensic pathology that was used by universities for decades.) To date, the only interest exhibited by forensic science in mass graves in Canada has been the recent unearthing of sled dogs in Whistler, BC at a cost of $250,000. No funding is available for investigating the cases of 50,000+ children murdered by the churches and state.

    Will you provide the resources necessary to hire professionals?

    I’m sure that the indigenous people of every land are well aware of the genocide committed against.

    Would you agree that the same cannot be said of the “European” community?

    The purpose of the digs is, in part, to bring to light the fate of the dead, and hold accountable the people and institutions responsible for genocide. To date, not a single individual has been charged with a crime in Canada.

    Do you agree that people responsible for serious crimes should be held accountable for their actions?

    Why do you claim that “Your continual insistence that only by going to Annett can we manage to understand anything about the schools and what happened there is a little weird.”? I have made no such claim, and would appreciate your correcting your statement.

    Why are you so concerned with the messenger, and yet make no credible attempt to rebut the message?

    Please accept my apology for mis-using your name, I meant no disrespect to you.

    Thank you,

    Andrew

    “One owes respect to the living. To the dead, one owes only the truth.” – Voltaire (1694-1778)

  9. CanadianSteve says

    Andrew, I don’t think you realize how harmful conspiracy theorists like Arnett are to the causes they claim to support. By making wildly speculative claims he turns off the people that should be paying more attention to these issues.
    I read the first section of “Hidden no longer” just now. It is immediately clear this is not an attempt to be historically accurate, but rather to spin a conspiracy. Some of the facts may be true, but he extrapolates wildly on motives without any basis or context – and this is only in his timeline. The language he uses is rediculously biased. If this book were my only knowledge of residential schools I would be inclined to think the whole topic was on the same level as 9/11 truthers.
    This is sad, because it does erode support for indigineous groups from ordinary Canadians. It is true that a genocide was perpetrated – no knowledgable person seriously denies it. However, there is also a lot of revisionist history going on with relation to European colonization of NA, adding in conspiracy theories doesn’t help.

  10. says

    Will you provide the resources necessary to hire professionals?

    No, sadly, I cannot do that. However, ask an archaeologist of your acquaintance how they feel about sites destroyed by amateurs and how much information has been lost that way.

    Would you agree that the same cannot be said of the “European” community?

    Actually, no, mostly because I can’t speak for Europeans. I do know that the atrocities of colonization are widely known in the U.S. The same goes for the Canadians I know. I know information on the topic is published in both Canadian and British newspapers.

    I don’t understand what putting out press releases talking about ritual abuse and murder are going to do to get the facts of genocide out to a wider audience, particularly when those subjects are much more likely to keep the release from being printed as is and, thus, printed at all.

    Do you agree that people responsible for serious crimes should be held accountable for their actions?

    Of course I do. Don’t be an ass. However, I see no good way that these actions bring that any closer. There are plenty of records of the atrocities that happened in the schools. What will an amateur dig led by an amateur who is only listened to by conspiracy theorists add to that to bring any of those people to an accounting? What do you expect to find in those graves that will tie any crime to any individual in any actionable way?

    Why are you so concerned with the messenger, and yet make no credible attempt to rebut the message?

    Which message? The message of genocide? I have only supported that message here. The message of ritual abuse and murder? As I noted above, these things are often claimed and exceedingly rarely turn out to have any substance. As such, it requires more than allegations for them to be taken as anything other than crackpottery.

    If you tell the world you’re looking for evidence that a Canadian leader personally murdered 10 kids and relying on an amateur to find it, you’ll get a very different reaction than if you tell them you’re giving the bodies a proper burial and looking for more information on their deaths while you do it. That last option? It would actually get real press. There is no conspiracy of silence. The CBC reports on this topic.

    The other reason I am concerned about the messenger is that Annett’s focus seems to be on Annett, not on the people he says he’s helping. There’s been enough of that, thank you.

    Now, as for your insistence that we need to listen to Annett. Your first comment:

    Please read the 425 pages of evidence of Canada’s holocaust at http://hiddennolonger.com and decide for yourself the veracity of the claims of genocide in Canada.

    I didn’t suggest at any point that there had been no genocide in this post you said you’d read. Quite the opposite. I had even given a reference for people who wanted to know more about the atrocities. You insisted I needed Annett to be able to judge. You even suggested I couldn’t talk about the subject until I’d read it:

    I look forward to discussing the implications of the scanned documents from various archives along with the eye-witness testimonials.

    So, yes, you’re saying Annett is critical to understanding what happened. He is not.

  11. says

    Hello Stephanie,

    The message, plain and simply, is that no one has been held accountable for the genocide.

    What, specifically, do you suggest be done to accomplish that goal?

    Also, can you direct your readers to a more complete collection of evidence than “Hidden No Longer”?

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  12. says

    Of course the people responsible should be held accountable. But what of those who’ve already passed on? What do you want to happen, there?

  13. says

    Hello Stephanie,

    When I suggested that you read “Hidden No Longer”, I meant that you do so before making recommendations one way or the other. You know, the intellectual honesty thing.

    Whether the murders and abuse had a ritual component or not is irrelevant. The murders, abuse and genocide happened, and continue to happen (Highway of Tears in BC is just one soul-wrenching example). Your focus on attacking a man I suspect that you have never spoken with, let alone met, does nothing to further the cause of justice in this case.

    So, for the record, what is your purpose here?

    What will you do to see that the people and institutions responsible for these crimes are brought to justice?

    Where do you stand, Stephanie?

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  14. says

    The idea of a number of children, or Native Americans of any age, being rubbed out and put in a mass grave by whites is not only unsurprising but has lots and lots of well documented precedence. But, for a particular instance to be demonstrated, it has to be …. demonstrated.

    I’ve used GPR a number of times. My work was in the early days, pioneering and all that, but I’ve kept up because I teach about it. You can’t see skeletons with GPR. Not that this claim is being made …. they claim to have detected fill, which is possible. But let’s just keep that clear.

  15. says

    Andrew, read the other comments here. My purpose is to make sure this gets treated seriously and factually, without anyone throwing up sensationalism or making it all about some white guy instead of about the children in those schools. It won’t happen when a ritual abuse and murder flag is being waved around unless there’s solid proof. It will happen if people talk about it around others who are likely to care.

    Some of those kids were probably very distantly related to me, which makes this personal. They were abused by people on a “mission from God” and who thought they were less than human because they weren’t the chosen people. That puts this story squarely within the purview of this blog.

    Now, kindly stop equating questioning Annett with questioning the Canadian genocide. Or go the fuck away. Either one works.

  16. Danick Metaluna says

    Hey there all of you here,
    first I do agree with you Stephanie on the fact that K. Annett may only be searching for sensationalism & by making this entire horrid story His discovery he just steal the words from the ones actually involved & who still suffer from such wickedness. If he really is this conspiracy nut & have no reliability, many will just don’t take it here in Europe, where we don’t have all the details & only a faint idea of this genocide, as if it had stopped hundred years ago… Which makes me think he might even be a double agent sent by the higher ups (like the Pope or the Queen or both) to make that entire story look impossible from an outside perspective. People don’t want to believe such horrid satanic abuses on children & just people can even exist, but the facts seems to point out that they’re feeding entire well oiled rings worldwide: Apparently so, there was a witness to the Queen’s kidnapping of those 10 disappearing native kids, & he was obviously shut up when he died unexpectedly after releasing his testimony & just before serving as a witness in court !… Searches have been made by countless people here in Europe but also in America about the ritual satanic abuses & killings, notably linked to mind control technics, pedophile rings & pornography involving many higher ups, here in France (High ups in pedo orgies in Toulouse), but also Belgium (Dutroux’s affair), Holland (High ups linked to Dutroux’s pedo ring), the States(Please read: “Transe formation of America” by Cathy O’Brian or “Thanks for the memories” by Bryce Taylor, both presidential sex slaves from a-very-early age)& now we discover Canada(Dick Cheney in the Vancouver club, already exposed by its pedo practices & now the Queen)… None of the attempts by genuine police detectives or judges ever got far, or enough attention because no medias ever reached us to get conclusive evidences, they’ve all been hushed up, ridiculed or covered up & justice never been pursued so far, certain judges even going as far as giving back the abused children to the accused abuser!… What does it tells you about how many judges, lawyers, mayors, ministers, presidents & nobility… being involved in these disgusting practices ? Conspiracists were the first to talk about the 911 inside job & now many more people do want a real inquiry, maybe they’re not so wrong when they’re talking about the satanic practices of our leaders & maybe we do need a real inquiry.
    Now the fact is: Whomever found these graves got to get the word out in a way that can reach major medias all over the world, & if we can at least share to the world the discoveries of the first real evidence of a mass killing of children, I say we gotta do it. & even if that guy is the first to talk about it, all the victims & their families can also share & add to those evidences. This guy Annett sure gotta be checked for what he really is, whether a genuine good guy, shocked by what he uncovered or a disinfo agent, either way: Now not only the words, but also the pics & the evidences are out. Let’s collect all the evidences & testimonies we can get, make the links when they need to & make it worldwide, the web can help us for that.

  17. says

    Hello Stephanie,

    Thanks for stating your purpose, appreciated. I agree, this is not about Kevin, so why do you keep focusing on him? Why not simply question the claims that you have trouble with, and then recognize that he has done more to expose these crimes than anyone else. We all wish that more people of good heart and intent would work toward justice. So far, few have presented themselves. The Mohawks INVITED Kevin because no-one else is doing anything. And finally, it is up to the accused to defend themselves against the claims – not your job.

    Your claim that your article “questions” Annett is a bit of a stretch. After all, you have admitted that you dismissed the evidence presented in “Hidden No Longer” prior to review. Hardly a hallmark of intellectual or scientific integrity, n’est-ce pas?

    So, to repeat, what will you do to see that the people and institutions responsible for these crimes are brought to justice?

    This is a very difficult and sensitive topic, so can we agree to work on getting justice, stick to the issues, and avoid the vulgarity of personal attacks?

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  18. says

    No, Andrew, I didn’t “dismiss” anything. I said, as you can note in comment #2, that I would “recommend the historian’s book over the self-published one.” Having gone further into Annett’s book, that recommendation still stands. Milloy’s is much better. It covers the same allegations in a much better-documented fashion, and it treats the abuses for what they are–exactly what one expects under the situation. They are a normal evil that will occur whenever people are given that much power over others, not some weird thing that can only happen when monsters are in charge.

    As for what I’m doing about the situation, I’m doing what I’m best equipped to do, sorting fact from probable fiction. I’ve already heard from skeptics who thought this smelled fishy but hadn’t found time to research the situation. One of them thanked me for checking it out. She was, for the record, already aware of the genocide. That part hasn’t been in doubt from the start.

    What do you think I should be doing, Andrew? I already asked how Annett’s actions were going to help with prosecutions, but you didn’t answer. What do you think needs to be done to attain further justice, and what are you doing besides running around defending Annett?

  19. Pete Dako says

    Stephanie, you must be severely out of touch and have actually had little or no connections to any first nations people. If you had you would not deny the truth of what obviously happened. Just watch the footage:
    http://www.topdocumentaryfilms.com/unrepentant-kevin-annett-canadas-genocide/
    Listen to the personal stories, and you will know, these people are telling the truth.
    Particularly disturbing to me, why on earth are you shooting the messenger? By attacking Kevin Annett, you’re just doing the work for the churches, the government agents and the RCMP who would prefer to cover this story up. What exactly is your problem with Mr. Annett? He’s been brave and selfless and caring and makes me very proud to be a Canadian. I wish we had more like him!

  20. Russ Letica says

    These attacks are simulated to create this propaganda imaginary to smear his name, every time he is involved in holding his own bloodline responsible to their crimes against humanity.

    There’s 1000′s of them for everyone you respond too. Most of this crap comes from poverty thinking, that one is making money off bringing Justice forward and most of them live in the US. This is a First Nations Issue and I for one allow Kevin to speak for me. Especially when it is on the topic of our Children, relatives.

    I been trying to teach them for years. I found many come around and see the truth eventually. If they don’t I won’t allow their education dictate to my intelligence on this matter.

    We don’t leave our Children behind in any Tradition, this is all long over due. Get your Nations to do the same for your stolen children. It’s the least you could do.

  21. says

    Hello Stephanie,

    It’s not for me to tell you what to do to help. Only you know your situation.

    As for Kevin’s actions, time will tell how successful he has been. The genocide continues today, and any increased awareness of that fact must help. That said, I see little to encourage me that more than a handful of people have any regard other than for themselves – and certainly indigenous people seem to have the least respect of all.

    What needs to be done to attain further justice? How about having the accused parties stand trial and face the charges against them?

    Thank you, and good night.

    Andrew

  22. says

    Russ, nothing simulated here. I found an article that pinged my skeptic senses, didn’t want to dismiss it out of hand, and started digging. Then I reported what I had found, with links and all so people could look for themselves.

  23. 24fps says

    I know people who were in residential schools in western Canada. I have to agree with Stephanie, there is evil enough in what happened to generations of these people that we don’t need to make anything up. To do so is to insult and minimize the experiences of the survivors.

    I seriously doubt the veracity of what Annett is claiming vis ritual abuse and murder. I don’t even want to get into the far-fetched claim that the Queen herself was in on it. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

  24. says

    Oh, your last question.
    I work with a number of groups to disseminate information about a host of injustices committed by the crown and vatican. Do you want details?

    A

  25. says

    Andrew, just two more things I’m curious about: Do you require that there be any kind of proof for those injustices before you put out press releases about them? Do you put your name in them more than you mention the people who were actually wronged?

  26. Russ Letica says

    There is a complete history here that has been hidden. A genocide of First Nation People. Where their children where stolen, raped and murdered because of the color of their skin. Picking a few links out and setting a tone to discredit is simulated, in your perception.

    There is 20 years of heart breaking evidence collected and 100′s of testimonials taken from these survivors. To play with their truth, you have no right.

    80% of the survivors had no part of the circus of Canada’s TRC. You ever wonder way? Because that hides the truth even more.

    The truth is coming out not matter what you choose to believe. Once we start removing our children from the prison the Vatican and these govt’s disposed of them into after they were done, will be exposed.

    I can hardly wait for you to write your perception about that truth.

    Russ Letica
    Madawaska Maliseet First Nation

  27. CanadianSteve says

    What people say when they have no evidence to back them up, and want to be vague enough to not be called on it later…
    “what obviously happened.” Courtesy of Pete Dako

    further, Pete asks:
    “why on earth are you shooting the messenger?”

    You really should read Stephanie’s article. It’s about how Kevin Annett is making extraordinary claims on very weak evidence. There is no point at which she denies abuse and killing of aboriginal children, just the more extraordinary claims made by Mr Annett. For example – the murder of 10 aboriginal children in Kamloops by by Q. Elizabeth in 1964. A quick search of Elizabeth’s 1964 visit indicated she didn’t go to Kamloops in 1964. It takes quite a conspiracy theory just to place her there, let alone murdering children.

    “you’re just doing the work for the churches, the government agents and the RCMP who would prefer to cover this story up”

    ah yes… the conspiracy theory again….
    evidence that fits the extraordinary claims please.

    @Andrew:
    Your remarks remind me of an election smear campaign – make somthing up and try to make it stick. You keep claiming Stephanie has said things she has not. Furhter you resort to such pathetic pleas as “Where to you stand” as if it there was a choice between supporting Arnett or denying the horrors of residential schools.

    There is a very good reason to be questioning Annett – he is claiming to represent people who may be unaware of his motives, and he may be misrepresenting reality in a way that could harm those same people.
    Imagine for a second that in his amateur dig they do find evidence for some of the more extraordinary claims – but it becomes tainted or lost because of poor forensic techniques. Who suffers? Not Kevin Arnett – he gets his story either way. Instead the families of those victims lose.
    If he is successful in bringing this before the international court he will lose – and forever make it seem like this is the domain of conspiracy theorists instead of a real historical genocide.

  28. says

    Stephanie, you’re denying everything – both history and life as it unfolds around you – simply by not watching or reading the material. How can we discuss anything? You insult all of us…. particularly fellow atheists! How can you even call yourself that when you dumbly side with religious discrimination and religious privilege over basic human rights? I might as well be at Focus On The Family, or LifeSite ChristianDominon.com for all the sense you’re making! When you call yourself a “skeptic” do you actually mean “truther” because that’s the paranoid vibe you project here. … also to the commenter about Queen Elizabeth, do you suggest that Sir John A. MacDonald wasn’t responsible for killing Louis Riel because he didn’t have his own hands on the noose? Don’t you kids get history books down there in your US schools?
    The proof of the genocide is right there in the textbook photos of severely sick children infected with smallpox forced into close quarters with healthy ones. The testimony of the survivors and dignity that remains speaks to the best and most noble quality in humanity. I don’t know how you could hear them and not feel the same way. I was particularly moved by the man who felt sad for the snakes the nuns and priest would throw into their bathtubs, the snakes who are cold-blooded would be sent into shock from the hot water and congregate quickly onto the children to try and escape…
    Seeing the movie, http://www.topdocumentaryfilms.com/unrepentant-kevin-annett-canadas-genocide/ really hit another familiar note when Kevin mentions the ‘apartheid’ a silent wall of non-communication between the first nations folks and regular citizens. That’s another thing you really can’t deny unless you just never experienced it. When I first encountered it for the first time as a kid, getting away from the city it was a total mystery that has taken a long time to begin to understand. Hearing these stories is a really good first step. I don’t know if you Stephanie and any other ‘doubters’ and ‘denyers’ can find some native people to talk to and listen to their stories, wherever you live. I’m in Toronto only a few hours from the Brantford school and was shocked to learn this school set up in the 1830s was still running and doing business while I was a kid in school, and even longer. That was still nothing like the shock of meeting a canadian poet, in person who told me how he had been taken from his parents at three years old and the very first thing he could ever remember there at the residential school was having the priests’ penis in his mouth. These horror stories are no fantasy, and they didn’t happen in some far off century. They were happening right in our neighbourhood and all around us!
    Anyway good luck to you. I really hope you start reading and watching soon — who knows… if you ask around it really shouldn’t be too hard, you will probably find some real people you’re not too ‘skeptical’ about, to bring with you to your podcast, to help get the word out.

  29. says

    “Canadian” Steve – where are you from? The RCMP? I guess you didn’t watch the film either, huh? Too busy writing brilliant comments.

  30. CanadianSteve says

    Pete
    I don’t know where you’re getting this stuff, Stephanie has said none of the things you accuse her of. Try and find a quote.

    As for Q. Elizabeth – KA’s witness account made the explicit claim that she was actually present for this event, not just responsible for it.

  31. says

    Hello CanadianSteve,

    Are you implying that the nine Mohawk elders and Mothers are incapable of managing their own affairs? Do you not think that they weighed the risks, and maybe lost a bit of sleep in the process?

    What is the basis of your claim “If he is successful in bringing this before the international court he will lose”? Is that a legal opinion?

    And as for lost and destroyed evidence, perhaps we should investigate the history of the various agencies, and the records that have been destroyed or withheld. (For the hard-of-thinking, if we had those documents, a dig would probably not be necessary.)

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  32. Pete says

    Of course I read your comments and article… sorry, but these details are just sophomoric.
    There are no extraordinary claims here, just simple truths.
    You write: “If he (Annett) is successful in bringing this before the international court he will lose – and forever make it seem like this is the domain of conspiracy theorists instead of a real historical genocide.”
    Bringing this before an international court will be a victory… for ALL of us. It will finally mark the beginning of the END of the genocide (see previous comments).
    Why are you so intent on burying the story and demonizing Annett who has already had his family, his livelihood working in the church, and basically everything taken away from him for working on this? Are you guys implying he’s done all of us this and sacrificed everything for some kind of 15 minutes of fame?

  33. lordshipmayhem says

    One factor not a lot of the commentators pushing Arnett’s grand conspiracy theory are wont to point out, is the fact that a baby boy born in 1900 had an estimated life expectancy of only 33 years or so – and that this statistic is considered an improvement over the preceding decades. That’s despite the widespread use of all-natural alternative medicine, so popular these days with the anti-science sort.

    In other words, a heck of a lot of children didn’t survive childhood. That’s why Victorian families had large numbers of offspring. You needed to guarantee at least two of your kids survived to reproduce.

    So, if a lot of kids die before ever reaching puberty, and you have a school with a large number of kids that has been active through a 70-year stretch of time noted for high childhood mortality, wouldn’t you expect to find large burial grounds filled with the remains of large numbers of children?

  34. says

    lordshipmayhem, no, actually. It’s well established that the rates of death were much higher in these schools than out of them. Also, anywhere else, you would expect children to be returned to their parents for burial.

  35. says

    These deaths are serious issues and should be taken seriously, like Stephanie is doing. They should not be used to leverage this cult of personality that has evidently formed around Arnett.

    Seriously, wow. I’ve started reading Hidden No Longer and it has every indication of being about conspiracy theory rather than facts. Every witness is considered hostile, every official corrupt. Only Arnett has the truth, evidently. And that truth is presented with circumstantial evidence where real evidence actually exists.

    Why is this about Arnett at all, people? Why can’t the evidence speak for itself?

  36. arakasi says

    Generally, when I find that someone makes errors on the stuff that is easy to verify e.g. Elizabeth II’s full name is NOT Elizabeth Windsor – she has no last name; then it calls into question the rest of their statements. Whatever the truth is here, we aren’t going to find through Annett & the ITCCS

  37. says

    Thanks for that link, Jason.

    A couple of points – Phil does not state that the perpetrators should be prosecuted, rather his stated goals are awareness and healing for his people. Nothing about healing for the perps, who are the really damaged ones.

    As for the first whistleblower, I believe that attribution belongs to Dr. Peter H. Bryce in his book “A National Crime”, published in 1922: http://hiddennolonger.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Appendix-3.pdf
    Dr. Bryce was “blowing the whistle” as early as 1907. He was fired and lost his pension as a result.

    Just to be clear to the author of this post and commentators who laugh at the conspiracy aspect of this tragedy: genocide IS a conspiracy, by definition.

    So, Stephanie, by correctly seeing the actions by church and state as genocide, you are agreeing fully that there is a conspiracy: to exterminate indigenous people, and take their land and resources. That is the purpose of genocide.

    Let us all join together and bring the perpetrators of genocide – past and present – to trial.

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  38. Russ Letica says

    To all you who doubt it. Pick a piece that isnt correct and prove it wrong. becasue this back and forth I feel, you feel is not in no way respectful for eh Children who the Vatican and these Govts Murdered.

    Go play games with someone elses children. Learn the meaning of the Two Row Wampum and finally honor something for a change.

    It is ones resposibility to learn this once they are aware of it or walk away like your ancestry has done, not the responsibilty to prove anything to any nay sayers.

    As you sit here writing statements that amount to nothing. Kevin Annett is with the Mohawk Nation getting ready to prove what he has stated, What all Native Nations have stated, over 1,100 of them.

    The Mohawk Women gave a Mandate to brig their children home, and as it should be the Men are obeying the Clans Mothers. Its easy to be outside of our Culture and make projections of a colonized mind set. No wonder it makes no sense to you. It doesnt effect you.

  39. says

    Russ Letica: could you please, PLEASE, point to someone who has “doubted” any part of the actual genocide carried out against First Nations? We are aware that the Church, in their religious fervour, did horrible things and were not held to account. You’ll find no love of Catholicism in these quarters, believe me.

    And I just reread the original post. The doubt is entirely about the supposed ritualistic murder of ten children by Queen Elizabeth, and the verity of any information obtained by Kevin Annett’s “psychic” (since all so-called psychics are parasitic charlatans), and the evidence that Annett has in the past potentially manipulated First Nations tribes for his own gain. This is straight-up reporting. The skepticism is about the parts of the story that turn an already horrific sequence of events into some sort of vast, ongoing conspiracy.

    It’s exactly like how 9/11 was a horrible, tragic event that resulted in a lot of lost lives, but the fact that it was carried out in the name of religion *wasn’t enough*, so conspiracy theorists added this whole extra layer of nonsense on top. Conspiracy theorists turning horrific events to their own advantage are ghoulish and evil in their own right.

    Either point to one of the things that we have actually expressed doubt about, and why we shouldn’t doubt those things, or please stop going on about how we’re doubting things here. The lack of nuance you express by calling us doubters as a blanket statement does damage to your cause.

  40. says

    @51: to clarify, the Phil Fontaine interview is the first instance of whistleblowing regarding that specific residential school, isn’t it? I was under that impression, and would welcome the correction. Otherwise, I agree with every sentiment expressed. A genocide is quite often a conspiracy against an entire peoples, and in this case, it rises to one already.

    But when seeking the truth, one must be careful not to accept just anyone’s claims, and certainly not psychics and people who have a vested interest in lying to you. Are the crimes not criminal enough when the truth is exposed?

    I’d strongly recommend anyone looking for truth in the matter start with the Truth and Reconciliation Commission.

  41. Russ Letica says

    My Cause? You call this my Cause. This is atrocities that have never been brought to Justice. Im not trying to prove anything here. I don’t need to hear what others think or what they feel is true or not. Know why, because my family/relatives lived it. Did your’s?

    You have no right to cause division because you believe one way and others believe another way. That to me is the conspiracy tactics I keep hearing you explain to us about. Yet you yourself only pulled a few links together, as you stated earlier, and concluded all this as the truth. Which in fact it is your truth and that is how a conspiracy theory starts.

    It’s not just with Kevin’s work. Its with all work that involves justice to Natives. We don’t give names because we end up dead! Our Women are still stolen without investigations and there is more Native Children in state care today then the entire 110 years of this Child Torture/Rape Prisons.

    Why not go after that, and revel the Gov’ts conspiracy theories? Show us where Kevin Profited? Show us where you can prove what Kevin said is make believe, because right now you sure demand a lot of attention to what you think in the same methods you excuse others of doing.

    Now if you have actually prove that all this is a lie, then please show it to us. Other wise stop projecting your actions to other people’s motives.

  42. Russ Letica says

    the TRC is designed to pay off people living in a produce poverty without Justice.

    Only 20% went thru the TRC, 80% wants Justice and we wont stop till we get it. The Govt used taxpayers money to pay off their crimes. Write about that.

    Our Treaties that are not honored was never to come from taxpayers money, there wasn’t even taxes at the time they were signed.

    The Liars and Conspiracy Theorist are in the Govt’s and their religions.

    They even use to treat the Native Children who told on their relatives with preferential treatment. So say that was the 20% who actually did go thru the TRC. This division is created to destroy, Natives see right thru this bullshit everytime. Enjoy your game, hope you get off.

  43. Russ Letica says

    Our National Leaders have been selling us out for decades. We dont place them in Leadership positions and they DO NOT Speak for us as Nations. They speak as an employee to the Govt. Because that is what they are.

  44. says

    Russ and Andrew, thanks kindly to you our brothers for sharing your comments and time with us. I really hope for the best, for all us… and I want to thank you personally and Mr. Annett,too if you can please do so on my behalf, and everybody else who will support the efforts of the Tribunal.

    For those who are interested, the poet I mentioned above who shared his stories with me about the residential schools is Michael J. Paul Martin. author of “She Said Sometimes I Hear Things” available from 7th Generation Books. I met him in 2005 playing a gig with another poet, my collaborator the wonderful bill bissett, and I will never forget the words he spoke.

    Aside from the issues discussed above, Stephanie I’d like you to know that Canada is still funding religious discrimination on SO many fronts. Here in Toronto, Ontario my province… is one of the last of three still taking taxpayer money to fund catholic schools… and our government is still keenly and routinely funnelling money into dubious ‘religious’ areas like: http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorials/article/1065996–what-can-5-million-do-for-religious-freedom
    Unfortunately we often see items like the above, or prayers in school and all manner of things excused on account of “FREEDOM OF religion” but we can enjoy never “FREEDOM FROM religion” — we don’t have the benefit of organizations like FFRF.org here to help fight these battles for us, and for a secularist like myself, the lines between church and state here in this country are often far too blurry for my liking.

    I invite you to check out my blog (link above) or google for more information.

  45. CanadianSteve says

    Andrew Said: “Just to be clear to the author of this post and commentators who laugh at the conspiracy aspect of this tragedy: genocide IS a conspiracy, by definition.”
    Umm, no it isn’t. To verify I checked the internation convention on genocide. Conspiracy is not part of the definition of genocide. On the other hand the actual definition does fit what was done to the first nations of NA: Here is a quote of Article 2:

    In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
    (a) Killing members of the group;
    (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
    (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
    (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
    (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

    I note that conspiracy to commit genocide is separate from genocide itself.

    @Russ who said in #52:
    “To all you who doubt it. Pick a piece that isnt correct and prove it wrong. ”
    How about the part about QEII that we have repeated several times?
    I’m also very curious if there is any truth to KA’s claim that Canada brought Nazi doctors to Canada post WWII to conduct medical experiments on Aboriginal peoples. Seems unlikely, though I freely admit I haven’t got any evidence either way at the momment.
    Russ also said in #57
    “Our National Leaders have been selling us out for decades. ”
    This is apparent even to a non-aboriginal like myself…. I would love to see a way to put control back to the people in the aboriginal communities.

    Anyway my favourite comment so far is this one from Pete in #44:

    “these details are just sophomoric.
    There are no extraordinary claims here, just simple truths.”

    ie. reality doesn’t matter – it’s all about the “Truth” – reminds me of Ed Brayton’s post about religious wingnuts saying just that.

    Oh, and if this ever gets to a court, what do you think they will look at? Oh yeah – details of evidence…. hmmm, looks like the details aren’t just “sophomoric” That’s why I can be so confident that KA’s claims are going nowhere in court.

  46. Russ Letica says

    I myself have heard the testimony of such medical experiments from survivors of our nations. The language was later determined to be German. Same doctors? I don’t know, same method of violence I do know.

    But now you mentioned the German’s, I have to say Hitler himself states in his autobiography states he got his idea to exterminate the Jews from the Indian Policy and how well it worked in the genocide of Turtle Island.

    It wasn’t only the Doctors they took, they took the real masterminds behind what could make a society become a savage in their thinking that mass murder was not the atrocity is actually is. If they didn’t take them the Russians would of.

    Why did the US wait 3+ years before ending that Holocaust? Because the Vatican Backed it!

    The way way to see a change in Native Communities is to honor the First Treaty, The Two Row Wampum. We are Nations with Sovereignty, yet under oppression of 500+ yrs, we are still listed as Wards to the State.

    50% of all resource profits of this land is ours, get your govts to pay it. The Govt tell us who are descendants are with their Status/Holocaust Cards they issues and only pay pennies on the dollar to those they approve. Instead of us, a human being, telling them who we produce.

    Not sure what the QEII is, I haven’t read all the post. Only the ones that reply back to me. See I don’t need to hear a projected thought on what I already know to be the truth of what actually happened and how no Justice was ever served. These rapist still walk the streets free today, worldwide.

    All of this is being done under an old British Colonial Law that is still on the books today. Which states when the system fails to bring about justice, it is the duty of the people to form people courts and bring about that Justice. It is that law the Tribunals are being held under.

    I have heard from the Mohawk Nation, The Clans Mothers, the Elders and Kevin A. on the current excavation of the mass grave on Mohawk Lands. This is actually being done by the Nation with Kevin being there as an invited guest to watch over the proceedings.

    Are we to project now that the Mohawk Nation has no right to Bring their Children Home?

    Ranting on a Man who works to expose the atrocities is not in the best interest to the truth of child rape, torture and genocide. A genocide that continues to happen today, with more modern methods.

    Maliseet First Nation, Holocaust Descendant.

  47. Russ Letica says

    Woliwon Pete. There’s an international network working the issue of Crimes of Church and State. In Ireland the ACCI is out in front of their churches daily.

    As Warriors we protect the Elders, Women and Children. We keep the wasicu at a distance. This type of writing is one of those reason. They believe their education over rules our intelligence.

    It’s why the worked is in the condition it is today. But that will soon be changing, because it’s coming and the Natives are preparing for a change not all of us will survive. But we will still be here, because we are our ancestry. Its the reason why we must bring our children home, they are us. Once released from the prison they were thrown into when finished with, they will walk in peace with us once again.

  48. says

    I want you, Russ, Pete and Andrew, to understand something: I truly hope you and your people get the justice you deserve.

    That we disagree that one particular white man who claims to be a reverend is or is not manipulating you for some reason, is completely separate from what we want. I want the truth to come out, whatever truth it might be. Considering the evidence presented in the original post, I don’t know if Kevin Annett is working in your best interests. I agree that your leaders are almost certainly not, and I wish you would find representation that better suits you.

    Please, though, don’t fall prey to more lies by more people who might want to abuse you further. Look critically at everyone who claims to be your friend. Not just us here at FtB — everyone.

  49. says

    Pete:

    we don’t have the benefit of organizations like FFRF.org here to help fight these battles for us, and for a secularist like myself, the lines between church and state here in this country are often far too blurry for my liking.

    No, but there are organizations here like CFI Canada, and two of us at FtB are Canadians (myself and Crommunist), and we are atheists who believe strongly in separation of church and state. We share the same goals in that respect. To protect everyone’s right to worship freely, government must have absolutely nothing to do with religion lest religious privilege seep into the system. We have already seen what kind of damage it can wreak, by the Catholic boarding schools on your people.

  50. Stacy Kennedy says

    Not sure what the QEII is

    QEII is Queen Elizabeth II. The International Tribunal and Kevin Annett claim that she personally murdered children in 1964.

    It’s there in the original post, where she is referred to, incorrectly, as “Elizabeth Windsor”.

    What Stephanie is objecting to are false claims being made by a conman.

    Nobody here is doubting that genocide occurred or saying that it should not be investigated.

    In order for justice to occur, it is important to get the facts straight.

  51. Russ Letica says

    Jason, Woliwon for your concern and your compassion in wanting to see this brought to Justice too and for your concern, Honestly.

    But Kevin Annett is a defrock Minster (records prove it) and was defrock when he reached out to the Natives in his area to bring them into the church. It was the natives who told him why they dont go. It was them who brought this information to him. He didn’t come looking for it, we told him about it. He was asked to carry their message, he didnt take it from them.

    See thats what people dont know. Because gossip and rants and smear campaigns for who knows what motive are spread.

    No one is doing anything with our children without our Tribal Councils involved. There is no money to be made here, only Justice to be served so healing can begin naturally, free. Taxpayers don’t have to pay off their crimes. They have to pay for their crimes.

    I am a status bloodline descendant to my Nation, I am one voice who backs him. We are not governed under the practice of one speaks for us. We speak as individuals and the majority rules. The Mohawk are showing that understanding today.

    I know Kevin has a lot of people for as many reasons who are against him. That is not my concern, the message he was given to carry for our Nations is. That is what matters, not what others think of him. Kevin lives below poverty. If one wanted to discredit Kevin, I would think that one fact would stop a lot of rumors that always a rise when we begin speaking of bring our children home.

    It not so far fetch form me to believe, maybe even govt sponsored. It not like they never projected this tactic before.

    Kevin was given his mission by the elders of Nations. That alone carries weight in Indian Country. It is that weight that personal motives become entangled in these crimes against humanity. Kevin’s personal message is not to accept any money for your truth. Justice is served before we think of civil actions. The TRC wants to go straight to the civil action where they will pay you off, in essence turning these children into prostitutes with accepting their payment of rape and abuse. The sickness continues and each side continues to discredit the next.

    There is something wrong in a society who doesn’t demand Justice as a majority, for over 500 years to date on this continent.

  52. Russ Letica says

    No He stated from eye witness that she went on a picnic with 10 children of the school and they were never seen again after they left with her. That is the testimoney I was privileged to see and hear from William Combs who was a prisoner of the school at that time.

  53. says

    Thanks Jason!
    I am already a donor & “friend” of CFI,Canada (who actually have a policy and mandate not to interfere in politics) and a very active member of Canadian Secular Alliance. I helped organize CSA’s rally at Queen’s Park in Toronto… but there are all kinds of constitutional issues and hurdles here we simply do not have the protection that our friends in the USA enjoy (although even with those laws in place, I realize organizations like ffrf and AA have their hands full protecting those rights).

  54. Yoritomo says

    Much of the really crazy conspiracy stuff seems to originate not with Annett’s “International Tribunal” (which I’d call delusional in other ways, including their self-perception), but with the God Discussion website cited by Stephanie. They seem to have taken Annett’s and the ITCCS’ statements, mixed them well, and made up all-new claims. That website says:

    [...] defendants Elizabeth Windsor, head of state of Canada and head of the Church of England and Pope Joseph Ratzinger, both of whom knowingly participated in the planning and coverup of the child genocide, according to forensic evidence.

    Suddenly eye-witness testimony becomes forensic evidence. How Ratzinger (who in 1970 was still a theology professor, not even a bishop) is supposed to have participated in the planning of the child genocide is anybody’s guess. The genocide is bad enough; these conspiracy theories will not be helpful.

  55. says

    Do you want to know how Elizabeth and the pope are responcible? Because they have knowingly covered it up which makes them accessories to the crimes. The papal bulls that have been on the books since explorers were sent out to find new lands for the European countries they represented authorized by the Catholic church the murder and inahilation of any indigenous people found in these lands who refused to be converted to christianity because not to do so made them less than human in the eyes of the church and therefore expendable. Through all the popes we have had in the following centuries ,not one of those holier than thou hypocrites ever removed such blatant genocidal approved actions from the books. Their bible says , “thou shalt not kill” Yet each and every pope and all the clergy under the umbrella of the church has violated their own commandments and committed mass murder and been hidden and protected from prosecution for it. As for Elizabeth, she is the head of the church of England which the United and Anglican churches of Canada fall under. She and the queens before her have also condoned the genocidal activities of these churches by not doing anything to stop it. And why would she or the pope because by allowing these attrocities to continue, they eliminate a vast number of indigenous people and gain access to all our land and minerals. And by the way, which ever one of you commented that Elizabeth doesn’t have a last name is wrong. She does but it is not used and yes Windsor is it. Do some more research . I learned this years ago as a young woman and why do you think they are refered to as “the house of windsor”. As for bashing Kevin for a fraud, for monetary gain and for putting himself on a pedistal by talking about himself in the first half of his books, did it ever occur to any of you bashers that if someone has not seen his documentary Unrepentent and only read one out of the 3 books he has written, they have no idea as to how he came to find out about the Residential school crimes so background for new readers needed to be in place. And exploiting Native people’s pain for monitery gain? Well let’s see, he was defrocked for repeatedly welcoming the local native people into his church to tell their stories of abuse at the hands of the very board members that defrocked Kevin for refusing to bury the truth like they did, the church bribed and paid his wife to divorce him and take his children away. He tried to continue his education and was black balled from the University and all manner of employment throughout B.C. which left him pretty well homeless for years, he has been severly beaten up 3 times by most likely government thugs trying to silence him. He spent his time with the native street people trying to councel and help them and stand with them as best as he could under his non financial success and depended on donations only. He has never charged a fee for any of his lectures, I know as I have attended a few. I am a state carded Native American of Muskogee Creek descent and stand behind all he has tried to do to bring justice to our murdered children and the survivors. Not only did the church do these things in north America but they did it in church run orphanages in Ireland too as I have spoken to survivors there also. Same crimes, different country and still unpunished.So all of you who claim to have known about the genocide, that it is nothing new, why have you not tried to do anything about it? Your government and law enforcement allowed it. Why has it been left to one man to expose to the world at the cost of 20 years of his life all these things you claim is common knowledge to many? I wrote many letters to the United Church of Canada , questioning them on many of the issues Kevin uncovered. They wrote back with vague answers not fully answering my questions and finally I backed them into a corner, they couldn’t explain or excuse themselves out of and they quit answering me. Gee I wonder why. And you have the nerve to bash and question Kevin’s motives which are pure and simple. Exposing the truth of what happened to our people, giving them a voice to tell their horrific stories and the courage and emotional support to do so. He is not speaking for us, he is providing a means for us to tell the world ourselves.And I as well as Russ Letica and so many other Native people support and applaud his efforts.Those of you who decry his efforts , call him and the tribunal frauds and a crock of crap do so because you don’t want to accept the fact that your ancestors and maybe still living relatives may be guilty of these crimes. How does it feel to know you might have a pedophile murdering relative in your recent ancestry? it wasn’t only clergy who did this but lay people too who worked for the churches.

  56. CanadianChick says

    it’s hard to know where to start…

    Once again, Queen Elizabeth was not in BC, let alone Kamloops, in 1964, so the supposed “eye witness” is wrong.

    Neither the Queen nor the Church of England have any control over the United Church of Canada. It is true that in the 70s there was talk of a merger between the Anglican Church of Canada and the United Church, but all that ever came of that was a shared hymnbook.

    The current Pope, while he is likely culpable in other abuses, wasn’t even part of the hierarchy at the time this happened.

    Psychics, to paraphrase Tim Minchin are either con-artists or mentally ill. So are many of the people who believe in them or follow their advice.

    NO ONE is denying that horrible things happened at the residential schools, but if the claimants can’t get basic facts straight, why trust the more outlandish claims. It’s all horrible enough without slandering the queen…

  57. says

    To Canadian chick, yes she was in canada in 1964 and here is the proof.”But her 1964 trip to the provincial capital is the one that stirred the biggest controversy. Mass demonstrations were organized and hundreds of protesters were arrested during that visit.

    Queen Elizabeth has chosen not to attend the 400th festivities, as she apparently was not invited by the federal government who may have feared an uproar in Quebec.” Since she was in canada for 8 days, who knows where else she may have visited while there?

    http://www.canada.com/topics/news/national/news/story.html?id=0ed97355-5422-43f4-b242-b88dd212f6a0
    As the official monarch of canada and the church of england of which the anglican and united church are a susidary of, she technically is the controlling head and could have put a stop to the church policies in the residential schools if she chose to which she didn’t , therefore she was as well as the pope who is the official head of all catholic churches in the world accessories to the crimes they both knew full well about. She was also in B.C. in 1959
    http://www.theroyalforums.com/8893-fiftieth-anniversary-of-queen-elizabeth-iis-trip-to-canada/

    Who is to say her entire iteinerary was listed during her 1964 visit, here is more proof she was in canada that year
    http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2010/06/24/f-queen-elizabeth-timeline.html
    The present pope was not in office when the last school may have closed but he sure knows about the crimes and has swept them under the rug like all those before him and is not about to bring those to justice who actually committed them and are still living so he is an accessory to the crimes as is Elizabeth. If you are aware of crimes being committed under your jurisdiction and you do nothing but cover up the scandal then you are an accessory to the crime period!

  58. says

    CanadianSteve said: “Conspiracy is not part of the definition of genocide.”

    But genocide IS part of the definition of conspiracy. Here’s why:

    definition of conspiracy: An agreement between two or more persons to engage jointly in an unlawful or criminal act.

    So, unless a genocide is conducted by a single person, or is considered lawful or not a criminal act, then genocide is a conspiracy.

  59. says

    Hi Marcia —  thanks kindly for the great links about the Queen’s trip… “happy memories” indeed! :)
    It’s been very amusing to see the folks commenting here… hard to pick the biggest laughs — but where are these royalists coming from… defending the Queen? I say! Cheerio!…
    I won’t grace any more replies to pretentious and juvenile anonymous posters who prefer to pick at the details and derail the fabulous and noble work being achieved here… but I just wanted to say thanks for sharing. The world is watching… Carry on!

  60. Yoritomo says

    The Queen was in Canada in 1964. As one of marcialane’s sources points out, she was in Charlottetown, in Quebec and in Ottawa. That’s quite far away from Kamloops. She would have had to disappear for an entire day in order to arrange her murder-picnic, and I would like to see some better sources for that. I’m pretty sure one could reconstruct her visit from 1964 newspapers in great enough detail to rule out such a disappearance. (Besides, why would she do so? If she had the ability and desire to arrange a secret murder-picnic in Kamloops, couldn’t she have found children to murder without having to travel 2,000 miles in each direction?)

    On the website Stephanie linked to, “forensic evidence” was claimed to implicate both Elizabeth and Ratzinger in the planning of the genocide. Can we agree that’s a pure fabrication? Or what kind of forensic evidence is supposed to link either to the planning of the genocide?

    Both Elizabeth and Ratzinger are also claimed to have aided with the cover-up. Now Ratzinger has repeatedly demonstrated that the well-being of the Church is more important to him than justice or the well-being of innocents, so hushing up the genocide would surely be in character for him. What I don’t see is any indication that either of the two actually knew of these atrocities.
    The Anglican Church of Canada is in communion with the Church of England, and Elizabeth is (ex officio) the Supreme Governor of the Church of England, but I see no indication that she has any say whatsoever in matters of the Anglican Church of Canada, much less the United Church of Canada (which is not even part of the Anglican Communion).

  61. Russ Letica says

    Well Said Marcie. This is a pack of Wasicu who are only here for their vested interest.

    Were as we fight to bring our own ancestry home. Let them eat each other, we have work to do in preparing our Nations to bring our raped and murdered children home.

    This post disrespects that effort and those children thrown into a hole and buried by the Vatican and the Govt’s.

  62. Russ says

    LOL at slandering the Queen. I’ll spit in her face and the faces of all her descendants. That Muderering Bitch and her ancestry are the root of Evil the Vatican indoctrinate today with.

    That bloodline has Genocide more human beings then natural causes and disease together. The Windsor family has taken this shorter version of their original name, a name that attaches them to the ancestry of the Roman Empire.

    The same Roman Empire that surrendered to the Crown of England.

    Search Europe’s royalty, you will see a lot of them are descendants of the Roman Empire.

  63. says

    Thank you Pete Dako. I am glad someone recognizes the important work being accomplished in exposing and spreading far and wide the attrocities committed against so many people by the crown and the church. There are many things the people who have commented here do not know and therefore comment without all the facts. Governments are getting very nervous about the disclosure of these acts against humanity and doing all they can to derail, discredit, and protect themselves as they too were complicit in looking the other way while these crimes were going on, knowing full well what was taking place but turning a blind eye. AS the queen and Ratzinger too have done and know full well what has transpired over the past 140 years.It is all about damage control and protecting their sorry butts from criminal prosecution.

  64. Adamo says

    Wow!

    Really?

    Wow!

    Let’s see if I’ve got this straight. A whole lot of children’s graves exist, nobody denies there was a massive tragedy, possibly even attempted genocide, but a bunch of you argue that wishing someone more reputable than a nutcase self-promoter were taking it up as his cause is exactly the same thing as denying the tragedy of all those deaths?

    Really?

    Wow!

    A=B. C=D. Therefore A=D. Right.

  65. Vicki says

    The Queen is a symbol. She wasn’t making Canadian policy, even though her picture was and is on the currency. Lester Pearson, John Diefenbaker and his predecessors, and Pierre Trudeau may have known and approved what was going on. That’s worth investigating, even though all those men are dead now.

    Actual evidence that she committed murder would be relevant, of course–as would evidence of any other specific person being involved. But the queen’s ceremonial position doesn’t mean she knew what was going on, let alone that she was directly involved.

    This seems like a distraction from the important work to be done here, which includes finding and if possible prosecuting the actual criminals, the people with bloody hands and the people who organized the crimes. Time is finite, and distraction and delay benefit the guilty in their comfortable retirements.

  66. says

    …Which makes me think he might even be a double agent sent by the higher ups (like the Pope or the Queen or both) to make that entire story look impossible from an outside perspective…

    The Queen is a “higher up” in a global conspiracy to systematically hide the truth from the entire world? THE QUEEN? Are you fucking serious? You sound exactly like a LaRouchie, and the total lack of paragraphs doesn’t help your credibility.

    Oh, and Andrew? How the fuck can you pretend one guy is exposing a hidden truth, when teh atrocities against Native American children in white America and Canada have been known (if not widely acknowledged) practically from day one?

    Also, questioning the credibility of one source — when we see good reason to do so — does not mean we condone the atrocities. Stop trying to trump adult discourse with self-righteous emotion; we’ve all seen that before (every conspiracy buff does it), and you’re not fooling anyone.

  67. says

    What sort of “forensic evidence” can prove participation in planning and covering up a crime? The only way “forensic evidence” can point to the Queen or Pope, is if the Queen or Pope were on-scene and wielding weapons or shovels at the time.

    This story is bullshit. Not to mention a gross insult to the memory of real victims of real crimes. And you, Andrew, are participating in this insult; so get off your damn hobby-horse and stop pretending you’re the righteous one.

  68. says

    Hello Raging Bee,

    Thank you for your emotional and childish comments (last I checked, scientists do not use words like “fuck” or “bullshit” in their discourse).

    Here is a simple question that demands an answer: If Canada’s genocide (an extremely serious crime with far-reaching implications) is so well known, as you claim, then why has there yet to be a single charge laid?

    If the queen and pope didn’t know what was happening, and is still happening, they should have. That’s the job of a leader of any institution. And a good leader insists on justice.

    If calling for justice and an international inquiry into Canada’s genocide is being self-righteous, then so I am.

    Again, let us stop bickering, and find justice for the victims.

    Thank you,

    Andrew

  69. says

    If the queen and pope didn’t know what was happening, and is still happening, they should have.

    They probably should, but then, where’s your forensic evidence that they participated? The fact that they should have known? Because that’s not evidence, that’s speculation.

    We want the truth to come out, but imagining bigger crimes to lay on top of the existing crimes just delegitimizes the existing crimes.

  70. says

    If Canada’s genocide (an extremely serious crime with far-reaching implications) is so well known, as you claim, then why has there yet to be a single charge laid?

    Because not enough people in power wanted to pursue it. That doesn’t prove a coverup; it just proves apathy, bigotry, and institutional inertia.

    Again, let us stop bickering, and find justice for the victims.

    You flog a story that has no credibility and insults our intelligence, and you accuse us of “bickering” when we question the factual assertions it makes? Either explain to us how flogging a bogus story achieves “justice,” or shut the fuck up and go away. Your pompous lecturing tone isn’t fooling anyone.

  71. says

    …last I checked, scientists do not use words like “fuck” or “bullshit” in their discourse.

    Last I checked, scientists — and prosecutors, attorneys, judges and investigators — do not automatically believe dodgy conspiracy stories without question.

  72. says

    Because not enough people in power wanted to pursue it. That doesn’t prove a coverup; it just proves apathy, bigotry, and institutional inertia.

    What it shows is dereliction of duty. Oh wait, that’s the class that benefits from genocide.

    Why not have the queen and pope face the charges against them? What makes you think that evidence against them does not exist?

    To those of you intent on protecting the criminal class responsible for these crimes: good luck to you.

    As you prefer to resort to personal attacks and glaring mis-interpretations of fact and law, I will now take my leave.

    Thank you and good-bye,

    Andrew

  73. Russ Letica says

    Jason is as ridiculous as his own narrcisstic comments. I bet he even has all the answers to world peace.

  74. stewart says

    Bye, you won’t be missed. In the meantime, let’s work on actual wrongs, and make a better world.

  75. Brandee says

    Hello, this is to the person who wants to dig up children’s bones. Who do you think you are? I see you are concerned with the North American Holocaust issue over the past 520 years, and the genocide; although, digging up children’s bones is not going to solve anything. Maybe you should try to research what the original intent of this genocide was and make that public. If you cared maybe you should lobby money for “these people” for language revitalization since that was apart of the colonization process, also organizing social movements that show restitution to the survivors of the genocide. I’ll say it again because this is very disturbing reading this, DIGGING UP CHILDREN’S BONES is not going to solve anything. I found this while I was researching the school my mother attended I am aboriginal and I do not appreciate people wanting to dig up my ancestors bones. Also she attended Mohawk Institute. God Bless the Quenn?

  76. Radiator says

    I see Kevin Annett & his theories have been getting a lot of attention on the net since Herr Rattzinger resigned.
    I think blogs like this should be required reading for those ready to jump onto any bandwagon laying into the catholic church- there’s more than enough for the godheads to answer for without discrediting it all by attaching wild speculations & fantasies.

  77. says

    There are many being paid to character assasinate Kevin annett and I am sure Heather Martin is one of them-she put me on her website as being a pedophile until I told her to give me her address so she could be sued for slander and she promply deleted everythin. IF you are a rich pedophile and together this massive ring has assets in the billions of dollars would you want to be exposed. How much easier to pay people to discredit and slander someone who has risked his entire life to tell the truth!

  78. says

    Canad and U.K. have BIG skeletons in their closets. Andrew: every single time someone goes on the Web and blogs for the truth they are mercilessly and viciously attacked just like Kevin Annett has been. You are the Voice of Reason, hence the attack by vicious, uncaring, small minded cretins who think it is just fine that so many native kids were tortured to death…just fine as long as it is not their own kids…this attitude is not only inexcusable it is montrous. It smacks of extreme racism which is why this all happened in the first place. If Canada is not an extremely racist society than WHY is THIS happening? DUH!

  79. says

    This is a Zahn hit piece and I wonder who is paying her to put up this website and run her smear campaign. I’ve watched Unrepentatn and read all 3 of Kevin Annett’s books and in no way , IMO , does he try to aggrandize himself. It was the retired director of Unrepentant that insisted Kevin Annett tell his story not the other way around. Obviously, Zahn if some pedophile raped and murdered your children you would be outraged but since it happened to indian children it’s not such a big deal. that is exactly why all this genocide is going on and Canada and the USA and the U.K. are the most genocidal countries of all Right Now. Hypocrites!

  80. Leslee says

    I am writing this nearly 2 years after most of these posts were done. There has been much support for Kevin Annett from various posters. But nothing that Kevin Annett has promised has happened. Ever. And if any of Kevin’s supporters have in the last 2 years, criticized or disagreed with Kevin, they are branded black/ops agents and on the payroll of government/church/pope/queen. Several First Nations have posted videos and written statements distancing themselves from Kevin and asking him to stop using their names, their stories and demanding the return of property. As a white man, the only thing Kevin should be doing is making it possible for the victims to speak. He should not be seen as the leader or spokesperson. I don’t know a lot of things. But what I do know is that Kevin Annett has not taken any responsibility for his actions as an ordained minister by the United Church of Canada. Settled in northern Manitoba, he quits after less than one year. He works for Fred Victor Mission in Toronto, where his actions at the mission raised questions of misappropriated funds and he again resigns after 6 months. It was only by the intervention of his mother, Margaret Annett that Kevin was offered the job in Port Alberni. When his ministry became in issue with the congregation at St. Andrews, he again resigned. But, Kevin tells everyone that he was fired, that he was issued a gag order, that he is the victim. But when a minister issues the statement publicly that the United Church is an evil entity, the end result of the hearing into his actions results in his delisting. With this example of how he has lied about the resignation and delisting, I have little faith in anything else he has said over the years. Evil things happened to the children in schools and orphanages and I am sorry for what my people did. But Kevin Annett should not be at the forefront of any search for justice.

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